mikeolu1:


Wonderful use of English Language. Good job

TRUE Christianity isn't about the efficacious use of language or educational background, it's about the TRUTH in anyway you're able to pass the message across. The Greek language is what the first century Christians used in writing the gospels and it wasn't in it's grammatical form but it's PIGIN so that everyone could read and EASILY grasp what they're trying to say! That's why Jesus said JEHOVAH has hidden the sacred secrets of God's kingdom away from the educated ones but have revealed it to the unletted Matthew 11:25 compared to Act 4:13

TATIME:
TRUE Christianity isn't about the efficacious use of language or educational background, it's about the TRUTH in anyway you're able to pass the message across. The Greek language is what the first century Christians used in writing the gospels and it wasn't in it's grammatical form but it's PIGIN so that everyone could read and EASILY grasp what they're trying to say! That's why Jesus said JEHOVAH has hidden the sacred secrets of God's kingdom away from the educated ones but have revealed it to the unletted Matthew 11:25 compared to Act 4:13

TATIME the pidgin master........

(b) Which NEW TRUTH Jehovah help Peter understand? Watchtower August 2018 second study article. Question to paragraph 3,4.

Was Jehovah being impartial a "NEW TRUTH"? That is how the organization twist the mind of it's adherents despite still using the pidgin.

Jehovah's impartiality started from the start of his dealings with mankind, Obviously Peter was the one struggling to accept it(Acts 10:9-16, 34,35) Peter walked with JESUS and see firsthand how Jesus treated those around him including the GENTILES that seek his ATTENTION, Oga no be "NEW TRUTH". Do you notice Paul said "Now I truly understand in Acts 10: 34,35. The truth was there all along na Peter no gree accept. Even after accepting the so called "NEW TRUTH" he still struggled (Gal 2:11-14)

Do you always note the use of this set of words ......"IF E BE SAY" as printed in those pidgin articles? These are statement bordering on guess work, uncertainties yet those responding to such, talk as if they are true or certainties. Even with the PIDGIN, adherents don't understand what they read most of them still struggle with the language. Na manage dem dey manage, obviously when the elders imposed it on them what can they do?

All of this is to show that no language is really the "language of the mind" we all embrace each and everyone of it. That "language of the mind mentality" oga na bojuboju things.

If the letters of Paul were written in GREEK PIGDIN as you posit in your POST, why did Peter say this in 2 Peter 3:15,16?

achorladey:


TATIME the pidgin master........

(b) Which NEW TRUTH Jehovah help Peter understand? Watchtower August 2018 second study article. Question to paragraph 3,4.

Was Jehovah being impartial a "NEW TRUTH"? That is how the organization twist the mind of it's adherents despite still using the pidgin.

Jehovah's impartiality started from the start of his dealings with mankind, Obviously Peter was the one struggling to accept it(Acts 10:9-16, 34,35) Peter walked with JESUS and see firsthand how Jesus treated those around him including the GENTILES that seek his ATTENTION, Oga no be "NEW TRUTH". Do you notice Paul said "Now I truly understand in Acts 10: 34,35. The truth was there all along na Peter no gree accept. Even after accepting the so called "NEW TRUTH" he still struggled (Gal 2:11-14)

Do you always note the use of this set of words ......"IF E BE SAY" as printed in those pidgin articles? These are statement bordering on guess work, uncertainties yet those responding to such, talk as if they are true or certainties. Even with the PIDGIN, adherents don't understand what they read most of them still struggle with the language. Na manage dem dey manage, obviously when the elders imposed it on them what can they do?

All of this is to show that no language is really the "language of the mind" we all embrace each and everyone of it. That "language of the mind mentality" oga na bojuboju things.

If the letters of Paul were written in GREEK PIGDIN as you posit in your POST, why did Peter say this in 2 Peter 3:15,16?

Instead of arguing all the time, why not first make a thorough research to ascertain what type of Greek language that was used to pen down the Christian Greek Scriptures? Is it the one that's for elites or the common that everyone speaks? In Nigeria we're fond of grammar but most Nigerians could easily grasp the PIDGIN, that's exactly what happened during the time that first century Christians were writing the gospels they used the expression that's common so that shepherds,fishermen,craftmen and others could EASILY understood! Peter wasn't an elite that's why Lord Jesus made use of Paul who was well educated as a missionary in order to canvas with both elites and uneducated EASILY!

rottennaija:


I don't need to ask, because the Bible is its own best interpreter, besides, I don't need the pastor to interpret the Bible for me (I know you depend on your Org and governing body to do so for you) for I am no follower of men.

The little flock were Jesus follower from the nation of Israel.
The other sheep were the gentiles.


There is no scripture that link the other sheep of John 10:16 to the great crowd of Re 7:9-17; 19:1, which by scriptural description is also on heaven.

