Muslims (alfa's) and herbalists do work hand in hand, and there seems to be a lot correlation between these two. Through the years I've noticed same M.O and relation also exist between them too fetish religion.

The herbalists uses sand and all sort of things to see the unknown, and so does the Alfa's. The terbi/tesba/ileke/rosery that these Alfa uses are in no way different to the glass/pot the herbalists uses to see the happenings in the world. Most of these Alfa's also wrap up and prepare concoction for their customers just like their herbalist counterpart.

Most importantly, Muslims believe so much in fetishism  and do not see anything wrong with it.

It is Haram for any muslim to practise fetishism or try to look into the future. That thing you tie around your waist or your body is haram, that water (naso) you wash yourself with is haram. .You are seeking protection in something other than God's protection.

What Alfas do is haram. . All they do is Haram, it is the same as juju because they are mixing Islam/Christianity with animistic practices. .

No difference at all.

What about carrying sword or gun for protection? Is that seeking protection outside of Allah?

^^Why would you need to carry Gun? Are you in a war zone?

But mohamed carried sword for protection na.

Most of the Yoruba films producers are Muslims, and this is why you see fetishism being displayed in these movies. The producers are ignorant and do not see anything wrong with consulting the herbalist. A slight challenges faced by any of the actors/actresses always result in consulting the herbalist, then the Alfas (birds of a feather)

Pastor AIO, you have to understand these fetishes are not part of this world, they are spiritual entities. Which we are basically worshipping, many believe in it more than the spiritual power of God. .You are using spiritual forces that are not Godly. .

Paris it is no difference. .Animistic practices have been going on in cultures for years and it is going to be hard for people to just drop it even though they are in another religion so they try to incorporate in with their now religions. .

one of the reasons why islam gained a big foothold in west africa outside of jihad, was the spiritual aspect of the religion.

africans have a very deep seated belief in the spirit world, and they found islam helped them in that area, just like the native doctors did.


ie, they could relate.


and no, i dont need to be jumped by any zealot because i'm simply stating the reasons why most africans mix spiritualism with foreign religions.

mr poster i think u got it mixed up ,their is a branch of islam dat deals with magic,sufism i think,im sure it is condemned by mainstream muslims

Some christian leaders are equally fetish and ritualistic

true.

no one's disputing that but its off topic.

still applicable to my comment anyway, which is africans take the metaphysical very seriously.

Chia diz muslims sef don tire me even de air we breath diz days in abuja is bomb. Kai make una quickly kill us nah,

tpia. The basis of the thread is to criticise. I only pointed that our side isnt 100% free either

no it isnt, of course.

however, the thread is in danger of being derailed.

Ok. I don't want to be part of derail it. I'll step aside

wats wrong with consulting a herbalist

i prefer dat 2 consulting a money-sucking mosquito of a pastor or a brainwashing deluded old imam.

^^Why not go to God directly? Have we not passed the age where you have to go through man to get through to God?

d herbalist is jus 2 cure.

we approach God directly.

I see, you are a pagan. . .

There are two different types of herbalist

1: someone that finds herbs to cure from trees, nature etc
2: someone that finds herbs through spiritual entities which the Op is talking about.(Seeking the oracle/ asking to bring 5 goats to sacrifice so the mighty god of orowolo can show him the cure)

@Pastoraio; « #2 on: Yesterday at 04:10:25 PM »
[Quote]What about carrying sword or gun for protection? Is that seeking protection outside of Allah?
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kandiikane (m)
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Re: Are There Any Diff Btw Muslims (Alfa) And Herbalists! Well, Don't Think So
« #3 on: Yesterday at 04:12:26 PM »

^^Why would you need to carry Gun? Are you in a war zone?
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Re: Are There Any Diff Btw Muslims (Alfa) And Herbalists! Well, Don't Think So
« #4 on: Yesterday at 04:35:39 PM »

But mohamed carried sword for protection na.[/Quote]Muhammad [as] carried sword on the battlefield to fight. he also shot arrows to kill disbelievers. Alhamdulillah. each time you write about islam you show your hatred in the nth degree. you see where the hatred i referref in my earlier post comes in?

olori ke ara e. you know that your paganic soul needs cleansing. you and 9japagan are so out of reality. he at least is not fronting like you pastoraio. one would think you are a christian until your ifadeyi posts are read.

kandiikane:

I see, you are a pagan. . .

There are two different types of herbalist

1: someone that finds herbs to cure from trees, nature etc
2: someone that finds herbs through spiritual entities which the Op is talking about.(Seeking the oracle/ asking to bring 5 goats to sacrifice so the mighty god of orowolo can show him the cure)

d 2nd can also b considered a priest.

^^Yes, if a person practices that as a religion. . . You cannot be in two. .Going to the mosque calling Allah's name and then going back home calling the almighty arowolo.

^^ now i agree, thats wrong. 1 must either proudly n bravely accept his true faith or jus leave.

eh heeh! Now we are on the same page. .

kandiikane:

calling the almighty arowolo.

what does this mean?

kandiikane:

Pastor AIO, you have to understand these fetishes are not part of this world, they are spiritual entities. Which we are basically worshipping, many believe in it more than the spiritual power of God. .You are using spiritual forces that are not Godly. .

