AlBaqir:


NB: This thread is NOT interested in examine the
correctness or wrongness of their activities as some might
want to submit, rather it only wish to state clearly the
definition of SECT/FACTION as different from a mere
GROUP/PARTY.

# SECT OR FACTIONS like AhluSunnah, Shia, Salafi etc preached Aqeedah (beliefs) and Fiqh (jurisprudence) different from each other. All of them are definitely among the 73 sects that the Prophet says his Ummah will be divided into.

# GROUP/PARTY like Nasfat, Ansarudeen, MSSN etc primarily belong in their Aqeedah and Fiqh, to one of the abovementioned SECTS/FACTIONS (i.e Sunni, Shia, Salafi etc) therefore are NOT "SECT" but "GROUP, PARTY OR ASSOCIATION" with a defined activities. We have established this fact with Quran 3: 104.

[b]AGAIN, whether they are right or wrong, is not the scope of this thread.

[/b]


Whether they re right or wrong abi, so nxt don't justify their correctness or wrongness, nxt time let ur post focus on d topic.

budosky:


I'm immature coz of the way I type?

What a stereotypical conclusion. Well, that's my preferred language and I type with it when dealing with Islamic matters.


"This is a strictly English Forum" Says who? .

I don't think you know the meaning of strictness or you don't know what you're saying. Maybe you should recheck the forum rules!

# 99% of Nairalander only understands English aside their mother language, and courtesy demand you comment in the language majority understand. And if the Arabic is so much dearer to you to write, then at least you translate for the benefit of majority. That is courtesy. Even Prophets were sent with the language of their people.

Empiree:
I hope you realized that Sheikh Bin Baz(ra) also made the same submission as op did?.

# That's bullshit to his fanatic self if at all he knows.

Empiree:
I hope you realized that Sheikh Bin Baz(ra) also made the same submission as op did?.

Na today u dey lie against our sheiks? even if its true .. our scholars can make mistake . .we muslims d0 n0t follow our scholars blindly

Hassan080196:


See jabata people. Always calling people Kaafir while what you people do is more grief. I laugh in swahili. Go listen to Sheikh ibn baz, uthymeen and sulaymeen ar ruhayli fataawas on groups/sects. Lest I forgot, you've termed all these scholars Kaafir as well . I pray Allah open your eyes from that state of ignorance you're wallowing in.

Any group following following the madhab of kutabu (Qur'an) wa Sunnah (Hadith) and manhaj salafu Salih is welcome in Islam.

go quote where our salafs said it and quote where jabata call them kafir

Abdullah2892:

brother, calm down
this is not a recommended way of dawah by d profet
u don't say pple will stay in hell, are u d 1 in charge?
Fear Allah, his fataawas might be wrong which I know but some things are still true der.
At least, he mention followung quran wa sunnah.
We know dat sects is not d best fin in Islam mostly d way dey re nowadays but den even if ure sect, wat is expected of any muslim is to follow d quran and sunnah as understood by d faithful predecessors, ur name, ur grp is nt d problem
but ur aqeedah and mnahaj

and Brother, pls don't do takfeer for pple just like dat for Allah sake
Allah might change him later even if he ia shia, and u knw dat hadith dat if u call sm1 member of hell and he was later pardoned by Allah, ull b d member of hell
Allahu Mustaan

I SAID IF HE DIE A SHITE . . .because u think am talking like jabata, u d0nt even kn0w d shuroot of kafir. .

shahydbinaliyu:
go quote where our salafs said it and quote where jabata call them kafir

I don't need to quote anything cos I listened to it myself. They (Jabata and Abu Ibeji) even condemned Riyadu salihin in that audio recording. So what are you telling me?

Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) said I av leave to things for you today follow Quran and hadith, so why bother ursef about those doctur that are complicating things understand ur Quran learn teachings of the prophet and pray to Allah to guide u.
Allah alam

vroy:
Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) said I av leave two things for you today follow Quran and hadith, so why bother ursef about those doctur that are complicating things understand ur Quran learn teachings of the prophet and pray to Allah to guide u.
Allah alam

# Kindly enlighten and show me where the Prophet says the underline.

I love this...

