Firefire:


Leave the myopic thugs to be gallivanting around the cyber space.

all these APC maggot wat is the difference between APC and pdp

anonimi:


Thank you o jare, bros for asking the right question. All the zombie followers of Sai Bubu & his 40 thieves nor fit ask better questions oh!
We know the NAMES of the worstest elements in PDP.
We also know how they have CHANGEd to born-to-gain progreTHIEVES in the assembly of APCheat.
Those who want to DECEIVE themselves otherwise are free to do. Abi shebi we are in a democracy with freedom of speech, thought and association!




www.nairaland.com/attachments/2102459_apcteam_png6dc9407cdcc2b68174c445361fc3e4c9

those names listed with which name did they steal,if they ever stole at all, did they steal or commit atrocity and impunity using apc stamp to corrupt d country? I just want to make #commonsense

wise up, we hv a leader and nothig is working rather things are going down in the drain, what is the headache now people are going home sacked because some body is some where blaming me or you be wise and think fast, complain and return the one talent giving to you

PassingShot:

We owe a dutyto educate the ignorant ones here.

Let them provide us the name of the party that did if not PDP.

This OP PassingShot has realized that Nigerians really are not very intelligent people, or how else can somebody ever advance this kind of argument? That the looters who left PDP and moved to APC just last year have become heavenly angels and certified saints capable of doing no wrong? These people represented by the OP hold the average Nigerian in contempt.

PassingShot is attempting to mesmerize us with an adroit footwork of illogical and incongruous nonsense.

Zombie nation.

As far as i am concern, pdp did nothing to this country. its was our selfish citizens. individually, people in their own ways are corrupt. the so-called apc members used to be in the so called destructive party, they destroyed the party and left 4 nonsense change. who told u the country needs change? the country only needs us to stop being greedy and selfish, stop being individualistic. stop being myopic because of sentiments. be logical and reasonable. Stand up 4 what is right, charity begins at home.

Niceiroko:
wise up, we hv a leader and nothig is working rather things are going down in the drain, what is the headache now people are going home sacked because some body is some where blaming me or you be wise and think fast, complain and return the one talent giving to you

Nigeria of today gives better hope and prospects that what GEJ left behind.
Tell me what is not working that should be working within five months of this regime.
Common sense tells us that it's easier to destroy and much more difficult to repair. Not so?

BELAEBY:
As far as i am concern, pdp did nothing to this country. its was our selfish citizens. individually, people in their own ways are corrupt. the so-called apc members used to be in the so called destructive party, they destroyed the party and left 4 nonsense change. who told u the country needs change? the country only needs us to stop being greedy and selfish, stop being individualistic. stop being myopic because of sentiments. be logical and reasonable. Stand up 4 what is right, charity begins at home.

Why are you sounding pained and confused?

In one breath, you said we didn't need change even though you agreed many are corrupt. In another breath you said we need to change our ways!

Those politicians who were able to loot the treasury could do so and get away with it because of the type of leadership and ideology of stealing not corruption of PDP. Let them come and steal as they did in PDP and see what becomes of them.

Bro the facts remains that party is made up of people, is the people in the party that have brought us to this quagmire and is still the same people that are now shouting change in the APC. is it difficult to understand?

PassingShot:
It’s unfortunate that politics has made many to become irrational and illogical in their reasoning. This fact is more pronounced on this forum by many members from both sides of the divide (APC & PDP).

I read with astonishment, an attempt by TonyeBarcanista to stand logic on its head with a thread claiming that it’s illogical to say PDP destroyed Nigeria for sixteen years! What an absurdity and irresponsibility!

If any sane human being wants to argue against the fact that it was PDP that destroyed Nigeria for sixteen years, the person will need to at least provide the name of the party that did. It won’t be enough to tell us that some of those in PDP who contributed to ruining Nigeria in those sixteen years have either moved to APC or another party. Anyone who maintains that PDP is not responsible is illogical and is committing fallacy of Ignoratio elenchi (diverting argument to unrelated issues).

