kvolander:

I graduated in chemical engrg. about 4 - 5 years ago, finished my service in august 2007 from Kebbi state as a teaching assistant in one of the best poly there. I thereafter dashed off to the UK to study MSc in petr. engrg. where I finished a year later.
I was refused further stay to remain in the UK which compelled me to relocate to naija in dec. 2008. I converted this UK disappointment energy into a determination energy utilizing a proactive process with prayer as a catalyst.
After nine months of futile applications in naija (not even an acknowledge from the hundreds of companies i applied to), I returned to the UK thanks to the almighty God who intervened when I applied for the UK permit from naija.
Ever since I came back to the UK,I had 2 interviews (one oil servicing and EPC) and one assessment centre (Multinational Oil Coy) but none was totally converted to an offer.Although, I'm still applying but I believe I should upgrade myself with some certifications while waiting for the job to come. I'm not only looking on the oil companies though but also any Energy coys and Process coys. Project management or IT are also options for me but very low on my priority list.
From the experience you guys have had; based on my background as explained above, could you advise me on the BEST CERTIFICATION to add to my current pool of skills that would enhance my chances a clinching a job on time?
Thanks in advance for your advice.

I wont waste my money on any more certifications but would concentrate on getting a job at all cost, being a graduate with no work experience whatsoever, any more certification wont help your job search as such except you are planning on changing field

debosky:

Well said guys - the crucial question hasn't been answered by tubabie as yet. . .is it engineering PM or 'other' PM?

Personally with my own experience so far, the best PM experience for an engineer will be working for an EPC company working on a major project, or for one of the oil and gas majors working on a major project as well. Generally you'll need to learn the project processes/work-flows of the industry you're in, or understand the general work flows within that industry to best determine what 'certifications' (internal or external) and the like you need.

In my own experience, I'd likely not do any PM certifications but focus on practical engineering project experience which can then be supplemented by PM certification much later - frankly experience and track record of delivery is far more valued in the engineering sector that PM qualifications.

However, if one is widening his/her scope to the wider PM community, the willingness to go through the certification hassle might be a good weapon to have in one's arsenal.

@ kvolander

Any HSE specific training will be an advantage - IOSH, IEMA and the other professional bodies will be a good starting point.

http://www.iosh.co.uk/information_and_resources/buy_our_books/be_the_best_-_read_more.aspx

http://www.iema.net/

How did the assessments/interviews go? I've had some experience in this regard so maybe I could give a few tips.

Thanks debosky for those links, I'll check them out right away.

The outcome wasn't positive on their so-called occasion, you know you really can't tell why you've not been taken but I'm using that as a stepping stone though. As I speak, two of the companies I mentioned have not even given me feedback after several requests for one.
However, I'll greatly appreciate any tips from you to help me in crossing over.

Thanks a great deal.

Kenny_G:

I wont waste my money on any more certifications but would concentrate on getting a job at all cost, being a graduate with no work experience whatsoever, any more certification wont help your job search as such except you are planning on changing field

Thanks Kenny_G,

Your point has been the reason behind my delay of going for any certification. I've always believed that no amount of certification can replace work experience.
I'm not thinking of changing field at all. It's engineering for life and I believe I'm so close to clinching one by God's grace.

No yawa, glad to have been of help

All quiet on the thread. . . .nothing interesting happening in your lives?

Which do you think gives better career opportunities - working for a manufacturing/producing company (e.g oil and gas producers - Total, Exxon, or Petrochemicals e.g Ineos, Petroplus and the like) or working for the EPC companies such as Atkins, Foster Wheeler, KBR, etc?

I've had a few discussions with people about this with varying views so please share yours.

Apologies - I locked the thread in error while trying to 'sticky' it instead.

debosky:

Which do you think gives better career opportunities - working for a manufacturing/producing company (e.g oil and gas producers - Total, Exxon, or Petrochemicals e.g Ineos, Petroplus and the like) or working for the EPC companies such as Atkins, Foster Wheeler, KBR, etc?
I've had a few discussions with people about this with varying views so please share yours.

