₦airaland Forum

But given that the SE and core north are filled to the brim with incompetent leadership , this would have been what they ought to correct about how VAT is collected.

Laziness and ineptitude combined is why VAT is collected at the point of production or from corporate headquarters which are all domiciled in the better South (SS and SW)


Everywhere else that VAT is law, it is charged on Point of sale.

One way to go about remediating this is by ensuring that major distributors of consumable brands are registered in their licenced state of distribution and from there the state FIRS can collect VAT directly. The harder way is to first review retail laws and have franchised outlets in every community as it's done in Europe and the US. The situation where every street has 20 provision shops will have to go in place of a licensed operator within a given radius and operating hours. In the US they have 7/11s that operate 24hrs within a block area. In Europe you have tobacconist and liquor licenced vendors operating within an area and time frame.

This is one way to get VAT directly at point of sale . The governors can mandate each vendor to operate purely cashless for certain transaction ranges.

The only drawback from this is that consumer volume in Nigeria will reduce drastically because most of these provision stores actually are the main buyers of goods from manufacturers and distributors and not the populace. If every street has about on average 10 provision shops stocking up on noodles and other essentials which they buy in bulk, you will understand how these petty traders actually boost consumption and demand of goods . The provision shops do not even make decent profit margins because they are too clustered in one area. Creating licenses for these petty traders is one way to recoup tax and declutter the over clogged market of retailers.

For airtime, this can easily be rectified by having the Telcos provide the state of location where their data or airtime is purchased and the vat applied therein.

For alcohol, the Sharia states should stop being hypocritical. Alcohol is far cheeper in the Sharia north than in the South because most bar owners there have a near monopoly and sell higher volumes than their counterparts in states that alcohol is legal. Sharia states can easily grant alcohol licenses to bar owners as is being done till this day by the Emirate council - a scenario dating back to colonial indirect rule in the north where British colonial workers had to get an alcohol and tobacco permit from the Amir claiming they suffer from a disease that requires they use both vices. Instead of the Emirs granting such licence to liquor houses which is the norm today, the state governorment should take over and if they like impose 300% VAT on every bottle sold within the confines of the drinking parlours.


This is the way forward.

AntiMarxist:
But given that the SE and core north are filled to the brim with incompetent leadership , this would have been what they ought to correct about how VAT is collected.

Laziness and ineptitude combined is why VAT is collected at the point of production or from corporate headquarters which are all domiciled in the better South (SS and SW)


Everywhere else that VAT is law, it is charged on Point of sale.

One way to go about remediating this is by ensuring that major distributors of consumable brands are registered in their licenced state of distribution and from there the state FIRS can collect VAT directly. The harder way is to first review retail laws and have franchised outlets in every community as it's done in Europe and the US. The situation where every street has 20 provision shops will have to go in place of a licensed operator within a given radius and operating hours. In the US they have 7/11s that operate 24hrs within a block area. In Europe you have tobacconist and liquor licenced vendors operating within an area and time frame.

This is one way to get VAT directly at point of sale . The governors can mandate each vendor to operate purely cashless for certain transaction ranges.

The only drawback from this is that consumer volume in Nigeria will reduce drastically because most of these provision stores actually are the main buyers of goods from manufacturers and distributors and not the populace. If every street has about on average 10 provision shops stocking up on noodles and other essentials which they buy in bulk, you will understand how these petty traders actually boost consumption and demand of goods . The provision shops do not even make decent profit margins because they are too clustered in one area. Creating licenses for these petty traders is one way to recoup tax and declutter the over clogged market of retailers.

For airtime, this can easily be rectified by having the Telcos provide the state of location where their data or airtime is purchased and the vat applied therein.

For alcohol, the Sharia states should stop being hypocritical. Alcohol is far cheeper in the Sharia north than in the South because most bar owners there have a near monopoly and sell higher volumes than their counterparts in states that alcohol is legal. Sharia states can easily grant alcohol licenses to bar owners as is being done till this day by the Emirate council - a scenario dating back to colonial indirect rule in the north where British colonial workers had to get an alcohol and tobacco permit from the Amir claiming they suffer from a disease that requires they use both vices. Instead of the Emirs granting such licence to liquor houses which is the norm today, the state governorment should take over and if they like impose 300% VAT on every bottle sold within the confines of the drinking parlours.