What is Logic?
In logic, necessity and sufficiency are implicational relationships between statements. The assertion that one statement is a necessary and sufficient condition of another means that the former statement is true if and only if the latter is true. That is, the two statements must be either simultaneously true or simultaneously false. 
In ordinary English, 'necessary' and 'sufficient' indicate relations between conditions or states of affairs, not statements. Being a male sibling is a necessary and sufficient condition for being a brother. Fred's being a male sibling is necessary and sufficient for the truth of the statement that Fred is a brother.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necessity_and_sufficiency

Applying the above explanation, it’s no rocket science to understand that if President Obasanjo was in PDP in the eight years he ruled, PDP as a party is responsible for the outcome of his leadership in those eight years. This fact will hold true for eternity even if he changes party ten times thereafter.

From 1999 to 2015, the three presidents we have had in Nigeria (OBJ, Yar’Adua and GEJ) all belonged in PDP throughout their tenure and there is NOTHING anyone can say or do to change the fact that it was PDP that ruled in those years. To conclude otherwise (or attempt to), will only expose the arguer as an illogical, unreasonable and a mischievous entity.

Factors that determine success or failure of a party
The writer of the referenced article failed to consider the following factors that resulted in failure of PDP. Instead, he dwelled ignorantly or mischievously on occurrences (defections) that didn’t have any impact on the fact that those defectors were in PDP when the party ruled for the sixteen years under review.

Party’s Ideology
A party’s philosophy is very important in shaping how the party is perceived by the populace. At a point, PDP was known and addressed as a “killer party” because of the members’ attitude of settling their political scores by assassination of their opponents and foes within. Pa Alfred Rewane, Chief Bola Ige, Funsho Williams, Eyo Eyo, Marshall Harry, Barnabas Igwe and many others were brutally murdered during PDP reign. Not a single of those assassinations has been resolved till date.

Another prominent ideology of PDP is corruption. Whether the party sympathizers online and offline like to hear it or not, PDP took corruption in Nigeria to another level. During OBJ’s regime, it was not uncommon to hear and read how the NASS was bombarded with Ghana-Must-Go bags starched with hard currencies to bribe NASS members to do the biddings of the presidency. We were not kids not to remember how Ken Nnamani, Emwerem, and Okadigbo were all removed through bribing of senate members.

Under PDP there were high profile corruption cases that remain unresolved till date. Pension scam (30 billion naira); Oil Subsidy fraud in which many were arraigned for defrauding the nation of billions of dollars in subsidies they never earned; Nigerian Immigration Scam where many innocent souls were lost and no one was brought to justice; Stella Oduah’s N255m BMW and Kerosene Scam just to mention a few.

Implication of PDP philosophy of political assassination and corruption is that a person with different belief who finds himself in such a party can easily be swayed into taking up the party’s crude and wicked ways of doing things. An example is a case of a PDP senator in 2007 that rejected his share of bribery on three occasions but finally gave in on the fourth occasion when he had become overwhelmed by the incessant approaches by his party to toe the party’s line.

Similarly, a crooked politician can be straightened by the good ideology of his party if he soon discovers that his crude ways have no place in his party’s belief.

Leadership
There is the common saying that when the head is rotten, it affects the whole body. This saying aptly describes the type of leaders we have had in PDP. It is the type of leadership that determines how the followers behave. When PDP politicians knew that OBJ was in the habit of bribing his way in the national assembly, what and who would have stopped them from engaging in their own “lootocracy”?
Whence PDP politicians knew that “stealing was not corruption” under GEJ, and also knew that keeping “the goats and yams” together (the politicians and the treasury) was enough justification for them to loot with reckless abandon, who/what would have stopped them from stealing?

Absence of good leadership from PDP in the sixteen years it ruled is well documented such that no one can wish it away. No amount of articles or campaign can sweep those unfortunate years away from Nigeria’s history and it makes mockery of anyone attempting to re-write the history because Nigerians are largely no fools. Those with short memories will always be reminded at the right time.

