Islam (Submission) condemns suicide as much as it condemns oppression and aggression against others. While the Muslims  (Submitters) are commanded to stand for their rights and defend themselves, their properties and their freedom they are told to first resort to peace advocate tolerance and disregard the ignorant. The following verses from the Quran show how the Quran describes suicide, such an important issue in our life that was made the center of the conflict in the Middle East lately.

[2:195] You shall spend in the cause of GOD; do not throw yourselves with your own hands into destruction. You shall be charitable; GOD loves the charitable.

[ 4:29] O you who believe, do not consume each others' properties illicitly - only mutually acceptable transactions are permitted. You shall not kill yourselves. GOD is Merciful towards you.

[ 4:30] Anyone who commits these transgressions, maliciously and deliberately, we will condemn him to Hell. This is easy for GOD to do.

Suicide bombing by young uninformed Muslim youths has been  carried out almost  routinely  as a mean of revenge in the Middle East conflict. It is mainly done to avenge their oppression, occupation and loss of freedom they have been experiencing all their life. It is carried out by the youth who lost all the hope to a peaceful settlement as they witnessed their families, loved ones, neighbors, and the innocent bystanders die or tortured at the hand of a merciless occupying force. Despite these intolerable situation no permission can be found in Islam to avenge by suicide bombing or  by targeting the innocent civilians.  These young desperate Muslim youth have been taught what is NOT in the Quran, and what was never promised by God in the Quran.

i chatted with a guy in Pakistan, and we were discussing suciding bombing the way forward. At the end of the discussion he try to makes me understand that the only to fight what you know is impossible, it is through succide bombing, I was terrify. i become afriad, i have to logout of my yahoomessenger

Suicide is the most desperate of human acts.

Also, remember that one man's "terrorist" is another man's "freedom fighter".

how terrific that's why i stay away from certain places, sorry if i hurt someone but what's the problem of some people in certain places like kad**a or afghanistan what do they want from the world? why is everything concerning them bomb and terror? why do you hear the names and you think of death or war? i heared theyre keeping a bomb that can destroy the whole world in seconds!! don't you think people that easily do sucide don't mind doing some nasty shit to the world? i guess i'm overacting but i'm scared

The point of this thread is that suicide bombing is un-islamic. It is a problem of the arab culture.

Thats what they always say whenever there is a crisis. It's unislamic, , it's a Religion of Peace oh the Prophet would not have condoned it if he were still alive. Enough of the talk. Fundamentalists derive their spiritual ammunition from Islam. If they did not think there would be a better life for them in Heaven when they carry out acts of terrorism.They would behave well

I am Christian, and I know that if I kill an unbeliever, and then blow myself up I am going to hell. There is nothing in it for me
So Islam and it's leaders need to address the issue of terrorists especially the Nigerian touts who kill their fellow man if anything happens.
Teacher snatched the koran from a student-- Oh cut his head
Israel bombed Hamas positions ----------Oh burn a church in maiduguri and kano
America invades Iraq---- Oh burn a whole bunch of christians
Cartoons, Oh burn churches and kill your fellow man

After all this someone comes along to remind me how unislamic it is, and how the Religion is just full of Peace
Spare me the talk. I want results. Talk is cheap

What about you, zebudaya? What have you done about the crisis? What makes you think a peaceful muslim has more responsibility in such crisis than a peaceful Christian? Afterall, they both do not support the violence. What have you done?

I THINK YOU SHOULD CHECK THIS OUT

4:89 They long that ye should disbelieve even as they disbelieve, that ye may be upon a level (with them). So choose not friends from them till they forsake their homes in the way of Allah; if they turn back (to enmity) then take them and kill them wherever ye find them, and choose no friend nor helper from among them

4:76 Those who believe do battle for the cause of Allah; and those who disbelieve do battle for the cause of idols. So fight the minions of the devil. Lo! the devil's strategy is ever weak.

5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom; (Anyone who resist Islam is deemed to be making war with Allah)

5:72 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah (himself) said: O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Lo! whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah, for him Allah hath forbidden paradise. His abode is the Fire. For evil-doers there will be no helpers.

Suicide bombing is a recent political phenomenon in the Arabic world. The ironic thing is that muslim has forgotten that.

Seun:

What about you, zebudaya? What have you done about the crisis? What makes you think a peaceful muslim has more responsibility in such crisis than a peaceful Christian? Afterall, they both do not support the violence. What have you done?

and what if i may ask was the point of your post? what do you think a "peaceful christian" is to do? go put himself on the line and stop the terrorists? why shldn't "peaceful" muslims assume the greater responsibility, is it not his religion of "peace" that is on the line?

methinks you missed the issue here, it is about islam and terrorism and not so much about Zeb's person!!!

