solite3:
so says the the man who serve who says allah is God.

John 8:44
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

I know your type a liar and a deceiver just like your father.

Jesus came with grace and truth

John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

According to you satanist,
Jesus came with grace something you said lead people to hell
It means Jesus came to destroy people.

Look at what Jesus said

Matthew 18:11
For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.

Contrary to what you herectics and dogs think
The gospel of grace is not from paul but from Jesus himself.
He came with grace and truth.

Hebrews 10:29
Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

Coming from the devil worshipper who wants to is using grace as an excuse to justify his sinful lifestyle on Earth.

It obvious that you would forget that I withdrew that statement to show you that you're the dead only seeking your fellow dead among the living.

Continue in your sinful ways, rape, commit adultery, kill, steal, cheat, that grace may abound, so you'd go and meet your fellows in hell who all had grace but continued in their sins.

So til you get where you belong in hell fire with your grace of hell fire, it's get thee behind me Satan!

Matthew 13:41-42 (KJV)

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

solite3:
I never said they had laws against prostitution.
I would better put as they probably knew prostitution was bad.

Well, that’s another talk altogether. Especially when you talk of temple prostitution for example, which was prevalent and seen as an act of worship to their various deities.

Someone raised under such a culture would not see prostitution as something bad.

That it’s bad in the sight of God, of course that one is non-negotiable. But to extend it further and think the Canaanites saw prostitution as something bad, that one doesn’t fly.

malvisguy212:
substitute her with the adulterous woman.

The adulterous woman was a Jew? Yes or no


Was Rahab a citizen of Jericho ever under the Mosaic Law and took an oath to bound by the blesses and curses of the law...like a typical Jew back then did? Before her encounter with the spies and eventual rescue, was Rahab bound to obey the Mosaic Law?

OkCornel:
The curious case of Simon the Sorcerer;





See the case of a sorcerer who believed in Jesus and was baptized. But thought he could purchase the power of the Holy Spirit with money.

Also see how he was rebuked by Peter and admonished to REPENT. Peter also clearly mentioned that Simon's heart was not right with God. This is despite the fact that Simon believed and was baptized earlier (in verse 13).

The sad part is, thinking belief alone is sufficient without repentance from a sinful lifestyle is nothing but hypocrisy.

Yes, at the initial stage, baby believers will still stumble, make errors and mistakes (not wilful sin nor iniquity), struggle with old habits. But as they grow in the TRUTH and have an unwavering focus on the teachings of Jesus and the instructions of the Holy Spirit, you'll see that old lifestyle falling away like scales and replaced by a new productive lifestyle. This is the growth and maturity expected of everyone who sincerely wants to walk in the TRUTH.



THIS TAKES ME BACK TO MY FIRST POST ON THIS THREAD. UNLESS THERE IS A CHANGE OF HEART (REPENTANCE), CONFESSIONS OF BELIEF & FAITH IS SHEER FRAUD!

one cannot believe, have faith without repentance.
If you think, faith means mere belief you are seriously mistaken.
Go back on my previous post and see what faith really means.
Simon the sorcerer might just be counted among the number of people that believed and where baptized but his main reason may just be to get the power of the holy Spirit not really to get right with God.
Judas iscariot was among the disciples but Jesus knew that judas iscariot was never part of him from the beginning but judas was still counted as a disciple.

solite3:
one cannot believe, have faith without repentance.
If you think, faith means mere belief you are seriously mistaken.
Go back on my previous post and see what faith really means.
Simon the sorcerer might just be counted among the number of people that believed and where baptized but his main reason may just be to get the power of the holy Spirit not really to get right with God.
Judas iscariot was among the disciples but Jesus knew that judas iscariot was never part of him from the beginning but judas was still counted as a disciple.

The bolded part of your post nails it then.

Anything without a change of heart is just a waste of time.

When Jesus keeps telling people “go and sin no more” it makes things clearer.

