true2god:
This site is both for personal studies and engaging in comparative religion: it is also for christian and Islamic apologetic exercise. Your quest for moral equivalence does not make sense because both religions do not teach people the same thing and both religions shape society in a diametrically opposite directions. You don't need to stifle a healthy debate all in the name to sound good or neutral. This is Nairaland 'religion section', please allow us to express ourselves.

Thank you.

Exactly both religions do not teach the same thing and that's something we have to deal with regardless of either the religions we practise.
And it was a healthy debate until someone accused the other side of being in satanic shackles and that was what prompted me to respond.
Just because both sides hold different ideologies and teachings shouldn't warrant one side to try to win the debate by demonizing the other. That was just utterly disrespectful and rude

worlexy:
What's the meaning of scriptures? if Allah calls Christians and Jews People of the Book, what Book is he talking about? Bible is derived from the Latin word Biblia which means Book. Taorah is Torah which is the first 5 books of the Bible, the Injeaskel is the Gospel, and Allah has told you to use your sense, so if all the books are in the Bible, you still expect Allah to spell it out to you that scriptures and Bible is the same?

ﻛَﺬٰﻟِﻚَ ﻳُﺒَﻴِّﻦُ ﺍﻟﻠَّﻪُ ﻟَﻜُﻢْ ﺀَﺍﻳٰﺘِﻪِۦ ﻟَﻌَﻠَّﻜُﻢْ ﺗَﻌْﻘِﻠُﻮﻥَ
"Thus does Allah make clear to you His verses that you might use reason(intellect)."
(QS. Al-Baqara 2: Verse 242)

You're asking me who wrote the Bible, go and the Sura 10:94 and Sura 16:43

At least we have meaning names as Titles of the chapters in the Bible . Unlike al Baqara that means The Cow, Al-Maaida: The Table, Al-Ana'am the Cattle and so on

Who gave the Bible it's name? No one cares to know.

How many people memorised the Bible in its original language? Who needs to know.

Can the chains of transmission of the Bible be authenticated? Who even understands authentication!

Abeg no tag me again!

Once again the Qur'an never mentioned Bible in any way. Scriptures refers to Books given to the Prophets of Allah before the last Prophet Muhammad.

true2god:
Christianity and Judaism, unlike Islam, is not based on the testimony of one man who does not even have an eyewitness to confirm if it was true that any god talked to him. The alpha and omega of Islam is Mohammed. Its is good you do a textual criticism of the Bible but you can never do a textual criticism of the Quran, all the various hadith and all the various seerah because they are compete disaster.

The First and the Last is Allah! And what dissaster are you talking about?

true2god:
The Bible, as you rightly claimed, has about 40 authors that span a period of 2500 years which led to the birth of the Jewish Torah and the Christan injil, the amalgamation which is called, in English language, the Bible. These authors are Jewish scribes who were moved, by the Spirit of God, who wrote what they saw (especially the first books of moses, Joshua, the kings, the chronicles, numbers, Esther, psalms, proverbs and the books of the major and the minor prophets) and this is what the Quran called 'the Taurat'.

Who amalgamated it? Who named the book Bible? Why lie the Qur'an recognises Chronicles, numbers, proverbs, Esther...?
Taurah was given to Moses, Injeel to Jesus, Zabur to David and Abraham and a host of others too received revelations.

true2god:
Now come to the time of the Messiah, the injil, it was written by eyewitnesses who saw and witnessed the life and time of Jesus. The first 4 chapters are called the gospel (Matthew, mark, Luke, John), follow by what happened in the early Christian communities (the act of the apostles), the epistles to the early churches or their church leaders, and lastly, the revelation of John the beloved (at the island of Patmos in today Turkey).

Where is the Gospel of Jesus himself? Lost. Eye-witness account can only be called narration or Hadith! And you forgot that hear the Bible contains lots of hear-says.

Mr Luke says in Luke 1 vs 1-4
Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.

