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Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq - Religion (2) - Nairaland

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Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 8:39am On Mar 01, 2017
true2god:
Muhammad personally beheads over 600 Jewish prisoners of war on page 494.
Muhammad orders the torturing of treasurer of Khaybar tribe, Kinana on page 515.

Sahih bukhari also reported this Mohammed's invasion of the Jewish tribe of khaybar and his subsequent 'marriage' to saffiyya. Note that safiya was a prisoner captured by Mohammed's men as a war booty. Also note that safiyya was also betrothed to kinana before Mohammed's men killed him which paved the way for Mohammed's marriage to saffiya. It will be interesting to note that, according to the Quran, the waiting period before a marriage can be consummated between a man and a divorced woman is 3months. Let's see the Quranic injunctions below:

Divorced women should keep themselves in waiting (before remarrying) three cources; and it is not lawful for them to conceal what God has created in their wombs, if they believe in God and last day; and their husbands have more right of taking them back during this, if they want reconciliation; they have (rights) similar to against them and men are a degree above them; and God is mighty and wise

(Al-Quran 2:228)

In surah Al-Ahzab it is stated:

O ye who believe! When ye marry believing women then divorce them before touching them then there is no iddah, you have reckon with.

(Al-Quran 33:49)

They above law was broken as shown below when Mohammed and his sahabas invaded the Jewish town of khaybar:

Narrated Abdul Aziz:
Anas said, "When Allah's Apostle invaded Khaibar, we offered the Fajr prayer there (early in the morning) when it was still dark. The Prophet rode and Abu Talha rode too and I was riding behind Abu Talha. The Prophet passed through the lane of Khaibar quickly and my knee was touching the thigh of the Prophet. He uncovered his thigh and I saw the whiteness of the thigh of the Prophet. When he entered the town, he said, ‘Allahu Akbar! Khaibar is ruined. Whenever we approach near a (hostile) nation (to fight) then evil will be the morning of those who have been warned.’ He repeated this thrice. The people came out for their jobs and some of them said, ‘Muhammad (has come).’ (Some of our companions added, ‘With his army.’) We conquered Khaibar, took the captives, and the booty was collected. Dihya came and said, ‘O Allah's Prophet! Give me a slave girl from the captives.’ The Prophet said, ‘Go and take any slave girl.’ He took Safiya bint Huyai. A man came to the Prophet and said, ‘O Allah's Apostle! You gave Safiya bint Huyai to Dihya and she is the chief mistress of the tribes of Quraiza and An-Nadir and she befits none but you.’ So the Prophet said, ‘Bring him along with her.’ So Dihya came with her and when the Prophet saw her, he said to Dihya, ‘Take any slave girl other than her from the captives.’" Anas added: "The Prophet then manumitted her and married her."

Thabit asked Anas, "O Abu Hamza! What did the Prophet pay her (as Mahr)?" He said, "Her self was her Mahr for he manumitted her and then married her." Anas added, "While on the way, Um Sulaim dressed her for marriage (ceremony) and at night she sent her as a bride to the Prophet. So the Prophet was a bridegroom and he said, ‘Whoever has anything (food) should bring it.’ He spread out a leather sheet (for the food) and some brought dates and others cooking butter. (I think he (Anas) mentioned As-Sawaq). So they prepared a dish of Hais (a kind of meal). And that was Walima (the marriage banquet) of Allah's Apostle." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 367)

Narrated Anas bin Malik

When Dihyah protested, wanting to keep Safiyah for himself, the Apostle traded for Safiyah by giving Dihyah her two cousins. The women of Khaybar were distributed among the Muslims.
Ishaq page 511

The Prophet conquered Khaybar by force after fighting. Khaybar was something that Allah gave as booty to His Messenger. He took one-fifth of it and divided the remainder among the Muslims.
Al-Tabari, Vol. 8, p. 130

