₦airaland Forum

raumdeuter:
Sterling left Liverpool at 21, CHO is 21

Sterling played over 9k minutes, CHO played 6k minutes
All competitions CHO has 16 goals and 21 assists for Chelsea
All competitions Sterling has 23 goals and 20 assists for Liverpool

I am talking about their EPL stats
Sterling had far better goal returns than Odoi and played a part in Liverpool title push with Suarez and Sturidge that year
With Odoi as starter Chelsea have never pushed for a title race

Kantebets:
I am talking about their EPL stats
Sterling had far better goal returns than Odoi and played a part in Liverpool title push with Suarez and Sturidge that year
With Odoi as starter Chelsea have never pushed for a title race

Must you be selective?

Is EPL the only existing tournament?

donstan18:
Must you be selective?

Is EPL the only existing tournament?

There is a reason EPL is rated above domestic cup competition
Anyone can stat pad with domestic cups but EPL/UCL is the real deal

raumdeuter:
It has zero correlation when you can sign a top player like Donarumma, Lewandowski and Mbappe for 0 while an average player like Sterling AWB Oxlade are more expensive. Many factors affect transfer fees to make it a reliable measure like lenght of contract, release clause

A team between June 2021 and June 2022 can assemble for total of $0.

-------Donaruma
Azpi Sule Rudiger Alaba
--Pogba--Wijanuldum-Brozovic
-Messi--Mbappe--Dybala

The better correlation would be wages paid. You can get sign a player with $0, but you probably cant get away with paying a playing $0 in salary

So in essence, amount spent by a club has no effect on their success or lack of thereof...

AnfieldFan:
So in essence, amount spent by a club has no effect on their success or lack of thereof...

Amount spent on transfer fees has minimal effect. Not amount spent on salaries

I'm leaving Rangers to join MK Dons bruh wtf

AnfieldFan:
You're saying NetSpend has no bearing on a team's success right??

Of course YES.

raumdeuter:
Amount spent on transfer fees has minimal effect. Not amount spent on salaries

Do you think City would be this successful if they didn't spend as much as they did from 2008 till now?

popizaino:
Of course YES.

Then how come City has become this successful over a short period of time...Compare City 2000 to 2010 and 2010 to 2020...

AnfieldFan:
Then how come City has become this successful over a short period...Compare City 2000 to 2010 and 2010 to 2020...

They have invested in getting good managers.

popizaino:
They have invested in getting good managers.

You can't get good managers without getting equally good players to compliment, there needs to be a balance...So how have they been able to achieve all they have achieved without aggressive player acquisitions being one of the driving catalysts as you would want us to believe?

2000 till 2020/21 season...Bear in mind, Chelsea is included in this question?

Kantebets:
CHO has played with Hazard,played under 3 different coaches yet such poor return
How do you start to teach such a person
Look the players Pep is dealing with at city -they were at least good before Pep signed them

Do seem to underestimate play time rhythm in your analysis, Sterling was playing game in game out and was hitting his strides, our attackers are poor but the rate the get chopped and shuffled it’ll be difficult for any to have impressive stats.

Kantebets:
There is a reason EPL is rated above domestic cup competition
Anyone can stat pad with domestic cups but EPL/UCL is the real deal

So how many UCL has Sterling won?

AnfieldFan:
Do you think City would be this successful if they didn't spend as much as they did from 2008 till now?

City could have chosen a different route, target free transfers and offer them a big salary. Like I have shown you a club can assemble top players on free transfer end up spending 0

AnfieldFan:
You can't get good managers without getting equally good players to compliment, there needs to be a balance...So how have they been able to achieve all they have achieved without aggressive player acquisitions being one of the driving catalysts as you would want us to believe?

2000 till 2020/21 season...Bear in mind, Chelsea is included in this question?

A good manager with a club can entice a team of free agent on bumper wages without paying a dime on transfer fees

PSG got Donarumma Messi Ramos and Wijnaldum for Free

BlueMann:
I'm leaving Rangers to join MK Dons bruh wtf

I'm transferring from molde to Valencia for 62 million.

raumdeuter:
City could have chosen a different route, target free transfers and offer them a big salary.

