Phut:

You are a complete asshole. Talking about comprehension and the like. Try making some sense. Then and only then will people "understand" you. Doofus!

I am sorry.

I am only responsible for what I write. I am not responsible for what you comprehend.

Keep it moving please.

Nihilist:


I am sorry.

I was responsible for spewing a lot of gibberish. I promise to do better next time.

*pats him on the head* Now, that is much better

Ihuomadinihu:

What's the meaning of that? That you dislike Igbos doesn't mean history will not accord credit to Igbo people. Jaja was an Igbo man by birth who grew up in an Ijaw household. The story of Jaja reminds me of People with Nigerian and Foreign citizenship.
Jaja is Igbo,history cannot deny that fact. You should be grateful that an Igbo son became a thorn in Europeans butt and elevated Niger delta in a positive way. At the end of the day, Jaja is not the only person of Igbo descent in Opobo. My neighbours are proudly opobians of Igbo descent.

Good thinking ,good product..am always amazed at the height of ignorance regarding SOUth SOUTH an SOUTH EAST brotherhood. Some dudes were arguing yesterday as per who owns a particularly attire a Nigerian rapper was wearing-wether it was East or South an I had to tell the guy that south south and south East had a lot in common ,it was GOWON that divided us. .I mean we were one region,but the "bully" wanted to make sure no drop of oil was found or left in Igbo land an so decided to divide us. Regrettably that seed of discord seems to have grown to an alarming proportion.

Phut:


*pats him on the head* Now, that is much better

How old are you? 12?

Nihilist:




How old are you? 12?

No, 5. Now keep it moving. Hanlele!

Nihilist:


Like your friend who keeps quoting me out of context, you keep missing the point.

I am firmly focused on the era. Maybe I should break it down for you so that what is already simple might become apparent.

1. Jaja forced all Palm oil farmers in the opobo region to sell their produce to him alone, leaving him free to dictate the buying price. If a farmer chose not to sell to Jaja, that farmer had no access to the British market.

2. Jaja prevented the British traders from buying from farmers, leaving him free to dictate the selling price. The only way for a British trader to access Opobo oil was through Jaja.

3. He did not resist the offer of a protectorate, but he resisted British attempts to bypass him as a middle man and deal directly with producers.

Good business, but what is heroic about that?

Exactly..!!! You've eyes but you can't see.

What happened after the bristish took over..? Did the farmers benefit from direct access to the British market. Did the bristish not set their own price. Did the bristish let the farmer trade with other countries directly. The end result was still monopoly. From fry pan to fire..

The destructive aspect is that the whiteman now controls the destiny of the so called protectorate. Which has led to the destruction of the independent civilization of King Jaja struggles. There lies his heroism. For he had foresight and he defended it..

GooseBaba:


Exactly..!!! You've eyes but you can't see.

What happened after the bristish took over..? Did the farmers benefit from direct access to the British market. Did the bristish not set their own price. Did the bristish let the farmer trade with other countries directly. The end result was still monopoly. From fry pan to fire..

The destructive aspect is that the whiteman now controls the destiny of the so called protectorate. Which has led to the destruction of the independent civilization of King Jaja struggles. There lies his heroism. For he had foresight and he defended it..

What kind of weak argument is this?

Jaja was removed, what suggests to you that the traders of Opobo were worse off?

Nihilist:


What kind of weak argument is this?

Jaja was removed, what suggests to you that the traders of Opobo were worse off?

*faints*....!!!!! Smh


Slippery slope bro, Colonization Happened... Mind you we are not guessing the future. This already happened. The rich african men of that era leading up to 1914 were merchants not farmers.

Trickle down economy happened, monopoly continued. The well to do african merchant that dealt directly with bristish businessmen set his own price with the locals. Now from one middle man they now have 2 middle men. Whose profit do you think will be shaved..?

Study simple economics....

History

GooseBaba:


*faints*....!!!!! Smh


Slippery slope bro, Colonization Happened... Mind you we are not guessing the future. This already happened. The rich african men of that era leading up to 1914 were merchants not farmers.

