samuk:
[s]The sophistication of Ife spread all the way to Mali, yet the Europeans that were in Benin city less than 200 miles from Ife since the 1400s never heard or visited Ife till the 1800s. I don't know what Yoruba love most between party jollof rice and lies.[/s]

You are going circular now. After debunking your lies about J. E. G. Sutton’s identification of Ibn Battuta’s “Yufi”; you’ve now fled back to the beginning — that is, to hinterland vs coast.

This has been debunked countless times on this same thread. Can’t you cope with some pain by accepting where God has put you exactly how it is? Haha!

In other words, the farther the Europeans’ penetration into the hinterland of early West Africa, the greater their risk of malaria.

This is basic high school stuff, Saamu. You should do better than this.

I guess European explorers also didn't visit Ife because they were also afraid of being killed.

Oh I forgot, the Europeans were afraid of mosquitos, bacteria and the unfavourable climatic conditions of Ife according to Tao.

You raise a dumb point; you proceed to debunk it while pretending to be unaware; you then finally proceed to commit the ab absurdo logical fallacy in the hope of veiling your idiocy.

Your pain is felt. I’m sending you love and light during these tough times. In any case, suicide should never be an option. Hold tight to God.

TAO11:
You are going circular now.

This has been debunked countless times on this same thread. Can’t you cope with pain and accept fate for where God has put you — Benin. Hahaha!

In other words, the farther the Europeans’ penetration into the hinterland of early West Africa, the greater their risk of malaria.

This is basic high school stuff Saamu. You should do better than this.

Okay, I am sure nairalanders have all heard you that the reason Europeans didn't visit Yoruba hinterland until 1824 was because they were afraid of mosquitos.

samuk:
Okay, I am sure nairalanders have all heard you that the reason Europeans didn't visit Yoruba hinterland until 1824 was because they were afraid of mosquitos.

Absolutely!

Somehow within me, I kind of feel that you genuinely do not know that. Forget about your usual pretence of feigning unaware. LMAO!

Let me put this to you in question form:

(1) Did you know before now that the Europeans have a very low immunity against mosquito bites??

(2) Did you know before now that the deeper they penetrated into the West African hinterlands, the more their risk of malaria??

Did you know these before now? Please answer genuinely.

Yes, I know “genuine” is too much to ask from a Bini. I’m only taking the risk.

TAO11:
Except that the earliest European visitors to Benin actually documented nothing about the following names as well: EwekaI, Ewuare I, Ezoti, Olua, Ozolua, Esigie, Ewedo, Oguola, and several more.

You have been debunked on this severally. You’re only testing the waters against those who may have missed your disgrace while it was ongoing live.

Ife, just as the other central Yorubaland area, is deeper in the interior of the West African forest than Benin which is closer to the coast.

As such, it is easier to be back at the coast from Benin under a day’s journey than from the interior which is an haven of mosquitoes against which the Europeans have low immunity.

Moreover, you may also find this additional information interesting. It is specifically on Ife, and it was collected by Ibn Battuta a 100 years before EUrOpEaN arrival. It was popularized in Europe from the 1300s.
www.nairaland.com/attachments/12912433_6a1b73d4b800414d88c53f016bd6c341_jpeg_jpeg97a6e137566f4d251f5cf2697716dde5 .

You have already been debunked on all these severally. Stop hoping to find a new victim to prey on.

Benin had no connection with Lagos at the time of the Europeans’ first visit to Lagos before they then visited Benin.

Moreover, Lagos was never at any time in its history under Benin as you’ve implied here as a conqueror-subject relationship.

Rather, the only noticeable relationship between Lagos and Benin was that which continued from Ashipa’s relationship with the then Oba of Benin — a patron-protege pact.

See the embedded image below for the details of this Lagos account as extracted from page 43 of Sir Alan Burns’ “History of Nigeria” published in 1929 — decades before Egharevba made his strange claims of conquest in his 1953 edition.
www.nairaland.com/attachments/12912408_584e15528bdf45c8aef7a4f70fd52548_jpeg_jpeg40c6fb0373e31cbaad272efbb8fbca0a

You mean we must assume that the absence of the names of Eweka I, Ewuare I, Ezoti, Oguola, Ozolua, Olua, et al. from the earliest records of the Europeans is proof that the EUrOpEaN visitors heard nothing about these Benin heroes and founding fathers ?? LMAO!

Moreover, I am not assuming that your claim about Benin/Ida and EUrOpEaN so-called mercenaries is a correct information though.

Well, if the meaning of “history” is merely “literature“, then you may be correct to say that Ife, Ewuare I, Eweka I, Ozolua, Esigie, et al. weren’t named in Benin history until in the 1800s.

But if “history” really means what it means — that is, if it really comprises of all historical evidence from archaeology, literature, maps, vast received accounts; then Ife has always been the origin of the Benin monarchy as I have demonstrated with archaeological evidence multiple times. See one of the links above.