Do you know who 'Theophilus' is?

true2god:
So the compilation of these books are what is called the bible as we know it today. And unlike the Quran, it is never the testimony of one-man and the events didn't happen in only two locations (Mecca and Medina) but in many geographical locations. The Bible accounts covers over 2500 year span while the Quran covers events of only 23 years.
So the question you need to ask yourself is, why are events that covers over 2500 years more accurate than events that covers only 23yrs? You also asked for the authors and this is a good question and I can't provide all the names now because I don't know their names offhand. And I will throw the same question back to you, it is on record that Mohammed used about 42 scribes to write the Quran, can you please provide all their names?

Alhamdulillah, you have let the cat out of the bag.

A Book written in 23yrs will be more authentic, easily preserved, easily memorised, error free than a Book written in 2500yrs as you claimed.
No one has ever memorised the Bible in it's original manuscript form.

As for your claim in red above, Muhammad is unlettered and as such can't read nor write so he would need people to write down the inspiration! Go from the east to the west to the north and south the Qur'an in it's Arabic language is one.

Can you list the authors of the Bible and tell us where the original manuscripts written by the authors are?

How many people memorised the Gospel of Jesus in Aramaic?

Rashduct4luv:


Who gave the Bible it's name? No one cares to know.

How many people memorised the Bible in its original language? Who needs to know.

Can the chains of transmission of the Bible be authenticated? Who even understands authentication!

Abeg no tag me again!

Once again the Qur'an never mentioned Bible in any way. Scriptures refers to Books given to the Prophets of Allah before the last Prophet Muhammad.

Go and argue with the Quran

FROM DAVID WOOD:
Ex-Muslims are everywhere, and the population is rapidly growing. To illustrate this fact, I go through the comments section of one recent video and show how many ex-Muslims are sharing their decision to leave Islam. If we're hearing from this many former Muslims in the comments section of a single video, how many are out there?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cw-5fbQM0Rs

The HUMOR of False Prophet Muhammad? | Christian Prince

All Islamic scholars the whole world get sweating when they met CP.. and Their face become pale.
When Moslem scholars talk of Mohamed's sense of humour what do they really think?
Imagine Mohamed asking his wives to cover themselves so that they wouldn't be SEEN BY THE BLIND MAN!
What is the sense in this?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jar7QVt5HaE

Rashduct4luv:


The First and the Last is Allah! And what dissaster are you talking about?



Who amalgamated it? Who named the book Bible? Why lie the Qur'an recognises Chronicles, numbers, proverbs, Esther...?
Taurah was given to Moses, Injeel to Jesus, Zabur to David and Abraham and a host of others too received revelations.



Where is the Gospel of Jesus himself? Lost. Eye-witness account can only be called narration or Hadith! And you forgot that hear the Bible contains lots of hear-says.

Mr Luke says in Luke 1 vs 1-4
Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.

Do you know who 'Theophilus' is?



Alhamdulillah, you have let the cat out of the bag.

A Book written in 23yrs will be more authentic, easily preserved, easily memorised, error free than a Book written in 2500yrs as you claimed.
No one has ever memorised the Bible in it's original manuscript form.

As for your claim in red above, Muhammad is unlettered and as such can't read nor write so he would need people to write down the inspiration! Go from the east to the west to the north and south the Qur'an in it's Arabic language is one.

Can you list the authors of the Bible and tell us where the original manuscripts written by the authors are?

How many people memorised the Gospel of Jesus in Aramaic?

The alpha and omega of Islam is Mohammed while Allah is the messenger delivering alleged convenient messages to Mohammed. I have shown you numerous hadith of sahih bukhari that confirmed that almost all the revelations in the Quran are wishes and desires of Mohammed but you deliberately decided to ignore them.

On the amalgamation of the Torah, you need to obey Allah who asked you to seek clarification from the people of the book. Its very unfortunate that Muslims seem to be smarter than Allah; instead of seeking clarification, you seek argument and bias. As I said earlier, the Bible is a record of events that lasted over 2500 years and locations, some are recorded Jewish history, some are recorded laws and customs for the people to follow in their daily moral life, some are dietary laws (Immediate burial of the dead, not drinking, not eating camels or animal deem unclean, etc) while the rest are the books of prophesies, from Ezekiel to the book of Malachi.

The new testament, or what you call the injil, is the recorded history of the Christian era, from the biography of Jesus (the first 4 books), the activities of the early Christian community to the book of revelation (at the island of Patmos). The new testament era is what we call the Judeo-christian era because it has it foundation on the old Jewish text and religion.

