Probably did it for the attention . The whole thing including the apologies that would come after was planned beforehand to maintain public relevance

"Court attention at all cost"

bennyann:


Your royal highness
plenty plenty hugs

Baby boo

Long time , no see , how are you

No response after replying your message

1-1 draw with Algeria

sonofthunder:


when lion roar, wetin you expect.

Martinez39:
Princess Ebuka is back.

Not really. Just for a while lol

nwabekeyi:
I think we have a misconception here, you are trying to say that every atheist believe that anything invented by man has to be a fiction?

The point of this thread is to show that there are human mind-dependent realities atheists mistake for objective reality, considering their rejection of God.

nwabekeyi:
How is mathematics fictional?
If 1+1 is not 2, your mobile phone cannot work?

Lol. Under a theistic worldview, it is. But under a naturalistic worldview which many atheists subscribe to, it is fictional, an invention of man. It is usually argued by theists that God grounds the realness of mathematics .

@johnnydon22

I'm glad you do accept that these are fictional, illusionary or imaginary orders in your worldview as an atheist. But I do have good logical arguments to demonstrate that indeed rationality, mathematics, equality, freewill, moral responsibility , objective morality etc are not fictional but objectively real in a theistic worldview

johnydon22:


Ebuka, I see your narcissism and ego are still there.

Lol. It has been quite a long time for any of us to still remain the same.

I have been called generous, humble, kind, stupid, brilliant, selfless, selfish etc. Everyone is entitled to their opinion about anything or anyone.

And no, no one can remain the same. There will be always change.Hope you as good, bro. Long time o

malvisguy212:
lol. just last week till yesterday the atheists on nairaland are on rampant ( dem just dey disturbed us ) all of a sudden they are no were to be found.

Very likely that they didn't understand the topic. I tried my best to keep it simple sha .

MrPresident1:


You need to modify the title of the thread to reflect

Suggestions?

MrPresident1:


I find it a bit odd to say 'God's existence' like God is external to us and needs validation from us. They reject God, they themselves.No such thing as 'reject God's existence'

I understand. In fact, God doesn't exist, God is. He imparts existence to all things . I just use it since it's the conventional way of expressing the denial of the reality of God. Thank you sir for pointing that out .

MrPresident1:
No man is without excuse

Romans 1:19
Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

What is to be known of God is manifest in them, it is inherent in them, and God has also shown it to them. But they are corrupt people who deny their very essence.

Romans 1:28
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

God is good, no man has any motivation to do good except in God. So because they have refused to acknowledge God, they have become animals filled to the brim with base propensities

Romans 1:29-31
Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenant-breakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

Once again, as you've pointed out, the Bible has been proven to be correct. Rejecting God's existence puts us on the same level as animals and other purely physical beings like plants, the clouds, chairs and my wardrobe.

malvisguy212:
welcome back bro. good to see you again. watch how atheists avoid this thread like plague because it exposed their sinful desire.

Thanks bro.

Exactly! I'm not surprised none of them has said anything. I will expose more of the folly of rejecting God's existence soon.

God's existence grounds the realness of objective morality, equality of man and woman, liberty or freedom of man, laws of mathematics, moral responsibility which is the corollary of being free, rights, rationality, the laws of logic, the uniqueness of man, etc

Without God, equality, liberty, rights, mathematics, moral responsibility etc are just useful fictions created by man to understand the world and cooperate effectively. Meaning, they dont exist in actuality or reality - if there is no God, they cannot be objectively real. Instead, they only exist in our inter-subjective reality: if we believe they exist, they become "real", if we dont, then they stop existing. Just as God, which atheists claim is not real, the aforementioned are just objects of fiction invented by man! Ridiculous, right? Many atheists dont know or realize this. So, let's explore the reality of the non-existence of God and realize the folly in its fullness.

