Empiree:
I think tintingz attributes literal values to some of those ahadith where Nabi {saw} reported to have cited Yunus {as}.

He's simply humbling himself by that statement.

If you see a rich man, muqadam, imam, sheik, waliy etc telling everyone to praise him, he's must be arrogant fellow and should be avoided.

Absolutely.

# Nabi also highlights his superiority over other Messengers thus:

Imam Muslim documents:

Yaḥyā b. Yaḥyā – Hushaym – Sayyār – Yazīd al-Faqīr – Jābir b. ‘Abd Allāh al-Anṣārī:

The Messenger of Allāh, peace be upon him, said: “I have been given five things which were never given to anyone before me. Every prophet was sent to HIS PEOPLE ONLY, while I have been sent to every red person and every black person"

Source: Abū al-Ḥusayn Muslim b. al-Ḥajjāj al-Qushayrī al-Naysābūrī, Ṣaḥīḥ Muslim (Beirut: Dār Iḥyā al-Turāth al-‘Arabī) [annotator: Muḥammad Fuād ‘Abd al-Bāqī], vol. 1, p. 370, # 521 (3)

lexiconkabir:


Muhammed message being the final makes him superior, the fact that Musa would follow his message makes Muhammad superior, the fact that Muhammad's message was to the whole world, both mankind and jinn while that of Moses was to bani israaeel makes Muhammad superior, the list goes on.

There are high ranked Prophets in the Quran and I didn't say Muhammad (SA) is not superior. The Quran didn't specify on one prophet to be Superior and didn't make distintion between the Prophets and Muhammad didn't either, He(SA) forbade us from saying it.

I don't know why you guys are saying the hadith i quoted was not referring to superiority.

I don't know what you mean by brag, but the prophet clearly Musa would be his follower, alright ever heard of the hadith where Muhammad led all the messengers in prayer including Musa? That was when he embarked on the jorney of israa, What does that tell you?

You should know brag means boasting, to boast about something.

Ever heard of the hadith Muhammad (SA) was asking advice from Moses(as) about solat? a superior shouldn't be asking an advice from someone that would have be his follower.

I have explained this severally, they are the same incase of prophet hood, all Prophets do not commit major sins, their bodies can't be eaten by the soil even if they are buried, they all won't be questioned in their graves, they all cannot fall into shirk, the list goes on, so these are what we mean by prophet hood, in this case they have the same favours!

What about their rank?

You told me not to misinterprets hadiths in a thread, I'm doing that.

And what does it proof?

Something like this:

Anas ibn Malik reported: A person came to the Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, and said, “O best of creation!” So the Prophet said:

That is Abraham, upon him be peace.

Source: Sahih Muslim 2369, Grade: Sahih

No misinterpretation.

Then they are the all the same in this aspect.

Okies.

Empiree:
I think tintingz attributes literal values to some of those ahadith where Nabi {saw} reported to have cited Yunus {as}.

He's simply humbling himself by that statement.

If you see a rich man, muqadam, imam, sheik, waliy etc telling everyone to praise him, he's must be arrogant fellow and should be avoided.

I'm following the literal meaning of the hadith no twisting, a brother has told me not to do such.

When it comes to the matter of the deen of Allaah, I am always serious, so I find some emos irritating when used for me.

thank you.

tintingz:
There are high ranked Prophets in the Quran and I didn't say Muhammad (SA) is not superior. The Quran didn't specify on one prophet to be Superior and didn't make distintion between the Prophets and Muhammad didn't either, He(SA) forbade us from saying it.

I don't know why you guys are saying the hadith i quoted was not referring to superiority.

You should know brag means boasting, to boast about something.

Ever heard of the hadith Muhammad (SA) was asking advice from Moses(as) about solat? a superior shouldn't be asking an advice from someone that would have be his follower.

What about their rank?

You told me not to misinterprets hadiths in a thread, I'm doing that.



