scholes0:


Maybe Ga people of Accra told him they come from Ketu in Benin republic (That is the origin of Ewe and Ga people via Ile Ife) and he thought they were meaning or meant Benin city in Naija

Ga people have no relationship with the Benin in nigeria.

Lol. Ga people came from your compound, they were your family members, bah?

My Ga inlaws have been making mistake about their origin since nearly thirty years, continue sir. BEDC & Ibadan press will be very proud of you.
Saddam Hussein, Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Emperor of Japan, King of Lesotho, Queen Elizabeth and many more must also come from Ife. Or were cast down from Hell too.

Opharhe:
You have really dissected the issue quit well, in a good academic manner. Yes, myself, an Urhobo, I don't see people from Edo, Esan areas etc as strangers too because I understand our shared heritage and understand the linguistic similarities. Infact, I found Esan to be be very similar to Urhobo language too if not more similar to Urhobo than Benin sef .
I find these things very interesting and I just can't get enough of it.
For example, In my Church Choir where I belong in school, I find myself easily noting and correcting mistakes in pronunciation of words in Edo language even when I don't get the real meaning of such words.
I stay in Benin occasionally, and the similarity of the language with Urhobo fascinates me a lot.

Yes, I've heard of the matter concerning Chief Igbe, Iyase of Benin being originally from Urhobo. It's even said there has been at least another Iyase of Urhobo origin in pre-colonial times probably from the Kokori axis of Agbon in Urhoboland.

I'm paternally from Ughelli Kingdom and I know that aside the general historical commonality of Urhobos and Edos, there existed a strong relationship between the royal houses of Ughelli and Benin in precolonial times, there are other examples too.

But I think I have a small issue with your Itsekiri narrative. Yes, the Royal house of Itsekiri is descended from Benin infact, Oba Olua was the father of Prince Iginuwa whose sons later founded the Itsekiri kingdom.

But the truth is, and evidence from far-reaching studies shows it too, the Yoruba-speaking communities that later formed the larger stock of the Itsekiri people were already existing before Ginuwa's sojourn to those paths. What Ginuwa and descendants did was organize and unite various small, scattered fishing communities into a Kingdom under the crown of the Olu. I'm not ruling out the possibility of later migrants from Yoruba areas into the coastal areas of Itsekiri.

The Urhobo have an interesting perspective on this matter because Oghara people played host to Ginuwa on his way from Benin as Itsekiri history also confirms.

Again, Ode-Itsekiri, the traditional headquarters and seat of the Olu(until not long ago) was already inhabited before Ginuwa's party arrived. It is said that Itsekiri is the name of the most prominent man they met there who welcomed them hence their adopting the name. Ginuwa himself is said to have died at Ijala and was buried there, never reaching Ode-Itsekiri. You can subject these to further research.

Thanks for the contribution.

It would be very speculative to rule out the presence of earlier migrants in or around any settlement dominated by one ethnic nationality today. So ruling out earlier Yoruboid people may not be wise. But which studies show these exactly?

The current Olu of Warri Ikenwoli claimed less than two years ago that Ooni of Ife was his fore-father. Despite clear historical evidence that Prince Ginuwa left Benin given the title "Ogiame/Lord of the Seas". His ancestor can only be so through Benin monarchy that produced Prince Ginuwa.

It won't be long before "written evidence" begin to appear that the first Olu was a previously unrecorded son of Oranmiyan. A son he left in Warri after leaving Benin on the way to become the first Alafin of Oyo. Such a claim, by someone with many degree titles to his name, would be music to the ears of many. However dubious the scholarship might be. It might seem improbable now, but do not be surprised if it should happen.

Our SW friends believe they are the educated people who should decide the narrative for us down South. Something Edo people in particular have always rubbished each time. Including Oba Akenzua II leading Edo & Delta people to walk out of Western Region parliament in Ibadan over the intransigence of the Alake of Abeokuta back then. So nor be today.

Ooni of Ife also recently claimed that an Ife prince founded Lagos monarchy. Despite the relatively late vassalage of Lagos to Benin (until 1853) and Late Oba Oyekan & current Oba Akiolu of Lagos clearly stating that Lagos throne began with Ashipa & Prince Ado, both from Benin.

If we were a bit more serious in Nigeria, genetic studies would put an end to many speculations. Migration patterns can be shown in DNA markers. Which wave is older, and the mixing pattern over many centuries in certain areas. Black Americans are tracing their origins to specific villages and communities in Africa, from Guinea to Ghana to Senegambia to Nigeria. Centuries on.