Since you are a follower of men, the day the Org and its governing body changes it to what the Bible teaches, in the name of new light, you will have no problem accepting it for you are your likes are like a ship in the water that is "tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of people in their deceitful scheming". (eph 4:14)

Meeeting workbook October 2018 week 1-7 What was the Festival of dedication? Study note on John 10:22 had this concluding words.......


Christ’s followers were not commanded to observe the Festival of Dedication. (Col 2:16, 17) However, there is no record that Jesus or his disciples CONDEMNED the CELEBRATING of this festival.

So why were they censoring all things FESTIVAL and CELEBRATIONS their adherents do? Do they really believe Colossians 2:16,17 or na LIP SERVICE? Do they JUDGE there adherents on this?

DOUBLE SPEAKING AT IT'S BEST.

TATIME:
Instead of arguing all the time, why not first make a thorough research to ascertain what type of Greek language that was used to pen down the Christian Greek Scriptures? Is it the one that's for elites or the common that everyone speaks? In Nigeria we're fond of grammar but most Nigerians could easily grasp the PIDGIN, that's exactly what happened during the time that first century Christians were writing the gospels they used the expression that's common so that shepherds,fishermen,craftmen and others could EASILY understood! Peter wasn't an elite that's why Lord Jesus made use of Paul who was well educated as a missionary in order to canvas with both elites and uneducated EASILY!

I know you will deflect as usual, PETER wasn't an ELITE. Hahahahahahahahaha! Peter need not be an ELITE to understand the SCRIPTURE as stated by the the master JESUS himself.

Now you contradicting yourself by stating Paul was sent to the ELITE, meaning some of what he wrote must have contained BIG GREEK GRAMMAR wey dey burst people thinking and brain.

Oga in the making of many books/RESEARCH that leads to book production there is no end ecclesiastical 12:12 its tiring to the flesh. Whatever is needed to fear God and keep his commandment as captured in ecclesiastics 12:13 is not only understood in PIGDIN and no extensive research is REQUIRED.


If PETER was taught "NEW TRUTH" what was the "OLD TRUTH"?

achorladey:


Meeeting workbook October 2018 week 1-7 What was the Festival of dedication? Study note on John 10:22 had this concluding words.......


Christ’s followers were not commanded to observe the Festival of Dedication. (Col 2:16, 17) However, there is no record that Jesus or his disciples CONDEMNED the CELEBRATING of this festival.

So why were they censoring all things FESTIVAL and CELEBRATIONS their adherents do? Do they really believe Colossians 2:16,17 or na LIP SERVICE? Do they JUDGE there adherents on this?

DOUBLE SPEAKING AT IT'S BEST.

What the organization is doing is slowly loosening their grip of many things, policies, celebrations, treatments of people... But they have to be very careful on how they do so so that it will not cause problem for the organization.

Already, we have seen it on blood, they basically allow blood transfusion but whole blood, they even adopt a don't ask, don't tell policy when patients are treated, elders are not expected to go around asking if the patient took blood or not as was done previously.

They have loosen their grip on heavenly sealing, it's a matter of time, probably decades that they will hands off birthdays and Christmas etc.

rottennaija:


What the organization is doing is slowly loosening their grip of many things, policies, celebrations, treatments of people... But they have to be very careful on how they do so so that it will not cause problem for the organization.

Already, we have seen it on blood, they basically allow blood transfusion but whole blood, they even adopt a don't ask, don't tell policy when patients are treated, elders are not expected to go around asking if the patient took blood or not as was done previously.

They have loosen their grip on heavenly sealing, it's a matter of time, probably decades that they will hands off birthdays and Christmas etc.

Meeting people one on one and face to face matters MOST according to Jesus, perhaps to teach others by examples so that whoever wants to learn can do so by watching the practical applications of what we're saying as you're doing it. The social media could only help with hints on our message but the real teaching must be practical!
Jehovah's Witnesses are on the streets in their neighborhood zealously preaching and teaching their neighbors about God's Kingdom. So if anyone has a complaint to lunch against the organization, let him/her meet people face to face and teach by examples so that what you feel others are missing could be presented in practical form. Satan is the father of all those hiding their faces to say malicious things against others in disguise because Satan is a liar and so nobody can learn anything from a person who is saying something but doing another thing.
Please my friends,let people learn from your examples by meeting them face to face. Granted you're raising accusations against a globally recognized organization and that's noteworthy but it's unwise when nobody know the ACCUSERS by face at least to see how things should be done appropriately! Revelations 12:10

achorladey:


I know you will deflect as usual, PETER wasn't an ELITE. Hahahahahahahahaha! Peter need not be an ELITE to understand the SCRIPTURE as stated by the the master JESUS himself.

Now you contradicting yourself by stating Paul was sent to the ELITE, meaning some of what he wrote must have contained BIG GREEK GRAMMAR wey dey burst people thinking and brain.

