mhmsadyq:

You are right. Someone new may be following this conversation.
The "you" is sagenaija and the[b]"We"[/b] is sagenaija and enilove.
Are you happy now?

Delusion is real!

We're seeing here how people can brainwash themselves with a PROPAGANDA they've been fed with.

Claim by Moslems:
All the words of the Koran are direct words of Allah
Enquiry by non-moslem:
So, when Allah speaking in Koran chapter 1 says - 'You alone do we worship...' and then
'Guide us in the straight path' who is Allah referring to?

Answer by Moslem:
According to our scholar 1 and scholar 2 and scholar 3 we are suppose to recite it. It has been given to us to recite.
Question by non-moslem:
Ok, you are supposed to recite it. But where did Allah say there that you are supposed to recite it?

Answer by Moslem:
So you don't understand how we are supposed to recite it. That is the beauty of our Din. It's the only true Din. Just look there you'll see it. If you don't it must be because Allah has misguided you.
Response by non-moslem:
Can't you just show me since you have been rightly guided?

Answer by Moslem:
Why not just accept whatever the believers in Allah say instead of arguing on what you have no knowledge. Don't you know that Islam means 'surrender' your brains and just accept whatever you are told? So, just take it, even if you don't understand.
Response by non-moslem:
But my question has not been answered. Who is Allah referring to in that portion of the Koran?

Answer by Moslem:
You have been answered. Allah knows best.

Rashduct4luv:


I think i will give you my final submission on all these your rantings. The Qur'an takes cognizance of the tradition of the Prophet and that's why Allah says in so many verses " Obey Allah and Obey the Messenger". We obey the messenger by following his traditions.

What are the context of the verses you quoted up there?

Do you think it's just like John 3:16 you guys quote without wanting to know the context, who was talking, who was being spoken to, who witnessed the speech, who wrote it, how reliable are they all, etc?
And Allah swear by any of His creation He wishes to but we swear by Him only.

Good bye!

Your brother Abdul, Empiree, had claimed some time ago that "all the words of the Qur'an are direct words of Allah" unlike the Bible". You seem to be disagreeing with him.

Sometimes one wonders how you guys passed your exams. But it may be that you allow yourselves to be smarter when it comes to your academics than you do your religion.

I gave you the Koran verses in points. I asked that you help us out by taking them one by one. You end up with just a fleeting remark on one of them. And the next thing you'll do is to tell the world 'He has been answered!'.

I take your silence on the others to mean that:,
1. It is the angel telling Mohamed he's not here to watch over their doings, as each man is for himself.
2. The angel (or Mohamed) has been commanded to serve and to bow in Islam to Allah's will.

So, it not only Allah's words we have in the Koran.

On the last one: usually a lesser swears by a higher being or thing. But you are saying
Allah swear by any of His creation....
A greater swearing by the lesser.
That's very interesting!

Cheers!

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
Delusion is real!

We're seeing here how people can brainwash themselves with a PROPh they've been fed with.

[b]Claim by Moslems:
All the words of the Koran are direct words of Allah
Enquiry by non-moslem:
So, when Allah speaking in Koran chapter 1 says - 'You alone do we worship...' and then
'Guide us in the straight path' who is Allah referring to?

Answer by Moslem:
According to our scholar 1 and scholar 2 and scholar 3 we are suppose to recite it. It has been given to us to recite.
Question by non-moslem:
Ok, you are supposed to recite it. But where did Allah say there that you are supposed to recite it?

Answer by Moslem:
So you don't understand how we are supposed to recite it. That is the beauty of our Din. It's the only true Din. Just look there you'll see it. If you don't it must be because Allah has misguided you.
Response by non-moslem:
Can't you just show me since you have been rightly guided?

Answer by Moslem:
Why not just accept whatever the believers in Allah say instead of arguing on what you have no knowledge. Don't you know that Islam means 'surrender' your brains and just accept whatever you are told? So, just take it, even if you don't understand.
Response by non-moslem:
But my question has been answered. Who is Allah referring to in that portion of the Koran?

Answer by Moslem:
You have been answered. Allah knows best.

Mtcheeeew.

I guessed you won't be pleased with my answer and i guessed rightly.
Continue...

Anyways, How does these stops me from worshipping Allah?

sagenaija:

Did you say CONTEXT?
Does the Koran have a context?
What is the exegesis of that portion?

All that you wrote there was your own making. Why do I say this?

According to Islam Allah is the one speaking in the Koran. According to the Koran it makes things clear:
Alif Lam Ra. A Book whose verses are set clear, and then distinguished, from One All-wise, All-aware: S. 11:1

A book that fully and clearly explains everything,

… Shall I seek a judge other than Allah while it is He Who has sent down unto you the Book (The Qur'an), explained in detail… S. 6:114 Hilali-Khan

… And We have sent down on thee the Book making clear everything, and as a guidance and a mercy, and as good tidings to those who surrender. S. 16:89 Arberry

A Book whereof the Verses are explained in detail; A Qur'an in Arabic for people who know S. 41:3 Hilali-Khan

So, tell us where or how
"Allah directed the servant to invoke Him constantly" in that portion (or even elsewhere) since the book (Koran) itself says it makes things clear.

NOTHING in that portion says anything like "Allah instructs you to invoke him like this.....". Not even the usual 'say' is here. Running to 'context' and 'exegesis' is therefore an attempt to reconcile the irreconcilable. Your comments have no support from anywhere in the Koran.

You accuse Matthew of committing grammatical blunder but here you are ignoring the glaring blunder by Allah. You're trying to make amends for him. Didn't he say he makes things clear? Why should it now take the MAGIC of Moslem REINTERPRETATION to explain what should plain?
You have just simply refused to see the obvious. You feel you must defend the indefensible.

Subhanallah! So you still dey here?