You made a claim that the Quran does not recognize other books like the numbers, the kings, Esther, the chronicles etc, can you shoe me, in the Quran, where the books of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy were listed as the Torah? And to clear your Islamic ignorance, because Mohammed was an illiterate and ignorant man too, there is no any book given to Moses, Jesus or David. What was recorded was an event about them, the laws (from God) they gave to the people and all these were written down by scribes at that time and documented as sacred and religious text.

For David, the psalms are songs (David was a song writer) whose inspiration are deemed divine hence also used for daily prayer both in the Jewish and Christian religion. The book of Psalm contain the songs and inspirations of other prophets (like Ezekiel, Esther etc, but are very minor) but the large part of Psalms (over 90%) was written by David.

Now back to the critical analysis of the Quran, you have refused to provide the names of the 42 scribes who write the Quran. You also know that, during the time of Mohammed, the traditional Arabic letters do not have diacritical marks which means that one word can have about three to four meanings. The diacritical marks were introduced over 250 years after the time of Uthman jbn affan, so my questions are:

1) Who supervised the introduction of the diacritical marks?

2) How do they treat the obvious biases in the meanings of some words in the Quran after the introduction of the critical marks?

3) Is Allah not aware there was no critical mark which will surely lead to the future editing of the Quran to accommodate critical marks in the text hence leading to obvious biases and biases and contradictions?

4) Going by the aforementioned, is the claim that the Quran was 100% preserved still tenable at this modern age and time?

You equally refused to touch where Umar jbn kathab and the blindman influenced the revelations of the Quran. If you check page 18, I provided all the relevant hadith.

Debating Muslims.Good source here

https://www.chick.com/information/article?id=Common-Logical-Fallacies-Made-By-Muslims

Kindly Get Paul Enenche Songs Here:

https://www.ibloggospel.com/p/ps-dr-paul-enenche-songs.html


....

basilico:
Debating Muslims.Good source here

https://www.chick.com/information/article?id=Common-Logical-Fallacies-Made-By-Muslims

A good one. Thanks.

COMMON LOGICAL FALLACIES MADE BY MUSLIMS

by Robert A. Morey
© 1996 Research and Education Foundation

Christians must be prepared to answer the typical objections made against the Gospel. Most of the objections are based on simple logical fallacies. The following is a list of some of the most common fallacies used by Muslims.

Note: The average Muslim does not know that his arguments are logically erroneous. He is sincere in his beliefs. Thus you must be patient and kind in sharing with him why his arguments are invalid.

1. The Fallacy of False Assumptions: In logic as well as in law, "historical precedent" means that the burden of proof rests on those who set forth new theories and not on those whose ideas have already been verified. The old tests the new. The already established authority judges any new claims to authority.

Since Islam came along many centuries after Christianity, Islam has the burden of proof and not Christianity. The Bible tests and judges the Qur'an. When the Bible and The Qur'an contradict each other, the Bible must logically be given first place as the older authority. The Qur'an is in error until it proves itself.

Some Muslims violate the principle of historical precedent by asserting that Islam does not have the burden of proof and that the Qur'an judges the Bible.

2. Arguing in a circle: If you have already assumed in your premise what you are going to state in your conclusion, then you have ended where you began and proven nothing.

If you end where you began, you got nowhere.

Examples:

Proving Allah by the Qur'an and then proving the Qur'an by Allah.
Proving Muhammad by the Qur'an and then proving the Qur'an by Muhammad.

Proving Islam by the Qur'an and then proving the Qur'an by Islam.

3. False Analogy: Comparing two things as if they are parallel when they are not really the same at all.
Examples:

Many Muslims erroneously assume that Muslims and Christians share the same concepts of God, revelation, inspiration, textual preservation, the Bible, prophethood, biblical history, conversion, etc...
Because a false analogy is drawn between Islam and Christianity, some Muslims think that any argument which refutes the Qur'an will likewise refute the Bible; any argument which refutes Muhammad will also refute Jesus Christ, etc...
For example, many Muslims claim that Muhammad and all prophets were sinless. They even deny that Abraham was an idol worshipper. Thus when a Christian points out all the wicked things that Muhammad did (mass murder, child abuse, lying, etc.), the Muslims will say, "If you are right, then you must also reject your biblical prophets for doing wicked things as well."
What he is really saying is, "If you reject my prophet, then you must reject your prophets as well. If Muhammad was a false prophet, then your prophets are false as well."