Oga in the making of many books/RESEARCH that leads to book production there is no end ecclesiastical 12:12 its tiring to the flesh. Whatever is needed to fear God and keep his commandment as captured in ecclesiastics 12:13 is not only understood in PIGDIN and no extensive research is REQUIRED.


If PETER was taught "NEW TRUTH" what was the "OLD TRUTH"?

You just want to argue but that's not the purpose of our ministry, we're to reach hearts with the message of God's kingdom. Paul wrote letters to Christians NOT those arrogant elites deluded with egotism so all His letters were written in pidgin Greek. But if he is to meet people one on one to present the good news, of course he should be well educated so that those elites who are thinking that the group belongs only to illiterates could meet an elite like themselves turned Christian and be moved to act. Act 26:28 Jesus chose Paul for that purpose but still he must remain under the supervision and direction of the GOVERNING BODY(12 Apostles) in Jerusalem. Act 2:42 compared with Act 15:22,17:10,

TATIME:
Meeting people one on one and face to face matters MOST according to Jesus, perhaps to teach others by examples so that whoever wants to learn can do so by watching the practical applications of what we're saying as you're doing it. The social media could only help with hints on our message but the real teaching must be practical!
Jehovah's Witnesses are on the streets in their neighborhood zealously preaching and teaching their neighbors about God's Kingdom. So if anyone has a complaint to lunch against the organization, let him/her meet people face to face and teach by examples so that what you feel others are missing could be presented in practical form. Satan is the father of all those hiding their faces to say malicious things against others in disguise because Satan is a liar and so nobody can learn anything from a person who is saying something but doing another thing.
Please my friends,let people learn from your examples by meeting them face to face. Granted you're raising accusations against a globally recognized organization and that's noteworthy but it's unwise when nobody know the ACCUSERS by face at least to see how things should be done appropriately! Revelations 12:10

The organization knows their accuser by face, some go to bethel headquarters, other write letter, other send videos, other do survey and send the report to them.

They know them.

TATIME:
You just want to argue but that's not the purpose of our ministry, we're to reach hearts with the message of God's kingdom. Paul wrote letters to Christians NOT those arrogant elites deluded with egotism so all His letters were written in pidgin Greek. But if he is to meet people one on one to present the good news, of course he should be well educated so that those elites who are thinking that the group belongs only to illiterates could meet an elite like themselves turned Christian and be moved to act. Act 26:28 Jesus chose Paul for that purpose but still he must remain under the supervision and direction of the GOVERNING BODY(12 Apostles) in Jerusalem. Act 2:42 compared with Act 15:22,17:10,

I honestly don't understand how you arrive at this, but I know where you got it from, which is the organization. But what you just wrote, the bolded, is far from being true, absolutely false.

rottennaija:


The organization knows their accuser by face, some go to bethel headquarters, other write letter, other send videos, other do survey and send the report to them.

They know them.

Of course Jesus and His disciples knew their ACCUSERS by face (John 8:44) But it's the people who knew Jesus and His disciples that doesn't know the REAL accusers. Because the accusers were hiding their faces from the people as in from the public! Mark 11:32 Whoever has anything against us always display their anger when we knock on their doors but on the contrary such people can't go out preaching and teaching in their neighborhood the way we're doing confidently! So "ala ti aja ba la inu aja naa nio jera si" Nicodemus was a member of the Jewish high court but because he knew Jesus' accusers he remained a SECRET disciple. Whereas the ordinary people only see the Roman soldiers maltreating Jesus but are ignorant of His REAL accusers. So go out and start preaching and teaching people because we're doing our own works PUBLICLY and people out there know our faces for sure!

TATIME:
You just want to argue but that's not the purpose of our ministry, we're to reach hearts with the message of God's kingdom. Paul wrote letters to Christians NOT those arrogant elites deluded with egotism so all His letters were written in pidgin Greek. But if he is to meet people one on one to present the good news, of course he should be well educated so that those elites who are thinking that the group belongs only to illiterates could meet an elite like themselves turned Christian and be moved to act. Act 26:28 Jesus chose Paul for that purpose but still he must remain under the supervision and direction of the GOVERNING BODY(12 Apostles) in Jerusalem. Act 2:42 compared with Act 15:22,17:10,

You want to force GOVERNING BODY into Acts 2:42, Acts 15:22, Acts 17:10. You will have to rewrite the NWT at the rate you are going.

TATIME:
Of course Jesus and His disciples knew their ACCUSERS by face (John 8:44) But it's the people who knew Jesus and His disciples that doesn't know the REAL accusers. Because the accusers were hiding their faces from the people as in from the public! Mark 11:32 Whoever has anything against us always display their anger when we knock on their doors but on the contrary such people can't go out preaching and teaching in their neighborhood the way we're doing confidently! So "ala ti aja ba la inu aja naa nio jera si" Nicodemus was a member of the Jewish high court but because he knew Jesus' accusers he remained a SECRET disciple. Whereas the ordinary people only see the Roman soldiers maltreating Jesus but are ignorant of His REAL accusers. So go out and start preaching and teaching people because we're doing our own works PUBLICLY and people out there know our faces for sure!

