With d rate @ which corrupt politicians and bank MDs donate n give thite is not bad 4 d gospel propagatn some might say. But my questn is: Is it right 2 accept such? Where is d discerning spirit of apostle paul. Armed robbers,drug dealers,419 are frontliners in churches and mosques. Whats goin on.

money no dey smell.

The bible provides answers to your questions.

2 Peter 2:1-3:

The Danger of False Teachers  
1 But there were also false prophets in Israel, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will cleverly teach destructive heresies and even deny the Master who bought them. In this way, they will bring sudden destruction on themselves. 2 Many will follow their evil teaching and shameful immorality. And because of these teachers, the way of truth will be slandered. 3 In their greed they will make up clever lies to get hold of your money. But God condemned them long ago, and their destruction will not be delayed.

monetary tithes is a good example of "clever lie" highlighted above.

Romans 16:17-18:
17 And now I make one more appeal, my dear brothers and sisters. Watch out for people who cause divisions and upset people’s faith by teaching things contrary to what you have been taught. Stay away from them. 18 Such people are not serving Christ our Lord; they are serving their own personal interests. By smooth talk and glowing words they deceive innocent people.

@Kunleoshob: You have said it all. But will they hear this and listen?

It is not the place of the pastor to question people sources of blessing.The pastor place is to teach people the word. It is left for them to obey. But if a pastor gets to know , a member has a wrong lifestyle, he brings him to order by teaching,correction and rebuke. Don't add to the bible. Did Jesus question the offerings he received? He even received perfume from a known love-peddler.

Luke 7:37
37 And, behold, a woman in the city, which was a sinner, when she knew that[ Jesus] sat at meat in the Pharisee's house, brought an alabaster box of ointment,

Why did Jesus accept perfume bought with Prost-titution? Where is discerning of spirit Of apostle Paul ?.Why do you guys just speak about what you dont know and acting as though you know something?

KunleOshob:

The bible provides answers to your questions.
monetary tithes is a good example of "clever lie" highlighted above.

Romans 16:17-18:
17 And now I make one more appeal, my dear brothers and sisters. Watch out for people who cause divisions and upset people’s faith by teaching things contrary to what you have been taught. Stay away from them. 18 Such people are not serving Christ our Lord; they are serving their own personal interests. By smooth talk and glowing words they deceive innocent people.

You are the one pasting lies here. The scripture you are quoting is not about tithes. Tithing is part of Gods plan for financial security for us. Tithes and offerings were instituted before the law. As long there is a high priest , there will be tithing. Why is your emphasis always on tithing what of offering? They go together my brother.

^^^^
Mr Agbaje, i know your problem so i won't bother to respond to the hubris you just wrote above. You and i know very well that once the false and fraudulent doctrine of tithes is removed from your business you and Oyaks are very likely to go bankrupt. But then again Oyaks has diversified to differents areas of business and scamming so he might get by. but you you might be forced to get a decent job and stop living off the sweat of others. It is criminal to say that "tithing is part of God's plan for financial security" whilst there is nowhere in the bible were tithing was financial or monetary. I won't bother to go into details cos i have shown you over and over again on this forum that tithing the way it is preached and interpreted today has no biblical basis i.e it is a doctrine of man derived from manipulating God's commandements to the ancient Israelites which was NEVER carried forward into christianity by Jesus nor the apostles. But only emerged in christianity several centuries after the apostles had departed. I know you know the truth but your love for filthy lucre would not allow you admit the truth

Joagbaje:

It is not the place of the pastor to question people sources of blessing.The pastor place is to teach people the word. It is left for them to obey. But if a pastor gets to know , a member has a wrong lifestyle, he brings him to order by teaching,correction and rebuke. Don't add to the bible. Did Jesus question the offerings he received? He even received perfume from a known love-peddler.

Luke 7:37
37 And, behold, a woman in the city, which was a sinner, when she knew that[ Jesus] sat at meat in the Pharisee's house, brought an alabaster box of ointment,

Why did Jesus accept perfume bought with Prost-titution? Where is discerning of spirit Of apostle Paul ?.Why do you guys just speak about what you dont know and acting as though you know something?

You are the one pasting lies here. The scripture you are quoting is not about tithes. Tithing is part of Gods plan for financial security for us. Tithes and offerings were instituted before the law. As long there is a high priest , there will be tithing. Why is your emphasis always on tithing what of offering? They go together my brother.

