Mark 6:4
But Jesus said, "Prophets are honored by everyone, except the people of their hometown and their relatives and their own family."

People usually criticise what they dont understand . There is a general level where we can all function by faith . For comfort ,edify etc. that's what most spiritually limited christian dwell and judge others.

We can all function to a level in spiritual ability. There's the general prophecy by faith. There is Gift of Prophecy and there's a third level which is the office of a prophet. Most people don't understand the office of the prophet. He may not be comforting or edifying . A prophet can judge! He can pronounce judgement On a nation or individual. A prophet does not necessary have to say sweet things. He warns of dangers and judgment . He has spiritual authority. He also gives direction and instructions. When a prophet warns of dangers coming , he shouldn't be label as prophet of doom. He is not an exhorter. But he may give exhortation. We must understand the ministry and office of The Prophet.

People usually quote 1corinthiana 14 to judge a prophet.

1 Corinthians 14:3
But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.


When Elisha pronounce judgment on those hooligans youth was it an exhortation or comfort. We should not misuse one verse without understanding to judge ministry gift.

The man giving exportation, comfort may not be a prophet . You may prophesy but you are not a prophet. Just as you may evangelize but you and not an evangeslist. You only do it by faith. To be an evangelist is a call , it's an office . To be a prophet is a call and an office. Let's try to understand this office and respect the prophets among us.

Joagbaje:
Mark 6:4
But Jesus said, "Prophets are honored by everyone, except the people of their hometown and their relatives and their own family."

People usually criticise what they dont understand . There is a general level where we can all function by faith . For comfort ,edify etc. that's what most spiritually limited christian dwell and judge others.

We can all function to a level in spiritual ability. There's the general prophecy by faith. There is Gift of Prophecy and there's a third level which is the office of a prophet. Most people don't understand the office of the prophet. He may not be comforting or edifying . A prophet can judge! He can pronounce judgement On a nation or individual. A prophet does not necessary have to say sweet things. He warns of dangers and judgment . He has spiritual authority. He also gives direction and instructions. When a prophet warns of dangers coming , he shouldn't be label as prophet of doom. He is not and exhorter. We must understand the ministry and office of The Prophet. When Elisha pronounce judgment on those hooligans youth was it an exhortation or comfort. We should not misuse one verse without understanding to judge ministry gift.

The man giving exportation, comfort may not be a prophet . You may prophesy but you are not a prophet. Just as you may evangelize but you and not an evangeslist. You only do it by faith. To be an evangelist is a call , it's an office . To be a prophet is a call and an office. Let's try to understand this office and respect the prophets among us.

Sharaap.


This is how you brainwash your fellow christians into allowing prophets to commit atrocities.


As for prophet Elijah and the bears. You clealy know that it is wrong and that it is murder but as a christian apologist, you spin it and say that it is an "exhortation"


Where in the bible does it say that the youths were hooligans? Where? You are a fake

Pls kindly close the door behind you if you have no meaningful thing to contribute

Well explained! may God open our spiritual eyes and ears.

Joagbaje: Mark 6:4
But Jesus said, "Prophets are honored by everyone, except the people of their hometown and their relatives and their own family."

People usually criticise what they dont understand . There is a general level where we can all function by faith . For comfort ,edify etc. that's what most spiritually limited christian dwell and judge others.

We can all function to a level in spiritual ability. There's the general prophecy by faith. There is Gift of Prophecy and there's a third level which is the office of a prophet. Most people don't understand the office of the prophet. He may not be comforting or edifying . A prophet can judge! He can pronounce judgement On a nation or individual. A prophet does not necessary have to say sweet things. He warns of dangers and judgment . He has spiritual authority. He also gives direction and instructions. When a prophet warns of dangers coming , he shouldn't be label as prophet of doom. He is not an exhorter. But he may give exhortation. We must understand the ministry and office of The Prophet.

People usually quote 1corinthiana 14 to judge a prophet.

