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Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? - Health (14) - Nairaland

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NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU / Strike: "JOHESU is Selfish, They don't know what they want" must read!! / Federal Health Workers Under The Umbrella Of JOHESU Embark On Indefinite Trike (2) (3) (4)

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Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by careerwoman(f): 11:39am On May 25, 2018
Solababa91:


Doctors should respect themselves and see if other health professionals won't reciprocate, why poking their nose into what does not concern them. JOHESU approached FG with some yearnings not the NMA, why will NMA tell the FG not to yield to their yearnings? The Minister of Health which has turned himself to Minister of Doctors came out to say JOHESU wants to be at par with Doctors in respect to salaries and emoluments. Can't JOHESU ask for his right again? What has NMA has to do with JOHESU plight? and who is NMA to dictate to the FG whose his to answer or not? NMA has gone on industrial action countless times and JOHESU or any health union has never for once told FG not to honour their quest, the sky is wide for any bird to fly. If you feel you are not well remunerated you have the right to discuss with your employer. Basic! If you are sincere with yourself you should know where this imbroglio emanated from. Let Doctors respect themselves and other professionals rather than despising and poking their nose into what does not concern them and see if they won't get respect in return. But if they feel they can continue to monopolize the system, they'll be given a good run for their money. Gracias

Yes, you have the right to discuss your finances with your employer. But why would you publish a comparison of salary between doctors and other health workers? Your ogas dragged doctors into the matter in the first place. I heard the right information about this strike even before it started. See, what your JOHESU ogas are after is for the removal of relativity and pay parity with doctors amongst other things. They were offered a salary raise at the first negotiation but they refused because it will automatically increase the doctor's salary. It's the relativity that's their problem not the salary raise (they haven't told you the truth). They know they have the numbers and will easily manipulate their junior members who already have had a bad experience with proud and poorly behaved doctors. When a doctor is proud or disrespectful, it's his personality and his problem. The profession is not to blame. All doctors are not proud or badly behaved. Stop the generalisation. That's the problem in the country. We make hasty generalisation of a particular group when we allow our emotions cloud our judgement.
Not all your members are saints either and some of them are also very rude and disrespectful. I've had my own good and bad experiences too..

My team had an emergency surgery one morning and asked that I go to the lab for an urgent PCV to be done for the patient. I took the sample myself and went to the lab.. I met a fellow med lab intern, greeted her very well ooo (because once they know you're a doctor, they toughen up) begged her to help me do the PCV. This madam blatantly refused saying that I would have to wait for the next person on duty who will come an hour later. I begged and begged but she didn't move a muscle (Simple PCV that I can do myself). I left the room and met her colleague on the corridor, ask that one politely and she didn't even allow me finish. She immediately took the sample and within 15-20 mins gave me the result.
So you see, doctors aren't the only ones to blame..
Mutual respect is key!!

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by larrrymore(m): 11:40am On May 25, 2018
Hairyrapunzel:



sorry hemiplegia isn't a disease. You are rehabilitating not treating a disease Mr man. Disability is not synonymous with disease neither can they be used interchangeably.

How will the brain regain it's function without treating the disease that caused damage?
sir.... no offence oo.. I think u need to go back to school

2 Likes

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Hairyrapunzel: 12:17pm On May 25, 2018
Thanks18:


Let me sound this to you as it has becoming my routine these days when confronted by medical illiterates like you. Just as the great Ikemba once said: "Having a dialogue with my country men is like having a dialogue with the deaf; it requires a great deal of repetition, a great deal of shouting and a great deal of gesticulation. In spite of all these efforts, you still run the risk of being misunderstood". You are simply daft, deaf or arrogant. You are very good in raising dust but very poor to substantiate those nothing with intelligent argument backed with logical answer and facts. I explain what disease is all about, instead of taking ample time to digest it, you conjured up nonsense. I see you have a fundamental problem and that's shallow understanding. Stop taking coffee and be hallucinating. Stop cramming for my point is not all those pathways in biochemistry. If you don't have anything to say again, keep mute than exhibiting a broad day light audacious ignorance. This is 21st century(age of information) and not dark ages where coercion is a tool in reasoning. I am a Physiotherapist. I know my job description and I owe you no further explanation as your mind is locked up with key of prejudice and illiteracy. I am through with you.
You said your job is treating diseases and I asked to show me where a physiotherapist treats diseases and you have refused. Shame did not allow you screen grab and paste here. Only Nigerian physiotherapist say they treat diseases. Even a physiotherapist telling me hemiplegia, spasticity and gait abnormalities are diseases. A Nigerian physiotherapist doesn't know the difference between disease and disability. You don't know your job description.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Hairyrapunzel: 12:19pm On May 25, 2018
larrrymore:

sir.... no offence oo.. I think u need to go back to school

See illiterate that says rehabilitation means treating diseases. You too no know your work.
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Solababa91(m): 12:45pm On May 25, 2018
careerwoman:


Yes, you have the right to discuss your finances with your employer. But why would you publish a comparison of salary between doctors and other health workers? Your ogas dragged doctors into the matter in the first place. I heard the right information about this strike even before it started. See, what your JOHESU ogas are after is for the removal of relativity and pay parity with doctors amongst other things. They were offered a salary raise at the first negotiation but they refused because it will automatically increase the doctor's salary. It's the relativity that's their problem not the salary raise (they haven't told you the truth). They know they have the numbers and will easily manipulate their junior members who already have had a bad experience with proud and poorly behaved doctors. When a doctor is proud or disrespectful, it's his personality and his problem. The profession is not to blame. All doctors are not proud or badly behaved. Stop the generalisation. That's the problem in the country. We make hasty generalisation of a particular group when we allow our emotions cloud our judgement.
Not all your members are saints either and some of them are also very rude and disrespectful. I've had my own good and bad experiences too..

My team had an emergency surgery one morning and asked that I go to the lab for an urgent PCV to be done for the patient. I took the sample myself and went to the lab.. I met a fellow med lab intern, greeted her very well ooo (because once they know you're a doctor, they toughen up) begged her to help me do the PCV. This madam blatantly refused saying that I would have to wait for the next person on duty who will come an hour later. I begged and begged but she didn't move a muscle (Simple PCV that I can do myself). I left the room and met her colleague on the corridor, ask that one politely and she didn't even allow me finish. She immediately took the sample and within 15-20 mins gave me the result.
So you see, doctors aren't the only ones to blame..
Mutual respect is key!!