Trickle down economy happened, monopoly continued. The well to do african merchant that dealt directly with bristish businessmen set his own price with the locals. Now from one middle man they now have 2 middle men. Whose profit do you think will be shaved..?

Study simple economics....

Mate your arguments are just hilarious.

Jaja signed away Opobo's sovreignty showing that he was not really opposed to a British Political Takeover.

That already rules out your theory that Jaja was some sort of bastion of indigenous rule.

The only thing Jaja is recorded opposing is an action that directly impacted on his finances.

your trickle down economics theory is not supported by the historical facts. Jaja was not an employer of labour. Jaja was not a producer. Jaja was not creating jobs or wealth. Jaja was not an industrialist. If I am wrong, produce some historical evidence to that effect.

Jaja was a wholesaler who forced farmers to sell to him on his terms,before selling that on for a profit.

Stop trying to over intellectualize an issue that only calls for common sense.

Good business man. Not a Hero

muktar10:
Is wike igbo tooo?

wike is nwaike ! Just théy ré changing their names to be less igbo. But we knw that wike is nwaike ezenwo is ezenwa. Ask thé gvr of River states hé knws what am saying. Nde ara. Even your south south dont exist in a World map. Just only in a division map in Nigeria thats where u Will see or here south south.

My final submission on this article.

Goosebaba, have a look at this article authored by Kemi Rotimi, (Ph.D. Department of History, Obafemi Awolowo University) and Olukoya Ogen, (Ph.D. Leventis Foundation Visiting Postdoctoral Fellow, Centre of African Studies, School of Oriental and African Studies, University of London).

Not only are the authors very learned in African history, this article appeared in a PAN AFRICAN MAGAZINE

Therefore, it is the humble position of this paper that the wars that Jaja and Nana fought were basically trade wars meant for the protection of their trading monopolies. Hence, their greatest significance lies in their roles as entrepreneurs cum super-merchants and not as proto-nationalists.

For example, they did not hesitate to sign treaties that effectively placed their kingdoms under the British Crown; and second, they mainly kicked against the clauses that granted free access to European traders.

This is the major reason why they deployed military forces which they were used to maintain their trading monopolies in the Niger Delta in defense of their strategic commercial interests against British interlopers.

Yet, in contrast, Jaja and Nana’s contemporaries such as Sultan Attahiru of Sokoto, Oba Ovonramwen of Benin and Awujale Aboki Tunwase of Ijebuland, to mention but a few, fought relentlessly to defend the corporate existence and political sovereignties of their respective kingdoms (Crowder 1968:134-136; Oduwobi 2004:34-36; Ayandele 1992: 21);


Jaja and Nana were not too fastidious about political sovereignty, but were primarily interested in obtaining explicit guarantees for the maintenance of their exclusive trading rights.

And most interestingly in this saga, Jaja and Nana also frustrated and prevented fellow African merchants living in their domains from threatening the trade monopolies which they enjoyed.

http://www.jpanafrican.com/docs/vol2no7/2.7_JajaAndNana.pdf

Nihilist:


Mate your arguments are just hilarious.

Jaja signed away Opobo's sovreignty showing that he was not really opposed to a British Political Takeover.

That already rules out your theory that Jaja was some sort of bastion of indigenous rule.

The only thing Jaja is recorded opposing is an action that directly impacted on his finances.

your trickle down economics theory is not supported by the historical facts. Jaja was not an employer of labour. Jaja was not a producer. Jaja was not creating jobs or wealth. Jaja was not an industrialist. If I am wrong, produce some historical evidence to that effect.

Jaja was a wholesaler who forced farmers to sell to him on his terms,before selling that on for a profit.

Stop trying to over intellectualize an issue that only calls for common sense.

Good business man. Not a Hero

Lmao!!! The issue here is if he was/ a hero... A good business man who was celebrated by his people and upon his death, they demanded for his remains and have him a kings burial.

Nihilist:


Mate your arguments are just hilarious.

Jaja signed away Opobo's sovreignty showing that he was not really opposed to a British Political Takeover.

That already rules out your theory that Jaja was some sort of bastion of indigenous rule.