Lastly, the corrupt politicians who have moved from PDP to APC cannot now be termed saints. They remain with stains and their corruption cases/allegations still hang on their neck and we hope they are eventually brought to justice. However, what is more important to Nigerians now is how they behave under new leadership and a new party with sane ideologies.

The question is, if PDP is not responsible for ruining Nigeria in the sixteen years it ruled, which party did?

Nigeria shall be great again!

you're right about your angle of argument and so does your referred article. But why people will agree with the previous post more is because of the moment in time. Like someone said, if APC top decision making group were all virtually PDP top decision making group as at the rot time, it therefore means we are dealing with just 3 letters and not people, that is if we have to exonerate them totally. And now we should rely on party philosophy? Well I bet the philosophy doesn't create itself right? And won't obey itself right? Thing is, with your stand on national issues at this level, you are not serving the interest of the nation. It's a case of misplaced priority. Rise above the blame game and see that PMB has to start Asap if he truly wanna help us. Change can't be hidden... when it comes even the blind will feel it. Trust me I don't do party. Am a Nigerian who believes in Nigeria. Don't burn defending a devil. Nice way to think though.

What we are experiencing is what the late Fela Anikulapo referred to as Association of International Thief Thief (ITT)

Where are we heading,when evry "so called" currupt leaders are now in d "so called" RIGHTEOUS party APC..SMH,we really have to stop the blame Game and get 2 work

PassingShot:


Party’s Ideology
A party’s philosophy is very important in shaping how the party is perceived by the populace. At a point, PDP was known and addressed as a “killer party” because of the members’ attitude of settling their political scores by assassination of their opponents and foes within. Pa Alfred Rewane, Chief Bola Ige, Funsho Williams, Eyo Eyo, Marshall Harry, Barnabas Igwe and many others were brutally murdered during PDP reign. Not a single of those assassinations has been resolved till date.

Another prominent ideology of PDP is corruption. Whether the party sympathizers online and offline like to hear it or not, PDP took corruption in Nigeria to another level. During OBJ’s regime, it was not uncommon to hear and read how the NASS was bombarded with Ghana-Must-Go bags starched with hard currencies to bribe NASS members to do the biddings of the presidency. We were not kids not to remember how Ken Nnamani, Emwerem, and Okadigbo were all removed through bribing of senate members.

Under PDP there were high profile corruption cases that remain unresolved till date. Pension scam (30 billion naira); Oil Subsidy fraud in which many were arraigned for defrauding the nation of billions of dollars in subsidies they never earned; Nigerian Immigration Scam where many innocent souls were lost and no one was brought to justice; Stella Oduah’s N255m BMW and Kerosene Scam just to mention a few.

Implication of PDP philosophy of political assassination and corruption is that a person with different belief who finds himself in such a party can easily be swayed into taking up the party’s crude and wicked ways of doing things. An example is a case of a PDP senator in 2007 that rejected his share of bribery on three occasions but finally gave in on the fourth occasion when he had become overwhelmed by the incessant approaches by his party to toe the party’s line.

Similarly, a crooked politician can be straightened by the good ideology of his party if he soon discovers that his crude ways have no place in his party’s belief.

In your mind APC has an ideology,abi?
The ideologies in all Nigerian parties are power and corruption.

PassingShot, let me ask you this question. If PDP is dissolved and those corrupt men move to a new party who then do we blame? As in, when you then blame PDP what image do you see?

PassingShot:

You're shouting the same thing for which you're being educated about.
The leadership provided by a party determines what and how the party members behave. Is that too much to comprehend?

Not at all. It's not?
Let's take a stock of the folks who constitute the current leadership of the APC, shall we?
There's no need naming names, but asides Buhari (whose leadership antecedents has been called into question severally), pray tell, how many leaders in the APC can you conscientiously single out as worthy in character?

If your company condones late coming, surely many who are not given in to coming late will soon resume late for work. On the other hand, if your company does not tolerate late coming, even the perpetual late comers will straighten their way.