The root problem is that the Muslim concept of prophethood is not the same as the Christian concept of prophethood. We teach that prophets sin like anyone else. Thus while Islam is refuted by the sins of Muhammad, Christianity is not jeopardized at all. The Muslim is guilty of setting up a "false analogy."

Whenever a Muslim responds to a Christian attack on the Qur'an, Muhammad, or Allah by flipping the argument around and applying it to the Bible, Jesus or the Trinity as if Islam and Christianity either stand or fall together, he is guilty of the fallacy of false analogy. Islam can be false and Christianity be true at the same time.

4. The Fallacy of Irrelevance: When you introduce issues which have no logical bearing on the subject under discussion, you are using irrelevant arguments.
Examples:

Some Muslims argue, "The Qur'an is the Word of God because the text of the Qur'an has been preserved perfectly." This argument is erroneous for two reasons:
Factually, the text of the Qur'an has not been preserved perfectly. The text has additions, deletions, conflicting manuscripts, and variant readings like any other ancient writing.
Logically, it is irrelevant whether the text of the Qur'an has been preserved because preservation does not logically imply inspiration. A book can be perfectly copied without implying its inspiration.
When Muslims attack the character and motives of anyone who criticizes Islam, they are using irrelevant arguments. The character of someone is no indication of whether he is telling you the truth. Good people can lie and evil people can tell the truth. Thus whenever a Muslim uses slurs such as "mean," "dishonest," "racist," "liar," "deceptive," etc., he is not only committing a logical fallacy but also revealing that he cannot intellectually defend his beliefs.
When confronted with the pagan origins of the Qur'an, some Muslims defend the Qur'an by answering, "So what! Didn't you Christians get Christmas from the pagans?"
This argument is erroneous for several reasons.
It is a false analogy to parallel the pagan origins of the rites commanded in the Qur'an with the present day holidays nowhere commanded in the Bible. What some modern day Christians do on Dec. 25th has no logical bearing on what the Qur'an commands Muslims to do (eg. the Pilgrimage, the Fast, etc.).
It is irrelevant that some Christians choose to celebrate the birth of Christ. Since the Bible nowhere commands it, it is a matter of personal freedom. But Muslims are commanded in the Qur'an to believe and practice many things which came from the paganism of that day.
The Muslim by using this argument is actually admitting that the Qur'an was not "sent down" but fabricated from pagan sources. This means he has become an unbeliever (Surah 25:4-6).
Some Muslims argue that the Qur'an is the Word of God because it contains some historically or scientifically accurate statements. This argument is irrelevant. Just because a book is correct on some historical or scientific point does not mean it is inspired. You cannot take the attributes of a part and apply it to the whole. A book can be a mixture of true and false statements. Thus it is a logical fallacy to argue that the entire Qur'an is true if it makes one true statement.
When a Muslim argues that history or science "proves" the Qur'an, this actually means that he is acknowledging that history and science can likewise refute the Qur'an. If the Qur'an contains just one historical error or one scientific error, then the Qur'an is not the Word of God. Verification and falsification go hand in hand.
The present meaning of a word is irrelevant to what it meant in ancient times. The word "Allah" is a good example. When confronted by the historical evidence that the word was used by pagan Arabs in pre-Islamic times to refer to a high god who was married to the sun-goddess and had three daughters, some Muslims will quote dictionaries, encyclopedias, etc. to prove (sic) that "Allah means God." They are thus using modern definitions to define what the word meant over a thousand years ago! What "Allah" means now has no bearing on what it meant before Muhammad.
5. The Fallacy of Equivocation: If we assume that everyone has the same definition of such words as God, Jesus, revelation, inspiration, prophet, miracle, etc., we are committing a very simple logical fallacy.