The above quotations are 100% Islamic sources. If we repudiate Ibn Ishaq, as being unreliable, did bukhari or al-tabari make thing smoother and better? If all Islamic sources did not present Mohammed in a positive light, how about the Koran?
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by patmen: 10:31am On Mar 01, 2017
read about mohammed 20% booty here,.. http://www.inthenameofallah.org/Booty%20Plunder%20&%20Loot%20in%20%20Muhammad's%20Islam.html
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by patmen: 10:34am On Mar 01, 2017
www.inthenameofallah.org/Booty%20Plunder%20&%20Loot%20in%20%20Muhammad's%20Islam.html
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 1:46pm On Mar 01, 2017
patmen:
www.inthenameofallah.org/Booty%20Plunder%20&%20Loot%20in%20%20Muhammad's%20Islam.html
This can be found in quran 8:41 where allahh and his apostle (Mohammed) are entitled to 20% of war booty. War booty, zakat, sadaqa and jizya are the major sources of financing Mohammed and his sahabas. Mohammed, after the death of khadijah, survive through war booty from gwazwa raids of infidels. They have no any economic and legitimate means of sustaining themselves.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 8:19am On Mar 02, 2017
true2god:

Muhammad orders the torturing of treasurer of Khaybar tribe, Kinana on page 515.

Sahih bukhari also reported this Mohammed's invasion of the Jewish tribe of khaybar and his subsequent 'marriage' to saffiyya. Note that safiya was a prisoner captured by Mohammed's men as a war booty. Also note that safiyya was also betrothed to kinana before Mohammed's men killed him which paved the way for Mohammed's marriage to saffiya. It will be interesting to note that, according to the Quran, the waiting period before a marriage can be consummated between a man and a divorced woman is 3months. Let's see the Quranic injunctions below:

Divorced women should keep themselves in waiting (before remarrying) three cources; and it is not lawful for them to conceal what God has created in their wombs, if they believe in God and last day; and their husbands have more right of taking them back during this, if they want reconciliation; they have (rights) similar to against them and men are a degree above them; and God is mighty and wise

(Al-Quran 2:228)

In surah Al-Ahzab it is stated:

O ye who believe! When ye marry believing women then divorce them before touching them then there is no iddah, you have reckon with.

(Al-Quran 33:49)

They above law was broken as shown below when Mohammed and his sahabas invaded the Jewish town of khaybar:

Narrated Abdul Aziz:
Anas said, "When Allah's Apostle invaded Khaibar, we offered the Fajr prayer there (early in the morning) when it was still dark. The Prophet rode and Abu Talha rode too and I was riding behind Abu Talha. The Prophet passed through the lane of Khaibar quickly and my knee was touching the thigh of the Prophet. He uncovered his thigh and I saw the whiteness of the thigh of the Prophet. When he entered the town, he said, ‘Allahu Akbar! Khaibar is ruined. Whenever we approach near a (hostile) nation (to fight) then evil will be the morning of those who have been warned.’ He repeated this thrice. The people came out for their jobs and some of them said, ‘Muhammad (has come).’ (Some of our companions added, ‘With his army.’) We conquered Khaibar, took the captives, and the booty was collected. Dihya came and said, ‘O Allah's Prophet! Give me a slave girl from the captives.’ The Prophet said, ‘Go and take any slave girl.’ He took Safiya bint Huyai. A man came to the Prophet and said, ‘O Allah's Apostle! You gave Safiya bint Huyai to Dihya and she is the chief mistress of the tribes of Quraiza and An-Nadir and she befits none but you.’ So the Prophet said, ‘Bring him along with her.’ So Dihya came with her and when the Prophet saw her, he said to Dihya, ‘Take any slave girl other than her from the captives.’" Anas added: "The Prophet then manumitted her and married her."

Thabit asked Anas, "O Abu Hamza! What did the Prophet pay her (as Mahr)?" He said, "Her self was her Mahr for he manumitted her and then married her." Anas added, "While on the way, Um Sulaim dressed her for marriage (ceremony) and at night she sent her as a bride to the Prophet. So the Prophet was a bridegroom and he said, ‘Whoever has anything (food) should bring it.’ He spread out a leather sheet (for the food) and some brought dates and others cooking butter. (I think he (Anas) mentioned As-Sawaq). So they prepared a dish of Hais (a kind of meal). And that was Walima (the marriage banquet) of Allah's Apostle." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 367)

Narrated Anas bin Malik

When Dihyah protested, wanting to keep Safiyah for himself, the Apostle traded for Safiyah by giving Dihyah her two cousins. The women of Khaybar were distributed among the Muslims.
Ishaq page 511

The Prophet conquered Khaybar by force after fighting. Khaybar was something that Allah gave as booty to His Messenger. He took one-fifth of it and divided the remainder among the Muslims.
Al-Tabari, Vol. 8, p. 130

The above quotations are 100% Islamic sources. If we repudiate Ibn Ishaq, as being unreliable, did bukhari or al-tabari make thing smoother and better? If all Islamic sources did not present Mohammed in a positive light, how about the Koran?
Muhammad orders the killing of Abdullah bin Katal’s and one of his singing-girls on page 550-1 of the biography of Mohammed by Ibn Ishaq.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 1:44pm On Mar 02, 2017
tbaba1234:
Ibn ishaq biography of Muhammad is full of unverified/false stories and narrations.