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

The sign of the people of bid’ah is that they do not follow the salaf. End quote from Majmoo’ al-Fataawa (4/155).

He also said (3/346): The sign of these groups – i.e., the seventy-two groups that go against Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah – is that they forsake the Qur’aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus. The one who follows the Qur’aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus is one of Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah. End quote.

It is not permissible for anyone to imagine after this that the Shi’ah, for example, are the saved group, or that the deviant Sufis, Khawaarij or Habashis are the saved group. Rather these are innovated groups which only follow invented ideas, that are denounced by the scholars and the majority of Muslims, who feel repulsion in their hearts towards them. Their ideas were never believed in for a day by Abu Bakr, ‘Umar, ‘Uthmaan or ‘Ali (may Allaah be pleased with them), or by Imam Abu Haneefah, Maalik, al-Shaafa’i or Ahmad ibn Hanbal. Would any wise person think that a belief that these imams were unaware of could be correct?

Think about it. There is the greatest and most obvious difference between Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah (the saved group) and other, misguided groups.

Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) says:

Hence the saved group is described as Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah, and they are the greater majority and the vast multitude. As for the other groups, they are followers of weird ideas, division, innovation and whims and desires, and none of these groups reached anywhere close to the size of the saved group, let alone being equal to them, rather some of these groups are very small in number. The sign of these groups is that they go against the Qur'aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus. The one who follows the Qur’aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus is one of Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah.

Majmoo’ al-Fataawa (3/346).

AlBaqir:


# That's bullshit to his fanatic self if at all he knows.

I'm seeing how moniker first time. He must have known you. He should rather agree with your message than attacking the messanger. Sheik bin baz would have agreed with what u said bcus he said the same thing. Those groups are not sects. They fall under second ayah you quoted. Abdelkabir would agree with u too if he doesn't allow SHIISM to cloud his judgment.

Rashduct4luv:
I love this...

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

The sign of the people of bid’ah is that they do not follow the salaf. End quote from Majmoo’ al-Fataawa (4/155).

# By definition, Salaf are refer to as the predecessors: the sahabah and the Tabi'ieen (followers of sahabah).

* Ibn Taymiyyah's submission is rather far from plain truth because we need to ask him, "which Salaf to be precise"?

For undeniable facts, several ahadith (largely documented by Bukhari and Muslim) exposed that MANY sahabah became KUFFAR, INNOVATORS and APOSTATES after the demise of the Prophet to the extent that Prophet predicted to disown them on the day of Qiyamat. These Sahabah cursed, fought and killed each other on RELIGIOUS issues. Likewise the Tabi'ieen followed suit. Yet, Ahlu Sunnah till date continue to follow ALL the Sahabah.

* So, again, we ask Ibn Taymiyyah, " which Salaf in particular should we follow "?

* In sha Allah, soon (below) we shall expose and dispose this cobweb submission of Ibn Taymiyyah.

Rashduct4luv:

He also said (3/346): The sign of these groups – i.e., the seventy-two groups that go against Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah – is that they forsake the Qur’aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus. The one who follows the Qur’aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus is one of Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah. End quote.

It is not permissible for anyone to imagine after this that the Shi’ah, for example, are the saved group, or that the deviant Sufis, Khawaarij or Habashis are the saved group. Rather these are innovated groups which only follow invented ideas, that are denounced by the scholars and the majority of Muslims, who feel repulsion in their hearts towards them. Their ideas were never believed in for a day by Abu Bakr, ‘Umar, ‘Uthmaan or ‘Ali (may Allaah be pleased with them), or by Imam Abu Haneefah, Maalik, al-Shaafa’i or Ahmad ibn Hanbal. Would any wise person think that a belief that these imams were unaware of could be correct?