When a Muslim says, "Christians and Muslims worship the same God," he is committing the fallacy of equivocation. While Christians worship the Triune God of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, Muslims worship a Unitarian deity. Obviously, they are worshipping different Gods.
When a Muslim says, "We believe in Jesus too," he is committing the fallacy of equivocation. The "Jesus" of the Qur'an is not the Jesus of the Bible. Islam preaches "another Jesus" (II Cor. 11:4). The Jesus of the Bible is God the Son who died on the cross for our sins. But the "Jesus" of the Qur'an is not God the Son and he did not die on the cross for our sins. Thus it is erroneous for Muslims to tell Christians that they believe in Jesus, too.
When a Muslim assumes that Christians have the same concept of revelation as Muslims, he is guilty of the fallacy of equivocation. According to Islam, the Qur'an was written in heaven by Allah and has no earthly sources. When we prove that it comes from earthly sources, this threatens the inspiration of the Qur'an. On the other hand, the Bible does not claim that it dropped out of heaven one day. It openly quotes from earthly sources. It uses pre-existing sources without any difficulty whatsoever, thus while the Qur'an is threatened by historical sources, the Bible is actually confirmed by them.
When a Muslim tells you that the word "Allah" has only one meaning: "the one, true, universal God," he is assuming a fallacy. The word "allah" has many different meanings.
It can be used as a generic term like the English word "God." Thus it can be applied to any god or goddess regardless if a true or false god is in view. (ex. The "Allahs" of Hinduism.)
The Nation of Islam uses it to refer to Wallace Dodd Ford, Elijah Muhammad, and Louis Farrakhan as "Allah" and teaches that all black people are "Allahs."
It has been used by some Christians in Arabic speaking countries as a generic name for the Holy Trinity.
It was used in pre-Islamic times by pagan Arabs to refer to the moon-god who was the father of al-Lat, al-Uzza and Manat.
It is used by Muslims to refer to their god.
Islam and Christianity do not worship the same God. The Christian worships the Holy Trinity while the Muslim worships a unitarian deity.

6. The Fallacy of Force: The Qur'an commands Muslims to wage war against non-Muslims and apostates (Surah 5:33; 9:5, 29).

Some Muslims use a false analogy to answer this argument. They respond by saying, "Well, what about the Crusades? You Christians use violence just like Muslims."

It is logically erroneous to set up a parallel between Muslims killing people in obedience to the Qur'an and Christians killing people in disobedience to the Bible. While the Qur'an commands Jihad, the New Testament forbids it.

7. The Fallacy Of Confusing Questions of Fact with Questions of Relevance: Whether something is factually true is totally different from the issue of whether you feel it is relevant. The two issues must be kept separate.

Examples:

When a Christian argues that some of the beliefs and rituals of the Qur'an came from pre-Islamic Arab paganism, the Muslim will deny it at first. But as more and more evidence is given, the Muslim will often do a flip-flop and begin arguing, "So what! Didn't you Christians get Christmas from the pagans?" The Muslim has now committed three fallacies:
The "So what!" argument is dealing with the issue of relevance, not fact. You must stop the Muslim at that point and ask him, "Since you are now dealing with the issue of whether the pagan origins of the Qur'an are relevant, does this mean that you are now agreeing to the fact of the pagan origins of Islam?"
The Muslim has also committed the fallacy of equivocation, The Bible is not threatened by historical sources. It freely refers to them and even quotes them (Acts 17: 28). But the Qur'an denies that it has any earthly historical sources (Surah 25:4-6).
He also committed the fallacy of false analogy. The Bible and the Qur'an are two totally different books. The inspiration of the Bible does not depend upon the fate of the Qur'an because what Muslims claim for the Qur'an is not what Christians claim for the Bible.
8. Phonic Fallacies: The phonetic sound of a word should not be used to twist its meaning. For example,

Some Muslims try to prove that the word "Allah" is in the Greek New Testament because of the Greek word alla. But while the word is pronounced "alla," it only means "but" in Greek. It has nothing to do with the Arabic "Allah."
Some Muslims have claimed that the word "Allah" is in the Bible because the Biblical word "Allelujah." They then mispronounce the word as "Allah-lujah" But "Allelujah" is not a compound Arabic word with "Allah" being the first part of the word. It is a Hebrew word with the name of God being "JAH" (or Yahweh) and the verb "alle" meaning "praise to." It means "praise to Yahweh." The Arabic word "Allah" is not in the word.
The same error is found in the Muslim argument that the word "Baca" (Psa. 84:6) really means "Mecca." The valley of Baca is in northern Israel.
Some Muslims have tried to go from "Amen" to "Ahmed" to "Mohammed!" Such nonsense is beyond belief.
9. "Red Herring" Arguments: When a Muslim is asked to defend the Qur'an, if he turns around and attacks the reliability of the Bible, the Trinity, the deity of Christ, the Crusades, etc., he is introducing irrelevant issues that have no logical bearing on the truthfulness of Islam. He is trying to divert attention from Islam to other issues.