If you want to learn about Islam, you can learn from more authentic sources.
Ibn Ishaq's biography of Mohammed correlated with sahih Bukhari's hadith by over 90%. See one of the correlations.

sahih Bukhari 5:59:369_______:

Narrated By Jabir bin Abdullah: Allah's Apostle said, "Who is willing to kill Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?" Thereupon Muhammad bin Maslama got up saying, "O Allah's Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?" The Prophet said, "Yes," Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Then allow me to say a (false) thing (i.e. to deceive Kab).The Prophet said, "You may say it." Then Muhammad bin Maslama went to Kab and said, "That man (i.e. Muhammad demands Sadaqa (i.e. Zakat) from us, and he has troubled us, and I have come to borrow something from you." On that, Kab said, "By Allah, you will get tired of him!" Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Now as we have followed him, we do not want to leave him unless and until we see how his end is going to be. Now we want you to lend us a camel load or two of food." (Some difference between narrators about a camel load or two.) Kab said, "Yes, (I will lend you), but you should mortgage something to me." Muhammad bin Mas-lama and his companion said, "What do you want?" Ka'b replied, "Mortgage your women to me." They said, "How can we mortgage our women to you and you are the most handsome of the 'Arabs?" Ka'b said, "Then mortgage your sons to me." They said, "How can we mortgage our sons to you? Later they would be abused by the people's saying that so-and-so has been mortgaged for a camel load of food. That would cause us great disgrace, but we will mortgage our arms to you." Muhammad bin Maslama and his companion promised Kab that Muhammad would return to him. He came to Kab at night along with Kab's foster brother, Abu Na'ila. Kab invited them to come into his fort, and then he went down to them. His wife asked him, "Where are you going at this time?" Kab replied, "None but Muhammad bin Maslama and my (foster) brother Abu Na'ila have come." His wife said, "I hear a voice as if dropping blood is from him, Ka'b said.They are none but my brother Muhammad bin Maslama and my foster brother Abu Naila. A generous man should respond to a call at night even if invited to be killed." Muhammad bin Maslama went with two men. (Some narrators mention the men as 'Abu bin Jabr. Al Harith bin Aus and Abbad bin Bishr). So Muhammad bin Maslama went in together with two men, and sail to them, "When Ka'b comes, I will touch his hair and smell it, and when you see that I have got hold of his head, strip him. I will let you smell his head." Kab bin Al-Ashraf came down to them wrapped in his clothes, and diffusing perfume. Muhammad bin Maslama said. I have never smelt a better scent than this. Ka'b replied. "I have got the best 'Arab women who know how to use the high class of perfume." Muhammad bin Maslama requested Ka'b "Will you allow me to smell your head?" Ka'b said, "Yes." Muhammad smelt it and made his companions smell it as well. Then he requested Ka'b again, "Will you let me (smell your head)?" Ka'b said, "Yes." When Muhammad got a strong hold of him, he said (to his companions), "Get at him!" So they killed him and went to the Prophet and informed him. (Abu Rafi) was killed after Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf."

This incident was also written by Ibn Ishaq: Muhammad arranges the beheading of Kab bin al-Ashraf on page 364-9 of Ibn Ishaq's biography of Mohammed.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by tbaba1234: 2:12pm On Mar 02, 2017
true2god:
Ibn Ishaq's biography of Mohammed correlated with sahih Bukhari's hadith by over 90%. See one of the correlations.

Lol, the problem is that you have no knowledge but try to come off as someone who has a clue. You did not even know that Ibn Ishaq is not considered reliable.

The above is just pure falsehood.

As regards the story you posted, Do you know the background story? Do you fully understand the context? Of course not!!

You can read a little more here:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/discover-the-truth.com/2015/01/24/kab-bin-al-ashrafs-killing-deception-was-the-prophet-p-annoyed/amp/

Biko, keep me out of your ignorant propaganda.

