If God is perfect and he created man in his perfect image, then why the need for circumcision? Altering God's perfect image would make it imperfect.

I still cannot wrap my head around how one who look at a beautiful newborn and decide the next thing to do is how and where to chop bits off of them because a religious belief 2000 years ago says it.

Afterthought 1:

Was Jesus circumcised? If so was his foreskin also raised from the dead?

Bacteriologist:
Afterthought 1:

Was Jesus circumcised? If so was his foreskin also raised from the dead?

Of course, he was Circumcised.....it's just that christianity tends to Ignore anything concerning sexuality with jesus, Forgeting that he was also human. (Dan brown said in his novel "The da Vinci code" that during that time , it was difficult to see a man more than 25 who wasn't married or Bethroted)........concerning Circumcision I'll wait For What the medical and religious exparts have to say.

Vulcanheph:

Of course, he was Circumcised.....it's just that christianity tends to Ignore anything concerning sexuality with jesus, Forgeting that he was also human. (Dan brown said in his novel "The da Vinci code" that during that time , it was difficult to see a man more than 25 who wasn't married or Bethroted)........concerning Circumcision I'll wait For What the medical and religious exparts have to say.

The afterthought was basically satire.
So would it follow that Christians believe Jesus's foreskin rose as well when he was resurrected?

Medically, circumcision slightly decreases the possibility of infection in MALES.

In females, however, it is completely dangerous and non-benficial.

You really believe man in his current fallen condition bears the image of God, or you believe with all your tendency for sin, you bear God's image? Think again. Circumcision is no longer a physical(though still medically advisable) requirement of God but spiritual

Finallydead:
You really believe man in his current fallen condition bears the image of God, or you believe with all your tendency for sin, you bear God's image? Think again. Circumcision is no longer a physical(though still medically advisable) requirement of God but spiritual

Oh...so there's a spiritual dïck with a spiritual fore skin than needs to be chopped off

The stupidity of religious people knows no bounds

Bacteriologist:


Oh...so there's a spiritual dïck with a spiritual fore skin than needs to be chopped off

The stupidity of religious people knows no bounds

It profiteth more to be still and learn from what he had to say.

1. No spiritual dick. Since the new covenant, it's now a circumcision of the heart [not that little organ that pumps blood though]

2. Talking about Jesus resurrecting with a forekeskin; Does Jesus need a dick after resurrection? Will his body come with a dick?
To remove waste? Definitely not.
To reproduce? Definitely not.

With this comment you've proved here that you're just trying to conceal your ignorance in DappaD's thread!

So Jesus never resurrected with his physical body for that would have meant having all his body parts functioning perfectly, of course he doesn't need that body no more therefore the truth is clear that what his followers saw and touched was a materialised form of body to show them that he is alive (in the spirit) and not back as a human (in the flesh)

Blabbermouth:

It profiteth more to be still and learn from what he had to say.

1. No spiritual dick. Since the new covenant, it's now a circumcision of the heart [not that little organ that pumps blood though]

2. Talking about Jesus resurrecting with a forekeskin; Does Jesus need a dick after resurrection? Will his body come with a dick?
To remove waste? Definitely not.
To reproduce? Definitely not.

It's genital mutilation... There's no way around it

You can never keep your atheism to yourself!

The reason is simple, you were blessed with the gift of speech and that makes you part of the human family where we need to communicate in order to make things better or make better choices. On thing that's baffling about atheism is the way you guys try to ridicule faith in God yet you want others to reason along with you on what you feel could solve the problems we have on the planet.

Circumcision served as a covenant between God and Abraham, note that Abel, Enoch, Noah and others were God's friends but they never got Circumcised. And God actually told Adam that he still needs to rely on him for instructions on how to go about his body, his folks, other creatures and his environment in general. Well that's the meaning of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil {Genesis 2:17} Adam has a relative freedom not absolute because there will come to be many intelligent beings (like Adam) when the couple begin to reproduce and only God can teach them how to relate without hurting one another. Think about the gigantic creatures on land and water, this creatures aren't as intelligent as man so man must rule over them {Genesis 1:26} their continuous subjection to humans largely depends on how we treat them!