The context of the Qur'an is entirely different from that of the Bible. It is evident that someone wrote the Bible in its entirety and God never for once dictate its entire wordings.

But the Qur'an is not so! Allah doesn't need to say invoke me with this verse/Surah! It was Allah speaking!

And when the Angel recited the Qur'an to the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam, he recited it that way!

You claim that

Yet you question when another person does the same. If that is not hypocrisy or folly then tell us the rationale for such stand. Why should this your argument hold true for Allah and you then question it when someone else does the same?

Concerning who wrote Matthew's gospel:
Papias a 1st century writer who, according to early evidence, was acquainted with those who knew the eyewitnesses of Christ and the apostles confirmed the authorship. In the early 2nd century Papias wrote a five book work called The Sayings of the Lord Interpreted otherwise known as An Exposition of the Oracles of the Lord – sections of which were preserved in the work of the 3rd and 4th century church historian Eusebius known as Church History. 

You can see that there is are validations for him as the writer from very early in christendom. The way he wrote was usual for writings of his time.

1. There's a big error when you compare Allah , the mighty and supreme to one "Matthew" whose surname, genealogy, moral and mental ability/capability is unknown. Allah uses I, Allah, We, Us, etc. for Himself. Can Matthew use same too?

2. How well do those people know Matthew? Can they confirm Matthew truly met Jesus? A hadith can be labelled unsound if it is discovered that one of the chain of narrators did not meet the other.

3. A simple google search says: Most scholars believe the gospel was composed between AD 80 and 90, with a range of possibility between AD 70 to 110; a pre-70 date remains a minority view. The work does not identify its author, and the early tradition attributing it to the apostle Matthew is rejected by modern scholars.

4. The book of Matthew was written with evident dependence on the earlier Gospel According to Mark.

Abeg keep your validations and lies to yourself. I need time do better things.

AntiChristian:


Subhanallah! So you still dey here?

The context of the Qur'an is entirely different from that of the Bible. It is evident that someone wrote the Bible in its entirety and God never for once dictate its entire wordings.

But the Qur'an is not so! Allah doesn't need to say invoke me with this verse/Surah! It was Allah speaking!

And when the Angel recited the Qur'an to the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam, he recited it that way!



1. There's a big error when you compare Allah , the mighty and supreme to one "Matthew" whose surname, genealogy, moral and mental ability/capability is unknown. Allah uses I, Allah, We, Us, etc. for Himself. Can Matthew use same too?

2. How well do those people know Matthew? Can they confirm Matthew truly met Jesus? A hadith can be labelled unsound if it is discovered that one of the chain of narrators did not meet the other.

3. A simple google search says: Most scholars believe the gospel was composed between AD 80 and 90, with a range of possibility between AD 70 to 110; a pre-70 date remains a minority view. The work does not identify its author, and the early tradition attributing it to the apostle Matthew is rejected by modern scholars.

4. The book of Matthew was written with evident dependence on the earlier Gospel According to Mark.

Abeg keep your validations and lies to yourself. I need time do better things.

I still dey here O!

1. You are questioning the validity of the book of Matthew. I have shown you that early church fathers who have links to the Apostles confirmed this. Yes! They confirm Matthew truly met Jesus. But you still don't want to accept it. So, what can we do?
I will show you some other time a major thing wrong with the chains of narrators in Islam.

God INSPIRED the men who wrote the Bible.
It did not have to be through dictation.

But it is Islam that is not what it seems to be.

2. It is you who has resorted to 'revelation', 'exegesis', 'context' and co just to explain a simple verse of the Koran. You EVADE questions because you know that if you are to truthfully answer them you will see that Islam is not what you thought it is.

First, you state that:

"Allah directed the servant to invoke Him constantly" in that portion (or even elsewhere) since the book (Koran) itself says it makes things clear.

And then you come up with:

"But the Qur'an is not so! Allah doesn't need to say invoke me with this verse/Surah! It was Allah speaking!"

So, just what are you saying?
Is it that Allah specifically asked his slaves to invoke him or that he didn't?
Do you see how you guys confuse yourselves?
This is what happens when truth is not key to you. All you want to do is win an argument at all cost.

Are you saying that Allah can use grammar anyhow he wishes but only the Moslems can 'understand' how he uses them. But when it happens elsewhere in literature then it is wrong. I would consider that a warped thinking.

You admit that it was the angel who recited the Koran to Mohamed.

Even at that, how does that explain the verses we're talking about? The angel never said here to Mohamed 'When you make your prayers open them with these words as follows......' Even if you say that the angel made the prayer as an example to Mohamed, nothing in that portion says so. That will only be your own interpretation, not what the Koran stated. And the Koran sets itself out to be a clear book.

These other examples, which I gave Rashduct4luv and he's been unable to answer, even make things worse:

1. (Koran 6:104)
Now have come to you, from your Lord, proofs (To open your eyes): If any will see, it will be for (the good of) his own soul; If any will be blind, it will be to his own (harm): I am not (here) To watch over your doings.

2. (Koran 27:91)
For me, I have been commanded to serve the Lord of this city, Him Who has sanctified it and to whom (Belong) all things; and I am
commanded to be of those who bow in Islam to Allah's Will

3. (Koran 84:16-19)
I swear by the afterglow of sunset, and by the night, and by the moon when she is at the full.

Is it Allah speaking in these verses?
Is it the angel speaking here?

I hope you will not run away like him but you will take them one by one and answer.

At the end of the day it is clear that either that the Koran is not a book that contains only words of Allah recited via the angel (like you said) or that Allah is a poor communicator. Either way that doesn't make things good for you guys.

More Reasons in Support of the Validity of the New Testament

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRZrA97PCRo
Apart from Church Fathers, contemporary writers of the New Testament time made independent statements that agree with the stories of the Scripture.

This video mentions a number of them.