Over the years when Benin & Ife arguments come up here on NL, I have volunteered to fund DNA tests for a dozen people each from Benin & Ife Royal families. To be carried out by reputable labs in Europe/abroad. If others volunteer too, and we can test hundreds of descendants on both sides, we can expect to get some useful results.

But obviously most people just want to argue & have no interest in finding out the truth once and for all.

As for Ode-Itsekiri or location, that changes. Everywhere. Nothing unusual about it. People move. For various reasons like finding more space, avoiding floods, a safer topography for defense, etc.

Even the famed coming of Oranmiyan to Benin, he never even entered Benin proper. Benin ruling nobility prevented him from getting anywhere close to the ancient ogiso palace, that is also the current palace. It took the great-great grandson of Oranmiyan called Oba Ewedo to conquer resisting nobles and move into Benin ancient ogiso palace.

As for Delta, you need to understand the dirty ethnic politics in the old Western Region (which Edo & Delta were part of then) that took place in the 1940s to early 1960s.

The premier of Western Region "elevated" Olu of Itsekiri to OLU of Warri. This was a time the entire area was called WARRI Province. This caused massive protest from Urhobo/Okpe/Isoko and other people. Because it seemed to indicate that the Olu was now the ruler of all of the province called Warri. It would be like calling one Ovie or Obi the "King of Delta" today. A compromise was reached to change name of the area to DELTA Province.

Of course the impression was now that Awolowo wanted to elevate the Yoruboid tribe in the area above others. These and other acts of undermining minority tribes in Old Western Region led to the referendum of 1963 that created Mid-West Region.

So publications that began from that era, placing Yoruba people in Delta long before Prince Ginuwa left Benin began to look suspicious. As part of the plan to cement Itsekhiri's as ancient people in the area.

Now with issues of land and oil wells/resources, the stakes are even higher still.

Many assertions touted as research work have to be carefully examined.

AreaFada2:


Lol. Ga people came from your compound, they were your family members, bah?

My Ga inlaws have been making mistake about their origin since nearly thirty years, continue sir. BEDC & Ibadan press will be very proud of you.
Saddam Hussein, Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Emperor of Japan, King of Lesotho, Queen Elizabeth and many more must also come from Ife. Or were cast down from Hell too.

Take it or leave it, I am not here for back and forth arguments.
There are 4 lineages (ethnic groups) in Ghana who trace ancestries from Ife, eithier by direct migration or second hand via other places/ another town.

They are the:
Ga
Ewe
Tabom
Ifę

Now, some Ga elements do claim benin- but the Belief is not endogenetic in their folklore because the whites were the ones who said so in the forms of Reindorf, Ward and Field, and it is not found anywhere in the indigenous oral literature of the Ga people themselves.

While the Gas thenselves before colonization have always claimed an affinity to Ile Ife and the Yoruba speaking gtoups in general.

The Ga-Adangbe migrated from Ile-Ife in south-western Nigeria led by powerful king Ayi-Kushi. In the 17th century, when they settled at Okaikoi near Nsawam, the Adangbe built the Ladoku kingdom. Presently the Ga-Adangbe live in the coastal plains west of the volta river

https://qknowbooks.gitbooks.io/jhs_1_social-ghana-as-a-nation/content/migration_route_of_the_ga-adangbe.html

The Ga-Adangbe are said to have migrated from Israel to at place called Ile-Ife in present day Nigeria. They then migrated from Ile-Ife to present day Ghana either by land or by sea. The first settled around the Afram planes and Shai areas in Ghana and later migrated to their present destination.

http://aglanceintoafrica.com/2017/02/28/the-ga-adangbe-people-of-ghana/

Throughout the culture and history of the Ga-Dangmes of Ghana, is a very strong conclusive evidence that they are direct descendants of the Hebrew Israelties that migrated to West Africa by way of Egypt, Ethiopia, Sudan, Lake Chad, Ile-Ife, Dahome, Togo and to the Gold Coast

they travelled through Southern Sudan and settled for a period of time at Sameh in Niger and then to Ile-ife in Nigeria. They migrated again in 1100 A.D and settled at Dahome and later, travelled to Huatsi in Togo where they stayed briefly

http://gadangme.weebly.com/ga-dangme-origins.html


Heck, even Ghanaian foruners on Nairaland have talked about this, and here is what they had to say:

shesi:

The Ga-Adangbes, a small tribe only significant because theirs is the land on which the Capital Accra is built, are said to have moved to their present location from the Yoruba region of Nigeria. They walked from modern day sudan, through Nigeria, to their current location in ghana. So they are said to be related to the Yoruba people of Nigeria.

salamander:
I'm one of the 3rd generation Hausa speaking Ghanaian.

