awesomeJ:

In case your mind deceives you, there have been billions of people in all generations, much better than you on several notes, who have willingly lived their entire lives serving God.

budaatum:

Your question is like asking me to test the potency of Yahweh. Except since it is a non-existing entity, it has no potency so there is nothing to test really.

budaatum:

The people of Orolu do not make such claims anymore because they only worked as a deterrent in the days when they were used. Nowadays, people defy the ancient taboos and nothing happens to them. So we have abandoned our taboos. Thanks to education, mainly.

adepeter2027:

I love this part of your point.

But we can observe the growth these microbes with our bare unaided eyes on various media.
Morphologies of these microbes can be describe.
Features of these microbes can be described.

Place à microscope on the table, call a Muslim, Christian, Atheist, Buddhist, Hindu etc to view, they all would agree on what they see through the microscope.

What about god? For years, there haven't been comprehensive explanation for a god. Even among the so called god believers, many disagree on the notion of a god.
You people claim god is spirit. You claim god can be accessed in the spiritual realm. You claim you encounter god but when prompted with questions, you all crawl back to your shell.

Can you pls use that same spiritual eyes to explain God? How he looks like? His complexion? His accent? Etc

Emmanystone:

Wow, see reasoning. And i'm suppose to really stand and answer this? Boy, move and grow up. You want to see spirits with a microscope.

Wooorissssdisss?

Emmanystone:

Hahahahahahahahahahaa. This is why i like having convos with clever people. They know how to be slimy.

Emmanystone:

So, don't worry, keep on. Death will come for you someday, then you'd know.

Emmanystone:

But, Obatala and Ogun do not have Judgement days, it is, if you do now, you see now. So, i ask you again, what did you do to defy these gods that you went away with no stink?

Emmanystone:

Really? What gave them the potency to work in those days? I guess you didn't know when you used this stone to smash your testicles.

Okay, these days, People defy Obatala and Ogun and nothing happens, Fine, what kind of ancient Taboos are people defying these days? Can you mention one?

And, What particular Taboos have you personally committed and go unscarred?

I really need to bring Vaxx in here. @Vaxx, this claims this brother is making here, are they true? Is it true that anyone can defy Obatala and go unscarred?

awesomeJ:

Buda doesn't seem to know if he's claiming my New York guy exists or not, just some long epistles.

budaatum:
First, you do not have to prove to me that there is some guy in New York who you write to when you want something. To be honest, I wouldn't have reason to doubt you get what you get from the guy by writing letters unless you give me reason to doubt you, say for instance, if you are known to bend the truth often! So why bother proving it to me in the first place?...............

Gggg102:
in some old threads, I've seen atheist argue that atheism is the lack of belief in god.

they claim that they are atheists not because they 'believe there is no god' but because they 'do not believe there is god'

awesomeJ:
Just finishing March Holyghost service now.

I've read through my mentions,. and really there isn't any which deserves a response.
Buda doesn't seem to know if he's claiming my New York guy exists or not, just some long epistles.
The other folks' comments seem immature and off point.
So thanks for saving me time.

However, if you have any reasonable argument that doesn't involve you going around in endless circles over talks we've had, bring it ON.

budaatum:
Buda is claiming buda does not give a damn, actually!

awesomeJ:


You may just keep those cents bro.

Now about answered and unanswered prayers.

The fact is even if it's only one prayer that gets answered, it is enough to establish that a God exists who answers prayers. If a million other prayers don't get answered, it still doesn't change the fact.

Take an instance,
Somebody says "road crashes kill people"

If for every 100 people that die by road crashes. a thousand others don't, doesn't change the validity of the statement?

And about having several gods, and knowing which one is right, that's not the issue I have with atheists. The issue I have with them is that they emphatically claim out of their ignorance, that God, and by extension, the supernatural, doesn't exist.

So, it only makes sense to try enlightening them.

Emmanystone:

Hahahahahahahahahahaa. This is why i like having convos with clever people. They know how to be slimy.

I didn't ask you to test the potency of YHWH because i know he won't answer you immediately. You'd have to run your course on earth. He is waiting for you when you breath your last. He will let you run your course on earth, then you'll lay dead, when that happens, lolzzzz

Here is what gives you the audacity to defy YHWH and gets ignored by Him for now.

Ecclesiastes:8:11-12
Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil.

Though a sinner do evil an hundred times, and his days be prolonged, yet surely I know that it shall be well with them that fear God, which fear before him:

So, don't worry, keep on. Death will come for you someday, then you'd know.

But, Obatala and Ogun do not have Judgement days, it is, if you do now, you see now. So, i ask you again, what did you do to defy these gods that you went away with no stink?