It all depends on what career path you are keen to pursue, for a start the EPC firms only really offer you a career in design with the occassional onsite operations/commissioning roles; whereas the operators "should" offer you the experience of working on site and a more rounded career with opportunities outside the mainstream design scope. Progression into management roles are not that easy with EPC but are seen as the norm with operators.
If you are keen on design/commissioning and the occassional placement on site then EPC is the way to go, although I have to add that when the operators start feeling the pinch EPC staff always bear the brunt via job losses.

debosky:

All quiet on the thread. . . .nothing interesting happening in your lives?

Which do you think gives better career opportunities - working for a manufacturing/producing company (e.g oil and gas producers - Total, Exxon, or Petrochemicals e.g Ineos, Petroplus and the like) or working for the EPC companies such as Atkins, Foster Wheeler, KBR, etc?

I've had a few discussions with people about this with varying views so please share yours.

I believe working for Production Company like Exxon, Ineos gives better leverage going forward for reasons below.

1. Production companies offer better experience. When you work for Production Company, you are exposed to the both plant design and operation aspect of the industry, while consulting firms like Foster Wheeler, KBR, Shaw only exposes you to the design aspect of the business. Even though working for consulting firm, you do get plant visit which exposes you to some plant optimization and operation which does not equate to the tantamount exposure you get while working for production firm. Although to get ahead in this industry, you need both experiences. Most organization values your operational experience more than your conceptual design experience. They might not even hire you if you don't have that operational experience.

2. I'm of the opinion that these production companies have more opportunities within, in comparison to consulting firms. For example, it is so easy to transition to business positions including budgeting, scheduling, estimating, purchasing, trading … with production company because they will have more and better open position, easy access to those positions and training program for easy transition in comparison to those consulting firms.

3. Production company also gives better job stability in comparison to consulting firms. Consulting firms are always at the helms of production firm for projects and if projects continue to remain unviable, that means no work for their workers. End results will be layoffs

as a young engineer its better you start your career with an EPC company (have up to five years)- a small one infact cos it gives you d opportunity to experience all the relevant fields of engineering, i.e you wouldnt be isolated to your process field (even in process- for a large EPC company, all you might end up doing is a small aspect i.e line sizing, PSV sizing) you get to broaden your knowlegde on other fields of engineering i.e control, piping, civil, d advantage is with this experience you could apply to a major producing company and end up being a  lead Engineer/Project manager/ for a number of reasons, 1. they are quite aware of your capabilities, 2. your experience speaks loudly for you 3. you do not require intensive training, i.e u hit the ground running on the project,4. you would be treated as a consultant.

Kenny_G:

I wont waste my money on any more certifications but would concentrate on getting a job at all cost, being a graduate with no work experience whatsoever, any more certification wont help your job search as such except you are planning on changing field

how do you get a job at all cost?
the point is there are a lot of engineers out there looking for job opportunities, the challenge is how do u get ahead, firstly you need a game plan i.e where do you really want to work?, secondly, you need to ask yourself what qualifications do u need to work in there?, thirdly, what criteria do i need to possess to edge other candidates - i.e training, experience.
Time waits for nobody, each second lost cant be regained, each moment of seeming idleness is meant for your training - as the saying goes "success is when preparedness meets opportunity".
case point- assuming you want to work with Mobil, you have sent your application, no response, nothing stops you for working for a small engineering firm earning peanuts( whislt gaining experience) -plan ur path

snthesis:

how do you get a job at all cost?[/b]the point is there are a lot of engineers out there looking for job opportunities, the challenge is how do u get ahead, firstly you need a game plan i.e where do you really want to work?, secondly, you need to ask yourself what qualifications do u need to work in there?, thirdly, what criteria do i need to possess to edge other candidates - i.e training, experience.
Time waits for nobody, each second lost cant be regained, each moment of seeming idleness is meant for your training - as the saying goes "success is when preparedness meets opportunity".
[b]case point- assuming you want to work with Mobil, you have sent your application, no response, nothing stops you for working for a small engineering firm earning peanuts( whislt gaining experience) -plan your path

exactly my point, there is only so much degree/qualification one can get without any relevant experience you run the risk of making yourself over-qualified for any engineering position. When i alluded that he needed to get a job at all cost its all about making short term sacrifices for the sake of gaining experience, no point in accumulating all these qualifications when he hasnt got any relevant experience, most employers are just as keen on experience as the qualification. For instance, a few weeks ago, I saw an advert for Graduate Process Engineer with one of the EPC co in London, the ad stated that the applicant must have graduated in 2009 and must have experience, and this is meant to be a graduate role for people frsh out of uni yet they are asking for exp,