I want you to know that this fight about emoluments have been on ground for a long time, but let me tell you the most recent episode, the strike JOHESU embarked on in 2016 was to push their grievances, the FG yielded, and promised to effect the payment from Sept last year or thereabout, JOHESU worried why it was not effected made it findings and found out NMA has hands in it, so JOHESU has a form of SOS had to publish that so as to inform the general public what they have been enduring so as to press home their demand. And as far as am concerned, there is nothing wrong with that, it is false that JOHESU wants equal pay with Doctors as NMA is saying because I. The amount JOHESU wants was also published, and it is not at par with NMA's. ii. The professional bodies under JOHESU (Nurses, Pharmacist, MLS and others) do not even get equal pay so how on earth would they be clamoring for equal pay with Doctors. I want you to know that disrespect is not only in name calling, or body language. That Doctors even see other licensed Professionals as people who don't treat patients or irrelevant and feels they are all encompassing and can do every man's job is equally disrespect. A Doctor would write a referral to a Physiotherapist and include in it the type of treatment that should be given the patient, I wonder why the Doctor will even refer in the first place he should have treated the patient himself since he knows what to do. This is disrespectful, the Physiotherapist is trained, licensed and certified to do whatever he deems fit, he is aware of his duties and responsibilities for God sake, he is not a TECHNICIAN, to be dictated to, he has gone through anatomy, physiology, biochemistry, pharmacology for a number of years any other courses DEEMED FIT for his training and thereafter a Licensed and certified Professional to practice. The attitude you got from the MLS intern you referred to though wrong, I condemn it, but is a resultant effect of what she sees Doctors do to other professionals long before now. Do you know there are Doctors that still write referrals with prescription sheets? Even when the referral sheet is available? It is disrespectful, a lot of issues needs to be resolved. Until Doctors see patient care as multidisciplinary and that patient condition dictates who the head of a Medical team will be then, will we get it right, and there will be harmony amongst all professionals but if they still feel they are all in all, we are in for a long thing.

P.S.: You will be the first Doctor to approach issues politely on this thread, may be you serve as a point of reference to other arrogant ones. Once again I commend your maturity.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by lanxebony(m): 1:20pm On May 25, 2018
The way NMA wants to rule the health sector

5 Likes

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by stunning4real: 1:32pm On May 25, 2018
dokyOloye:
Who told you that?
You mean a doctor can't dress the bed or administer drugs?
Abi na to check vital signs?
where I work Doctors don't do that here sir/ma
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by stunning4real: 1:34pm On May 25, 2018
Teecomm:




Yeah
They can do what all those people could do....It's this Division of Labour that is making problem rise up jare
they can do but will any Doctor do it?
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by careerwoman(f): 1:37pm On May 25, 2018
Solababa91:

I want you to know that this fight about emoluments have been on ground for a long time, but let me tell you the most recent episode, the strike JOHESU embarked on in 2016 was to push their grievances, the FG yielded, and promised to effect the payment from Sept last year or thereabout, JOHESU worried why it was not effected made it findings and found out NMA has hands in it, And as far as am concerned, there is nothing wrong with that, it is false that JOHESU wants equal pay with Doctors as NMA is saying because I. The professional bodies under JOHESU (Nurses, Pharmacist, MLS and others) do not even get equal pay so how on earth would they be clamoring for equal pay with Doctors. I want you to know that disrespect is not only in name calling, or body language. That Doctors even see other licensed Professionals as people who don't treat patients or irrelevant and feels they are all encompassing and can do every man's job is equally disrespect. A Doctor would write a referral to a Physiotherapist and include in it the type of treatment that should be given the patient. This is disrespectful, the Physiotherapist is trained, licensed and certified to do whatever he deems fit, he is aware of his duties and responsibilities for God sake, he is not a TECHNICIAN, he is a Licensed and certified Professional. The attitude you got from the MLS intern you referred to though wrong, I condemn it, but is a resultant effect of what she sees Doctors do to other professionals long before now. Do you know there are Doctors that still write referrals with prescription sheets? Even when the referral sheet is available? It is disrespectful, a lot of issues needs to be resolved.

Thank you for the commendation.
Do you know that before the new salary scale for doctors was effected, resident doctors had to go on strike in their respective hospitals? The FG had approved the scale but some hospitals weren't paying. Maybe other health workers should check with the hospitals because I don't think the salary scale that they published is correct. I've said it that intern pharmacists and lab scientists earn 130+ as net salaries in some the federal hospitals.
Another point I wanted you to understand was the relativity I mentioned. If a salary raise is effected, I hope you know it will automatically increase the doctor's salary (which your ogas don't want). The main bone of contention is the reduction of that ratio between the CONMESS and CONHESS scale which was approved after the FG had done a research on other countries' scales. Health workers are poorly paid in Nigeria, I absolutely agree. NMA only entered the matter because of that relativity not your pay increase.

Then, concerning the issue you raised about referrals to physiotherapy. In the hospital I trained at and where I'm currently working, we write referrals to physiotherapists to review patients that will benefit from the therapy. The form is different from the regular referral forms. In times of shortage, we use any paper nearby. In orthopaedic surgeries, our patients always have some form of contact with physiotherapists during their management. We ask for A REVIEW and will specify what part of the body will need the rehabilitation. It doesn't mean we're telling you your job rather it makes it easier for you to do your job. A patient with malignant pleural effusion with chest tube insitu will benefit from chest physiotherapy not limb or any other physiotherapy. However, during your review you might also pick up other problems the patient might have which the doctor may also have missed which should be documented on the patient's file and related back to the doctor. The doctor still remains the head of the team.
In these federal hospitals I've been to, physiotherapists run their own ward rounds too and document in the patient's folder.
Medicine is an evolving science nobody knows it all plus no one is above mistakes.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by danilmo: 1:54pm On May 25, 2018
Solababa91:


Please let's leave him to his ignorance, I had told him earlier on to go check what a disease is, a supposed intelligent physician would have at least make findings or enlighten himself with what he doesn't know rather than feigning his ignorance and living on what he's been told or fed with, may be we should tell them it's not business as usual, we've woken up, we have new generations of Professionals now, not the one they run over years back, nobody can paint blue as black for anybody. NOT AGAIN! These has been their problem right from onset, instead of them to bring themselves low and learn NO! rather they will keep boasting and Doctoring on ignorance and it's been affecting them. WHEN ONE THINKS HE KNOWS EVERYTHING AND KEEPS RANTING "STOOFS". The other two up there said an HIV patient cannot have stroke secondary to meningoencephalitis and one was even trying to build STOOF where there exists none by saying blah blah blah "there are diseases HIV patients can have" or whatever, have not seen anyone of them respond on these thread any longer I know they would have made research to visit the link I shared and buried their head in shame. That is same way they formulate false diagnoses and diseases processes to poor and ignorant patients, these one too said gait abnormality, hemiplegia and spasticity are not diseases, then what are they? Good health? He has not even checked what a disease is or care to know what Physical Therapy is all about. May be he's been fed too that all PT's do is just to carry hand and leg or PM. Laughs...

pls remain in ur house ,
keep the strike alive while patient patronise our private hospital..

grin

all dsame, all na win win for doctors.
cheesy

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Nobody: 2:15pm On May 25, 2018
Thanks18:


Pls answer what is a disease? According to US National library of Medicine, a disease is any condition which results in the disorder of a structure or function in a living organism that is not due to any external injury. Going by this definition, a physiotherapist has a clinical skills and autonomy to assess, diagnose and treat disease using physical means. In stroke, we treat and rehabilitate but there are some MSK, we treat and improve quality of life. Don't be arguing blind for this thread is not a secondary school debate where people beat around the bush for academic exercise. Rather argue with your books and keyboard by asking google.
You just contradicted urself dear. In that definition, a disease is a *condition* which results in the disorder of structure or function........ That condition is the UNDERLYING CAUSE that is being treated by the Doctor and his medical team. If that "condition" is not taken care of, u will just be wasting ur time except if you can identify and treat the underlying cause.
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Nobody: 2:20pm On May 25, 2018
stunning4real:
where I work Doctors don't do that here sir/ma
"Can't" and "don't" are two different words.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by dokyOloye: 2:30pm On May 25, 2018
stunning4real:
where I work Doctors don't do that here sir/ma
The question is "can they,do they have the capacity to"?
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Thanks18(m): 3:04pm On May 25, 2018
Bidexgarl:

You just contradicted urself dear. In that definition, a disease is a *condition* which results in the disorder of structure or function........ That condition is the UNDERLYING CAUSE that is being treated by the Doctor and his medical team. If that "condition" is not taken care of, u will just be wasting ur time except if you can identify and treat the underlying cause.