Furthermore, he is assuming that if he can refute the Bible, then the Qur'an wins by default. If he can refute the Trinity, then Allah wins by default. But this is logically erroneous. You cannot prove your position by refuting someone else's position. The Bible and the Qur'an could both be wrong. Muslims must prove their own book.

10. Straw Man Arguments: When you put a false argument into the mouth of your opponent and then proceed to knock it down, you have only created a "straw man" argument, Muslims sometimes either misunderstand or deliberately misquote the arguments Christians give them.
Example:

Some Muslims have built a "straw man" argument that claims that we teach, "The Qur'an teaches that Allah is the Moon-god and that Muslims knowingly believe in and worship the Moon-god and his daughters." They then knock down this "straw man" argument and claim victory. Of course, we never said such nonsense. What we have said is that while the Qur'an claims that Allah is God and Muslims think they are worshipping the one true God, in reality they are worshipping a false god preached by a false prophet according to a false book.

Conclusion

The average Muslim has been deceived by Muslim apologists who use such logical fallacies without regard to reason, fact or honesty. But there are many Muslims who want to be rational in their religion and thus have an open mind to rational discourse. Once they see that their arguments are based on logical fallacies, they will be open to the wonderful news that Jesus Christ is the Son of God who died for our sins on the cross.

Been away from this subpost. Glad to see my xtian friends have not given in to Islam deceptions and I'm happy to note that tintingz and usermane are now apostates.
Islam is fake.
I stopped posting here because threads were being moved to that Islam protected real estate of muslins @nairaland where you have to affirm the shahada.
True2god let's keep up the good fight.
Where is parisbook, annunaki, et al to continue this fight?

basilico:
Been away from this subpost. Glad to see my xtian
True2god let's keep up the good fight.
Where is parisbook, annunaki, et al to continue this fight?

they have embraced Islam and moved to Medina. How you dey bro... Long time

Thanks for confirming apostasy of usermane. Let's hope he comes here and confirms your allegation.

Empiree:
they have embraced Islam and moved to Medina. How you dey bro... Long time

Thanks for confirming apostasy of usermane. Let's hope he comes here and confirms your allegation.

You will soon testify to the fakery of Allah and his messenger.

true2god:
You will soon testify to the fakery of Allah and his messenger.

I am sure many of your fellow christians disagree with you on this. You are less and less sensible these days. What happened to you, bro.

Empiree:
I am sure many of your fellow christians disagree with you on this. You are less and less sensible these days. What happened to you, bro.

Tintinz and usermane have opened their mind to reality and I know you are getting there. Don't let your arrogance destroy your ability to critical reasoning. You are smarter than allah and his messenger.

true2god:
Tintinz and usermane have opened their mind to reality and I know you are getting there. Don't let your arrogance destroy your ability to critical reasoning. You are smarter than allah and his messenger.

do you agree with their new "religion"?

Empiree:
do you agree with their new "religion"?

What's their new religion?

true2god:
What's their new religion?

you tell me.

basilico:
I'm happy to note that tintingz and usermane are now apostates.

See CHRISTIANs in Nigeria. Wallahi, I'm sad at this. Yet they claim Muslims want to islamise Nigeria.

Empiree:
See CHRISTIANs in Nigeria. Wallahi, I'm sad at this. Yet they claim Muslims want to islamise Nigeria.

This text looks like an hadith, that is a rumour or Chinese whisper. I thought you are wiser than this; come on mehn, I expected something more reasonable. Are you still fasting?

true2god:
This text looks like an hadith, that is a rumour or Chinese whisper. I thought you are wiser than this; come on mehn, I expected something more reasonable. Are you still fasting?

bro, I thought you are a realist. Get over religious sentiment. The lady that sent this to me is a family member. You need to condemn wrong when you see one. Wrong is wrong.

