According to the book of Revelations, Jesus was crucified at the creation of the world, Revelations 13: 8;

King James Version
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the [size=15pt]Lamb slain from the foundation of the world[/size].


New International Version
All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the [size=15pt]Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world[/size].


So why do Christian keep trying to tell lies about some crucifixion happening about 2000 years ago?  Common Christians, shape up.

is ur name in that book?

The secrets of those that changed the bible is unveiling, thank God for that, so Jesus never died but after completing his mission he went to heaven, that means the HOLY QURAN came to really clearify the untold, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaba, won tin gba wa men, ori won ko FOKASILE, its just that xtians are stubborn in accepting the REAL TRUTH, and they are the same BEAST holding power to rule the world as they claimed to be INFALLIBLE meaning GOD,may GOD help us sha

uplawal:

The secrets of those that changed the bible is unveiling, thank God for that, so Jesus never died but after completing his mission he went to heaven, that means the HOLY QURAN came to really clearify the untold, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaba, won tin gba wa men, ori won ko FOKASILE, its just that xtians are stubborn in accepting the REAL TRUTH, and they are the same BEAST holding power to rule the world as they claimed to be INFALLIBLE meaning GOD,may GOD help us sha

we have accepted the truth a long time ago. We know that the bible was corrupted and the corrupt version is called the "KORAN"

huxley:

According to the book of Revelations, Jesus was crucified at the creation of the world, Revelations 13: 8;

King James Version
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the [size=15pt]Lamb slain from the foundation of the world[/size].


New International Version
All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the [size=15pt]Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world[/size].


So why do Christian keep trying to tell lies about some crucifixion happening about 2000 years ago? Common Christians, shape up.

since the bible says that jesus was crucified or killed from the creation of the world why did the noah's flood take place? its very clear that the redactors of the bible did not even bother to cross check to see that the different writing myths agree with each other. . .

noetic:

is ur name in that book?

don't go and write your own book, keep on deluding your self waiting for your name to appear in a non existent imaginary book that only exists in your deluded imaginations. . .

uplawal:

The secrets of those that changed the bible is unveiling, thank God for that, so Jesus never died but after completing his mission he went to heaven, that means the HOLY QURAN came to really clearify the untold, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaba, won tin gba wa men, ori won ko FOKASILE, its just that xtians are stubborn in accepting the REAL TRUTH, and they are the same BEAST holding power to rule the world as they claimed to be INFALLIBLE meaning GOD,may GOD help us sha

what is this you think the koran (another book of myths and lies) is better than the bible?

huxley:

According to the book of Revelations, Jesus was crucified at the creation of the world, Revelations 13: 8;

King James Version
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the [size=15pt]Lamb slain from the foundation of the world[/size].


New International Version
All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the [size=15pt]Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world[/size].


So why do Christian keep trying to tell lies about some crucifixion happening about 2000 years ago? Common Christians, shape up.

This is a new one I never knew that Jesus was crucified or killed since the creation of the world. why then did the Noah's flood take place in the bible since Jesus was killed since the beginning of the world?

huxley

stop using the KJV it has errors in it.

But anyway

In the foreknowledge of God; and inasmuch as all mercy and grace, from the beginning, was given in view of his death and passion
The is the foreknowledge of God, inasmuch as all mercry and grace from the beginning was given in view of his death and passion. Remember in the beginning Christ was prophecied to come. God already knew he would be slain. Look up Gen 3:15

~Lady~:

huxley

stop using the KJV it has errors in it.

But anyway

In the foreknowledge of God; and inasmuch as all mercy and grace, from the beginning, was given in view of his death and passion
The is the foreknowledge of God, inasmuch as all mercry and grace from the beginning was given in view of his death and passion. Remember in the beginning Christ was prophecied to come. God already knew he would be slain. Look up Gen 3:15

Yes, but when was jesus slain? Was it about 2000 years ago, or was it at the creation of the world as Rev says?