OkCornel:


Well, that’s another talk altogether. Especially when you talk of temple prostitution for example, which was prevalent and seen as an act of worship to their various deities.

Someone raised under such a culture would not see prostitution as something bad.

That it’s bad in the sight of God, of course that one is non-negotiable. But to extend it further and think the Canaanites saw prostitution as something bad, that one doesn’t fly.

non jews are far removed from God hence their values reflecedt it.
My friend prostitution is bad in the sight of God non negotiable just like homosexuality.
For examples an homosexual can be saved irrespective of his sinful condition, doesnt mean God permit homosexuality.
The law reveals God's standards not only to the jews but through the jews to the whole world.
Hope you know salvation was for the jews only?
Rehab understand that God has already given the city to the Jews not they the canaanites and her only hope where the jews that is why she did what she did.

OkCornel:


The bolded part of your post nails it then.

Anything without a change of heart is just a waste of time.

When Jesus keeps telling people “go and sin no more” it makes things clearer.

change of heart is actually God's work.

Repentance means for the sinner to turn to Christ.
As for the change of heart away from sin, it is God's work.

Ezekiel 36:26
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

jesusjnr:
Don't waste your time to justify the error that makes many to continue in their sins that grace may abound.m

how do you guys read scripture ? did not Paul answer this questions ? Paul meets that argument head,on by stating in Romans 6:2 , “God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

What does that mean? It means that the moment you believe on Jesus Christ as your Savior God sees you as identified completely with Jesus Christ. Verse 6 goes on to explain that: “Knowing this, that our old man has been crucified with him, that the body of sin
might be annulled, that we should no longer serve sin”
When it says, “our old man,” it is referring to the person we were before we trusted Christ, the person who was born into sinful race and who sinned willfully in rebellion against God.

solite3:
change of heart is actually God's work.

Repentance means for the sinner to turn to Christ.
As for the change of heart away from sin, it is God's work.

Ezekiel 36:26
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

And where does man’s choice come to play in the midst of this?

It all starts with a choice to obey or refuse...

It’s more or less a partnership, and not just God’s work. Man’s role is to make that choice to have a change of heart, and subsequently to be obedient.

OkCornel:


The adulterous woman was a Jew? Yes or no


Was Rahab a citizen of Jericho ever under the Mosaic Law and took an oath to bound by the blesses and curses of the law...like a typical Jew back then did? Before her encounter with the spies and eventual rescue, was Rahab bound to obey the Mosaic Law?

listen, James know his audience, was he wrong for using rahab to illustrate his point ?

solite3:
non jews are far removed from God hence their values reflecedt it.
My friend prostitution is bad in the sight of God non negotiable just like homosexuality.
For examples an homosexual can be saved irrespective of his sinful condition, doesnt mean God permit homosexuality.
The law reveals God's standards not only to the jews but through the jews to the whole world.
Hope you know salvation was for the jews only?
Rehab understand that God has already given the city to the Jews not they the canaanites and her only hope where the jews that is why she did what she did.

We don’t need to go about in circles over this one.

You assumed the Canaanites saw prostitution as something bad, and I do not agree with that. Temple prostitution was entrenched in Canaanite culture and traditions. And in their eyes, they see it as some sort of worship to their deities, in their own eyes, it’s not bad.


But in the eyes of God, and those filled with His Spirit and nature, it is obviously wrong and bad.


That’s what I’m saying.

malvisguy212:
listen, James know his audience, was he wrong for using rahab to illustrate his point ?

What brought James into this equation?


We were talking about whether Rahab should be stoned to death for violating a law she was not aware of as a gentile? A law she was never under?

And now we’re jumping to James? Na wa

malvisguy212:
how do you guys read scripture ? did not Paul answer this questions ? Paul meets that argument head,on by stating in Romans 6:2 , “God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

What does that mean? It means that the moment you believe on Jesus Christ as your Savior God sees you as identified completely with Jesus Christ. Verse 6 goes on to explain that: “Knowing this, that our old man has been crucified with him, that the body of sin
might be annulled, that we should no longer serve sin”
When it says, “our old man,” it is referring to the person we were before we trusted Christ, the person who was born into sinful race and who sinned willfully in rebellion against God.

