Deadlytruth:


Still taking verses in isolation thus out of context. In verse 27 of that Acts chapter 8, the Eunuch is reported to be on his journey back home after having gone for worship in Jerusalem. How could an unbeliever have gone to worship in Jerusalem?

And does Acts 11:20 record that they went from house to house among those Greek unbelievers?
Recall that the contention is about the rightness or wrongness of going from house to house among unbelievers.

CAPTIVATOR:


Very funny, Now I could see why we keep going in circles .

I agree with you that almost all who went to Jerusalem accept that a Messiah is coming . If that's your definition of believer, I disagree .

A believer is someone who has accept Christ as the promised Messiah . its on record that many Jews despite worshipping God or performing the custom of going to Jerusalem don't accept Jesus is the Christ .

Yes, Someone can believe messiah is coming but disregard Christ as that Messiah thinking he is not the one as many do say during Christ Ministry .

The Eunuch is Not a believer because he hasn't come to know or believe in Jesus Christ as the promised messiah . A Believer will never have asked ' who Is it the prophet is talking about, - Act 8 : 34 Not until Philip preached the message of Jesus as Messiah to him in the next verse .

So yes, he believed a Messiah is coming , But yet to accept Christ Jesus as that Messiah . so which demand that gospel which Philip preached . Same Gospel preached in Act 5:42 proving those been evangelized to are yet to believe Jesus is the Messiah

Jozzy4:


Worshipping God is same as accepting Christ as Messiah? Gosh lol

Every Jew claims to worship Jehovah God in Jerusalem Yet many of them reject Jesus as Messiah till today !!! Learn and reason .

A Jew belives Messiah is coming BUT its a different ball game to accept that Jesus the son of Mary is that Messiah . ( identity )

You yourself quoted this :


Acts chapter 1;

5 There were Jews living in Jerusalem, religious people who had come from every country in the world. 6 When they heard this noise, a large crowd gathered. They were all excited, because all of them [ Religious people and Jews who has come to Jerusalem ] heard the believers talking in their own languages. "
( Bracket Mine )

Why are those religious people in Jerusalem Clearly Separated from believers in this verse ?

Deadlytruth:


As per the bolded; let me use another illustration since the Eunuch's one does not convince you.

John The Baptist was a believer spreading the message about Christ and asking people to repent. However, he had not known who Christ was despite Christ was standing right in front of him. It took the Holy Spirit telling him who Jesus was. This meant John the Baptist was a believer who however did not know the person he believed in until the Holy Spirit showed him. So he obviously kept on asking the Holy Spirit to reveal the identity of Jesus to him despite he had believed in Him and had been preaching and baptizing others who repented to follow Christ.
You can't be conducting baptisms on behalf of a person you are yet to believe in.

See the passage below:
John Chapter 1.

29. The next day John saw Jesus coming to him, and said, “There is the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world! 30 This is the one I was talking about when I said, ‘A man is coming after me, but he is greater than I am, because he existed before I was born.’ 31 I did not know who he would be, but I came baptizing with water in order to make him known to the people of Israel.”

This shows clearly that he believed in and was preaching about a person he had not known.

32 And John gave this testimony: “I saw the Spirit come down like a dove from heaven and stay on him. 33 I still did not know that he was the one, but God, who sent me to baptize with water, had said to me, ‘You will see the Spirit come down and stay on a man; he is the one who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’ 34 I have seen it,” said John, “and I tell you that he is the Son of God.”


Based on the above the Eunuch was a believer in Christ and went to worship the God who sent Him even though he was yet to know who exactly that Christ was.

CAPTIVATOR:




With the above, thanks for your time . we can just safely conclude that Every Jew is a believer, including the pharisees , Sadducees and all who expects the messiah . They are all believers , they just don't know who the Christ is yet . - Even the Samaritan woman testifies that the whole nation Expects the Messiah who will show them the way forward - John 4:25 .

So from your standpoint even that woman is a believer Despite she having 5 husbands, The Pharisees too and all . they all believed in the Messiah .


With that, am not surprised you could say Act 5:42 was a message to belivers since the whole Jewish nation are believers the moment they expect the Messiah . Even when they kill Jesus , they are still very much believers, since they have faith in the coming of the Messiah though not recognizing him




Thanks Bro

shaykhalislaam:
WE INVITE YOU TO ISLAM

Peace and blessings of God be upon the one who follows the right guidance!

We are glad that you are reading this.

It is this reading that can change your life in the best way.

Why?

Because we want to invite you to Islam!

Today we often hear that someone embraced Islam.

But why?

What does this mean?

Why did he do it?