1 Corinthians 14:3
But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.


When Elisha pronounce judgment on those hooligans youth was it an exhortation or comfort. We should not misuse one verse without understanding to judge ministry gift.

The man giving exportation, comfort may not be a prophet . You may prophesy but you are not a prophet. Just as you may evangelize but you and not an evangeslist. You only do it by faith. To be an evangelist is a call , it's an office . To be a prophet is a call and an office. Let's try to understand this office and respect the prophets among us.

Great thread.

Can't we pray and change prophecies especially danger. Why do some prophets dwell more on confirmation, I thought prophecies are warnings, meaning even the prophets should not just wait for them to happen but pray and fast if possible to avert it. Is the office of the prophet just declaring what must happen?

Joagbaje: Pls kindly close the door behind you if you have no meaningful thing to contribute

lol, you think your lies will not be challenged?


Please, show me where the bible says that the youths were hooligans like you said.


Everyone can see that you're a liar.

logicboy:

Sharaap.


This is how you brainwash your fellow christians into allowing prophets to commit atrocities.


As for prophet Elijah and the bears. You clealy know that it is wrong and that it is murder but as a christian apologist, you spin it and say that it is an "exhortation"


Where in the bible does it say that the youths were hooligans? Where? You are a fake

Calm down this is suppose to be a discussion not a thug fight. Perhaps the use of the word "Hooligans" was an insolvent analogous proximate and an aberration from the thought that was intended to be communicated because the bible didn't really call them Hooligans but the bible didn't also qualify the action of the prophet as an act of murder like you tried to portray. So where did you get your verdict from.

I love the authority the prophets of old were working with, they were the rulers of the nations those days. There words were law, even though they had kings, the kings were subject to the prophets. They rule successfully by been submissive to the words of the prophets. That made the big differences between king Saul and king David. Saul had no regard for the words of the prophet and lost the kingdom to David who had high regard for the prophets and their words. Also between David and Solomon, David had a fulfilled end because his friends were the Prophets. During David time you always read, prophet Nathan is here to see you but in Solomon time what you read is the Queen of Sheba is here or he has married the daughter of this king or that king from strange lands and in the end, though he was the wisest king that ever lived, he also did the most foolish act and reduced himself to the service of strange gods.
Imagine a prophet pronouncing judgement on an entire nation. 3 and a half years of no rain and when he decided they must have learnt there lesson he called forth rain again. Wow! This is awesome. I pray for thesame authority to rest and abide with the Prophets of our day. And that they will be conscious of the authority that God has given them and fearlessly change our nations for good.

Unfortunately, you'll keep praying and it will never happen...

If only our leaders will recognize the authority God has given to the Prophets and seek their counsel, they will lead and rule flawlessly.

newmi:
Calm down this is suppose to be a discussion not a thug fight. Perhaps the use of the word "Hooligans" was an insolvent analogous proximate and an aberration from the thought that was intended to be communicated because the bible didn't really call them Hooligans but the bible didn't also qualify the action of the prophet as an act of murder like you tried to portray. So where did you get your verdict from.

How do you define murder? "Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human,"

If I unleashed a pack of bears to kill your family for mocking me, is that not murder?



How do you define hooligans? "A violent young troublemaker, typically one of a gang"

Were the youths violent? The bible only said that they mocked his bald head.

sophiap: I love the authority the prophets of old were working with, they were the rulers of the nations those days. There words were law, even though they had kings, the kings were subject to the prophets. They rule successfully by been submissive to the words of the prophets. That made the big differences between king Saul and king David. Saul had no regard for the words of the prophet and lost the kingdom to David who had high regard for the prophets and their words. Also between David and Solomon, David had a fulfilled end because his friends were the Prophets. During David time you always read, prophet Nathan is here to see you but in Solomon time what you read is the Queen of Sheba is here or he has married the daughter of this king or that king from strange lands and in the end, though he was the wisest king that ever lived, he also did the most foolish act and reduced himself to the service of strange gods.
Imagine a prophet pronouncing judgement on an entire nation. 3 and a half years of no rain and when he decided they must have learnt there lesson he called forth rain again. Wow! This is awesome. I pray for thesame authority to rest and abide with the Prophets of our day. And that they will be conscious of the authority that God has given them and fearlessly change our nations for good.