EQUALITY : If there is no God that grounds the ontological equality( our souls by nature makes us equal ) of man and woman - the soul of man and woman are equal before God - how can we say that that we are equal? What makes us equal? In what way are we equal? Equality, if there is no God, becomes a fictional creation of man to enable a functional society. The realness of equality only exists in our inter-subjective reality: if we stop believing that man and women are equal and deserve equal rights and opportunities, then it fails to exist. In the same vein, we can also create fictions like we are innately unequal that would enable a hierarchy -based society, just as ancient societies did. At this point, you can see clearly that there is no reason to denigrate patriarchy or believe that women deserve equal rights as men. Or that slavery is not okay. Slaves were once believed to have an inherent "slavish-nature". Racists can choose to believe the inequality of races or the inherent superiority of particular races to others. People who believe men are superior can point to patriarchal societies as evidence that women are inferior to men. In the future, people would be able to genetically enhance themselves to have superior physical & mental qualities, in what way would anyone prove that they are equal to unenhanced, average people?

FREEDOM AND LIBERTY, MORAL RESPONSIBILITY : If there is no God that created us and gave us souls to be free and have liberty, then we are slaves to the laws of nature, which are responsible for all that exists, according to naturalists. What makes us free? Our souls, the immaterial part of us created by God which give us the ability to make choices. Souls are not bound by the laws of nature, because they are not elements of the natural world. If you deny the existence of souls created by God and insist we are wholly physical beings, then our choices are inevitably determined by the laws of nature. That means there is no moral responsibility. There is no moral responsibility without freewill. I can't be held responsible or accountable for my actions since there were not freely committed. The laws of nature should be culpable for any action performed by all purely physical beings. The actions of man would be no different from those of the hurricane or storm or animals. Eg. Stalin and Hitler ordered the killings of millions of people and the destruction of properties, if these were not free actions, then they are no different from those of natural disasters like typhoons and hurricanes since they all operate under the laws of nature. So clearly, you being responsible for your moral actions is some illusion or fiction that you "chose" or made to believe. . There won't be rewards and punishments which are necessary for a functional society. Why should I be punished or rewarded for what the laws of nature did?

RATIONALITY : Same can be said about rationality. We are not freely thinking since we have no freedom or will as subjects of the laws of nature. How can I tell if what I believe is indeed true if I cannot freely figure them out myself? How can I know what's true? If I'm not free to think, then I'm not thinking. My thoughts are just whatever the laws of nature make me think. That is scary is, right? That is what you get when you deny God's existence. You are not rational in essence, you are simply outputting inputs given to you by the laws of nature. So indeed, we are just under the illusion of being rational. Rationality or reason is not real, it is just some fiction we choose the belief in. This reality would also undermine logical conclusions.

MATHEMATICAL LAWS : Does 1+1 really equal 2? Is it an objective and necessary truth that 2+1 equals 3? Are numbers and the laws of mathematics just useful fictions invented by man to understand the world? Isn't it crazy to deny the realness of mathematics and it's applicability in the physical world? How can objective reality be represented by something subjectively defined by man? If there is no God whose existence grounds the realness of mathematics, then they are just objects of fictions, mere abstractions, that dont exist outside the human mind. Philosophers like Plato and St Augustine argued that the mathematical truths are objective, unchanging and such cannot be products of a changing and temporary world - this means they are part of an immutable or unchanging, immaterial reality which is beyond the physical world, thus transcendent. And this proves the existence of a transcendent immaterial mind who is responsible for this transcendent reality of mathematics. The physical reality, as Plato argued, is dependent on a transcendent reality. That's why we can use mathematics - objects of a transcendent reality - to understand the physical world

UNIQUENESS OF MAN : Do you believe you are significant and different from animals, thus unique and special? Who told you that? Oh, that's just some fictional BS you've been told and made to believe. Do you realize that being subjects to the laws of nature, you are not free, you are not rational, you are a purely physical being, and your actions are already determined by the laws of nature? You are not different from other components of nature whose existence and functionality wholly depend on the laws of nature. You evolved from lower life forms, just as every other animal; sentient just as many other animals. You are purely physical and subject to the laws of nature, just like every other natural thing!

RIGHTS : Ugh! Don't tell me you actually think you have rights. That's just some made-up shit invented by man that grants us access to natural resources or any kind of resources. And guess who believe that too? Atheists! Remember, in the book of Genesis, God told Adam, the representative of mankind, that he has dominion over whatever that exists on earth: He's been given rights. But if there is no God, on what basis do we have rights?? None, if you "think" really hard about that. Because it's all fictional.