Kenny_G:

For instance, a few weeks ago, I saw an advert for Graduate Process Engineer with one of the EPC co in London, the ad stated that the applicant must have graduated in 2009 and must have experience, and this is meant to be a graduate role for people frsh out of uni yet they are asking for exp,

So how did you forget to tell moi?

@Topic
Yes You guys are so right,The experience comes in more handy than the qualifications , infact it goes like this, "Seek ye first the initial engineering experience and all other things shall be added unto you"

tubabie:

So how did you forget to tell moi?

ahhhhhhh sorry oo i didnt know you were still seeking, ill look for the advert again

i observed that no one is talking about software's on this forum

snthesis:

i observed that no one is talking about software's on this forum

what do you mean by software? Simulations software i.e. HYSYS PROSIM or CHEMCAD?

snthesis:

i observed that no one is talking about software's on this forum

You can start the discussion, cos I actually enjoy that part of Process Engr

Kenny_G:

what do you mean by software? Simulations software i.e. HYSYS PROSIM or CHEMCAD?

Let me add ASPEN PLUS also.

Kenny_G:

what do you mean by software? Simulations software i.e. HYSYS PROSIM or CHEMCAD?

yeah simulation software- u cant b a complete process engineer in dis age without the knowledge of applicable software. i got my current job cos i could use HYSyS, eva since then i am always on the lookout for new stuffs, have learnt how to use Flarenet, Pipephase, Pipesim,mathcad and neva underestimate microsoft excel tis a very powerful tool.

snthesis:

yeah simulation software- u cant b a complete process engineer in dis age without the knowledge of applicable software. i got my current job cos i could use HYSyS, eva since then i am always on the lookout for new stuffs, have learnt how to use Flarenet, Pipephase, Pipesim,mathcad and neva underestimate microsoft excel tis a very powerful tool.

True a modern day process engineer needs good knowledge of Hysys at the least, over here pipephase/pipesim are more for people who are into flow assurance. But self-financing your training for these skills would cost a lot at least over here but like you their advantages as they give you the edge over people who cant use them,

In general, software knowledge is important, but not as much as some people think (in my opinion). Without that indepth understanding of the basic chemical engineering/thermodynamic principles, you'll simply be manipulating numbers - garbage in garbage out.

A typical example is producing phase diagrams in HYSYS which can give you some erroneous results if you use the wrong Equation of State for example.

That said, if you are an adept user, you can be extremely valuable and give important insights into processes and ways to optimise or modify them.

One major issue with simulation software is that if you don't use them frequently in your work, you tend to have to 'relearn' things each time you need it - that's why it can be a risky investment to simply learn process simulation privately without doing some applied work to fully embed the knowledge.

it's like driving a car - if you go to driving school, you know the basics, but if you don't drive regularly you get rusty and can't always make the best decisions on the road.

Debosky is right to some extent learning to use Hysys and the other tools privately without regularly using them can be back-fire, but I'll still say if you get the chance to learn it do so.

typical example is producing phase diagrams in HYSYS which can give you some erroneous results if you use the wrong Equation of State for example.
Also, one would assume that the user is a chemical engineer with basic understanding of process engineering so this shouldnt be an issue, mind you most people just play safe and go for Peng Robinson,

Yipee! I'm back!!
I gather a lot of Nigerian Chemical Engineers are in the U.K., with M.Sc.s to boot!
Graduate Schemes, 250-word "Competence Questions" and time-consuming applications,

On software, many employers prefer HYSYS to CHEMCAD, although CHEMCAD is more general (feedstock in HYSYS is hydrocarbon restricted).
Aspen Plus is a lot like CHEMCAD (to me) and demonstrates the power of Microsoft Excel.
If you do not have these, please, please search and obtain Microsoft Visio. Play 'process design' with MS Visio - you can self-teach.
I really want to get MY VERY OWN food-processing industry off the ground in Nigeria!