Thank you.

1 Like

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 2:50pm On Mar 02, 2017
tbaba1234:


Lol, the problem is that you have no knowledge but try to come off as someone who has a clue. You did not even know that Ibn Ishaq is not considered reliable.

The above is just pure falsehood.

As regards the story you posted, Do you know the background story? Do you fully understand the context? Of course not!!

You can read a little more here:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/discover-the-truth.com/2015/01/24/kab-bin-al-ashrafs-killing-deception-was-the-prophet-p-annoyed/amp/

Biko, keep me out of your ignorant propaganda.

Thank you.
I don't get your point, do you mean Ibn Ishaq and Bukhari fabricated falsehood against your prophet? Do you mean your prophet did not send an assassin to kill his enemy, as narrated by Bukhari and collaborated by Ibn Ishaq?

I really need to know what you are trying to prove.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by Lukay99: 4:46pm On Mar 02, 2017
true2god:
Your statement here is contradictory. While you praised the work of Ibn Ishaq on the biography of Mohammed, you also claimed that some of his stories are unverifiable. How can you say a man's work is an important point of reference and at the same time condemn his work? I don't understand this logic.

Please note that Ibn Ishaq is a better Muslim than you. He is a second generation historian of Islamic theology and his works are older than the famous bukhari's hadith. And no known Islamic scholar had written any scholarly work condemning his work. We non-muslims are interested in anything/action that disqualifies Mohammed as a decent man let alone a prophet and sahih Bukhari, al-tabari, sahih Muslim and ibn ishaq have enough proof that showed Mohammed as a fake prophet.

Thank you!

Are you God? How can you decide who's a better Muslim between two people you know very little about their private life
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 6:53pm On Mar 02, 2017
Lukay99:


Are you God? How can you decide who's a better Muslim between two people you know very little about their private life
OK bro, your point has been noted. Your logical contribution to this thread will be appreciated.

Do you believe in sahih Bukhari's hadith and Ibn Ishaq's biography of Mohammed?
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 4:30am On Mar 03, 2017
true2god:
Muhammad orders the killing of Abdullah bin Katal’s and one of his singing-girls on page 550-1 of the biography of Mohammed by Ibn Ishaq.
Muhammad arranges the assassination of the old man Abu Afak on page 675 of the biography of Mohammed by Ibn Ishaq.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 9:16pm On Mar 03, 2017
true2god:
Muhammad arranges the assassination of the old man Abu Afak on page 675 of the biography of Mohammed by Ibn Ishaq.
Muhammad approves the murder of an old one-eyed Bedouin man, by Amr bin Umayya, one of his Jihadist thugs on page 674-5 in the biography of Mohammed by Ibn Ishaq.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by lfleak: 10:21pm On Apr 30, 2017
Lol this guy is too dumb!
Keep wasting your time reading a 700pages book
Keep trying ..
grin
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by Almost1122: 11:23pm On Apr 30, 2017
Don't even bother to argue with satanic children that are supporting each others here. The Book published in America to criticize Islam every day are more than ten(10) yet Islam is the fattest growing Religion in the world. 100% shame on Fault Finders. Almighty Allah is the one guilding this Religion. ''They Plot And Plan, And Allah(swt) Too Plan But, The Best Of Planner Is Allah,(Qur'an 8:30). Fools!
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 6:55am On May 01, 2017
Almost1122:
Don't even bother to argue with satanic children that are supporting each others here. The Book published in America to criticize Islam every day are more than ten(10) yet Islam is the fattest growing Religion in the world. 100% shame on Fault Finders. Almighty Allah is the one guilding this Religion. ''They Plot And Plan, And Allah(swt) Too Plan But, The Best Of Planner Is Allah,(Qur'an 8:30). Fools!
Let me get you clear, do you mean the Americans wrote *the biography of Mohammed by Ibn Ishaq* and also compiled your sahih bukhari's hadith? I need to get you clearly.

Is the 'sira' by Ibn Ishaq no longer Islamic source document? Are you ashamed of all the atrocities of your prophet as contained in the hadith?
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 6:56am On May 01, 2017
lfleak:
Lol this guy is too dumb! Keep wasting your time reading a 700pages book Keep trying .. grin
Do you mean your sira on Mohammed, his biography, is a useless book?
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by shadeyinka(m): 7:28am On May 01, 2017
@true2god

Muslims will rather reinvent history rather than face the truth. It is a trademark they inherited from their father and grandfather.

