No2Atheism:

@topic

I sincerely think I need to do thanksgiving for being born into a non-muslim family . . .cus I can't even imagine the kind of mental breakdown I would have had to go through just to break away from this silly muslim mindset . . .

Cus this topic is just simply ridiculous . . .

One minute allah is telling us spermatozoa comes from the abdominal part of the body. . . the next minute someone is telling us everybody is born a muslim . . . even the pigmies from the gods must be crazy movie



I think US should just bomb us with Laughing gas [/b]and saw me the trouble of reading this ridiculous posts by muslims . . .

I'm so glad ALLAH brought me out of darkness, and let me into the light
So, your spermatozoa is actually from your head
Your mental breakdown is just beyond imagination, b]I think US should just bomb us with Laughing gas , so deep inside you, you know what the truth is. . . oh! i understand, it's hard to say for you
Look, i was once a kiriyo like you are, and there's nothing you can say about kiriyonity that is strange
So, ride on

No2Atheism:



enlighten me please . . .or is there a particular way to spell Allah now . . .

Don't you worry, that's the spelling. . . He's just warning you about the wrath that will fall upon you soonest if you continue jesting with that name, but mind you, he's just too merciful

No2Atheism:



enlighten me please . . .or is there a particular way to spell Allah now . . .

not really. . .I just felt since u are aware that the korans allah is a demon. . .and also that Jehovah is linguistically called Allah, . .you would be better off spelling the former with a small "a" and the latter with a capital "A".

May Allah have mercy on you,

Abu Zola:

May Allah have mercy on you,

(AMIN) Praise be to allah Abu is born again

Abu Zola:

May Allah have mercy on you,

has allah ever shown anyone mercy?

Noetic you are a disgrace to humanity

Abu Zola:

Noetic you are a disgrace to humanity

Thank you. At least I am human. . . .can u call the terrorist slaves of allah like u humans?

what are the physical characteristics and emotional definitions of a human, versus that of say lion or other things, trees and stone like?

a terrible human is still a human, only that he/she is different from a good human by repressing her/his goodness. while the good person represses his/her evil qualities.

all humas have the good and evil in them. you are categorised as good because you do good deeds or dont do evil, even while others are doing it. you are a bad person because you do bad instead of chooding to do good.

it is the ability to choose that make us different emotionally from instinctive animals, driven only by their libidos; the id.

man is the only creation that we know that has ability to walk steadily on two feet, and have completely developed thumbs, that are very useful for fully functioning upper limbs; hands are almost useless without the thumbs. definitely awkward in usage without the thumbs. An evil man is still a man. A good man is not greater than just a man. Jesus said from the Bible: why call me good? The only one who is Good IS GOD HIMSELF.

nopuqeater:

what are the physical characteristics and emotional definitions of a human, versus that of say lion or other things, trees and stone like?

a terrible human is still a human, only that he/she is different from a good human by repressing her/his goodness. while the good person represses his/her evil qualities.

all humas have the good and evil in them. you are categorised as good because you do good deeds or dont do evil, even while others are doing it. you are a bad person because you do bad instead of chooding to do good.

it is the ability to choose that make us different emotionally from instinctive animals, driven only by their libidos; the id.

man is the only creation that we know that has ability to walk steadily on two feet, and have completely developed thumbs, that are very useful for fully functioning upper limbs; hands are almost useless without the thumbs. definitely awkward in usage without the thumbs. An evil man is still a man. A good man is not greater than just a man. Jesus said from the Bible: why call me good? The only one who is Good IS GOD HIMSELF.

and whats the lesson from this long and irrelevant epistle?

ofcource is only meaningless to NOETIC and meaninigful to other readers

Of course.

ofcource is only meaningless to NOETIC and meaninigful to other readers

Pain in Noetic' ass as usual

@Babs787,yeah,pls lets meet on yahoo,titialayo25@yahoo.co.uk,thanks

nobody was born with belief in any religion. So we are all born athiests.

uplawal:

@Babs787,yeah,pls lets meet on yahoo,titialayo25@yahoo.co.uk,thanks

titialayo we will meet on yahoo and i ll post some bible verses to you,i thot it was abuzola

Salam Sister, we will discuss.

okay Alhaji Babs,when you wake up pls let me know okay?its very important o,Asalamu Alekum




@godslave,no not Abuzola,hes one of the reverts from christianity  too,but a muslim till he die ,and he was not a yeye christian then, i think he was a pastor sef,look, u dey fool yourself in xtianity,better accept ISLAM before Jesus comes,so u dnt die in state of umbelief in your CREATOR and so you wont be forced to be a muslim when he comes or cos Jesus is coming to discipline umbelievers by SHARIA,thats why you see muslims preparing for it now,its gonna be dreadful then,he will rule by SHARIA(AL-QURAN) and nothing like yeye RAPTURE cos everyone including Jesus will die,Angel of death too will die, so just stop this your child play thing and save yourself from latter destruction okay,the better for you,godson, i urge you to get a copy of the holy QUR'AN and read it,God is the only one speaking directly to his creatures,may God guide you to the right path, amin.

uplawal:

@godslave,no not Abuzola,hes one of the reverts from christianity too,but a muslim till he die ,and he was not a yeye christian then, i think he was a pastor sef,

lol remember what ther bible says so many will call master master but he will deny them,are you sure your christian reverts where not muslims camouflaging as christians in the firs place?so he is a pastor i challenge him to name his church and parish i can bet you it is neither known nor reputable he s prolly a celestial or c and s pastor

uplawal:

look, u dey fool yourself in xtianity,better accept ISLAM before Jesus comes,so u dnt die in state of umbelief in your CREATOR and so you wont be forced to be a muslim when he comes or cos Jesus is coming to discipline umbelievers by SHARIA,thats why you see muslims preparing for it now,its gonna be dreadful then,he will rule by SHARIA(AL-QURAN) and nothing like yeye RAPTURE cos everyone including Jesus will die,Angel of death too will die, so just stop this your child play thing and save yourself from latter destruction okay,the better for you,godson, i urge you to get a copy of the holy QUR'AN and read it,God is the only one speaking directly to his creatures,may God guide you to the right path, amin.

sister titialayo,i am not an unbeliever,i believe that jesus died for both me and your and abuzola's sins,and he has washed away all our sins,all he is asking of you is to confess your sins and be born again and live a holy and blameless life.
jesus has already died and ascended into heaven as for the holy quran i have gotten the yusuf ali translation and i have read it,same as the bible and i can tell you that islam will lead you no other way but straight to hell.i am praying for you and i can bet you that you will still revert back to christianity once you see what a true born again and broken christian is compared to islam.

@Godson2009

lol remember what ther bible says so many will call master master but he will deny them,are you sure your christian reverts where not muslims camouflaging as christians in the firs place?so he is a pastor i challenge him to name his church and parish i can bet you it is neither known nor reputable he s prolly a celestial or c and s pastor

Oga, you a newbie here. You should ask your brothers and sisters here,my posts speak for me. If I lie, you are not God, so leave to judge.

I am sure you would not have read and still reading the bible like I do. If you look at the above verse you are trying to cite, Jesus was talking to you Christians because you ignored his teachings and took to Pauline Christianity. I bet you do not know what christianity is all about. I have been there, ardent member and you should know the difference between the christianity of then and the one practised by you today.

Do you know your bible to even challenge and can you even challenge me to the Quran and Bible.