I find it really strange that you claim he had answered these questions, yet you're here preaching the gospel of the grace that encourages men to continue in sin, so how possible that?

If he actually corrected that error as you claim, you wouldn't be here yet justifying a grace that would make men not to do any work but continue in their sins.

Such a grace leads men to hell!

All those who died after the death of Jesus and yet went to hell had that grace.

So what's the difference, they all had the grace but they yet continued in their sins whether they believed in Jesus or not.

Do you think that those many who Jesus told he never knew didn't believe in him?

Yet they were able to do such wonderful works in His name?

The difference is that they continued in their iniquity despite having that grace.

Grace can save no man who continues in his sins!

Matthew 13:41-42 (KJV)

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

OkCornel:


What brought James into this equation?


We were talking about whether Rahab should be stoned to death for violating a law she was not aware of as a gentile? A law she was never under?

James is the author, in discussing this issue, James use the story of rahab to illustrate his point.

let me ask you a question, How many laws must be broken for a man to become a LAWBREAKER? If you have a chain with just one of the links broken, is it still a broken chain? what does James 2:10 mean ?

jesusjnr:
I find it really strange that you claim he had answered these questions, yet you're here preaching the gospel of the grace that encourages men to continue in sin, so how possible that?

If he actually corrected that error as you claim, you wouldn't be here yet justifying a grace that would make men not to do any work but continue in their sins.

Such a grace leads men to hell!

All those who died after the death of Jesus and yet went to hell had that grace.

So what's the difference, they all had the grace but they yet continued in their sins whether they believed in Jesus or not.

Do you think that those many who Jesus told he never knew didn't believe in him?

Yet they were able to do such wonderful works in His name?

The difference is that they continued in their iniquity despite having that grace.

Grace can save no man who continues in his sins!

Matthew 13:41-42 (KJV)

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

thank you for your time .

OkCornel:


And where does man’s choice come to play in the midst of this?

man's choice is either believe in Christ finished work and accept God's gift of eternal life or not.

It all starts with a choice to obey or refuse...

the obedience is to take accept Jesus or not.

It’s more or less a partnership, and not just God’s work. Man’s role is to make that choice to have a change of heart, and subsequently to be obedient.

I dont know where you get partnerships from?
Because you want to boast that you did something, that is man's carna nature talking there. Sorry God has planned it in such a way that only him takes the glory.
God is the one one taking away the stony heart and replacing it with a new heart, There is no partnership there.

Ezekiel 11:19
And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

There is no partnership here,


Ezekiel 36:27-29, 31 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.

I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you.

Then shall ye remember your own evil ways, and your doings that were not good, and shall lothe yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and for your abominations.

You see that only after God has saved them will they look back at their former condition and hate their old self.

Compare with these verses,

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?
Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Note what washed sanctified and justified them,
The Name of Jesus.
Only Jesus can do that for a man.

Well said.
God is Light and there's no darkness in Him at all. How can someone claim that he believes in Jesus Christ, and that he is a follower of God and still be found with evil deeds?
Light and darkness are two parallel lines.

Someone who has truly received of this grace will shun all ungodliness and worldly lust. That is what this GRACE teaches. You can't claim to merely believe without actually turning away from your sins.

OkCornel:
The curious case of Simon the Sorcerer;





See the case of a sorcerer who believed in Jesus and was baptized. But thought he could purchase the power of the Holy Spirit with money.

Also see how he was rebuked by Peter and admonished to REPENT. Peter also clearly mentioned that Simon's heart was not right with God. This is despite the fact that Simon believed and was baptized earlier (in verse 13).