Pastor JoAgbaje: Could you please show us Scriptural references where Jesus passed the "offering" basket around

KunleOshob:

^^^^
Mr Agbaje, i know your problem so i won't bother to respond to the hubris you just wrote above. You and i know very well that once the false and fraudulent doctrine of tithes is removed from your business you and Oyaks are very likely to go bankrupt. But then again Oyaks has diversified to differents areas of business and scamming so he might get by. but you you might be forced to get a decent job and stop living off the sweat of others. It is criminal to say that "tithing is part of God's plan for financial security" whilst there is nowhere in the bible were tithing was financial or monetary. I won't bother to go into details cos i have shown you over and over again on this forum that tithing the way it is preached and interpreted today has no biblical basis i.e it is a doctrine of man derived from manipulating God's commandements to the ancient Israelites which was NEVER carried forward into christianity by Jesus nor the apostles. But only emerged in christianity several centuries after the apostles had departed. I know you know the truth but your love for filthy lucre would not allow you admit the truth

Stop attacking ministers , it is one thing not to believe in something , it is another thing not to accept others that believe in it. How much is tithe? Just ten percent, people are Giving lands,cars and houses for the gospel. Why this bias of yours. If anyone gives tithe ,he gives for his own benefit. My tithe is the smallest part of my giving. I give far more than my tithe to God I don't even feel I give something by paying tithe. I may get a 100,000 now and decide to give everything , the tithe is only 10,000 ! We have given cars , and all for gospel sake. How much is 10% ! All I have belong to christ.

Everyone should work by his conviction. If you refuse to tithe, I should condemn you . And you too should not condemn those who believe in tithe. You are bringing ridicule to the body of christ by you actions

ogajim:

Pastor JoAgbaje: Could you please show us Scriptural references where Jesus passed the "offering" basket around

John 12:6
6 This he said, not that he cared for the poor; but because he was a thief, and had the bag, and bare what was put therein.

What bag? Money bag. What was put therein ? Money ofcourse

@joagbaje
I don't condenm the poor people that have been manipulated to believe in tithes, it is people like you and your pay master oyaks that manipulate scritures to justify the fraudulent version of tithes being preached today that the scriptures condenm and I stand by the teachings of christ in condenming fraud using his name.

ps: that aside I would really appreciate it if you stop this false posturing of being a giver. It is clear from your profession and the false doctrines you preach in your so called church that you are a beneficiary of the scam. You are a receiver and NOT a giver. It is also well documented that your church is notorious for receiving stolen money yet you a so called pastor is shameless enough to defend it and quoting irrelevant scriptures as above to defend the digusting act. May God have mercy on your soul.

Pastor JoAgbaje! Pastor JoAgbaje! Pastor JoAgbaje!

How many times did I call your name? Dude, I asked a simple question and you are going to come back with a LAME excuse in the form of a verse used to describe Judas Iscariot?

Stay away from the bottle my man if this is your best shot. I have never found a passage in the HOLY Bible where Jesus or his Disciples passed the basket around for offerings/tithes(the payers of which get honorable mention/shout outs/come to the front for special prayers).
If Jesus Christ did not do it or his Disciples, IT IS WRONG/FALSE, the man fed thousands of folks without offering, come on man!

KunleOshob:

@joagbaje
I don't condenm the poor people that have been manipulated to believe in tithes, it is people like you and your pay master oyaks that manipulate scritures to justify the fraudulent version of tithes being preached today that the scriptures condenm and I stand by the teachings of christ in condenming fraud using his name.

You should rather work on the salavtion .

ps: that aside I would really appreciate it if you stop this false posturing of being a giver. It is clear from your profession and the false doctrines you preach in your so called church that you are a beneficiary of the scam. You are a receiver and NOT a giver. It is also well documented that your church is notorious for receiving stolen money yet you a so called pastor is shameless enough to defend it and quoting irrelevant scriptures as above to defend the digusting act. May God have mercy on your soul.

You get into sentiments when you have nothing tangible to say, I am a tither and not a tithe collector. I believe in tthing and it's working mightily .I have been tithing from my child hood. I'm raising my kids in it according the word. Even if they don't understand it fully.

One day your eyes will be opened to truth.

^^^
Even for oyaks to distribute his so called free indepence rapshody of errors, he has to milk his members to pay for it and of course the contract for the printing of the filthy pamphlets goes to his printing company were he profits from it handsomely. He also gets he promote his brand and personality based on the seeds of the deluded partners scammed into financing his personal aggrandisement.

KunleOshob:

^^^
Even for oyaks to distribute his so called free indepence rapshody of errors, he has to milk his members to pay for it and of course the contract for the printing of the filthy pamphlets goes to his printing company were he profits from it handsomely. He also gets he promote his brand and personality based on the seeds of the deluded partners scammed into financing his personal aggrandisement.

Critics are never satified. So What do you expect? Angels from heaven to pay the bills? The Gideon bibles circulated in every hotel all over the world have you asked if it's printed free in the press. People paid to sponsor them. We are doing something to bless a generation . What else do you do worthwhile outside criticism and personality attacks. This is simply envy because you are unknown. When you begin to make impact. Heaven and earth will celebrate you.