Those that preach along the road, street and in other Public places, are they doing it PUBLICLY? Do you know their FACES? Do others living in your neighborhood KNOW THEIR FACES? Denial is ALLOWED if you so desire. Do they not see you a JW as one of the ACCUSERS?

achorladey:


Those that preach along the road, street and in other Public places, are they doing it PUBLICLY? Do you know their FACES? Do others living in your neighborhood KNOW THEIR FACES? Denial is ALLOWED if you so desire. Do they not see you a JW as one of the ACCUSERS?

What business do people have with a noise maker that's simply demonstrating on the main street? My friend, you love deceit oooooooo! No wonder you can't stay in the light.
You're comparing those knocking doors indiscriminately to speak with people of all sort with those who are just talking to the air.

achorladey:

You want to force GOVERNING BODY into Acts 2:42, Acts 15:22, Acts 17:10. You will have to rewrite the NWT at the rate you are going.

I thought you and your friends are well educated so you do well please to give another rendering that's better and well fitting. If those 12 Apostles are the ones controlling the activities of all the first century Christians globally, telling them what to continue with as necessary things and laws that are no more in operation regarding pure worship. Well i don't have any other way to call them than a well "organized ruling class" "central team of authority" or better still the "GOVERNING BODY!"

TATIME:
What business do people have with a noise maker that's simply demonstrating on the main street? My friend, you love deceit oooooooo! No wonder you can't stay in the light.
You're comparing those knocking doors indiscriminately to speak with people of all sort with those who are just talking to the air.

You call them NOISEMAKERS, hahahahahahaha. While you're still a MUSLIM and you blare your speakers every now and then during the day, did you count YOURSELF as being NOISEMAKERS then?

We also need to keep in mind a SECOND IMPORTANT fact: Jehovah may give us recognition in WAYS we MAY never expect. Watchtower July 2018 1st study article paragraph 10,18.


Since JWS believe GOD gives recognition in UNEXPECTED WAYS obviously it will be only for Jws alone.Hahahahahahahahaha.

John 7:24 “Stop judging by the outward appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”​—

Your last meeting emphasize IMPARTIALITY yet you are condemning by outward appearance.

rottennaija:


I honestly don't understand how you arrive at this, but I know where you got it from, which is the organization. But what you just wrote, the bolded, is far from being true, absolutely false.

Please do better by explaining to the world why the same leader of a group separated 12 an in just TWELVE of hundreds of his own followers all called disciples,only to name these few chosen ones as Apostles (Luke 16:13) and to say a SPECIAL prayer FOR and WITH them! John 17:1-26 You know better than me because i've been "brainwashed" by these men in New York called GB so please enlighten everyone why the same Jesus SEPARATED few of His own countless disciples and gave them another group name "Apostles". I was taught to believe that His motive was to have an earthly ruling class over His followers (Matthew 16:19) serving as moderators and supervisors during His absence! Act 1:15-26

achorladey:


You call them NOISEMAKERS, hahahahahahaha. While you're still a MUSLIM and you blare your speakers every now and then during the day, did you count YOURSELF as being NOISEMAKERS then?

We also need to keep in mind a SECOND IMPORTANT fact: Jehovah may give us recognition in WAYS we MAY never expect. Watchtower July 2018 1st study article paragraph 10,18.


Since JWS believe GOD gives recognition in UNEXPECTED WAYS obviously it will be only for Jws alone.Hahahahahahahahaha.

John 7:24 “Stop judging by the outward appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”​—

Your last meeting emphasize IMPARTIALITY yet you are condemning by outward appearance.

You are the funniest clown ever! So you think after i became a Christian i still don't realise that back then we were just noisemakers? 1Corinthians 15:8,9 Of course Paul later knew that all those not with the organization are doomed! Roman's 10:1-4 compared to Luke 9:60

TATIME:
I thought you and your friends are well educated so you do well please to give another rendering that's better and well fitting. If those 12 Apostles are the ones controlling the activities of all the first century Christians globally, telling them what to continue with as necessary things and laws that are no more in operation regarding pure worship. Well i don't have any other way to call them than a well "organized ruling class" "central team of authority" or better still the "GOVERNING BODY!"

Being well EDUCATED does not accord us the LIBERTY to make unnecessary insertion into the WORD OF GOD(Galatians 1:6-. Humility should tell you so. None of all the 12 Apostles you mention ever and never CALLED himself a GOVERNING BODY. Oga TATIME where did you GET that from?

Between you and Apostle Paul who is LYING Galatians 1: 1,15-17.