What did it gave him?

After reading this article, with God’s help you will get the answers to these questions.

The Muslim religion is based on belief in the One God, who is not similar to anyone else, and no one and nothing is comparable to Him.

In Arabic, the religion is called “Islam” in English it means “obedience to God” and the word “Muslim” from Arabic means “man, who is obedient (submissive) to Only God.”

Many religions are called after a man - the father or the founder of it.

Only Islam called not by the name of a person but in fact, by the relationship between man and the Almighty Creator.

The Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be upon him) – is not the founder of a new religion.

He revived the teachings of previous Prophets and Messengers (peace be upon them), which was much forgotten by people before his arrival.

The first prophet was our forefather Adam (peace be upon him), and the last - the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him).
Other messengers are Prophets Muhammad, Ibrahim (Abraham), Musa (Moses), `Isa (Jesus), Nuh (Noah), peace be upon them all.

A person submitted to God must believe in all the prophets and messengers, and recognize their mission, otherwise he will not find the true faith, and true believer - is a man completely obedient to the will of the Lord, and such person is a Muslim.

The belief in Allah and belief in His prophets is a pillar of the Muslim faith.

All the prophets were obedient to God, that is, Muslims.

Allah has commanded in the Qur'an to those who follow the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), to believe in Allah and in what has been sent down by Him through all the prophets, that is, recognize the Quran and other divine Scriptures: the Torah, the Psalms, the Gospel, the message of the prophets.

Allah said that there is no difference between the prophets: all of them are - the Muslim brothers.

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: “The best words which I, and all prophets before me, said are: La ilaha illAllah” (there is nothing worthy of worship except the One God - Allah).

Therefore, Muslims recognize, believe, love and revere all the prophets.

It is necessary to recognize all the prophets, but one should not deify any one of them, for they are the creation of God, created by Him.

None of the prophets taught the people to worship them or some other creatures, because it would be leading to paganism and delusion from which they were saving people.

Acceptance of Islam is not a betrayal of Christianity and the teachings of Jesus Christ – on the contrary Muslims like the son of Mary (peace be upon him) and honor him because he is a great prophet of God.

To be a Muslim - is to follow the precepts of Jesus (peace be upon him), including a covenant that after him comes a new mediator and intercessor for humanity.

Muslims await the second coming of Jesus to the earth, after which he will lead the community of Muslims, and to all the faithful there will come calm and harmony after long oppressions.

Belief  - is a private matter of each individual, and there is no compulsion in Islam.

Who sincerely believed and accepted in heart the faith taught by the prophets Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad and all other prophets (peace be upon them), he should say aloud the following testimony of Monotheism (Shahaadah) with the intent to convert to Islam:

(Ash hadu an laa ilaaha illaa Allaah wa ash hadu anna Muhammadan RasoolulLaah)

“I testify that there is nothing worthy of worship except the One God - Allah, and I bear witness that Muhammad – is His prophet and messenger.”

If one cannot say the words in Arabic, he says to them in a language he knows.

From this point the person becomes a Muslim, that is, obedient to Only God, and his life begins anew.

All previous sins are forgiven, and he, clean like a newborn baby, enters into a new life.

Acceptance of Islam does not require carrying out official events inviting witnesses, walking to the mosque, etc.

Rather it is sufficient enough to sincerely believe in heart and say Shahaadah by himself.

Changing the name is not a prerequisite for becoming a Muslim, but if he wants a person can take a name characteristic of the Muslim tradition.

Right after the adoption of Islam it is desirable for the man to bathe.

After acceptance of Islam, not all people can understand him correctly, as in society, there are certain fears and false stereotypes about Islam, formed thanks to the activities of pseudo-religious sects and movements.

But the truth is that Islam has nothing in common with terror, and the true Muslim cannot sow evil on earth.

In Islam, there is no such requirement that those who became Muslims should officially announce about their faith.

But everyone has to follow the teachings of Islam.

For those who chose the path of Islam, their earlier committed sins are forgiven.

Studying the basics of Islam, Muslim converts learn how to perform correctly the five daily prayers, fasting, hajj, etc.

All Muslims are each other’s brothers and sisters.

The six components for the Muslim faith are:

1. Belief in Allah.

2. Belief in angels.

3. Belief in the holy books.

4. Belief in the Messengers.

5. Belief in the Day of Judgment.

6. Belief in Allah's predestination.

The bases of Islam

Religion of Allah consists of three pillars:

1. Iman - faith in all that has been sent down in revelation from Allah.

2. Islam - submission to all the commandments and prohibitions of Allah.

3. Ihsan – conformity of one’s language, heart and deeds with all the requirements of religion of Islam, that is to worship the Creator sincerely and perfectly.  