The sad part is, thinking belief alone is sufficient without repentance from a sinful lifestyle is nothing but hypocrisy.

Yes, at the initial stage, baby believers will still stumble, make errors and mistakes (not wilful sin nor iniquity), struggle with old habits. But as they grow in the TRUTH and have an unwavering focus on the teachings of Jesus and the instructions of the Holy Spirit, you'll see that old lifestyle falling away like scales and replaced by a new productive lifestyle. This is the growth and maturity expected of everyone who sincerely wants to walk in the TRUTH.



THIS TAKES ME BACK TO MY FIRST POST ON THIS THREAD.[b] UNLESS THERE IS A CHANGE OF HEART (REPENTANCE), CONFESSIONS OF BELIEF & FAITH IS SHEER FRAUD!
[/b]

solite3:
man's choice is either believe in Christ finished work and accept God's gift of eternal life or not.

the obedience is to take accept Jesus or not.

I dont know where you get partnerships from?
Because you want to boast that you did something, that is man's carna nature talking there. Sorry God has planned it in such a way that only him takes the glory.
God is the one one taking away the stony heart and replacing it with a new heart, There is no partnership there.

Ezekiel 11:19
And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

There is no partnership here,


Ezekiel 36:27-29, 31 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.

I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you.

Then shall ye remember your own evil ways, and your doings that were not good, and shall lothe yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and for your abominations.

You see that only after God has saved them will they look back at their former condition and hate their old self.

Compare with these verses,

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?
Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Note what washed sanctified and justified them,
The Name of Jesus.
Only Jesus can do that for a man.

Partnership. Man’s duty is to obey.

Of what use is God’s grace and love when a stubborn man is unwilling to change his ways?


Can two work together unless they agree?



Another thing, did Simon the sorcerer not believe and accept Christ’s finished work? And yet Peter scolded him that his heart is not right with God?

malvisguy212:
James is the author, in discussing this issue, James use the story of rahab to illustrate his point.

let me ask you a question, How many laws must be broken for a man to become a LAWBREAKER? If you have a chain with just one of the links broken, is it still a broken chain? what does James 2:10 mean ?

You have not answered my question. On what grounds should Rahab be penalised under a Law she was never under?


Abi the Mosaic Law applied to the gentiles too?

Who was the Mosaic Law meant for?

solite3:
man's choice is either believe in Christ finished work and accept God's gift of eternal life or not.

the obedience is to take accept Jesus or not.

I dont know where you get partnerships from?
Because you want to boast that you did something, that is man's carna nature talking there. Sorry God has planned it in such a way that only him takes the glory.
God is the one one taking away the stony heart and replacing it with a new heart, There is no partnership there.

Ezekiel 11:19
And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

There is no partnership here,


Ezekiel 36:27-29, 31 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.

I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you.

Then shall ye remember your own evil ways, and your doings that were not good, and shall lothe yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and for your abominations.

You see that only after God has saved them will they look back at their former condition and hate their old self.

Compare with these verses,

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?
Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Note what washed sanctified and justified them,
The Name of Jesus.
Only Jesus can do that for a man.

That means there’s no place for obedience in a man’s walk with God?


All the effort comes from God’s end, no obedience to God’s instruction is required from man at all right?


No need to obey, just believe and end up as a barren branch in the vine.

Bodydialect57:
Well said.
God is Light and there's no darkness in Him at all. How can someone claim that he believes in Jesus Christ, and that he is a follower of God and still be found with evil deeds?
Light and darkness are two parallel lines.

Someone who has truly received of this grace will shun all ungodliness and worldly lust. That is what this GRACE teaches. You can't claim to merely believe without actually turning away from your sins.

Exactly!

OkCornel:


You have not answered my question. On what grounds should Rahab be penalised under a Law she was never under?


Abi the Mosaic Law applied to the gentiles too?

Who was the Mosaic Law meant for?

are you implying that God has no interest for the gentile ? because adultery is under the mosaic law mean the gentile can commit adultery ? rehab had knowledge of this law so she stand condemned. or because you okcornel is a gentile mean you can commit adultery ?