The only thing Jaja is recorded opposing is an action that directly impacted on his finances.

your trickle down economics theory is not supported by the historical facts. Jaja was not an employer of labour. Jaja was not a producer. Jaja was not creating jobs or wealth. Jaja was not an industrialist. If I am wrong, produce some historical evidence to that effect.

Jaja was a wholesaler who forced farmers to sell to him on his terms,before selling that on for a profit.

Stop trying to over intellectualize an issue that only calls for common sense.

Good business man. Not a Hero

Lmao!!! The issue here is if he was/ a hero... A good business man who was celebrated by his people and upon his death, they demanded for his remains and gave him a kings burial.

That tells you that any PHD thesis on the subject matter does not take away his heroic accomplishment. Till this day, he is remembered for his accomplishment by his people for his heroic endeavor.

You talk about hostile takeover and you still blame Jaja for protecting his interest. You just dey throw words around anyhow..

GooseBaba:


Lmao!!! The issue here is if he was/ a hero... A good business man who was celebrated by his people and upon his death, they demanded for his remains and have him a kings burial.

Mate Hitler was celebrated by his people so that doesn't mean much.

Being a successful businessman does not make you a hero.

Otherwise Dangote, Cosmas Maduka, and Theophilus Danjuma are positively heroic.

GooseBaba:


Lmao!!! The issue here is if he was/ a hero... A good business man who was celebrated by his people and upon his death, they demanded for his remains and gave him a kings burial.

That tells you that any PHD thesis on the subject matter does not take away his heroic accomplishment. Till this day, he is remembered for his accomplishment by his people for his heroic endeavor.

You talk about hostile takeover and you still blame Jaja for protecting his interest. You just dey throw words around anyhow..

It seems that, like your friend earlier, you lack comprehension skills.

What Blame did I place anywhere?

I only pointed that Jaja was solely protecting his interests when he squared up to the British, and not protecting the interest of his people.

Was there a hostile takeover? Yes.

Did I give him props for being a business man? Yes.

Was he a nationalist hero? No

King Jaja!
The King in the SOUTH
My King

Nihilist:


Mate Hitler was celebrated by his people so that doesn't mean much.

Being a successful businessman does not make you a hero.

Otherwise Dangote, Cosmas Maduka, and Theophilus Danjuma are positively heroic.

Smh, are this people you mentioned representing a people or community..!?

In regards to hitler he remains a hero to his people. Go study why he started annexing other european countries. Simple resources control. Germany did not get her share of world War 1. The German economy was in ruins. Hitler simple wanted his share of the bounty. You're not looking at the big picture. After world War 2, what were europeans sharing.? The african bounty. You are looking at the means he used to make him less a hero. But forgetting that he was trying to collect what was due. Why do you think germany was allowed to flourish after world War 2..? Think man... Follow the money. It's all about resources..

Nihilist:


It seems that, like your friend earlier, you lack comprehension skills.

What Blame did I place anywhere?

I only pointed that Jaja was solely protecting his interests when he squared up to the British, and not protecting the interest of his people.

Was there a hostile takeover? Yes.

Did I give him props for being a business man? Yes.

Was he a nationalist hero? No

King Jaja was a ruler who protected his people! Call it what ever name u want! Being nationalist or whatever! He signed a treaty with the British Monarch that gave the nigeria state her independence without bloodshed! Nigeria independence would v been 1st in Africa b4 Ghana if not for the north

Nihilist:


It seems that, like your friend earlier, you lack comprehension skills.

What Blame did I place anywhere?

I only pointed that Jaja was solely protecting his interests when he squared up to the British, and not protecting the interest of his people.

Was there a hostile takeover? Yes.

Did I give him props for being a business man? Yes.

Was he a nationalist hero? No

I really don't get your argument. This is a man who grew from being a mere slave to a King. He then went ahead to establish his own Kingdom and named it himself. From the biography we just read, 14 out of the 18 houses in Bonny left their homes and followed him.

The guy didn't stop there. He established a successful business empire and controlled trade along the Imo River region. He built schools for his people that were at par with those in England.