Something like this:

Anas ibn Malik reported: A person came to the Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, and said, “O best of creation!” So the Prophet said:

That is Abraham, upon him be peace.

Source: Sahih Muslim 2369, Grade: Sahih

No misinterpretation.

Okies.

How do you explain Muhammad(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) leading the messengers in salaah? To me this is the most glaring proof.

Don't kings ask subjects for advice? Does that reduce the superiority of the king?

lexiconkabir:
When it comes to the matter of the deen of Allaah, I am always serious, so I find some emos irritating when used for me.

thank you.

No vex.

How do you explain Muhammad(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) leading the messengers in salaah? To me this is the most glaring proof.

Don't kings ask subjects for advice? Does that reduce the superiority of the king?

Actually the follower advice and sent him back for reduction.

tintingz:
No vex.

lol

Actually the follower advice and sent him back for reduction.

And when he(alayhi salaatu wa salaam) sent him(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) back at some point, he(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) refused.

so how do you explain Muhammad(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) leading the messengers in salaah?

tintingz:
I'm following the literal meaning of the hadith no twisting, a brother has told me not to do such.

There is difference btw twisting and interpreting text.

That means you would take literally verses where Allah described those with black faces will go to hell and those with white faces will go to paradise. Taking it literally suggests that ALL black people everywhere are hell-bound including great Ulama amongst them. And ALL White people are going to paradise regardless. I hail thee.

Also, you would take literally where sacred text says those who are blind in this world will be blind in Afterlife.

Empiree:
There is difference btw twisting and interpreting text.

OK sir.

That means you would take literally verses where Allah described those with black faces will go to hell and those with white faces will go to paradise. Taking it literally suggests that ALL black people everywhere are hell-bound including great Ulama amongst them. And ALL White people are going to paradise regardless. I hail thee.

Also, you would take literally where sacred text says those who are blind in this world will be blind in Afterlife.

Personally, I don't take all verses in scriptures literally but in this thread I'm doing that.

tintingz:
OK sir.

Personally, I don't take all verses in scriptures literally but in this thread I'm doing that.

Cool

lexiconkabir:


lol





And when he(alayhi salaatu wa salaam) sent him(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) back at some point, he(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) refused.

The question is how many times did Moses(as) sent Muhammad (SA) back for reduction of solah? At the end when it gotten to 5, Nabi(SA) was shy to go back for reduction.

so how do you explain Muhammad(sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) leading the messengers in salaah?

Sir, I didn't say Muhammad (SA) is not superior, my point here is since Muhammad forbade us from saying it why should I say it.

There are verses in the bible that portray Jesus(as) to be superior than all Prophets. I think this were also the reasons Muhammad (SA) forbade us from making a prophet superior than others but that doesn't mean Muhammad is not superior likewise other high ranked prophets (as).

tintingz:
I'm following the literal meaning of the hadith no twisting, a brother has told me not to do such.

This literalism really got me laughing about a Yoruba movie. Two(2) stooges took bible verses literally and they got beat up.

The first guy met a pastor for success. Pastor advised him to be patient and that "God's time is the best".

The guy understood "the best" but he attributed God with church and time with traditional wall clock with time. So he went to the church and stole the watch. He was nabbed immediately upon exiting the church. When asked why he did that, he said pastor told him "God's time is the best"


The second stooge was in the church and carefully listened to pastor. Pastor quoted this bible verse:


"Cast your bread (food) upon the waters, for you will find it after many days." ◄ Ecclesiastes 11:1 ►


He went to a local store and stole a bag of rice worths #aira8000 from sales girl. Owner called police to search for him but he already went to nearby river, opened bag of rice and tossed it on the water. His partner asked what happens now?. He said "we wait here and the rice would come out boiled everywhere multiplied".

While waiting at the river, store owner and police cornered them and they served jail time.

tintingz:
The question is how many times did Moses(as) sent Muhammad (SA) back for reduction of solah? At the end when it gotten to 5, Nabi(SA) was shy to go back for reduction.