Suddenly, Abraham decides to sacrifice Ismael rather than Ishack
Suddenly Jesus says he hasn't authorised Christians to make Him, His Mother and God partners in Trinity
Suddenly, their father becomes the greatest prophet who ever lived (with no evidence or proof to show for it)

Deceptions throughout: no compulsion in religion, yet conquest after conquest they use as means of conversion.

Islam is indeed PEACE

1 Like

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by lfleak: 8:12am On May 01, 2017
true2god:
Do you mean your sira on Mohammed, his biography, is a useless book?
Lol.. am just afraid a man will successfully waste 17 out of his daily 24 hours on nairaland trying to make a non-existing point...
I just hope you are a pastor who is been fed by the sheeple if not, broda go and hustle! grin

1 Like 1 Share

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 8:30am On May 01, 2017
shadeyinka:
@true2god

Muslims will rather reinvent history rather than face the truth. It is a trademark they inherited from their father and grandfather.

Suddenly, Abraham decides to sacrifice Ismael rather than Ishack
Suddenly Jesus says he hasn't authorised Christians to make Him, His Mother and God partners in Trinity
Suddenly, their father becomes the greatest prophet who ever lived (with no evidence or proof to show for it)

Deceptions throughout: no compulsion in religion, yet conquest after conquest they use as means of conversion.

Islam is indeed PEACE
The bible asked 'if the foundation is destroyed what shall the righteous do?'

The foundation of Islam is fraught with lies and deceptions and shall it continue. Muslims will be zealous and aggressive in promoting Mohammed's lies and deceptions.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 8:35am On May 01, 2017
lfleak:
Lol.. am just afraid a man will successfully waste 17 out of his daily 24 hours on nairaland trying to make a non-existing point...
I just hope you are a pastor who is been fed by the sheeple if not, broda go and hustle! grin
I dnt know your level of income but I'm not convinced you earn more than me, that is if you have a job.

That aside, you haven't made any reasonable contribution so far, neither have you refuted any of the facts brought against your prophet.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by lfleak: 8:53am On May 01, 2017
true2god:
I dnt know your level of income but I'm not convinced you earn more than me, that is if you have a job.

That aside, you haven't made any reasonable contribution so far, neither have you refuted any of the facts brought against your prophet.
Yea.. a pastor will surely earn thousands folds than me...

contribution..? Lol you are reading a biography of someone written by another person not based on one on one interview but talks from different generations... dont you think..?
like this one you brought out.

Narrated By Jabir bin Abdullah: Allah's Apostle said, "Who is willing to kill Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?" Thereupon Muhammad bin Maslama got up saying, "O Allah's Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?" The Prophet said, "Yes," Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Then allow me to say a (false) thing (i.e. to deceive Kab).The Prophet said, "You may say it." Then Muhammad bin Maslama went to Kab and said, "That man (i.e. Muhammad demands Sadaqa (i.e. Zakat) from us, and he has troubled us, and I have come to borrow something from you." On that, Kab said, "By Allah, you will get tired of him!" Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Now as we have followed him, we do not want to leave him unless and until we see how his end is going to be. Now we want you to lend us a camel load or two of food." (Some difference between narrators about a camel load or two.) Kab said, "Yes, (I will lend you), but you should mortgage something to me." Muhammad bin Mas-lama and his companion said, "What do you want?" Ka'b replied, "Mortgage your women to me." They said, "How can we mortgage our women to you and you are the most handsome of the 'Arabs?" Ka'b said, "Then mortgage your sons to me." They said, "How can we mortgage our sons to you? Later they would be abused by the people's saying that so-and-so has been mortgaged for a camel load of food. That would cause us great disgrace, but we will mortgage our arms to you." Muhammad bin Maslama and his companion promised Kab that Muhammad would return to him. He came to Kab at night along with Kab's foster brother, Abu Na'ila. Kab invited them to come into his fort, and then he went down to them. His wife asked him, "Where are you going at this time?" Kab replied, "None but Muhammad bin Maslama and my (foster) brother Abu Na'ila have come." His wife said, "I hear a voice as if dropping blood is from him, Ka'b said.They are none but my brother Muhammad bin Maslama and my foster brother Abu Naila. A generous man should respond to a call at night even if invited to be killed." Muhammad bin Maslama went with two men. (Some narrators mention the men as 'Abu bin Jabr. Al Harith bin Aus and Abbad bin Bishr). So Muhammad bin Maslama went in together with two men, and sail to them, "When Ka'b comes, I will touch his hair and smell it, and when you see that I have got hold of his head, strip him. I will let you smell his head." Kab bin Al-Ashraf came down to them wrapped in his clothes, and diffusing perfume. Muhammad bin Maslama said. I have never smelt a better scent than this. Ka'b replied. "I have got the best 'Arab women who know how to use the high class of perfume." Muhammad bin Maslama requested Ka'b "Will you allow me to smell your head?" Ka'b said, "Yes." Muhammad smelt it and made his companions smell it as well. Then he requested Ka'b again, "Will you let me (smell your head)?" Ka'b said, "Yes." When Muhammad got a strong hold of him, he said (to his companions), "Get at him!" So they killed him and went to the Prophet and informed him. (Abu Rafi) was killed after Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf."