Look at it this way, the only people who will straighten their ways are mere employees who really don't have a say in how the coy is run.
But if I were one of the people who brought the man who made that policy into play, chances are that I will continue to do things my way, perhaps, I'll change MO, but does it really change who/what I am at the core?.You do not try to bite the fingers that feed you, else you'll be burnt. You don't express your will to fight corruption with the same people who have seriously damaging and questionable character and expect people to throw in their vote of confidence to you.

You mentioned the Saraki case.
Even Gbawe has so far admitted that he was being politically witch hunted because of the choices he made. Whether you believe or not, Saraki is being tried today because he got in bed with the PDP.
Have you bothered asking yourself how come a Saraki case that was adjourned indefinitely by a competent court reconvened the next day, just after Amaechi was confirmed?

Did you see the copies of that document I posted?
I'd like to know your take.

Now tell me, who makes a company? Not individuals? Has that absolved the leadership of its responsibilities?

Again, I ask, Pshot, who were the leaders of the then PDP, and who are those who now make up the intricate fabric of the APC?

Common sense please!

I reserve my comment.

PassingShot:
It’s unfortunate that politics has made many to become irrational and illogical in their reasoning. This fact is more pronounced on this forum by many members from both sides of the divide (APC & PDP).

I read with astonishment, an attempt by TonyeBarcanista to stand logic on its head with a thread claiming that it’s illogical to say PDP destroyed Nigeria for sixteen years! What an absurdity and irresponsibility!

If any sane human being wants to argue against the fact that it was PDP that destroyed Nigeria for sixteen years, the person will need to at least provide the name of the party that did. It won’t be enough to tell us that some of those in PDP who contributed to ruining Nigeria in those sixteen years have either moved to APC or another party. Anyone who maintains that PDP is not responsible is illogical and is committing fallacy of Ignoratio elenchi (diverting argument to unrelated issues).

What is Logic?
In logic, necessity and sufficiency are implicational relationships between statements. The assertion that one statement is a necessary and sufficient condition of another means that the former statement is true if and only if the latter is true. That is, the two statements must be either simultaneously true or simultaneously false. 
In ordinary English, 'necessary' and 'sufficient' indicate relations between conditions or states of affairs, not statements. Being a male sibling is a necessary and sufficient condition for being a brother. Fred's being a male sibling is necessary and sufficient for the truth of the statement that Fred is a brother.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necessity_and_sufficiency

Applying the above explanation, it’s no rocket science to understand that if President Obasanjo was in PDP in the eight years he ruled, PDP as a party is responsible for the outcome of his leadership in those eight years. This fact will hold true for eternity even if he changes party ten times thereafter.

From 1999 to 2015, the three presidents we have had in Nigeria (OBJ, Yar’Adua and GEJ) all belonged in PDP throughout their tenure and there is NOTHING anyone can say or do to change the fact that it was PDP that ruled in those years. To conclude otherwise (or attempt to), will only expose the arguer as an illogical, unreasonable and a mischievous entity.

Factors that determine success or failure of a party
The writer of the referenced article failed to consider the following factors that resulted in failure of PDP. Instead, he dwelled ignorantly or mischievously on occurrences (defections) that didn’t have any impact on the fact that those defectors were in PDP when the party ruled for the sixteen years under review.

Party’s Ideology
A party’s philosophy is very important in shaping how the party is perceived by the populace. At a point, PDP was known and addressed as a “killer party” because of the members’ attitude of settling their political scores by assassination of their opponents and foes within. Pa Alfred Rewane, Chief Bola Ige, Funsho Williams, Eyo Eyo, Marshall Harry, Barnabas Igwe and many others were brutally murdered during PDP reign. Not a single of those assassinations has been resolved till date.

Another prominent ideology of PDP is corruption. Whether the party sympathizers online and offline like to hear it or not, PDP took corruption in Nigeria to another level. During OBJ’s regime, it was not uncommon to hear and read how the NASS was bombarded with Ghana-Must-Go bags starched with hard currencies to bribe NASS members to do the biddings of the presidency. We were not kids not to remember how Ken Nnamani, Emwerem, and Okadigbo were all removed through bribing of senate members.