Thank you softee!!! You hit the nail on the head. If you go to its core and history, it is fosho' without doubt that Islam is definately not a religion of peace contrary to what people profess.

@ Seun

May God continue to bless your thinking. Amen

davidylan, my obvious point is that talk is all that we can do. Whether you are a muslim or a Christian, unless you are in the police or armed forces, there is absolutely nothing you can do except to discuss the issues and make those radical muslims realise that their actions are entirely wrong even by Islamic standards.

Peaceful muslim, like other Nigerians, are busy thinking about how to get their next meal. They don't have the time to start working as emergency counter-terrorism operatives just because some nuts are killing in the name of their religion. All they can do is talk and make it known that suicide bombing does not belong to their religion. That is aceptable to me.

Seun, your recommendations are ok as far as grandiloquence go. I'm not against dialogue, and would even go so far as to add 'tolerance' and 'peaceful co-existence', etc. We need those today more than ever.

But how do you stop a man with a matchet at your door and say, "Hold on,,, calm down,,, let's talk" Talk? He stares you in the face, grins, and with one sharp swing of his cutlass he comes down on you while chanting "Allah is the greatest!"

If I were far away from the scene of raw violence, it would have been easy to say the same thing as you recommend (and I'm not condemning it at all). But where were the police and law enforcement agents when the killings started for days in the north of Nigeria? Let's not forget that Christians made the concerted effort to "talk" and dialogue with their Muslim neighbours in the north; but they were ridiculed, laughed at, and derisively turned away from 'Government House.'

While people waited for "talk", the killings went on unabated. What would non-Muslims (whether Christians, pagans, non-religious, etc) have done under such circumstances? Now, the push is for dialogue; but back then at the moment of crises, what would have been your recommendations to the maddening crowd who didn't understand what it meant to "talk"?

If you are in a position to do more than just talking, then be my guest. Nobody is stopping you. However, it is hypocritical to criticize a muslim for saying "Islam is a religion of peace" when you are sitting on your ass, also doing nothing about the problem. This is a case of pot calling kettle black, and I strongly detest that sort of hypocrisy.

4:89 They long that ye should disbelieve even as they disbelieve, that ye may be upon a level (with them). So choose not friends from them till they forsake their homes in the way of Allah; if they turn back (to enmity) then take them and kill them wherever ye find them, and choose no friend nor helper from among them

Please read the verse again and understand it. This is talking about a precise moment during the time of prophet muhammed. The quran was not revealed in one go. It was revealed to prophet Muhammed at a specific time and due to a specific reason. This verse talks about those who disbelieved and made the lives of muslims difficult, torturing, killing them and taking their property. They wanted Muslims to turn back to idol worship instead of worshipping only One God.

4:76 Those who believe do battle for the cause of Allah; and those who disbelieve do battle for the cause of idols. So fight the minions of the devil. Lo! the devil's strategy is ever weak.

Same as above. As you can see, idol worship and not the people of the book is what is being refered to. The people of the book are Christians and Jews.

5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom; (Anyone who resist Islam is deemed to be making war with Allah)

The statement in brackets are your own or a comment made by someone trying to press a point which is just bogus. Read the first verse. Those who figh Allah, will fight not HIM directly but the believers hence as a believer, you have the right to defend yourself. This is not "turn the other cheek" sort of justice. I and certainly any person with reasonble common sense will defend themselves when physically abused. There's no compulsion in religion. Why is it that Islam is the fastest going religion in the world? Look at the U.S., why are they converting en-masse? because american muslims have daggers underneath their throats or sending them mail bombs? no. Unlike many, they buy the quran, read it and understand it.

5:72 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah (himself) said: O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Lo! whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah, for him Allah hath forbidden paradise. His abode is the Fire. For evil-doers there will be no helpers.

Whats your point?

SEUN, what are YOU doing about the problem? It seems like all we do here is just talk and critisize and make judgements on other people's opinion. What have you done about it yourself?

Seun:

If you are in a position to do more than just talking, then be my guest. Nobody is stopping you. However, it is hypocritical to criticize a muslim for saying "Islam is a religion of peace" when you are sitting on your ass, also doing nothing about the problem. This is a case of pot calling kettle black, and I strongly detest that sort of hypocrisy.

