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How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? - Career (5) - Nairaland

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Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by ybn: 2:05pm On May 11
Unityp:
Two staff in one of the Federal Ministries got employment letter the same time,with the same grade level and step,both of them did documentation/assumption of duty the same day.One did in the morning while the other did his in the afternoon but the time was not recorded.
Now the question is how do you determine seniority between this two on the nominal roll?Pls admin gurus in the civil service should help out here because this is exactly what a friend is passing through in her place of work.

The one who first completes documentation and assumed duty is the senior.
If one submits documents and defer assumption of duty to a latter date, the second who assumes duty immediately becomes the senior.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by femi4: 2:08pm On May 11
LadiIshola:

Staff number appearance is not an evidence of how people reported. Even if 10 people report for assumption at the same exact time, they cannot all occupy the same spot on a list, they have to follow each other based on the discretion of the admin officer attending to them, so that would determine how their names appear on a list. So should that be a determinant for seniority, even when someone who came later, maybe split seconds, appears before others she met there?
So what they look at is the age, civil service is still traditional, doesn't apply the ethos of the private sector. The elder amongst them in such situation is adjudged the senior and others follow like that according to their ages.
Stop misinforming the public

Get a public service rule book and read

2 Likes

Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by halogate: 2:12pm On May 11
garfield1:



In universities,appointment to hod or dean is not by seniority
Boss...we are talking about Civil Service.
Meanwhile..even in the University, appointment of HOD is rotational and by seniority.
You cannot give a Dr. HOD when a Prof in that Dept is yet to head.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Folarxn: 2:18pm On May 11
Noneroone:
[img][/img] you don't sound like a civil servant

Really? Well, I took these for you. To douse your curiosity.

It's quite unfortunate that people who are not civil servants or not in the Civil Service are arguing “the rules” with people who are in fact, in the service.

First screenshot is my recent Civil Service Exams results (pay attention to Public Service Rules and my scores therein).

Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Mijy: 2:18pm On May 11
There is what we call PN personal number, the person who received his/her PN first is the senior. Simple.

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Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Folarxn: 2:20pm On May 11
Mijy:
There is what we call PN personal number, the person who received his/her PN first is the senior. Simple.

Correct.

PN = Personnel Number. It might be called PSN (Personnel Service Number) in the State Civil Service.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by chris51(f): 2:56pm On May 11
ChybuzzDD:
The one who first submitted his filled forms and had his name written first in the list is the senior.
If their names were written down while issueing them their employment letters, the one who first wrote down his name is the senior.

In other words, their serial number
on the register will determine their seniority.

You are correct. Staff number is in serial order.

1 Like

Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by cosade(m): 3:06pm On May 11
LadiIshola:

Staff number appearance is not an evidence of how people reported. Even if 10 people report for assumption at the same exact time, they cannot all occupy the same spot on a list, they have to follow each other based on the discretion of the admin officer attending to them, so that would determine how their names appear on a list. So should that be a determinant for seniority, even when someone who came later, maybe split seconds, appears before others she met there?
So what they look at is the age, civil service is still traditional, doesn't apply the ethos of the private sector. The elder amongst them in such situation is adjudged the senior and others follow like that according to their ages.


Folarxn:


Bros, I've been here since the page of this thread was 2, it's now 4/5. To me, if you explain till tomorrow, people who've chosen to be ignorant will continue to be. Further explanation are exercise in futility.

As for me, I'm done correcting or replying to this thread. People are just arrogantly ignorant and are clearly not open to learning.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by sonofElElyon: 3:14pm On May 11
First use grade level.. if same grade level then date of 1st appointment.. then date of present appointment

Unityp:
Two staff in one of the Federal Ministries got employment letter the same time,with the same grade level and step,both of them did documentation/assumption of duty the same day.One did in the morning while the other did his in the afternoon but the time was not recorded.
Now the question is how do you determine seniority between this two on the nominal roll?Pls admin gurus in the civil service should help out here because this is exactly what a friend is passing through in her place of work.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by noisy45(m): 3:18pm On May 11
Date and year of appointment
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Jsabigi: 3:36pm On May 11
To determine seniority, you consider the following:
1. Appointment letter
2. Acceptance letter
3. Class of Degree/qualifications (in peculiar cases)
4. Age
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Sailorsoldier1: 3:52pm On May 11
In the military its ur surname which influences ur service number based on alphabetical order
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by garfield1: 4:04pm On May 11
halogate:

Boss...we are talking about Civil Service.
Meanwhile..even in the University, appointment of HOD is rotational and by seniority.
You cannot give a Dr. HOD when a Prof in that Dept is yet to head.