Under PDP there were high profile corruption cases that remain unresolved till date. Pension scam (30 billion naira); Oil Subsidy fraud in which many were arraigned for defrauding the nation of billions of dollars in subsidies they never earned; Nigerian Immigration Scam where many innocent souls were lost and no one was brought to justice; Stella Oduah’s N255m BMW and Kerosene Scam just to mention a few.

Implication of PDP philosophy of political assassination and corruption is that a person with different belief who finds himself in such a party can easily be swayed into taking up the party’s crude and wicked ways of doing things. An example is a case of a PDP senator in 2007 that rejected his share of bribery on three occasions but finally gave in on the fourth occasion when he had become overwhelmed by the incessant approaches by his party to toe the party’s line.

Similarly, a crooked politician can be straightened by the good ideology of his party if he soon discovers that his crude ways have no place in his party’s belief.

Leadership
There is the common saying that when the head is rotten, it affects the whole body. This saying aptly describes the type of leaders we have had in PDP. It is the type of leadership that determines how the followers behave. When PDP politicians knew that OBJ was in the habit of bribing his way in the national assembly, what and who would have stopped them from engaging in their own “lootocracy”?
Whence PDP politicians knew that “stealing was not corruption” under GEJ, and also knew that keeping “the goats and yams” together (the politicians and the treasury) was enough justification for them to loot with reckless abandon, who/what would have stopped them from stealing?

Absence of good leadership from PDP in the sixteen years it ruled is well documented such that no one can wish it away. No amount of articles or campaign can sweep those unfortunate years away from Nigeria’s history and it makes mockery of anyone attempting to re-write the history because Nigerians are largely no fools. Those with short memories will always be reminded at the right time.

Lastly, the corrupt politicians who have moved from PDP to APC cannot now be termed saints. They remain with stains and their corruption cases/allegations still hang on their neck and we hope they are eventually brought to justice. However, what is more important to Nigerians now is how they behave under new leadership and a new party with sane ideologies.

The question is, if PDP is not responsible for ruining Nigeria in the sixteen years it ruled, which party did?

Nigeria shall be great again!

I will only agree with you if we are considering just the title of the post from a logical stand point but in actuality, the name of the party is irrelevant as it is the members of the party that define it and not the other way around. The members formed the party, PDP was not an existing institution with a handbook stating that in order to become a member, u must first prove that u are corrupt. Hence, if corrupt politicians that were in PDP and contributed to the destruction of the country form another party and then turn around and point fingers at their creation and blame it for their sins, that is complete hogwash. Note that Nigeria is for all intents and purposes a one party state. Its always the same old people, just under a different umbrella.

Reyginus:
PassingShot, let me ask you this question. If PDP is dissolved and those corrupt men move to a new party who then do we blame? As in, when you then blame PDP what image do you see?

Whatever acts of corruption committed by them in PDP will continue to be associated with PDP. Their acts in the new party will be determined by the type of leadership provided by that party.

A case is that of a PDP senator that rejected his bribe share on three different occasions but still gave in on the fourth attempt when he realized he couldn't beat the others who openly collected their share. It became a case of if you can't beat them you join them.

Following from your question, does it make sense to say PDP is not responsible? If you say yes, then which party is?

The issue is beyond the display of logic or philosophy. It's about being sincere with ourselves as a people.

You say PDP destroyed Nigeria and I ask, is PDP a human being? Why are you focusing on the party rather than the individuals that make up the party? Obj led Nigeria as a PDP president, but he had his freedom of choice. He had the power to choose either to do right or wrong. His decisions and indecision weren't a result of party ideology. And let me state it clearly here, there is nothing like party ideology in practical politics. Those words are mere rhetoric except you can prove to me that any party official can mandate the president or governors on how to carry on their administrative affairs.