@bolded. Do you mean Obatala and Ogun were gods in those days whose potencies worked against those who defied them to act as a deterent, but now works no more?

Really? What gave them the potency to work in those days? I guess you didn't know when you used this stone to smash your testicles.

Okay, these days, People defy Obatala and Ogun and nothing happens, Fine, what kind of ancient Taboos are people defying these days? Can you mention one?

And, What particular Taboos have you personally committed and go unscarred?

I really need to bring Vaxx in here. @Vaxx, this claims this brother is making here, are they true? Is it true that anyone can defy Obatala and go unscarred?

budaatum:

So, Gggg102, 8 pages of to and fro, and no closer to resolving anything. But hopefully, you may understand why its safer for the not so bold or certain, atheist, to claim a lack of belief, instead of an assertion of knowledge?

I thank you for the thread!

budaatum:
Your question is like asking me to test the potency of Yahweh. Except since it is a non-existing entity, it has no potency so there is nothing to test really.

Tasma:


Naa praying and receiving and answer to your prayer is not proof of a God. The only way to prove there is a being that answers prayers is if everytime anyone prays to him he receives his prayer request. If there are cavaets like was he praying sincerely or did God also want what he wanted for himself then there is no way to prove the beings existence. Furthermore people receive this same "blessings" though not praying at all or praying to myriad, different concepts of God. Again I repeat one persons subjective appraisal of whether prayers are answered cannot be held proof of the existence of a God.

MuttleyLaff:
The second line emboldened was so uncalled for

vaxx:
first of all, obatala, ogun or any other energies are not GODS. they are orisha. when you put it into yoruba syllable , it goes like this ori- ti- a- sha...meaning ,the head we specifically selected ...we do not worship orisha rather we honor and acknowledge them ,our cuilture
are characterized by a deep sense of the interdependence of all life. every life form and element of Nature has an inner soul force – including rivers, rocks, clouds, metals, flowers, thunder, and the wind. These natural energies that comprise the Universe are symbolically represented by Orisa . Each Orisa has its own specific function. Humans are in constant communication with Orisa energy, whether we’re aware of it or not. for instance, te-ki- ina- lo- Ji(press and let fire wake it) known as technology in English are simply a combination of iron, steel,metal and human ability to convert fire to electricity, coal to gas and so some other interesting things we do with fire.. so you can not defile this natural energy and go Scot free, the ogun and shango, are the symbolic representation of technology,(i.e. the inner soul in them)cars ,phones, electricity even cutlass or any other product of technology comes with their taboo, check the manual instructions, if you defile them, they will work against you... it work till today, as it work in the past no one defile the orisha and go Scot free.

Obatala is the symbolic representation of purity and cleanliness , No one defiles purity and cleanliness without facing the consequence.

budaatum:

There you go again with the snideness. Can't you help yourself?!


"You wait and see" Is what Obatala and Ogun people would say too.


You don't know anything about me. That's why I am here laughing.

My maternal great grandparents were Ifa Priests in the Orolu Kingdom. And because of it we are steeped in the Ifa awo. My paternal grandfather, the Basorun, was an Obatala Priest. Obatala is the Supreme God in Orolu Land. You might from this understand that I have pedigree.

Whenever I arrive in the Orolu Kingdom, I do a walk around the town as part of my os[h]a (I've added the h so it reads well), and I must start after 2am, for that is when the Spirits that ensure Orolu prospers roam around the Kingdom. The walk takes me past Saint John's - the first church in town, past the first mosque and past the Palace in front of which stands the I Bo Osa (Osa Shrine), and takes approximately 1.5 - 2 hours. And on it, I will meet nightwatchmen, who are Ogun worshippers, as nightwatchmen usually are in Yoruba land.

They will shout out, "Iwo wo lo nlo ni ibe yen?" (Who is it that goes there?). And I will respond, "Emi" (Me). They would ask, "Ta ni iwo?" (Who is 'me'?) and I will respond, "Emi Basorun". (Me, Basorun). You see, I'm not the Basorun, my uncle is, but we Basoruns have this thing that every Omo Basorun (Child of Basorun) refers to themselves as Basorun so when you see one, you have seen us all. They will then respond, "Te le jeje o, S'Orun" ('Thread on the ground softly, you the Heavenly Doer'), plus some other things. I will respond with the appropriate response, and go on my way.