~Lady~:

huxley

stop using the KJV it has errors in it.

But anyway

In the foreknowledge of God; and inasmuch as all mercy and grace, from the beginning, was given in view of his death and passion
The is the foreknowledge of God, inasmuch as all mercry and grace from the beginning was given in view of his death and passion. Remember in the beginning Christ was prophecied to come. God already knew he would be slain. Look up Gen 3:15

the biblegod already knew he will be slain eh? revelation says that he was killed since the beginning of creation. . . . . .

Why do deluded Christian continue believing Jesus was killed about 2000 years ago when the bible clearly says it happen at the creation of the world?

huxley:

Why do deluded Christian continue believing Jesus was killed about 2000 years ago when the bible clearly says it happen at the creation of the world?

what does the foundation/creation of the world mean? where u there? was it a PHYSICAL experience?

Jesus was crucified 2000 years ago, as known and willed by the father at the FOUNDATION/CREATION of the world.

Unless a grain dies, it shall remain a grain. The truth is if your eyes are opened to the truth, the answer to your question is pretty simple. But you need to experience your eyes being opened and it is not something that you control.

It comes by the way of grace, which nobody can give you here. So, the first thing to ask for is to say ' Lord please open my eyes and my heart so that I could understand these things.' You may start by saying the lord's prayer several times a day and you can also read this book "Jesus Christ Catholic". I cannot remember the author, but you will be blown away by so many things. For example, how Abraham's skull was hidden away for so many generations until it was buried at "the place of the Skull" where Christ was finally crucified. You are going to be blown away, if you ask that your eyes be opened to the truth. Hopefully you can stand the truth when you see it.

Just you know, I am not a priest, a pastor or even a "good christian." I just like to read about mysteries.

Kivaro:

Unless a grain dies, it shall remain a grain. The truth is if your eyes are opened to the truth, the answer to your question is pretty simple. But you need to experience your eyes being opened and it is not something that you control.

It comes by the way of grace, which nobody can give you here. So, the first thing to ask for is to say ' Lord please open my eyes and my heart so that I could understand these things.' You may start by saying the lord's prayer several times a day and you can also read this book "Jesus Christ Catholic". I cannot remember the author, but you will be blown away by so many things. For example, how Abraham's skull was hidden away for so many generations until it was buried at "the place of the Skull" where Christ was finally crucified. You are going to be blown away, if you ask that your eyes be opened to the truth. Hopefully you can stand the truth when you see it.

Just you know, I am not a priest, a pastor or even a "good christian." I just like to read about mysteries.

Yes, blown away if I had a mind as addled and perforated as yours. What is your basis for accepting these "mysteries" as true?

Sure, I said what I needed to say. Ask that your eyes be opened and then you will understand. Most of us start life with milk and then graduate to solid food. Someone on milk might get constipation if he/she took solid food. Until then, Bro!

noetic:

what does the foundation/creation of the world mean? where u there? was it a PHYSICAL experience?

Jesus was crucified 2000 years ago, as known and willed by the father at the FOUNDATION/CREATION of the world.

is this one of your usual meaningless spin on things the bible says? the bible says that parents should stone to death disobedient children and you tried to spin it by saying the children practiced treason. . .now the passage in revelation clearly says that jesus was slain from the creation of the world. you are now trying to spin it to mean that it was willed by the father at the FOUNDATION/CREATION of the world. the passage says he was slain from the creation not that the father willed that he will be slain. . . is this one of your disobedience to parents = treason?

@ Huxley.

The passage doesn't say what you think it does.

Read it again.

It says "slain from the creation of the World". Not "slain at the creation of the world".

Put another way it could read "slain as a result of the creation of the World". It has nothing to do with a specific time period. It's saying that once the World was created, the Lamb was destined to die.

Bastage:

@ Huxley.

The passage doesn't say what you think it does.

Read it again.

It says "slain from the creation of the World". Not "slain at the creation of the world".