# In the weird thinking of Ibn Taymiyyah, it is the so-called Ahlu Sunnah that follows "Qur'an, Sunnah, and consensus of scholars"

1. Who exactly are the Ahlu Sunnah our boogey sheik is talking about? Athariyyah (Salafiyyah today), Ash'ariyyah (majority of present day Ahlu Sunnah), Matrudiyyah etc, which one exactly? In Aqeedah (beliefs), all these self acclaimed Ahlu Sunnah are far different from each other.

Scholar's consensus? Ahlu Sunnah fiqh (jurisprudence) is the most alarming. Maliki Fiqh is different from Hanbali Fiqh which is also different from Shafi'i Fiqh, and Hanafi Fiqh. In fact, both Imam Malik and Ahmad Ibn Hanbal see Imam Abu Hanifah as APOSTATE who was no longer a Muslim.

Even, ibn Taymiyyah himself was GREATLY opposed by ALL his Sunni contemporary scholars to the fact that the consensus ruling of these Sunni scholars made him used 80% of his lifetime in Jail for his weird belief. And all his books were banned in the public. al-Hafiz Ibn al-Asqalani who was an Ash'ariyyah and the best Sunni in Hadith sciences declared Ibn Taymiyyah as MUNAFIQ.

So, what scholar consensus was Ibn Taymiyyah talking about?


2. Let us look at the Hadith of 73 sects and see Sunni interpretation of it:

# Imam Ibn Majah documents:

Narrated ‘Awf b. Malik:

Allāh’s Apostle, peace be upon him, said:

“The Jews divided into 71 sects. Only one of them will be in Paradise while the remaining 70 will be in Hellfire. The Christians divided into 72 sects. 71 of them will be in Hellfire while one will be in Paradise. I swear by One Who has the soul of Muhammad in His Hand, my Ummah will divide into 73 sects. Only one of them will be in Paradise, while the remaining 72 will be in Hellfire.”

It was said: “Who are they (i.e. the saved sect)?”

He replied: “The Jama’ah.”

Al-Albani comments: Sahih (authentic)

Source: Muhammad Nasir al-Din al-Albani, Sahih Sunan Ibn Majah (Riyadh: Maktab al-Tarbiyyah al-‘Arabi li Dawl al-Khalil; 1408), vol. 2, p. 364.


# Shaykh al-Albani comments on the submission by Imam al-Tirmidhi on the meaning of "The Jama'ah" thus:


"This meaning was taken from the statement of Ibn Mas’ud: “ The Jama'ah is whatever agrees with the Haqq
(Truth) even if it is only you (that follow it) .” Ibn Asakir recorded it in Tarikh Dimashq (13/322/2) with a Sahih chain from him" .

Source: Muhammad b. ‘Abd Allah al-Khatib al-Tabrizi,
Mishkat al-Masabih (Beirut: al-Maktab al-Islami; 1405)
[annotator: Muhammad Nasir al-Din al-Albani], vol. 1,
p. 61


This meaning of "Jama'ah" crushed the emotional interpretation of sheik ibn Taymiyyah that "because Ahlu Sunnah" are the MAJORITY then, it is the saved sect.


# In sha Allah, we shall examine the criteria the Prophet left to determine the right, saved sect.

Rashduct4luv:

Think about it. There is the greatest and most obvious difference between Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah (the saved group) and other, misguided groups.

Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) says:

Hence the saved group is described as Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah, and they are the greater majority and the vast multitude. As for the other groups, they are followers of weird ideas, division, innovation and whims and desires, and none of these groups reached anywhere close to the size of the saved group, let alone being equal to them, rather some of these groups are very small in number. The sign of these groups is that they go against the Qur'aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus. The one who follows the Qur’aan, Sunnah and scholarly consensus is one of Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah.

Majmoo’ al-Fataawa (3/346).