sounds like a movie script, so as maslam went ahead to talk to ka'b... all he said was recorded..? dnt you zealous being think/.?
you can go any length just to gain a useless point...

1 Like 1 Share

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by alBHAGDADI: 8:58am On May 01, 2017
true2god:
I dnt know your level of income but I'm not convinced you earn more than me, that is if you have a job.

That aside, you haven't made any reasonable contribution so far, neither have you refuted any of the facts brought against your prophet.
They can't refute anything you post here cos they know that doing such is equal to fighting against allah the moon god.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by alBHAGDADI: 9:00am On May 01, 2017
lfleak:
Yea.. a pastor will surely earn thousands folds than me...

contribution..? Lol you are reading a biography of someone written by another person not based on one on one interview but talks from different generations... dont you think..?
like this one you brought out.



sounds like a movie script, so as maslam went ahead to talk to ka'b... all he said was recorded..? dnt you zealous being think/.?
you can go any length just to gain a useless point...
If that's the case, then you should tell us that you don't believe in the authentic hadiths too cos they are also records and not one on one interviews.

Stop cherry picking.

2 Likes

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by AgentOfAllah: 9:05am On May 01, 2017
From experience, I can say with a significant degree of certainty that most Muslims inexplicably give hadiths far more importance than they deserve. Tbaba unwittingly hinted at the root cause of this unfortunate attribution of importance in his comment which I've quoted below:

tbaba1234:

...It is not everything a Muslim writes that we take authority from.

I ask, why appeal to any authority at all?

As meticulous as the likes of Imam Bukhari and his cohorts were, they too, invariably fell into the trap of hinging authenticity on authority. This is why their "irreproachable" stamps of authenticity, the ones Muslims fondly refer to as "sahih", gave preponderance to the reputation of the narrators, qualified by their chain (isnad) of connection to the prophet, over the consistency of the contents (matan) upon which their reports are based. The unfortunate consequence of this is that you'll find many hadiths (and I'm not referring to the week ones) codified by the respective sahih collections which are in blatant contradictions with each other.

In the best case scenario, many of the narrators may not have intended to lie, but the contradictions nevertheless, expose the unreliability of human memory, especially when narrating oral traditions that are several decades, if not centuries old. I mean, our memories even fail us when narrating events that are merely hours old! In the worst case, some of these authority figures may even have blatantly lied. No matter either ways, it is obvious that appeal to authority is a questionable way to compile events of cosmic significance. The only way in which Bukhari and co's approach would make any sense is if those texts were intended to be read purely as historical biographs, not as a set of divinely inspired codifications by which to live your life, which is how most Muslims presently treat them.

Additionally, since consistency does not necessarily translate to accuracy, the consistent parts of the sahih collections are automatically questionable too, which makes the collections all together, less than reliable. It is therefore, shocking that God should communicate its important message to its creations by such an unreliable method.

So nevermind Ibn Ishaq, he's just a convenient scapegoat useful in elevating the works of the other famous collectors who were more painstaking than he was in their appeals to authority. Although, their compilations are practically no more significant than his, historically or factually. Even if we discountenance his contributions, most Muslims still have big problems in their treatment of hadiths.