It is a historically fact that the Ga/Adangme came from Ile Ife in Nigeria. They settled in modern Accra after driving away the Fantis. When one visits Osu, one of the clans in Accra, there is a place called Alata and one can hear some traces of Yoruba in the Ga language especially when pouring libation to the gods.

The Gonjas in northern Ghana are believed to have linked to Northern Nigeria. The word is a Hausa word (Gwanja) which means trading. I was also told that the Dagombas came from Nigeria.

Now, I do know how TRUE any of these claims by the Ga people are, but your total disregard for the Yoruba/Ife version of the history of these people speaks a lot more about your already set predisposition/state of mind.

If anyone neutral on this issue were to examine the issue at hand closely, by far the majority will agree that the Ga-adangbes have a much greater chance of closer affinity with the Yorubas than the Edos. This is just common sense, not ethnic postuting or whatever.

AreaFada2:


It would be very speculative to rule out the presence of earlier migrants in or around any settlement dominated by one ethnic nationality today. So ruling out earlier Yoruboid people may not be wise. But which studies show these exactly?

The current Olu of Warri Ikenwoli claimed less than two years ago that Ooni of Ife was his fore-father. Despite clear historical evidence that Prince Ginuwa left Benin given the title "Ogiame/Lord of the Seas". His ancestor can only be so through Benin monarchy that produced Prince Ginuwa.

It won't be long before "written evidence" begin to appear that the first Olu was a previously unrecorded son of Oranmiyan. A son he left in Warri after leaving Benin on the way to become the first Alafin of Oyo. Such a claim, by someone with many degree titles to his name, would be music to the ears of many. However dubious the scholarship might be. It might seem improbable now, but do not be surprised it did.

Ooni of Ife also recently claimed that an Ife prince founded Lagos monarchy. Despite the relatively late vassalage of Lagos to Benin (until 1853) and Late Oba Oyekan & current Oba Akiolu of Lagos clearly stating that Lagos throne began with Ashipa & Prince Ado, both from Benin.

If we were a bit more serious in Nigeria, genetic studies would put an end to many speculations. Migration patterns can be shown in DNA markers. Which wave is older, and the mixing pattern over many centuries in certain areas. Black Americans are tracing their origins to specific villages and communities in Africa, from Guinea to Ghana to Senegambia to Nigeria. Centuries on.

Over the years when Benin & Ife arguments come up here on NL, I have volunteered to fund DNA tests for a dozen people each from Benin & Ife Royal families. To be carried out by reputable labs in Europe/abroad. If others volunteer too, and we can test hundreds of descendants on both sides, we can expect to get some useful results.

But obviously most people just want to argue & have no interest in finding out the truth once and for all.

As for Ode-Itsekiri or location. that changes. Nothing unusual about it. People move. For various reasons like finding more space, avoiding floods, a safer topography for defense, etc.
Even the famed coming of Oranmiyan to Benin, he never even entered Benin proper. Benin ruling nobility prevented him from getting anywhere close to the ancient ogiso palace, that is also the current palace. It took the great-great grandson of Oranmiyan called Oba Ewedo to conquer resisting nobles and move into Benin ancient ogiso palace.

As for Delta, you need to understand the dirty ethnic politics in the Western Region (which Edo & Delta were part of then) that took place in the 1940s to early 1960s.
The premier of Western region "elevated" Olu of Itsekiri to OLU of Warri. This was a time the entire area was called WARRI Province. This caused massive protest from Urhobo/Okpe/Isoko and other people. Because it seemed to indicate that the Olu was now the ruler of all of the province called Warri. It would be like calling one Ovie or Obi the "King of Delta" today. A compromise was reached to change name of the area to DELTA Province.
Of course the impression was now that Awolowo wanted to elevate the Yoruboid tribe in the area above others. These and other acts of undermining minority tribes in Old Western Region led to the referendum of 1963 that created Mid-West Region.

So publications that began from that era, placing Yoruba people in Delta long before Prince Ginuwa left Benin began to look suspicious. As part of the plan to cement Itsekhir's as ancient people in the area.