No, the question is, if Muhammad had refused from the starting, is there anything Musa could do?

Sir, I didn't say Muhammad (SA) is not superior, my point here is since Muhammad forbade us from saying it why should I say it.

Since you now agree that Muhammad is superior, the most glaring reason being that he is the Imam of other messengers, then I'm done, that was why i came to the thread in the first place.

There are verses in the bible that portray Jesus(as) to be superior than all Prophets. I think this were also the reasons Muhammad (SA) forbade us from making a prophet superior than others but that doesn't mean Muhammad is not superior likewise other high ranked prophets (as).

I have no business with the bible....

I have said this severally, they are the same in ptophethood and the prophet forbade us saying contrary to that, perhaps you don't understand, all the ahadeeth the prophet talked about prophets being the same used the word "Prophets" never have i seen a hadith that said "all messengers are the Same" there is a difference, which proves that the prophet was referring to prophethood, but if you have such hadith bring it.

lexiconkabir:


No, the question is, if Muhammad had refused from the starting, is there anything Musa could do?

The question goes both ways. Then we will be observing 50 solah.
Musa played his role.

Since you now agree that Muhammad is superior, the most glaring reason being that he is the Imam of other messengers, then I'm done, that was why i came to the thread in the first place.

No where I said Muhammad is not superior in the first place, you can go and read back my posts. What am saying is that the Quran didn't specify on one prophet to be superior than others the Quran make use of pluralism when talking about the exalted prophets.

Didn't the Quran said Ibrahim is the imam of all nation, he's Allah's friend? Should i say he's superior than other prophets? NO.. Nabi does not like it.

I have no business with the bible....

Yes you have because the reasons of "make no distinction" in the Quran and Hadith are because the Jews and Christians do so.

I have said this severally, they are the same in ptophethood and the prophet forbade us saying contrary to that, perhaps you don't understand, all the ahadeeth the prophet talked about prophets being the same used the word "Prophets" never have i seen a hadith that said "all messengers are the Same" there is a difference, which proves that the prophet was referring to prophethood, but if you have such hadith bring it.

Was Musa(as) not a messenger? prophet Muhammad said he's not better than Moses. Messagers are also prophets, the hadith talked about both prophet and messager

The hadith talk about a Jew boasting about a prophet and he got slapped, they took the matter to the prophet and he got angry after hearing what happened then he said "I am not better than moses and do not make a prophet better than another" he even said he's not better than Jonah.

Now today we see Muslims, Christians, Jews boasting and making prophet better than another which the prophet condemned.

tintingz:
The question goes both ways. Then we will be observing 50 solah.
Musa played his role.

.

# Please don't tell me you believe in this tale by moonlight.

# Nabi Musa was sent to Israelites. Nabi Muhammad was sent to the humanity but his job primarily begins with the Arabs. More than 1000 years between Musa and Muhammad. So how can Musa know the Arabs and the humanity?

# Nabi Muhammad was 40 years before he was ordained. Is 40 years not enough to study his environment with their psychic?

tintingz:
The question goes both ways. Then we will be observing 50 solah.
Musa played his role.

No where I said Muhammad is not superior in the first place, you can go and read back my posts. What am saying is that the Quran didn't specify on one prophet to be superior than others the Quran make use of pluralism when talking about the exalted prophets.

Didn't the Quran said Ibrahim is the imam of all nation, he's Allah's friend? Should i say he's superior than other prophets? NO.. Nabi does not like it.


Yes you have because the reasons of "make no distinction" in the Quran and Hadith are because the Jews and Christians do so.

Was Musa(as) not a messenger? prophet Muhammad said he's not better than Moses. Messagers are also prophets, the hadith talked about both prophet and messager

The hadith talk about a Jew boasting about a prophet and he got slapped, they took the matter to the prophet and he got angry after hearing what happened then he said "I am not better than moses and do not make a prophet better than another" he even said he's not better than Jonah.