1 Like

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by lfleak: 9:16am On May 01, 2017
alBHAGDADI:
If that's the case, then you should tell us that you don't believe in the authentic hadiths too cos they are also records and not one on one interviews.

Stop cherry picking.
the ONLY AUTHENTIC BOOK AND GUIDANCE FOR ALL MUSLIMS AND ISLAM IS THE HOLY QURAN .. the perfect book which will never get compromised or infected protected by Allah... unlike hadiths that have mostly contradicting words.. why? its of different people opinion, I can write Micheal Jackson bio that he is illuminati and you write yours that he was just a noble christian and not illuminati and that brings contradiction.
and also remember, the hadith can be compared to the likes of the bible.. but when you are ready to argue with me about islam, then bring forth the Holy Quran
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by annunaki2(m): 9:18am On May 01, 2017
Almost1122:
Don't even bother to argue with satanic children that are supporting each others here. The Book published in America to criticize Islam every day are more than ten(10) yet Islam is the fattest growing Religion in the world. 100% shame on Fault Finders. Almighty Allah is the one guilding this Religion. ''They Plot And Plan, And Allah(swt) Too Plan But, The Best Of Planner Is Allah,(Qur'an 8:30). Fools!

Islam is the 'fattest' growing religion in the world yet millions of muslims all over the world are renouncing Islam every year. Kontinu deceiving yourself, Islam cannot survive these modern times when the truth about Islam and it's evil prophet is now being circulated freely on the Internet. You yourself now know mohammed was a fraud but the fear of islam's evil apotasy laws is still keeping you and millions of other victims of this babaric religion hostage.

1 Like

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by alBHAGDADI: 9:25am On May 01, 2017
lfleak:
the ONLY AUTHENTIC BOOK AND GUIDANCE FOR ALL MUSLIMS AND ISLAM IS THE HOLY QURAN .. the perfect book which will never get compromised or infected protected by Allah... unlike hadiths that have mostly contradicting words.. why? its of different people opinion, I can write Micheal Jackson bio that he is illuminati and you write yours that he was just a noble christian and not illuminati and that brings contradiction.
and also remember, the hadith can be compared to the likes of the bible.. but when you are ready to argue with me about islam, then bring forth the Holy Quran
If the hadiths are not reliable, then how come you follow the 5 pillars of Islam and other Islamic practices written in them? How certain are you that they are truly Islamic practices?


below is a thread of mine that explains a Quran verse that supports the reason why ISIS kills Muslims as well, the killing which you Muslims love to use as reason why ISIS and the likes are not muslims. Pls, refute it on the thread.

https://www.nairaland.com/3707284/christians-muslims-why-isis-kills

2 Likes

Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 9:29am On May 01, 2017
lfleak:
Yea.. a pastor will surely earn thousands folds than me...

contribution..? Lol you are reading a biography of someone written by another person not based on one on one interview but talks from different generations... dont you think..?
like this one you brought out.



sounds like a movie script, so as maslam went ahead to talk to ka'b... all he said was recorded..? dnt you zealous being think/.?
you can go any length just to gain a useless point...
FYI, I am not a pastor because many pastors are not even trustworthy, that is not to say there are no genuine ones. I work in the financial service industry and a project consultant. Not bragging, na God I give all the glory.

Back to the issue at hand, as alBagdadi stated, who composed/compiled the hadith? Are Bukhari, Muslim, Ibn majjah and Abu dawood, who compiled most of the hadith and the sunnah, among the sahabas? No.

If you condemn the 'sirah' by ibn Ishaq, you should also condemn the hadith by Bukhari, Muslim, Ibn majjah and the sunnah by Abu dawood. This is because they compiled those hadith and the sunnah over 200 years after the death of Mohammed. And fya, Ibn Ishaq lives and write the biography of Mohammed long before Bukhari and Muslim compiled the hadith.

Non of the compiler of the hadith saw Mohammed face to face or had personal encounter with him. They were traveling from place to place to get information about Mohammed, just like the modern day investigative journalist, their findings which they compiled to form the hadith. You can call the compilers of the hadith journalist because non of them were eyewitness to the life of Mohammed and his sahabas. And you will agree with me that you can't trust what they compilers of the hadith because of thousands of bias, hence Muslims have to classify the hadith into authentic, weak and fabricated hadith.