And Jonah’s missionary endeavor to the people of Nineveh in fare away Assyria is a delightful illustration of the Lord’s interest in Gentile people , even while the main focus remained upon the nation of Israel. so long as you reject what is right, you stand condemned.

malvisguy212:
are you implying that God has no interest for the gentile? because adultery is under the mosaic law mean the gentile can commit adultery ? rehab had knowledge of this law so she stand condemned. or because you okcornel is a gentile mean you can commit adultery ?

And Jonah’s missionary endeavor to the people of Nineveh in fare away Assyria is a delightful illustration of the Lord’s interest in Gentile people , even while the main focus remained upon the nation of Israel. so long as you reject what is right, you stand condemned.

Nah nah nah, you're shifting the goalpost to something else here. You said Rahab deserved to be stoned to death ACCORDING TO THE LAW.

Were the gentiles ever under the Mosaic Law in the first place? Did Rahab partake in the oath to be bound according to the blessings and curses of the Law?

As regards your other questions, man was conscious of good and evil ever since Adam & Eve ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Knowledge of good and evil did not start with the 10 commandments or the mosaic law. Cain did not need any 10 commandments before he got to know killing Abel was wrong.

Let's move on to Judah who committed "fornication" with Tamar who later gave birth to twins. Judah and Tamar were never under the Law, does it then make sense to "stone them to death" for such an act?

The Mosaic Law, it's blessings, curses and penalties were applicable to the Jews right from when those instructions were given. All the 613 instructions.

OkCornel:


Nah nah nah, you're shifting the goalpost to something else here. You said Rahab deserved to be stoned to death ACCORDING TO THE LAW.

Were the gentiles ever under the Mosaic Law in the first place? Did Rahab partake in the oath to be bound according to the blessings and curses of the Law?

As regards your other questions, man was conscious of good and evil ever since Adam & Eve ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Knowledge of good and evil did not start with the 10 commandments or the mosaic law. Cain did not need any 10 commandments before he got to know killing Abel was wrong.

Let's move on to Judah who committed "fornication" with Tamar who later gave birth to twins. Judah and Tamar were never under the Law, does it then make sense to stone them to death for such an act?

The Mosaic Law, it's blessings, curses and penalties were applicable to the Jews right from when those instructions were given. All the 613 instructions.

so as you know what is right and wrong, you stand condemned. Gentile idolatry is condemned as sin by the prophets of God Exodus 20:3-5;
32:35; Numbers 25:1-9. is idolatry not under the mosaic law ?

malvisguy212:
so as you know what is right and wrong, you stand condemned. Gentile idolatry is condemned as sin by the prophets of God Exodus 20:3-5;
32:35; Numbers 25:1-9. is idolatry not under the mosaic law ?

Was Rahab under the mosaic law? that she should be stoned to death ni?

I also gave you the example of Judah that fornicated with Tamar, you conveniently side stepped that question to run to idolatry. Please why shouldn't Judah and Tamar be stoned to death? or what they did was not wrong?

OkCornel:


Was Rahab under the mosaic law? that she should be stoned to death ni?

I also gave you the example of Judah that fornicated with Tamar, you conveniently side stepped that question to run to idolatry. Please why shouldn't Judah and Tamar be stoned to death? or what they did was not wrong?

this will be my last post on this thread.

in James 2 , it is very clear that James audience has the same mind set as you guys. James use rahab the prostitute to illustrate his point, a shame to people who claimed to be save. James audience thought that good work will earn them eternal life, so James ask this question :
James 2:25-26 In the same way, was not even Rahab
the prostitute CONSIDERED RIGHTEOUS for what
she did when she gave lodging to the spies
and sent them off in a different direction?
As the body without the spirit is dead, so
faith without deeds is dead.

wasn't rehab the worst ? ( a prostitute ) how then was she considered righteous by this Jews ? was she justified by faith ? or work ? if you claimed that you have done good deed that will earn you eternal life, rahab the prostitute has done far greater.