More information about the basics of Islam and what it means to be a Muslim, you will find with us.

All your questions regarding the Islamic faith and Muslim life, will be answered by our scholars.

Ask – and we will answer!

Muslim – is the happiest man in this world, and in eternal life paradise and contentment Lord of the worlds is waiting for him!

{©©©©©©©©©©}

Shaykh Al Islaam ArRushdiy

Inviting to good, enjoining what is right and forbidding what is wrong. Promoting Islam in its True Form.

Headquarters: 1, Alh. Kamaldeen Mustapha Street, off Kas Avenue, behind Sabo Market, Sabo, Ikorodu, Lagos, Nigeria.

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Web: shaykhalislaam.

Deadlytruth:


You have deliberately misinterpreted the message to preserve your narrative in the face of superior argument.

The issue under contention is whether one back then could be a believer before ever knowing who exactly Jesus was, and the answer is a big Yes. John the Baptist and the Ethiopian Eunuch stand out as the best examples.

The Samaritan Woman and all the others you mentioned above came to believe in Jesus after getting to know him in person. The Judaist Jews were not believers because even though they were expecting a Messiah, the perception they had about the characteristics that Messiah would posses was contrary to that which was clearly spelt out in the scriptures they Ironically claimed was their guide.The scriptures described the Messiah as peaceful and compassionate, humane, loving, humble and self-effacing; but they ignored all that and created their own version of the attributes of the Messiah to include a physical warrior, a killer, a blood thirsty conqueror, etc. Such was a clear disbelief in the scriptures, hence they became unbelievers even though they were expecting a Messiah too.

On the other hand, both the Jews and non-Jews like John and the Eunuch, who chose not to create their own mental version of the messiah but believed the attributes of the Messiah as spelt out in the scriptures were believers hence did not need to have seen or known Him before believing in Him. That was a display of great faith which Christianity itself is all about. Thanks for your time too.

CAPTIVATOR:


There is nothing superior in the argument, Just confusion - someone interpreting believing in Messiah to be same as Believing in Jesus .



Best examples of believing in Jesus or Messiah?

John didn't know who exactly is the Messiah until he met Jesus , The Ethiopian Eunuch too didn't know Jesus is Messiah until Philip preached for him.

So you are still mistakening Beliving in Messiah as Same with believing Jesus is that messiah . that is your error







They all belived in the Messiah ... Yet that doesn't make them believers . Now we are getting there . your inability to separate the two is what causes the going up and down in circles .

Now did John belived in Jesus until he met him ?

Did the Eunuch believed in Jesus until he was shown the truth about Jesus ?

( and don't make the mistake of confusing beliving in the Messiah as same as believing in Jesus as that Messiah)

Since believing Jesus is that Messiah is an entirely different thing, its understandable why the apostles Preach the message of Jesus is Messiah in Act 5:42 to unbelievers ( people who Re yet to accept Jesus is that Messiah they have been waiting for )

Deadlytruth:


Let me help you one more time.
Before the birth of Jesus, the scriptures had already made it known that the Messiah would be named Jesus - Mathew 1:22.
So whoever had read the scriptures already knew the Messiah as Jesus, thus whoever genuinely believed in the promised Messiah as described in the scriptures automatically also believed in Jesus as the Messiah prior to even His birth let alone the launching of His ministry. Only the Jews practising Judaistic fundamentalism deliberately refused to accept it like that not because they were sincerely ignorant of it but because it did not conform to their own carnal minded idea of who a savior should be.
If, we were to accept your position that no one could be a believer in Jesus before he revealed Himself through the beginning of His ministry, then one would be misled into assuming that John the Baptist was an unbeliever prophet preaching and baptizing on Jesus' behalf just because he had not known Jesus physically.
Does that make sense?
In fact John the Baptist believed in Jesus without anyone having preached to him at all. Same with the Eunuch.

All those who came to John to get baptized knew that John was preaching the Messiah they were specifically expecting. Also note that the Pharisees and Sadducees who came for the baptism had repented of believing in a warrior Messiah and accepted the Messiah as Jesus. John the Baptist himself made this known in his declaration when he saw them coming.

CAPTIVATOR:


Show us where it is written that the Messiahs name is JESUS ?

Bro, there is no reason to take you serious anymore . its glaring already that you know not what you are saying ! so Matthew is part of the Hebrew Scriptures available at that time . In fact Matthew has written his gospel at the time such that everybody already know the Messiahs name is Jesus .



Seriously ?