Acts 2:42 states they devoted themselves to the apostle's teachings not that the APOSTLES IMPOSED THEMSELVES/TEACHINGS on the new converts or call themselves GOVERNING BODY or to be seen as GOVERNING BODY.

TATIME:
You are the funniest clown ever! So you think after i became a Christian i still don't realise that back then we were just noisemakers? 1Corinthians 15:8,9 Of course Paul later knew that all those not with the organization are doomed! Roman's 10:1-4 compared to Luke 9:60

TATIME: You are the funniest clown ever! So you think after i became a Christian i still don't realise that back then we were just noisemakers?

Achorladey: Obviously you agreed you aren't NOISEMAKERS then and when the JWS say so to you back then to you will fiercely disagree. Hahhahahahha na so life be. Anywhere belle face. Give it more thought.

Of what use is this scripture cited? 1Corinthians 15:8,9

TATIME:Of course Paul later knew that all those not with the organization are doomed! Roman's 10:1-4 compared to Luke 9:60

Achorladey : Be bold enough to pick out ORGANIZATION from the scriptures cited. Luke 9:60 and Roman's 10: 1-4.

I will assist you though on what is needed to avoid DAMNATION Romans 10:9

achorladey:


Being well EDUCATED does not accord us the LIBERTY to make unnecessary insertion into the WORD OF GOD(Galatians 1:6-. Humility should tell you so. None of all the 12 Apostles you mention ever and never CALLED himself a GOVERNING BODY. Oga TATIME where did you GET that from?

Between you and Apostle Paul who is LYING Galatians 1: 1,15-17.

Acts 2:42 states they devoted themselves to the apostle's teachings not that the APOSTLES IMPOSED THEMSELVES/TEACHINGS on the new converts or call themselves GOVERNING BODY or to be seen as GOVERNING BODY.

If you're criticizing Jehovah's Witnesses,it's the WORSTEST situation you could find yourself in life my friends,because you will always avoid the truth!
"Governing Body" is the appropriate term for a group of few individuals that's overseeing the affairs of a greater number of people take it or leave it.
When Jesus said "do not Lord it over the flock" (Luke 22:25,26) of course He is appointing the Apostles as OVERSEERS of His ever growing group! But making it clear to them that they should be careful not to turn themselves as lords over His organization.
That's why you could find someone like me (though a black man) here in Africa easily explaining all that we believe from the scriptures for those who want to join the group due to the obvious good works. Unlike those who are G.Os (lords over) their own religious groups where none of the members can face critics like you to defend his/her faith with efficacy. I became one of Jehovah's Witnesses because i PERFECTLY understood what i was taught to believe. So i know that all religious groups have a GB but the time has come to rebel against leadership in worship. Atheism is rapidly growing by the second and soon the goats(those who have no regards for headship in sacred matters) will be separated from the sheep(the obedient ones).Matthew 25:32 I'm sure by that time you and your friends will be hunting for Jehovah's Witnesses but before then i will continue to torment your "lying souls" with the TRUTH! Luke 16:24

achorladey:


TATIME: You are the funniest clown ever! So you think after i became a Christian i still don't realise that back then we were just noisemakers?

Achorladey: Obviously you agreed you aren't NOISEMAKERS then and when the JWS say so to you back then to you will fiercely disagree. Hahhahahahha na so life be. Anywhere belle face. Give it more thought.

Of what use is this scripture cited? 1Corinthians 15:8,9

TATIME:Of course Paul later knew that all those not with the organization are doomed! Roman's 10:1-4 compared to Luke 9:60

Achorladey : Be bold enough to pick out ORGANIZATION from the scriptures cited. Luke 9:60 and Roman's 10: 1-4.

I will assist you though on what is needed to avoid DAMNATION Romans 10:9

As a Muslim i always believe in TEACHERS in faith,these ones teaches us things that MUST BE ADHERED to still i kept wondering why there was NO unity! We're only united for trouble but for good works there is always a DIVISION. So when i met Jehovah's Witnesses, at first i was sceptical about their mode of operations but gradually i begin to see what i've been searching for even while i was going to the Churches with my uncle and later when i returned to the family's religion "Islam". Therefore i PERFECTLY understood that the word ORGANIZATION was coined out from ORGANIZE.It's true that NO other religious group can confidently claim to be an organization, since they're not TRULY organized!
We're Jehovah's Witnesses,we wrote the Bible and it's ONLY within this ORGANIZATION that you can find the modern day English to help you grasp the concept of the whole message (BIBLE)!