With your permission, mod./ debosky, could we share U.K.-based vacancies here?

hi everybody. . .im so happy to find a thread dedicated to chemical engineers here. . .more power to the elbow of everyone helping out on this thread.
Im a fresh graduate of chemical engineering waiting for service in June 2010. . . .My question is that im plannning to do my Msc in UK after my service, but in confused on what i should do for Msc. . . .pls, i need advice. . . . .any advice will be appreciated. . thanks

magicln9t:

hi everybody. . .im so happy to find a thread dedicated to chemical engineers here. . .more power to the elbow of everyone helping out on this thread.
Im a fresh graduate of chemical engineering waiting for service in June 2010. . . .My question is that im plannning to do my Msc in UK after my service, but in confused on what i should do for Msc. . . .pls, i need advice. . . . .any advice will be appreciated. . thanks

Safety Engineering @ sheffield, Biochemical engineering at several, Petroleum @ Imperial college and heriot watt you have a wide range of options; perhaps the first question you need to address is what you want to do with your career.

Im a chemical engr with masters in env.management.i run my out manufacturing unit n still keep in tab with my profession.

conn-kg:

With your permission, mod./ debosky, could we share U.K.-based vacancies here?

By all means do so - as long as the openings are chemical/process engineering related.

Kenny_G:

Debosky is right to some extent learning to use Hysys and the other tools privately without regularly using them can be back-fire, but I'll still say if you get the chance to learn it do so.

Definitely - at least you'll be able to say something relevant if asked at an interview.

typical example is producing phase diagrams in HYSYS which can give you some erroneous results if you use the wrong Equation of State for example.
Also, one would assume that the user is a chemical engineer with basic understanding of process engineering so this shouldnt be an issue, mind you most people just play safe and go for Peng Robinson,

I agree, but most people tend to develop a 'dependency' on simulation tools and that can lead to people thinking less and just going with the outputs of the model. This is just a general issue I've come across - whenever machines get involved, never lose the ability to at least 'cross-check' or validate the results.

This is why the basic principles you learn in University, especially in Nigeria when you don't have all the software available, is very crucial to making the best use of these models.

Anyways, the core matter here is that I haven't really used the off the shelf models for much - I've mostly written my own code in Matlab or used Excel for my modelling requirements. So all you HYSYS gurus I have beef for y'all.

@ magicln9t (great username btw )

You've completed your undergrad so I believe you can point to certain areas you were very good at, or that you showed interest in. I think that should be your starting point - what are you interested in? What are you good at? Then after you answer those, then you can move on to what industry would that be best applied and then decide on a course based on those pieces of information.

Thanks!

I hope the link below works for you,

[url]http://www.gradcracker.com/search?search-submit=Search&disciplineID[]=3&utm_source=Registered+Students&utm_campaign=32e43ffd43-Student_Email_18_03_20103_17_2010&utm_medium=email[/url]

Had a tough day yesterday, a little distracted now.
Moving,

Ok. Greetings y'all. I'm glad to identify myself as a chemical engineer too. But what use is my chemical engineering when I can't facilitate the success of at least a single throughput of any of the products I was taught in school I can produce as a chemical/process engineer? The paints, cement, pharmaceuticals, refined petroleum products, pulp/paper, soaps, detergent and stuff. What's the point when you don't have a ready market to absorb you and put you in essence in the line of your trade? What sells here? I'm a bit confused as to why I burnt all those candles making countless material, momentum and energy balances over several unit operations.

deluxecad:

Ok. Greetings y'all. I'm glad to identify myself as a chemical engineer too. But what use is my chemical engineering when I can't facilitate the success of at least a single throughput of any of the products I was taught in school I can produce as a chemical/process engineer? The paints, cement, pharmaceuticals, refined petroleum products, pulp/paper, soaps, detergent and stuff. What's the point when you don't have a ready market to absorb you and put you in essence in the line of your trade? What sells here? I'm a bit confused as to why I burnt all those candles making countless material, momentum and energy balances over several unit operations.

i quite agree with you, its disheartening slaving all thoses years and in the end competing for a bank job, with the OBJ era a ray of light opened i.e local content development and this totally created openings for nigerian engineers to practice, learn and compete with their foreign counterparts unfortunately Yaradua didnt deem it fit to actively tow this line.

debosky:


I agree, but most people tend to develop a 'dependency' on simulation tools and that can lead to people thinking less and just going with the outputs of the model. This is just a general issue I've come across - whenever machines get involved, never lose the ability to at least 'cross-check' or validate the results.