If you think you have the liver and knows the bible and Quran, create a thread for only you and I and we thrash out issues with facts.

If you are ready, signigy your acceptance and we ride on.

sister titialayo,i am not an unbeliever,i believe that jesus died for both me and your and abuzola's sins,and he has washed away all our sins,all he is asking of you is to confess your sins and be born again and live a holy and blameless life.

Oga you left my question unaswered when you claimed he died for you.

Is he aware of his coming to die?
Why did he shout on the cross?
Can blood gush from the dead?

jesus has already died and ascended into heaven as for the holy quran i have gotten the yusuf ali translation and i have read it,same as the bible and i can tell you that islam will lead you no other way but straight to hell.i am praying for you and i can bet you that you will still revert back to christianity once you see what a true born again and broken christian is compared to islam.

But it did not he was crucified huh? If they crucify someone and he did not die, would you still say he was crucified?


Welcome to my world

@Uplawal

okay Alhaji Babs,when you wake up pls let me know okay?its very important o,Asalamu Alekum

I am very sorry sweet sister. Let us talk, you have my details.

babs787:

@Godson2009
Oga, you a newbie here. You should ask your brothers and sisters here,my posts speak for me. If I lie, you are not God, so leave to judge.

am i really lol i have my reasons for saying so,uplawal a.k.a titialayo said same thing but i always like to break issues down to the barest basics,therefore please if you were a christian
1.were you a broken and born again christian?i hope you realise this are two different terms,or were you a sunday sunday christian?
what church ,parish did you attend?
before i make my own retorts thank you

babs787:

I am sure you would not have read and still reading the bible like I do. If you look at the above verse you are trying to cite, Jesus was talking to you Christians because you ignored his teachings and took to Pauline Christianity. I bet you do not know what christianity is all about. I have been there, ardent member and you should know the difference between the christianity of then and the one practised by you today.

its suprising and funny a muslim is talking about context here,seeing as you same muslims are the regular culprits at quoting bible verses out of context

babs787:

Do you know your bible to even challenge and can you even challenge me to the Quran and Bible.

i dont have a monopoly on knowledge of both books i.e the holy bible and the book of confusion quran,but i can tell you with every sense of responsibility and humility that i have read enough of the quran,and the bible to know your book is frought with contradictions,confusions and double speak,when u chat with uplawal,ask her to tell u if i have a knwledge of the quran or not

babs787:

If you think you have the liver and knows the bible and Quran, create a thread for only you and I and we thrash out issues with facts.

sire,by all means please open the thread and i will gladly debate every single point to a conclusive end with yyou,with all humility my academic research was done on justifications of islamic terrorism ,history of islam and for me to get a final score of 71 which is a first class in a british university i am sure you will agree i know what i am saying,if i get a jb i am pursuing now about research studies in nigerian/west african terrorism i will let you know , i am still learning as a budding academic but one thing i am sure is that i can prove and defend every single assertion i have made about islam,not only that i have defended those points severally on this same section and religion sections,ask your friend uplawal,abuzola,olabowale e.t.c i have thrown the challenge to you now i ll be waiting for that thread

babs787:

If you are ready, signigy your acceptance and we ride on.

i am ready sire,lets go there like they will say in naija

babs787:

Oga you left my question unaswered when you claimed he died for you.
Is he aware of his coming to die?

yes he was,because he got the mandate and the commission from his father in heaven to come on earth and die for the sins of the world,his coming was also fore told by prophets,and men of GOD even before he was born,secondly he was a GOD the son of the almighty albeit a smaller GOD to his father

babs787:

Why did he shout on the cross?

because e felt pain,like every normal human being remember he came "in human form" not in supernatural form hence he felt pain,he felt emotion,he cried he loved e.t.c

babs787:

Can blood gush from the dead?

i am not a medical doctor so i will have to get back to you on that after i quickly ask my gf who is one pls bear with me
But it did not he was crucified huh? If they crucify someone and he did not die, would you still say he was crucified?

babs787:

@Godson2009
But it did not he was crucified huh? If they crucify someone and he did not die, would you still say he was crucified?
Welcome to my world

no i wouldnt,but fortunately this is a moot point because he was cruxified,however if you have evidence "in the bible" to show otherwise then feel free to share with everyone here

@Godson2009

am i really lol i have my reasons for saying so,uplawal a.k.a titialayo said same thing but i always like to break issues down to the barest basics,therefore please if you were a christian
1.were you a broken and born again christian?i hope you realise this are two different terms,or were you a sunday sunday christian?
what church ,parish did you attend?
before i make my own retorts thank you

I am not perturbed in you believing me or not as long as God is my witness.

its suprising and funny a muslim is talking about context here,seeing as you same muslims are the regular culprits at quoting bible verses out of context

That shows that you have a long way to go in understanding your bible and the book of peter said there is no secret interpretation of the words.

i dont have a monopoly on knowledge of both books i.e the holy bible and the book of confusion quran,but i can tell you with every sense of responsibility and humility that i have read enough of the quran,and the bible to know your book is frought with contradictions,confusions and double speak,when u chat with uplawal,ask her to tell u if i have a knwledge of the quran or not

Oga, spare me the time. Let me have your claim or you create a thread where we analyse that

sire,by all means please open the thread and i will gladly debate every single point to a conclusive end with yyou,with all humility my academic research was done on justifications of islamic terrorism ,history of islam and for me to get a final score of 71 which is a first class in a british university i am sure you will agree i know what i am saying,

You started with your allegation and should deem it fit to create a thread for that. You should be able to support your claim with facts and not just story telling. When you are ready Mr God son , set the ball rolling and we would if you really know about your book let alone mine.

if i get a jb i am pursuing now about research studies in nigerian/west african terrorism i will let you know , i am still learning as a budding academic but one thing i am sure is that i can prove and defend every single assertion i have made about islam,not only that i have defended those points severally on this same section and religion sections,ask your friend uplawal,abuzola,olabowale e.t.c i have thrown the challenge to you now i ll be waiting for that thread

I dont have time for this sir. You said many things about my religion which I said you should provide facts and if I were you, I would have furnish same sharp sharp.

I am still chalenging you here since you started the argument to furnish me your facts and we dance along.

i am ready sire,lets go there like they will say in naija

Open a thread for you and I or you furnish me your facts here.

yes he was,because he got the mandate and the commission from his father in heaven to come on earth and die for the sins of the world,

Please let me have the verse(s) he was told that.

his coming was also fore told by prophets,and men of GOD even before he was born,secondly he was a GOD the son of the almighty albeit a smaller GOD to his father

Let me have the prophecies please (hope you have asked your big brothers you met here etc and some of your sisters about me )

because e felt pain,like every normal human being remember he came "in human form" not in supernatural form hence he felt pain,he felt emotion,he cried he loved e.t.c

Please, do not try to feed me. I said why did he shout, 'my God why has thou forsaken me"? What was he forsaken for?

i am not a medical doctor so i will have to get back to you on that after i quickly ask my gf who is one pls bear with me
But it did not he was crucified huh? If they crucify someone and he did not die, would you still say he was crucified?

Waiting for your doctor's response.

no i wouldnt,but fortunately this is a moot point because he was cruxified,however if you have evidence "in the bible" to show otherwise then feel free to share with everyone here

Did he die on the cross? I need a YES or No response


Thanks

babs787:

@Godson2009


I am not perturbed in you believing me or not as long as God is my witness.