Seun, when you talk about hypocrisy, whose marque are you detesting - yours, mine, or the fundamentalist Muslim's? My own 'brand' of hypocrisy (according to you) is that I am "sitting on my ass doing nothing" in the face of threats on my life!!?? The fundamentalist Muslim's hypocrisy is that he claims that "Islam is a religion of peace" and does the exact opposite by taking innocent lives on no justified excuse other than a cartoon he has not even seen (and I am not to criticise that, abi?). Now, your own hypocrisy is that you sit down as much as I do and criticise me for being threatened with death, and also write me off as being 'hypocritical to criticize a muslim for saying "Islam is a religion of peace" when the Qur'an openly sanctions murder? Now see who's the pot calling kettle black. I am not half as intelligent as you are when it comes to confusing issues the way you do; but I certainly know that "talk" is cheap in the face of raw violence and murder.

But you are also talking. That's my point. You have not done anymore than the people you are criticizing. It's an obvious point that doesn't need to be repeated, but I will repeat it anyway.

How can you sit there and accuse others of doing what is not their duty when you yourself have not done anything? Is anybody here a police officer? Is anyone here armed? Because as far as I am concerned, the armed forces are the only people who can stop this. The muslims who are bold enough to stand up and say "no, this is not allowed in Islam" should be encouraged. The police should also be encouraged to do their job of simple crimesolving.

The biggest hypocrisy is that after each cowardly terrorist act the vast majority of Muslims remain quiet and don't condemn these actions. You do not see them demonstrating on the streets against mindless violence or the murder of Innocent women and children. But draw a stupid cartoon and they go into a rage and spend days looting and burning their own cities!

These type of hypocrites disgust me!

How can you sit there and accuse others of doing what is not their duty when you yourself have not done anything? Is anybody here a police officer? - Seun_

If it is not the responsibility of Shehu of Borno, The Sultan of Sokoto, the Emir of Kano, The Imams , that zamfara idiot, and other so called leaders of Islam in Nigeria to educate their followers about the importance of non-violence. Whose duty is it?

zebudaya:

How can you sit there and accuse others of doing what is not their duty when you yourself have not done anything? Is anybody here a police officer? - Seun_

If it is not the responsibility of Shehu of Borno, The Sultan of Sokoto, the Emir of Kano, The Imams , that zamfara idiot, and other so called leaders of Islam in Nigeria to educate their followers about the importance of non-violence. Whose duty is it?

He says it is my 'hypocritic' duty!

zebudaya:

How can you sit there and accuse others of doing what is not their duty when you yourself have not done anything? Is anybody here a police officer? - Seun_

If it is not the responsibility of Shehu of Borno, The Sultan of Sokoto, the Emir of Kano, The Imams , that zamfara idiot, and other so called leaders of Islam in Nigeria to educate their followers about the importance of non-violence. Whose duty is it?

As far as I know:
- kismat is not the Shehu of Borno.
- kismat is not the Sultan of Sokoto.
- kismat is not the Emir of Kano'
- kismat is not the Zamfara 'idiot'.

Now, even if kismat is an Imam, if all he can do is go to the mosque and make his followers understand that suicide bombing and similar inhuman vices are unislamic, then that would be an excellent contribution. It would rob those violent people of the justificatyion they claim. Many imams and muslims are not willing to do even this, so I we should encourage those that are.

I think its the duty of the Islamic leadership in Nigeria to educate Muslims in nigeria that Suicide bombing is not the way to go,

I JUST PRAY SUICIDE BOMBINGS DONT START IN NIGERIA O, Amen, Amen

Seun:

As far as I know:
- kismat is not the Shehu of Borno.
- kismat is not the Sultan of Sokoto.
- kismat is not the Emir of Kano'
- kismat is not the Zamfara 'idiot'.

Now, even if kismat is an Imam, i[b]f all he can do is go to the mosque and make his followers understand that suicide bombing and similar inhuman vices are unislamic,[/b] then that would be an excellent contribution. It would rob those violent people of the justificatyion they claim.

---

, so I we should encourage those that are.

Seun At the end of the day you are stilll saying the same thing I am saying. You just thought it was beneath you to agree with me at first. Typical naija behavior. You had to argue the hard way . Kismat and other "peaceful muslims", the Shehu,Sultan,Emir other Islamic leaders should make an "excellent contribution" of educating their fellowers about the importance of non-violence. Until then they should stop releasing press releases, and posting on message boards about Islam being a "peaceful religon"
End of story.

zebudaya: You are very ignorant to think that all the people on this forum are Christians. For your information, there are many many muslims on this forum and by posting this message, kismat has succeeded in saying something important to them. THat is a step I greatly applaud.

and when did i assume everybody on the forum was christian?

