IbroSaunks:

for example. to differentiate products,the formula is u (dv/dx) + v(du/dx). doing it another way would just give u a wrong answer.

Lol, The truth is that you can do calculation with programs. All of mathematics operations can be carried out in computer programming only that they are slightly done in many cases. The operators and operands, Variable assignment, values, Statements, etc are done in slight different ways from general mathematics for the computer interpreters to be able to understand them and execute them. Algorithms is not actually a formula for programming like there are formulas in mathematics, it is analytic way to tell a computer to perform a task for you rather a way to solve a problem.

from my experience, basic maths solving skills are needed like knowing 1/1000, 2/100 without consulting a calculator. most importantly a flexible mind and strong abilities for problem solving is needed

my point was, that to diffentiate an expression of that form, it is a rule to use that formula. On the other hand, if you're told to write a program that calculates the lcm of 3 numbers, there would definitely be different approaches, though some would be faster than others by a few milliseconds. Some may be better suited for smaller numbers. But there is no rule, no convention (maybe except in naming variables and methods), which makes it an art of some sort. therefore, it requires more creativity.

You need to be good in Maths to be a good programmer but you may not necessarilly be a Guru. If you start showing intererst and luckily u become a Guru, sky will be your limit. I always believe the most logical and smart people have mathematical knowledge.

guonno:

if a man = old
kill
else if
a man = young
spare
else if
he is not old or young
lock him up
else end
This is a typical program, and the simplest look at it tells u it is nothing but a piece of logic.
If y=5 and h=6, then what is k if k=y+h? Answer is 11.
A close look at the math above reveals that math is also based on logical reasoning. Therefore a good knowledge of math would aid your programming ability.

GREAT!! Concise and on point!!!

Someone said will have a library of functions to call, who wrote those functions? is it not programmers?

I think i get the point, some people want to be doing low-budget programming - download all scripts and libraries, so if there is no library or you want to do a new application that requires its own unique formulars and stuffs, it is impossible eh?

I have some experience in application programming, before i retired to web apps, and i can say that maths is a must to get to some levels.

IbroSaunks:

u can write different algos to solve a single problem, the question would be which would b more efficient given particular constraints or the context of a problem.

IbroSaunks:

for example. to differentiate products,the formula is u (dv/dx) + v(du/dx). doing it another way would just give u a wrong answer.

Learning is a life long process , and it does not hurt to have maths skills, even advanced skills. Like I said, if you are looking to focusing a lot more in designing of algorithms then you will not go wrong with brushing up on your maths skills (Asymptotics, Calculus, Differential equations, etc.). Even if you want to remain a run-of-the-mill programmer, having maths skills still will help put you up above the rest.

*dhtml:

Someone said will have a library of functions to call, who wrote those functions? is  it not programmers?

I think i get the point, some people want to be doing low-budget programming - download all scripts and libraries, so if there is no library or you want to do a new application that requires its own unique formulars and stuffs, it is impossible eh?

I have some experience in application programming, before i retired to web apps, and i can say that maths is a must to get to some levels.

You missed the context of my post. It was in response to a guy arguing about the accuracy of algorithms. My point is that even if you encounter such an equation in a programming problem, you will probably just call a function. However, even then, it will probably be for a subset of your calculations/manipulations.

Also, calling a function is easy but is your answer correct? You have to understand the function and data well enough to pass it in as an input in the right format. Think about having a multi-dimensional data as an input into a function.

Bottom line, you need math; it’s just a question of how much!

In my opinion, to be very successful at it, you have to at least like mathematics. As for being a guru, it really depends on what your definition of guru is. One thing is for sure, if you do NOT like math/problem solving, programming is definitely not for you.

afam4eva:

Beaf, this your logic get k-leg oo.

Why na?
I'm good at math and I basically write algorithms for a living; so I'm always looking up math ideas to compliment my code and after years of doing it, it has occurred to me that even highest applied math is very easily and naturally expressed in code. Loops for example, are calculus on steroids; with loops, you could do everything calculus can do and a World of stuff calculus cannot dream off; and its the same in all other areas of math.
In math you have strict grey-bearded conventions, whereas in programming there is a natural and easily comprehensible logical flow.

Because code is written in natural language and algorithms mimic the real World, a programmer can do every last thing a mathematician can do, but a mathematician cannot do the half a programmer can. Therefore, it is better to replace math with programming. In fact it is easy to predict that our grandchildren will not study math, instead they would study scientific computing.

Kobojunkie:

Learning is a life long process , and it does not hurt to have maths skills, even advanced skills. Like I said, if you are looking to focusing a lot more in designing of algorithms then you will not go wrong with brushing up on your maths skills (Asymptotics, Calculus, Differential equations, etc.). Even if you want to remain a run-of-the-mill programmer, having maths skills still will help put you up above the rest.

i had agreed with you since, its impossible to go through computer - science here without doing some math,

yes you need maths and a lot of logical reasoning.

What without mathematics are you programming without good mathematical knowledge.
The fact remains that one needs to be versatile.
90% of one's task as a programmer involves mathematics.
Think of the 3dimensional diagram and lots more.