Ironically, this is precisely why everyone who is not a Bini like you thinks you are a blatant liar.

Name me one non-Benin from your so-called most-people who thinks your lies are actually truths. None! That’s my handiwork. I exposed you.

Just as Ewuare I, Eweka I, Ozolua, Esigie, et al. all have no eyewitness proof despite the fact that the Europeans reached Benin at a time when most of these men are supposed to be ruling Benin. LMAO!

But, like I said, if “history” really means what it means — that is, if it really comprises of all historical evidence from archaeology, literature, maps, vast received accounts; then Ife has always been the origin of the Benin monarchy as I have demonstrated with archaeological evidence multiple times. See one of the links above.

You mean just as many Benin writers have grappled and contradicted themselves on the origin of the Benin people —contradicting one another from Egypt, to Sudan, to Sky, to Europe, to Ife, etc. ?? Is this what you have in mind here?

Moreover, unlike in the case of the Yorubas; there is only one account of Oduduwa’s origin which emanates originally from the Yorubas themselves.

And that is the indigenous account which states that Oduduwa is a Yoruba man from Ife. There are no earlier contrary historical accounts to this which emanates from the Yorubas themselves.

And no one (including historians) ever took the Binis seriously on this fraudulent claim.

Historians note that this Benin claim is a very recent one. The historians added that the received traditions from Benin prior to this new false claim states in categorical terms that Oduduwa a Yoruba king of Ife is the grandfather of the Benin monarchy.

Historians thus conclude that the recent twisted false claim which the Binis came up with in the 1970s is nothing but an interesting nonsense borne out of inferiority complex.

You mean just as the Binis say their first Ogiso sky-dived from the heaven into Benin city round about??

Or just as as Classical Europe said Alexander the Great has two horns and he is the son of Zeus-Ammon??

In other words, these are mythological narratives drummed up to glamorize and deify a heroic figure.

No Yoruba ever originated a Meccan (or Middle Eastern) account. I have long debunked you to silence on this.

Your style is to run-off from one beating only to repeat the same lie elsewhere in the hope finding a new victim who missed out on your disgrace the first time.

This is the only account which originates ab-initio from the Ife and Yorubas themselves.

Name me one earlier account of Yoruba origination which contradicts it.

The only myth here that people are now avoiding like a plague is samuk and his fatuous lies.

And I will continue debunking you up to the point when you will type a comment and every single non-Benin Nairalnder will simply hiss as their reply.

Except that they have always been in agreement.

And except that what the Benin palace holds as the “official” account is not what you read on blogs and hear them put to the non-academic public.

Except that there is today among historians of African and Yoruba history.

This is the very pep-talk you deserve every morning and night.

Do yourself the good of reading this to yourself day and night in order that your delusions may be curtailed if not completely obliterated.

Substitute the word “Binis” for “Yoruba” here, then read this to yourself day and night everyday and notice the positive impact in your life in a week’s time.

Just as my refutation of your lies are to enable the whole wide world continue to see you for who they’ve been seeing you as — an insecure unrepentant fraud ??

The Europeans (your gods) may have visited different parts of the vast Yorubaland at different periods of history for safety reasons.

What is heartbreaking to you, which is very key, is that your gods (the Europeans) first visited Yorubaland before they were literally begged by the Benin king to visit their land too.

Cc: Obalufon, Ideadoctor, sesan85, babtoundey, Balogunodua

Ife never had anything to do with Benin because His Europeans authors who are the most dependable sources of his history did not record it. Then, all these men Eweka I, Ewuare I, Ezoti, Oguola, Ozolua, Olua, et al never, at any point in time, existed in Benin history because the same Europeans were silent about them and unaware of their existence. You just murdered him with his own permutations and fabrications.

And Yufi is now Zimbabwe... I have been laughing hard about this. Saamu, why Zimbabwe again? You have moved from Nupe to Birnin-Kebbi to Igala. Now you are arriving at Zimbabwe. With the rate you are going, you will soon land in Russia, Iraq and Iran. Do you have to shamelessly dislodge Benin ascendance from Ife with such ridiculous assertion! Everything is there for you to see in the shared slang, religion,deities and traditions. Your people gladly bear Yoruba names, worship Yoruba Gods, embrace Yoruba traditional norms and deify Yoruba heroes (one of whom is Oranmiyan). You ignored all these and went to align with Zimbabwe, Russia, Nupe, Birnin-Kebbi, Japan and Russia who don't share any other thing with you other than being human.

Tao, keep killing him and his allies. They sure cannot survive it. I can see Samuk foaming in the mouth already while Gregboy and his duplicated moniker have disappeared and gone with the wind

babtoundey:
Ife never had anything to do with Benin because His Europeans authors who are the most dependable sources of his history did not record it. Then, all these men Eweka I, Ewuare I, Ezoti, Oguola, Ozolua, Olua, et al never, at any point in time, existed in Benin history because the same Europeans were silent about them and unaware of their existence. You just murdered him with his own permutations and fabrications.