I have told you if you truly want to know more about why God made arrangements for the Bible, you must consult his Witnesses feel free to ask them thought provoking questions regarding what is affecting mankind in general and not this idea of ridiculing people's beliefs.

You'll continue to feel hurt within as you're feeling now if you refuse to learn from God's true servants, and don't pretend as if you enjoy coming to a public forum everyday thinking of what to type next about religion. Every normal person knows how deeply hurt you are inside if you can't just walk away without complaining about what others around you does.

So the only way to be happy is what Jesus of Nazareth commissioned some two thousand years ago, he taught his disciples to go visiting their neighbours and trying to build a lasting friendship by looking for ways to develop the same line of thought on necessary things. John 17:20-23
Is that not the same thing you've been trying to do on this forum for years?
Well you may detest the name "Jesus" because you don't want anyone or anything to tell you how to live your life but know that you too have no right to teach others if everyone is absolutely free, it's rather advisable to build the same line of thought by having one unique role model that you and your neighbours can emulate and that ideal role model is Jesus of Nazareth! John 3:16-19

Bacteriologist:
If God is perfect and he created man in his perfect image, then why the need for circumcision? Altering God's perfect image would make it imperfect.

I still cannot wrap my head around how one who look at a beautiful newborn and decide the next thing to do is how and where to chop bits off of them because a religious belief 2000 years ago says it.

Vulcanheph:

Of course, he was Circumcised.....it's just that christianity tends to Ignore anything concerning sexuality with jesus, Forgeting that he was also human. (Dan brown said in his novel "The da Vinci code" that during that time , it was difficult to see a man more than 25 who wasn't married or Bethroted)........concerning Circumcision I'll wait For What the medical and religious experts have to say.

Um.s Christ was born in Old Covenant Judea and so He was circumcised according to the Old Covenant Law which is not the same as the New Covenant that Christians are governed by.

Circumcision is meant as a seal of the Old Covenant, and so since Jesus Christ was born into the Old Covenant and made it known that He came to fulfil it, that means He also got sealed as well.

Christians are not sealed his circumcision and so are not expected to be circumcised as the people of the Old Covenant.

Bacteriologist:
If God is perfect and he created man in his perfect image, then why the need for circumcision? Altering God's perfect image would make it imperfect.

If I spit into your your drinking water, shall it be pure, where it was pure? If Sniper is put in your food, is it still food?

Shall it not be required that the impurity be cut out or cut off?

But it is quite understandable that the only thing that the Blind See is Darkness, hence the inability to see!

MaxInDHouse:
With this comment you've proved here that you're just trying to conceal your ignorance in DappaD's thread!

So Jesus never resurrected with his physical body for that would have meant having all his body parts functioning perfectly, of course he doesn't need that body no more therefore the truth is clear that what his followers saw and touched was a materialised form of body to show them that he is alive (in the spirit) and not back as a human (in the flesh)

I am asking him why Jesus ought to resurrect with a dick.
How does that contradict anything?

By the way, we both know your position is not founded in the scripture. All you have are - we are part of the group Jesus kept on teaching, so listen to us, we are right.
Or, this doesn't make sense, this is what makes sense.

I will take Jesus' own words over anybody anyday anytime, twice on Sunday.

Bacteriologist:
If God is perfect and he created man in his perfect image, then why the need for circumcision?

Circumcision was usually already done before God commanded Abraham and the Israelites to circumcise

Bacteriologist:
Altering God's perfect image would make it imperfect.

No where in the Bible is there any mention of man (i.e. human beings) created as a perfect image of God

Bacteriologist:
I still cannot wrap my head around how one who look at a beautiful newborn and decide the next thing to do is how and where to chop bits off of them because a religious belief 2000 years ago says it.

"And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you,
every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed."
- Gen. 17:12

"¹Then the LORD said to Moses,
²“Say to the Israelites, ‘ A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be unclean for seven days,
as she is during the days of her menstruation.
³And on the eighth day the flesh of the boy’s foreskin is to be circumcised"
- Lev. 12:1-3

"²⁴One night while Moses was in camp, the LORD was about to kill him.
²⁵But Zipporah circumcised her son with a flint knife.
She touched his legs with the skin she had cut off and said, “My dear son, this blood will protect you.”
²⁶So the LORD did not harm Moses. Then Zipporah said, “Yes, my dear, you are safe because of this circumcision.”
- Exodus 4:24-27

The best and safest time to do this is the eighth day because on the eighth day, the amount of vitamin K and prothrombin present is elevated above 100% of normal and it is the only day in the males life in which under normal conditions, this will ever be the case.