# Let us see the criteria our Prophet laid down for the identification of the saved sect:


Narration of Holy Prophet to follow Sunnah of Rightly Guided Caliphs[/size]

There is a Narration in Musnad Ahmad, 28/373


Abd Allah – my father – al-Dahhak b. Mukhalad – Thawr – Khalid b. Ma’dan – ‘Abd al-Rahman b. ‘Amr al-Sulami – ‘Irbad b. Sariyah:

The Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him, led us in salat al-fajr. Then, he faced us and delivered an eloquent sermon to us, which caused the eyes to shed tears and also caused fear in the hearts. We said or they said, “O Messenger of Allah, this is a farewell sermon. So, give us instructions.” He said, “I instruct you to fear Allah, and to listen and obey your ruler even if he is an Ethiopian slave. For, whoever lives among you shall witness after me several disagreements. Therefore, follow my Sunnah and the sunnah of the khulafa, who are rashidun and mahdiyun. Bite onto it with your molar teeth. And beware of innovated matters. For, verily, every innovation is a bid’ah; and verily, every bid’ah is misguidance.”

Sheikh Shoaib al-Arnawut terms the Narration Authentic

# Also, This Narration is present in Sunan Abi Daood, 4/200, Narration 4607; and Sheikh Albany termed it Authentic

# Tirmidhi also mentioned this Narration in His Sunan, 5/44; and termed it Hasan Saheeh.


This riwayah tells us a number of crucial facts:

1. The Prophet, peace be upon him and his family, was aware that disagreements would arise soon after his death, during the lifetimes of his Sahabah.

2. He ordered his Sahabah to follow his Sunnah and the sunnah of the khulafa after him. He used the singular “sunnah,” and not the plural “sunan,” apparently to emphasize that all these Khulafau would have a single, uniform sunnah. It was not possible for one of them to have a sunnah which would be different from the sunnah of another. The sunnah of all the Khulafa, whatsoever their number, would be one and the same in all cases and circumstances.

To further re-emphasize the point, he used the singular pronoun “it” to refer to his Sunnah and the sunnah of these khulafa jointly. This then establishes that the Sunnah of Muhammad and the sunnah of the khulafa are so perfectly identical and uniform that they are in essence one and the same entity.


* Nabi did NOT left the "Khulafah" he's (was) talking about undefined. He introduced them to us:


1. In the same hadith, he said, "...who are RASHIDUN, and MAHDIYUN". Meaning that ANY Khalifah who is not "Rashidun and Mahdiyun" is absolutely not from amongst the "Khulafah, in Qur'an terminology, 'those in authority'", that Nabi is talking about.


This definition is a great acid test to know the RIGHT "Khulafa" to be followed as MANY of the "Khulafah" after the demise of Nabi OPPOSED Allah and His Messenger.


# Shaykh Dr. al-Fawzan explains in His Sharah Aqeeda Wastia, page 165:

"The rashid is he who knows the truth and practises it. His opposite is the deviant, and that is he who knows the truth but does not practise it. His statement (mahdiyin) means those whom Allah guided to the truth"



2. Nabi also confirm and emphasised on this in Hadith Thaqalain (two weighty things) and Hadith Khalifatain (two Caliphs) which is Mutawattir hadith. He address primarily the entire Sahabah, and secondarily the entire Ummah:


"I have left over amongst you at-Thaqalain (in other versions, he used the word Khalifatain [two Caliphs], and Am rain [two orders]) which IF you adhere to it you will NEVER go astray; the book of Allah and my ITRAH, Ahl al-Bayt. They will NEVER separate from each other till they meet me at the pool".


In short, the standard instructions of the Prophet to be followed after Nabi is summarised as follows:


To follow "Khulafah" (and not just any Salafi), and those "Khulafah" with the following criteria:


1. (Their) Sunnah is the same, as it is the SAME with that of Nabi.