And Yufi is now Zimbabwe... I have been laughing hard about this. Saamu, why Zimbabwe again? You have moved from Nupe to Birnin-Kebbi to Igala. Now you are arriving at Zimbabwe. With the rate you are going, you will soon land in Russia, Iraq and Iran. Do you have to shamelessly dislodge Benin ascendance from Ife with such ridiculous assertion! Everything is there for you to see in the shared slang, religion,deities and traditions. Your people gladly bear Yoruba names, worship Yoruba Gods, embrace Yoruba traditional norms and deify Yoruba heroes (one of whom is Oranmiyan). You ignored all these and went to align with Zimbabwe, Russia, Nupe, Birnin-Kebbi, Japan and Russia who don't share any other thing with you other than being human.

Tao, keep killing him and his allies. They sure cannot survive it. I can see Samuk foaming in the mouth already while Gregboy and his duplicated moniker have disappeared and gone with the wind

The thing is they are quite certain that their lies will get them somewhere.

TAO11:
The thing is they are quite certain that their lies will get them somewhere.

It is getting them nowhere than the cesspool of shame and disgrace. Uncle Samuk has been saying/typing/ conceiving dobodobo since.

babtoundey:
It is getting them nowhere than the cesspool of shame and disgrace. Uncle Samuk has been saying/typing/ conceiving dobodobo since.

Mean!

gregyboy:


Balogunodua
Sesan85

Why is your Oba called "Ikeji Orisha," "Ovbi Adimula" (son of Adimula) and "Abieyuwa N'ovbi Odua N'uhe (The son of the wealthy Odua of Ife)?

samuk:


It's not only Abieyuwa, it's Abieyefe.

This colossal slowpoke doesn't even know the praise names of his own Oba, smh. And this is the incorrigible dimwit TAO11 has been wasting intellectual energy on?

sesan85:
This colossal slowpoke doesn't even know the praise names of his own Oba, smh. And this is the incorrigible dimwit TAO11 has been wasting intellectual energy on?

Lol!

TAO11:
LMAO! All I see in this comment are pains, tears, and disappointments.

Yeah, I may feel terrible too if I was in your shoes — realizing that my kingdom (about which I’ve been fed many lies since childhood) was unnoticed for Ife in the 1300s.

Folks, let’s find out how fast @samuk will disown that same material from where he shared his screenshots.

The same screenshots about which he clearly understands not a thing as would be demonstrated now.

I am not sure when Benin history was stolen. All I am sure of instead is that a EUrOpEaN visitor to Benin and Yorubaland in the pre-1897 days stated that Benin was inconsiderable as a town when compared with Yoruba towns — and he mentioned some minor Yoruba towns to that end. How is this my fault?

Having said that, if you were someone who reads, then you would have long realized that the Summaries and Conclusions are the culmination of a series of argument.

In the light of that, the same scholar, whose material you screenshoted actually concluded in the same material as shown in the summary below on the final page just before his end notes.

Reference: J. E. G. Sutton, “Ibn Battuta’s Yufi — Bronze and Gold In Mid-Iron Age Africa,” Transafrican Journal of History, Vol. 10, No. 1/2 (1981), p. 160.

Now, let the u-turn begin!

Cc: Obalufon, Balogunodua, babtoundey, Ideadoctor, Sesan85,

Lolzzz... you just killed him with this....

What do expect from a slowpoke like samuk and his fellow miscreants...they always screenshot a particular page that suit their propaganda..

Balogunodua:

Lolzzz... you just killed him with this....

What do expect from a slowpoke like samuk and his fellow miscreants...they always screenshot a particular page that suit their propaganda..

Haha!

Even the pages he refers to do not support his lies. I could have disgraced him from his own pages but I chose to go straight to the culmination of the author’s work (i.e. the summary) after which there was no further analysis from the author.

The author clearly showed (both on his pages and the summary) that Ibn Battuta’s notes indicate that he was referring to two different places — one in South-Eastern Africa; and the popular one being Ife in Western Africa.

Let me attach the summary page here again to keep him reminded as he his fond of pretending to be amnesiac for every new Nairaland page that comes up.

His pains, sorrows, disappointments, and frustrations are understandable. His kingdom could not be noticed at a time when Ife was already making waves in the world.

TAO11:
Haha!

Even the pages he refers to do not support his lies. I could have disgraced him from his own pages but I chose to go straight to the culmination of the author’s work (i.e. the summary) after which there was no further analysis from the author.

The author clearly showed (both on his pages and the summary) that Ibn Battuta’s notes indicate that he was referring to two different places — one in Southern-Eastern Africa; and the popular one being Ife in Western Africa.

Let me attach the summary page here again to keep him reminded as he his fond of pretending to be amnesiac for each new page that comes up.