Dear, don't quote out of context when I was responding a jamboree that called himself a physician. A physiotherapist has a clinical expertise and autonomy to prevent, treat and rehabilitate an underlying cause and a disorder of structure or function using noninvasive techniques. Take time and read all my position in this thread. Also look into the WHO and Intl labour organization definition of Physiotherapist or Physical therapist.

WHO didn’t mince word saying that ‘Physiotherapists assess, plan and implement rehabilitative programs that improve or restore human motor functions, maximize movement ability, relieve pain syndromes, and TREAT or prevent physical challenges associated with injuries, diseases and other impairments. They apply a broad range of physical therapies and techniques such as movement, ultrasound, heating, laser and other techniques. They may develop and implement programmes for screening and prevention of common physical ailments and disorders. ILO in classifying their job stated that “Physiotherapists and related associate professionals TREAT disorders of bones, muscles and parts of the circulatory or the nervous system by manipulative methods, and ultrasound, heating, laser or similar techniques, or apply physiotherapy and related therapies as part of the treatment for the physically disabled, mentally ill or unbalanced.
As a physiotherapist, I prevent, treat and rehabilitate some conditions. But if you are threaten by my job roles, then you have a problem not me. Thanks
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Thanks18(m): 3:06pm On May 25, 2018
larrrymore:

sir.... no offence oo.. I think u need to go back to school

God bless you. That guy is a quota system Dr. He is a confused man. Dont mind him.I have ignored him because his problem is malignant.
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by boldest: 8:21pm On May 25, 2018
.
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Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by boldest: 8:25pm On May 25, 2018
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by boldest: 8:32pm On May 25, 2018
[quote author=Solababa91 post=67850015]..
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Cityguy: 10:12pm On May 25, 2018
fumebi:
Are doctors and other medical staffs in private hospitals having this problem? Are private hospitals on strike?
Let's the public hospitals be privatised.
Exactly! We don't have this kind of nonsense there because they all know their places and the doc is the BOSS! NMA is for doctors and the other co-workers have their individual associations but because of the fact that they do not match individually, the need to gang-up under the amorphous JOHESU to hold Nigerians to ransom arose. Government should simply outsource pharmacy and lab services and most of these problems will fizzle out. Alternatively, govt should just hands-off health. Privatise and let's see an investor that would keep the senior cadres of these allied professions who spend greater part of the day gossiping or aimlessly roaming the whole space in his or her employ.

2 Likes

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Cityguy: 10:23pm On May 25, 2018
mfm04622:


So you want to earn same amount with doctors? Do you think it is fair for you a lab technician that spent 3 years in school and a doctor that spent 6 to earn the same?
When it comes to administration of hospitals, yes doctors should not be head of hospitals. Doctors don't have any advantage over other professionals when it comes to managing hospitals.
Some studies have demonstrated hospitals ran by doctors to be better managed than those they didn't run. The clamour for headship by Johesu is born out of greed. They also want their hands in their imaginary 'cookie jar'. I can't even imagine that happening in Nigeria cos it will never happen. Their services are important and complimentary but that is what it is-ancilliary. The earlier that is realised, the better for the system. The shouts for government to give it to administrators is their plan B when it became obvious their dreams will not materialise. Like one of the women before King Solomon, their philosophy is 'if I can't have it, so should you also'.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Cityguy: 10:37pm On May 25, 2018
donald197:
Adopt YAHAYA AHMED report,or choose technocrats to go n see what obtains in UK,US ,AUSTRALIA and other developed countries. If both parties are not satisfied yet,privatize the health sector.
Yayale Ahmed's presidential committee did a thorough job and consulted widely, even as far as studying what obtains in developed parts of the world but as usual, it was not allowed to see the light of the day because some parties would not agree and it got sacrificed on the alter of politics cum corruption. How long should this briggande be allowed? It has become a cancer and needs being excised. The pay comparisons you have there will never be accepted even though it's what obtains in those 'sane climes' they tout so much.
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Cityguy: 10:49pm On May 25, 2018
stasius:
Privatization!

Privatization!!

Privatization!!!

Privatize the health sector! Simple...
Health will be very expensive and the poor may not afford it after this but sanity will be restored!
Privatize the health sector!!!
Yeah! It will be very expensive but with universal health insurance coverage, the burden will be lessened on patients and the system will function better.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Cityguy: 11:11pm On May 25, 2018
CircleOfWilis:
go get urs...

https://www.rcr.ac.uk/public-and-media/common-medical-terms/radiology-faqs
It can be annoying when people refuse to take to corrections. Half knowledge is really bad and that unfortunately is the bane of Johesuites.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by portable4real: 6:51am On May 26, 2018
@careerwoman..

I really appreciate how you manage your comment. I see you to be among the set of Doctors I do give kudos to.
There is no profession without flaws. No profession is left out.

In fact with the way people are trading words here, I shake head for Nigerian health institution. I doubt if some are really ready for mutual cooperation or respect as said.

Like you said we have bad and good ones in each professions. But the way some of your colleagues look down on other team in hospital makes it worst and give rooms for unnecessary hatred that I wonder if it was taught In school as well.

Sincerely I have so many of the Dr I appreciated also.
some situation do happened when I was a student then that made me wonder if it is the best or standard means of practice in medicine. later I see that it was arrogance.
Am a graduate Nurse. Yes am proud to be. my dream course right from childhood and also a microbiology graduate.

you will see instances where patient will be dying gradually on the ward, and the Nurses will be giving suggestion and the Drs will be ignoring it till thing get out of hands.

I still salute some of the Nurses that has saved some patients from this mess through their own intervention with the patient and relatives cooperation... is it that the Nurses doesn't have say despite the length of time spent with patient ?

Some consultant will have patient on the ward which the reg are managing are they won't even show up at all. If the Nurses observed a deterioration in condition and gives them several calls you won't see them. I doubt if they also sign to save life.

It was on this nairaland that a Dr said they should scrap degree in Nursing for selfish reason.
so that they will be using nurses as slaves and degree holders won't take such.
Is this how Medicine was years back? There is no profession that doesn't want to upgrade but your people doesn't want it.

there is a lot of loopholes in our health settings...

Enough of this proofing of stuffs here and let maturity reflects.
NIGERIA WILL BE BETTER ONE DAY....

3 Likes

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Hairyrapunzel: 6:59am On May 26, 2018
portable4real:
@careerwoman..

I really appreciate how you manage your comment. I see you to be among the set of Doctors I do give kudos to.
There is no profession without flaws. No profession is left out.

In fact with the way people are trading words here, I shake head for Nigerian health institution. I doubt if some are really ready for mutual cooperation or respect as said.