True.in my Dept, it's by seniority and by rotation.all the profs have held it and it is now rotating among the doctors who are senior lecturers
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by GALAXY2012: 4:38pm On May 11
D staff number can be used to identify seniority. d person dat did documentation in d morning is d senior because his/her staff number will be lesser Dan d person dat did documentation in d afternoon or evening
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Dreadful: 4:45pm On May 11
Folarxn:


You guys just say unsubstantiated things with audacity… Which chapter, section or subsection of the Public Service Rules is your claim stated?

Here's a screenshot of the the copy of PSR book I used for my Civil Service Exams.

I'm a civil servant and I know more than you. If staff are on same Cadre, grade level and step, the determinant factor for who the senior will be is always the date of birth. Snap a page where what you stated is written in that your civil service rule let me see.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by NoToPile: 4:53pm On May 11
HEAVEN4444:
i said if employed on the same day then age trumps. unless of course the younger guy has many more skills. however the premise of this post is that if two people are employed to the same job on the same day who is senior.

Age?


Is there a backing for this in PSR, I am yet to see this.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Richthekid: 4:55pm On May 11
Oh
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by toask111: 5:24pm On May 11
Unityp:
Two staff in one of the Federal Ministries got employment letter the same time,with the same grade level and step,both of them did documentation/assumption of duty the same day.One did in the morning while the other did his in the afternoon but the time was not recorded.
Now the question is how do you determine seniority between this two on the nominal roll?Pls admin gurus in the civil service should help out here because this is exactly what a friend is passing through in her place of work.


I don't knk wmuch about Agencies, Boards and so on but in the main Civil Service, once you have been given employment letter, the Civil Service Commission requires you to write an:
1. Acceptance letter. Your letter will carry a date and it must be submitted. If my letter was received first before the next person on the same day, and a file (all files in the service has a File) is opened for me first before you, then I'm your senior by virtue of arriving first;

2. The Commission expect you to submit a Medical Report of fitness. The medical report usually carry a date. If the date on your medical report comes before the next person. You have automatically become the Senior to the next person.

These are the yardstick used by the Civil Service Commission.

NB: it is believe that you have received to your duty post once you submit your letter of acceptance...
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by halogate: 5:35pm On May 11
..now unless my eyes are decieving me..I don't see any "age" in this PSR
Seniority 020106..


Now unless like someone stated earlier that the HR/Admin may decide use "managerial discretion"...

But the required rule is in fine print for all to see.

#IRestMyCase

Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by halogate: 5:37pm On May 11
Folarxn:


Correct.

PN = Personnel Number. It might be called PSN (Personnel Service Number) in the State Civil Service.
Oga..we have tried. The PSR screenshot is there. Anyone that wants to use "selective understanding" should carry on.

1 Like

Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by olumzzz(m): 5:38pm On May 11
Pymetrics:

It's like you don't understand the politics of workplace. Being given some roles and responsibilities may give you an opportunity to connect with influential people, interfacing contractors where you get kickback (i don't support this, just saying), or you represent your workplace in outside settings. This person may be collecting same salary and allowances as others, but he's getting some advantages and this is what employee in the same level compete for. It's a fundamental politics of workplace.
This is what i was talking about. People are too corruption-driven.
Workplace shouldn't be about getting kickbacks.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by halogate: 5:42pm On May 11
Dreadful:

I'm a civil servant and I know more than you. If staff are on same Cadre, grade level and step, the determinant factor for who the senior will be is always the date of birth. Snap a page where what you stated is written in that your civil service rule let me see.
Boss..no age for here oh.

PS: pls note the last statement.."as duly REFLECTED in the appropriate REGISTER"

Which means...as ur names line up in that register for assumption of duty..that's how your seniority is.

1 Like

Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Folarxn: 6:03pm On May 11
Dreadful:

I'm a civil servant and I know more than you. If staff are on same Cadre, grade level and step, the determinant factor for who the senior will be is always the date of birth. Snap a page where what you stated is written in that your civil service rule let me see.

Lol. Since I asked first, why don't you prove me wrong to the whole world?

Someone had earlier asked that I prove I'm a civil servant and I've uploaded a picture of my Civil Service Examinations results. I'm done uploading any bullshit to prove any foolish points to faceless, random, and probably jobless trolls.

If you think your claim is right, that age is determining factor of seniority in the civil service, then simply post a screenshot of the PSR where it said so. Shikena. EOD.

Just in case you're still in the mood to argue baselessly, here you go:
halogate:

Boss..no age for here oh.