This is religious discrimination at job opportunity. This is not a hadith. No wonder there are many Muslims who converted to CHRISTIANITY because of jobs not convictions. Later they start saying they are exmuslims.

Nigeria govt is a bogus. Isn't there laws that protect citizens in this case. What sort of nonesense is this.

Empiree:
bro, I thought you are a realist. Get over religious sentiment. The lady that sent this to me is a family member. You need to condemn wrong when you see one. Wrong is wrong.

This is religious discrimination at job opportunity. This is not a hadith. No wonder there are many Muslims who converted to CHRISTIANITY because of jobs not convictions. Later they start saying they are exmuslims.

Nigeria govt is a bogus. Isn't there laws that protect citizens in this case. What sort of nonesense is this.

The acting chief Justice of kebbi state was not confirmed because she is a Christian. Gbajabiamila have to become a compulsory Muslim to become the speaker of the house of assembly. All the service chiefs in the security agencies are Muslims. The three arms of government are ALL headed by Muslims. Muslims are worst when it comes to play religious and identity politics worldwide, the ummah comes first before nations or race.

Islam is evil bro and the world is waking up to this reality.

true2god:
The acting chief Justice of kebbi state was not confirmed because she is a Christian. Gbajabiamila have to become a compulsory Muslim to become the speaker of the house of assembly. All the service chiefs in the security agencies are Muslims. The three arms of government are ALL headed by Muslims. Muslims are worst when it comes to play religious and identity politics worldwide, the ummah comes first before nations or race.

Islam is evil bro and the world is waking up to this reality.

kini jagbajagba ti man you nso?. We talking about average citizens you talking about politics/politicians. Who them help?. This lady saw ads and went there for job to put food on her table and to feed family but you talking about politicians?. Where is your humanity?. How I wish I own business in nija. I will employe based on qualifications not religion. The only time you employe Muslims only is something specifically defined for Muslims only like cleaning masjid etc.


Later you will tell me how CHRISTIANs are loving and Christlike. Rubbish

Empiree:
See CHRISTIANs in Nigeria. Wallahi, I'm sad at this. Yet they claim Muslims want to islamise Nigeria.

A re-replay just so the people of this thread can see it.
I laugh whenever someone says Buhari wants to Islamise Nigeria.
It's the same thing Northerners said about Goodluck and his anti-muslim agenda. It's all baseless accusations driven by religious sentiment.
I mean Buhari had 4 years to finish what they are accusing him of, but here we are. No political moves have been made under the authority of FG to change Nigeria into an Islamic country or to covert the Christian population.
You can make a valid point and criticism of Buhari's incompetence in dealing with the Hurdsmen crisis, communal clashes and bokoharam which is a real cause for concern, but they are trying to create a problem that doesn't exist or one that only exists in their minds.
What will they say if Buhari finishes this next 4 years without anything happening? That it is their prayers that stopped Buhari from accomplishing the Islamisation? The man had the perfect opportunity during the military dictatorship era. Why would he wait until civilian rule when you can't do anything you want and get away with it?
I'm just saying people have a tendency to create patterns in their minds where one doesn't exist and it may originate from genuine worries, but we can see this is just some BS.

Looks like Nigeria is ungovernable. How I wish I'm a politician and influencial one. I will set record straight regardless of what nincompoops say.

Empiree:
kini jagbajagba ti man you nso?. We talking about average citizens you talking about politics/politicians. Who them help?. This lady saw ads and went there for job to put food on her table and to feed family but you talking about politicians?. Where is your humanity?. How I wish I own business in nija. I will employe based on qualifications not religion. The only time you employe Muslims only is something specifically defined for Muslims only like cleaning masjid etc.


Later you will tell me how CHRISTIANs are living and Christlike. Rubbish

You wanna drag me into politics bro; your non-stop deflection strategy that you are notorious for. It is a fact that if your name is not Mohammed, Abdullahi, Usman, Abubakar, etc, there is a limit you can go in getting jobs or contract in corporate Nigeria. Many people answer Muslim names to enter Nigeria army as a RECRUIT, ordinary RECRUIT.