Its obvious that one would need maths to be a good programmer. I even mentioned that computer -science as a whole is a branch of applied math. The question is if one needs to be a GURU, i.e. if one needs to b, like really really good at it,

An above average knowledge of mathematics (including abstract mathematics) could enhance programming skills. Otherwise, one becomes a programmer who gets stuck every now and then - this makes programming fun wane as a result.

@topic

Hell No!

Maths has hardly anything to do with programming. There are applications that need maths ability but not all.

It is good to know maths for programming but you surely don't have to be a maths guru.

What you need for programming is worldly experience & observation, aptitude for systems thinking (i.e. thinking about how different modules in a system interact and work together efficiently) and how systems will be and can be used.

Good programmers have comprehensive thinking. They are gurus in understanding the total possible usage and using style of a system by people.

like somebody has already commented: computer science & programming is applied maths, but given that virtually all libraries required to build nearly any project\programme to solve life's problems has been written & freely available, then u don't need to be a maths guru in order to make a living programming. but for the guys who actually developed the systems & environments that we all play with in the name of programming, they definitely need to be very good in maths.

^^^I believe some of you people talking are talking based on theory and have not really developed professional applications. If we are talking of learning programming and using functions and libraries - then you dont need to be a maths guru.

But to be a good programmer, is a different thing entirely. I believe that a good programmer should not be handicapped when it comes to maths or whatever. My programming master for instance develop banking applications, so maths libraries will assist and do all the work for him eh?

Nnaemiemax:

GREAT!! Concise and on point!!!

If you began to debug that simple program you would find out that the statement is not wrong but the names are not properly addressed for the interpreter not to generate error messages. It might be concise but there are errors already that I can see - that is the reasoning side to it.The mathematical side of it is basically about calculations. General mathematics is good but being a guru is an advantage.

^^^
It means I must defaecate on my pants before I can know that it smell horribly bad?(it is rhetoric).

@Omo_to_dun, how am I supposed to see ur post from far away if u don't use ur signature font?

*dhtml:

^^^I believe some of you people talking are talking based on theory and have not really developed professional applications. If we are talking of learning programming and using functions and libraries - then you dont need to be a maths guru.

But to be a good programmer, is a different thing entirely. I believe that a good programmer should not be handicapped when it comes to maths or whatever[b]. My programming master for instance develop banking applications, so maths libraries will assist and do all the work for him eh?[/b]

All Programmers are not equal

          a) there is your run-of-the-mill web developer who happens to build forms using existing libraries and open source ware where much of the real brainwork, and core functionality has already been  coded.

           b) there are those who rely to a great deal on Math libraries to accomplish many of the work they need done. We are talking people who probably work on banking applications e.g calculating totals, summations etc.

           c) then there are those who do serious programming, develop core libraries, APIs and handle such problem as ensuring that code produced is   optimized. These people need to research topics to find applicable formulas, and then code up the best algorithm to calculate final results and what not. e.g, those who work in security , or the guys who came up with the Page Rank algorithm that Google currently uses.

You cannot tell me you are working as such companies as Google, Argonne-labs, NIH, Lockheed Martin, Texas Instrument,  etc  (not simply slapping together their web site) building their core infrastructure, and without maths skills. Do a Google search on Google Company interview Questions for Programmers, and you will be shocked to note how it math laden the interview questions are for them.

It is a similar case in other engineering fields.  I suspect that what you consider some aspects of computing theory because you have not been exposed to other more involved areas in programming yourself. And this is the case with majority of programmers out there.

all4naija:

^^^
It means I must defaecate on my pants before I can know that it smell horribly bad?(it is rhetoric).

Lmao.

Come on guys, no need to show our proGRAMMER skills here.
A good programmer may not necessarily be a math guru, but a developer should definitely have above average math skills. The mason Vs the architect

Let's stop repeating ourselves in different ways,

i just thought i should post this , after i did that google search kobojunkie said *ellipsis*

http://www.impactinterview.com/2009/10/140-google-interview-questions/

omo_to_dun:



Nigerian programmers need to step up. I am tired of perusing through countless posts that seek solutions to trivial problems that can be solved by a Google Search.

Pls for once can we let a good post end a thread? Not mine, omo_to_dun's,

^^^
In your rambling mind we shouldn't air our views because you think one person can make a decision that is acceptable to all. Please,spare me that aged  perception.Most of us know Google exist for information search and your mentor don't have to remind us of the mantra.   

Thank you.

I think it is time to let people who do not already know that logic in programming is a branch of mathematics. 

IbroSaunks:

i just thought i should post this , after i did that google search kobojunkie said *ellipsis*

http://www.impactinterview.com/2009/10/140-google-interview-questions/

That is a pretty good link there.

all4naija:

^^^
In your rambling mind we shouldn't air our views because you think one person can make a decision that is acceptable to all. Please,spare me that aged  perception.Most of us know Google exist for information search and your mentor don't have to remind us of the mantra.   

Thank you.

All4naija abi all4Mumu, wetin dey make you vex today?

Hi Kobo, you sound like someone who is well informed about computer science. Please I need your help o.