OBJECTIVE MORALITY : Do you believe that everyone should agree that it is good to love one another, to be fair, just and kind to one another, to not kill, oppress the poor etc. Now, imagine if we stopped believing that. We can go ahead to murder, hate, oppress and be unjust to another and choose to see it as a good thing. History is replete which such atrocious actions perpetrated by man. But if right or wrong is all fictional, subjective or inter-subjective, based on the whims of man, no objective standard since only God's nature provides that, then we can do all sorts of things without condemnation, because all things are permitted if there is no God. The Nazis can conclude that their actions are right and the Holocaust was morally "good", Rwanda genocide can be "justified", because without a transcendent moral authority, who makes the rules and why do you think anyone is morally obligated to follow them? So if there is no God, man is simply under the illusion that there are objectively good or bad things, and we can condemn or praise people for doing " good " or "bad" things.

CONCLUSION: So that's it, guys! Atheists assert that God is an object of fiction made up by man to understand and navigate the natural world, without understanding the implications: there is no equality, liberty, rights, mathematical laws, moral responsibility, rationality, objective morality etc. They are objects of fiction, just like God, invented by man to make sense of the world he lives in. You do realize they believe they are smart because they dont believe a particular object of fiction, God, while believing other fictions? Lol

benzics:
Hello

It's been a while here though.. Let's just go straight to the topic..

NB: We heathens do not believe in gods, but for the sake of argument, let's assume he's real

You've probably heard theists yapping about how God is all powerful, all knowing and all good, even though their various books do not agree with that, they just choose "blind faith", like what kind of an all good God kills innocent souls because some people are guilty??

Let's hit the nail on the head..

God is not Omnipotent / All powerful

From the beginning of the Bible, Genesis, it proved God is not omnipotent, because he created the earth in "6 days" and RESTED on the seventh day... Couldn't he have created everything within the twinkle of an eye? And why does an all powerful being need rest? Probably because he is not all powerful after all.. .

God is not Omniscient or Omni-knoweth and omnipresent

Remember when he was asking Adam and Eve why they were hiding? And he got mad when he discovered that they've eaten the forbidden fruit? This proves he didn't know when Adam and Eve were eating the fruit, or maybe he knew and was just trying to confirm (wait, this means he wasn't sure ), or he was sure but just trying to fu-ck with them, which makes him a joker!

God is not all good

A God who could order the killings of little kids by bears just because they mocked his prophet is everything but Good..

A God who could allow things like the Holocaust, WWII, ISIS, EBOLA, AIDS is not an all good God..

A God whom already knows your climax but just trying to fu-ck with your life is a real joker, he already knows you are going to hell but still creates you to go to hell, is that one a good God?

Is God really all knowing?
(Don't mind this one o )

Does God know how men feel when they "cum" and how women feel when they orgasm, , does God know how it feels to suck on a nice b-itchy titties?? If Yes, then God is not all good, and if no, then God is not all knowing..
(a reference by Darkmatter)

Why there is no sin

Religion made us to understand that before we were "created", God has already planned our lives, and EVERYTHING that happens is according to God's grand plan.. Which means isis is just a part of God's plan , aids, hiv, just everything is going as planned by God.. So why do you theists still term people as "sinners", when in fact they cannot choose to not do what "God has planned", so you see, it's really not their fault, but God's plan, and curse you if you go against his plans .. ...


Hopefullandlord , hahn, jonbellion, felixomor, kingebukasblog, randomperson, and y'all "infidels", come in here or burn for eternity!!! remember I love you

.
This is incredibly shallow. I usually ignore such pile of dirt but I go will ahead to VERY EASILY refute this because I was mentioned and I'm free to .

1. The word "shabat" was the Hebrew word used which was translated to "rest" , but it means “to cease or stop.” I think the English translators wanted to maintain the anthropomorphic nature of God to pass the message that we need rest - showing the importance of the Sabbath day - after long hours of work through out the other days of the week. So a direct translation that is clearly congruent with the context is " God ceased or stopped creation.

