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|Is Water Baptism A Necessity For The Holy Ghost Baptism by HappyRabbi: 3:42pm On Dec 20, 2020|
I have often heard some Preachers Emphasize the Necessity of Water Baptism,in order to be a recipient of the Holy ghost Baptism,even in scripture,many were immersed in Water before receiving the holy ghost. but have seen people who claim to have been baptized with the holy ghost,evidenced by speaking in tongues immediately after their salvation experience before doing water baptism.pls I need your Informed opinions on these
|Re: Is Water Baptism A Necessity For The Holy Ghost Baptism by sammy329(m): 3:57pm On Dec 20, 2020|
No, the House of Cornelius received the baptism of the Spirit before water baptism.
Acts100:44-47 (KJV) While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
|Re: Is Water Baptism A Necessity For The Holy Ghost Baptism by doggedfighter(f): 4:05pm On Dec 20, 2020|
What's that for?
|Re: Is Water Baptism A Necessity For The Holy Ghost Baptism by xproducer: 7:57pm On Dec 20, 2020|
Water baptism, like circumcision of the foreskin, is a sign that just as water washes away dirt from the skin, GOD uses the water of the word to wash away our sins
"There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ: - 1 Peter 3:21 (antitype is "something that is represented by a symbol." )
GOD does the real spiritual washing that imputes the righteousness of the Lord JESUS to His elect, so that we are acceptable before Him:
"Then I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean; I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from all your idols." - Ezekiel 36:25
"Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her, that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word, that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish." - Ephesians 5:25-27
|Re: Is Water Baptism A Necessity For The Holy Ghost Baptism by Ihedinobi3: 8:02pm On Dec 20, 2020|
The short answer is that water baptism is not a part of the Christian experience at all today. So the question of its necessity in order to have the baptism of the Holy Spirit does not even arise.
4 And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; 5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.”
Acts 1:4-5 (NKJV)
11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
Matthew 3:11 (NKJV)
8 I indeed baptized you with water, but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.”
Mark 1:8 (NKJV)
33 I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, ‘Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’
John 1:33 (NKJV)
Water baptism is John's baptism. It was only meant for the Jews of his day in order to prepare them for Jesus Christ. The spiritual principle on which that baptism worked is the same on which the ceremonial washing of the priests worked.
17 Then the LORD spoke to Moses, saying: 18 “You shall also make a laver of bronze, with its base also of bronze, for washing. You shall put it between the tabernacle of meeting and the altar. And you shall put water in it, 19 for Aaron and his sons shall wash their hands and their feet in water from it. 20 When they go into the tabernacle of meeting, or when they come near the altar to minister, to burn an offering made by fire to the LORD, they shall wash with water, lest they die. 21 So they shall wash their hands and their feet, lest they die. And it shall be a statute forever to them—to him and his descendants throughout their generations.”
Exodus 30:17-21 (NKJV)
These ceremonial washings were symbolic. Dipping into water does not really do anything to us spiritually. It doesn't cleanse our sins. Only the Sacrifice of Jesus does that if we believe in the Gospel. But these washings symbolize our reception of the Gospel, of our need for a Savior and our acceptance of the One that God Himself gives to us.
21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ
1 Peter 3:21 (NIV)
As you see from the above passage, the baptism that saves us is not the washing of water. Water baptism only symbolized it.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word
Ephesians 5:25-26 (NIV)
We are cleansed through the Word of God when we believe it.
3 You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you.
John 15:3 (NIV)
It is true that some believers were still baptized in water in Acts of the Apostles. This is because (1)they were Jews who knew of John's baptism and failed to take advantage of it earlier. By partaking in it, they identified with their need for Israel's Messiah, thus readying them to move on to the Cross. (2)The apostles and disciples were still learning exactly what the Cross of Christ had brought about, so they made a few mistakes.