This is lacking in Islam. Outside the Islamic sources no independent contemporary writers relate anything that falls in line with the Standard Islamic Narrative.

In fact, coins and rock inscriptions of the 7th century that Mohamed was supposed to have established Islam tell us a completely different story.

sagenaija:
More Reasons in Support of the Validity of the New Testament

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRZrA97PCRo
Apart from Church Fathers, contemporary writers of the New Testament time made independent statements that agree with the stories of the Scripture.

This video mentions a number of them.

This is lacking in Islam. Outside the Islamic sources no independent contemporary writers relate anything that falls in line with the Standard Islamic Narrative.

In fact, coins and rock inscriptions of the 7th century that Mohamed was supposed to have established Islam tell us a completely different story.

All this still proves nothing! No one ever put the Bible to memory in it's original language at any given point in time.

Continue looking for excuses. We know you are a liar already.

AntiChristian:


Subhanallah! So you still dey here?

The context of the Qur'an is entirely different from that of the Bible. It is evident that someone wrote the Bible in its entirety and God never for once dictate its entire wordings.

But the Qur'an is not so! Allah doesn't need to say invoke me with this verse/Surah! It was Allah speaking!

And when the Angel recited the Qur'an to the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam, he recited it that way!

1. There's a big error when you compare Allah , the mighty and supreme to one "Matthew" whose surname, genealogy, moral and mental ability/capability is unknown. Allah uses I, Allah, We, Us, etc. for Himself. Can Matthew use same too?

2. How well do those people know Matthew? Can they confirm Matthew truly met Jesus? A hadith can be labelled unsound if it is discovered that one of the chain of narrators did not meet the other.

3. A simple google search says: Most scholars believe the gospel was composed between AD 80 and 90, with a range of possibility between AD 70 to 110; a pre-70 date remains a minority view. The work does not identify its author, and the early tradition attributing it to the apostle Matthew is rejected by modern scholars.

4. The book of Matthew was written with evident dependence on the earlier Gospel According to Mark.

Abeg keep your validations and lies to yourself. I need time do better things.

1)You are a spiritual Lilliputian . By attacking or doubting the Bible is simply calling your Allah and Muhammad fake god and fake prophet since Allah claimed it was his words.

2) Despite various nonsense written in the Qur'an , how can you call that the word of God? Like women having sperm , Sun setting in a mud , calling Mary the sister of Aaron , saying Allah holds the birds in the air , saying all things were created in pairs ,
abrogating the Qur'an and causing it to be forgotten to hide the truths etc.

People knew the Qur'an wasn't divine.

Allah Subhanahu Wa Ta'ala said:
وَقَالَ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوٓا إِنْ هٰذَآ إِلَّآ إِفْكٌ ٱفْتَرٰىهُ وَأَعَانَهُۥ عَلَيْهِ قَوْمٌ ءَاخَرُونَ  ۖ فَقَدْ جَآءُو ظُلْمًا وَزُورًا
"And those who disbelieve say, "This [Qur'an] is not except a falsehood he invented, and another people assisted him in it." But they have committed an injustice and a lie."
وَقَالُوٓا أَسٰطِيرُ الْأَوَّلِينَ اكْتَتَبَهَا فَهِىَ تُمْلٰى عَلَيْهِ بُكْرَةً وَأَصِيلًا
"And they say, "Legends of the former peoples which he has written down, and they are dictated to him morning and afternoon.""
(QS. Al-Furqaan 25: Verse 4-5)
The above is true because Allah and Muhammad didn't know women produce eggs which is fertilized by the sperm .

3) Can you give any proofs that Allah is mighty or a creator ? Nothing .
Allah was the idol worshiped by the ancestors of Muhammad.
He could not heal , could not raise the dead, could not heal Muhammad of ordinary poison , could not convince people to worship him through sign and wonders except by asking Muslims to kill and force people to worship him. The list is endless.

This is another reason why Muhammad caused you Muslims to be worshiping the stone. The Arabs were stone worshippers and you are worshiping the stone by bowing towards the kabah day in day out.

Hadith:
It was narrated from Abdullah bin Ubaid bin Umair that a man said:

"O Abu abdur-Rahman, why do I only see you touching these two corners?" He said: "I heard the Messenger of Allah say: 'Touching them erases sins.' And I head him say: 'whoever circumambulates seven times, it is like freeing a slave.'"

Hasan (Darussalam)
Sunan an-Nasa'i 2919
In-book : Book 24, Hadith 0
English translation : Vol. 3, Book 24, Hadith 2922
Sunan an-Nasai

motayoayinde:


I THINK PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE ACTUALLY MORE OBSSESSED WITH SEX THAN YOU'D LIKE THE WORLD TO BELIEVE MUSLIMS ARE.

YOU'RE ALL ALWAYS EITHER LOOKING FOR SEXUAL INNUENDOS IN EVERY PAGE, PARAGRAPH AND LINE OF EVERY ISLAMIC TEXT OR FORGING SOME STRANGE THINGS ACCORDING TO YOUR WARPED SEXUAL FANTASIES.

WHERE DID YOU FIND "WOMEN WITH BREASTS HAVING THE NAMES OF ALLAH WRITTEN ON THEM"?

I'LL REFRAME YOUR LAST QUESTION THIS WAY: WHY DOES NAIRALAND CONTINUE TO HARBOUR AND TOLERATE PEOPLE LIKE YOU?

Ayinde ọ̀gọ̀, how could you not see that the author of Koran/Quran is a pitiful pervert that need help. Mohammed formulated everything in the Koran/Quran to serve his sexual fantasies, in fact whatever doesn't serve Mohammed's purpose does not please Allah, Mohammed is Allah and Allah is Mohammed. If it were to be in the generation that Mohammed/Allah, appeared Allah would be in rehab home.