So, in this case of circumcision surgery needing to be done, then day eight is the perfect day to have it done, simply because vitamin K and prothrombin are at their peak on that day and as vitamin K and prothrombin are vital to coagulation, that stops bleeding and paves way to healing faster. Apparently blood clotting mechanism does not function fully until the age of six months and is particularly weak in the first two to four days after birth.

Going back to answering the thread's titled question, well, the point of circumcision as commanded by (abrahamic) religion, is God letting Abraham realised that He owns Abraham's "little man" Abraham in cahoot with his wife, were trying to pull a fast one and helping God produce the promised heir. Seven times God had to keep reminding Abraham that He will give him a son through his wife Sarah, but Abraham still went into Hagar. Anyway long story, cut short, at age 99 years old, when Abraham had become impotent and/or infertile, God symbolically used circumcision to covenantally mark Abraham, and then miraculously make it possible for an impotent and/or infertile man and barren woman to produce a son, Isaac the promised child. Abraham's descendants, the Israelites, were commanded to repeat this practice as a memorial

MuttleyLaff:
Circumcision was usually already done before God commanded Abraham and the Israelites to circumcise

No where in the Bible is there any mention of man (i.e. human beings) created as a perfect image of God

"And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you,
every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed."
- Gen. 17:12

"¹Then the LORD said to Moses,
²“Say to the Israelites, ‘ A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be unclean for seven days,
as she is during the days of her menstruation.
³And on the eighth day the flesh of the boy’s foreskin is to be circumcised"
- Lev. 12:1-3

"²⁴One night while Moses was in camp, the LORD was about to kill him.
²⁵But Zipporah circumcised her son with a flint knife.
She touched his legs with the skin she had cut off and said, “My dear son, this blood will protect you.”
²⁶So the LORD did not harm Moses. Then Zipporah said, “Yes, my dear, you are safe because of this circumcision.”
- Exodus 4:24-27

The best and safest time to do this is the eighth day because on the eighth day, the amount of vitamin K and prothrombin present is elevated above 100% of normal and it is the only day in the males life in which under normal conditions, this will ever be the case.

So, in this case of circumcision surgery needing to be done, then day eight is the perfect day to have it done, simply because vitamin K and prothrombin are at their peak on that day and as vitamin K and prothrombin are vital to coagulation, that stops bleeding and paves way to healing faster. Apparently blood clotting mechanism does not function fully until the age of six months and is particularly weak in the first two to four days after birth.

Going back to answering the thread's titled question, well, the point of circumcision as commanded by (abrahamic) religion, is God letting Abraham realised that He owns Abraham's "little man" Abraham in cahoot with his wife, were trying to pull a fast one and helping God produce the promised heir. Seven times God had to keep reminding Abraham that He will give him a son through his wife Sarah, but Abraham still went into Hagar. Anyway long story, cut short, at age 99 years old, when Abraham had become impotent and/or infertile, God symbolically used circumcision to covenantally mark Abraham, and then miraculously make it possible for an impotent and/or infertile man and barren woman to produce a son, Isaac the promised child. Abraham's descendants, the Israelites, were commanded to repeat this practice as a memorial

According to the Bible, Abraham was the first man to circumcise his kid. But thank you for admitting the bible is fiction and isn't right about anything.

In the REAL world, Circumcision may date back to before the fiction book, bible was written. So I agree with you on that.


Provide a source for your elevated vitamin k blood level claims on the 8th day from a neutral source because I am well aware of the crooked and lying nature of christian apologists.


Lastly, would you agree with me that circumcision is a violation of the individual's bodily autonomy? If tribal marks on a baby are prohibited because there is no consent and permanently scars the kid, why should cutting the foreskin of the same baby be allowed?


Because a book written in the stone age says so?