2. Should be Rashidun and Mahdiyun


3. Will NEVER separate from the Qur'an


# So, any sahabah and any SECT and anybody after them who do NOT follow these explicit instructions is KAFIR and not saved sect or from it.

shahydbinaliyu:
BETTER GO READ THE HADITH OF HUDAIFAH IBN YAMAN . . BUKHARI 7084, MUSLIM 1847 . . . EGBE IS KUFRU. . PLAIN KUFRU . . . IF Y0U ARE A MUSLIM, NEVER BELIEVE ANYTHING THIS SHITE ALBAQIR SAYS O. . WALAI HE IS WORSE THAN JEWS. . EVEN THAN AWON BABA ALAWO . . WORSE THAN SUFI XEF. . pers0n wey hate abubakr and aeesha, umar, uthman, abu hurayrah and many sahabahs . . every friday dem dey curse our sahabahs . . them say aeesha did adultery . . them even have absolute different quran and hadith . . . taqiyah is what he is using. . 7

This is trait of Tekfireeeh bring the understanding of salaf that go with your view...And Also this is understanding of jabataerror And cohorts

And you think all these dancing people in their sunday asalatu, those advocate of democracy, those that believe in ruling with something else apart from the sharia, the accusers of the companions, and others are all upon the truth

Trying to twist the evidences to suit one's stand point is not the solution.
It has been said by the prophet that people will get divided and all will be in hell except one, which are those that practise Islam based on the teaching and understanding of the prophet and and the companions.

May Allaah grant us ability to Follow the truth after it is known.

There are some people in this forum which they have indoctrine them with trait of Extremist by a man calling jabata may Allah guide them to the right path,its only them they declare All sect as disbeliver which they don't have Any salafy scholar predecessors on it even present scholars.....stay away of methodology of khowahrihj......

AlBaqir:




# Let us see the criteria our Prophet laid down for the identification of the saved sect:


Narration of Holy Prophet to follow Sunnah of Rightly Guided Caliphs[/size]

There is a Narration in Musnad Ahmad, 28/373


Abd Allah – my father – al-Dahhak b. Mukhalad – Thawr – Khalid b. Ma’dan – ‘Abd al-Rahman b. ‘Amr al-Sulami – ‘Irbad b. Sariyah:

The Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him, led us in salat al-fajr. Then, he faced us and delivered an eloquent sermon to us, which caused the eyes to shed tears and also caused fear in the hearts. We said or they said, “O Messenger of Allah, this is a farewell sermon. So, give us instructions.” He said, “I instruct you to fear Allah, and to listen and obey your ruler even if he is an Ethiopian slave. For, whoever lives among you shall witness after me several disagreements. Therefore, follow my Sunnah and the sunnah of the khulafa, who are rashidun and mahdiyun. Bite onto it with your molar teeth. And beware of innovated matters. For, verily, every innovation is a bid’ah; and verily, every bid’ah is misguidance.”

Sheikh Shoaib al-Arnawut terms the Narration Authentic

# Also, This Narration is present in Sunan Abi Daood, 4/200, Narration 4607; and Sheikh Albany termed it Authentic

# Tirmidhi also mentioned this Narration in His Sunan, 5/44; and termed it Hasan Saheeh.


This riwayah tells us a number of crucial facts:

1. The Prophet, peace be upon him and his family, was aware that disagreements would arise soon after his death, during the lifetimes of his Sahabah.

2. He ordered his Sahabah to follow his Sunnah and the sunnah of the khulafa after him. He used the singular “sunnah,” and not the plural “sunan,” apparently to emphasize that all these Khulafau would have a single, uniform sunnah. It was not possible for one of them to have a sunnah which would be different from the sunnah of another. The sunnah of all the Khulafa, whatsoever their number, would be one and the same in all cases and circumstances.

To further re-emphasize the point, he used the singular pronoun “it” to refer to his Sunnah and the sunnah of these khulafa jointly. This then establishes that the Sunnah of Muhammad and the sunnah of the khulafa are so perfectly identical and uniform that they are in essence one and the same entity.


* Nabi did NOT left the "Khulafah" he's (was) talking about undefined. He introduced them to us:


1. In the same hadith, he said, "...who are RASHIDUN, and MAHDIYUN". Meaning that ANY Khalifah who is not "Rashidun and Mahdiyun" is absolutely not from amongst the "Khulafah, in Qur'an terminology, 'those in authority'", that Nabi is talking about.