Hendtime:

Ayinde ọ̀gọ̀, how could you not see that the author of Koran/Quran is a pitiful pervert that need help. Mohammed formulated everything in the Koran/Quran to serve his sexual fantasies, in fact whatever doesn't serve Mohammed's purpose does not please Allah, Mohammed is Allah and Allah is Mohammed. If it were to be in the generation that Mohammed/Allah, appeared Allah would be in rehab home.

See oponu afofungbemu!

As if everything in the Qur'an is sex. How many times was sex mentioned in the Qur'an?

You guys are dotards!

AntiChristian:


See oponu afofungbemu!

As if everything in the Qur'an is sex. How many times was sex mentioned in the Qur'an?

You guys are dotards!

Ọlọpọlọ dudu
Deal with the sexual pervert you call call Allah stop getting worked up when we call out the evil in your cult

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
Delusion is real!

We're seeing here how people can brainwash themselves with a PROPh they've been fed with.

[b]Claim by Moslems:
All the words of the Koran are direct words of Allah
Enquiry by non-moslem:
So, when Allah speaking in Koran chapter 1 says - 'You alone do we worship...' and then
'Guide us in the straight path' who is Allah referring to?

Answer by Moslem:
According to our scholar 1 and scholar 2 and scholar 3 we are suppose to recite it. It has been given to us to recite.
Question by non-moslem:
Ok, you are supposed to recite it. But where did Allah say there that you are supposed to recite it?

Answer by Moslem:
So you don't understand how we are supposed to recite it. That is the beauty of our Din. It's the only true Din. Just look there you'll see it. If you don't it must be because Allah has misguided you.
Response by non-moslem:
Can't you just show me since you have been rightly guided?

Answer by Moslem:
Why not just accept whatever the believers in Allah say instead of arguing on what you have no knowledge. Don't you know that Islam means 'surrender' your brains and just accept whatever you are told? So, just take it, even if you don't understand.
Response by non-moslem:
But my question has been answered. Who is Allah referring to in that portion of the Koran?

Answer by Moslem:
You have been answered. Allah knows best.

They are bunch of fools and set of dummies

AntiChristian:


See oponu afofungbemu!

As if everything in the Qur'an is sex. How many times was sex mentioned in the Qur'an?

You guys are dotards!

Dont mind the followers of Paul (paulinity) who is not sure if he has the spirit of God

I Corinthians 7
40 But in my opinion [a widow] is happier (more blessed and [f]to be envied) if she does not remarry. And also I think I have the Spirit of God.

Hendtime:


They are bunch of fools and set of dummies

is that what Jesus taught you followers of paul

Mathew 5
22But I say to you that everyone who continues to be [ad]angry with his brother or harbors malice (enmity of heart) against him shall be [ae]liable to and unable to escape the punishment imposed by the court; and whoever speaks contemptuously and insultingly to his brother shall be [af]liable to and unable to escape the punishment imposed by the Sanhedrin, and whoever says, You [ag]cursed fool! [You empty-headed idiot!] shall be [ah]liable to and unable to escape the hell (Gehenna) of fire.

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
Delusion is real!

We're seeing here how people can brainwash themselves with a PROPh they've been fed with.

[b]Claim by Moslems:
All the words of the Koran are direct words of Allah
Enquiry by non-moslem:
So, when Allah speaking in Koran chapter 1 says - 'You alone do we worship...' and then
'Guide us in the straight path' who is Allah referring to?

Answer by Moslem:
According to our scholar 1 and scholar 2 and scholar 3 we are suppose to recite it. It has been given to us to recite.
Question by non-moslem:
Ok, you are supposed to recite it. But where did Allah say there that you are supposed to recite it?

Answer by Moslem:
So you don't understand how we are supposed to recite it. That is the beauty of our Din. It's the only true Din. Just look there you'll see it. If you don't it must be because Allah has misguided you.
Response by non-moslem:
Can't you just show me since you have been rightly guided?

Answer by Moslem:
Why not just accept whatever the believers in Allah say instead of arguing on what you have no knowledge. Don't you know that Islam means 'surrender' your brains and just accept whatever you are told? So, just take it, even if you don't understand.
Response by non-moslem:
But my question has been answered. Who is Allah referring to in that portion of the Koran?

Answer by Moslem:
You have been answered. Allah knows best.

Allah mentioned in the Quran there he was the one who revealed Surat fatiha

Allah SWT said:

"And We have certainly given you, [O Muhammad], seven of the often repeated [verses] and the great Qur'an."
(QS. Al-Hijr 15: Verse 87)

* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com

Suratul fatiha has seven verses and it is repeated daily by Muslims when praying It was to teach Muslims how to pray just like the Lord's prayer in the Bible.

Question: who was Jesus praying to forgive him his trespasses the lords prayer?

enilove:


This is another reason why Muhammad caused you Muslims to be worshiping the stone. The Arabs were stone worshippers and you are worshiping the stone by bowing towards the kabah day in day out.

Hadith:
It was narrated from Abdullah bin Ubaid bin Umair that a man said:

"O Abu abdur-Rahman, why do I only see you touching these two corners?" He said: "I heard the Messenger of Allah say: 'Touching them erases sins.' And I head him say: 'whoever circumambulates seven times, it is like freeing a slave.'"

Hasan (Darussalam)
Sunan an-Nasa'i 2919
In-book : Book 24, Hadith 0
English translation : Vol. 3, Book 24, Hadith 2922
Sunan an-Nasai

Why did your God (Jesus) tell his worshippers to worship stone at Jerusalem

According to (1 King 8 vs 44-45) RSV. "If thy people go out to battle against their enemy, whatever, thou shalt sent them, and shall pray unto the Lord toward the city (Jerusalem) which thou hast chosen, and towards the house that I have built for thy name, then hear thou in heaven their prayer and their supplication, and maintain their cause".