JOAGBAJE, DO YOU SEE THE EXTREMISM THAT YOU ARE PREACHING? Sohiap agrees with you and wants the nation to become a theocracy where prohphets are answerable to no one but God. He wants prophets to have the ability to withhold rain for 3 days and let people die of famine and starvation because they did not worship his God.


Death for not being christian. Are you any different from Boko Haram?

I know my God to be one who's ears are always open to answer the prayers of the saints so I definetly know my Prayers will be answered because he takes joy in answering my Prayers.
If your prayers are not answered, that means you've not be putting your faith to work; without faith it is impossible to please God. Always remember that.

I usually don't agree with you, but I have to here.. one of the reasons I'm agnostic... the Christian God is indeed a jealous God, and I suspect the Bible is a version of the Israelites experience... imagine the Amalekites that were wiped out because they didn't believe him. Imagine the Canaanites that were chased out of their land by the former slaves of another kingdom...

My favorite war game, Call of Duty, has this scene in which one the characters says "History is written by the victor"...

musKeeto: I usually don't agree with you, but I have to here.. one of the reasons I'm agnostic... the Christian God is indeed a jealous God, and I suspect the Bible is a version of the Israelites experience... imagine the Amalekites that were wiped out because they didn't believe him. Imagine the Canaanites that were chased out of their land by the former slaves of another kingdom...

My favorite war game, Call of Duty, has this scene in which one the characters says "History is written by the victor"...

Thank you for speaking out against such extremism

logicboy:

lol, you think your lies will not be challenged?


Please, show me where the bible says that the youths were hooligans like you said.

Everyone can see that you're a liar.

You could have simply ask questions instead of overworking your emotions.

They were not children as popularly assumed . They were accountsble young men .Here's a quote for you from amplified.

2 Kings 2:23
From Jericho he went to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, a gang of young men from the city began mocking and making fun of him because of his bald head.

Joagbaje:

You could have simply ask questions instead of overworking your emotions.

They were not children as popularly assumed . They were accountsble young men .Here's a quote for you from amplified.

2 Kings 2:23
From Jericho he went to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, a [b]gang of young men fr[/b]om the city began mocking and making fun of him because of his bald head.

If I walk down the street with 6 of my male friends, were a a gang of 7 young men. "Gang" does not mean anything unless you qualify it; gang of robbers, gang of merry men etc

logicboy:


JOAGBAJE, DO YOU SEE THE EXTREMISM THAT YOU ARE PREACHING? Sohiap agrees with you and wants the nation to become a theocracy where prohphets are answerable to no one but God. He wants prophets to have the ability to withhold rain for 3 days and let people die of famine and starvation because they did not worship his God.


Death for not being christian. Are you any different from Boko Haram?

Every thing must not land on Jo. Why not question sophia? You dey fear am? I didn't say what Sophia said . And I may or may not agree with her.

Joagbaje:

Every thing must not land on Jo. Why not question sophia? You dey fear am? I didn't say what Sophia said . And I may or may not agree with her.

Sophia is already mad- someone that wants Prophets to withhold rain for 3 years and let people starve to death.

The problem is that you dont know the effects of your preaching. When you excuse Elijah for killing youths and say that people should respect prophets, your preaching emboldens extremists. You are just ignorant but not mad.


The worst thing is that you can not even have the decency to deny Sophia- what do you mean that you may or may not agree with her?

I understand and respect the office of the prophet...No doubt about that but I don't think any prophet has a sovereign authority to bless, curse, judge or condemn except that mandate comes from heaven.... In which case, it mostly has anyway.

Jasiel: I understand and respect the office of the prophet...No doubt about that but I don't think any prophet has a sovereign authority to bless, curse, judge or condemn except that mandate comes from heaven.... In which case, it mostly has anyway.