Like you said we have bad and good ones in each professions. But the way some of your colleagues look down on other team in hospital makes it worst and give rooms for unnecessary hatred that I wonder if it was taught In school as well.

Sincerely I have so many of the Dr I appreciated also.
some situation do happened when I was a student then that made me wonder if it is the best or standard means of practice in medicine. later I see that it was arrogance.
Am a graduate Nurse. Yes am proud to be. my dream course right from childhood and also a microbiology graduate.

you will see instances where patient will be dying gradually on the ward, and the Nurses will be giving suggestion and the Drs will be ignoring it till thing get out of hands.

I still salute some of the Nurses that has saved some patients from this mess through their own intervention with the patient and relatives cooperation... is it that the Nurses doesn't have say despite the length of time spent with patient ?

Some consultant will have patient on the ward which the reg are managing are they won't even show up at all. If the Nurses observed a deterioration in condition and gives them several calls you won't see them. I doubt if they also sign to save life.

It was on this nairaland that a Dr said they should scrap degree in Nursing for selfish reason.
so that they will be using nurses as slaves and degree holders won't take such.
Is this how Medicine was years back? There is no profession that doesn't want to upgrade but your people doesn't want it.

there is a lot of loopholes in our health settings...

Enough of this proofing of stuffs here and let maturity reflects.
NIGERIA WILL BE BETTER ONE DAY....
Is it not a nurses job to observe deterioration and progress and give feedback to the doctor? If she doesn't then what the hell is she doing in the ward?

1 Like 1 Share

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by portable4real: 7:39am On May 26, 2018
@hairyrapunzel
please and please you can just keep mute if can let peace reign.

Who said is not Nurses duty. So you could not pick any fault at the consultant they have feedback without showing up.

Please don't quote me again, am not here for all this childish play.

You are not the person I quoted. you can just read and pass.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Hairyrapunzel: 7:49am On May 26, 2018
portable4real:
@hairyrapunzel
please and please you can just keep mute if can let peace reign.

Who said is not Nurses duty. So you could not pick any fault at the consultant they have feedback without showing up.

Please don't quote me again, am not here for all this childish play.

You are not the person I quoted. you can just read and pass.
See anger. Is it not there nurses duty before? You can't paint things black every time. Never heard of or seen any consultant that never showed up for his/her patients before. Maybe you can't differentiate the consultant from the reg.

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by larrrymore(m): 1:42pm On May 26, 2018
portable4real:
@careerwoman..

I really appreciate how you manage your comment. I see you to be among the set of Doctors I do give kudos to.
There is no profession without flaws. No profession is left out.

In fact with the way people are trading words here, I shake head for Nigerian health institution. I doubt if some are really ready for mutual cooperation or respect as said.

Like you said we have bad and good ones in each professions. But the way some of your colleagues look down on other team in hospital makes it worst and give rooms for unnecessary hatred that I wonder if it was taught In school as well.

Sincerely I have so many of the Dr I appreciated also.
some situation do happened when I was a student then that made me wonder if it is the best or standard means of practice in medicine. later I see that it was arrogance.
Am a graduate Nurse. Yes am proud to be. my dream course right from childhood and also a microbiology graduate.

you will see instances where patient will be dying gradually on the ward, and the Nurses will be giving suggestion and the Drs will be ignoring it till thing get out of hands.

I still salute some of the Nurses that has saved some patients from this mess through their own intervention with the patient and relatives cooperation... is it that the Nurses doesn't have say despite the length of time spent with patient ?

Some consultant will have patient on the ward which the reg are managing are they won't even show up at all. If the Nurses observed a deterioration in condition and gives them several calls you won't see them. I doubt if they also sign to save life.

It was on this nairaland that a Dr said they should scrap degree in Nursing for selfish reason.
so that they will be using nurses as slaves and degree holders won't take such.
Is this how Medicine was years back? There is no profession that doesn't want to upgrade but your people doesn't want it.

there is a lot of loopholes in our health settings...