Again let us take a look at another verse in the Bible (Daniel 6 vs 10) "Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house, and his window been open in his chamber towards Jerusalem, he kneeled upon his kneels three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did before. Then these men assembled, and found Daniel praying and making supplication before his God".

(Psalm 5 vs 7) ASV. "I will worship towards thy Holy Temple, and praise thy name for thy loving kindness and for thy truth, for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name".


Your God orders his followers to worship stones.

this is Jerusalem and not mecca.

Hendtime:


Ọlọpọlọ dudu
Deal with the sexual pervert you call call Allah stop getting worked up when we call out the evil in your cult

is that why the sons of your God are sexual pervert

Genesis 6
1 WHEN MEN began to multiply on the face of the land and daughters were born to them,
2 The sons of God saw that the daughters of men were fair, and they took wives of all they desired and chose.

3 Then the Lord said, My Spirit shall not forever dwell and strive with man, for he also is flesh; but his days shall yet be 120 years.

4 There were giants on the earth in those days--and also afterward--when the sons of God lived with the daughters of men, and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.


Like father like son even your God had sex with the Virgin Mary to give birth to his only begotten son

Luke 1
35 Then the angel said to her, The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you [like a shining cloud]; and so the holy (pure, sinless) Thing (Offspring) which shall be born of you will be called the Son of God.(H)


Son of God

Hendtime:


Ọlọpọlọ dudu
Deal with the sexual pervert you call call Allah stop getting worked up when we call out the evil in your cult

Alhamdulillah! I no get cult! Na you get one!
Abiiko omo!

haekymbahd:
is that what Jesus taught you followers of paul

Mathew 5
22But I say to you that everyone who continues to be [ad]angry with his brother or harbors malice (enmity of heart) against him shall be [ae]liable to and unable to escape the punishment imposed by the court; and whoever speaks contemptuously and insultingly to his brother shall be [af]liable to and unable to escape the punishment imposed by the Sanhedrin, and whoever says, You [ag]cursed fool! [You empty-headed idiot!] shall be [ah]liable to and unable to escape the hell (Gehenna) of fire.


Allah mentioned in the Quran there he was the one who revealed Surat fatiha

Allah SWT said:

"And We have certainly given you, [O Muhammad], seven of the often repeated [verses] and the great Qur'an."
(QS. Al-Hijr 15: Verse 87)

* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com

Suratul fatiha has seven verses and it is repeated daily by Muslims when praying It was to teach Muslims how to pray just like the Lord's prayer in the Bible.

Question: who was Jesus praying to forgive him his trespasses the lords prayer?

In the Lord's prayer in the Bible Jesus said: "Pray, then, in this way: 'Our Father, who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. ....."

Please where in sura fatiha did Allah say anything like 'This is how you are to pray........'? Show us or simply admit that it you Moslems who are making things up and trying to defend the inexcusable.

Earlier, enilove said this:

This verse is not preceded by qul (say) which means it's a direct speech of whoever the author of the Quran is and since you Muslims claim that the Quran is the words of Allah (even though Allah never spoke to Muhammad directly, it was an unknown jinn that tormented Muhammad in the cave of Hira that revealed some part of the Quran to him) then Allah is the one praying here to be guided to the right path.

And I had also previously told your colleague this:
Why would Allah be teaching his slaves how to pray and did not clearly say so? Does the hadith you claim specifically say that THE PRAYER refers to this sura?

Allah starts by:
'In the name of Allah...' and
'All praise is due to Allah alone'
Then goes on to say:
'You alone do we worship...' and then
'Guide us in the straight path'

Even if you take the first few words, as you guys argue, as being the words of Allah Allah referring to himself how do you reconcile that with what follows - 'You alone do we worship'? And 'Guide us ...'?
Who is the 'YOU' here and who is the 'WE'?
Who is saying 'Guide us...'?
Obviously the person speaking cannot mean anything different than that the 'WE' is the ones telling the 'YOU' that they worship him - ie. the 'YOU'. And the ones asking for guidance are doing so from a superior being.

BUT THEN, according to Moslems, Allah is the ONLY ONE speaking throughout the Koran. So, when the one speaking says 'You alone do we worship' how can that still be Allah? Is Allah saying that he's part of those worshipping Allah?
AGAIN, nothing in this portion says anything like 'Allah says that when you pray, pray like this ....' If there is please show us. Give us the reference from the Koran.

So, please show us CLEARLY where and how "It was to teach Muslims how to pray" like you stated.

AntiChristian:


Alhamdulillah! I no get cult! Na you get one!
Abiiko omo!

Alhamdu = praise be
Li = to
Lah = moon god

And you can open your stinking mouth to say that you don't have a cult? Who worship a moon diety if not cultists?

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
In the Lord's prayer in the Bible Jesus said: "Pray, then, in this way: 'Our Father, who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. ....."

Please where in sura fatiha did Allah say anything like 'This is how you are to pray........'? Show us or simply admit that it you Moslems who are making things up and trying to defend the inexcusable.

Earlier, enilove said this:


And I had also previously told your colleague this:
Why would Allah be teaching his slaves how to pray and did not clearly say so? Does the hadith you claim specifically say that THE PRAYER refers to this sura?

Allah starts by:
'In the name of Allah...' and
'All praise is due to Allah alone'
Then goes on to say:
'You alone do we worship...' and then
'Guide us in the straight path'

Even if you take the first few words, as you guys argue, as being the words of Allah Allah referring to himself how do you reconcile that with what follows - 'You alone do we worship'? And 'Guide us ...'?
Who is the 'YOU' here and who is the 'WE'?
Who is saying 'Guide us...'?
Obviously the person speaking cannot mean anything different than that the 'WE' is the ones telling the 'YOU' that they worship him - ie. the 'YOU'. And the ones asking for guidance are doing so from a superior being.