This definition is a great acid test to know the RIGHT "Khulafa" to be followed as MANY of the "Khulafah" after the demise of Nabi OPPOSED Allah and His Messenger.


# Shaykh Dr. al-Fawzan explains in His Sharah Aqeeda Wastia, page 165:

"The rashid is he who knows the truth and practises it. His opposite is the deviant, and that is he who knows the truth but does not practise it. His statement (mahdiyin) means those whom Allah guided to the truth"



2. Nabi also confirm and emphasised on this in Hadith Thaqalain (two weighty things) and Hadith Khalifatain (two Caliphs) which is Mutawattir hadith. He address primarily the entire Sahabah, and secondarily the entire Ummah:


"I have left over amongst you at-Thaqalain (in other versions, he used the word Khalifatain [two Caliphs], and Am rain [two orders]) which IF you adhere to it you will NEVER go astray; the book of Allah and my ITRAH, Ahl al-Bayt. They will NEVER separate from each other till they meet me at the pool".


In short, the standard instructions of the Prophet to be followed after Nabi is summarised as follows:


To follow "Khulafah" (and not just any Salafi), and those "Khulafah" with the following criteria:


1. (Their) Sunnah is the same, as it is the SAME with that of Nabi.


2. Should be Rashidun and Mahdiyun


3. Will NEVER separate from the Qur'an


# So, any sahabah and any SECT and anybody after them who do NOT follow these explicit instructions is KAFIR and not saved sect or from it.

In other words, what you are saying is only Shi'a will make heaven and other sects are in Hell. You wont leave your deceit.

AlBaqir:


# By definition, Salaf are refer to as the predecessors: the sahabah and the Tabi'ieen (followers of sahabah).

* Ibn Taymiyyah's submission is rather far from plain truth because we need to ask him, "which Salaf to be precise"?

For undeniable facts, several ahadith (largely documented by Bukhari and Muslim) exposed that MANY sahabah became KUFFAR, INNOVATORS and APOSTATES after the demise of the Prophet to the extent that Prophet predicted to disown them on the day of Qiyamat. These Sahabah cursed, fought and killed each other on RELIGIOUS issues. Likewise the Tabi'ieen followed suit. Yet, Ahlu Sunnah till date continue to follow ALL the Sahabah.

* So, again, we ask Ibn Taymiyyah, " which Salaf in particular should we follow "?

* In sha Allah, soon (below) we shall expose and dispose this cobweb submission of Ibn Taymiyyah.





# In the weird thinking of Ibn Taymiyyah, it is the so-called Ahlu Sunnah that follows "Qur'an, Sunnah, and consensus of scholars"

1. Who exactly are the Ahlu Sunnah our boogey sheik is talking about? Athariyyah (Salafiyyah today), Ash'ariyyah (majority of present day Ahlu Sunnah), Matrudiyyah etc, which one exactly? In Aqeedah (beliefs), all these self acclaimed Ahlu Sunnah are far different from each other.

Scholar's consensus? Ahlu Sunnah fiqh (jurisprudence) is the most alarming. Maliki Fiqh is different from Hanbali Fiqh which is also different from Shafi'i Fiqh, and Hanafi Fiqh. In fact, both Imam Malik and Ahmad Ibn Hanbal see Imam Abu Hanifah as APOSTATE who was no longer a Muslim.

Even, ibn Taymiyyah himself was GREATLY opposed by ALL his Sunni contemporary scholars to the fact that the consensus ruling of these Sunni scholars made him used 80% of his lifetime in Jail for his weird belief. And all his books were banned in the public. al-Hafiz Ibn al-Asqalani who was an Ash'ariyyah and the best Sunni in Hadith sciences declared Ibn Taymiyyah as MUNAFIQ.

So, what scholar consensus was Ibn Taymiyyah talking about?