The baptism of Christianity is the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Although in the beginning, that baptism was not instantaneous as soon as one believed the Gospel, today it is. The difference is because the Apostolic Age was the Age of transition from the Age of Israel to the Age of the Church. During that time, it was necessary for Gentiles especially to appreciate that they were being made one with the Jews. Salvation is from the Jews (John 4:22), and Gentile believers are made part of the Israel of God because of their faith. In order to drive this lesson home, every Gentile believer needed the Jewish Apostles to come and lay hands on them first before they received the Holy Spirit. When the New Testament was completed and distributed (during the lifetime of some of the apostles), there was no further need for this. In fact, God demonstrated to Peter through the experience of Cornelius and his family that the Holy Spirit was for all who believed, whether Jew or Gentile, but that was a lesson that still took years for even him to learn (see Galatians 2:11-16, for example). With the completion of the New Testament, all Gentile believers had access to revelation that they were made one with Jewish believers although they owed their salvation to the Jews. So instead of the continued practice of laying on of hands for the baptism of the Holy Spirit, all that is required is faith in Jesus Christ. At the point of faith in Jesus, we receive the Holy Spirit. There is now no more delay.
You do mention the gift of speaking in tongues, so I understand that this may still be a bit confusing. In Acts, we read that even the very first disciples to receive the outpouring of the Holy Spirit spoke in tongues and we see that this happened in many other instances. These days, that has become the standard for knowing whether we have been baptized in the Holy Spirit or not, but that is an error. On the one hand, this teaching that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is evidenced by speaking in tongues is recent. It began with the Pentecostal movement in the 1800s and it is false. You will see in the Scriptures that there is a significant variety of spiritual gifts. Speaking in tongues is only one of them. Some people who received the Holy Spirit prophesied rather than speak in tongues (see Acts 19:6 for example). On the other hand, gifts such as those were given so that the Gospel would spread faster or so that the truths that were yet to be written down in the New Testament would be attested to by supernatural signs and wonders to encourage those who were willing to believe them. Those gifts are no longer being given in the Church (1 Corinthians 13:8-12). So, judging the baptism by the presence or absence of the gift of speaking in tongues is not biblical.
In conclusion, water baptism has nothing to do with faith in Jesus Christ, and speaking in tongues has no place in the Church anymore. Anyone who wants to know if they are baptised in the Holy Spirit need only ask if they believe the Gospel. If they do, then they are. If they don't, then they aren't.
9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.
Romans 8:9 (NKJV)
|Re: Is Water Baptism A Necessity For The Holy Ghost Baptism by Kobojunkiee: 11:00pm On May 04|
HappyRabbi:In John 3, Jesus Christ tells you have to be born of water and of Spirit in order to become a part of His Kingdom. So definitely. water baptism is essential for Salvation to take place.
And if you read all the way through to John 3 vs 16 through 21, you learn what it is you are saved(salvation) from, death, and what it is you are graced with in place of death when you become a part of the Kingdom of God - eternal life.
Now, as for those who "speak in tongues" right after being baptized... no where in scripture are you told that "speaking in tongues" is a sign of baptism by the Spirit of God. And also be aware that not all tongues are of God.
In fact, back some years ago, even as one who didn't really believe in God, I was able to utter some similar sounding gibberish that many confuse with tongues and this happened many many years before I finally got baptized.
Another important thing to know is that another necessary step to becoming a part of the Kingdom of God is to eat the body and drink the blood of Jesus Christ. In John 10, I believe. Jesus Christ makes it clear that it is only those who eat His flesh and drink His blood that have eternal life, which in John 3 vs 16-21, is the end result of being saved.
So for Salvation to take place, one must
1) believe in Jesus Christ and accept He is who He says He is
2) be baptized in water(born of water)
3) must eat of Jesus Christ's body and drink His blood in order to graced with eternal life in the Kingdom of God.
4) born of Spirit(
Jesus Christ, however, does not specify that the Spirit is God's or the Holy Spirit)
The Holy Spirit of Spirit of God comes after that and is through continued obedience to the teachings and commandments of Jesus Christ - John 14 and 15
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