His pains, sorrows, disappointments, and frustrations are understandable. His kingdom could was nothing to write home about at a time when Ife was already making waves in the world.

I have read his so called screenshot and it does not say Yufi was not Ufe (Ife) that is located in West Africa, it only say ls the other Yufi in Kilwa Ibn Battuta is talking about is located in Zimbabwe. If I'm not mistaking...

Balogunodua:
I have read his so called screenshot and it does not say Yufi was not Ufe (Ife) that is located in West Africa, it only say ls the other Yufi in Kilwa Ibn Battuta is talking about is located in Zimbabwe. If I'm not mistaking...

Absolutely!

J. E. G. Sutton simply states that Ibn Battuta himself (or his secretary) overused the name of “Ife” when referring to two different major black Africa kingdoms who were, at the time, already in trade contact with the wider world.

And he identified these two black African kingdoms from Ibn Battuta’s notes as:

(1) Ife itself in west Africa — reaching the wider world via Mali/the Saharan caravan.

(2) Zimbabwe in south-east Africa — reaching the wider world via Kilwa/the Indian Ocean.

During this period, bEnIn kInGdOm was, as expected, no where to be found — much less noticed from Mali.

————————
PS: The attachment below (from page 148 of the same article) illustrates these early international routes more clearly with my red highlights.

NB: The phrase “Places Mentioned” in this attachment does not refer to places mentioned by Ibn Battuta.

Rather, the phrase refers to places mentioned by Sutton in this article wherein he discusses Ibn Battuta’s notes.

Only some of these places were mentioned by name in Ibn Battuta’s notes — e.g. Mali, Ife, etc.

Balogunodua:

I have read his so called screenshot and it does not say Yufi was not Ufe (Ife) that is located in West Africa, it only say ls the other Yufi in Kilwa Ibn Battuta is talking about is located in Zimbabwe. If I'm not mistaking...

Are you guys this dull, did Ife had any Yemeni connection or gold dust? Did you read the article at all or Tao lies has eaten so deep into your brains that you can no longer comprehend what you read?

Ibn Bittuta never mentioned Ife by name. Your later day revisionist are the ones inferring Ife to be Yufi.

If Ife had gold, the Europeans would have known about it and be there.

Stop promoting fictitious Ife, Ife was a little unknown villages. The Ooni is still struggling to get proper recognition by the Oba of Lagos, Awujale of Ijebu and Olugbo.

sesan85:


Why is your Oba called "Ikeji Orisha," "Ovbi Adimula" (son of Adimula) and "[s]Abieyuwa N'ovbi Odua N'uhe (The son of the wealthy Odua of Ife)[/s]?

Okiji Orisha was never his praise title neither does any benin understand it,

Adimula is not a Yoruba name the last time i checked

Abieyuwa n ovbi uhe, is a receipt titled added his title to promote the bini ife myth, it was never an ancient title but rather a 2020 title, which we know was included for cultural supiority issh


Just get it at the back if your mind benin-ife was a made up shit by the binis and yoruba after the creation of nigeria to unite edo ad a Yoruba tribe they needed a common history such as oduduwa

sesan85:
This colossal slowpoke doesn't even know the praise names of his own Oba, smh. And this is the incorrigible dimwit TAO11 has been wasting intellectual energy on?

You demonstrate the hallmarks of an illiterate. Are you not aware that Benin oral tradition says Oduduwa was a Benin prince?

My argument is there is nothing in either Benin or Yoruba history that supports Benin/Ife relationship earlier than 1800s.

Tao is still looking for evidence to prove me wrong. Until then, you guys can continue to fool yourselves with fabrications.

samuk:
[s]Are you guys this dull, did Ife had any Yemeni connection or gold dust? Did you read the article at all or Tao lies has eaten so deep into your brains that you can no longer comprehend what you read?

Ibn Bittuta never mentioned Ife by name. Your later day revisionist are the ones inferring Ife to be Yufi.

If Ife had gold, the Europeans would have known about it and be there.[/s]

I’m still here @samuk. Moreover, it’s past 1:00 AM Nigerian time. Is there anything serious keeping you awake?? LMAO!

Anyways, Ife does have gold dust (aka alluvial gold) as well as trade connection through the Sahara with the wider Middle-East according to your own very article which you obviously fail to read.

All you have to do is read. Yes, I know the word “read” scares the soul out of you.

Moreover, Ife was mentioned by name by Ibn Battuta. He transcribed the local name “Ufe” [aka “Ife”] in Arabic rendition as “Yufi”.

Exactly the same way the early Portuguese transcribed the local name “Ubini” [aka “Ibini”] as “Beny”.

The only difference being that the Yorubas wouldn’t abandon their own pronunciation for a foreigner’s rendition.

The Binis did exactly that. The Binis’ inferiority complex has clearly been around for some time. I learnt that your daddies call the Europeans “children of Gods”. Lol!