But they didn't, and to buttress my point, not only did City spend big and currently spending big on player acquisitions, they've matched the the biggest teams in player wages..

raumdeuter:
Like I have shown you a club can assemble top players on free transfer end up spending 0

Now, bear in mind that what you did is speculative as no top team has gathered 10 world class players on a free...

raumdeuter:
A good manager with a club can entice a team of free agent on bumper wages without paying a dime

PSG got Donarumma Messi Ramos and Wijnaldum for Free

I have told AnfieldFan my good friend that the netspend argument is not a solid one because it can be beat in any direction. Liverpool paid more for Karius and Alisson than City paid for Claudio Bravo and Ederson. They paid more for Oxlade and Keita than Gundo and B. Silva.

AnfieldFan:
You can't get good managers without getting equally good players to compliment, there needs to be a balance...So how have they been able to achieve all they have achieved without aggressive player acquisitions being one of the driving catalysts as you would want us to believe?

2000 till 2020/21 season...Bear in mind, Chelsea is included in this question?

If we lool very carefully around, we would see a lot of teams equally investing heavily on players by doing so badly.

Maximilan:
Do seem to underestimate play time rhythm in your analysis, Sterling was playing game in game out and was hitting his strides, our attackers are poor but the rate the get chopped and shuffled it’ll be difficult for any to have impressive stats.

CHO has been playing for four years three different coaches yet poverty returns
He was a regular under lampard in his first season in charge

AnfieldFan:
But they didn't, and to buttress my point, not only did City spend big and currently spending big on player acquisitions, they've matched the the biggest teams in player wages..



Now, bear in mind that what you did is speculative as no top team has gathered 10 world class players on a free...

See Liverpool's current wage bill compared to City's.

AnfieldFan:
But they didn't, and to buttress my point, not only did City spend big and currently spending big on player acquisitions, they've matched the the biggest teams in player wages..

Now, bear in mind that what you did is speculative as no top team has gathered 10 world class players on a free...

PSG last summer bought 4 top players for free, Madrid has already done Alaba and Mbappe, possibly Pogba by summer

That someone hasnt done it does not mean it cannot be done. Teams are doing it already, targeting free transfers

Juventus did it. between 2013 and 2019 they picked many players on free transfers and built a team of Pogba Rabiot, Ramsey Can, Khedira, Dani Alves all on free

Kantebets:
CHO has been playing for four years three different coaches yet poverty returns
He was a regular under lampard in his first season in charge

Bayern would have maximized his output. You also have to consider the positions he has played in. CHO was thought of in the same mold as Foden and Greenwood when he was younger. I suspect extra curricula events may be affecting him.

raumdeuter:
A good manager with a club can entice a team of free agent on bumper wages without paying a dime on transfer fees

We are talking building a team able to compete for trophies consistently.
For a coach to draw world class players, the club itself has to have some sort of studied history...
Ole got Varane, Cavani, Ronaldo...I don't think his coaching chops were responsible, more of the history of the club in question..
I'm not saying Coaches don't attract players because they do, but the best coach can't attract 7-11 world class players to a club like Norwich when Manchester is interested. It mainly happens when two big clubs are vying for a player's sig, the player then goes for the manager he feels will better serve his ambition as well as his productivity...

raumdeuter:
PSG got Donarumma Messi Ramos and Wijnaldum for Free

Secondly, clubs who don't have the financial muscle can't pay humongous wages even if they get these players free..

popizaino:
If we lool very carefully around, we would see a lot of teams equally investing heavily on players by doing so badly.

You don't need to go far, Man United is an example...
Good recruitment team, competent manager and level of competition in the league are all factors...

The point is, does spending big have an effect on success trophy wise?

Android22:
I have told AnfieldFan my good friend that the netspend argument is not a solid one because it can be beat in any direction. Liverpool paid more for Karius and Alisson than City paid for Claudio Bravo and Ederson. They paid more for Oxlade and Keita than Gundo and B. Silva.