TATIME:
Please do better by explaining to the world why the same leader of a group separated 12 an in just TWELVE of hundreds of his own followers all called disciples,only to name these few chosen ones as Apostles (Luke 16:13) and to say a SPECIAL prayer FOR and WITH them! John 17:1-26 You know better than me because i've been "brainwashed" by these men in New York called GB so please enlighten everyone why the same Jesus SEPARATED few of His own countless disciples and gave them another group name "Apostles". I was taught to believe that His motive was to have an earthly ruling class over His followers (Matthew 16:19) serving as moderators and supervisors during His absence! Act 1:15-26

Well, let me begin by saying that there has been a lot of super imposition of ideas on scriptural passages by the Org to fit into how they are structured.

From my observations on watchtower publications, it depends what they want to achieve that will now decide if they add apostle Paul among those called governing body or not.

The question then really is, was there a sort of governing body or central authority in Jerusalem that Jesus used to administers the affairs of the congregation in the first century or did Jesus direct the affairs of different congregation without passing through the said GB?

Did congregations in the first century had individual autonomy or did they look up to a central authority in Jerusalem for direction and control as done among Jws today?

What does the Bible show?

Someone had worked in this topic before and had presented a compelling argument. This person has was Late Bro. Raymond Franz, a former member of the governing body of Jehovah’s Witnesses. I therefore implore you to consider his argument and the scriptures used.

In his book, In search of Christian freedom, please find chapter 4, centralized authority. Here is a link to the book https://drive.google.com/file/d/11mAZsWuNqmW1YH1gYU5eJh8dL32uTCaG/view?usp=drivesdk

rottennaija:




Well, let me begin by saying that there has been a lot of super imposition of ideas on scriptural passages by the Org to fit into how they are structured.

From my observations on watchtower publications, it depends what they want to achieve that will now decide if they add apostle Paul among those called governing body or not.

The question then really is, was there a sort of governing body or central authority in Jerusalem that Jesus used to administers the affairs of the congregation in the first century or did Jesus direct the affairs of different congregation without passing through the said GB?

Did congregations in the first century had individual autonomy or did they look up to a central authority in Jerusalem for direction and control as done among Jws today?

What does the Bible show?

Someone had worked in this topic before and had presented a compelling argument. This person has was Late Bro. Raymond Franz, a former member of the governing body of Jehovah’s Witnesses. I therefore implore you to consider his argument and the scriptures used.

In his book, In search of Christian freedom, please find chapter 4, centralized authority. Here is a link to the book https://drive.google.com/file/d/11mAZsWuNqmW1YH1gYU5eJh8dL32uTCaG/view?usp=drivesdk

You're not getting it,are you? Franz is NO MORE here now so whatever his argument back then has NO binding on the CURRENT organizational direction today! I think your problem is failure to grasp that the organization is NOT STAGNANT. Ezekiel 1:15-21 compared to Revelations 14:4 The Lamb moving ahead of the organization is not stagnant,so it's the GB that He is using to direct His people. If a Christian who happens to be a member of the GB says or argued about something, it's not to be imposed on what the BODY has prayed upon for direction from the Lamb(Jesus). So if Franz is here today and realize that the GB is giving specific directions, he dare not stand against the BODY because whoever does that is already fighting against the SPIRIT! Ananias and Saphiras died not because the arrangement set by the GB back then was perfect but because they took a step AGAINST the SPIRIT. Act 5:9 Of course the arrangement was faulty that's why it had to stop immediately after the death of the Christian couple! Jesus taught them that "they'll always have the poor in their midst"(Mark 14:7) therefore that arrangement to eradicate poverty was a grevious error but whatever they bind on earth is binded in heaven! Matthew 16:19
So be warned!

TATIME:
You're not getting it,are you? Franz is NO MORE here now so whatever his argument back then has NO binding on the CURRENT organizational direction today! I think your problem is failure to grasp that the organization is NOT STAGNANT. Ezekiel 1:15-21 compared to Revelations 14:4 The Lamb moving ahead of the organization is not stagnant,so it's the GB that He is using to direct His people. If a Christian who happens to be a member of the GB says or argued about something, it's not to be imposed on what the BODY has prayed upon for direction from the Lamb(Jesus). So if Franz is here today and realize that the GB is giving specific directions, he dare not stand against the BODY because whoever does that is already fighting against the SPIRIT! Ananias and Saphiras died not because the arrangement set by the GB back then was perfect but because they took a step AGAINST the SPIRIT. Act 5:9 Of course the arrangement was faulty that's why it had to stop immediately after the death of the Christian couple! Jesus taught them that "they'll always have the poor in their midst"(Mark 14:7) therefore that arrangement to eradicate poverty was a grevious error but whatever they bind on earth is binded in heaven! Matthew 16:19
So be warned!

Ok. You can rest your case. I have no time for arguments

rottennaija:


Ok. You can rest your case. I have no time for arguments

What a great day! I owe you a bottle of Romero. That's more like it, we need not argue since i belong to the group of obedient ones but you to those following the lord whose sheep are not unitedly worshipping as one group, there shouldn't be any argument.. You know where you belong and i know where i belong. Farewell!