Enough of this proofing of stuffs here and let maturity reflects.
NIGERIA WILL BE BETTER ONE DAY....
it happen here..... a nurse give suggestions but the Dr ignore it.... later the patient die...... when the relative of the patient took it up.. the panel found out the Dr s guilty...to safe his job they transferred him to another hospital while the relative think they sack him
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by emekatheo: 1:52pm On May 26, 2018
On 25/May/2018 / In Press Publications
Association of Hospital and Administrative Pharmacists of Nigeria (AHAPN) Press Release
The attention of the Association of Hospital and Administrative Pharmacists of Nigeria (AHAPN) has been drawn to yet another rejoinder by the Nigerian Medical Association (NMA), to the current JOHESU led strike action as contained in her latest Press Release titled “RE: ONGOING STRIKE ACTION BY JOHESU AND ITS EXTENSION.” We are amazed at the despondency and sheer desperation with which the NMA has pursued this issue of adjusted salary for members of JOHESU, even when the government had earlier done same for her members.
At a time when Nigeria’s healthcare indices are at an all time low, and indeed one of the lowest in the world, at a time when the dreaded Ebola scourge is about resurfacing close to our borders, all a supposedly elitist group like the NMA has done is to bug the government of the day with unnecessary distractions, blackmails and empty threats about bringing down the government and shutting down the health sector if the government as much as adds one naira to the salaries of non medical doctors, even when the government has increased their salary twice in the not too distant past. How demeaning! How shameful! How belittling! We wish to observe that if the NMA had expended half as much energy in tacking Nigeria’s healthcare challenges, the country would have become a centre of medical tourism like the rest of the world.i. According to the NMA “In view of the above, the NMA painfully wishes to inform the Federal Government of Nigeria that any award to the non- medically qualified health professionals that violates the January and July agreements of 2014 shall result in the resumption of the suspended withdrawal of service of 2014. Please take this as a notice sir.”
ii. The NMA continued “The above reminder is predicated on the extension of the ongoing strike action embarked upon by the amorphous body called ‘JOHESU’ to states and local government areas, the basis of which is to strengthen its callous and ill motivated agitation for pay parity between her members and doctors with the resultant erosion of relativity and further hierarchical distortion in the health sector vis-à-vis her clandestine romance with some top government officials.” Oh, is the NMA afraid? What is she afraid of? Realizing that she no longer enjoys monopoly of strike action, the NMA has suddenly become jittery and desperate and like the proverbial drowning man that will clutch at anything to survive, has started casting aspersions at “some (imaginary) top government officials.”
iii. It is public knowledge that in 2009 when late President Musa Yar ‘adua was in office, NMA clamoured for salary increase for her members as usual, but met with a rebuff from the then president, who insisted that any increase in salary would cut across all professionals in the healthcare sector, and not only medical doctors. A committee was set up to work out the modalities for the increment which resulted in the Consolidated Health Salary Scale (CONHESS). This was approved by the then president and implemented in January 2010. Medical doctors and other healthcare workers were together on CONHESS then; and there was relative peace in the sector.
Iv. By 2014, when the CONHESS was due for review, the NMA as usual went behind to lobby the then president for their separate salary scale, and ended up with CONMESS which was far more robust than CONHESS. The CONMESS was quickly approved and doctors were paid their arrears promptly. Even though an adjustment in salary was calculated for non medical doctors, it was never implemented for them till date.
v. The medical doctors had their salary increased again between 2016 and 2017, under the guise of maintaining relativity. They (doctors) were initially opposed to skipping for CONHESS, for which they argued then that it was criminal to skip any level, but JOHESU went to the National Industrial Court and won the case. The doctors suddenly changed their song and started demanding for skipping for CONMESS, which was quickly approved by the Minister of Health (himself a medical doctor) and they were paid arrears pronto, whereas many health care workers on CONHESS have not been paid their skipping allowance since 2010. This is one of the reasons JOHESU is on strike today.
vi. The fact remains that medical doctors enter the CONMESS Scale at the equivalent of GL12, which is by far higher than other healthcare professionals who enter at GL 10. That in itself is relativity. At no point in time is JOHESU asking for same pay with medical doctors as the NMA and the Honourable Minister of Health would erroneously want the world to believe. All JOHESU is asking for is salary adjustment as was done for medical doctors. What erosion of relativity is NMA talking about when they are already advantaged at entry point?
i. On the issue of consultancy, hear the NMA “The demand for the appointment of other health workers as consultants (with payment of specialist allowance) is a self-centered agitation aimed at ensuring they are in charge of clinical care. This is not only an aberration (considering international best practice) that will add no value to clinical/patients care, it will certainly worsen morbidity and mortality indices in Nigeria. We therefore affirm the rejection of this demand.” Again we are tempted to ask what is the NMA afraid of? Is she acting out of ignorance of what consultants from other health professions are capable of in putting into health care or is it just a case of NMA refusing and rejecting change?
ii. Whether the NMA likes it or not, consultant pharmacists have come to stay. All over the world, including the United Kingdom, consultant pharmacists are collaborating with physicians and other professionals for optimal patient care; no wonder medical tourism is very high in those countries. That explains why even our own very President is compelled to patronize medical services in UK where the practice is close to ideal. In UK for instance, consultant renal care pharmacists work hand in hand with renal physicians and other professionals to optimize patient care, but in Nigeria, a medical officer with an MBBS or at best an internal medicine physician willclaim to know it all and prefer to consult alone so that their inadequacies will not be public knowledge. No wonder our health indices in Nigeria are competing with those of Somalia, Sudan and Togo (among the lowest in the world). We make bold to state that the NMA is not in a position to reject appointment of consultants from other health disciplines including pharmacists, because it will run counter to international best practice.
On the issue of headship of hospitals, hear the NMA “The demand for headship of Departments/Units in the hospital by members of JOHESU/AHPA will lead to unprecedented chaos in the health sector with ripple effect on the health of Nigerians. We reaffirm our rejection of this demand.” Again we state emphatically that nothing can be further from the truth. It would appear that the NMA is afraid of even its own shadow. It is common knowledge that when hospital administrators were managing hospitals before the coming of (Olikoye Ransone Kuti in 1985), there was peace, tranquility, serenity and convivial atmosphere in the hospitals. But as soon as medical doctors usurped the management of hospitals, chaos has become the order of the day. We state without equivocation that you do not need to have an MBBS or be a surgeon (FWACS) to successfully manage a hospital. You could argue about heading clinical services in a hospital, but certainly not the administration of the hospital.i. The NMA concluded by threatening the government in what has now become their hallmark “In conclusion, the Nigerian Medical Association wishes to once again remind government of the implications of acceding to any demand that violates the collective bargaining agreement of January 2014.”
ii. We wish to observe that government’s acquiescence to previous NMA demands over the years is one of the factors that emboldened the NMA to act in the way she has carried on so far. The NMA has been systematically milking Nigeria dry under the guise of collective bargaining, such that today in Nigeria, a medical house officer who just left medical school, is placed on CONMESS 1, the equivalent of CONHESS 12 (What a nurse earns after 15 years in service) while a Registrar earns same salary as an Assistant Director of Nursing Services (ADNS)!. A pharmacist who rose through the ranks to become director of pharmaceutical services, even with a Masters degree and after 35 years of service, earns about 500,000 thousand naira monthly, whereas a freshly qualified consultant (6 years post NYSC) earns over 600,000 thousand naira monthly, while older consultants earn one million naira and above monthly (there are close to ten thousand of them currently) thanks to NMA’s machinations. The irony or is it tragedy of all these is that these so called consultants see patients once a week, and a fixed number of patients at that. Other days of the week, patients are left at the mercy of house officers, medical officers and at best registrars. For how long will this treachery continue in the healthcare sector?
iii. This is the disparity that the NMA wants to maintain between their salary and those of other healthcare workers at all costs. This explains why they are so jittery and keep issuing threats to various ministers and indeed the presidency not to honour JOHESU’s demands, because of their narrow mindedness.
CONCLUSION
From the foregoing, it is very obvious that the NMA is not fighting a just cause, and as such, we demand that government should call her bluff and accede to JOHESU’s demands once and for all.NMA is threatening government with strike if government grants JOHESU’s demands; as the NMA must have observed by now; she no longer enjoys monopoly of strikes in the health sector. Any strike called by the NMA in future over salary of other health care workers will meet with further strikes by JOHESU members.We insist on our earlier call for a Unified Salary Scale for all healthcare workers, including consultants, with workers entering the scale based on their qualifications and years of service.We demand that appointment of minister of health should be rotated among the various health professionals (in line with international best practice) and should not be the exclusive preserve of medical doctors, who most of the time exhibit bias towards medical doctors at the detriment of other health care workers. This practice has unwittingly prolonged the strife in the health sector. A case in point is the World Health Organization (WHO), whose Director General is not a medical doctor, yet the world body continues to make giant strides.We insist on appointment of pharmacists and other duly qualified healthcare professionals as consultants and medical directors of federal tertiary institutions as a way out of the current quagmire.We believe it’s time to call a spade a spade. The federal government should summon the political will to call the bluff of the NMA, before she finally destroys the healthcare sector beyond repairs. As it stands now, the NMA has lost her respect and credibility among other health care professionals because of her pursuit of mediocrity and this has not augured well for service delivery in the sector.Where the government chooses to continue to treat the NMA with kid’s gloves, then Nigerians should be prepared for a long drawn out crisis in the health sector with terrible consequences for all. A stitch in time saves nine.
Please accept assurances of our esteemed regards.
Pharm. Martins Oyewole MAW Pharm. Jelili Kilani
National Chairman AHAPN National Secretary

3 Likes

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by lanxebony(m): 6:00pm On May 26, 2018
#THEY_RUINED_OUR_TEAM
NB: Long post

When we were admitted into the university, some of us were in Nursing Sciences, Optometry, Medical Laboratory Science, Medicine and Surgery, Physiotherapy, Dentistry, Pharmacy, Radiology etc.

We were subjected to general studies (GST,GSS).
We were taught by mathematicians, Education teachers, physicists and philosophers.

Since they knew little or nothing about the slight differences in our course of study, they addressed us by a general name: Medical and Health Sciences.

We made friends amongst one another.

" What's your department? " I'd asked.

" Nursing sciences. "

" Wow! I 'm in Medicine and Surgery. Meet my friend, she's in Pharmacy."

That way, we became bound by the cords of friendship, and we read at the Medical Laboratory Science block.
We had one common goal: to pass our exams.

We put our heads together in solving the past questions for that semester.