He was so powerful that he even lent some of his soldiers to the British to fight the Ashanti people of Ghana. Tales of his deeds reached the Queen herself and she even recognized him personally for it!

Then most importantly, he was still able to stand up to the British government when he felt the existence of his people were threatened.

All these great feats for a mere slave boy! He may not be a hero to you, but to his people, he surely is one.

Nihilist:


It seems that, like your friend earlier, you lack comprehension skills.

What Blame did I place anywhere?

I only pointed that Jaja was solely protecting his interests when he squared up to the British, and not protecting the interest of his people.

Was there a hostile takeover? Yes.

Did I give him props for being a business man? Yes.

Was he a nationalist hero? No

You lack foresight. This is an open book discussion and you're still failing. Wealth moved out of the country after he was exiled, Are you expecting him to use supernatural power to negotiate a hostile takeover . You need power and leverage to bargain. A leader that already shows great vision for his people. What did the bristish build after they ruled for 80 years..?

Nowadays, a police or soldier dies in the line of duty, he is considered a hero. And a man that defended his vision and lived it, you want to call a greedy businessman.. " smh..

GooseBaba:


Smh, are this people you mentioned representing a people or community..!?
.

That is exactly the point.

At no point in history is it recorded that Jaja of Opobo was representing any other interests other than his own during his tete a tete with the British.

If You can consider Jaja a hero for protecting his narrow interests, then it follows Dangote and Cosmas are also heroes in their own rights

In regards to hitler he remains a hero to his people. Go study why he started annexing other european countries. Simple resources control. Germany did not get her share of world War 1. The German economy was in ruins. Hitler simple wanted his share of the bounty. You're not looking at the big picture. After world War 2, what were europeans sharing.? The african bounty. You are looking at the means he used to make him less a hero. But forgetting that he was trying to collect what was due. Why do you think germany was allowed to flourish after world War 2..? Think man... Follow the money. It's all about resources.

You're veering off into mumbo jumbo territory here now.

The Hitler example was to show you how subjective your criteria for the defining a hero was. This is not a discussion Hitler and/or Nazi Germany, but I have to correct you yet again. The treaty of Versailles was punitive, ergo Germany was paying reparation for it's aggression during the great war which it lost. If Germany lost the war, what bounty was Germany and/or Hitler trying to get?

Mate your knowledge of history, politics, and economics is suspect

The fact that Jaja is celebrated by his people does not make him a hero. He brought immense financial fortitude to his family who continue to rule Opobo today. This hereditary rule of Opobo alone is enough explanation for his deification in those parts.

ok

GooseBaba:


You lack foresight. This is an open book discussion and you're still failing. Wealth moved out of the country after he was exiled, Are you expecting him to use supernatural power to negotiate a hostile takeover . You need power and leverage to bargain. A leader that already shows great vision for his people. What did the bristish build after they ruled for 80 years..?

Nowadays, a police or soldier dies in the line of duty, he is considered a hero. And a man that defended his vision and lived it, you want to call a greedy businessman.. " smh..

Great foresight for his people?

How?

Where?

Even presented with informed opinions from learned fellows of the field, backed by historical accounts, you continue to spout utter hogwash.

I'm done.

Elipsis:
I really don't get your argument. This is a man who grew from being a mere slave to a King. He then went ahead to establish his own Kingdom and named it himself. From the biography we just read, 14 out of the 18 houses in Bonny left their homes and followed him.

The guy didn't stop there. He established a successful business empire and controlled trade along the Imo River region. He built schools for his people that were at par with those in England.

He was so powerful that he even lent some of his soldiers to the British to fight the Ashanti people of Ghana. Tales of his deeds reached the Queen herself and she even recognized him personally for it!

Then most importantly, he was still able to stand up to the British government when he felt the existence of his people were threatened.

All these great feats for a mere slave boy! He may not be a hero to you, but to his people, he surely is one.

Read the article again.

Then read my post again.

Then read this article
http://www.jpanafrican.com/docs/vol2no7/2.7_JajaAndNana.pdf

I'm done with this.