Players are deliberately running down their contracts now to move on a free transfer and eat all the money alone without their parent club getting anything

Chelsea can lose Azpi Christensen and Rudiger for free meaning Newcastle or PSG can just get all 3 for free by promising huge wage.

If Madrid end the transfer window for the past 2 seasons adding Mbappe Pogba Alaba 3 of the best players in their position for a sum total of 0 which can free up money to buy some other not free players. Basically Madrid can set up a world class 11 with 100-200m which another team will spend 900m for an inferior team because they are not getting them for free

Android22:
Bayern would have maximized his output. You also have to consider the positions he has played in. CHO was thought of in the same mold as Foden and Greenwood when he was younger. I suspect extra curricula events may be affecting him.

extra curricula bawo
Bayern dodged a bullet bro
Even Pulisic that has been called out here has better EPL goals returns than CHO

Android22:
See Liverpool's current wage bill compared to City's.

I don't know how this is relevant as I'm not even talking wage bills here though they factor in the argument as well....


Secondly, Liverpool's wage bill is highly incentivized by certain performance accomplishments...
Virgil didn't play almost throughout last season, how much do you think he earned pee week?

AnfieldFan:
We are talking building a team able to compete for trophies consistently.
For a coach to draw world class players, the club itself has to have some sort of studied history...
Ole got Varane, Cavani, Ronaldo...I don't think his coaching chops were responsible, more of the history of the club in question..
I'm not saying Coaches don't attract players because they do, but the best coach can't attract 7-11 world class players to a club like Norwich when Manchester is interested. It mainly happens when two big clubs are vying for a player's sig, the player then goes for the manager he feels will better serve his ambition as well as his productivity...


Secondly, clubs who don't have the financial muscle can't pay humongous wages even if they get these players free..

Money attracts players and by money I mean salary.

There was a time Etoo after winning CL left to Anzhi Machakchala with some other players

Neymar DiMaria Mbappe Cavani Thiago Silva Zlatan Verrati all left top clubs to PSG a club established in 1970.

Clubs have financial muscle to sign players the point is Madrid can assemble a top class team of peak players with just 200m while Newcastle might spend 900m to assemble an inferior team

raumdeuter:
PSG last summer bought 4 top players for free, Madrid has already done Alaba and Mbappe, possibly Pogba by summer

That someone hasnt done it does not mean it cannot be done. Teams are doing it already, targeting free transfers

Juventus did it. between 2013 and 2019 they picked many players on free transfers and built a team of Pogba Rabiot, Ramsey Can, Khedira, Dani Alves all on free

The point is a team hasn't done it before....Every other thing is speculative....
Teams who are massively successful over a short period of time have spent big...
If Newcastle becomes a top 6 club in England over the coming years, it won't be because they built a world class 11 for free...
Exceptions happen whereby 2-3 players move to a club for free, but it's because they club has already tested success and massively structured their teams to get the most optimal money value...

raumdeuter:
Players are deliberately running down their contracts now to move on a free transfer and eat all the money alone without their parent club getting anything

Chelsea can lose Azpi Christensen and Rudiger for free meaning Newcastle or PSG can just get all 3 for free by promising huge wage.

If Madrid end the transfer window for the past 2 seasons adding Mbappe Pogba Alaba 3 of the best players in their position for a sum total of 0 which can free up money to buy some other not free players. Basically Madrid can set up a world class 11 with 100-200m which another team will spend 900m for an inferior team because they are not getting them for free

This is accurate and drives home the point I was trying to make to him that day. It is not enough to just say team A spent 1B and team B spent 600M therefore Team A should be more successful. Just like the example you gave above, Team B could also be paying the players more money which is not covered with the transfer fee and Netspend argument. That is not to say money does not help with succeeding.

AnfieldFan:
I don't know how this is relevant as I'm not even talking wage bills here though they factor in the argument as well....


Secondly, Liverpool's wage bill is highly incentivized by certain performance accomplishments...
Virgil didn't play almost throughout last season, how much do you think he earned pee week?

The underlying issue was that Netspend does not factor wage bill. Believe me, every club's wage bill is incentivized. As City did not win the UCL last season, many of the figures you saw there would not be maxxed out.