You argue that PDP is a killer and destructive party yet Donald Duke was a governor under PDP and he transformed Cross River State. Sullivan Chime and Chris Ngige were PDP governors of Enugu and Anambra states respectively, and they did excellently well as governors. Even Godswill Akpabio did so much in transforming Akwa Ibom into one of the most beautiful states today. Rotimi Amaechi in his first tenure was a PDP governor and he did very well then. Majority of his wonderful projects were done under PDP.
So when you say that party ideology determines the actions and inaction's of politicians, what exactly are you referring to?

Shehu Shagari's administration was noted for massive corruption before Buhari toppled the government. Please can you tell me the party that was in power in those years? Nobody remembers the party because it's not all about the party, but about the individuals in the party.
When you talk about leadership failure, I will agree that it can affect the outcome of government, but leadership failure isn't about party but about the leaders themselves.
Audu Ogbeh and Barnabas Gemade were both PDP chairmen in the past. You can't alienate them from the failures of PDP as a party in those years because they are no longer in PDP, cos doing that will mean shifting the blame for their mistakes to those who are currently in PDP today, some of whom were not there when the mess were done. For example, you can't blame Nuhu Ribadu for the ills of PDP over the past 16 years because he's now in PDP, despite that he's barely 2 years in the party, while you hail El Rufai and Kwankwaso as change agents despite that they were in PDP for over 12 out of the 16 years of PDP rule.

So in essence, my point is that the focus shouldn't be on the party alone, but on the major players in those years. When we shift our focus to the major actors in those years of misgovernance rather than on the party, then people like El Rufai, Kwankwaso, Amaechi, Atiku, Saraki Obasanjo, Audu Ogbeh, Barnabas Gemade, and a host of other former PDP stalwarts who are active in APC today will stop displaying their arrogance, but rather go and hide their faces in shame knowing that we've not forgotten their history. They should also not be allowed to criticise PDP like they are currently doing, or even be involved in critical decision making in this administration, being that they are part and parcel of the decay of this country. It's only when this is done that we can talk about a true and sincere CHANGE in Nigeria.

PassingShot:

Whatever acts of corruption committed by them in PDP will continue to be associated with PDP. Their acts in the new party will be determined by the type of leadership provided by that party.

A case is that of a PDP senator that rejected his bribe share on three different occasions but still gave in on the fourth attempt when he realized he couldn't beat the others who openly collected their share. It became a case of if you can't beat them you join them.

Following from your question, does it make sense to say PDP is not responsible? If you say yes, then which party is?

Lol. So in essence their sins are washed away because they laid claim to a new ideology? Lol. Yeah PDP is responsible.

The question now is, is PDP an existing thing? As in, can any word or name be evil? Can names or words take responsibility?

pimpo:


I will only agree with you if we are considering just the title of the post from a logical stand point but in actuality, the name of the party is irrelevant as it is the members of the party that define it and not the other way around. The members formed the party, PDP was not an existing institution with a handbook stating that in order to become a member, u must first prove that u are corrupt. Hence, if corrupt politicians that were in PDP and contributed to the destruction of the country form another party and then turn around and point fingers at their creation and blame it for their sins, that is complete hogwash. Note that Nigeria is for all intents and purposes a one party state. Its always the same old people, just under a different umbrella.

The argument is purely for the title from logic point of view. This wouldn't have been necessary had one Barcanista not attempted to stand logic on its head.

Your reasoning is valid but we must also look at the leadership and ideology of the party. That of PDP was defined the moment Audu Ogbe was forced out because OBJ couldn't stand his moral principles. Another defining moment was when the nation's attorney general was murdered and NOTHING could be done about it.
Surely, a few party members will want to misbehave but it's the party that will say no to their unsanctioned behaviour. Where that is not done, impunity sets in. And that is what happened to PDP.

bolawillams:
The issue is beyond the display of logic or philosophy. It's about being sincere with ourselves as a people. .