TATIME:
As a Muslim i always believe in TEACHERS in faith,these ones teaches us things that MUST BE ADHERED to still i kept wondering why there was NO unity! We're only united for trouble but for good works there is always a DIVISION. So when i met Jehovah's Witnesses, at first i was sceptical about their mode of operations but gradually i begin to see what i've been searching for even while i was going to the Churches with my uncle and later when i returned to the family's religion "Islam". Therefore i PERFECTLY understood that the word ORGANIZATION was coined out from ORGANIZE.It's true that NO other religious group can confidently claim to be an organization, since they're not TRULY organized!
We're Jehovah's Witnesses,we wrote the Bible and it's ONLY within this ORGANIZATION that you can find the modern day English to help you grasp the concept of the whole message (BIBLE)!

So many things to laugh about.....

1.As a JW now you always believe in GOVERNING BODY in faith,these ones teaches us things that MUST BE ADHERED.

Were you asked to believe in GOVERNING BODY? Do the beroeans just ADHERED to Paul's preaching or EXAMINED them?

TATIME: Therefore i PERFECTLY understood that the word ORGANIZATION was coined out from ORGANIZE.It's true that NO other religious group can confidently claim to be an organization, since they're not TRULY.

achorladey: How can you PERFECTLY understand when the GOVERNING BODY you believed IN always makes mistakes and error? Obviously you gulp down their MISTAKES and ERROR. That is why they say Peter learned NEW TRUTH about IMPARTIALITY. Has God ever been PARTIAL?

It's clear part of the PERFECT things you UNDERSTAND about the CLAIMED ORGANIZATION is what is below......


TATIME: We're Jehovah's Witnesses,we wrote the Bible and it's ONLY within this ORGANIZATION that you can find the modern day English to help you grasp the concept of the whole message (BIBLE)

Achorladey : Another thing to lol about. Oga TATIME, una don dey WRITE Bible too? � No wonder your ORGANIZATION is forcing GOVERNING BODY and ORGANIZATION into the SCRIPTURES.

Since when is the admonition of doing things orderly become setting up an ORGANIZATION and go as far as make claims, only CLAIMS of being JEHOVAH'S ORGANIZATION. �

What about pidgin? TATIME!

TATIME:
If you're criticizing Jehovah's Witnesses,it's the WORSTEST situation you could find yourself in life my friends,because you will always avoid the truth!
"Governing Body" is the appropriate term for a group of few individuals that's overseeing the affairs of a greater number of people take it or leave it.
When Jesus said "do not Lord it over the flock" (Luke 22:25,26) of course He is appointing the Apostles as OVERSEERS of His ever growing group! But making it clear to them that they should be careful not to turn themselves as lords over His organization.
That's why you could find someone like me (though a black man) here in Africa easily explaining all that we believe from the scriptures for those who want to join the group due to the obvious good works. Unlike those who are G.Os (lords over) their own religious groups where none of the members can face critics like you to defend his/her faith with efficacy. I became one of Jehovah's Witnesses because i PERFECTLY understood what i was taught to believe. So i know that all religious groups have a GB but the time has come to rebel against leadership in worship. Atheism is rapidly growing by the second and soon the goats(those who have no regards for headship in sacred matters) will be separated from the sheep(the obedient ones).Matthew 25:32 I'm sure by that time you and your friends will be hunting for Jehovah's Witnesses but before then i will continue to torment your "lying souls" with the TRUTH! Luke 16:24

TATIME: If you're criticizing Jehovah's Witnesses,it's the WORSTEST situation you could find yourself in life my friends,because you will always avoid the truth!

achorladey: It's good you started your statement with "IF", that shows uncertainty on your part about what I highlighted above.

Many people and religious ORGANIZATIONS have been CRITICISED in times past, you must have CRITICISED the JWS as well before you become a CONVERT. Please while you are still a MUSLIM back then, those criticizing you then most have done the WORSTEST and be in the WORSTEST situation. TRUE/FALSE?

Respond accordingly to all the points I have raised in our conversation from yesterday till today let's see who is avoiding the TRUTH. I have repeatedly enlighten and broaden your scope about some and many of the scriptures you have cited here. I have even have the time to delve, deepdive into some of the recent Watchtower study articles you dearly cherished. Do you respond accordingly to anyone of them?

Na Apostate you go eventually call us last last. Na your way. Satan na APOSTATE, when he encountered our MASTER Jesus, JESUS no RUN. Jesus stand GIDIGBA. Take your stand against the Devil ni bibeli WI. Yoo sa kuro lodo re. KA JI KO?

John 14:6 is part of the Bible reading this week. Write out the explanation let us see as contained in the meeting workbook.

achorladey:


So many things to laugh about.....

1.As a JW now you always believe in GOVERNING BODY in faith,these ones teaches us things that MUST BE ADHERED.