That shows that you have a long way to go in understanding your bible and the book of peter said there is no secret interpretation of the words.


Oga, spare me the time. Let me have your claim or you create a thread where we analyse that


You started with your allegation and should deem it fit to create a thread for that. You should be able to support your claim with facts and not just story telling. When you are ready Mr God son , set the ball rolling and we would if you really know about your book let alone mine.


I dont have time for this sir. You said many things about my religion which I said you should provide facts and if I were you, I would have furnish same sharp sharp.

I am still chalenging you here since you started the argument to furnish me your facts and we dance along.

Open a thread for you and I or you furnish me your facts here.

Please let me have the verse(s) he was told that.

Let me have the prophecies please (hope you have asked your big brothers you met here etc and some of your sisters about me )

Please, do not try to feed me. I said why did he shout, 'my God why has thou forsaken me"? What was he forsaken for?

Waiting for your doctor's response.


Did he die on the cross? I need a YES or No response


Thanks

im sure and i hope yo will agree with me that there isnt much debate in your retort all you keep on doing is making open ended and nebulous comments rather than committing yourself to a stance,when you alledged that you were the repository of knowledge on islam i though you will be a welcome challenge having tackled your elders in islam i.e alhaji olabowale,nopqueater and they gave me a good debate,they never shied away from any single issue neither did they make open ended retorts like you are doing,i have highlighted hadiths and qurans backing my main assertions up namely gender inequality,intolerance and violence in islam,i have highighted the quranic verses of the satanic verse,same as one of the abrogated verse or jihad but you have not deemed it fit to disprove it nor show me the contradictions you keep making empty pchallenges to publish,i dont have time to open a thread because you simply are no match sire the same thing you wrote in the first comment you replied to is the same thing you wrote here, in order for you to get an idea of what i am on about please check my past threads where i and olabowale have debated issues in the religion section or me and others who are more knowledgeable in thethe quran than you are.

im sure and i hope yo will agree with me that there isnt much debate in your retort all you keep on doing is making open ended and nebulous comments rather than committing yourself to a stance,when you alledged that you were the repository of knowledge on islam i though you will be a welcome challenge having tackled your elders in islam i.e alhaji olabowale,nopqueater and they gave me a good debate,they never shied away from any single issue neither did they make open ended retorts like you are doing,i have highlighted hadiths and qurans backing my main assertions up namely gender inequality,intolerance and violence in islam,

gender inequality my foot. ifthere is any real gender inequality, it is not in Islam, though reains in the community of muslims, christians, ews, and all others, but the doctrine of inequality that is gender based is in christianity, judaism, etc. definitely not in islam. my evidence; while the bible put the blame of the transgression in its garden of eden on women, cursing her with pain of childbirth, Quranm does not do such a thing because the responsibility of the obedience or disobedience to the commandment is borne by adam for himself and hawa for herself. each could have refused the suggestion. and Allah did not curse either of them, rather He accepted their repentance, which was different from the case of the evil, shaitan from the family of jinns.

muslim women have burnt the proverbial 'bra' and and truly entered the woman liberation from the very first revelaion of mere 5 verses out of over 6000 that the Quran contained. they were already seasoned by the time the prophet died [as], the reason killing of daughters stopped among the cronic practisers. women were able t own properties and no more properties themselves, the reason women still bear their family names even as they are married. women were able to speak up, the reason they participated in the convenant, oath [bayah] to muhammad [as] in udabiyyah. have you ever heard of the women around the prophets? women became teaches in the faith, they teached Quran which they memorized, narrated ahadiths. today the process of separation of thegenders in academic setting allows the women to speak up, video as tool of education, both have been with muslims, while the west is just waking up to them, etc. Aisha [ra] took opposite side of Ali Bin Abitalib [ra] the kalifah; why, because of freedom of choice, to speak up, and to stand as individual. and by the way no one wll bear another's responsibily, the reason every religious law and obligation is covering each person regardless of gender. the oppressor of female gender is not the muslims; american women ar still fighting for equality, even today. even black people are still fighting for equality, though obama is the president. surprise surpise, is a thing hat christianity throws out to people to surprise them.

i have highighted the quranic verses of the satanic verse,same as one of the abrogated verse

if there is a satanic verse, which you said is abrogated; show meits satanic content, and show me the abrogation, if you cant show me what is satanic in the verse or verses you are lying about, and show us abrogated verses to have been written before or after it to take its place, then you shoul be ashamed of your shameless lies. abrogation in the Quraan occurs when a better verse or a verse of equal value is brought about to replace a condition which was addressed before; for xample, abrogation of verse which cautioned about drinking alcohol as time of salah is near, to never to drink it at all. if you cant produce the satanic verse, and or what replaced it or what it replaced as in the abrogation, then, darn man, shot your freakin trap because your statementis withou merit, justlike your trinity to be One God, yet jesus was no better in character and quality than human nd human messenger, prophet [as].

or jihad

this is the only reasonable thing you have said that i cant dispute. however jihad by definition is struggle against evil. no muslim must start a war, a conflict except to crrect the wrong in the most atural way. for example the jews of madina were fought because they proved to be traitors; guilty of rason aginst their own cit state. what do you do with treasonial people except fight hem because they will be a sourceof weakness amongst your rank if you allw them to enjoy the rights of the society. america had civil war because of treason, the south undermining the agreed upon constitution. nigeria had her own because in paper it was forthe same reason. england fought the young ameican colony because it was practising treason against the crown ofengland with its 'tea party' dubbed movement. do you have any sense of what is reality, or you are already bain freezed to the trinity fantasy? has anyone practised the turning thr othecheek; america didnt, and she is the best of all nations, toay. the citizens pride themselves as the most humae merciful of allpersons; lol.

but you have not deemed it fit to disprove it nor show me the contradictions you keep making empty pchallenges to publish,i dont have time to open a thread because you simply are no match sire the same thing you wrote in the first comment you replied to is the same thing you wrote here, in order for you to get an idea of what i am on about please check my past threads where i and olabowale have debated issues in the religion section or me and others who are more knowledgeable in thethe quran than you are.

but show us the satanic verses, and their abrogations. e need to see snd et the whole world judge what you claim. it is easy to lie and no challenge thrown against the lies. when we say your gods are not 1 but 3, we can see it and show you verses to buttress our positions. we will not beempty talkers like you. jesus didnt fight because he had sense that number and might will crush their adversary, in battle. or jesus was afraid, uncertain of theoutcome, not having a good supporting soldiers, even afte he prepared them for war, purchasing swords, with almost all teir belongings. it was supposed to be do or die, the reason you will trade everything except the cloh on your back, for ammunitions.

babs787, dont waste your time with godSON2009. he willnever give you an answer, except what involves paddy adenuga. keeris are always like that. he cant even give you a yes or no on the life of his human god; if he died, he was no better than me, a human being, fori have not died, yet, though i will sometime in the future.

if he did not die on the cross, then the whole lie is now exposed.

nopuqeater:

gender inequality my foot. ifthere is any real gender inequality, it is not in Islam, though reains in the community of muslims, christians, ews, and all others, but the doctrine of inequality that is gender based is in christianity, judaism, etc. definitely not in islam. my evidence; while the bible put the blame of the transgression in its garden of eden on women, cursing her with pain of childbirth, Quranm does not do such a thing because the responsibility of the obedience or disobedience to the commandment is borne by adam for himself and hawa for herself. each could have refused the suggestion. and Allah did not curse either of them, rather He accepted their repentance, which was different from the case of the evil, shaitan from the family of jinns.