Now today we see Muslims, Christians, Jews boasting and making prophet better than another which the prophet condemned.

I better stop here, cuz I'm not sure what you want to gain from this.

Salaam.

Empiree:
This literalism really got me laughing about a Yoruba movie. Two(2) stooges took bible verses literally and they got beat up.

The first guy met a pastor for success. Pastor advised him to be patient and that "God's time is the best".

The guy understood "the best" but he attributed God with church and time with traditional wall clock with time. So he went to the church and stole the watch. He was nabbed immediately upon exiting the church. When asked why he did that, he said pastor told him "God's time is the best"


The second stooge was in the church and carefully listened to pastor. Pastor quoted this bible verse:


"Cast your bread (food) upon the waters, for you will find it after many days." ◄ Ecclesiastes 11:1 ►


He went to a local store and stole a bag of rice worths #aira8000 from sales girl. Owner called police to search for him but he already went to nearby river, opened bag of rice and tossed it on the water. His partner asked what happens now?. He said "we wait here and the rice would come out boiled everywhere multiplied".

While waiting at the river, store owner and police cornered them and they served jail time.

Lol

lexiconkabir:


I better stop here, cuz I'm not sure what you want to gain from this.

Salaam.

Alright sir.

Salaam.

AlBaqir:


# Please don't tell me you believe in this tale by moonlight.

# Nabi Musa was sent to Israelites. Nabi Muhammad was sent to the humanity but his job primarily begins with the Arabs. More than 1000 years between Musa and Muhammad. So how can Musa know the Arabs and the humanity?.

These arguments are weaker than noodles!

The angels knew about only jinns, how did they know humans will act like jinns? You see the pathetic logic?

You want us to derail the thread?

Don't you have the same narration in your book? You do, hope you know that?

AlBaqir:


# Please don't tell me you believe in this tale by moonlight.

# Nabi Musa was sent to Israelites. Nabi Muhammad was sent to the humanity but his job primarily begins with the Arabs. More than 1000 years between Musa and Muhammad. So how can Musa know the Arabs and the humanity?

# Nabi Muhammad was 40 years before he was ordained. Is 40 years not enough to study his environment with their psychic?

Sir, are you saying the hadith is not true?

lexiconkabir:


The angels knew about only jinns, how did they know humans will act like jinns? You see the pathetic logic?

# Thank God we are discussing about human beings not angels. Human knowledge is primarily peculiar to his immediate environment that's why we are materialistic in nature. Angels are in their spiritual world far complex than man's world.

# Angel knew human will act like Jinns because of the same freewill given to both man and jinns. No doubt Jinns have been living before man was created. However they failed to realize that freewill that can do evil is also the one that can do good. They passionately highlights the darkness of freewill and keep mute on its goodness if at all they know it.

lexiconkabir:


You want us to derail the thread?

Don't you have the same narration in your book? You do, hope you know that?

# I don't derail thread. You guys brought the discussion already.

# None of our books of ahadith is 100% and we never claimed so. There are truth and there are lies in them. So the fact that the said tale by moonlight is also present in Shia books doesn't make it right either.

tintingz:
Sir, are you saying the hadith is not true?

A very big lie. That's why I said its a tale by moonlight. Anyway to Sunni and Shia, it might be of authentic or good chain but obviously part of the matn (content) of the report can never stand intellectual argument some of which I have submitted above.

AlBaqir:


# Thank God we are discussing about human beings not angels. Human knowledge is primarily peculiar to his immediate environment that's why we are materialistic in nature. Angels are in their spiritual world far complex than man's world.

# Angel knew human will act like Jinns because of the same freewill given to both man and jinns. No doubt Jinns have been living before man was created. However they failed to realize that freewill that can do evil is also the one that can do good. They passionately highlights the darkness of freewill and keep mute on its goodness if at all they know it.

The same way nabi Musa(عليه سلم) guessed the way Muhammad's (صلى اللّه عليه و سلم) ummah would act, due to the way his people acted towards him.