This is why the basic principles you learn in University, especially in Nigeria when you don't have all the software available, is very crucial to making the best use of these models.

Anyways, the core matter here is that I haven't really used the off the shelf models for much - I've mostly written my own code in Matlab or used Excel for my modelling requirements. So all you HYSYS gurus I have beef for y'all.

dont beef, adapt- besides its easy to use.
its not a dependency, its the future (recall TD boards, and now autocad), the cost of running a valid license for dis softwares aint yam, the Oil coys know of its proven competency and are willing to shell d costs. now doubt a thorough knowledge of chemical engineering is required to run and interprete results.
i wouldnt hire a mechanical engrg to run my simulations.

snthesis:

dont beef, adapt- besides its easy to use.
its not a dependency, its the future (recall TD boards, and now autocad), the cost of running a valid license for dis softwares aint yam, the Oil coys know of its proven competency and are willing to shell d costs. now doubt a thorough knowledge of chemical engineering is required to run and interprete results.
i wouldnt hire a mechanical engrg to run my simulations.

Don't worry I am adapting fast.

The risk of dependency is real. . . .one of the major oil companies fell into this trap in the 80's believing it could rely 100% on modelling outputs without verifying the data and it cost quite a bit to recoup the impact of this.

@ deluxecad

I feel your pain - I personally believe we are producing too many chemical engineers at the moment given the poor utilisation of the ones we have already. Having thousands of people competing for primarily 'oil company' jobs (most times not even chemical engineering roles) is surely unsustainable.

I had real-time experience in process engineering operations during my industrial trainee days, some 6 or so yrs ago and now it seems that all those popular companies have been run aground or driven moribund by lousy and selfish govt policies. How can we have four refineries in Nigeria and none is running at fullstream? Downtime this, downtime that. I filled in Chemical engineering in two of the blank spaces in my JAMB form with much gusto only to end up practising structural/civil engineering. What a waste of enthusiasm. Our schools are busy churning out kids with hot ambitions who'll end up tucked away as a stressed out teller in one bank somewhere along the street. What hope is left? There's so much glut in the labour market and there's either going to be a blowout some time if these damned policy makers don't bleed off the excess to some reasonable quarters. My advice to the younger folks is to diversify, be vast, don't localize yaself. Broaden out! God help us.

deluxecad:

I had real-time experience in process engineering operations during my industrial trainee days, some 6 or so yrs ago and now it seems that all those popular companies have been run aground or driven moribund by lousy and selfish govt policies. How can we have four refineries in Nigeria and none is running at fullstream? Downtime this, downtime that. I filled in Chemical engineering in two of the blank spaces in my JAMB form with much gusto only to end up practising structural/civil engineering. What a waste of enthusiasm. Our schools are busy churning out kids with hot ambitions who'll end up tucked away as a stressed out teller in one bank somewhere along the street. What hope is left? There's so much glut in the labour market and there's either going to be a blowout some time if these damned policy makers don't bleed off the excess to some reasonable quarters. My advice to the younger folks is to diversify, be vast, don't localize yaself. Broaden out! God help us.

Naija, hmmm e go better

The fact is that not every chemical engineering graduate will practice 'core' process engineering. The sooner we realise that the better. Even if you do, you might not use up to 20% of what you learned in school on a regular basis.

One trend that is very popular amongst chemical engineering grads is to pursue an environmental engineering/management/science degree as a follow up Masters. How viable is this as an alternative?

We all know there is environmental degradation in the Niger Delta and all that, in addition to the fact that there is increased environmental awareness and consciousness worldwide. Does this translate into jobs for those who decide to pursue the environmental path after graduation?

Let's discuss.