Another extremist

Joagbaje, are you seeing the result of your preaching? Jasiel believes that a prophet has the right to curse, judge and condemn people when the mandate comes from heaven.

How do you ascertain that the judgement comes from heaven?

Was it from heaven when Oyedepo slapped the young girl?

Logicboy I suggest u get a bible. It would go a long way in clearing up a lot of things beyond your understanding. Elisha did not of his own accord withhold rain for the purpose of making people starve. You don't understand the circumstances in and for which those events occurred.
Besides that u argue blindly only puts ur ignorance on display. You're not as good a debater as you u so ignorantly claim.

logicboy:


How do you define murder? "Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human,"

If I unleashed a pack of bears to kill your family for mocking me, is that not murder?



How do you define hooligans? "A violent young troublemaker, typically one of a gang"

Were the youths violent? The bible only said that they mocked his bald head.

Providing a definition for murder or understanding it is by no degree a hard nut to crack for me but my point is that the bible didn't call it "MURDER" rather on the contrary, from the context we can deduce the following truths:

1) These young men in question were untrained
2) They were profane and irreverent especially in a theocracy of that nature in which almost absolute regard and reverential honour is given to a Prophet as "THE VOICE OF GOD" and an intermediary conjunction bridging the people to God and constituting an extension of God to the people so what happened to these "foolish" young men should be seen AS A DIRECT CONSEQUENCE OF THEIR ACTIONS RATHER THAN A FUNCTION OF THE PROPHET'S ACTION. This is because there is the possibility that even if the prophet had not said anything those kids wouldn't perhaps escaped their act of disregard and profaned irreverence for the "VOICE OF GOD".
It is in the same light that we view the demise of Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5 with the Apostle Peter as "THE VOICE OF GOD" in this context

Acts 5:1-11 (King James Version)
"But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession,
And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet.
But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart?
thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.
And the young men arose, wound him up, and carried him out, and buried him.
And it was about the space of three hours after, when his wife, not knowing what was done, came in.
And Peter answered unto her, Tell me whether ye sold the land for so much? And she said, Yea, for so much.
Then Peter said unto her, How is it that ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord? behold, the feet of them which have buried thy husband are at the door, and shall carry thee out.
Then fell she down straightway at his feet, and yielded up the ghost: and the young men came in, and found her dead, and, carrying her forth, buried her by her husband
And great fear came upon all the church, and upon as many as heard these things"

You see like the Apostle Peter pointed out in a profound statement ". . . why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost. . .Then Peter said unto her, How is it that ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord?. . ." The point is whatever that is done to the Prophet is done to "the one who sent or appointed him"

Jasiel: Logicboy I suggest u get a bible. It would go a long way in clearing up a lot of things beyond your understanding. Elisha did not of his own accord withhold rain for the purpose of making people starve. You don't understand the circumstances in and for which those events occurred.
Besides that u argue blindly only puts ur ignorance on display. You're not as good a debater as you u so ignorantly claim.

His purpose was to punish the King and his people. Starvation is a direct result of the punishment. No rain = no crops, no crops = no food, no food = starvation.

The bible never said that God instructed Elijah to stop the rain from falling;

"1 Kings 17
New International Version (NIV)
Elijah Announces a Great Drought

17 Now Elijah the Tishbite, from Tishbe[a] in Gilead, said to Ahab, “As the Lord, the God of Israel, lives, whom I serve, there will be neither dew nor rain in the next few years except at my word.”

newmi:
Providing a definition for murder or understanding it is by no degree a hard nut to crack for me but my point is that the bible didn't call it "MURDER" rather on the contrary, from the context we can deduce the following truths:

1) These young men in question were untrained
2) They were profane and irreverent especially in a theocracy of that nature in which almost absolute regard and reverential honour is given to a Prophet as "THE

You see like the Apostle Peter pointed out in a profound statement [b]". . . why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost. . .Then Peter said unto her, How is it that ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord?. . ." The point is whatever that is done to the Prophet is done to "the one who sent or appointed him"[/b]

1) The youth were not violent

2) The youth mocked a human being for being bald. The death penalty does not apply. Did you see that in anywhere in the 10 commandments or the other laws in Exodus?

