[size=14pt]‘As a senator in 1992, I was earning N6,500 per month’[/size]
Written by Abiodun Awolaja
Friday, 05 August 2011


Chief Segun Bamigbetan Baju, former senator and former Ambassador to the Republic of Cuba, Honduras, Nicaragua and the Commonwealth of the Bahamas, spoke with Abiodun Awolaja at the Ifaki-Ekiti country home of former Governor Segun Oni last Friday, on the political gathering at his (Oni’s) mother’s burial, Nigeria’s foreign policy, the controversy over the remuneration of National Assemblymembers, and sundry issues.

DURING the burial ceremony of Madam Comfort Oni, mother of Chief Segun Oni, we have seen an outpouring of goodwill and emotions across party lines. What is your comment on that?

Well, certainly we have seen tremendous outpouring of love, respect and goodwill towards Chief Segun Oni, the immediate past governor of Ekiti State, who is a very good friend. More importantly, he is a decent Nigerian, well educated, and a polished politician. I’m amazed myself to see the composition of the attendance that we had today(last Friday); there were at least four past and present governors of Ekiti State, starting from Niyi Adebayo, Ayodele Fayose; of course, Oni the host, and also the current governor, Kayode Fayemi. Also, former Governor Osarhimen Osunbor of Edo State, senators, past and present, members of the House of Representatives and leaders of political parties, were all represented.

I was particularly touched by what the Prelate of the Methodist Church, Dr Ola Makinde, said. He said, “This is a demonstration of love, and Ekiti is starting it for Nigeria.’’ Regardless of partisan views, we all came together to give mama a befitting burial, and that is a lesson for us all to learn because we all put politics aside. We just came to pay our last respects to a wonderful Nigerian, who had done so well for her children. And, of course, that is why we had so many Prelates and Bishops in attendance. It was really a great day.

Would you say that demonstrates the resilience of our culture, because sometimes we seem to have lost touch with the culture, mixing politics with everything?

I think today we have seen the best of our culture. Also, we must not forget the fact that we have seen a lot about the character of Engineer Segun Oni and the goodwill that he enjoys from across Nigeria; you saw messages from the governor of Niger State; from the President and Commander-in-Chief, and from the Senate President.

We have had this issue of people saying that the salaries of senators are too high, without seemingly extending the same criticism to the executive. Is it that there is a conspiracy against the Nigerian legislature, or that the problem is within the National Assembly itself?

I think, frankly, you would need to ask the current legislators. I was in the Senate in 1992 and, if I remember correctly, I was earning N6,500 per month.
Per month?

Yes, and that was everything. As a matter of fact, the Senate President was earning N13,000. Perhaps I have lost touch with what is happening. But then, I think we need to do something about it (the jumbo pay) because if we are leaders of the people, we must not be out of touch with the feelings of the people.

We must represent their best feelings and aspirations.
Critics of Nigeria’s foreign policy, including the Vice-Chancellor of the Obafemi Awolowo University (OAU), Ile-Ife, Osun State, Professor Bamitale Omole, have said that Nigeria has a Big Brother approach, extending a hand of fellowship which is not reciprocated, especially by the French West-African countries. As a former ambassador, would you say we on the right track?

Well, Nigeria cannot afford not to be the Big Brother in Africa, by virtue of our sheer size, population, and endowments. It is a role that we have to play. And, of course, you know that internationally, we play a major role in peace-keeping operations all over the world, not just in Africa. But what needs to be corrected is that we must insist on being treated with the same kind of respect with which we treat our neighbours, our brothers.That is the important point.

On Nigeria’s democracy, we have observed some positive developments. For instance, we have had losers of elections congratulating the winners the moment they were declared. We also had an election that we can say was an improvement on previous ones. Taking a critical look at our democracy, would you say that we are improving?

Certainly, we are improving. But there are so many areas we need to cover. We may not cover everything overnight, but in certain areas, it has been a learning curve for the leaders, those who are aspiring to lead, and even the populace. The parties that lost now have to go back to the drawing board and ask themselves: ‘’where did we get it wrong?’’ And this is the whole essence of democracy.

The issue of President Goodluck Jonathan proposing a single term for the president and governors has generated a lot of controversy. How do you see it?


Well, the idea of single term has been around for some time, but if you ask me (and I’m not speaking on behalf of my party), I think there is a lot of credence in the two-term policy, because it gives credit to those who have done well, and it gives the people the opportunity to change, to correct, people who have been elected but did not perform well.

You see, sometimes (I don’t know whether this is the Nigerian nature) we tend to get so impatient. Those who have designed programmes and policies in their wisdom have done a lot of work and, of course, they must have taken their experiences into consideration. You know, their past experiences must have been instructive in coming up with those policies. But sometimes we, in our haste, jettison such policies, only to come back to them in a few years. I think the idea of two-term for the executive is a very sound one.

We should be more reflective. We have only practised democracy now for just 12 years since the return to civil rule in 1999, and we are already changing the constitution so many times. I don’t think this is necessary. We need to improve on our institutions; it is the institutions that are failing.

Our judiciary should function. You have seen all that has been going on, all the allegations between judges. It’s unfortunate; we should strengthen our institutions. The judiciary, police, customs, our power supply agency, should all function. Once we have the agencies functioning, then I don’t think there would be much problems.

Is this a problem of change in values?

If we must be honest with ourselves, we must reflect on how we started. We are operating a borrowed system; this is not our traditional system. It is good, but perhaps we need time to master it.

We already have a culture, and some aspects of our culture are very good and superior . But we are borrowing the ones we think are better. We can’t master it overnight; we have to be a bit patient. At least, we have seen some level of benefit that is better than when we had the military. The people can exercise their rights, vote out bad leaders. We didn’t have that under the military.

Even our civil service is not perfect. The civil service has been there for 50 years or thereabouts, but democracy has only been there for a few years. We need to take a critical look, throw the searchlight on our civil service. Is it functioning at the optimum level? Because, for anybody who is elected as a governor, you need the civil service, you need the technocrats. If that is already a crumbling institution, then something has to be done. Otherwise, you can’t perform even with the best intentions.

Some people have said that politicians are able to perpetrate corruption only because they are aided by civil servants; that if the top directors do not cooperate with you, you cannot steal as a commissioner or minister. In concrete terms, how do we reform the judiciary?

You have said it all. No politician can steal without the cooperation of the civil service. Any politician that does so would simply find himself behind bars. I will give you an example.

In the state of Illinois in the United States, the past three or four governors are in prison. And the last one that was there when Obama was elected— after Obama was elected US President, he was caught on tape negotiating Obama’s vacant senate seat and was impeached. So, let our institutions work. The problem is not the politicians; if anybody does anything wrong, and the institutions are strong enough, he goes to jail, and then that would put an end to everything.

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