PS: pls note the last statement.."as duly REFLECTED in the appropriate REGISTER"

Which means...as ur names line up in that register for assumption of duty..that's how your seniority is.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by halogate: 6:11pm On May 11
@Florxn..
Bro I have loaded the PSR screenshot for seniority oh. Anyone that is still assuming age is a criterion should continue.
..I don't know which proof we can give them again undecided undecided
.. Something that is written in fine print?
..maybe their own ministry or agency is using a different PSR book.
Anyway..Kudos to u. We have tried.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by halogate: 6:39pm On May 11
..For those saying age is a criterion. Let me use this to dissuade such notions.
In the Agency where I work, we had a couple of new staffs last year.
Two of them are on GL07 -Step 3. The first one is a young guy..abt 30yrs. The second is a father of 3..above 40.
The first guy (30yrs) reported in October. The second guy (40yrs) reported in December.
Now how do I know the young guy is senior and age does not matter.

1. His staff ID No: comes before the second guys own...

2. On any list..his name comes before the second guys own.

..even something as simple as Annual Leave Schedule..the seniority stylishly reflects.

Now..has age been used as a criterion in anyway??

And incase u want to go the Alphabet line. First guys surname starts with G while the second guys starts with A.
So Age and Alphabet doesn't follow at all
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by larrypourl(m): 7:02pm On May 11
Unityp:
Two staff in one of the Federal Ministries got employment letter the same time,with the same grade level and step,both of them did documentation/assumption of duty the same day.One did in the morning while the other did his in the afternoon but the time was not recorded.
Now the question is how do you determine seniority between this two on the nominal roll?Pls admin gurus in the civil service should help out here because this is exactly what a friend is passing through in her place of work.

File number is the finally solution.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Ajalekoko76(m): 9:35pm On May 11
The officer that submitted or came in the morning is assumed senior on nominal roll. There is no big deal except that one name shall come b4 other.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by LadiIshola(m): 11:53pm On May 11
Folarxn:


This is not an informed take.

Nothing is done at the discretion of the admin officer in charge. There are laid down rules and regulations regarding this topic. Reason why we hava Public Service Rules book which is over 100 pages long (screenshot is attached).

Age has never, is not, and will never be the determinant of seniority in the Ministerial Civil Service. At the basic level, it's based on whose file was created/opened first. My file number at work is 4034, so you're telling that someone whose file number is 4035 or 4036 is my senior simply because he/she is 38-year-old and I'm 23? I laugh in Fulfulde. grin

You're twisting the fact, no one said age is the exclusive criteria for determining seniority in service, what I said is that after checking all relevant data and both officers being considered are on par, then age is used. And by the way, the civil service rule you mentioned only talked about using the date on the "assumption of duty certificate". It was silent on what happens after both AODCs have the same dates. It's open to interpretations.....See screenshot below for clarity. So I'm not a dunce, I know what I'm saying....

Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by bussy2020(m): 5:43am On May 12
It can be determined via staff number.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by evansjeff(m): 9:36am On May 12
olumzzz:
Wahala be like bicycle.
We Africans get wahala, can't we just do our jobs as specified in our job descriptions and collect our salaries without the need for a baseless discrepancy for seniority.
Funniest thing is they are on the same grade level and earn the same pay yet looking for seniority

You will not understand the full implications of this until you’re in the public service. Do you know that those two persons can have 5 years left in service and there’s an appointment position to be made, one can be made the overall boss (DG, CEO, Permanent Secretary, Director, Principal) over the other in their remaining 5 years carrier and the other remain a common officer simply because one wrote name before other.

And these positions attracts huge financial benefits which will create a wide salary discrepancy between both persons. Just imagine that, and this is someone who is your mate and you both came to work the same day. Now you have to be answering SIR/MA to the person.
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by olumzzz(m): 9:39am On May 12
evansjeff:


You will not understand the full implications of this until you’re in the public service. Do you know that those two persons can have 5 years left in service and there’s an appointment position to be made, one can be made the overall boss (DG, CEO, Permanent Secretary, Director, Principal) over the other in their remaining 5 years carrier and the other remain a common officer simply because one wrote name before other.

And these positions attracts huge financial benefits which will create a wide salary discrepancy between both persons. Just imagine that, and this is someone who is your mate and you both came to work the same day. Now you have to be answering SIR/MA to the person.
If you've worked in public service, you will know that such appointments isn't made based on the day you came in but by who you know or who your godfather is
Re: How Do You Determine Seniority With Staff On The Same Level And Step? by Dreadful: 11:20am On May 12
Folarxn:


Lol. Since I asked first, why don't you prove me wrong to the whole world?

Someone had earlier asked that I prove I'm a civil servant and I've uploaded a picture of my Civil Service Examinations results. I'm done uploading any bullshit to prove any foolish points to faceless, random, and probably jobless trolls.

If you think your claim is right, that age is determining factor of seniority in the civil service, then simply post a screenshot of the PSR where it said so. Shikena. EOD.

Just in case you're still in the mood to argue baselessly, here you go:
You are dumb! I've been in service for 14 years.
Names are organized in nominal roll based on Cadre, grade level, step and age.

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