Put another way it could read "slain as a result of the creation of the World". It has nothing to do with a specific time period. It's saying that once the World was created, the Lamb was destined to die.

if i say that corruption has been endemic in nigeria since[b] from [/b]independence, what does that tell you?. . . .

I think that we are not taking into account that there are two regimes being referred to here.  One is the temporal and the other is the eternal.  It is a common mistake to look at eternal things and try to understand them with a temporal way of thinking, mainly because our brains evolved to deal with temporal reality. 

That is why we have questions like 'what precedes God'? or 'Who created God'?  There is no before or after when we talk about eternal things.  There is no time, so before and after do not come into play.  Language fails to deal with the eternal because Language is designed to articulate temporal things that's why in grammar we learn the different tenses, past tense, present tense, future tense. 

Slain at/from the foundation of the world does not refer to a point in time. Time is a part of creation.  We could also say slain at the foundation of Time. 

An event in eternity can have an avatar in time and it will not matter when it time it occurs, whether in the past, now, or in the future.  That event already exists eternally in Eternity but will exist for a short span of time in temporal reality whether this is in the past or in the present or in the yet to come. 
In fact it was a common philosophical and religious idea that temporal events are just copies of eternal events.  Plato was big on this, the idea that the physical world is but a likeness of the eternal world.  So events in the temporal are just pseudo-manifestation of events in the eternal.  Things are translated from Being to Becoming.  Eternally they exist always as Being, but temporally they Become for a short span and then Pass away again.  Literally THEY HAPPEN (in French ILS PASSent, in old english They come to PASS). 

The cruxifiction 2000 years ago was a temporal passing event, an avatar of an eternal event that IS prior to the foundation of TIME and CREATION. 

23 It was necessary then that the figurative representations of the things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with sacrifices better than these.

24 For the Christ is not entered into holy places made with hand, figures of the true (read copies of the true-pastor aio), but into heaven itself, now to appear before the face of God for us:

25 nor in order that he should offer himself often, as the high priest enters into the holy places every year with blood not his own;

26 since he had then been obliged often to suffer from the foundation of the world. But now once in the consummation of the ages he has been manifested for the putting away of sin by his sacrifice. (read now, in recent times, temporally, at the END of ages he has been manifested.)

Hebrews 9

mazaje:

if i say that corruption has been endemic in nigeria since[b] from [/b]independence, what does that tell you?. . . .

It doesn't tell me anything as it's not grammatical.

You can have either "since" or "from" but not both in the same sentence.

You've also got to remember that "slain" is a past verb whereas "corruption" in your sentence is a noun so you can't make a comparison with your own sentence and the Bible passage as they are incompatible.


Grammatically, the only way the Bible passage can make sense is in the way I've defined it in my first post - Christ was destined to die from the beginning.


Incidentally, my own personal opinion is that Revelation is a crock of shit. A view shared by a large number of the clergy who never wanted it included in the Bible in the first place - the time it is "prophesising" passed long ago with the Roman Empire and it is now utterly irrelevant. I see it as no more than the carrot and the stick book that gets all of the idiot fundamentalists frothing at the mouth.

Bastage:

It doesn't tell me anything as it's not grammatical.

You can have either "since" or "from" but not both in the same sentence.

You've also got to remember that "slain" is a past verb whereas "corruption" in your sentence is a noun so you can't make a comparison with your own sentence and the Bible passage as they are incompatible.


Grammatically, the only way the Bible passage can make sense is in the way I've defined it in my first post - Christ was destined to die from the beginning.


Incidentally, my own personal opinion is that Revelation is a crock of shit. A view shared by a large number of the clergy who never wanted it included in the Bible in the first place - the time it is "prophesising" passed long ago with the Roman Empire and it is now utterly irrelevant. I see it as no more than the carrot and the stick book that gets all of the idiot fundamentalists frothing at the mouth.

it wasn't "prophesising" anything. . . the book is just the rants of a disturbed man. . . with ideas, imaginations and fantasies that fit only a disturbed and deluded individual. . .

mazaje:

it wasn't "prophesising" anything. . . the book is just the rants of a disturbed man. . . with ideas, imaginations and fantasies that fit only a disturbed and deluded individual. . .