Were you asked to believe in GOVERNING BODY? Do the beroeans just ADHERED to Paul's preaching or EXAMINED them?

TATIME: Therefore i PERFECTLY understood that the word ORGANIZATION was coined out from ORGANIZE.It's true that NO other religious group can confidently claim to be an organization, since they're not TRULY.

achorladey: How can you PERFECTLY understand when the GOVERNING BODY you believed IN always makes mistakes and error? Obviously you gulp down their MISTAKES and ERROR. That is why they say Peter learned NEW TRUTH about IMPARTIALITY. Has God ever been PARTIAL?

It's clear part of the PERFECT things you UNDERSTAND about the CLAIMED ORGANIZATION is what is below......


TATIME: We're Jehovah's Witnesses,we wrote the Bible and it's ONLY within this ORGANIZATION that you can find the modern day English to help you grasp the concept of the whole message (BIBLE)

Achorladey : Another thing to lol about. Oga TATIME, una don dey WRITE Bible too? � No wonder your ORGANIZATION is forcing GOVERNING BODY and ORGANIZATION into the SCRIPTURES.

Since when is the admonition of doing things orderly become setting up an ORGANIZATION and go as far as make claims, only CLAIMS of being JEHOVAH'S ORGANIZATION. �

What about pidgin? TATIME!

All the inspired writers are Jehovah's Witnesses. Isaiah 43:10-13 compared with Hebrews 11:4-12:1 I believe in teachers in faith because Jesus told Peter as a member of the GB "feed my sheep" THREE consecutive times! John 21:15-17 If the body err due to imperfections,those under their care should know that such is inevitable but speaking against them is what i will never ever do! Jehovah has taught US many lessons through the experience of those who rebelled against HEADSHIP in HIS setting! Numbers 12:1-8 16:1-50 compared with 1Corinthians 10:11
If you're arguing that you don't want to recognize any group as the one belonging to the true God, i perfectly understand that you detest divine direction under which people from all races could be organized!

achorladey:



TATIME: If you're criticizing Jehovah's Witnesses,it's the WORSTEST situation you could find yourself in life my friends,because you will always avoid the truth!

achorladey: It's good you started your statement with "IF", that shows uncertainty on your part about what I highlighted above.

Many people and religious ORGANIZATIONS have been CRITICISED in times past, you must have CRITICISED the JWS as well before you become a CONVERT. Please while you are still a MUSLIM back then, those criticizing you then most have done the WORSTEST and be in the WORSTEST situation. TRUE/FALSE?

Respond accordingly to all the points I have raised in our conversation from yesterday till today let's see who is avoiding the TRUTH. I have repeatedly enlighten and broaden your scope about some and many of the scriptures you have cited here. I have even have the time to delve, deepdive into some of the recent Watchtower study articles you dearly cherished. Do you respond accordingly to anyone of them?

Na Apostate you go eventually call us last last. Na your way. Satan na APOSTATE, when he encountered our MASTER Jesus, JESUS no RUN. Jesus stand GIDIGBA. Take your stand against the Devil ni bibeli WI. Yoo sa kuro lodo re. KA JI KO?

John 14:6 is part of the Bible reading this week. Write out the explanation let us see as contained in the meeting workbook.

Digression
G.O General Overseer is what the Churches are calling their leaders. It's not found in the Bible because G.O mean the head,having all the authority. But Governing Body is what Jehovah's Witnesses are using and you're crying,whereas i pointed to the Apostles as a "Ruling Class" "Center group of Authority" or "Governing Body" and your response is "there is nowhere governing body is written in the scriptures" as if Daddy or Mummy G.O is found in the Bible My friend, you can run but you can't hide!

TATIME:
Digression

You could have responded accordingly, hahahahahahaha. Na today I know you. Digression ko, Diversion ni.

TATIME:
Digression
G.O General Overseer is what the Churches are calling their leaders. It's not found in the Bible because G.O mean the head,having all the authority. But Governing Body is what Jehovah's Witnesses are using and you're crying,whereas i pointed to the Apostles as a "Ruling Class" "Center group of Authority" or "Governing Body" and your response is "there is nowhere governing body is written in the scriptures" as if Daddy or Mummy G.O is found in the Bible My friend, you can run but you can't hide!

You could have attended to my post accordingly.

Where did you see me use Daddy G. O, Mummy G. O in all of my conversation with you.

Now that you mention Daddy G. O and Mummy G. O you can clearly see that you are not different from those other religious organizations who COINED terms from their own thinking and mindsets to fit into the BIBLE. A case of the Kettle calling the Pot black. Get the sense of it.

Give me scriptures that state where Jesus called the apostles RULING CLASS or CENTER GROUP OF AUTHORITY. Later you will come and tell me that Jesus told them not to LORD over there brothers. Hahahahahahahahah CONTRADICTIONS na your way.