BUT THEN, according to Moslems, Allah is the ONLY ONE speaking throughout the Koran. So, when the one speaking says 'You alone do we worship' how can that still be Allah? Is Allah saying that he's part of those worshipping Allah?
AGAIN, nothing in this portion says anything like 'Allah says that when you pray, pray like this ....' If there is please show us. Give us the reference from the Koran.

So, please show us CLEARLY where and how "It was to teach Muslims how to pray" like you stated.

Thank you very much for this beautiful piece

They are deluded of not their Quran won't ask them to pray 3 times and hadith changed it to 5 times. Hadiths that were compiled about 300 years after Muhammad the pedophile has died
Ibn Isham is the owner of this cult called Islam

haekymbahd:
Why did your God (Jesus) tell his worshippers to worship stone at Jerusalem

According to (1 King 8 vs 44-45) RSV. "If thy people go out to battle against their enemy, whatever, thou shalt sent them, and shall pray unto the Lord toward the city (Jerusalem) which thou hast chosen, and towards the house that I have built for thy name, then hear thou in heaven their prayer and their supplication, and maintain their cause".

Again let us take a look at another verse in the Bible (Daniel 6 vs 10) "Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house, and his window been open in his chamber towards Jerusalem, he kneeled upon his kneels three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did before. Then these men assembled, and found Daniel praying and making supplication before his God".

(Psalm 5 vs 7) ASV. "I will worship towards thy Holy Temple, and praise thy name for thy loving kindness and for thy truth, for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name".


Your God orders his followers to worship stones.

this is Jerusalem and not mecca.

Your problem is Like the saying goes , they have eyes but cannot see , ears have they but cannot hear ''.

Can you answer these questions ?

1)Was that God's commandments or requests from man to God ?

2)When does a prayer request becomes a law ?

3) Before the Synagogue was built , was God
answering there prayers or not ?

4) After it was built , are their prayers to the temple or to God ?

5) Where is it written that they should worship A STONE ?
6) Is there anything like the LAWS OF SOLOMON ?

7) Are these people Christians ?

Hear what Jesus said :

John 4:20-26 KJV
Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
[21] Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this THIS MOUNTAIN , NOR YET AT JERUSALEM , worship the Father.
[22] Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
[23] But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
[24] God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
[25] The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.
[26] Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.

The Arabs are stone worshippers from the time of Ishmael and the Scriptures you gave did not mention STONES and this was not God's commandment but a request which Jesus came and abolished .

Hadith
It was narrated from Abdullah bin Ubaid bin Umair that a man said:
"O Abu abdur-Rahman, why do I only see you touching these two corners?" He said: "I heard the Messenger of Allah say: 'Touching them erases sins.' And I head him say: 'whoever circumambulates seven times, it is like freeing a slave.'"

Hasan (Darussalam)

Sunan an-Nasa'i 2919
In-book : Book 24, Hadith 0
English translation : Vol. 3, Book 24, Hadith 2922
Sunan an-Nasai

HOW CAN TOUCHING OF A STONE ERASE YOUR SINS ?

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
In the Lord's prayer in the Bible Jesus said: "Pray, then, in this way: 'Our Father, who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. ....."

Please where in sura fatiha did Allah say anything like 'This is how you are to pray........'? Show us or simply admit that it you Moslems who are making things up and trying to defend the inexcusable.

Earlier, enilove said this:


And I had also previously told your colleague this:
Why would Allah be teaching his slaves how to pray and did not clearly say so? Does the hadith you claim specifically say that THE PRAYER refers to this sura?

Allah starts by:
'In the name of Allah...' and
'All praise is due to Allah alone'
Then goes on to say:
'You alone do we worship...' and then
'Guide us in the straight path'

Even if you take the first few words, as you guys argue, as being the words of Allah Allah referring to himself how do you reconcile that with what follows - 'You alone do we worship'? And 'Guide us ...'?
Who is the 'YOU' here and who is the 'WE'?
Who is saying 'Guide us...'?
Obviously the person speaking cannot mean anything different than that the 'WE' is the ones telling the 'YOU' that they worship him - ie. the 'YOU'. And the ones asking for guidance are doing so from a superior being.

BUT THEN, according to Moslems, Allah is the ONLY ONE speaking throughout the Koran. So, when the one speaking says 'You alone do we worship' how can that still be Allah? Is Allah saying that he's part of those worshipping Allah?
AGAIN, nothing in this portion says anything like 'Allah says that when you pray, pray like this ....' If there is please show us. Give us the reference from the Koran.

So, please show us CLEARLY where and how "It was to teach Muslims how to pray" like you stated.

kDid you even read this at all or you intentionally overlooked


Allah SWT said:

"And verily We have given you seven of the oft-repeated [verses] — the Prophet (s) said that this meant [sūrat] al-Fātiha, as reported by the two Shaykhs [Bukhārī and Muslim], since it is repeated in every unit of prayer (rak‘a) — and the great Qur’ān."
(QS. Al-Hijr 15: Verse 87)

* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com

Suratul Fatiha was revealed by Allah through Angel Gabriel for Muslims to recite often in prayer what more do you want to hear or see?


I quoted the Quran and not hadith so I am not framing anything up.

Hendtime:


Alhamdu = praise be
Li = to
Lah = moon god

And you can open your stinking mouth to say that you don't have a cult? Who worship a moon diety if not cultists?

Allah SWT said:

"And of His signs are the night and day and the sun and moon. Do not prostrate to the sun or to the moon, but prostate to Allah, who created them, if it should be Him that you worship."
(QS. Fussilat 41: Verse 37)

* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com

Hope you know Arab Christians and Jews also call God as Allah infact the Arabic bible has Allah as God?

haekymbahd:
kDid you even read this at all or you intentionally overlooked


Allah SWT said:

"And verily We have given you seven of the oft-repeated [verses] — the Prophet (s) said that this meant [sūrat] al-Fātiha, as reported by the two Shaykhs [Bukhārī and Muslim], since it is repeated in every unit of prayer (rak‘a) — and the great Qur’ān."
(QS. Al-Hijr 15: Verse 87)

* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com

Suratul Fatiha was revealed by Allah through Angel Gabriel for Muslims to recite often in prayer what more do you want to hear or see?