Now with issues of land and wells/resources, the stakes are even higher still.

Many assertions touted as research work have to be carefully examined.

What are you trying to say with all these?

That Itsekiri people and history began with Iginuwa's 15th century arrival in that area or what?
Or that the itsekiris are not an old established tribe in the Niger Delta?

Itsekiri history predates prince Ginuwa. And till today there are Itsekiri villages like Ugborodo, Omadino, Inorin and Ureju etc that predate the 15th century founding of Warri kingdom in Ode Itsekiri. (Big warri)

These towns have semi autonomous statutes within the Warri Kingdom till now, and their Oloyes and Olajas have always resisted the rule of the Olu based on their senior statuses. Only recently have they all agreed to reluctantantly accept the Olu as the supreme head of all Itsekiris, to foster oneness and unity.

The opposite of what you are claiming is infact what happened. The later Benin iginuwa group that joined the autochtonous Yoruboid coastal peoples were the ones who modified the itsekiri culture to an extent. It wasn't the Yorubas that migrated to join an original Edo speaking group, but a banished and disowned edo prince (maybe I should even say ex-prince) with his group of courtiers looking for where to start a new life.

You have to learn to differenciate between the ethnogenesis/origin of people, and subsequent influence of neighboring ethnic groups on such people. This is the same mistake Benins are making in Lagos Island with the Aworis and Onitsha with the Igbos. Also warri with the Itsekiris. All these people are not Benin people in any way.

Cc: Opharhe, Efewestern

Opharhe:

Yes, I've heard of the matter concerning Chief Igbe, Iyase of Benin being originally from Urhobo. It's even said there has been at least another Iyase of Urhobo origin in pre-colonial times probably from the Kokori axis of Agbon in Urhoboland.

I'm paternally from Ughelli Kingdom and I know that aside the general historical commonality of Urhobos and Edos, there existed a strong relationship between the royal houses of Ughelli and Benin in precolonial times, there are other examples too.

Yes that is true. Probably several Iyase were Urhobo. It would not have been considered unusual in anyway. Urhobo, Esan, Isoko, Western Igbo and many others were often integral part of the Imperial Army. Ogogobiaga, an Igbo indigene was one of Benin's most formidable soldiers in the 16th century. Charged with checking Eastern flank of the empire. With lots of privileges and fame back then.
Considering that Iyase was head of the army (not commander of the army, that was/is Chief Ezomo of Benin), it would still probably have been a person of distinction from any Edoid affiliated land to be the Iyase (prime minister & second in command to the Oba).

At least two Iyase were Ado-Akure people(from Eastern Yorubaland). Of course Yoruba people today probably deny Benin punitive expedition against & capture of Akure in 1818. Over the murder of Benin imperial ambassadors. The Arakale (an Akure chieftain mostly responsible) was eventually caught, trialed and beheaded). He had escaped to Ado-Ekiti, where the Ewi quickly expelled him. The most famous Ado-Akure origin Iyase of Benin was Okoro-Otun. He lived long and served three obas of Benin.
Today Arakale Road is a major road in Akure. You can link from it to Ondo-Akure Road, Oba Adesida Road & Oyemekun Road. And Okoro-Otun Avenue connects Central Road to Ikpokpan to link you to Sapele Road & Boundary Road, GRA Benin-City. So history is all around us if we look carefully around us.

A Prince of Brass (bayelsa State), from the Amayanabo family was also an Iyase of Benin. His descendants are the Otokiti family of Benin today. A very large & successful lot.
The Iyase is not a hereditary position, but an administrative/political one. The idea is to select a person of great repute, successful in his previous calling, with diplomatic skills, experience, well-traveled, preferably without any ties with the powerful palace chief and dukes of the Kingdom. This it is hoped will make him independent and objective in representing the citizens of Benin as a whole.

The success of Benin Empire was a collective one. For Edoid people and Beyond. From people skilled in arts and craft coming to Benin for royal patronage, war mercenaries,to the Ijaw seafarers responsible for transporting troops & goods along the Atlantic and many more.

The recent situation in Nigeria where in order to gain political relevance, avoid marginalization and get a share of the national cake, it has become expedient to highlight our differences. Instead of what unites us. So much so that Urhobo & Okpe are now being increasing seen as different people.

kn23h:


Are you mad?

Ikebe is a Yoruba word.

What is ass in yoruba?

Carlmax:


What is ass in yoruba?

Idi and Ikebe.

Ileke Idi

Ibebe Idi