welcome back ahaji olabowale a.k.a nopuqueater a.k.a lagbaja i knew it was only a matter of time before you took me on,thats why i kept mentioning your name.
i see,let us assume that is the christian explanation for women suffering,what is the islamic explanation for women suffering i.e the pains of childbirth?
i have posted some verses of the quran showing the obvious gender inequality,lets even for get about the past ,in contemporary islam the same thing that obtains 100 of years ago still obtains today,christianity has moved on from the old testament to the new testament where apostle paul enjoins the husband to treat his wife like christ treats the church, with loving kindness,tenderness e.t.c can you tell me why the man should beat the woman for disobedience when she is not a dog or an ass?why cant a husband simply talk to his supposed beloved wife??lets start from there sire

nopuqeater:

compare that with the islamic injunction to beat your wives,,in the hadith which asserts that women are worse than dogs
muslim women have burnt the proverbial 'bra' and and truly entered the woman liberation from the very first revelaion of mere 5 verses out of over 6000 that the Quran contained. they were already seasoned by the time the prophet died [as], the reason killing of daughters stopped among the cronic practisers.

are you talking about the same quran that gives the male child a double portion of inheritance?
the same quran that allows one male witness double that if it is a woman?
the same quran which advocated for the man to marry as manyy as he can but the woman to remain quiet,resolute and long suffering no matter what?
alhaji i wont let u off this assertion that easy because it is simply not true

nopuqeater:

women were able t own properties and no more properties themselves, the reason women still bear their family names even as they are married. women were able to speak up, the reason they participated in the convenant, oath [bayah] to muhammad [as] in udabiyyah.

i see,so is a pious and faithful woman allowed to come outside and sit in the living room with her husband and his male friends? lets assume its a very hot day and she has been cleaning the kitchen wearing a teeshirt and over size jogger buttoms is she allowed to sit down and freely discuss with them??especially without covering herself up

nopuqeater:

have you ever heard of the women around the prophets? women became teaches in the faith, they teached Quran which they memorized, narrated ahadiths.

so one question,are they allowed to teach men who can learn from them?
are they allowed to stand on the podium and publicly teach men in the mosque then?surely they should be if the genders are equal in islam

nopuqeater:

today the process of separation of thegenders in academic setting allows the women to speak up, video as tool of education, both have been with muslims, while the west is just waking up to them, etc. Aisha [ra] took opposite side of Ali Bin Abitalib [ra] the kalifah; why, because of freedom of choice, to speak up, and to stand as individual. and by the way no one wll bear another's responsibily, the reason every religious law and obligation is covering each person regardless of gender. the oppressor of female gender is not the muslims; american women ar still fighting for equality, even today. even black people are still fighting for equality, though obama is the president. surprise surpise, is a thing hat christianity throws out to people to surprise them.

tell me,does islam allow the female to challenge the male without any form of repercussions??if you say yes i will like you to show me the quranic verse aqnd i will show u the quranic verse which doesnt allow the female to challenge the male's authority especially husband and wife.
if no one will bear the other's responsibility,why then are the women not given liberation from the men so that they can freely pursue their destinies and be responsible for whatever they makle of it?

nopuqeater:

if there is a satanic verse, which you said is abrogated; show meits satanic content, and show me the abrogation, if you cant show me what is satanic in the verse or verses you are lying about, and show us abrogated verses to have been written before or after it to take its place, then you shoul be ashamed of your shameless lies.

i have posted the satanic verses which you can clearly see in the same page so i wont bother posting it again,however a simple google search,without going into my own personal sources will tell you that the satanic verses which was words mohammad uttered after being aledgedly tempted to say so, i personally think its a load of bollocks and i believe that mohammadf in mecca was facing persecution ,leading a religion that was still weak wanted to endear the general pagan meccans to himself,betrayed his own religious principles and venerated the pagan gods of mecca, there is owever something i will like to add which i discovered like november last year do you know that 2 of the godesses were actually sun gods and afiliated with the moon
im sure you understand where i am going with that and what i am inferring,however you are perfectly at liberty to explore this further,when i discovered this i was astonished some godess mohammaed briefly vvenerated and justified their existence were afiliated to the sun and moon,muslims bow down to the sun and use the moon to sight their festivals connect 2 and 2 together,

nopuqeater:

abrogation in the Quraan occurs when a better verse or a verse of equal value is brought about to replace a condition which was addressed before; for xample, abrogation of verse which cautioned about drinking alcohol as time of salah is near, to never to drink it at all. if you cant produce the satanic verse, and or what replaced it or what it replaced as in the abrogation, then, darn man, shot your freakin trap because your statementis withou merit, justlike your trinity to be One God, yet jesus was no better in character and quality than human nd human messenger, prophet [as].

alhaji,i am suprised,i have never known you to loose your temper like uplawal are you in a bad mood?your son will not be pleased at this kind of example pls calm down i know what abrogation means in fact i have a nice journal on it i can avail you off anytime you want it.but just like the rest of islamic doctrines it is hollow and of no real religious impact, a man wrote a set of prophecies and injunctiions,he realises he has made a series of mistakes,he goes back and then corrects himself,what is genius about that??
i can write a load of gibberish and then go back and correct myself,like criminologists will say,you cannot use captured criminals as a controll sample because the smart criminals are the ones who have never being caught by the police, so if mohammad was that smart,then he wouldnt have to correct himself, besides i have asked you this severally.
1.was it mohammad who made the mistake in the visions and prophecies he received?
2.was it your allah who made the mistake and then corrected him/herself?
because it is obvious that someone made a mistake which needed to be abrogated no?

nopuqeater:

this is the only reasonable thing you have said that i cant dispute. however jihad by definition is struggle against evil. no muslim must start a war, a conflict except to crrect the wrong in the most atural way.

so you re disputing the fact that the satanic verses,was abrogated lateri see so what about quran 2;191 isnt that unprovoked attack
i am sure you have read sayyid qutb's milestones because we have talked about it briefly before on jihad and his arguments about jahiliyah,and also taymiyyah and what he argues concerning jiad.you are espousing the views of modernist islamist,but a fundamental neo conservative muslim will disagree with you,so who do you want me to believe??

nopuqeater:

for example the jews of madina were fought because they proved to be traitors; guilty of rason aginst their own cit state. what do you do with treasonial people except fight hem because they will be a sourceof weakness amongst your rank if you allw them to enjoy the rights of the society.

that is a big fat lie sire,mohammad's attack was unprovoked,he attacked the three different jewish sects in order to take over medina with trumped up charges,i am busy this week but i will try and look for my sources on this and come back to u on that definitely.
secondly if you believe treason should be punished by death,that means you should not be against the assasination attempt on mohammad,and his companion resulting in his escaping from mecca then cause heis offence was treason against mecca as well??

nopuqeater:

america had civil war because of treason, the south undermining the agreed upon constitution. nigeria had her own because in paper it was forthe same reason. england fought the young ameican colony because it was practising treason against the crown ofengland with its 'tea party' dubbed movement. do you have any sense of what is reality, or you are already bain freezed to the trinity fantasy? has anyone practised the turning thr othecheek; america didnt, and she is the best of all nations, toay. the citizens pride themselves as the most humae merciful of allpersons; lol.

i see so you are showing your true islamic colours of violence and machiavellian tendencies, so you believe violence is the only way to freach your goals as muslimsslam is a religion of peace indeed lool

but show us the satanic verses, and their abrogations. e need to see snd et the whole world judge what you claim. it is easy to lie and no challenge thrown against the lies.