Go and sit down and do a very core analysis on what it means to believe in Jesus as Messiah after that You will better understand why the Jews and others need to be Evangelized to that Jesus Is Messiah both from house to house and right there in the Temple -Act 5:42

CAPTIVATOR:


Show us where it is written that the Messiahs name is JESUS ?

Bro, there is no reason to take you serious anymore . its glaring already that you know not what you are saying ! so Matthew is part of the Hebrew Scriptures available at that time . In fact Matthew has written his gospel at the time such that everybody already know the Messiahs name is Jesus .



Seriously ?

Go and sit down and do a very core analysis on what it means to believe in Jesus as Messiah after that You will better understand why the Jews and others need to be Evangelized to that Jesus Is Messiah both from house to house and right there in the Temple -Act 5:42

JMAN05:


You will have difficulty discussing with this guy. Had he been consistent and had knowledge of the scriptures, it would have been easier. Stating that what was written in Matthew has been there even before Jesus birth is a gaffe that gives him away.

Deadlytruth:


It's you who shouldn't be taken seriously anymore as you keep shifting the goalpost. You don't really have an idea of what you are saying.
It is a pity you are not able to read between the lines in Matthew's account.
Even though it is written in The new testament, the scenario which Matthew was referring to in that account all happened before Jesus was born and not after Jesus started his ministry.
It is like arguing that those ancestors mentioned in the genealogy of Jesus all existed in the New Testament times just because the genealogy account itself was given in Mathew - a new testament book.
Isiah Chapter 7:14 makes it clear that the Messiah's earthly mother would name him "Emmanuel" which means "God with us" . Prior to the Messiah's birth, Angel Gabriel told His earthly father to name Him "Jesus" meaning "God will save His people"
Yet before both of these instances happened all other prophets had prophesied that the Messiah would come and dwell among his people and save them. So who could have read the Hebrew text then and still not know that the Messiah was going to be called Jesus?

It is you who needs to sit down and do a core analysis and deep personal study of the promise of the Messiah while freeing your mind from a doctrine imposed on you by some 8 men who are just as human as yourself.

JMAN05:


You will have difficulty discussing with this guy. Had he been consistent and had knowledge of the scriptures, it would have been easier. Stating that what was written in Matthew has been there even before Jesus birth is a gaffe that gives him away.

CAPTIVATOR:


Show us where the Hebrew scriptures said the name if the Messiah is Jesus ? Show us where " Jesus " was written in the Hebrew scripture ?

Rubbish, So Emmanuel is the same as Jesus ?

The name Jesus was not given until Gabriel told Mary . Go and sit down and learn , You have a long way to go Bro

JMAN05 is right . I see

Enjoy your day .

Deadlytruth:

[s]
The crux of our argument here is whether or not anyone could be a believer in the true Messiah before getting to know him in person or by name as "Jesus".
You said it wasn't. I said it was, and I showed you where it is so recorded so as to prove it that people knew him as Jesus and believed in him as the Messiah even though he had not been born let alone having the opportunity to meet Him.
But rather than accept it or prove me wrong, you shifted the goalpost to Hebrew text. How does that change the fact that Angel Gabriel mentioned Jesus' name before his birth? How does that change the fact that John the Baptist believed in him and baptized in his name before he ever met him in person?
It is only when you declare that John the Baptist was an unbeliever that I will believe you are sincerely convinced that no one could have believed in Jesus without having being preached to about him.
Who preached to John the Baptist?
Who preached to the Pharisees and convinced them to abandon the warrior Messiah expectation for the peaceful one which was already known as Jesus at the time they got so converted?
Was John the Baptist an unbeliever despite he was preaching and baptizing on Jesus' behalf?
Unfortunately you didn't offer a single response to all these posers but shifted the goalpost to Hebrew text.
That was pure rubbish! Answer these questions first before any other thing.

JMAN05 is right for implicitly arguing that the recording of the announcement of Jesus birth in Matthew means that it happened in the new testament times?
That is the biggest illogicality I saw in recent times.
I can see that like calls onto like.
You can retain what some 8 men have brainwashed you to believe at the expense of your own logical thinking and self study. The day they adjust that doctrine you'll start singing another tune. We have seen a lot of doctrinal summersaults before now by you people.
You once claimed the world would end in 1914. When it failed, you shifted it to the mid 70s. When it failed again you moved it to the 2000s. The book of Deuteronomy says that anyone whose prophesy fails is not of God. But despite the failures of your organization's prophesies you still stick to it and yet claim to know the scriptures? What an irony!
Paul the Apostle warned that no one should believing in anyone who later adjusts his doctrine even if it is by himself. Yet you people keep adjusting your doctrines and you Ironically claim to know the scriptures? Who really takes you people seriously if not yourselves?