GooseBaba:


Exactly..!!! You've eyes but you can't see.

What happened after the bristish took over..? Did the farmers benefit from direct access to the British market. Did the bristish not set their own price. Did the bristish let the farmer trade with other countries directly. The end result was still monopoly. From fry pan to fire..

The destructive aspect is that the whiteman now controls the destiny of the so called protectorate. Which has led to the destruction of the independent civilization of King Jaja struggles. There lies his heroism. For he had foresight and he defended it..

On point!

The 1880s witnessed a severe trade depression that ruined some of the European firms trading in the Delta and threatened the survival of others. The surviving firms responded to the situation in two ways. First, they reached an agreement among themselves, though not with complete unanimity, to offer low prices for produce. Second, they claimed the right to go directly to the interior markets in order to sidestep the coastal middlemen and reduce the handling cost of produce.

The British firms wanted to get lower prices for the benefit of themselves and themselves alone. Every sensible person knows that the bigger a trade entity is, the bigger its bargaining powers. What the other house should have done is to enter into some sort of trade pact with the Ana Pepple house. Afterall, United we stand and divided we fall. But instead, because of jealousy" and "crabs in a bucket mentality, Manilla Pepple sought to take advantage of The Ana Pepple's house weakness, after the fire. Unfortunately for them, it boomeranged. And here we have people talking about hostile takeovers. Mtcheww! Infact, prior to the fire and the war, most of the houses willingly joined Ana Pepple house when they faced insolvency and such, and this was how Ana Pepple grew until Manilla Pepple came with its palava.

Kingship was impossible of attainment for anyone of slave origins in Bonny. Instead he (Jaja) sought another land where he could give full scope to his boundless energies.

A master strategist, he relocated in the Andoni country away from the seaboard at a strategic point at the mouth of the Imo river, the highway of trade between the coastal communities and the palm-oil rich Kwa Iboe and Igbo country. There, he survived the initial problems of a virgin settlement as well as incessant attacks of his Bonny enemies.

^^^
The beginnings of King Jaja's Kingdom.

For 18 years, Ja Ja ruled his kingdom with firmness and remarkable sagacity. He strengthened his relations with the hinterland palm-oil producers through judicious marriages and blood covenants which bound the parties into ritual kingship.

Strategic intermarriages. One of the prime ways in which kingdoms are grown.

How are civilizations formed? People come together for the greater good. They also give up some rights and freedoms for the greater good. It is laughable to suggest that independent farmers should trade directly with big British corporations that have the backing of the British government. Arrangements such as that would only result in a raping of the people. There was definitely the need for a King and if he bought from his subjects and sold to the British, then so be it. I daresay they would get even worse prices if they tried to stand alone. Its was for this reason that the British sought to overthrow the Indigenous sovereignty, declare a free for all and proceeds with the scramble for Africa.

But in the 1880s, the clouds of British imperialism were closing in menacingly on Opobo, the overthrow of indigenous sovereignties having been initiated by John Beecroft, the first British consul to Nigeria (1849-54). British imperialism had begun to assert itself forcefully; British officials on the spot were increasingly ignoring indigenous authorities, while British traders had begun to insist on trading directly with the hinterland palm-oil producers. Ja Ja tackled these formidable problems judiciously and with restraint.

The honeymoon between Ja Ja and the British turned out to be meteoric: the ultimate ambitions of the two ran at cross-purposes. Ja Ja guarded his independence jealously, had a tight grip on the interior markets and confined British traders to Opobo, away from these markets. made sure that the traders paid their comeys (customs and trade duties) as and when due[/b].

A great leader he was, making sure that they paid customs and trade duties which would inure to the benefit of Opobo people. Yes, King Jaja got rich. But so did the Queen of England. And so that doesn't make him any less of a great and heroic King.
On the other hand, the British wanted to overthrown the Indigenous sovereignties, declare it a no mans land, impose their rule and then turn around and tax the same people. How can any Nigerian want this, or be against a system that fought this?


The treaty of protection was foisted on King Jaja and the British reneged on their agreement not to take over his country.