[/quote]
how many times do you want me to post the same verse??if you go through my reply to babas787 i have posted the verses,and i know that mohammad obviously abrogated it in medina but that is not my concern because i personally believe he realised he wwas caught in an embarassing position and he skillfully tried to extricate himself, you know what they say about liars, they simply lie again to cover up the first one.so what exactly do you want to challenge??
that there is no satanic verses??
or that mohammad did not try to anull it and put foward abrogations explaining the context in which he uttered those words?

[quote author=nopuqeater link=topic=246849.msg5736299#msg5736299 date=1269177045] when we say your gods are not 1 but 3, we can see it and show you verses to buttress our positions. we will not beempty talkers like you. jesus didnt fight because he had sense that number and might will crush their adversary, in battle. or jesus was afraid, uncertain of theoutcome, not having a good supporting soldiers, even afte he prepared them for war, purchasing swords, with almost all teir belongings. it was supposed to be do or die, the reason you will trade everything except the cloh on your back, for ammunitions.

alhaji olabpowale, lol lol i am sure even you know this is a load of bollocks as u can see i have credited you in making comments backed up by the quran even though i know the quran is false.
jesus did not fight in spite of the multitudes who followed him and would have protected and fought for him,but because like he said that is what satan wanted so that his mission will be distrupted.
can imagine pastor adeboye sending 20,000 people to start matcheting muslims in jos and what the distraction will be?

@Godson2009

im sure and i hope yo will agree with me that there isnt much debate  in your retort all you keep on doing is making open ended and nebulous comments rather than committing yourself to a stance,when you alledged that you were the repository of knowledge on islam i though you will be a welcome challenge having tackled your elders in islam i.e alhaji olabowale,nopqueater and they gave me a good debate,they never shied away from any single issue neither did they make open ended retorts like you are doing,i have highlighted hadiths and qurans backing my main assertions up namely gender inequality,intolerance and violence in islam,i have highighted the quranic verses of the satanic verse,same as  one of the abrogated verse or jihad but you have not deemed it fit to disprove it nor show me the contradictions you keep making empty pchallenges to publish,i dont have time to open a thread because you simply are no match sire the same thing you wrote in the first comment you replied to is the same thing you wrote here, in order for you to get an idea of what i am on about please check my past threads where i and olabowale have debated issues in the religion section or me and others who are more knowledgeable in thethe quran than you are.

Oga, I know your type and I am used to your infantile debate. I perused your posts  and did not see where you have been able to argue/debate intelligently but prefer going in circles. You brought allegation which you could not substantiate and when you were told that your allegations are all lies and requested for your proof, you claimed that someone is making open ended comments.

You should have your  if you can not defend or post your claim here.

I am still saying all you posted are lies and if you are truthful, kindly post your proof and we move on.

babs787:

@Godson2009


Oga, I know your type and I am used to your infantile debate. I perused your posts and did not see where you have been able to argue/debate intelligently but prefer going in circles. You brought allegation which you could not substantiate and when you were told that your allegations are all lies and requested for your proof, you claimed that someone is making open ended comments.

You should have your if you can not defend or post your claim here.

I am still saying all you posted are lies and if you are truthful, kindly post your proof and we move on.

irrespective of how infantille you might think of my comments simply answer these direct questions,
1.did i back up my assertions about gender inequality in islam yes or no?
2.did i back up my assertions about the inherent violence in islam yes or no?
3.did i back up my assertion about the specific verses reffered to as the satanic verses or not yes or no?
4.did i not elaborate upon the "satanic verse" or not namely the assertion that the names of the godess was same as godess of the sun and one of the three godesss was actually connected to the moon,and how this was connected to islam bowing down to the sun??
simply answer a yes or no , these arew the points or issues of contention between us and i have answered every one of those assertions with the rekllevant hadiths and quranic verses the rest are issues you intentionally try to confuse yourseles over.

as for the holy spirit pointing to mohammad i hope u are satisfied with the bible verses posted by another helpful christian brother here showing conclusive proof that your assertions concerning that is a figment of your imagiations sire

@godSON2009: « #58 on: March 21, 2010, 06:28 PM »

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
gender inequality my foot. ifthere is any real gender inequality, it is not in Islam, though reains in the community of muslims, christians, ews, and all others, but the doctrine of inequality that is gender based is in christianity, judaism, etc. definitely not in islam. my evidence; while the bible put the blame of the transgression in its garden of eden on women, cursing her with pain of childbirth, Quranm does not do such a thing because the responsibility of the obedience or disobedience to the commandment is borne by adam for himself and hawa for herself. each could have refused the suggestion. and Allah did not curse either of them, rather He accepted their repentance, which was different from the case of the evil, shaitan from the family of jinns.

welcome back ahaji olabowale a.k.a nopuqueater a.k.a lagbaja i knew it was only a matter of time before you took me on,thats why i kept mentioning your name.
i see,let us assume that is the christian explanation for women suffering,what is the islamic explanation for women suffering i.e the pains of childbirth?
i have posted some verses of the quran showing the obvious gender inequality,lets even for get about the past ,in contemporary islam the same thing that obtains 100 of years ago still obtains today,christianity has moved on from the old testament to the new testament where apostle paul enjoins the husband to treat his wife like christ treats the church, with loving kindness,tenderness e.t.c can you tell me why the man should beat the woman for disobedience when she is not a dog or an backside?why cant a husband simply talk to his supposed beloved wife??lets start from there sire

the bolded is absolutely incorrect. the only thng we have in common is the religion and maybe the male gender. if your assumption is correct in your own eye, then it is no wonder you take three gods to be One God. just the other day, in 2010 america, the women as a whole i still struggling for equality in many conditions. america was even willing to accept a black man for the office of the presidency instead of a woman. please, mr. ask paddy adenuga if his wife is on the same equal footing with him, or his mother on equal footing with his father?

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
compare that with the islamic injunction to beat your wives,,in the hadith which asserts that women are worse than dogs
muslim women have burnt the proverbial 'bra' and and truly entered the woman liberation from the very first revelaion of mere 5 verses out of over 6000 that the Quran contained. they were already seasoned by the time the prophet died [as], the reason killing of daughters stopped among the cronic practisers.

are you talking about the same quran that gives the male child a double portion of inheritance?
the same quran that allows one male witness double that if it is a woman?
the same quran which advocated for the man to marry as manyy as he can but the woman to remain quiet,resolute and long suffering no matter what?
alhaji i wont let u off this assertion that easy because it is simply not true

first stop calling me Alhaji, because i have not made the pilgrimage yet, and an not lagbaja or olabowale. now, i spoke about the Quran which gives 2 times the portion to man as what is given a woman. ask paddy adenuga if he has double the authority of his sister, older or younger in the family business or setting. he will tell you that after his father he is next, definitely over his women siblings, and even his mother. you mr. has a lot to learn about the reality of life.