I also learnt from Captain Crows memoirs of 1791 that whenever “they [the Binis] meet an EUrOpEaN they fall down on the right knee, clap their hands three times and exclaim ‘We reverence you!’“. ROTFLMAO!

Having said that, refer to the attachment below from (your own source) for a gentle reminder of how your own source, Sutton, wraps up and summarizes.
www.nairaland.com/attachments/12917193_76c3e1e30741408794757b4e3c9229ae_jpeg_jpeg2e80fe98bff4db63b4a25e0a3490b446

Ibn Battuta, in addition to writing about Ife in west Africa (now I’m wondering if Zimbabwe is in West Africa), also [over]used Ife’s name for an entirely different polity down south.

[s]Stop promoting fictitious Ife, Ife was a little unknown villages. The Ooni is still struggling to get proper recognition by the Oba of Lagos, Awujale of Ijebu and Olugbo[/s]

You mean fictitious bEnIn kIngDoM that wasn’t even worth considering by Ibn Battuta in the 1300s??

You mean how the Oba of Benin struggles till date to get any recognition from the Ogiame family which is based right inside Benin city.

In sum, it’s modern time and everyone has the liberty to associate and dis-associate from whomsoever they please.

What remains unchanging, however, is that the actual line from which the Olugbo claim to have originally descended (the Obatala line) accepts the supremacy of the Ooni till date.

Moreover, the progenitor of the present ruling dynasty of Lagos Island (i.e. Ashipa) is recognized in the Lagos traditions as an Isheri chief of Ife royal descent through Olofin Ogunfunminire.

Finally, the present Awujale’s ancestor remains frozen in both picture and writing till date where he consented to being one of the princes that went out originally from Ife.

These are the facts that matter. Not the modern-day superficial permutations and combinations.

Cc: Balogunodua, Sesan85

samuk:
[s]You demonstrate the hallmarks of an illiterate. Are you not aware that Benin oral tradition says Oduduwa was a Benin prince?[/s]

Sharrap liar!

Benin’s extant oral traditions actually says nothing of such rubbish.

Prior to the 1970s, Benin traditions maintain simply that Oduduwa, an Ife king from the Yoruba country, is the grandfather of the Benin monarchy.

It took some random Bini men a lot of inferiority complex in the 1970s to come up with the strange fabrication which historians have at once rejected as an interesting nonsense.

In fact, what is interesting is that this 1970s fabrication is not the “official” tradition of the Benin palace which it avails the academic community.

[s]My argument is there is nothing in either Benin or Yoruba history that supports Benin/Ife relationship earlier than 1800s.[/s]

This has been established from both textual and archaeological evidence multiple times all over Nairaland including on this very thread.

[s]Tao is still looking for evidence to prove me wrong. Until then, you guys can continue to fool yourselves with fabrications.[/s]

You may continue your life in denial like I have adviced you — but providing it is effective in helping you cope with the sad reality (for you) of the ancient pre-1400 Ife-Benin connection.

Cc: sesan85

@sasan85, did you notice where “my rag” remarked that the praise poetries of the Benin king which link him to Ife as an Ife child were recently added in 2020 for the purpose of propping up Benin culture and elevating Benin kingdom.

That’s actually a very interesting confession to make as may be seen in the embedded screenshot below.
www.nairaland.com/attachments/12917281_45d7124c0d6645f69946e79346971b0e_jpeg_jpeg60cba7f56748c2bb6209048e8aad3df0

Moreover, “Adimula” is a pure Yoruba word with no meaning at all in Bini language.

But if you must insist otherwise, then here is the challenge for you, my rag:

What does “Adimula” mean in Bini language? Show us an analysis of its syllabic components just as I would be doing with the Yoruba ‘parallel’ below:

“Adimula” = “He/that [whom/which is] held on to, [to] save [one]”

“A” = Refers to the pronoun: “he” or “that”.

“Dìmú” = To “hold on to” sth.

“Là” = To be saved.

I should also add that Benin kings’ praise poetry is not actually “Adimula” itself.

Rather, the praise poetry of the kings of Benin is “Ovbi’ Adimula” meaning: “Child of the Adimula”.

“Adimula” itself is a praise poetry of Ife kings till date.

samuk:



The sophistication of Ife spread all the way to Mali, yet the Europeans that were in Benin city less than 200 miles from Ife since the 1400s never heard or visited Ife till the 1800s. I don't know what Yoruba love most between party jollof rice and lies.

I guess European explorers also didn't visit Ife because they were also afraid of being killed.

Oh I forgot, the Europeans were afraid of mosquitos, bacteria and the unfavourable climatic conditions of Ife according to Tao.

Portuguese get to know about the Benins from the Itshekiri .. Think of the distance to Ile -ife Samuk..Benin was nearer to warri,, lot of water channels from warri to Benin which ease the rigor of travelling through unknown route ..Go and read Portuguese account about ile-ife ..Portuguese get to know about ile-ife from the Benin Royals...

samuk:


Are you guys this dull, did Ife had any Yemeni connection or gold dust? Did you read the article at all or Tao lies has eaten so deep into your brains that you can no longer comprehend what you read?