In July 1884, fearing German intrusion in the Delta, the British consul, Edward Hewett, rushed to the area, foisting treaties of protection on the indigenous sovereignties. With a veiled threat from a man-of-war, Ja Ja too was stampeded into placing his kingdom under British protection. But unlike the other African monarchs, this was not before he had sought explanation for the word "protectorate," and had been assured by the consul that his independence would not be compromised. Hewett wrote to Ja Ja informing him, inter alia (among other things), that:
[b]the queen does not want to take your country [/b]or your markets, but at the same time she is anxious that no other nation should take them. She undertakes … [to] leave your country still under your government; she has no wish to disturb your rule.

The following year, European powers entered into the Treaty of Berlin which set the stage for the scramble and partition of Africa among themselves, without regard to the wishes of Africans. The treaty provided for free navigation on River Niger and other rivers, such as the Imo, linked to it. On the basis of this, the British consul asserted that British firms were within their rights to trade directly in the interior palm-oil markets. That same year, 1885, Britain proclaimed the Oil Rivers Protectorate, which included Ja Ja's territory. Sending a delegation to the British secretary of states for the colonies to protest these actions by right of the treaty of 1884, Ja Ja's protest fell on deaf ears. A man of his word, he was shocked at Britain reneging on her pledge.

Harry Johnston, acting vice-consul, a young hothead anxious to advance his colonial career, imagined that Ja Ja would be a perfect stepping-stone to attain his ambition. Arriving at Opobo on a man-of-war, Johnston invited Ja Ja for a discussion on how to resolve the points of friction between Opobo and the British traders and officials. Said Johnston:

I hereby assure you that whether you accept or reject my proposals tomorrow, no restrictions will be put on you - you will be free to go as soon as you have heard my message.

But again the British reneged on their pledge: Ja Ja would not return to his kingdom alive. Once on board the warship Goshawk, Johnston confronted him with a deportation order or the complete destruction of Opobo.

Rather than face complete destruction of Opobo, his Kingdom which he had founded, he chose the lesser of two evils; deportation. And this sacrifice among others is what makes him a hero in the eyes of his people.

Today, an imposing statue of Ja Ja stands in the center of Opobo with the inscription:
A king in title and in deed. Always just and generous.

To his people he is a King and a hero. And that he shall remain. End of ....

Nihilist:


Great foresight for his people?

How?

Where?

Even presented with informed opinions from learned fellows of the field, backed by historical accounts, you continue to spout utter hogwash.

I'm done.

If you like you done or you cook that one na your own..

Meanwhile, there is something called critical thinking, which you clearly lack. After reading about history do you just accept it without question. So informed opinions can no longer be questioned ba?

King Jaja becomes a hero, when his people says so..not when historians point out his tactics of survival, his ego or personal interest. You read but you don't think.

GooseBaba:


If you like you done or you cook that one na your own..

Meanwhile, there is something called critical thinking, which you clearly lack. After reading about history do you just accept it without question. So informed opinions can no longer be questioned ba?

King Jaja becomes a hero, when his people says so..not when historians point out his tactics of survival, his ego or personal interest. You read but you don't think.

Mate you really need to stop quoting me out of context.

You keep exposing a lack of intelligence, and comprehension skills.

If at this stage in the discussion, you are contending that Jaja was a hero merely because his 'people' say so, then you are so far back mentally, there is no point trying to drag you along.

I'm done with this.

Nihilist:


Mate you really need to stop quoting me out of context.

You keep exposing a lack of intelligence, and comprehension skills.

If at this stage in the discussion, you are contending that Jaja was a hero merely because his 'people' say so, then you are so far back mentally, there is no point trying to drag you along.

I'm done with this.

And you say he is not a hero with what measurement..!?

When will Nigerians learn to celebrate their own


Anyway, I pray we see even better Nationalists in this generation and the ones to come.

if histories like this are taught very comprehensively in school maybe Nigerians and Africans will have more sense to always suspect the whiteman and his Denonic plans.

Thanks 4 d article I gained a lot. I admire Jaja's intelligence but @ d same time. I dislike is actions of sending troopS 2 take over an African city stae.