2. God asking questions doesn't mean he is not omniscient. There are many answers that I thought about to the question but I'll try to keep it simple. Remember, if you at all know that, the authors of the Bible used anthropomorphism to make God relatable to humans. So the question doesn't express a lack of knowledge of Adam's location. It is more of an expression of His desire for Adam's availability to return to his role which he abandoned hiding away from Him because of the guilt caused by his sin and rebellion.

About theophanies - which is the physical manifestation of God - God taking a human appearance limited His presence to a particular location. Yes, God is omnipresent in his full nature as a non-physical , infinite being, but when he takes a physical form, he becomes finite and confined to particular location. Christ is argued to have appeared to Adam and Eve and to Moses , so such appearances are called Christophanies - they prove the pre-existence of Christ.

3. God is The Good or Goodness. And morality is rooted in God's immutable nature. So what is morally good becomes ethically right if an only if it is congruent with the commandment of God. So whatever God commands is good, because He is The Good. Without God, there is no objective standard of goodness and morality, so you cannot subjectively define something as good or evil, when clearly, such value judgement rest entirely on your personal opinion and expect it to be necessary true regardless of personal opinion : nothing is is right or wrong if morality is subjective . So without God, The Good or Goodness, how can you evaluate a moral action as objectively good or evil? You can't. So if value judgements are entirely subjective, then anyone can say that the Holocaust was good as the Nazis thought, or child sacrifice is good as the Aztecs and worshipers of Molech thought, or serial rape and murder of women is good as practical atheist Ted Bundy insisted. What makes these things wrong if there is no God whose nature provides the objective standard of goodness??

Why does God permit evil? Because He has morally sufficient reasons to. It's that simple.

4. The word "sin" originated from a word which meant "missing the mark" or "being in error". Because there is an objective standard of morality, to fall short means to sin . Or the failure to follow God's commandment means " being in error". Example : God commands us not to lie. If you lie, then you are in error, thus have sinned.

hakeem4:
I do not know if there is an afterlife or not. But it’s plausible that there is might not be an afterlife because there is no evidence

Can you bring an argument to support your position? If you think there is none.

"No evidence" is an intellectually lazy response

Earth-flatners also claim there is no evidence for a spherical earth. So anyone can throw "no evidence" to avoid the intellectual rigor of showing their position is reasonable

LordReed:


It is you who fails to understand what you are implying. Does the so called lack of evidence for naturalism et al mean that the lack of evidence for a god fails? Answer that simple question lemme see whether you are honest.

Uncle, no. The inconsistent propositional attitude is why I said no one should take you people seriously. You are intransigent about the lack of evidence for God claiming all rational and ruled by logic but having hot romantic relationship with naturalism et al and/or having beliefs that ain't supported by any evidence . That's laughable!

malvisguy212:
everything is fine bro, felixmore is still on sabbatical leave ?

I think so. And I don't think I'd be coming back anytime soon after today because clearly, there has been no intellectual challenge offered by atheists that've ignited my interest. Its even worse, no disrespect to anyone though.

IAmSabrina:

This entire conversation is a heavy strawman fallacy and i can't keep repeating why

Also, If you adopt a scientific view, then you can agree that life is possible on earth because of the specific circumstance of the earth, having the right chemical makeup, being just far away enough from the sun to enable the reactions that created life.

Alien is just a term for a creature existing on something that isn't earth; AKA something similar as to what happened in our circumstance--just somewhere else. Now how many sun-like stars are there in the universe? A number we can't even fathom. So it's not that far-fetched to assume that type of circumstance happened elsewhere, is it?

Now we go to the concept of god. In a common perception, he is an entity that created everything and it is a totally human concept. By that I mean that god is centered around us wanting to feel safe--heaven, being forgiven, having a reason to live, moral definition. It's almost like an organized defense mechanism to existence, right?

So aliens are just a reasonable assumption based on what we've observed, where the other is not that at all.

Lol. I still can't believe you haven't grasped the message yet.

And even if you do, atheism is still independent of them.

No one is saying this. My post is clear. You still have few hours left if you want to have a discussion with me. I don't have that much time for frivolities.

LordReed:

You are clearly saying if we subscribe to self refuting positions then the atheist position falls.

You are the one who keeps on making this false conclusion.