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
women were able t own properties and no more properties themselves, the reason women still bear their family names even as they are married. women were able to speak up, the reason they participated in the convenant, oath [bayah] to muhammad [as] in udabiyyah.

i see,so is a pious and faithful woman allowed to come outside and sit in the living room with her husband and his male friends? lets assume its a very hot day and she has been cleaning the kitchen[b][/b] wearing a teeshirt and over size jogger buttoms is she allowed to sit down and freely discuss with them??especially without covering herself up

while your women are responsible for all the cleaning,it is not so in Islam. the wife has clear responsibilities which do not include cooing meals for the husband, washing the husband cloths, etc. her responsibilities are hat she does not become an ally to the enemies of her husband or have sexual intercourse with somebody who is not her husband, etc. if the women companions sat around and spoke to Muhammad (AS, the best of Muslim example, whomyou said cant help himself around women) and other male companions and no one was abused, then is it a matter to be disputed today, except that you mr godSON is happy to see women from other familie in "second skin" where though they wore cloths, but everything and every part is showing. dirty minded man. you should b ashamed of yourself. no wonder you sleep with the woman in 9ja, and you do not consider it a sexual sin.

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
have you ever heard of the women around the prophets? women became teaches in the faith, they teached Quran which they memorized, narrated ahadiths.

so one question,are they allowed to teach men who can learn from them?
are they allowed to stand on the podium and publicly teach men in the mosque then?surely they should be if the genders are equal in islam

[/quote]the custodian of the first Mushaf (Kitaab; fully compiled and binded into a book Quran) was a woman; Hafsa binta Umar, zaujah Rasulluh (RA to our mother Hafsa, AS to the Messenger).many of them memorized the Quran and taught it. Hadiths were taught by women of knowledge to men. I guess the trustee position of Hafsa negates all your assumptions about disregard of women, by Islam since the Book of Authorit is Quran, and the first is kept by a woman. Peae tell us what christian worldwide body that is headed by a woman, efficiently and she is the law?

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
today the process of separation of thegenders in academic setting allows the women to speak up, video as tool of education, both have been with muslims, while the west is just waking up to them, etc. Aisha [ra] took opposite side of Ali Bin Abitalib [ra] the kalifah; why, because of freedom of choice, to speak up, and to stand as individual. and by the way no one wll bear another's responsibily, the reason every religious law and obligation is covering each person regardless of gender. the oppressor of female gender is not the muslims; american women ar still fighting for equality, even today. even black people are still fighting for equality, though obama is the president. surprise surpise, is a thing hat christianity throws out to people to surprise them.

tell me,[b]does islam allow the female to challenge the male without any form of repercussions??[/b]if you say yes i will like you to show me the quranic verse aqnd i will show u the quranic verse which doesnt allow the female to challenge the male's authority especially husband and wife.
if no one will bear the other's responsibility,why then are the women not given liberation from the men so that they can freely pursue their destinies and be responsible for whatever they makle of it?

surah Al-Mujadila [chapter 58, verses 1-5, are good enough] below is verse 1 and you can rad the rest yourself;
Sahih International
Certainly has Allah heard the speech of the one who argues with you, [O Muhammad], concerning her husband and directs her complaint to Allah . And Allah hears your dialogue; indeed, Allah is Hearing and Seeing.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn
God has certainly heard the words of her who disputes with you, [her who] consults you, O Prophet, concerning her husband, who has repudiated her by zihār — he had said to her, ‘You are to me [as untouchable] as the back of my mother’. She asked the Prophet (s) about this and he told her that she was [thenceforth] forbidden to him, as was customary among them [at the time of Jāhiliyya], namely, that repudiation by zihār results in permanent separation. She was Khawla bt. Tha‘laba and he was Aws b. al-Sāmit — and complains to God, of her being alone and of her impoverishment while having young children, whom if she were to leave with him, they would go astray, but whom, if they remained with her, would go hungry. And God hears your conversation, your consulting. Assuredly God is Hearer, Seer, [He is] Knower.

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
if t[b][/b]here is a satanic verse, which you said is abrogated; show meits satanic content, and show me the abrogation, if you cant show me what is satanic in the verse or verses you are lying about, and show us abrogated verses to have been written before or after it to take its place, then you shoul be ashamed of your shameless lies.

i have posted the satanic verses which you can clearly see in the same page so i wont bother posting it again,however a simple google search,without going into my own personal sources will tell you that the satanic verses which was words mohammad uttered after being aledgedly tempted to say so, i personally think its a load of bollocks and i believe that mohammadf in mecca was facing persecution ,leading a religion that was still weak wanted to endear the general pagan meccans to himself,betrayed his own religious principles and venerated the pagan gods of mecca, there is owever something i will like to add which i discovered like november last year do you know that 2 of the godesses were actually sun gods and afiliated with the moon
im sure you understand where i am going with that and what i am inferring,however you are perfectly at liberty to explore this further,when i discovered this i was astonished some godess mohammaed briefly vvenerated and justified their existence were afiliated to the sun and moon,muslims bow down to the sun and use the moon to sight their festivals connect 2 and 2 together,

the bolded above and others you wrote below to present your argument, would have seen plausable, if at anytime in the Makkan period the muslims enjoyed any peace, if only for a moment, not even a day! Muhammad (AS) started his mission simply on a simple Principle: God Almighty is One, Alone in His Supremacy and has no part. Muhammad ws not the first that postulated this: Ibrahim (AS) postulated the same Principleby simply aking the community of his forefathers; ask that big idol. Jesus and others postulated the sme by saying: our God is but One Lord. As to Muhammad (AS)without your saying something that can not be substantiated; point out to a point in time that the Muslims were not hated for "killing" the positions of the 360 gods? I remember that Abu Lahab was angry with Muhammad (AS) from the moment he announced that God is One and all gods are nothing, he (Abu Lahab, and even Abu Jahal (Abu Sham)) woul have been happy, and would have buried the hatchet, if only for one moment, and asked why the change of mind thereafter. None of these hapened and Surah "Kafiruun" was revealed to reject the suggestion that Islam could ever be practised along with the mixture of a single paganic ideologue; the reason innovation in Islam is frowned upn.

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
abrogation in the Quraan occurs when a better verse or a verse of equal value is brought about to replace a condition which was addressed before; for xample, abrogation of verse which cautioned about drinking alcohol as time of salah is near, to never to drink it at all. if you cant produce the satanic verse, and or what replaced it or what it replaced as in the abrogation, then, darn man, shot your freakin trap because your statementis withou merit, justlike your trinity to be One God, yet jesus was no better in character and quality than human nd human messenger, prophet [as].

alhaji,i am suprised,i have never known you to loose your temper like uplawal are you in a bad mood?your son will not be pleased at this kind of example pls calm down i know what abrogation means in fact i have a nice journal on it i can avail you off anytime you want it.but just like the rest of islamic doctrines it is hollow and of no real religious impact, [b]a man wrote a set of prophecies and injunctiions,he realises he has made a series of mistakes,he goes back and then corrects himself,[/b]what is genius about that??

i do not intend to beat downany dead horse, again; i am not Alhaji and stop confusing me with anyone else; thats the problem wth Christinity; confusing human prophet with God Who remains Unseenand Immortal. the words of the man in bold, if he corrected himself, wit absolute prophesies, must be better than Jesus wo actually opposed his own statements not to call anyone a fool for the speaker wilbe hell bound, and or the fact that he promised to come back to earth in the time of his disciples, and it has been over 2000 years without that return and no disciple is alive, today. Could a real prophet be this wrng? Could God be wrong?