What does this mean?

lets talk facts wen we say PDP did destroy Nigeria lets look n see n say wat is real,. in 16teen yr d growth of d economy has reachd an height dat in jst 6month ds so called APC has looted n nw wants to mk we see say PDP left nothing in d treasury, let dem, d so call APC come n tell us wat n how dey gt money to pay all d coast pay for d so called MAI GKASIYA to travel round d world bt wen it comes for tym to pay Nigerians salary dat is wen HE will knw dat PDP destroyed nigeria

usman195000:
lets talk facts wen we say PDP did destroy Nigeria lets look n see n say wat is real,. in 16teen yr d growth of d economy has reachd an height dat in jst 6month ds so called APC has looted n nw wants to mk we see say PDP left nothing in d treasury, let dem, d so call APC come n tell us wat n how dey gt money to pay all d coast pay for d so called MAI GKASIYA to travel round d world bt wen it comes for tym to pay Nigerians salary dat is wen HE will knw dat PDP destroyed nigeria

Stop the abbreviation.

Reyginus:
Lol. So in essence their sins are washed away because they laid claim to a new ideology? Lol. Yeah PDP is responsible.

The question now is, is PDP an existing thing? As in, can any word or name be evil? Can names or words take responsibility?

I never said their sins are washed away. In the op, I clearly stated that their allegations and corruption cases remain with them and we hope they're brought to justice somehow.
Yes, PDP is a being in the context of law. No word or name can be evil but documented deeds and actions can be associated with a name to define what it is or what it is not.

We can see that between 1999 and May 2015 individuals occupied various political offices, the actions(and inactions) of these office-holders contributed to the decline of the Nigeria and her economy. Majority of these people were at one time or the other indicted for corrupt practices and fraud while in office. Most of these people are members of APC and some appointed into offices. ALL of them combined are responsible for the sorry state of things in Nigeria. We can't forget so soon that it was Saraki and Amaechi(as NGF Chairpersons) that moved for the Sharing and depletion of the Excess Crude Account, which GEJ bowed to between 2007 and 2012. In fact, theyalso pushed for the sharing of One Billion Dollars in Soveriegn Wealth Fund but was resisted by Jonathan. Today, Saraki is not just APC Senator but also the Senate President, while Amaechi is a minister-designate. Can we forget so soon that Audu Ogbeh, a minister-designate and APC Senator Barnabas Germade were PDP National Chairmen between these period. The claim by APC defies logic in every sense

Abeg! If Buhari wants to work, He should start jare. Before Obama became presidents, we're there no issues facing US?. Have you heard he blamed it on the former leadership?

Let APC fulfil their promises to us.

We really need this change .

This whole blame game is jst sum form of distraction really,oga PMB theres loads and loads of work 2 be done sir,pls get to it ASAP

I think it is worthy of note that the article is emphatic at wanting to indict the PDP, and ensuring the they are seen as 'guilty' as charged'! it does not require one who is politically biased to notice that there are issues that beg for attention in the topic above.
1) the issue of the 'decay' that happened in this country over the last 16years goes beyond what one should just attribute to just 'a party' it was a phenomenon that existed in who we have become as a people. corruption has already woven into the very fabrics of our own existence. ask yourself this question, if you were active politically and not affiliated to the party known as PDP, would you have acted differently?
2)wheatear you like it or not, PDP is just a name, the politicians in it actually, are the culprits. that is why if for example there is say a legal suit against the party, it is individuals that are docked. if that is true, it also goes to say that it is not the brand PDP that is responsible, but the players in it during that period, so I feel until we begin to see it from this light, we may still be getting it wrong. I stand to be corrected, but in the last elections, a Tanko Al makura, with all the alleged issues against him still won an election under the umbrella of APC, while Labaran Maku did not because of the PDP stigma. in a nut shell, I think with this kind of idea we will not keep getting it wrong

PassingShot:

I never said their sins are washed away. In the op, I clearly stated that their allegations and corruption cases remain with them and we hope they're brought to justice somehow.
Yes, PDP is a being in the context of law. No word or name can be evil but documented deeds and actions can be associated with a name to define what it is or what it is not.

Being? Okay. And I'm asking what if the people who bear the name decide to move house? If we want to prosecute the Party who is to stand trial? The Party as a Being or the Politicians it describes?

Kennydoc:


My guy, the issue is beyond the display of logic or philosophy. It's about being sincere with ourselves as a people.