# I don't derail thread. You guys brought the discussion already.

As an example, and what we were discussing about the narration is not related to what you said, so you clearly wanted to derail the thread.

# None of our books of ahadith is 100% and we never claimed so. There are truth and there are lies in them. So the fact that the said tale by moonlight is also present in Shia books doesn't make it right either.

Actually the probability of the reliability of your books is 1×10^-99, what I'm i even saying? Its zero!

A piece of advice friends, let's endeavour to stop using this SAW, PBUH, AS etc..let's try and spell dem in full. Saw is a tool. It is highly disliked by the ulama!

AlBaqir:


# Please don't tell me you believe in this tale by moonlight.

# Nabi Musa was sent to Israelites. Nabi Muhammad was sent to the humanity but his job primarily begins with the Arabs. More than 1000 years between Musa and Muhammad. So how can Musa know the Arabs and the humanity?

# Nabi Muhammad was 40 years before he was ordained. Is 40 years not enough to study his environment with their psychic?

So you dont believe in isra wa miraj or you dont believe in the incident that took place within (his accouter with other prophets)?.

Empiree:
So you dont believe in isra wa miraj or you dont believe in the incident that took place within (his accouter with other prophets)?.

# Haba abok.i

# We ONLY talk in respect to 50 salats where Nabi Musa alayhi salam is being said to have continuously adviced Nabi Muhammad salallahu alayhi wa ahli, wa salim, to request that the salat be shorten till 5 daily salat.

# Believe in Isra wal miraj in both spiritual and bodily form of Nabi is Wahjib in Shi'i beliefs.

Imagine NL dictionary faah: It translate and showed "âboki" as "northerners". That's silly.

AlBaqir:


# Haba abok.i

# We ONLY talk in respect to 50 salats where Nabi Musa alayhi salam is being said to have continuously adviced Nabi Muhammad salallahu alayhi wa ahli, wa salim, to request that the salat be shorten till 5 daily salat.

# Believe in Isra wal miraj in both spiritual and bodily form of Nabi is Wahjib in Shi'i beliefs.

Imagine NL dictionary faah: It translate and showed "âboki" as "northerners". That's silly.

I think it was censored because people have abused the word abokī(tribalism abuse).

RABIUSHILE04:
A piece of advice friends, let's endeavour to stop using this SAW, PBUH, AS etc..let's try and spell dem in full. Saw is a tool. It is highly disliked by the ulama!

It is an abbreviation.

AlBaqir:


A very big lie. That's why I said its a tale by moonlight. Anyway to Sunni and Shia, it might be of authentic or good chain but obviously part of the matn (content) of the report can never stand intellectual argument some of which I have submitted above.

Do Shi'a have their own version of the said hadith?

tintingz:
It is an abbreviation.

Praise be to Allaah. What is prescribed is to write “salla Allaahu ‘alayhi wa salaam (May Allaah send blessings and peace upon him)” in full, and not to write it in abbreviated form, such as writing (S) or (SAWS) etc. Shaykh ‘Abd al-‘Azeez ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: As it is prescribed to send blessings upon the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) in prayer when saying the tashahhud, and it is prescribed when giving khutbahs, saying du’aa’ and praying for forgiveness, and after the adhaan, and when entering and exiting the mosque, and when mentioning him in other circumstances, so it is more important to do so when writing his name in a book, letter, article and so on. So it is prescribed to write the blessing in full so as to fulfil the command that Allaah has given to us, and so that the reader will remember to say the blessing when he reads it. So we should not write the blessing on the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) in short form such as writing (S) or (SAWS) etc, or other forms that some writers use, because that is going against the command of Allaah in His Book, where He says (interpretation of the meaning): “Send your Salaah on (ask Allaah to bless) him (Muhammad), and (you should) greet (salute) him with the Islamic way of greeting (salutation, i.e. As‑Salaamu ‘Alaykum)” [al-Ahzaab 33:56] And that (writing it in abbreviated form) does not serve that purpose and is devoid of the virtue of writing “salla Allaahu ‘alayhi wa salaam (May Allaah send blessings and peace upon him)” in full. Moreover the reader may not take notice of it and may not understand what is meant by it. It should also be noted that the symbol used for it is regarded as disapproved by the scholars, who warned against it. #source: islamqa.com