I'm going to get a life, i suggest you leave that cyber cafe and get one too.

Islam & Peace
Muslim propagandists are nowadays making extraordinary efforts to change the image of Islam by reintroducing it to the Western society as a religion that calls for peace and rejects violence. One of the new theories that they are trying to sell is that the name of their religion Islam implies the meaning of ‘Peace’, which in Arabic is Salam. The grounds for their theory is that both words are derived from the same root in the Arabic language!

While it may be possible to deceive those who do not speak Arabic or those who do not know much about Islam, propaganda like this does not fool someone who knows the Arabic language and the teaching of Islam, a religion that was established by violence and still believes in violence as a principal and as a way of life. The relationships between Muslims themselves and between them and all other nations have always been based on terror and still is. Islam and Salam are two incongruous words that share no common ground either in name or in substance.

In order to find the meaning of a certain word in the Arabic dictionary, it is essential to search for the three letter infinitive verb which is called the root. Many words can be derived from the same root, but they don't necessarily have to have any similarity in their meaning. The word Islam, which means ‘submission’, is derived from the infinitive Salama. So is the word Salam which means ‘peace’ and so is the verb Salima which means ‘to be saved or to escape from danger’. One of the derivations of the infinitive Salama means ‘the stinging of a snake’ or ‘The tanning of the leather’. Hence, if the word Islam has something to do with the word Salam i.e. ‘Peace’, does that also mean that it must be related to the ‘stinging of the snake’ or ‘tanning the leather’?

Muhammad used to send letters to the kings and leaders of the surrounding countries and tribes, inviting them to surrender to his authority and to believe in him as the messenger of Allah. He always ended his letters with the following two words: "Aslem, Taslam!". Although these two words are derived from the same infinitive Salama which is the root of Salam, i.e. ‘Peace’, neither one of them implies the meaning of ‘peace’. The sentence means ‘surrender and you will be safe’, or in other words, ‘surrender or face death’. So where is the meaning of ‘Peace’ in such a religion that threatens to kill other people if they don't submit to it?

On the other hand, the Qur'an and other Islamic books like Al-Hadith and Al-Sira, i.e. the life of Muhammad, are full of evidence which proves that had it not been for violence, Islam wouldn't have existed or wouldn't have survived until today. A good example to mention would be The Wars Of Al-Riddah, i.e. ‘the wars against the apostates’, that began immediately after the death of Muhammad. Feeling relieved by the disappearance of the strong fearful leader Muhammad, the tribes which have been forced to embrace Islam, revolted and began, one after another, to renegade and to refuse paying the taxes imposed on them by the Prophet's government. In response to the revolution, the first Caliph, Abu-Bakr, ordered his army to fight the apostates. It took him almost two years of fighting to force the tribes back into the fold of Islam. These wars were not ordered only by the first Caliph, but they were also instructed by Allah and his messenger Muhammad. The Qur'an states clearly that those who go back from Islam are to be punished by death: "But if they turn renegades seize them and slay them wherever ye find them and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks. Al-Nisaa 4:89." Muhammad also said, as narrated by Al-Bukhari, "If somebody - a Muslim - discards his religion, kill him."

The Qur'an not only ordered the killing of those who embraced Islam and afterwards decided to renegade, but also commanded the followers to fight all nations until they either believe in it, pay the Jizya or face death:


"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the last day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and his apostle nor acknowledge the religion of truth of the people of the Book (the Jews and the Christians) until they pay the Jizya with willing submission and feel themselves subdued. Surat At-Tauba 9:29"
And in the same Sura, verse 5, the Qur'an also states: "Fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem , " Now doesn't the image of Islam as a religion of peace sound, after all, a little bit hard to believe? ,

source = http://www.answering-islam.org.uk/Hoaxes/salamislam.html

kismat:

Please read the verse again and understand it. This is talking about a precise moment during the time of prophet muhammed. The quran was not revealed in one go. It was revealed to prophet Muhammed at a specific time and due to a specific reason. This verse talks about those who disbelieved and made the lives of muslims difficult, torturing, killing them and taking their property. They wanted Muslims to turn back to idol worship instead of worshipping only One God.

Same as above. As you can see, idol worship and not the people of the book is what is being refered to. The people of the book are Christians and Jews.