I quoted the Quran and not hadith so I am not framing anything up.

You are the one who is not taking time to read things CAREFULLY. Calm down and look at things CAREFULLY.

Even with clear evidence Moslems can't see the discrepancies and falsehoods in the Koran.

NOTICE that the verse reads:
"And We have bestowed upon thee the Seven Oft-repeated (verses) and the Grand Qur'an."
— Yusuf Ali
NOTICE that it has an 'AND' between the first part of it and the second part? What does that tell you?

Just in case you are not yet getting it, what it means is that IF the 'seven oft-repeated' (btw 'verses' IS NOT in the original) was part of the Koran, it should have read "........ oft-repeated IN THE Grand Quran". In other words, the use of the word 'AND' instead of 'IN THE' means that that portion is talking about TWO SEPARATE things - the 'oft-repeated' and the Koran. It is not talking about the 'oft-repeated in the Koran.

So, yes you quoted the Koran BUT you ADDED to it (or picked a translation that ADDED to it) in order to make it say what you want.

Now, look at that verse that you quoted again, CAREFULLY. And please answer these questions:
1. Is this portion of the verse you quoted originally in theKoran:  [verses] — the Prophet (s) said that this meant [sūrat] al-Fātiha, as reported by the two Shaykhs [Bukhārī and Muslim], since it is repeated in every unit of prayer (rak‘a) — ?
2. If so please show us. If not, where did you get it from?

That portion of the Koran as it ORIGINALLY appears is not asking Moslems to recite al-fatiha. It is when you add words and phrases to it that you guys arrive at what you want and you now want us to accept it as such. That verse is talking about the 'oft-repeated' and 'the Koran'.

What you end up doing is actually framing things up: The exact opposite of what you claim not to be doing.

haekymbahd:
Allah SWT said:

"And of His signs are the night and day and the sun and moon. Do not prostrate to the sun or to the moon, but prostate to Allah, who created them, if it should be Him that you worship."
(QS. Fussilat 41: Verse 37)

* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com

Hope you know Arab Christians and Jews also call God as Allah infact the Arabic bible has Allah as God?

Two poke wave fallacy and argumentum ad populi


What is the meaning of Allah? Let's start from there

Hendtime:

Two poke wave fallacy and argumentum ad populi


What is the meaning of Allah? Let's start from there

Ask the Arab Christians and Jew this?

Also before we can have a discussion go and erase Allah from the Arabic bible you can't eat your cake and have it.

Al - the
ilah - god
Allah - the god


Do not prostrate to the sun or to the moon, but prostate to Allah, who created them, if it should be Him that you worship."
(QS. Fussilat 41: Verse 37)

The problem you have is that the Bible you hold is not in the language (Aramaic) of your God.

Can I ask you please translate "God" in the language (Aramaic) of your God (Jesus)?

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
You are the one who is not taking time to read things CAREFULLY. Calm down and look at things CAREFULLY.

Even with clear evidence Moslems can't see the discrepancies and falsehoods in the Koran.

NOTICE that the verse reads:
"And We have bestowed upon thee the Seven Oft-repeated (verses) and the Grand Qur'an."
— Yusuf Ali
NOTICE that it has an 'AND' between the first part of it and the second part? What does that tell you?

Just in case you are not yet getting it, what it means is that IF the 'seven oft-repeated' (btw 'verses' IS NOT in the original) was part of the Koran, it should have read "........ oft-repeated IN THE Grand Quran". In other words, the use of the word 'AND' instead of 'IN THE' means that that portion is talking about TWO SEPARATE things - the 'oft-repeated' and the Koran. It is not talking about the 'oft-repeated in the Koran.

So, yes you quoted the Koran BUT you ADDED to it (or picked a translation that ADDED to it) in order to make it say what you want.

Now, look at that verse that you quoted again, CAREFULLY. And please answer these questions:
1. Is this portion of the verse you quoted originally in theKoran:  [verses] — the Prophet (s) said that this meant [sūrat] al-Fātiha, as reported by the two Shaykhs [Bukhārī and Muslim], since it is repeated in every unit of prayer (rak‘a) — ?
2. If so please show us. If not, where did you get it from?

That portion of the Koran as it ORIGINALLY appears is not asking Moslems to recite al-fatiha. It is when you add words and phrases to it that you guys arrive at what you want and you now want us to accept it as such. That verse is talking about the 'oft-repeated' and 'the Koran'.

What you end up doing is actually framing things up: The exact opposite of what you claim not to be doing.

Now you can help me by telling me the seven oft- repeated verses.


Ubadah ibn al-Samat reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said, “There is no prayer for one who does not recite the opening of the Book, Surat al-Fatihah.”

Source: Ṣaḥīḥ al-Bukhārī 723, Ṣaḥīḥ Muslim 394


Since Fatiha was revealed by Allah it will definitely be in the Quran...

Allah SWT said:

"And We have certainly given you, [O Muhammad], seven of the often repeated [verses] and the great Qur'an."
(QS. Al-Hijr 15: Verse 87)

At least you saw seven oft-repeated so tell us the seven oft repeated verses by Muslims this is logic surutul fatiha has seven verses and it recited in every rakah of every solat compulsorily for Muslims...

sagenaija:
The Women of Allah's Paradise
Much has been written about the women of Allah's Paradise. The Koran speaks of maidens confined in tents that no man or jinn has had sex with. They are said to have large breasts. They are virgins.