i can write a load of gibberish and then go back and correct myself,like criminologists will say,you cannot use captured criminals as a controll sample because the smart criminals are the ones who have never being caught by the police, so if mohammad was that smart,then he wouldnt have to correct himself,

ifi corected my own statement before anyone detected my error[s], could i be declared as incorrect? if i could be declared as incorrect, then tell me who is right; Moses who said God is One, Unseen or Jesus of the Bible who sad Gods are three; he, ghost and father, while he Jesus was obviously seen and then killed in every which was that a person could have been killed?

besides i have asked you this severally.
1.was it mohammad who made the mistake in the visions and prophecies he received?
2.was it your allah who made the mistake and then corrected him/herself?
because it is obvious that someone made a mistake which needed to be abrogated no?

in my dialogue wth you, ths is the first time we are talking about "satanic" verses, which I have asked you to show me on the pages of the Quran. You have not shown it, and threfore your questions are absolutely irrelevant; if we pay tattention to the fact that anyone can say anythig about anyone, as long as he does no have to proof it, it may be believed my many with the same idealogue. if say that the christians believe in 3 Gods, that will be a fact baed on what you christians belief in, withyour Trinity idea: Jesus who died. Ghost who is unseen but alays on errant. Yahweh who is not killed. That wil be a fact, but not One God.
Give me that same fact about "satanic" verses, when every recitation of the Quran starts with Audhu bIllahi minal Shaithani rajiim: do the christian curse any of their allies: evn Judas Iscariot, the very intimate disciple who carried our every request of Jesus? To answer your two question: I have answered them above with a simple statement; Satanic verse did not happen, hence your questions are inappropriate.

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
this is the only reasonable thing you have said that i cant dispute. however jihad by definition is struggle against evil. no muslim must start a war, a conflict except to crrect the wrong in the most atural way.

so you re disputing the fact that the satanic verses,was abrogated lateri see so what about quran 2;191 isnt that unprovoked attack
i am sure you have read sayyid qutb's milestones because we have talked about it briefly before on jihad and his arguments about jahiliyah,and also taymiyyah and what he argues concerning jiad.you are espousing the views of modernist islamist,but a fundamental neo conservative muslim will disagree with you,so who do you want me to believe??[quote]

I simply areed with you that Veses about Jihad are on the pages of the Quran. While am honest about my Quran, you will deny your Bible. below are verses 2;190 to guide you along to 191. notice my bolded.

Sahih International
Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn
After the Prophet (s) was prevented from [visiting] the House in the year of the battle of Hudaybiyya, he made a pact with the disbelievers that he would be allowed to return the following year, at which time they would vacate Mecca for three days. Having prepared to depart for the Visitation [‘umra], [he and] the believers were concerned that Quraysh would not keep to the agreement and instigate fighting. The Muslims were averse to becoming engaged in fighting while in a state of pilgrimage inviolability in the Sacred Enclosure [al-haram] and during the sacred months, and so the following was revealed: And fight in the way of God, to elevate His religion, with those who fight against you, the disbelievers, but aggress not, against them by initiating the fighting; God loves not the aggressors, the ones that overstep the bounds which God has set for them: this stipulation was abrogated by the verse of barā’a, ‘immunity’ [Q. 9:1], or by His saying [below]:
2:191
to topSahih International
And kill them wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al- Haram until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn
And slay them wherever you come upon them, and expel them from where they expelled you, that is, from Mecca, and this was done after the Conquest of Mecca; sedition, their idolatry, is more grievous, more serious, than slaying, them in the Sacred Enclosure or while in a state of pilgrimage inviolability, the thing that you greatly feared. But fight them not by the Sacred Mosque, that is, in the Sacred Enclosure, until they should fight you there; then if they fight you, there, slay them, there (a variant reading drops the alif in the three verbs [sc. wa-lā taqtilūhum, hattā yaqtulūkum, fa-in qatalūkum, so that the sense is ‘slaying’ in all three, and not just ‘fighting’]) — such, killing and expulsion, is the requital of disbelievers.

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
for example the jews of madina were fought because they proved to be traitors; guilty of rason aginst their own cit state. what do you do with treasonial people except fight hem because they will be a sourceof weakness amongst your rank if you allw them to enjoy the rights of the society.

that is a big fat lie sire,mohammad's attack was unprovoked,he attacked the three different jewish sects in order to take over medina with trumped up charges,i am busy this week but i will try and look for my sources on this and come back to u on that definitely.
secondly if you believe treason should be punished by death,that means you should not be against the assasination attempt on mohammad,and his companion resulting in his escaping from mecca then cause heis offence was treason against mecca as well??

there were no sects of jews, but tribes in madina. what were the trumped up charges and why did many of them accepted Islam, allowing him [as[ to decide their disputes? one of them died in the second fight where hamzah [ra] was murdered by wahsi, against the makkans. i accepted treason should be carry capital punishment, Alhamdulillah, the unsuccessful attempt on the life of the messenger by devine intervention is another proof of his Messengership. the same way Jesus was spared of humiliation of dying on the cross, except you love to tag him as accursed, humiliated soul.

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
america had civil war because of treason, the south undermining the agreed upon constitution. nigeria had her own because in paper it was forthe same reason. england fought the young ameican colony because it was practising treason against the crown ofengland with its 'tea party' dubbed movement. do you have any sense of what is reality, or you are already bain freezed to the trinity fantasy? has anyone practised the turning thr othecheek; america didnt, and she is the best of all nations, toay. the citizens pride themselves as the most humae merciful of allpersons; lol.

i see so you are showing your true islamic colours of violence and machiavellian tendencies, so you believe violence is the only way to freach your goals as muslimsslam is a religion of peace indeed lool

laugh all you want; while you turn blind eyes, America the leadership of Christianity thrown aside christian doctrine, you will say if only for a moment to not turn the other cheek, but to kill Afghanistanis, and pre=empt in Iraq. then turn around in both places to begin christian prolytesizing, winning souls for the Jesus they forgot toremember as they engaged in wars. i know you will say that it is the defense of country, so i ask you; which isto be respected, jesus and christianity or nation? when you ignore jesus you are either a lying christian or the bible lies. both cant be telling the truth.

but show us the satanic verses, and their abrogations. e need to see snd et the whole world judge what you claim. it is easy to lie and no challenge thrown against the lies.

Quote
how many times do you want me to post the same verse??if you go through my reply to babas787 i have posted the verses,and i know that mohammad obviously abrogated it in medina but that is not my concern because i personally believe he realised he wwas caught in an embarassing position and he skillfully tried to extricate himself, you know what they say about liars, they simply lie again to cover up the first one.so what exactly do you want to challenge??
that there is no satanic verses??
or that mohammad did not try to anull it and put foward abrogations explaining the context in which he uttered those words?

all abrogated verses were left in the Quran just as what abrogated them. Why not the satanic verses that you said abrogated, if truly there were such verses? te obvious conclusion is there were no satanic verses, so there were no abrogations to what neve existed. i am not making this statemeny because you have no proof, i am saying this in addition because if at anytime there was a moment alliance betwen the muslims, that time of utterance would have been it. we do know there was no time of peace until the triumph over makka, the reason they suffered continuosly and isolated at sometime, banished to outskirt of he city, attempts were made over the life of the prophet, and many minor hijr were made to even african egypt, before the final one to madina, and we do not hear at anytime that any of his people including his uncles who died disbelieving that they asked him; why did you change your statement after you have gain all of us as your ally? many views support the fact that there were no 'satanic verses', considering that Surah Kafiruun was revealed in makka and shaithan is always cursed by muslims; where do you think you can secure yourelf with lies, except that the muslims challenge you of them?