Ibn Bittuta never mentioned Ife by name. Your later day revisionist are the ones inferring Ife to be Yufi.

If Ife had gold, the Europeans would have known about it and be there.

Stop promoting fictitious Ife, Ife was a little unknown villages. The Ooni is still struggling to get proper recognition by the Oba of Lagos, Awujale of Ijebu and Olugbo.

Samuk why are you so daft and stupid.... You didn't even read and understand what you posted..is Yemini or Zimbabwe in West Africa? Your lies have blind to the point of confusion...

TAO11:
I’m still here @samuk. Moreover, it’s past 1:00 AM Nigerian time. Is there anything serious keeping you awake?? LMAO!

Anyways, Ife does have gold dust (aka alluvial gold) as well as trade connection through the Sahara to with the wider Middle-East according to your own very article which you obviously fail to read.

All you have to do is read. Yes, I know the word “read” scares the soul out of you.

Moreover, Ife was mentioned by name by Ibn Battuta. He transcribed the local name “Ufe” [aka “Ife”] in Arabic rendition as “Yufi”.

Exactly the same way the early Portuguese transcribed the local name “Ubini” [aka “Ibini”] as “Beny”.

The only difference being that the Yorubas wouldn’t abandon their own pronunciation for a foreigner’s rendition.

The Binis did exactly that. The Binis’ inferiority complex has clearly been around for some time. I learnt that your daddies call the Europeans “children of Gods”. Lol!

I also learnt from Captain Crows memoirs of 1791 that whenever “they [the Binis] meet an EUrOpEaN they fall down on the right knee, clap their hands three times and exclaim ‘We reverence you!’“. ROTFLMAO!

Having said that, see the attachment below from your own source for a gentle reminder of where your authority, Sutton, wraps up and summarizes that:

Ibn Battuta, in addition to writing about Ife in west Africa (now I’m wondering if Zimbabwe is in West Africa), also used Ife’s name for an entirely different polity down south.

You mean fictitious bEnIn kIngDoM that wasn’t even worth considering as by Ibn Battuta in the 1300s??

You mean how the Oba of Benin struggles till date to get any recognition from the Ogiame family which is based right inside Benin city.

In sum, it’s modern time and everyone has the liberty to associate and dis-associate from whomsoever they please.

What remains unchanging, however, is that the actual line from which the Olugbo claim to have originally descended (the Obatala line) accepts the supremacy of the Ooni till date.

Moreover, the progenitor of the present ruling dynasty of Lagos Island (i.e. Ashipa) is recognized in the Lagos traditions as an Isheri chief of Ife royal descent through Olofin Ogunfunminire.

Finally, the present Awujale’s ancestor remains frozen in both picture and writing till date where he consented to being one of the princes that went out originally from Ife.

These are the facts that matter. Not the modern-day superficial permutations and combinations.

Cc: Balogunodua, Sesan85

I don't know why this Edo peeps are so daft...they are ready to swallow anything their European master tells them when it suits their agenda...but when it doesn't they claim same Europeans are lying....

[s]

Balogunodua:

I don't know why this Edo peeps are so daft...they are ready to swallow anything their European master tells them when it suits their agenda...but when it doesn't they claim same Europeans are lying....

[/s]

[s]

Balogunodua:

Samuk why are you so daft and stupid.... You didn't even read and understand what you posted..is Yemini or Zimbabwe in West Africa? Your lies have blind to the point of confusion...

[/s]

[s]

Balogunodua:

Lolzzz... you just killed him with this....

What do expect from a slowpoke like samuk and his fellow miscreants...they always screenshot a particular page that suit their propaganda..

[/s]

TAO11:
@sasan85, did you notice where “my rag” remarked that the praise poetries of the Benin king which link him to Ife as an Ife child were recently added in 2020 for the purpose of propping up Benin culture and elevating Benin kingdom.

That’s actually a very interesting confession to make as may be seen in the embedded screenshot below.
www.nairaland.com/attachments/12917281_45d7124c0d6645f69946e79346971b0e_jpeg_jpeg60cba7f56748c2bb6209048e8aad3df0

Moreover, “Adimula” is a pure Yoruba word with no meaning at all in Bini language .

But if you must insist otherwise, then here is the challenge for you, my rag:

Tell us what this word means in Bini language by analyzing its components as I would demonstrate the Yoruba ‘parallel’ below:

“Adimula” = “He/that [whom/which is] held on to, [to] save [one]”

“A” = Refers to the pronoun: “he” or “that”.

“Dìmú” = To “hold on to” sth.

“Là” = To be saved.

I should also add that Benin kings’ praise poetry is not “Adimula” — rather it is “Ovbi’ Adimula” meaning “Child of the Adimula”.