Judybash93:
It's genital mutilation... There's no way around it

Right? Just a case of parents imposing their religious views on their kids in what would be child abuse!

Cutting up your child's genitals permanently because your religion says so. What if the child adopts a different religion or becomes irreligious altogether?

He remains scarred FOR LIFE because the parents imposed their bloodletting religious rituals on him.

Unfortunately, few theists use their brain to think.

Bacteriologist:
According to the Bible, Abraham was the first man to circumcise his kid. But thank you for admitting the bible is fiction and isn't right about anything.

Was the first man recorded to have been asked by God to circumcise et cetera. It must have being in your sleep that dreamt someone admitting the bible is fiction and isn't right about anything.

Bacteriologist:
In the REAL world, Circumcision may date back to before the fiction book, bible was written. So I agree with you on that.

Goody goody good then

Bacteriologist:
Provide a source for your elevated vitamin k blood level claims on the 8th day from a neutral source because I am well aware of the crooked and lying nature of christian apologists.

Science eventually caught up and copped on about this, lmso. Go research am nah, lmso

Bacteriologist:
Lastly, would you agree with me that circumcision is a violation of the individual's bodily autonomy? If tribal marks on a baby are prohibited because there is no consent and permanently scars the kid, why should cutting the foreskin of the same baby be allowed?

Because a book written in the stone age says so?

God made Abraham, so is sovereign over Abraham, possessing supreme or unrestricted power over him, implying He can do whatever He likes with Abraham's body.

Now my dear friend, when you have created something as little as a gnat, then maybe you can turn up here for a discussion and we have a jaw jaw basing on you too being a creator and/or maker of something from scratch with life, lmso

is it because you know you Must Fall into One of the Several Chasms of UnRightness Laid for Foolish people through me, that You Flee from Me? (Lie Here!)

Bacteriologist:

...would you agree with me that circumcision is a violation of the individual's bodily autonomy? If tribal marks on a baby are prohibited because there is no consent and permanently scars the kid, why should cutting the foreskin of the same baby be allowed?

Because a book written in the stone age says so?

Any Alteration, either by addition or subtraction is modification of the Natural Body.

When you speak of violation, then you speak of Law. And, if violation, then therefore whose Law is Violated?

Surely The Owner Of A Thing Violates No Law if He Exercises His Right To Modify His Thing, in the exercise of His Ownership!

Therefore, it is Not Possible For The Owner Of Man to breach any Law, because, it is own His Thing!

If it is a man made law, Kai, every man can make his own law too and it is my law to disobey the law created by another man, so Case Dismissed!

Perfect physical bodies must possess sexual organs Sir!

So it's either you agree with JWs that Jesus resurrected as a spirit or you agree that he must possess a dick!

Blabbermouth:

I am asking him why Jesus ought to resurrect with a dick.
How does that contradict anything?

By the way, we both know your position is not founded in the scripture. All you have are - we are part of the group Jesus kept on teaching, so listen to us, we are right.
Or, this doesn't make sense, this is what makes sense.

I will take Jesus' own words over anybody anyday anytime, twice on Sunday.

MaxInDHouse:

Perfect physical bodies must possess sexual organs Sir!

So it's either you agree with JWs that Jesus resurrected as a spirit or you agree that he must possess a dick!

Agree with JWs? Do JWs agree with Jesus? No! He literally said - Guys,
Jesus ressurected is flesh and bones, not a spirit. He even asked them - shey Spirits dey get flesh and bones, come and handle me na, I am flesh and I am bones.

Talking about Dick - I didn't tell you he didn't resurrect with one.
Neither did I tell you he resurrected with one.

If you are wise, you can go ahead with telling giving me a detailed scriptural anatomy of the first man before his fallen state
- Does he have blood?
- Does he excrete?
- Does he eat against hunger and thirst?
- Can he be injured or subjected to accidents

Goodluck.

How do you know JWs don't agree with Jesus?

Jesus himself said so many things on how to recognize his GROUP so that anywhere you find them you can easily know them. But if you don't think Jesus meant a specific group will surface then it means Christians can't unite as one big family where unbelievers will hate them globally! Matthew 10:22

As for the bolded, keep for those whom you're sure that they agreed with Jesus, i'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses and i can only tell you what all JWs globally believe, and since you think we don't agree with Jesus, it will be better you ask those that agreed with Jesus!