As I said earlier, don't accuse others of what is ingrained in your religion. Read the 'Reliance of the traveler', a trusted Islamic book on how Muslims should treat non-Muslims in a case of a corporate existence (quran 5:51).

true2god:
You wanna drag me into politics bro; your non-stop deflection strategy that you are notorious for. It is a fact that if your name is not Mohammed, Abdullahi, Usman, Abubakar, etc, there is a limit you can go in getting jobs or contract in corporate Nigeria. Many people answer Muslim names to enter Nigeria army as a RECRUIT, ordinary RECRUIT.

As I said earlier, don't accuse others of what is ingrained in your religion. Read the 'Reliance of the traveler', a trusted Islamic book on how Muslims should treat non-Muslims in a case of a corporate existence (quran 5:51).

You are shifting goal post. Anyways, whats is your understanding of Q5:51?. If your understanding is what it is, how then can you harmonize and deduce Q5:51 from these other ayat Q3:113 and Q60:8?

Empiree:
You are shifting goal post. Anyways, whats is your understanding of Q5:51?. If your understanding is what it is, how then can you harmonize and deduce Q5:51 from these other ayat Q3:113 and Q60:8?

This is what we mean when we say Islam speaks from both sides of the mouth.

As two different and opposing views are given the Moslem can decide to choose which one he wants depending on how convenient it is for him.

If he is at a disadvantage he chooses the more 'peaceful' verse. If he has the upper hand or among his fellow Moslems he goes for the opposite.

Most times it will take tafsir upon tasfir to try to unravel what a verse or the contradictions really mean.

Empiree:
You are shifting goal post. Anyways, whats is your understanding of Q5:51?. If your understanding is what it is, how then can you harmonize and deduce Q5:51 from these other ayat Q3:113 and Q60:8?

A friend of mine told me 'You can tell a Muslim that fire is hot , but if the Qur'an says it is not , they will continue to burn themselves . They get an "A" for dedication , but an "F" for Logic'.

You need not be a first class student to know that there is a contradiction in the ayah you provided but, by using the hadith and the tafsir formula, the contradictions will be cleared ONLY by an authorized scholar. This is why informed people see Islam as a joke promoted by illiterate Arab barbarians in the 7th century. I would have loved to explain the reasons for the contradictions, as I always did, but I won't spoon feed you much; you are smarter than that.

true2god:
A friend of mine told me 'You can tell a Muslim that fire is hot , but if the Qur'an says it is not , they will continue to burn themselves . They get an "A" for dedication , but an "F" for Logic'.

You need not be a first class student to know that there is a contradiction in the ayah you provided but, by using the hadith and the tafsir formula, the contradictions will be cleared ONLY by an authorized scholar. This is why informed people see Islam as a joke promoted by illiterate Arab barbarians in the 7th century. I would have loved to explain the reasons for the contradictions, as I always did, but I won't spoon feed you much; you are smarter than that.

CONTRADICTION?. This s why you need to leave Islam alone because it is too big for you. Now read what a NL member said about you after reading your comments since yesterday

As AlBa.qir once said "His (true2god) brain fluctuates, sometimes he sounds brilliant, sometimes he sounds stark ignorant". To me, he sounds stupid and silly most of the time

Back to the topic. Some 5 years ago you guys quoted Q5:51 endlessly and we explained to you. Our explanation did not differ from established tafsir. If you recall very well in my recent posts in this thread, I singled you out from peace loving Orthodox CHRISTIANITY which means part of the CHRISTIANs who are not anti Islam are our friends according to Q3:113 and Q60:8.

Also recall that anytime I mentioned CHRISTIANITY and Judaism in the context of terrorism I always said "not all of you". So Q5:51 is talking about crazy Christian like you who hate Islam. Called Allah and His messenger unprinted words. Such CHRISTIANs are deprived of these ayat Q3:113 and Q60:8?. So there is no contradiction.

So this Christian Prince is like the Christian equivalent of Dr Zakir Naik?

IMAliyu:
So this Christian Prince is like the Christian equivalent of Dr Zakir Naik?

No. He is not christian nor jewish. He is combination of jew and christian known as zionist. He is a trained Zionist to do what he does for living (anti islam). He doesnt know anything about islam but twist text to confuse weak ones