Now, if you know anything about Yoruba land, you would know that my walk has a meaning to those who are in the know. What amazes them is that Omo Baba Ilu Oyinbo, ("The Child of the Old Man from London" - the old man, having spent years abroad and who appears to have practically lost all knowledge of the local culture), first, knows the role of his forefathers (walking around town in the middle of the night conversing with the Spirits and ensuring they keep on making the Kingdom prosper). Second, that Omo Baba Ilu Oyinbo is brave enough to take on this role (The middle of the night in the Orolu Kingdom is when the Gods send the Spirits to place a mark on those who will depart from earth that day so, if you don't want to die, stay indoors!). And third, that Omo Baba Ilu Oyinbo knows the right things to say when the Spirits accost him on his walk (not knowing the right words is like not knowing the password, and if you get it wrong the Spirits will just make you depart from earth that very moment!). You might understand why, part of our response in the dialogue is the phrase "Ilu a toro o" (There will be peace and prosperity in the land o).

As Omo Basorun, it is my duty to go up into the heavens and bring light to my people. And the only way I can personally defy the Gods of the land is by me not performing the duty assigned to me by the Gods. And if I do not perform my duty, which is not just walking around town in the middle of the night but also going up into the heavens and bringing Light to my Kingdom, I, buda will die. But I like performing my duty, so buda, lives!


I hope from what I've said above that you would understand me when I say, in the old days, the Gods will tell the likes of myself to take those who defy them to the bottom of the river and bash their heads in and use their skulls to drink sekete. But like human sacrifices, which we did because our Gods required it, we do no more because we are not so stupid anymore. And since we, the doers of the errands of our Gods no more do that which we claimed our Gods told us to do, they, our Gods, have lost their potency to punish those who defy them. Now, they have learnt to forgive many times and make different demands of us.

But besides that, Omo Basorun (It means "Son of the King of the Heavens", in case you do not know), is not able to defy his father, 'The King of the Heavens'. And if anyone is bold enough to falsely accuse him of such a crime, the Son of the King of the Heavens will go up into the Heavens, get permission from his Father, The King of the Heavens, to blot out the light and the Kingdom will be in darkness!

My point is that my beliefs are irrelevant. When I am in Rome I am a Roman, And when I am in the Orolu Kingdom, I am Omo Basorun, the Son of the King of the Heavens who goes up to his Father, the King of the Heavens, from where he brings Light into the Orolu Kingdom.

budaatum:

There you go again with the snideness. Can't you help yourself?!


"You wait and see" Is what Obatala and Ogun people would say too.


You don't know anything about me. That's why I am here laughing.

My maternal great grandparents were Ifa Priests in the Orolu Kingdom. And because of it we are steeped in the Ifa awo. My paternal grandfather, the Basorun, was an Obatala Priest. Obatala is the Supreme God in Orolu Land. You might from this understand that I have pedigree.

Whenever I arrive in the Orolu Kingdom, I do a walk around the town as part of my os[h]a (I've added the h so it reads well), and I must start after 2am, for that is when the Spirits that ensure Orolu prospers roam around the Kingdom. The walk takes me past Saint John's - the first church in town, past the first mosque and past the Palace in front of which stands the I Bo Osa (Osa Shrine), and takes approximately 1.5 - 2 hours. And on it, I will meet nightwatchmen, who are Ogun worshippers, as nightwatchmen usually are in Yoruba land.

They will shout out, "Iwo wo lo nlo ni ibe yen?" (Who is it that goes there?). And I will respond, "Emi" (Me). They would ask, "Ta ni iwo?" (Who is 'me'?) and I will respond, "Emi Basorun". (Me, Basorun). You see, I'm not the Basorun, my uncle is, but we Basoruns have this thing that every Omo Basorun (Child of Basorun) refers to themselves as Basorun so when you see one, you have seen us all. They will then respond, "Te le jeje o, S'Orun" ('Thread on the ground softly, you the Heavenly Doer'), plus some other things. I will respond with the appropriate response, and go on my way.

Now, if you know anything about Yoruba land, you would know that my walk has a meaning to those who are in the know. What amazes them is that Omo Baba Ilu Oyinbo, ("The Child of the Old Man from London" - the old man, having spent years abroad and who appears to have practically lost all knowledge of the local culture), first, knows the role of his forefathers (walking around town in the middle of the night conversing with the Spirits and ensuring they keep on making the Kingdom prosper). Second, that Omo Baba Ilu Oyinbo is brave enough to take on this role (The middle of the night in the Orolu Kingdom is when the Gods send the Spirits to place a mark on those who will depart from earth that day so, if you don't want to die, stay indoors!). And third, that Omo Baba Ilu Oyinbo knows the right things to say when the Spirits accost him on his walk (not knowing the right words is like not knowing the password, and if you get it wrong the Spirits will just make you depart from earth that very moment!). You might understand why, part of our response in the dialogue is the phrase "Ilu a toro o" (There will be peace and prosperity in the land o).