Blabbermouth:

Agree with JWs? Do JWs agree with Jesus? No! He literally said - Guys,
Jesus ressurected is flesh and bones, not a spirit. He even asked them - shey Spirits dey get flesh and bones, come and handle me na, I am flesh and I am bones.

Talking about Dick - I didn't tell you he didn't resurrect with one.
Neither did I tell you he resurrected with one.

If you are wise, you can go ahead with telling giving me a detailed scriptural anatomy of the first man before his fallen state
- Does he have blood?
- Does he excrete?
- Does he eat against hunger and thirst?
- Can he be injured or subjected to accidents

Goodluck.

MaxInDHouse:
How do you know JWs don't agree with Jesus?

Jesus: I'm not a spirit, I am flesh and bones
JW: No, you are a spirit.

Jesus himself said so many things on how to recognize his GROUP so that anywhere you find them you can easily know them. But if you don't think Jesus meant a specific group will surface then it means Christians can't unite as one big family where unbelievers will hate them globally! Matthew 10:22

That one big family will happen soon. Like I've stressed out many times, that big family will answer to only 1 king - Lord Jesus.

As for the bolded, keep for those whom you're sure that they agreed with Jesus, i'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses and i can only tell you what all JWs globally believe, and since you think we don't agree with Jesus, it will be better you ask those that agreed with Jesus!

No be fight na.
Jesus said - Guys, I no be spirit, I am confirm flesh and bones.

If Paul rises from the dead and says something contrary to this, I will ignore him!

If Peter rises from the dead and says something contrary to what he [Peter himself] confirmed, I will ignore him!

How much more a GROUP that claimed it was chosen by God in the 1900s?

That's me for you, Christ over anything, yea, even over me!

I still [really really] wish that JW were consistent with Christ concerning Hell. I speak as a man, annihilation is perfect to me.

But the WORD himself said - Confirmed lake of fire, Alive!
I will take his words over mine anyday anytime, thrice on Friday.

Whenever the highlighted suffice please! please!! please!!! I'm begging on my knees, don't hesitate to inform me because that's the only thing that can convince me that Jesus is not just a fictional character or fabrication of some people! John 17:20:23

But until then, i stand firmly with JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES, they're the one and only group that's making everything Jesus said in that book come to life! Matthew 5:13-16

Blabbermouth:

Jesus: I'm not a spirit, I am flesh and bones
JW: No, you are a spirit.

That one big family will happen soon. Like I've stressed out many times, that big family will answer to only 1 king - Lord Jesus.

No be fight na.
Jesus said - Guys, I no be spirit, I am confirm flesh and bones.

If Paul rises from the dead and says something contrary to this, I will ignore him!

If Peter rises from the dead and says something contrary to what he [Peter himself] confirmed, I will ignore him!

How much more a GROUP that claimed it was chosen by God in the 1900s?

That's me for you, Christ over anything, yea, even over me!

I still [really really] wish that JW were consistent with Christ concerning Hell. I speak as a man, annihilation is perfect to me.

But the WORD himself said - Confirmed lake of fire, Alive!
I will take his words over mine anyday anytime, thrice on Friday.

MaxInDHouse:
Whenever the highlighted suffice please! please!! please!!! I'm begging on my knees, don't hesitate to inform me because that's the only thing that can convince me that Jesus is not just a fictional character or fabrication of some people! John 17:20:23

You won't need anyone to say - Here, come and see the big family of Christ! Neither will you need anyone to lead you to their dwelling place.

The sun's rays lightens up anywhere it penetrates and no one is expected to alert anyone - the sun is rising!

Same is as this Assembly of the called out ones that I speak of.

But until then, i stand firmly with JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES, they're the one and only group that's making everything Jesus said in that book come to life! Matthew 5:13-16

Well, we might have our differences [I recently realized that they are many] in doctrines, but If you truly name the name of Christ, believe in Christ Jesus and his God, then go on with your worship, I will go on with mine. Till Christ gathers all that are His under one umbrella, I say - Goodluck!