Okay, I get you. It is okay to not rely on God (Allah) if your alternative is physical/material like drugs for healing or a sword for self defence, but if the alternative is spiritual then that is wrong and you must only depend on allah.

So the atheist that runs to his doctor is better than the pagan who runs to his onisegun.

tpia@:

one of the reasons why islam gained a big foothold in west africa outside of jihad, was the spiritual aspect of the religion.

africans have a very deep seated belief in the spirit world, and they found islam helped them in that area, just like the native doctors did.


ie, they could relate.


and no, i dont need to be jumped by any zealot because i'm simply stating the reasons why most africans mix spiritualism with foreign religions.

Are you suggesting that there is not spirit world in christianity? How is Islam more 'spiritual' than christianity?

kandiikane:

I see, you are a pagan. . .

There are two different types of herbalist

1: someone that finds herbs to cure from trees, nature etc
2: someone that finds herbs through spiritual entities which the Op is talking about.(Seeking the oracle/ asking to bring 5 goats to sacrifice so the mighty god of orowolo can show him the cure)

Do you realize that the same word in the NT that is used for sorcery/witchcraft is the same word used for medicine. Namely, Pharmakos. In other words a pharmacist is a winch according to biblical thinking.

Even in yoruba it is the same word. Oogun is medicine and it is magic. Perhaps your separation of physical and spiritual is what is wrong and that the ancients did not think of it like the way that you do.

tpia@:

what does this mean?

maybe he means Orunmila

Pastor AIO:

Do you realize that the same word in the NT that is used for sorcery/witchcraft is the same word used for medicine. Namely, Pharmakos. In other words a pharmacist is a winch according to biblical thinking.

Even in yoruba it is the same word. Oogun is medicine and it is magic. Perhaps your separation of physical and spiritual is what is wrong and that the ancients did not think of it like the way that you do.

true. as i said before, Paganism is very much conected with the sciences, nature and the workings of the Universe.

now apart from all these known facts, can someone please tell me why does islam and d quraan propagate Jinns or spirits when they r supposed to reject it this shows that they were still scared of heresy againt the old religions.

tpia@:

what does this mean?

Why are you asking me? You should know more about this more than me

Pastor AIO:

Okay, I get you.  It is okay to not rely on God (Allah) if your alternative is physical/material like drugs for healing or a sword for self defence, but if the alternative is spiritual then that is wrong and you must only depend on allah. 

So the atheist that runs to his doctor is better than the pagan who runs to his onisegun.

Are you suggesting that there is not spirit world in christianity?  How is Islam more 'spiritual' than christianity?

What is this? HUH? The man asked  about Islam not Christianity? How did I suggest anything about Christianity? Are there not Christians also going to babas?
If you are a pagan or these herbalists are what you believe in, then I cannot say nothing about that because it is your belief system but you cannot be doing both whether you are muslim, christian or jew.
Do you realize that the same word in the NT that is used for sorcery/witchcraft is the same word used for medicine.  Namely, Pharmakos(this was never a witch but a scapegoat when disaster happens who is expelled out of the commuinity as a sort of purification and it was an ancient greek practice). In other words a pharmacist is a winch according to biblical thinking. 
So someone that goes to seek cures from plant is a witch? These types of cures have been around since biblical times and even before the biblical times. This is how people survived in the olden days because of these people just now they have advanced with how they make this.

Even in yoruba it is the same word.  Oogun is medicine and it is magic.  Perhaps your separation of physical and spiritual is what is wrong and that the ancients did not think of it like the way that you do.

I find that science explains the world in one way and religion explains in another and science makes more sense and has evidences, but in life many have to have a spiritual belief in something so they can be at peace and have morality in their lives be it it paganism, Christianity, buddism, islam etc.
I do not have anything wrong with anyones belief system but I referred to herbalists(the priests) as haram in islam because they seek something other than God.
I do not see anything wrong in herbalist who find cure from plants and nature who heals because in the bible it says God  is the healers of all but when many are sick and go to the pastor for healings they are never healed instead they are told it is because they do not have enough faith.
God gave someone the brain to seek cures from plants so why not go to that person?

PAGAN  9JA:

maybe he means Orunmila

true. as i said before, Paganism is very much conected with the sciences, nature and the workings of the Universe.

now apart from all these known facts, can someone please tell me why does islam and d quraan propagate Jinns or spirits when they r supposed to reject it this shows that they were still scared of heresy againt the old religions.

Well jinns are inbetweeners, made by God who also have freewill(According to quran).  Abraham religions have paganistic(if I can use that word) influences to them and I believe jinns were also part of the pagan religion practiced in Saudi at that time.

^^^ the post above is confusing. I was addressing Tpia when I asked if christianity was not spiritual. She is a 'christian' and she is talking about spirituality as if it is a bad thing.

Anywhere in the NT that you see the word Sorcery, or Witchcraft check the original greek. The word is Pharmakos which means medicine as well. Those bible passages could equally be condemning those who practice medicine. In fact there is nowhere in the NT that herbs or medicines are prescribed or endorsed. All healing is by faith. God heals everything. In this those who run to pastors when they have a headache have biblical backing.

I'm yet to see an incensed christian or Muslim pray when the situation is aggressive. They mostly all pick up their swords. That's one business where neither are willing to leave it to God.