[/s]

Deadlytruth

Before the birth of Jesus, the scriptures had already made it known that the Messiah would be named Jesus - Mathew 1:22.
So whoever had read the scriptures already knew the Messiah as Jesus .

CAPTIVATOR:


I mentioned Hebrew scripture because that is the only scripture available at the time of Jesus . !!! Learn for once



Tell us the scripture they read which tells them the messiah's name is Jesus before Jesus was born ?

Matthew was completed after Jesus has left the earth . So it couldn't be Matthew they read .

Just point out that scripture that said it that Messiahs name is Jesus . chikenah!

xaggar:
Deadlytruth... When u see or rather read the truth please acknowledge it.

Kpere!

xaggar:
How do you believe in someone you don't even know or heard about.

I may believe in someone even if I haven met him but because I've heard about him or his ways.

If the eunuch believed in Jesus, how come he asked Phillip who the Isaiah's prophesy referred to?

Get your definition of a messiah right!

PervertProphet:



I recently on a Saturday was waving one who came with some little kids to tell preach some of the GB approved lies as usual. Lol, I made a mess of him backing up with facts. That he brought 3 sets of their Elders to speak to me. Those ones were quickly "deflated" by me that they left in shame.They generally avoid my office till date. Lol!

Janosky:

Wetin arrogant Pervert go fit "deflate"?
My brothers simply left you in peace because they have seen through your lies....

JWs you met have no time to waste with a Pervert who twists and Perverts facts.
Pervert simply confirmed that JWs embark on the preaching ministry with zeal and focus.
Kudos to my JW brothers jare....

IAmSkinny:


I believe that isn't his real name, it's just an online moniker for the purpose of anonymity. But yeah, you stooped so low; cursing and and smearing the individual with what he chose to be his moniker, even when you have zero evidence of his true personality. Wehdone sir. True Christians my left ass cheek.

Janosky:

pervert
verb
1. distort or corrupt the original course,
meaning, or state of (something).
"he was charged with conspiring to
pervert the course of justice"
synonyms: distort, warp, corrupt,
subvert, twist, bend, abuse, divert,
deflect, misapply, misuse,
misrepresent, misinterpret,
misconstrue, falsify, garble
2. lead (someone) away from what is
considered natural or acceptable.
"Hector is a man who is simply
perverted by his time"
synonyms: corrupt, lead astray,
deprave, make degenerate, debauch,
debase, warp, vitiate, pollute, poison,
contaminate, demoralize
noun
a person whose sexual behaviour is
regarded as abnormal and unacceptable.
synonyms: deviant, degenerate, debauchee,
perverted person, depraved person, perv,
perve, dirty old man, sicko, weirdo
PERVERT | meaning in the Cambridge
English Dictionary
https://dictionary.cambridge.org › pervert


*** prophet,definition..
/ˈprɒfɪt/
noun
1. a person regarded as an inspired
teacher or proclaimer of the will of
God."
***
Dictionaries - Easton's Bible Dictionary -
Prophet
Prophet
[S]
(Heb. nabi, from a root meaning "to bubble
forth, as from a fountain," hence "to utter",
Compare Psalms 45:1 ). This Hebrew word
is the first and the most generally used for a
prophet.....
In Josh 13:22Balaam is called (Heb.) a kosem
"diviner," a word used only of a false
prophet.

Thus a prophet was a spokesman for God;
he spake in God's name and by his authority
( Exodus 7:1 ). He is the mouth by which
God speaks to men ( Jeremiah 1:9 ; Isaiah
51:16 ),"

**
***##
Mr "IamSkinny", why you no add 'Pervert' to your own moniker or dey use am as your nick name?

If you have a functional God-given conscience, let it judge you.
Shalom.

IAmSkinny:


You will go at any length to justify all the curses so I am not surprised at all.

Janosky:

You're just here to rant and make baseless claims without concrete proofs.
Worse still, if you were the recipient of the other moniker's abusive rants and invectives, hell would be let loose on this forum..
If you get "sense" like the 'PervertProphet' you're defending, add his moniker to your own nau.... no long story.

Shalom.

IAmSkinny:

Waoo. Cursing truly runs in your vein. Christian my arse. . I will ignore your hypocritical and cursing self henceforth.

Janosky:
You're just here to rant and make baseless claims without concrete proofs. Just adopt the 'PervertProphet' moniker you're defending, make we know say you get 'sense'. No dull yourself. Shalom.