The encyclopedia of Islam list more features - they have 4 colours, are transparent, and "on the breast of each are inscribed two names: one being a name of Allah and one that of her husband".

Why is it that a book supposedly from God describes an afterlife that appears CUSTOMIZED for sexual satisfaction of men?
Why did the prophet of Islam further describe these women, and the pleasures of Paradise so obscenely?
Why did he use the virgins of paradise (along with the angels) to THREATEN women in this life?
Why does Paradise sound like it's full of beings who bully and harass women?
How is it that Moslem women aren't supposed to feel eternally inferior in comparison to Allah's SPECIALLY CREATED women?
Why would the god of the universe be interested in miraculously BOOSTING the sexual power of men in the afterlife?
And why is it that Moslems tolerate this nonsense in their scriptures and traditions, when if it existed somewhere else, it would be their number one point of attack?

Empiree, Lukgaf, Rashduct4luv, Antichristian, motayoayinde, mhmsadyq, haekymbahd or Realismailakabir

Hendtime:


Alhamdu = praise be
Li = to
Lah = moon god

And you can open your stinking mouth to say that you don't have a cult? Who worship a moon diety if not cultists?

Show me which dictionary translates Lah as moon god! We have thrashed this case many times but it seems you still live in the past!

Allah says in Qur'an 21:33 what means: And He it is Who has created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon, each in an orbit floating.

I guess you inherited this lie but from who? Satan surely is your inspiration!

haekymbahd:
Ask the Arab Christians and Jew this?

Also before we can have a discussion go and erase Allah from the Arabic bible you can't eat your cake and have it.

Al - the
ilah - god
Allah - the god


Do not prostrate to the sun or to the moon, but prostate to Allah, who created them, if it should be Him that you worship."
(QS. Fussilat 41: Verse 37)

The problem you have is that the Bible you hold is not in the language (Aramaic) of your God.

Can I ask you please translate "God" in the language (Aramaic) of your God (Jesus)?

For you to know that Allah is a fraud, he was the one supposed to be speaking in the first chapter of the Qur'an yet he say Bisimlah Allah is your God only him shall you worship maybe Allah will forgive you for past, present and future sin (because Allah don't even know or is not sure about what he would do)

Mumbo jumbo, junks stranded together
To answer your question about Allah in the Arabic Bibleb this is nothing but translational error you want a non speaker of a language to interpret and introduce a new name that is alien to the native speaker? How would they understand what you are saying? Boy, you're too daft.
As for changing the name "Allah" in the Arabic bible, we Christians don't do the redaction that you Islamic cultists do. All of your books are redacted back to the 7th century, none of them was written in the 7th century, they were written in the 9th and 10th centuries and then redacted back to the 7th century. This is why there are many historical errors
The CIRA, Hadiths, Tafsir and Quran were written and compiled in the 9th and 10th centuries. Ibn Ishaq put together the CIRA and lied that it was written by Ibn Isham in the 7th century.
Go and see what Yassir Qadhi and Mohammed Hijab said about "holes in the standard narrative of Islam"
Boy go and seal up the holes first before you come here to talk to me.

Al = the
Ilah= God (which God?) the moon, the sun or the star? If you say ilah is god then you should be able to tell us which god it is? Ilah is actually the god of the Nabateans which you Islamic cultists fraudulently stole to be your own

AntiChristian:


Show me which dictionary translates Lah as moon god! We have thrashed this case many times but it seems you still live in the past!

Allah says in Qur'an 21:33 what means: And He it is Who has created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon, each in an orbit floating.

I guess you inherited this lie but from who? Satan surely is your inspiration!

If it is Allah that is telling you this in Surah 21:33 the question you should ask is why was he talking in the third person? Allah said "it is he" who is the he? Can you guys see how daft your Allah can be?
Because your Quran is a copyist book there are many things in it that you don't even know what they mean for example what is the meaning of Yasin/Yaseen? 10billiom pounds for you if you know the meaning

Hendtime:


For you to know that Allah is a fraud, he was the one supposed to be speaking in the first chapter of the Qur'an yet he say Bisimlah Allah is your God only him shall you worship maybe Allah will forgive you for past, present and future sin (because Allah don't even know or is not sure about what he would do)

Mumbo jumbo, junks stranded together
To answer your question about Allah in the Arabic Bibleb this is nothing but translational error you want a non speaker of a language to interpret and introduce a new name that is alien to the native speaker? How would they understand what you are saying? Boy, you're too daft.
As for changing the name "Allah" in the Arabic bible, we Christians don't do the redaction that you Islamic cultists do. All of your books are redacted back to the 7th century, none of them was written in the 7th century, they were written in the 9th and 10th centuries and then redacted back to the 7th century. This is why there are many historical errors
The CIRA, Hadiths, Tafsir and Quran were written and compiled in the 9th and 10th centuries. Ibn Ishaq put together the CIRA and lied that it was written by Ibn Isham in the 7th century.
Go and see what Yassir Qadhi and Mohammed Hijab said about "holes in the standard narrative of Islam"
Boy go and seal up the holes first before you come here to talk to me.

Al = the
Ilah= God (which God?) the moon, the sun or the star? If you say ilah is god then you should be able to tell us which god it is? Ilah is actually the god of the Nabateans which you Islamic cultists fraudulently stole to be your own

This is what you get when you listen to those people you mentioned! If there are holes in the standard narrative why not fill them or ask those people to fill them.

This is why I say some/most Christians are hypocrites. They sabi scrutinize others but they'll crumble when the same criticism is applied to them.

Are you confusing Allah with Al-lat? Allah is our Lord! Al-lat was an idol worshipped during the pre-Islamic Arab period with Al-manat, Hubal, Al-'Uzzah, etc.

Mention the geneology of Adam to Noah after Cain killed Abel in the Bible?