“Adimula” itself is a praise poetry of Ife kings till date.

He will come back and tell you Adimula means Prince of Prince....

samuk:


You demonstrate the hallmarks of an illiterate. Are you not aware that Benin oral tradition says Oduduwa was a Benin prince?

My argument is there is nothing in either Benin or Yoruba history that supports Benin/Ife relationship earlier than 1800s.

Tao is still looking for evidence to prove me wrong. Until then, you guys can continue to fool yourselves with fabrications.

Dear annoying, stubborn, incorrigible midwit, your ill-educated "fictional Ife" cockamamie has been debunked by even your own Bini ancestors who call your Ife descended Oba "Abieyuwa N'ovbi Odua N'uhe" (The son of the wealthy Odua of Ife), appellations your dumb ass wasn't even aware of.
Secondly, can you show me any reputable "oral tradition" of Benin (whether local or foreign) which claims Oduduwa Olofin Adimula was some spurious Ekala-whatever, or Izoduwa, or Imadoduwa from Benin predating Erediauwa's 1970s-80s revisionist and ahistorical dross?

How come in the praise names of your Oba, Oduduwa's other name "Adimula" gets a mention (your Oba is also called "ovbi' Adimula" - son of Adimula), but no presence of Ekala-whatever? Again, how come there's an Ugie Odudua (a Bini festival in honour of Oduduwa) and no Ugie Ekala-whatever? Could it be that your Bini ancestors weren't aware that Oduduwa was Ekala-whatever? Unlike TAO11, I don't believe in showing civility to irredeemable knuckleheads who pompously disseminate ignorance and don't care about facts hence I avoid "debating" with colossal clowns like you. You call Ife "fictional Ife" but your own Bini ancestors venerate the same "fictional Ife"? The irony.

sesan85:


Dear annoying, stubborn, incorrigible midwit, your ill-educated "fictional Ife" cockamamie has been debunked by even your own Bini ancestors who call your Ife descended Oba "Abieyuwa N'ovbi Odua N'uhe" (The son of the wealthy Odua of Ife), appellations your dumb ass wasn't even aware of.
Secondly, can you show me any reputable "oral tradition" of Benin (whether local or foreign) which claims Oduduwa Olofin Adimula was some spurious Ekala-whatever, or Izoduwa, or Imadoduwa from Benin predating Erediauwa's 1970s-80s revisionist and ahistorical dross?

How come in the praise names of your Oba, Oduduwa's other name "Adimula" gets a mention (your Oba is also called "ovbi' Adimula" - son of Adimula), but no presence of Ekala-whatever? Again, how come there's an Ugie Odudua (a Bini festival in honour of Oduduwa) and no Ugie Ekala-whatever? Could it be that your Bini ancestors weren't aware that Oduduwa was Ekala-whatever? Unlike TAO11, I don't believe in showing civility to irredeemable knuckleheads who pompously disseminate ignorance and don't care about facts hence I avoid "debating" with colossal clowns like you. You call Ife "fictional Ife" but your own Bini ancestors venerate the same "fictional Ife"? The irony.

An illiterate masks every word with insults to divert attention, this is the practice here on nairaland by the average Yoruba, this can only intimidate someone who have nothing to say. I just zigzag through your insults and see nothing tangible and sensible in your comments as usual.

Someone with sound education and with superior knowledge and information always relishes the opportunity to school the less informed or ignorant. The reason I am always reluctant to reply Yoruba insults most of the time is because, it distracts from the knowledge and education I am passing into your block heads.

Insults doesn't win you an argument and it doesn't distract me from bursting your lies.

In Benin oral tradition, the Benin prince Ekaladerhan assumed the name Izoduwa (I have chosen the part of wealth) which the Yoruba corrupted to Oduduwa. He chose this name because of the circumstances surrounding his escape from Benin to Ife, beside, it's customary for every Benin prince to choose a new name on assumption or when they become an Oba. Benin oral history says Ekaladerhan became oba with the new name Izoduwa AKA Oduduwa in Ife

Enough of the Oral history above because it's nothing but a fantastic myths to the average Benin person. Like every society, Benin also have her myths and this is one of them. Benin rather dwells on real history because Benin is full of history. Yoruba don't have history, so they relish myths and they try to present their myths as history to the less informed.

Even the Yoruba can't prove that Oduduwa wasn't a myth that came into Benin oral history in the 1800s. The reason the Yoruba is fixated with the Benin/Ife connection is without it Yoruba history is nothing.

Yoruba history that started in 1824 when the Europeans first visited Oyo needs Benin history desperately to backdate their history to the 1100s through the fabricated Benin/Ife relationship.

This was a grand conspiracy against the Igbos because it gives the Yoruba history an illegitimate legitimacy above Igbo history.

Yoruba people as we know them today began in 1808 through the amalgamation of freed and returnee slaves with the negro of south western Nigeria.