Bacteriologist:


The afterthought was basically satire.
So would it follow that Christians believe Jesus's foreskin rose as well when he was resurrected?

Medically, circumcision slightly decreases the possibility of infection in MALES.

In females, however, it is completely dangerous and non-benficial.

The Bible doesn't recommend circumcision for females. Only for males. And to why remove what God sent with the new baby, are you also recommending that the umbilical cord be left on a new baby after birth without being cut?

MaxInDHouse:
Whenever the highlighted suffice please! please!! please!!! I'm begging on my knees, don't hesitate to inform me because that's the only thing that can convince me that Jesus is not just a fictional character or fabrication of some people! John 17:20:23
But until then, i stand firmly with JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES, they're the one and only group that's making everything Jesus said in that book come to life! Matthew 5:13-16

Ahh you haven't got the gist yet? What he's simply saying is that Jesus will one day come and force everybody inside one religion in the guise of “one big happy family”
So even though he knows there's no Biblical basis for that, he still keeps agitating over it

HedwigesMaduro:


The Bible doesn't recommend circumcision for females. Only for males. And to why remove what God sent with the new baby, are you also recommending that the umbilical cord be left on a new baby after birth without being cut?

There's a false equivalence there.

An umbilical cord will cut off by itself after about 3 days of birth. It's not meant to be a permanent body part.

The genital fore skin does not expire except being cut. It can last throughout life. You see, the two parts cannot be compared.

Also, the umbilical cord can pose a health risk (e.g jaundice) for the child if not cut early. The foreskin is harmless throughout the early stages of life and can only cause problems later in life (when the child can now make decisions for himself).

Only JWs are worshipers of my own God Sir!

Blabbermouth:

You won't need anyone to say - Here, come and see the big family of Christ! Neither will you need anyone to lead you to their dwelling place.

The sun's rays lightens up anywhere it penetrates and no one is expected to alert anyone - the sun is rising!

Same is as this Assembly of the called out ones that I speak of.

Well, we might have our differences [I recently realized that they are many] in doctrines, but If you truly name the name of Christ, believe in Christ Jesus and his God, then go on with your worship, I will go on with mine. Till Christ gathers all that are His under one umbrella, I say - Goodluck!

I understood him perfectly, one thing he doesn't understand is if Jesus is coming to force himself on everyone and drag them under one umbrella, then he need not warn against false prophets since he will drag all misinformed persons after himself!

DappaD:


Ahh you haven't got the gist yet? What he's simply saying is that Jesus will one day come and force everybody inside one religion in the guise of “one big happy family”
So even though he knows there's no Biblical basis for that, he still keeps agitating over it

Bacteriologist:


There's a false equivalence there.

An umbilical cord will cut off by itself after about 3 days of birth. It's not meant to be a permanent body part.

The genital fore skin does not expire except being cut. It can last throughout life. You see, the two parts cannot be compared.

Also, the umbilical cord can pose a health risk (e.g jaundice) for the child if not cut early. The foreskin is harmless throughout the early stages of life and can only cause problems later in life (when the child can now make decisions for himself).

Oooook. Have you ever cut your nails before? They grow naturally as programmed from birth. They don't need cutting either. Or your hair. I bet by now your claws should be like that of a werewolf.

HedwigesMaduro:


Oooook. Have you ever cut your nails before? They grow naturally as programmed from birth. They don't need cutting either. Or your hair. I bet by now your claws should be like that of a werewolf.

Nails don't "grow" naturally. What you see are dead cells being pushed out. Same with hair.

But it would be a huge task expecting a bible basher to understand the rudiments of basic biology.

Try harder with your ad hominems that expose how ignorant you really are.

Bacteriologist:


Nails don't "grow" naturally. What you see are dead cells being pushed out. Same with hair.

But it would be a huge task expecting a bible basher to understand the rudiments of basic biology.

Try harder with your ad hominems that expose how ignorant you really are.

Oh! Thanks a lot. I now know nails don't grow naturally. How about sharing with me the tricks you use in making your nails grow at your whim? I'm ready to learn new things.

Bible basher? Are you replying to the wrong person? Or probably you need to lay low on that white powder.