The statement in brackets are your own or a comment made by someone trying to press a point which is just bogus. Read the first verse. Those who figh Allah, will fight not HIM directly but the believers hence as a believer, you have the right to defend yourself. This is not "turn the other cheek" sort of justice. I and certainly any person with reasonble common sense will defend themselves when physically abused. There's no compulsion in religion. Why is it that Islam is the fastest going religion in the world? Look at the U.S., why are they converting en-masse? because american muslims have daggers underneath their throats or sending them mail bombs? no. Unlike many, they buy the quran, read it and understand it.

Whats your point?

None of what you said convinced me one bit that islam is a peaceful religion, infact you just made me believe me it even more.

4:89 They long that ye should disbelieve even as they disbelieve, that ye may be upon a level (with them). So choose not friends from them till they forsake their homes in the way of Allah; if they turn back (to enmity) then take them and kill them wherever ye find them, and choose no friend nor helper from among them
[color=#990000]

So just because they made life difficult for muslims allah teaches you to kill them? Somehow that does not seem like the actions of 'a religion of peace'.[/color]

[b]5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom; (Anyone who resist Islam is deemed to be making war with Allah)


The statement in brackets are your own or a comment made by someone trying to press a point which is just bogus. Read the first verse. Those who figh Allah, will fight not HIM directly but the believers hence as a believer, you have the right to defend yourself. This is not "turn the other cheek" sort of justice. I and certainly any person with reasonble common sense will defend themselves when physically abused. There's no compulsion in religion. Why is it that Islam is the fastest going religion in the world? Look at the U.S., why are they converting en-masse? because american muslims have daggers underneath their throats or sending them mail bombs? no. Unlike many, they buy the quran, read it and understand it. [/b]

Still violent, This just sums up war, So if someone bombs your country because you are muslim, allah teaches you to bomb there country back? You see this is violence it just backs up my claim that islam is not a peaceful religion it is in fact a violent one. As for islam is the fastest growing religion. This is because islam is a fashion religion, expecially amoung teenagers (as i am one myself) many teenagers want to fight and because they know that islam allows this. They have no problem converting. Also, every situation that happens against muslims they take it as a chance to kill the kufarrs and believe allah is happy. Yes islam is the fastest growing but Christianity has the most believers. So this means that after islam grows people see the truth and come to God! Glory be to God![font=Lucida Sans Unicode][/font][/color][color=#990000]

softee,
Allah teaches us patience and mercy so i hope that u do not accuse of such a thing as that Allah teaches us crimes. As Kismat said b4, islam condems such act because ts killing innocent souls, so pls rethnk of ur ideas that islam is an agressive religion.
as for the verses u gave us i support Kismats response because if u thnk of this question u will know what really happened.
If Jesus(may gods prayers and peace fall on him) gets into a war ppl will sacrifice their lives to protect the prophet and his message from God is that right?!
well this is the case of us the muslims but pls do not go back to the wrong idea the we support suicide bombs because remember that Islam condemns such act.
thank u

Maybe Islam condemns these acts, but it seems the followers of Islam don't.

What is a religion without people. Why do Muslims not demonstrate against these murderous terrorist actions? Can it be that they are only capable of burning flags?

Agree with Reverend
I was in the midst of the suicide bombing attacks on the London tube on July 7th 2005 and these people were ALL Muslims NONE of the were Christians Jews Hindus or Jedi (as I am )
In all it was very firightening noisy and Im still able to burst into tears today if I hear any loud bangs I missed one bomb nr Liverpool Street Station and one on the buus in front of me!
Al I and lots of is were trying to do was go on our way to work peacefully minding our own business, this was attempted again on July 21st thankfully for myself I was on holiday but my friends family and colleagues were not! Today, I still fear for my safety and leaving my family behind in the event I do in fact, become a statistic in the fanatics war against "The West"

I have spoken to my Muslim freinds sand they say "it is not for us to say what these people see as a war for them iin their minds they areat war who are we to say they are wrong" Im sorry but in my view all Im doing is minding my own life doing good to others as I can if there were a war as a pacifist I would refuse to fight so if ISLAM is so all peacefull then why the hell arent they standing up and saying so

There are many Muslim elders in our country who COULD make a difference if they wanted to, but they choose not to[b] judge [/b] another on what they think is their war, well its not good enough Islam, not good enough by half!!

I should be able to live a long life as a pacifist I would not harm anyone why should I not expect the same? I dont live in Utopia of course not, but I try to do as I would be done by and I harm no one. IF Muslims were TRULY condemning acts of terrorism they COULD be a little more active in doing so, the fact is , they arent!

They may not agree with it and they may not join in themselves but by doing nothing they condone what fanatics do in the name of Islam which is making a dirty word of ISLAM the world over!