Quote from: nopuqeater on March 21, 2010, 02:10 PM
when we say your gods are not 1 but 3, we can see it and show you verses to buttress our positions. we will not beempty talkers like you. jesus didnt fight because he had sense that number and might will crush their adversary, in battle. or jesus was afraid, uncertain of theoutcome, not having a good supporting soldiers, even afte he prepared them for war, purchasing swords, with almost all teir belongings. it was supposed to be do or die, the reason you will trade everything except the cloh on your back, for ammunitions.

alhaji olabpowale, lol lol i am sure even you know this is a load of bollocks as u can see i have credited you in making comments backed up by the quran even though i know the quran is false.
jesus did not fight in spite of the multitudes who followed him and would have protected and fought for him,but because like he said that is what satan wanted so that his mission will be distrupted.
can imagine pastor adeboye sending 20,000 people to start matcheting muslims in jos and what the distraction will be?

please stop calling me Olabowale, since i am not he. jesus did not fight because he would have been defeated, except that God Almighty granted him victory. you cant say that jesus was a peaceful man since even as a man who had not began his ministry got angry with the money changers enough to turn over their trading desks. we cant say a prson like that is peaceful, when we also consider the verses where people were told to kill servants who do no produce enough wealth for the master. Adeboye can fight all he wants; if he wins it is because the people he won over were evil doers. i disagree with the muslim tribes who fought and killed innocent people, when you consider that muslims should not start a conflict and must not kill noncombatants. the muslims of today are not emulating Muhammad (AS) and for sure te jos or thos who start conflcts are disgrace to islam.
the other reason for adeboye to win is if Allah wills it so that Adeboye ad like mind will cntinue to go astray, since sometimes evils win, or thatthe muslims may actually take stock of their deeds, the muslims of Andulisia lost tothe cross worshippers of Spain, the same people the protestants call "idol/mary worshippers".

@Godson2009

irrespective of how infantille you might think of my comments simply answer these direct questions,
1.did i back up my assertions about gender inequality in islam yes or no?

I did not see it and I would not be requesting for same if I had seen it. My response showed where I joined the discusssion.

2.did i back up my assertions about the inherent violence in islam yes or no?

Check my response up please. There should be no problem if you had presented your 'supposed' response from your Oblongata . You only need to re-type or better still go to where you posted and do a 'copy and paste' for me.

3.did i back up my assertion about the specific verses reffered to as the satanic verses or not yes or no?

Specific verses ke . Oga, my response showed where I joined and do not have time to go back. There should be no problem if you had presented your 'supposed' response from your Oblongata . You only need to re-type or better still go to where you posted and do a 'copy and paste' for

4.did i not elaborate upon the "satanic verse" or not namely the assertion that the names of the godess was same as godess of the sun and one of the three godesss was actually connected to the moon,and how this was connected to islam bowing down to the sun??

I did not see it and I would not be requesting for same if I had seen it.

There should be no problem if you had presented your 'supposed' response from your Oblongata . You only need to re-type or better still go to where you posted and do a 'copy and paste' for

simply answer a yes or no , these arew the points or issues of contention between us and i have answered every one of those assertions with the rekllevant hadiths and quranic verses the rest are issues you intentionally try to confuse yourseles over.

I did not see it and I would not be requesting for same if I had seen it.

as for the holy spirit pointing to mohammad i hope u are satisfied with the bible verses posted by another helpful christian brother here showing conclusive proof that your assertions concerning that is a figment of your imagiations sire

Please, kindly direct to that post from your friend. I am realy interested in learning from you and your friend.

babs787:

@Godson2009

I did not see it and I would not be requesting for same if I had seen it. My response showed where I joined the discusssion.

permit me if i dont post a lot on each of your bullet points because i am also busy doing something else online check quran 4;34 yusuf ali translation which i prefer
"34. Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Allah is Most High, great (above you all)."
that is one example of gender inequality,as you kow there are several hadiths as well

babs787:

Check my response up please. There should be no problem if you had presented your 'supposed' response from your Oblongata . You only need to re-type or better still go to where you posted and do a 'copy and paste' for me.

this time i will avail you of two verses cause i am in a generous mood,
quran 2;191 same yusuf ali translation"191. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

quran 2;216 "216. Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not.
i still have more in your quran where these came from,

babs787:

Specific verses ke . Oga, my response showed where I joined and do not have time to go back. There should be no problem if you had presented your 'supposed' response from your Oblongata . You only need to re-type or better still go to where you posted and do a 'copy and paste' for

qurran 53;19-22 "19. Have ye seen Lat. and 'Uzza,

20. And another, the third (goddess), Manat?

21. What! for you the male sex, and for Him, the female?

22. Behold, such would be indeed a division most unfair!

i dont need to explain the controversy about the satanic verses again do i?if you dont know then wiki it out or google
i cant buy you a car and still be looking for a driver for you

babs787:

I did not see it and I would not be requesting for same if I had seen it.

Consulting Professor Alfred Guillaume on this topic provides a background to this Sura:
"The other gods mentioned in the Qur’an are all female deities: Al-Lat, al-‘Uzza, and Manat, which represented the Sun, the planet Venus, and Fortune, respectively; at Mecca they were regarded as daughters of Allah. The cult of Al-Lat was widespread. As Allah means ‘the god’, so Al-Lat means ‘the goddess’. She is mentioned by Herodotus; in old Arabian inscriptions; and in the pre-Islamic poets; and was the great mother goddess who, under various names, was worshipped all over the ancient world. Ta’if, a town near Mecca, was a centre of her worship. For the Meccan’s
(source;http://discoverislam.tripod.com/moon.html)
i will enjoin you to read the article as well,i have other more credible sources if you want,can you now see the connection of islam and the three gdesses??

babs787:

There should be no problem if you had presented your 'supposed' response from your Oblongata . You only need to re-type or better still go to where you posted and do a 'copy and paste' for
I did not see it and I would not be requesting for same if I had seen it.

i have addressed this in the previous block of comments,how am i doing so far my oblongata must be doing a good job loooool

babs787:

Please, kindly direct to that post from your friend. I am realy interested in learning from you and your friend.

dexmond
Posts: 300

Offline

Re: Who Is The Helper That Jesus(puh)said He Will Send If Not Prophet Mohammed(puh)
« #57 on: March 21, 2010, 05:54 PM »

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From the scriptures below and the questions that follow, I argue that Muslims claim that Mohammed is the Comforter/Holyghost is false.

Acts 13:2

While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit
said, "Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have
called them."


Was it Mohammed that asked the apostles to separate Barnabas and Saul? NO, therefore, Mohammed is not the Holy Spirit/Comforter

Matthew

28:19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in
the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

Did the apostles baptise in Mohammeds name? No, therefore, muslims claim that Mohammed is the HolyGhost/Comforter, is faulty
i hope you have learnt from these bible erses,which has effectively chattered your dreams of connecting your ibo made religion to christianity have a nice weekend