How is a person saved? “For by grace are ye saved THROUGH FAITH, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast.” Salvation is a gift. It is free (paid for by the blood of Christ). All the sinner needs to do is to receive that gift by faith.

a believer must performed Good work to show the evidence of his Faith. work in this context is not the kind of work that will earn you eternal life, you do Good work because you are save.

James 2:3-4 If you show special attention to the man wearing fine clothes and say, “Here’s a good seat for you,” but say to the poor man, “You stand there” or
“Sit on the floor by my feet,” have you not
discriminated among yourselves and become
judges with evil thoughts?

this passage show the kind of work James had in mind.

alBHAGDADI:

Imagine someone walks up to you and says he wants to give you a 50 storey skyscraper on Eko Atlantic City. He then says you will be the one to build it from scratch i.e dig the foundation, mix the cement bend the irons, mould the blocks and build it up to the 50th floor all by yourself without highering labourers. Will you consider that to be good news?

Now, imagine someone offers you the keys to an already completed skyscraper in Eko Atlantic and says all you have to do is believe it exists. is this good news?

The latter is the good news because you don't have to do any work before you get the promise. All you do is to believe, unlike the first which gives you a list of hard work to do, which you can never finish, before you can attain promise.

With heaven, you don't have to do any work other than just believe in Jesus. You don't have to ensure you do not sin before you can make heaven. All you need is to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.

But some people believe that works is required for salvation or to make heaven. Yes, works is required but what kind of work is that? Let's ask Jesus Christ


John 6:28-29
28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

What did Jesus also say in the most famous bie verse which is John 3:16?

John 3:16 (KJV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

What did the disciples of Jesus preach? Did they preach work based salvation or faith/believe salvation?

Acts 16:30-31 (KJV)
30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house

As seen so far, the work God requires from us to do is to believe on his Son Jesus Christ. The disciples went further to state that work based salvation is false whereby you rely on your own works of righteousness. There is nothing like my works of righteousness plus faith as requirement for salvation. What salvation requires is believe/faith, not works of righteousness e.g not signing, doing good etc.

Ephesians 2:8-9 (KJV)
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The disciples also added that even if you do not work at all but believe on Jesus, you are still seem as righteous before God.

Romans 4:5 (KJV)
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Why is God still considering you a righteous man and would allow you into heaven despite your many sins? That's because Jesus has taken your sins upon himself and has given you his righteousness.

2 Corinthians 5:21 (KJV)
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

What did Jesus do exactly on the cross? His action on the cross made him the saviour of mankind. When you appear before a judge for horrible sins, he will definitely sentence you. Now, imagine someone shows up from nowhere and bails you out of the judgment. That's exactly what Jesus cries does with his blood. He bails those who believe in him from the consequence of sin when they die.

There is no eternal punishment for you if you believe in Jesus. You already have eternal life once you believe.

John 3:18 (KJV)
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God

Can you now see that it is easy to make heaven just as it is easy for you to drink water? Yes, it is easy as saying...

"Lord Jesus Christ, I believe in you as my Lord and Savior. Save me today and give me eternal life. I no longer rely on my works but your work on the cross".

You see how easy that was. Isn't it good news that heaven is easy to make and it is done once. There's nothing like losing your salvation.

Philippians 1:6 (KJV)
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

God who saved you today is not like an earthly bank that will lose what was saved. That's why he's a mighty God. He won't have sacrificed Jesus if he knew his blood won't be capable of keeping what it saved. The power on that blood can't be quantified. Those who believe they can lose their salvation don't really believe in Jesus. They are just paying lips service. They don't believe that Jesus the same yesterday, today and forever is capable of taking away their sins of yesterday, today and forever. They believe he only has power over their sins of yesterday, that's why they hold themselves responsible for the sons they commit henceforth. They've condemned themselves.