Sesan85 did you notice that I hardly have any room for insults during the course of this lecture? It's so because I have something to say and a superior knowledge and information than you.

The irrefutable facts.

1. As already stated, modern Yoruba was created in 1808 from descendants of freed slaves from all over Africa and south west Nigeria people.

2. Some of you here are parroting Ife as your new homes because you no longer know where you originally descended from in African because of the circumstance in which your ancestors found themselves in Nigeria amongst the south western people of Nigeria.

3. Most original people or owners of south western Nigeria don't subscribe to Ife or Ooni supremacy, this is still evidence today. After almost 100 years of the political creation of Ife as the cradle of Yoruba nation, the Ooni and Ife is still struggling to gain any recognition from the Oba of Lagos, Awujale of Ijebu, Olugbo, etc, the superiority of the last Ooni was never recognised by the Alaafin.

4. If Ife was genuinely the cradle of Yoruba civilisation and not a concocted and fabricated lie, there wouldn't have been supremacy tussle amongst south west monarchs.

5. The supremacy of the Benin monarch is not being questioned by any monarchy in the entire south south Nigeria because Benin is real while Ife is a fake political imitation.

6. All Oba of Lagos from present to previous sees the Oba of Benin as their royal father not the Ooni. They see themselves as Benin descendants not Ife.

7. You will hardly see real Ife here on nairaland debating what they know to be lies. Only the wannabe without historical roots are here parroting Ife fabrications and lies.

8. Yoruba can only try to sell theirs lies to those that don't know or have history. Benin itself is history others study and the average Benin person is very much at home with history and can't be intimidated and cowed by insults from nitwits without historical roots.

samuk:


An illiterate masks every word with insults to divert attention, this is the practice here on nairaland by the average Yoruba, this can only intimidate someone who have nothing to say. I just zigzag through your insults and see nothing tangible and sensible in your comments as usual.

Someone with sound education and with superior knowledge and information always relishes the opportunity to school the less informed or ignorance. The reason I am always reluctant to reply Yoruba insults most of the time is because, it distracts from the knowledge and education I am passing into your block heads.

Insults doesn't win you an argument and it doesn't distract me from bursting your lies.

In Benin oral tradition, the Benin prince Ekaladerhan assumed the name Izoduwa (I have chosen the part of wealth) which the Yoruba corrupted to Oduduwa. He chose this name because of the circumstances surrounding his escape from Benin to Ife, beside, it's customary for every Benin prince to choose a new name on assumption or when they become an Oba. Benin oral history says Ekaladerhan became oba with the new name Izoduwa AKA Oduduwa in Ife

Enough of the Oral history above because it's nothing but a fantastic myths to the average Benin person. Like every society, Benin also have her myths and this is one of them. Benin rather due on real history because Benin is full of history. Yoruba don't have history, so they relish myths and they try to present their myths as history to the less informed.

Even the Yoruba can't prove that Oduduwa wasn't a myth that came into Benin oral history in the 1800s. The reason the Yoruba is fixated with the Benin/Ife connection is without it Yoruba history is nothing.

Yoruba history that started in 1824 when the Europeans first visited Oyo needs Benin history desperately to backdate their history to the 1100s through the fabricated Benin/Ife relationship.

Yoruba people as we know them today began in 1808 through the amalgamation of freed and returnee slaves with the negro of south western Nigeria.

Sesan85 did you notice that I hardly have any room for insults during the course of this lecture? It's so because I have something to say and a superior knowledge and information than you.

The irrefutable facts.

1. As already stated, modern Yoruba was created in 1808 from descendants of freed slaves from all over Africa and south west Nigeria people.

2. Some of you here are parroting Ife as you new homes because you no longer know where you originally descended from in African because of the circumstance in which your ancestors found themselves in Nigeria amongst the south western people of Nigeria.

3. Most original people or owners of south western Nigeria don't subscribe to Ife or Ooni supremacy, this is still evidence today. After almost 100 years of creating Ife as the cradle of Yoruba nation, the Ooni and Ife is still struggling to gain any recognition from the Oba of Lagos, Awujale of Ijebu, Olugbo, the last Ooni was never recognised by the Alaafin etc.

4. If Ife was genuinely the cradle of Yoruba civilisation and not a concocted and fabricated lie, there wouldn't have been supremacy tussle amongst south west monarchs.

5. The supremacy of the Benin monarch is not being questioned by any monarchy in the entire south south Nigeria because Benin is real while Ife is a fake imitation.

6. All Oba of Lagos from present to previous sees the Oba of Benin as their royal father not the Ooni. They see themselves as Benin descendants not Ife.

7. Yoruba can only try and sell theirs lies to those that don't know or have history. Benin itself is history others study and the average Benin person is very much at home with history and can't be early intimidated and cowed by insults from nitwits without historical roots.

Are you for real ?

Obalufon:
Are you for real ?

Point to the part you disagree with for me to provide you with evidence.

One Day we go go the Oba palace to hear what he says