Actually it was "prophesising".

It's about the downfall of the Roman Empire.

Take it in the context of the times it was written in. The author was a Christian at a time when Rome was set against Christianity. It wasn't until the 19th century that it became to be considered as a "vision of the future" as modern day fundamentalists look upon it now.

I'm not suggesting for one second that it is accurate - although Rome eventually fell, it did so without fulfilling any of the "prophesies" in Revelation.

Good link below describing how and why Revelation was written:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/apocalypse/revelation/white.html

i need to start reading my bible

lady bam:

i need to start reading my bible

What have you long been doing?

Pastor AIO:

I think that we are not taking into account that there are two regimes being referred to here.  One is the temporal and the other is the eternal.  It is a common mistake to look at eternal things and try to understand them with a temporal way of thinking, mainly because our brains evolved to deal with temporal reality. 

That is why we have questions like 'what precedes God'? or 'Who created God'?  There is no before or after when we talk about eternal things.  There is no time, so before and after do not come into play.  Language fails to deal with the eternal because Language is designed to articulate temporal things that's why in grammar we learn the different tenses, past tense, present tense, future tense. 

Slain at/from the foundation of the world does not refer to a point in time. Time is a part of creation.  We could also say slain at the foundation of Time. 

An event in eternity can have an avatar in time and it will not matter when it time it occurs, whether in the past, now, or in the future.  That event already exists eternally in Eternity but will exist for a short span of time in temporal reality whether this is in the past or in the present or in the yet to come. 
In fact it was a common philosophical and religious idea that temporal events are just copies of eternal events.  Plato was big on this, the idea that the physical world is but a likeness of the eternal world.  So events in the temporal are just pseudo-manifestation of events in the eternal.  Things are translated from Being to Becoming.  Eternally they exist always as Being, but temporally they Become for a short span and then Pass away again.  Literally THEY HAPPEN (in French ILS PASSent, in old english They come to PASS). 

The cruxifiction 2000 years ago was a temporal passing event, an avatar of an eternal event that IS prior to the foundation of TIME and CREATION. 
Hebrews 9

You have come back again with this eternal/temporal business without so much as defining or giving examples as to what they are. In fact, nothing in the above address the question I asked. And then you expect me to respond!

huxley:

You have come back again with this eternal/temporal business without so much as defining or giving examples as to what they are. In fact, nothing in the above address the question I asked. And then you expect me to respond!

I didn't think that I'd need to define them. I thought you were familiar with them.

basically Time is what you experience as before, now and after.

When experience is no longer arranged in terms of the passage of time then we get a glimpse of the eternal. Eternal is timelessness.

I am not making this up. Many people have discussed this before me. Even in Science, your favourite Big Bang theory suggests that Time comes into existence at some stage of the Big Bang. Believe me, Cessation of Time is not my invention. Maybe if I was a physicists then you'll take what I'm saying more seriously but since I'm not you just dismiss it. I'd rather you actually addressed it and if it is not intellectually sound, feel free to take it apart. Now I know that you are quite capable of dissecting weak arguments. You do it all the time on nairaland. So oblige me, kind sire.

I don't know how you can say that what I wrote did not even address your question. Did you read verses 25 and 26 of the hebrews chapter I quoted. I'll repeat it.

25 nor in order that he should offer himself often, as the high priest enters into the holy places every year with blood not his own;

26 since he had then been obliged often to suffer from the foundation of the world. But now once in the consummation of the ages he has been manifested for the putting away of sin by his sacrifice.

How do you reconcile the two contradicting statements in verse 26. a) . . . suffer from the foundation of the world. and b) . . .now at the consummation of the ages he has been manifested . . .?

It seems to me that there is more depth to this than your shallow reading allows for, don't you think?