I guess Pastor JoAgbaje can't answer my question,

Follow Jesus Christ's examples and not that of a man like you and me.

ogajim:

I guess Pastor JoAgbaje can't answer my question,

Follow Jesus Christ's examples and not that of a man like you and me.

You raised the issue.I didn't say Jesus passed offering bag. If he did or not let's leave it for another thread. Don't misplace my point . My point based on the topic here is that you cannot blame pastors for not scrutinizing what people give to God in their churches. I only use Jesus as an example, people gave him money and other things , if you will not blame Jesus for collection without question even from a prosti-tute then you should not hold any pastor responsible for what people give, how many hours will the church spend asking each giver , where did you get this money? Jesus didn't teach that, neither Paul . So why are we creating a new doctrine on human ideology.

You really want to know why? It is a simple logic, figure it out yourself. Tithing was first mentioned in d Bible wrt Abraham/Melchizedek (am I right?) and we were told in that account that Abraham paid a tithe of all to Melchizedek (other version of d Bible say a tithe of all the plunder and loot both of which mean taking what doesnt belong to you illegaly which have very strong correlation with the poster's question), and Melchizek collected it without asking for it's origin. May be and maybe , they are probably obeying Bible to the fullest there since we are Abraham's seed and therefore expected to follow his examples. Abi ke?

If "Pastors" would preach the PURE UNADULTERATED BIBLICAL TRUTH, I doubt they would have half a house let alone a full house at every service.

It is not hard to figure out why they dance around holiness and sin thereby becoming more motivational speakers instead of shepherding their flock as Christ intended.

Joagbaje:

How much is tithe? Just ten percent, people are Giving lands,cars and houses for the gospel.

Joagbaje:

How much is 10% !

Abi na. Just 10%, no mind them jare I think you should encourage/mandate the tithing members of your church to give more than just 10%, it’s just too small. They can do better.

Joagbaje:

My tithe is the smallest part of my giving. I give far more than my tithe to God I don't even feel I give something by paying tithe. I may get a 100,000 now and decide to give everything , the tithe is only 10,000 !

But Jo you know say na free money you dey collect na, I don’t expect you to give just 10%. Like Kunle noted you are more a receiver than a giver, freely you receive freely you give. Abi no be so?

Joagbaje:

All I have belong to christ.

This, to a large extent is correct, you guys tend to pocket offerings made to the Almighty, an example is the tithe. I think you should give it all back

Joagbaje:

My point based on the topic here is that you cannot blame pastors for not scrutinizing what people give to God in their churches.

I want to agree with you here Jo, the pastor is not expected to stand by the offering/collection box to verify and approve the source of incoming contributions/offerings. This cannot be easily achieved.

Zikkyy:

I want to agree with you here Jo, the pastor is not expected to stand by the offering/collection box to verify and approve the source of incoming contributions/offerings. This cannot be easily achieved.

Even though it would be difficult to achieve, pastors are morally bound to teach memebers against making illicit money and worse still using such abominable money as an offering to God. However this is not the case in a number of these churches. CEC for example is notorious for receiving stolen money from it's members an they constantly put their members under pressure to give money to them at all cost, this puts the mebers under pressure and pushes so of them to commit crimes just to give to the church. And we are all witnesses to how pastor agabje has defended this wicked act several times on this forum

KunleOshob:

CEC for example is notorious for receiving stolen money from it's members an they constantly put their members under pressure to give money to them at all cost, this puts the mebers under pressure and pushes so of them to commit crimes just to give to the church.

You a liar! Nobody put anyone under pressure. What's your source of misinformation ? Have you been in CEC before?. And how many times have you heard pastor chris on Tv talking about money? He simply teaches us of the life in christ. Dominion in life etc. You know your lies don't sell again as at other time dude. Nobody has Kunle time . One of the most unstable human beign.

And we are all witnesses to how pastor agabje has defended this wicked act several times on this forum

Go to bed bro. Do something worthwhile with your life and your time.

KunleOshob:

Even though it would be difficult to achieve, pastors are morally bound to teach memebers against making illicit money and worse still using such abominable money as an offering to God. However this is not the case in a number of these churches.

You are very correct. This is where I have issues with people like Jo, too much emphasis on money, money, money.

KunleOshob:

Even though it would be difficult to achieve, pastors are morally bound to teach memebers against making illicit money and worse still using such abominable money as an offering to God.

oga Kunle, I must disagree with you on the bold part above.
Pastors claim to know all because they are God's representative on earth. They claim to see witches, wizards and other demons to be exorcised from their members so small thing like to know if a man is offering pensioners and salary earners savings put into their IPOs should not be "difficult" please.
Cheers.