Bunmi my Pharmacist friend, was good at Mathematics.
Ekene the Nursing guy, was a wizard in Chemistry.
I loved Biology, and Ahmed my Optometry friend taught us Physics.

Together, we solved the past questions, taught and complimented each other.
Now towards our third Year in school, things started to go sour, and South. Bunmi would pass and just wave. Ekene barely would talk to me, and whenever Ahmed picked my calls, I 'd feel like I owed God a testimony.

Each of us had the key to our respective classes and we locked them against every other student that wasn't in our department. The center could no longer hold - things fell apart:

" They should have considered it a privilege to be associated with me."

" Oh, I didn't tell you? "

Towards our third year in school, we had new lecturers with entirely different mindsets , behaviors and speech. They were our seniors in the profession.
They'd availed themselves so we could be taught.

Pharmacists taught the Pharmacy students.
Doctors taught the student Doctors.
Scientists taught the student Scientists.
Matrons taught the student Nurses.

Every thing went fine, until we were introduced to a strange course; a course not found in the curriculum. But we learnt it. It was injected into us, and it went straight into our heads and our minds absorbed them.
They were injections of words.

We were told to uphold our disciplines with great esteem and never to accept any humiliation from anybody.

They told us that we were superior to other departments. Student laboratory scientists were told that without the laboratory, the hospital is handicapped. The Nursing students were told that they were indispensable. The student Doctors were told that they were general overseers. The Pharmacists assumed the appellation ; Bedrock of Medical Practice.

These may not be entirely false, but the next words injected in us triggered the hatred, ego rise and envy.
We were told of how other departments in the same medical field hated us; of the need to stand up and uphold the fight because other departments are jealous of ours and wants to humiliate us. We were told that medical doctors were arrogant and hence we'd give them no room for such display. We were told that nurses were insulting, hence, all relationships with them should be kept at a highly official level and with great consciousness of our ego; that the medical laboratory scientists were poke - nosing into our territory, so we must annihilate them as possibly as we can.
We were taught to esteem our ego and defend our profession against our 'foes' in the same field.

No wonder we now feel insecure amongst ourselves - the injection really worked.

Sadly, as I bleed in my heart writing this, I recalled our first years, when our minds were like virgins. We were together and we all had one mind and one goal - The Exam.

Now we are faced with a bigger goal - The patient.

But, we aren't together.

So,

How can we Pass?

They've ruined our team.

Written by Isaiah Ugochukwu Obialor (Student Medlab Scientist)
Reviewed by

1 Like

Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Hairyrapunzel: 8:37pm On May 26, 2018
emekatheo:
On 25/May/2018 / In Press Publications
Association of Hospital and Administrative Pharmacists of Nigeria (AHAPN) Press Release
The attention of the Association of Hospital and Administrative Pharmacists of Nigeria (AHAPN) has been drawn to yet another rejoinder by the Nigerian Medical Association (NMA), to the current JOHESU led strike action as contained in her latest Press Release titled “RE: ONGOING STRIKE ACTION BY JOHESU AND ITS EXTENSION.” We are amazed at the despondency and sheer desperation with which the NMA has pursued this issue of adjusted salary for members of JOHESU, even when the government had earlier done same for her members.
At a time when Nigeria’s healthcare indices are at an all time low, and indeed one of the lowest in the world, at a time when the dreaded Ebola scourge is about resurfacing close to our borders, all a supposedly elitist group like the NMA has done is to bug the government of the day with unnecessary distractions, blackmails and empty threats about bringing down the government and shutting down the health sector if the government as much as adds one naira to the salaries of non medical doctors, even when the government has increased their salary twice in the not too distant past. How demeaning! How shameful! How belittling! We wish to observe that if the NMA had expended half as much energy in tacking Nigeria’s healthcare challenges, the country would have become a centre of medical tourism like the rest of the world.i. According to the NMA “In view of the above, the NMA painfully wishes to inform the Federal Government of Nigeria that any award to the non- medically qualified health professionals that violates the January and July agreements of 2014 shall result in the resumption of the suspended withdrawal of service of 2014. Please take this as a notice sir.”
ii. The NMA continued “The above reminder is predicated on the extension of the ongoing strike action embarked upon by the amorphous body called ‘JOHESU’ to states and local government areas, the basis of which is to strengthen its callous and ill motivated agitation for pay parity between her members and doctors with the resultant erosion of relativity and further hierarchical distortion in the health sector vis-à-vis her clandestine romance with some top government officials.” Oh, is the NMA afraid? What is she afraid of? Realizing that she no longer enjoys monopoly of strike action, the NMA has suddenly become jittery and desperate and like the proverbial drowning man that will clutch at anything to survive, has started casting aspersions at “some (imaginary) top government officials.”
iii. It is public knowledge that in 2009 when late President Musa Yar ‘adua was in office, NMA clamoured for salary increase for her members as usual, but met with a rebuff from the then president, who insisted that any increase in salary would cut across all professionals in the healthcare sector, and not only medical doctors. A committee was set up to work out the modalities for the increment which resulted in the Consolidated Health Salary Scale (CONHESS). This was approved by the then president and implemented in January 2010. Medical doctors and other healthcare workers were together on CONHESS then; and there was relative peace in the sector.
Iv. By 2014, when the CONHESS was due for review, the NMA as usual went behind to lobby the then president for their separate salary scale, and ended up with CONMESS which was far more robust than CONHESS. The CONMESS was quickly approved and doctors were paid their arrears promptly. Even though an adjustment in salary was calculated for non medical doctors, it was never implemented for them till date.
v. The medical doctors had their salary increased again between 2016 and 2017, under the guise of maintaining relativity. They (doctors) were initially opposed to skipping for CONHESS, for which they argued then that it was criminal to skip any level, but JOHESU went to the National Industrial Court and won the case. The doctors suddenly changed their song and started demanding for skipping for CONMESS, which was quickly approved by the Minister of Health (himself a medical doctor) and they were paid arrears pronto, whereas many health care workers on CONHESS have not been paid their skipping allowance since 2010. This is one of the reasons JOHESU is on strike today.