Can you now see how the good news is truly good news and pleasant to the ears? That's the good news Jesus said we should spread from Judea to the ends of the Earth.

bro, the good news is good because it brings liberty not bondage.
God bless you for this

malvisguy212:
this will be my last post on this thread.

in James 2 , it is very clear that James audience has the same mind set as you guys. James use rahab the prostitute to illustrate his point, a shame to people who claimed to be save. James audience thought that good work will earn them eternal life, so James ask this question :
James 2:25-26 In the same way, was not even Rahab
the prostitute CONSIDERED RIGHTEOUS for what
she did when she gave lodging to the spies
and sent them off in a different direction?
As the body without the spirit is dead, so
faith without deeds is dead.

wasn't rehab the worst ? ( a prostitute ) how then was she considered righteous by this Jews ? was she justified by faith ? or work ? if you claimed that you have done good deed that will earn you eternal life, rahab the prostitute has done far greater.


How is a person saved? “For by grace are ye saved THROUGH FAITH, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast.” Salvation is a gift. It is free (paid for by the blood of Christ). All the sinner needs to do is to receive that gift by faith.

a believer must performed Good work to show the evidence of his Faith. work in this context is not the kind of work that will earn you eternal life, you do Good work because you are save.

James 2:3-4 If you show special attention to the man wearing fine clothes and say, “Here’s a good seat for you,” but say to the poor man, “You stand there” or
“Sit on the floor by my feet,” have you not
discriminated among yourselves and become
judges with evil thoughts?

this passage show the kind of work James had in mind.

You are still shifting goalpost to something else.

Why should Rahab be stoned to death over a law she was not under?

It’s synonymous to judging a Christian with the Sharia law to determine whether such a person is law abiding.

On what grounds should Rahab the gentile be stoned to death?

malvisguy212:
this will be my last post on this thread.
in James 2 , it is very clear that James audience has the same mind set as you guys. James use rahab the prostitute to illustrate his point, a shame to people who claimed to be save. James audience thought that good work will earn them eternal life, so James ask this question :
James 2:25-26 In the same way, was not even Rahab
the prostitute CONSIDERED RIGHTEOUS for what
she did when she gave lodging to the spies
and sent them off in a different direction?
As the body without the spirit is dead, so
faith without deeds is dead.

wasn't rehab the worst ? ( a prostitute ) how then was she considered righteous by this Jews ? was she justified by faith ? or work ? if you claimed that you have done good deed that will earn you eternal life, rahab the prostitute has done far greater.


How is a person saved? “For by grace are ye saved THROUGH FAITH, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast.” Salvation is a gift. It is free (paid for by the blood of Christ). All the sinner needs to do is to receive that gift by faith.

a believer must performed Good work to show the evidence of his Faith. work in this context is not the kind of work that will earn you eternal life, you do Good work because you are save.

James 2:3-4 If you show special attention to the man wearing fine clothes and say, “Here’s a good seat for you,” but say to the poor man, “You stand there” or
“Sit on the floor by my feet,” have you not
discriminated among yourselves and become
judges with evil thoughts?

this passage show the kind of work James had in mind.

Your last post on this thread as concerned him, not your last post on this thread

OkCornel:


You are still shifting goalpost to something else.

Why should Rahab be stoned to death over a law she was not under?

It’s synonymous to judging a Christian with the Sharia law to determine whether such a person is law abiding.

On what grounds should Rahab the gentile be stoned to death?

you are not qualify to discuss this topic. anyway you tried. thank you for your time. stay bless.

MuttleyLaff:
Your last post on this thread as concerned him, not your last post on this thread

may be you are right. but that brother keep repeating the same thing .

malvisguy212:
you are not qualify to discuss this topic. anyway you tried. thank you for your time. stay bless.

Deflection deflection deflection.

No wahala bro. Do enjoy your day.