3) The youth were not in a theocracy, they were in a monarchy. Ahab was king.

4) As for the bold part, was it not Peter that denied Jesus? Is that not denying God/a prophet of God? Hypocrisy?

5) Also for the bold part, just because something is in the bible, it doesnt mean that it is true. If I insult a prophet, the prophet is not God, I am insulting the prophet. The pope is not God and neither is pastor Chris who are men like me. Should I be senteced to death for insulting pastor Chris or the pope?

Idolatory was the main reason God punished his people. But never mind, u won't understand how grave a sin idolatory is and it isn't worth my while explaining to u.

Jasiel: Idolatory was the main reason God punished his people. But never mind, u won't understand how grave a sin idolatory is and it isn't worth my while explaining to u.

Dont make foolish assumptions. I was a christian for 22 years.


Idolatory is central to some people's religion. As Nigerians, our ancestors and great grand parents were all traditionally idol worshippers. Are you by any chance implying that our forefathers deserve famine?

logicboy:


1) The youth were not violent

2) The youth mocked a human being for being bald. The death penalty does not apply. Did you see that in anywhere in the 10 commandments or the other laws in Exodus?

3) The youth were not in a theocracy, they were in a monarchy. Ahab was king.

4) As for the bold part, was it not Peter that denied Jesus? Is that not denying God/a prophet of God? Hypocrisy?

5) Also for the bold part, just because something is in the bible, it doesnt mean that it is true. If I insult a prophet, the prophet is not God, I am insulting the prophet. The pope is not God and neither is pastor Chris who are men like me. Should I be senteced to death for insulting pastor Chris or the pope?

With no malicious intent whatsoever to discredit your stance but permit me to say that you don't seem to be reckoning with my perspective, l am not advocating that they were "violent" can't remember ever even mentioning that perhaps you might need to review my most recent post again. They were IRREVERENT AND PROFANE and it is also important that you understand that they were in a "THEOCRATIC GOVERNING SYSTEM" so the logic of HUMANE MORAL RATIONALITY does not appeal to the justice of the time. God is Merciful and Kind otherwise if we were in such a dispensation who can tell those who would still be alive where it was JUSTIFICATION BY WORKS AND SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS but thank God for His Grace.

Logicboy.
Its VERY UNLIKELY that you've ever been a Christian for 22 seconds. Being a pastor, bearing fancy titles anyone may choose, or church-going membership, do not make anyone a Christian.

sophiap: If only our leaders will recognize the authority God has given to the Prophets and seek their counsel, they will lead and rule flawlessly.

our leaders ? which prophets ? oyedepo ?

ckkris: Logicboy.
Its VERY UNLIKELY that you've ever been a Christian for 22 seconds. Being a pastor, bearing fancy titles anyone may choose, or church-going membership, do not make anyone a Christian.

You just lied. What did the bible tell you about lying, Mr Ckkris, the real christian?


I was a catholic for 22 years. I was a christian. I read the bible, fasted and prayed.

newmi:
With no malicious intent whatsoever to discredit your stance but permit me to say that you don't seem to be reckoning with my perspective, l am not advocating that they were "violent" can't remember ever even mentioning that perhaps you might need to review my most recent post again. They were IRREVERENT AND PROFANE and it is also important that you understand that they were in a "THEOCRATIC GOVERNING SYSTEM" so the logic of HUMANE MORAL RATIONALITY does not appeal to the justice of the time. God is Merciful and Kind otherwise if we were in such a dispensation who can tell those who would still be alive where it was JUSTIFICATION BY WORKS AND SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS but thank God for His Grace.

You can do ur mental gymanstics to approve murder in the bible bu it is still murder.