vi. The fact remains that medical doctors enter the CONMESS Scale at the equivalent of GL12, which is by far higher than other healthcare professionals who enter at GL 10. That in itself is relativity. At no point in time is JOHESU asking for same pay with medical doctors as the NMA and the Honourable Minister of Health would erroneously want the world to believe. All JOHESU is asking for is salary adjustment as was done for medical doctors. What erosion of relativity is NMA talking about when they are already advantaged at entry point?
i. On the issue of consultancy, hear the NMA “The demand for the appointment of other health workers as consultants (with payment of specialist allowance) is a self-centered agitation aimed at ensuring they are in charge of clinical care. This is not only an aberration (considering international best practice) that will add no value to clinical/patients care, it will certainly worsen morbidity and mortality indices in Nigeria. We therefore affirm the rejection of this demand.” Again we are tempted to ask what is the NMA afraid of? Is she acting out of ignorance of what consultants from other health professions are capable of in putting into health care or is it just a case of NMA refusing and rejecting change?
ii. Whether the NMA likes it or not, consultant pharmacists have come to stay. All over the world, including the United Kingdom, consultant pharmacists are collaborating with physicians and other professionals for optimal patient care; no wonder medical tourism is very high in those countries. That explains why even our own very President is compelled to patronize medical services in UK where the practice is close to ideal. In UK for instance, consultant renal care pharmacists work hand in hand with renal physicians and other professionals to optimize patient care, but in Nigeria, a medical officer with an MBBS or at best an internal medicine physician willclaim to know it all and prefer to consult alone so that their inadequacies will not be public knowledge. No wonder our health indices in Nigeria are competing with those of Somalia, Sudan and Togo (among the lowest in the world). We make bold to state that the NMA is not in a position to reject appointment of consultants from other health disciplines including pharmacists, because it will run counter to international best practice.
On the issue of headship of hospitals, hear the NMA “The demand for headship of Departments/Units in the hospital by members of JOHESU/AHPA will lead to unprecedented chaos in the health sector with ripple effect on the health of Nigerians. We reaffirm our rejection of this demand.” Again we state emphatically that nothing can be further from the truth. It would appear that the NMA is afraid of even its own shadow. It is common knowledge that when hospital administrators were managing hospitals before the coming of (Olikoye Ransone Kuti in 1985), there was peace, tranquility, serenity and convivial atmosphere in the hospitals. But as soon as medical doctors usurped the management of hospitals, chaos has become the order of the day. We state without equivocation that you do not need to have an MBBS or be a surgeon (FWACS) to successfully manage a hospital. You could argue about heading clinical services in a hospital, but certainly not the administration of the hospital.i. The NMA concluded by threatening the government in what has now become their hallmark “In conclusion, the Nigerian Medical Association wishes to once again remind government of the implications of acceding to any demand that violates the collective bargaining agreement of January 2014.”
ii. We wish to observe that government’s acquiescence to previous NMA demands over the years is one of the factors that emboldened the NMA to act in the way she has carried on so far. The NMA has been systematically milking Nigeria dry under the guise of collective bargaining, such that today in Nigeria, a medical house officer who just left medical school, is placed on CONMESS 1, the equivalent of CONHESS 12 (What a nurse earns after 15 years in service) while a Registrar earns same salary as an Assistant Director of Nursing Services (ADNS)!. A pharmacist who rose through the ranks to become director of pharmaceutical services, even with a Masters degree and after 35 years of service, earns about 500,000 thousand naira monthly, whereas a freshly qualified consultant (6 years post NYSC) earns over 600,000 thousand naira monthly, while older consultants earn one million naira and above monthly (there are close to ten thousand of them currently) thanks to NMA’s machinations. The irony or is it tragedy of all these is that these so called consultants see patients once a week, and a fixed number of patients at that. Other days of the week, patients are left at the mercy of house officers, medical officers and at best registrars. For how long will this treachery continue in the healthcare sector?
iii. This is the disparity that the NMA wants to maintain between their salary and those of other healthcare workers at all costs. This explains why they are so jittery and keep issuing threats to various ministers and indeed the presidency not to honour JOHESU’s demands, because of their narrow mindedness.
CONCLUSION
From the foregoing, it is very obvious that the NMA is not fighting a just cause, and as such, we demand that government should call her bluff and accede to JOHESU’s demands once and for all.NMA is threatening government with strike if government grants JOHESU’s demands; as the NMA must have observed by now; she no longer enjoys monopoly of strikes in the health sector. Any strike called by the NMA in future over salary of other health care workers will meet with further strikes by JOHESU members.We insist on our earlier call for a Unified Salary Scale for all healthcare workers, including consultants, with workers entering the scale based on their qualifications and years of service.We demand that appointment of minister of health should be rotated among the various health professionals (in line with international best practice) and should not be the exclusive preserve of medical doctors, who most of the time exhibit bias towards medical doctors at the detriment of other health care workers. This practice has unwittingly prolonged the strife in the health sector. A case in point is the World Health Organization (WHO), whose Director General is not a medical doctor, yet the world body continues to make giant strides.We insist on appointment of pharmacists and other duly qualified healthcare professionals as consultants and medical directors of federal tertiary institutions as a way out of the current quagmire.We believe it’s time to call a spade a spade. The federal government should summon the political will to call the bluff of the NMA, before she finally destroys the healthcare sector beyond repairs. As it stands now, the NMA has lost her respect and credibility among other health care professionals because of her pursuit of mediocrity and this has not augured well for service delivery in the sector.Where the government chooses to continue to treat the NMA with kid’s gloves, then Nigerians should be prepared for a long drawn out crisis in the health sector with terrible consequences for all. A stitch in time saves nine.
Please accept assurances of our esteemed regards.
Pharm. Martins Oyewole MAW Pharm. Jelili Kilani
National Chairman AHAPN National Secretary