RABIUSHILE04:


Praise be to Allaah. What is prescribed is to write
“salla Allaahu ‘alayhi wa salaam (May Allaah send
blessings and peace upon him)” in full, and not to
write it in abbreviated form, such as writing (S) or
(SAWS) etc. Shaykh ‘Abd al-‘Azeez ibn Baaz (may
Allaah have mercy on him) said: As it is
prescribed to send blessings upon the Prophet
(peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) in
prayer when saying the tashahhud, and it is
prescribed when giving khutbahs, saying du’aa’
and praying for forgiveness, and after the
adhaan, and when entering and exiting the
mosque, and when mentioning him in other
circumstances, so it is more important to do so
when writing his name in a book, letter, article
and so on. So it is prescribed to write the blessing
in full so as to fulfil the command that Allaah has
given to us, and so that the reader will
remember to say the blessing when he reads it.
So we should not write the blessing on the
Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon
him) in short form such as writing (S) or (SAWS)
etc, or other forms that some writers use,
because that is going against the command of
Allaah in His Book, where He says (interpretation
of the meaning): “Send your Salaah on (ask
Allaah to bless) him (Muhammad), and (you
should) greet (salute) him with the Islamic way of
greeting (salutation, i.e. As‑Salaamu
‘Alaykum)” [al-Ahzaab 33:56] And that (writing it
in abbreviated form) does not serve that
purpose and is devoid of the virtue of writing
“salla Allaahu ‘alayhi wa salaam (May Allaah send
blessings and peace upon him)” in full. Moreover
the reader may not take notice of it and may not
understand what is meant by it. It should also be
noted that the symbol used for it is regarded as
disapproved by the scholars, who warned
against it.
#source: islamqa.com

All Muslims 95%(not accurate) on internet knows what "S.A.W, A.S. P.B.U.H" means even many non-muslims.

If it is an article it is understandable to write it fully but here we're posting comments, you don't expect someone to write it fully every time he or she wants to mention the Prophets. When a brother abbreviates I already know what it meant.

AlBaqir:


# Haba abok.i

# We ONLY talk in respect to 50 salats where Nabi Musa alayhi salam is being said to have continuously adviced Nabi Muhammad salallahu alayhi wa ahli, wa salim, to request that the salat be shorten till 5 daily salat.

# Believe in Isra wal miraj in both spiritual and bodily form of Nabi is Wahjib in Shi'i beliefs.

Imagine NL dictionary faah: It translate and showed "âboki" as "northerners". That's silly.

I hope they dont get mad for calling them Abok.i. Sounds like derogatory phrase just like calling White people redneck or African Americans n!gga they get upset

tintingz:
All Muslims 95%(not accurate) on internet knows what "S.A.W, A.S. P.B.U.H" means even many non-muslims.

If it is an article it is understandable to write it fully but here we're posting comments, you don't expect someone to write it fully every time he or she wants to mention the Prophets. When a brother abbreviates I already know what it meant.

From ur logic, we can spell rasullullaah's name as 'Muhd' bcuz some ppl abbreviated it to dat, and u undastnd it? That is an insult to the messenger of Allaah. SAW,AS and odas r insult to him and odas like him, bcuz a broda abbrv, and u understood it, does that make it good?!? Also, as muslims, we shud strive hard to earn the pleasure of Allaah, by sending salawat to d rasullullaah, we shouldn't be too lazy to do it, even in written and all. Don't justify claims like dis, u can't spell it full, YOU can't spell it full niiiii, but don't justify ur claim which is wrong akhee. The aforementioned fatwas explains itself perfectly well...wallaahu must'an.