2. Let us look at the Hadith of 73 sects and see Sunni interpretation of it:

# Imam Ibn Majah documents:

Narrated ‘Awf b. Malik:

Allāh’s Apostle, peace be upon him, said:

“The Jews divided into 71 sects. Only one of them will be in Paradise while the remaining 70 will be in Hellfire. The Christians divided into 72 sects. 71 of them will be in Hellfire while one will be in Paradise. I swear by One Who has the soul of Muhammad in His Hand, my Ummah will divide into 73 sects. Only one of them will be in Paradise, while the remaining 72 will be in Hellfire.”

It was said: “Who are they (i.e. the saved sect)?”

He replied: “The Jama’ah.”

Al-Albani comments: Sahih (authentic)

Source: Muhammad Nasir al-Din al-Albani, Sahih Sunan Ibn Majah (Riyadh: Maktab al-Tarbiyyah al-‘Arabi li Dawl al-Khalil; 1408), vol. 2, p. 364.


# Shaykh al-Albani comments on the submission by Imam al-Tirmidhi on the meaning of "The Jama'ah" thus:


"This meaning was taken from the statement of Ibn Mas’ud: “ The Jama'ah is whatever agrees with the Haqq
(Truth) even if it is only you (that follow it) .” Ibn Asakir recorded it in Tarikh Dimashq (13/322/2) with a Sahih chain from him" .

Source: Muhammad b. ‘Abd Allah al-Khatib al-Tabrizi,
Mishkat al-Masabih (Beirut: al-Maktab al-Islami; 1405)
[annotator: Muhammad Nasir al-Din al-Albani], vol. 1,
p. 61


This meaning of "Jama'ah" crushed the emotional interpretation of sheik ibn Taymiyyah that "because Ahlu Sunnah" are the MAJORITY then, it is the saved sect.


# In sha Allah, we shall examine the criteria the Prophet left to determine the right, saved sect.

I once engaged a Shi'a Imam in discussion and he started with something like "all the problems and differences in Islam are caused by the Sahabah!...after this i just switched off my ears! You are all the same.

Rashduct4luv:


In other words, what you are saying is only Shi'a will make heaven and other sects are in Hell. You wont leave your deceit.

Is that what you perceived? Am sorry that's your unacademic conclusion. I never made mention of any SECT as saved sect. All I just did is exposing the flaws of the claim of sheik Ibn Taymiyyah in declaring Ahlu Sunnah as the saved sects.

* The criteria of identification is there and glaring.

Rashduct4luv:


I once engaged a Shi'a Imam in discussion and he started with something like "all the problems and differences in Islam are caused by the Sahabah!...after this i just switched off my ears! You are all the same.

Wallahi that is the bitter truth that Ahlu Sunnah used to run away from and usually don't wanna hear, or know but cover up.

# Wallahi you cannot run away from the obvious evidences proving that.

AlBaqir:


Wallahi that is the bitter truth that Ahlu Sunnah used to run away from and usually don't wanna hear, or know but cover up.

# Wallahi you cannot run away from the obvious evidences proving that.

It's like you don't know the difference between Ahl Sunnah and Salafy! Shi'ism stinks!

Rashduct4luv:


It's like you don't know the difference between Ahl Sunnah and Salafy! Shi'ism stinks!

# Salafy claims Ahlu Sunnah, Ahlu Sunnah claims Salafi; and each don't desist in excommunicating the other.

# "Shi'ism stinks"?! That's a common Salafi-Wahabi slogans. It is one of their old form of propaganda. Its fast losing its planned usefulness.

* And indeed, to a Salafi, Ahlu Sunnah etc, Shiism must be "stinks" because what it preaches is a great threat to the existence of Ahlu Sunnah Aqeedah.

And,

* If it stinks, we wouldn't have Mutawattir Hadith from the prophet promising success and Jannah to the "Shi'at of Ali" in Qiyamat.

* If it stinks, Sahabah and Tabi'ieen that were known as Shia-Rafidha wouldn't have dare going near it.

* If indeed it stinks, Imam Bukhari, Imam Muslim and host of other Sunni Hadith collectors would have avoid Rafidha narrators they have galore in their respective Sahih, Musnad and other books.