As Omo Basorun, it is my duty to go up into the heavens and bring light to my people. And the only way I can personally defy the Gods of the land is by me not performing the duty assigned to me by the Gods. And if I do not perform my duty, which is not just walking around town in the middle of the night but also going up into the heavens and bringing Light to my Kingdom, I, buda will die. But I like performing my duty, so buda, lives!


I hope from what I've said above that you would understand me when I say, in the old days, the Gods will tell the likes of myself to take those who defy them to the bottom of the river and bash their heads in and use their skulls to drink sekete. But like human sacrifices, which we did because our Gods required it, we do no more because we are not so stupid anymore. And since we, the doers of the errands of our Gods no more do that which we claimed our Gods told us to do, they, our Gods, have lost their potency to punish those who defy them. Now, they have learnt to forgive many times and make different demands of us.

But besides that, Omo Basorun (It means "Son of the King of the Heavens", in case you do not know), is not able to defy his father, 'The King of the Heavens'. And if anyone is bold enough to falsely accuse him of such a crime, the Son of the King of the Heavens will go up into the Heavens, get permission from his Father, The King of the Heavens, to blot out the light and the Kingdom will be in darkness!

My point is that my beliefs are irrelevant. When I am in Rome I am a Roman, And when I am in the Orolu Kingdom, I am Omo Basorun, the Son of the King of the Heavens who goes up to his Father, the King of the Heavens, from where he brings Light into the Orolu Kingdom.

awesomeJ:
I guess you thought the comment covered you. I was referring to just some 2 guys or so, who quoted me with silly arguments.
Unless you think you did, Relax man

awesomeJ:


Why do you guys make silly arguments like this now.

I apply to Exxon for a job, I got the job, does it have to be that everyone who applies to a job at Exxon gets it before your own funny imagination actually gets convinced that Exxon exists to give people jobs.

And the fact that other people get jobs without applying to Exxon, in your own mind, that means Exxon doesn't exist to give jobs?

Really lame line of thought if you ask me.

Emmanystone:

I can't believe i just read this from a man who claims there is no God(s). .........................

budaatum:
The Orolu Kingdom is 8 hours away from London, door to door at that. A blink of the eye and like one single step for the Son of the King of the Heavens. If they sneeze in the Kingdom, the Son hears it wherever she is. I do confess that modern technology helps.

I never expected you to understand anything I wrote, so your response hardly surprises me. Someone referred to you as Analice. Is that really you. It would explain a lot. Please note that your right to have your questions to buda answered has been suspended, though buda has the right to ignore this rule at any time
she wishes.

EmperorHarry:

That was an error right?!

MuttleyLaff:
No brother, it isn't bout me.
I just felt you slighting anyone on that thread wasn't called for
You may and/or could have said their arguments were feeble I thought

budaatum:

Nope. Intentional. As in, written with a specific intent. Every word carefully considered and chosen.

MuttleyLaff:
No brother, it isn't bout me. I just felt you slighting anyone on that thread wasn't called for You may and/or could have said their arguments were feeble I thought

Tasma:


Lol your argument would only stand if you could prove that it was God that gave the answer to your prayer. If Exxon gave me a job I can prove that Exxon wrote the acceptance letter to me. Can you prove that it was your concept of God that answered your prayer more so since people that don't even pray receive same blessings. Receiving a "blessing" does not acknowledge the source of the so called blessing. Does this make some sense to you?

budaatum:

What awesome seems to have is utter contempt for others. He would have said otherwise if he thought or felt different.

Seun:
If a person continues to post wrong information after he has been corrected many times, at some point we have to assume that it is deliberate.

EmperorHarry:

Really bruh!!!
First you had me strain my eyes and you still didn't shed more light on the use of the word
Is it that your a she(this I doubt) or are you referring to buda as a she?(most likely)

awesomeJ:


You probably didn't read the thread from the beginning.
In my foremost analogy,
I said I wrote a letter to my guy in New York, asking that he'd make me get an 'A' in MTS 415. In the end about 5 out of 90 of us in the class got 'As'
Asking the other guys how they made the grades, some would tell you it was their hard work, maybe another would mention his closeness to the course instructor as being the cause.

on my own part, I know all I did was write a letter, and I got the exact thing I requested for. So it shouldn't be difficult for you to agree when I say it's my letter to my New York guy that wrought my success.

Now ask yourself, why do people ask successful folks for the secrets of their success. It's basically because, we realize that the one who achieves a thing is the one in the best position to tell the means via which it was achieved.

Kenneth Hagin prayed, and got an instant healing. Tell me what you think the source of the healing was, if you think it wasn't prayer.