Just say it's you want your basic salary to be the same with the doctors own (you want relativity removed) you talk about international best practices yet you don't want the pay ascribed to international best practices.
Funny lot.
Re: Drop A Suggestion On How To Solve The NMA Vs Johesu Issue? by Hairyrapunzel: 8:50pm On May 26, 2018
emekatheo:
On 25/May/2018 / In Press Publications
Association of Hospital and Administrative Pharmacists of Nigeria (AHAPN) Press Release
The attention of the Association of Hospital and Administrative Pharmacists of Nigeria (AHAPN) has been drawn to yet another rejoinder by the Nigerian Medical Association (NMA), to the current JOHESU led strike action as contained in her latest Press Release titled “RE: ONGOING STRIKE ACTION BY JOHESU AND ITS EXTENSION.” We are amazed at the despondency and sheer desperation with which the NMA has pursued this issue of adjusted salary for members of JOHESU, even when the government had earlier done same for her members.
At a time when Nigeria’s healthcare indices are at an all time low, and indeed one of the lowest in the world, at a time when the dreaded Ebola scourge is about resurfacing close to our borders, all a supposedly elitist group like the NMA has done is to bug the government of the day with unnecessary distractions, blackmails and empty threats about bringing down the government and shutting down the health sector if the government as much as adds one naira to the salaries of non medical doctors, even when the government has increased their salary twice in the not too distant past. How demeaning! How shameful! How belittling! We wish to observe that if the NMA had expended half as much energy in tacking Nigeria’s healthcare challenges, the country would have become a centre of medical tourism like the rest of the world.i. According to the NMA “In view of the above, the NMA painfully wishes to inform the Federal Government of Nigeria that any award to the non- medically qualified health professionals that violates the January and July agreements of 2014 shall result in the resumption of the suspended withdrawal of service of 2014. Please take this as a notice sir.”
ii. The NMA continued “The above reminder is predicated on the extension of the ongoing strike action embarked upon by the amorphous body called ‘JOHESU’ to states and local government areas, the basis of which is to strengthen its callous and ill motivated agitation for pay parity between her members and doctors with the resultant erosion of relativity and further hierarchical distortion in the health sector vis-à-vis her clandestine romance with some top government officials.” Oh, is the NMA afraid? What is she afraid of? Realizing that she no longer enjoys monopoly of strike action, the NMA has suddenly become jittery and desperate and like the proverbial drowning man that will clutch at anything to survive, has started casting aspersions at “some (imaginary) top government officials.”
iii. It is public knowledge that in 2009 when late President Musa Yar ‘adua was in office, NMA clamoured for salary increase for her members as usual, but met with a rebuff from the then president, who insisted that any increase in salary would cut across all professionals in the healthcare sector, and not only medical doctors. A committee was set up to work out the modalities for the increment which resulted in the Consolidated Health Salary Scale (CONHESS). This was approved by the then president and implemented in January 2010. Medical doctors and other healthcare workers were together on CONHESS then; and there was relative peace in the sector.
Iv. By 2014, when the CONHESS was due for review, the NMA as usual went behind to lobby the then president for their separate salary scale, and ended up with CONMESS which was far more robust than CONHESS. The CONMESS was quickly approved and doctors were paid their arrears promptly. Even though an adjustment in salary was calculated for non medical doctors, it was never implemented for them till date.
v. The medical doctors had their salary increased again between 2016 and 2017, under the guise of maintaining relativity. They (doctors) were initially opposed to skipping for CONHESS, for which they argued then that it was criminal to skip any level, but JOHESU went to the National Industrial Court and won the case. The doctors suddenly changed their song and started demanding for skipping for CONMESS, which was quickly approved by the Minister of Health (himself a medical doctor) and they were paid arrears pronto, whereas many health care workers on CONHESS have not been paid their skipping allowance since 2010. This is one of the reasons JOHESU is on strike today.
vi. The fact remains that medical doctors enter the CONMESS Scale at the equivalent of GL12, which is by far higher than other healthcare professionals who enter at GL 10. That in itself is relativity. At no point in time is JOHESU asking for same pay with medical doctors as the NMA and the Honourable Minister of Health would erroneously want the world to believe. All JOHESU is asking for is salary adjustment as was done for medical doctors. What erosion of relativity is NMA talking about when they are already advantaged at entry point?
i. On the issue of consultancy, hear the NMA “The demand for the appointment of other health workers as consultants (with payment of specialist allowance) is a self-centered agitation aimed at ensuring they are in charge of clinical care. This is not only an aberration (considering international best practice) that will add no value to clinical/patients care, it will certainly worsen morbidity and mortality indices in Nigeria. We therefore affirm the rejection of this demand.” Again we are tempted to ask what is the NMA afraid of? Is she acting out of ignorance of what consultants from other health professions are capable of in putting into health care or is it just a case of NMA refusing and rejecting change?
ii. Whether the NMA likes it or not, consultant pharmacists have come to stay. All over the world, including the United Kingdom, consultant pharmacists are collaborating with physicians and other professionals for optimal patient care; no wonder medical tourism is very high in those countries. That explains why even our own very President is compelled to patronize medical services in UK where the practice is close to ideal. In UK for instance, consultant renal care pharmacists work hand in hand with renal physicians and other professionals to optimize patient care, but in Nigeria, a medical officer with an MBBS or at best an internal medicine physician willclaim to know it all and prefer to consult alone so that their inadequacies will not be public knowledge. No wonder our health indices in Nigeria are competing with those of Somalia, Sudan and Togo (among the lowest in the world). We make bold to state that the NMA is not in a position to reject appointment of consultants from other health disciplines including pharmacists, because it will run counter to international best practice.
On the issue of headship of hospitals, hear the NMA “The demand for headship of Departments/Units in the hospital by members of JOHESU/AHPA will lead to unprecedented chaos in the health sector with ripple effect on the health of Nigerians. We reaffirm our rejection of this demand.” Again we state emphatically that nothing can be further from the truth. It would appear that the NMA is afraid of even its own shadow. It is common knowledge that when hospital administrators were managing hospitals before the coming of (Olikoye Ransone Kuti in 1985), there was peace, tranquility, serenity and convivial atmosphere in the hospitals. But as soon as medical doctors usurped the management of hospitals, chaos has become the order of the day. We state without equivocation that you do not need to have an MBBS or be a surgeon (FWACS) to successfully manage a hospital. You could argue about heading clinical services in a hospital, but certainly not the administration of the hospital.i. The NMA concluded by threatening the government in what has now become their hallmark “In conclusion, the Nigerian Medical Association wishes to once again remind government of the implications of acceding to any demand that violates the collective bargaining agreement of January 2014.”
ii. We wish to observe that government’s acquiescence to previous NMA demands over the years is one of the factors that emboldened the NMA to act in the way she has carried on so far. The NMA has been systematically milking Nigeria dry under the guise of collective bargaining, such that today in Nigeria, a medical house officer who just left medical school, is placed on CONMESS 1, the equivalent of CONHESS 12 (What a nurse earns after 15 years in service) while a Registrar earns same salary as an Assistant Director of Nursing Services (ADNS)!. A pharmacist who rose through the ranks to become director of pharmaceutical services, even with a Masters degree and after 35 years of service, earns about 500,000 thousand naira monthly, whereas a freshly qualified consultant (6 years post NYSC) earns over 600,000 thousand naira monthly, while older consultants earn one million naira and above monthly (there are close to ten thousand of them currently) thanks to NMA’s machinations. The irony or is it tragedy of all these is that these so called consultants see patients once a week, and a fixed number of patients at that. Other days of the week, patients are left at the mercy of house officers, medical officers and at best registrars. For how long will this treachery continue in the healthcare sector?
iii. This is the disparity that the NMA wants to maintain between their salary and those of other healthcare workers at all costs. This explains why they are so jittery and keep issuing threats to various ministers and indeed the presidency not to honour JOHESU’s demands, because of their narrow mindedness.
CONCLUSION
From the foregoing, it is very obvious that the NMA is not fighting a just cause, and as such, we demand that government should call her bluff and accede to JOHESU’s demands once and for all.NMA is threatening government with strike if government grants JOHESU’s demands; as the NMA must have observed by now; she no longer enjoys monopoly of strikes in the health sector. Any strike called by the NMA in future over salary of other health care workers will meet with further strikes by JOHESU members.We insist on our earlier call for a Unified Salary Scale for all healthcare workers, including consultants, with workers entering the scale based on their qualifications and years of service.We demand that appointment of minister of health should be rotated among the various health professionals (in line with international best practice) and should not be the exclusive preserve of medical doctors, who most of the time exhibit bias towards medical doctors at the detriment of other health care workers. This practice has unwittingly prolonged the strife in the health sector. A case in point is the World Health Organization (WHO), whose Director General is not a medical doctor, yet the world body continues to make giant strides.We insist on appointment of pharmacists and other duly qualified healthcare professionals as consultants and medical directors of federal tertiary institutions as a way out of the current quagmire.We believe it’s time to call a spade a spade. The federal government should summon the political will to call the bluff of the NMA, before she finally destroys the healthcare sector beyond repairs. As it stands now, the NMA has lost her respect and credibility among other health care professionals because of her pursuit of mediocrity and this has not augured well for service delivery in the sector.Where the government chooses to continue to treat the NMA with kid’s gloves, then Nigerians should be prepared for a long drawn out crisis in the health sector with terrible consequences for all. A stitch in time saves nine.
Please accept assurances of our esteemed regards.
Pharm. Martins Oyewole MAW Pharm. Jelili Kilani
National Chairman AHAPN National Secretary

Lies lies lies.
Didn't they skip johesu in 2015? The increased their pay and paid their arrears.
The doctors got skipping in 2017 arrears where never paid and their pay increased the way they increased johesu' own although their arrears where never paid.




There is relativity in the health sector and this is what your people want removed. Stop spreading lies.
Johesu even goes ahead to compare their basic salary to the gross earning of a professor in medicine.

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