It's laughable to subscribe to self refuting, unproven positions and to hold beliefs in general that have no evidence while claiming to lack the belief in God because there is supposedly no proof. Your propositional attitude should be consistent : you shouldn't subscribe to unproven positions like naturalism *or hold beliefs that have no evidence just like you don't with theism(which you believe isn't supported by evidence)

Do you and IamSabrina understand it now?

Ihedinobi3:

I think that you're exactly right. I have spent some time answering atheists and listening to atheism, and my verdict is that there is no real objection that atheists have to theism, and certainly none at all to Christ.

However, free will is the most powerful thing in the Universe. God made it so. This is precisely what makes God say to creatures that He made ex nihilo that they are gods. That is pretty serious. It is also why a human being can look at all existence around him and pretend that they see absolutely nothing. That is what free will makes possible.

For this reason, I don't think it is worth the energy and time to try to reason with atheists. I am happy to answer their questions where it is worth it to answer them, and to correct their misconceptions about the Bible where it is useful for other readers. Otherwise, I am not interested in or concerned with their objections, since they are nothing more than insane excuses.

Exactly!

malvisguy212:
lol. indeed you are welcome bro. good to know you are alright.

Thanks bro. Thank God for everything. What about you, I hope everything is fine?

LordReed:


The topic of this thread puts a lie to this. One Good Reason Why You Shouldn't Take Atheists Seriously because their arguments are based on self refuting positions is your implication. And when it is pointed out to you again and again your error, you hide under the pretext that that is not what you mean. You ain't fooling us you know.

Again, you don't understand the point as the emboldened text shows. Read my latest response to IamSabrina. If you can't comprehend that too, then there is nothing else I can do man tbh

hakeem4:
First of all soul is a religious construct. There is no scientific evidence for it.

It's philosophical to some extent.

There is no scientific evidence for numbers and mathematical laws but you still accept them as true and evident.

Science studies nature. End of story. And that's why it's so limited.

LordReed:


No they are not but even if they are so what?

Lol. They are indeed

So what? That's why I wrote the post. You clearly didn't understand the message. Read it again... And again... Till you finally understand it!

IAmSabrina:







SMH, KingEbukasBlog. No one's going back to read your OP. It's your duty to lay a good foundation in your OP so that we can all follow properly from there.

Till then, i still stand by my earlier response

The point is clear : atheists subscribing to the positions which are self refuting, irrational and not supported by evidence contradicts their take on theism and God's existence.

Here's a simple dialogue to illustrate my point

Atheist : I'm a rational person, I lack the belief in God because there is no evidence

Me : really? But you subscribe to positions like naturalism, skepticism, logical positivism that are self-refuting and not supported by evidence.

Atheist : Errrmm

Me : I understand you also think aliens exist

Atheist : yeah, I do

Me : so where is the evidence that such exist?

Atheist : there is none actually

Me : so you lack belief in God because, supposedly, there isn't evidence to support that belief... But you think aliens exist without any evidence and you subscribe to positions that are self refuting and not supported by evidence??

Atheist : lol yeeaaahhh

Me : so I shouldn't take you seriously then because of the contradictory propositional attitude

Atheist : I'm really sorry for disturbing your peace. I'm clearly irrational

LordReed:


Yes

Do you know positions such as, naturalism, skepticism, logical positivism which many atheists subscribe to are not only not supported by evidence but are self-refuting?

IAmSabrina:

Its the widely accepted definition and for good reason but OK.

What is your definition, pray tell?


LOL. This is just a massive strawman.

Atheism itself has nothing more or less to do than with the lack of belief in gods. Of course it is compatible with materialism and all the philisophies you listed. Being an atheist is its own thing.I


OK. Pause.

First of all you are committing the fallacies of strawmanning & generalization for thinking ALL atheists share these beliefs

Secondly, its glaringly obvious you know little about atheism.

You'll probably need
this before you can take your argument any further

I think you should read the topic and my post again to properly grasp the message being passed here.

hakeem4:
First of all soul is a religious construct. There is no scientific evidence for it. The answer is we do not know what happens when we die. If you notice the afterlife myth was created so that those who lost their loved ones can reunite
My question is why should there be life after death if there was no life before birth ?

You are contradicting yourself. There is no afterlife like you previously claimed or that you don't know for sure