You say PDP destroyed Nigeria and I ask, is PDP a human being? Why are you focusing on the party rather than the individuals that make up the party? Obj led Nigeria as a PDP president, but he had his freedom of choice. He had the power to choose either to do right or wrong. His decisions and indecisions weren't a result of party ideology. And let me state it clearly here, there is nothing like party ideology in practical politics. Those words are mere rhetorics except you can prove to me that any party official can mandate the president or governors on how to carry on their administrative affairs.

You argue that PDP is a killer and destructive party yet Donald Duke was a governor under PDP and he transformed Cross River State. Sullivan Chime and Chris Ngige were PDP governors of Enugu and Anambra states respectively, and they did excellently well as governors. Even Godswill Akpabio did so much in transforming Akwa Ibom into one of the most beautiful states today. Rotimi Amaechi in his first tenure was a PDP governor and he did very well then. Majority of his wonderful projects were done under PDP.
So when you say that party ideology determines the actions and inactions of politicians, what exactly are you referring to?

Shehu Shagari's administration was noted for massive corruption before Buhari toppled the government. Please can you tell me the party that was in power in those years? Nobody remembers the party because it's not all about the party, but about the individuals in the party.
When you talk about leadership failure, I will agree that it can affect the outcome of government, but leadership failure isn't about party but about the leaders themselves.
Audu Ogbeh and Barnabas Gemade were both PDP chairmen in the past. You can't alienate them from the failures of PDP as a party in those years because they are no longer in PDP, cos doing that will mean shifting the blame for their mistakes to those who are currently in PDP today, some of whom were not there when the mess were done. For example, you can't blame Nuhu Ribadu for the ills of PDP over the past 16 years because he's now in PDP, despite that he's barely 2 years in the party, while you hail El Rufai and Kwankwaso as change agents despite that they were in PDP for over 12 out of the 16 years of PDP rule.

So in essence, my point is that the focus shouldn't be on the party alone, but on the major players in those years. When we shift our focus to the major actors in those years of misgovernance rather than on the party, then people like El Rufai, Kwankwaso, Amaechi, Atiku, Saraki Obasanjo, Audu Ogbeh, Barnabas Gemade, and a host of other former PDP stalwarts who are active in APC today will stop displaying their arrogance, but rather go and hide their faces in shame knowing that we've not forgotten their history. They should also not be allowed to criticise PDP like they are currently doing, or even be involved in critical decision making in this administration, being that they are part and parcel of the decay of this country. It's only when this is done that we can talk about a true and sincere CHANGE in Nigeria.

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Passing Shot ,you are a Daniel come to judgement.In football your writeup could be likened to a hattrick,in wrestling a pinfall, in boxing a knockout,in science Eureka,in the military the centre of gravity and in sex hitting the Gee-spot.You have hit the intellectual Gee-spot of the argument leading to real intellectual orgasm unlike the fake intellectual orgasm Mr Barcanista treated us to a day ago.I just want to add that irrespective of the number of years any present member of APC spent or held political office under PDP,leaving PDP is enough grounds for one to conclude they were not in support of the madness that took place in PDP(Of course I am not referring to the leaders like Obj or GEJ who gave the party 'ideological' direction).And that act of leaving PDP to APC could be likened to being born again.The new romance with PDP may not exonerate them from their misdeeds in the past but it totally washes them from the stigma or leprosy of being in the pdp in the past.

Reyginus:
Being? Okay. And I'm asking what if the people who bear the name decide to move house? If we want to prosecute the Party who is to stand trial? The Party as a Being or the Politicians it describes?

The answer that's applicable if those questions were on a company is applicable in case of a party. Ok?
Every party is a legal being that can sue and be sued.

What's your point? Again, if PDP is not responsible for the rot, which party is?

Firefire:



APC is the new ruling / opposition party in town.

They won the election by propaganda, and also planning to govern with propaganda.

APC, Party of professional liars and career propagandist.

Firefire, you still dey alive? Thought you left when GEJ lost.