From my perspective, the sirah, according to Ibn Ishaq, is more reliable that Bukhari's hadith because not all his hadith is sahih, according to Muslims.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by annunaki2(m): 9:30am On May 01, 2017
lfleak:
the ONLY AUTHENTIC BOOK AND GUIDANCE FOR ALL MUSLIMS AND ISLAM IS THE HOLY QURAN .. the perfect book which will never get compromised or infected protected by Allah... unlike hadiths that have mostly contradicting words.. why? its of different people opinion, I can write Micheal Jackson bio that he is illuminati and you write yours that he was just a noble christian and not illuminati and that brings contradiction.
and also remember, the hadith can be compared to the likes of the bible.. but when you are ready to argue with me about islam, then bring forth the Holy Quran

Even your so called quoran is filled with lies, contradictions, errors, inconsistencies and terror inspiring messages. Is it not the same pathetic quoran that says the sun sets in a muddy pool
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by lfleak: 9:39am On May 01, 2017
true2god:
FYI, I am not a pastor because many pastors are not even trustworthy, that is not to say there are no genuine ones. I work in the financial service industry and a project consultant. Not bragging, na God I give all the glory.

Back to the issue at hand, as alBagdadi stated, who composed/compiled the hadith? Are Bukhari, Muslim, Ibn majjah and Abu dawood, who compiled most of the hadith and the sunnah, among the sahabas? No.

If you condemn the 'sirah' by ibn Ishaq, you should also condemn the hadith by Bukhari, Muslim, Ibn majjah and the sunnah by Abu dawood. This is because they compiled those hadith and the sunnah over 200 years after the death of Mohammed. And fya, Ibn Ishaq lives and write the biography of Mohammed long before Bukhari and Muslim compiled the hadith.

Non of the compiler of the hadith saw Mohammed face to face or had personal encounter with him. They were traveling from place to place to get information about Mohammed, just like the modern day investigative journalist, their findings which they compiled to form the hadith. You can call the compilers of the hadith journalist because non of them were eyewitness to the life of Mohammed and his sahabas. And you will agree with me that you can't trust what they compilers of the hadith because of thousands of bias, hence Muslims have to classify the hadith into authentic, weak and fabricated hadith.

From my perspective, the sirah, according to Ibn Ishaq, is more reliable that Bukhari's hadith because not all his hadith is sahih, according to Muslims.
you hear yourself, u just compared them to modern day journalist... like the one i quoted before... those things you wrote are all false..
read them again yourself, like : A whisper to B that C is mad... how was the whispered word noted..?
yeas that's your perspective because it suite u more isnt it? grin
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by true2god: 9:41am On May 01, 2017
lfleak:
the ONLY AUTHENTIC BOOK AND GUIDANCE FOR ALL MUSLIMS AND ISLAM IS THE HOLY QURAN .. the perfect book which will never get compromised or infected protected by Allah... unlike hadiths that have mostly contradicting words.. why? its of different people opinion, I can write Micheal Jackson bio that he is illuminati and you write yours that he was just a noble christian and not illuminati and that brings contradiction.
and also remember, the hadith can be compared to the likes of the bible.. but when you are ready to argue with me about islam, then bring forth the Holy Quran
I beg to disagree bro. You can't do away with the hadith and the sunnah, as a Muslim, when/if they don't fit into your narrative. over 90% of the sharia law, fatwa and Islamic thought are from the hadith and the sunnah of your prophet. The five pillars of Islam, which Muslims hold and religiously promote, are not in the Quran but in the hadith. The number of times you pray in a day is dictated in the hadith, not the Quran. As a Muslim, you can't run away from the hadith, except you want to abandon Islam altogether.
Re: Christians And Muslims: Let's Study Prophet Mohammad's Biography By Ibn Ishaq by lfleak: 9:43am On May 01, 2017
alBHAGDADI:

If the hadiths are not reliable, then how come you follow the 5 pillars of Islam and other Islamic practices written in them? How certain are you that they are truly Islamic practices?


below is a thread of mine that explains a Quran verse that supports the reason why ISIS kills Muslims as well, the killing which you Muslims love to use as reason why ISIS and the likes are not muslims. Pls, refute it on the thread.

https://www.nairaland.com/3707284/christians-muslims-why-isis-kills
5 pillars of islam are all in Quran FYI... dont expect me to hump unto that thread... bring them one by one here while I dissolve them.. grin

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