This is the way forward.

Look the north in the eye speak truth to the north without mentioning the South East, you cowards should grow some balls for once

AntiMarxist:
But given that the SE and core north are filled to the brim with incompetent leadership , this would have been what they ought to correct about how VAT is collected.

Laziness and ineptitude combined is why VAT is collected at the point of production or from corporate headquarters which are all domiciled in the better South (SS and SW)


Everywhere else that VAT is law, it is charged on Point of sale.

One way to go about remediating this is by ensuring that major distributors of consumable brands are registered in their licenced state of distribution and from there the state FIRS can collect VAT directly. The harder way is to first review retail laws and have franchised outlets in every community as it's done in Europe and the US. The situation where every street has 20 provision shops will have to go in place of a licensed operator within a given radius and operating hours. In the US they have 7/11s that operate 24hrs within a block area. In Europe you have tobacconist and liquor licenced vendors operating within an area and time frame.

This is one way to get VAT directly at point of sale . The governors can mandate each vendor to operate purely cashless for certain transaction ranges.

The only drawback from this is that consumer volume in Nigeria will reduce drastically because most of these provision stores actually are the main buyers of goods from manufacturers and distributors and not the populace. If every street has about on average 10 provision shops stocking up on noodles and other essentials which they buy in bulk, you will understand how these petty traders actually boost consumption and demand of goods . The provision shops do not even make decent profit margins because they are too clustered in one area. Creating licenses for these petty traders is one way to recoup tax and declutter the over clogged market of retailers.

For airtime, this can easily be rectified by having the Telcos provide the state of location where their data or airtime is purchased and the vat applied therein.

For alcohol, the Sharia states should stop being hypocritical. Alcohol is far cheeper in the Sharia north than in the South because most bar owners there have a near monopoly and sell higher volumes than their counterparts in states that alcohol is legal. Sharia states can easily grant alcohol licenses to bar owners as is being done till this day by the Emirate council - a scenario dating back to colonial indirect rule in the north where British colonial workers had to get an alcohol and tobacco permit from the Amir claiming they suffer from a disease that requires they use both vices. Instead of the Emirs granting such licence to liquor houses which is the norm today, the state governorment should take over and if they like impose 300% VAT on every bottle sold within the confines of the drinking parlours.


This is the way forward.

What exactly is Point of Sale ?

Does it have a definition

aribisala0:
What exactly is Point of Sale ?

Does it have a definition

Where you purchase goods and services directly.

Your local provision shop in your neighborhood is considered as a "Point of Sale".

Mrfeel:
Look the north in the eye speak truth to the north without mentioning the South East, you cowards should grow some balls for once

I drag north here pass you cowards.

Besides, you are all opposing this bill for same reason the north is opposing it.

No difference between an Aboki and an 0koro after all.

You are correct,
The states should be collecting tax, not Federal Government and not at Ports.

I believe this was the case when it was called sales tax, before being reformed as VAT.
If companies in Nigeria are remitting even income tax from accross the country to Lagos state, how do you trust same to give you point of derivation for VAT without simplifying the headache with Lagos state.


There is no need for any retail licencing or any major retailer and such. The simple thing is a law mandating any major distributor of any goods in a state to register for VAT. Alternatively, it can be done with revenue, any distributor that retail more than 1 million naira in any specific good or service in a state should register for VAT.

Excluding all out of state distribution and deliveries. This exclusion should be a federal law.

AntiMarxist:
I drag north here pass you cowards.

Besides, you are all opposing this bill for same reason the north is opposing it.

No difference between an Aboki and an 0koro after all.

Speak your truth to north without mentioning south east, grow some balls, cowards, North against bill reform, you mention south east to hide face, north hunger protest, mention south east gaslighting north to hide face, grow some balls look your masters in the eye for once

Mrfeel:
Speak your truth to north without mentioning south east, grow some balls, cowards, North against bill reform, you mention south east to hide face, north hunger protest, mention south east gaslighting north to hide face, grow some balls look your masters in the eye for once

Lolz

Orji Ozwor Kalu aka the "gift from a slave girl" who is your highest ranking Senator has come out to openly oppose the bill.

Your obi is doing his usual empty mouth salad over this bill out of fear of not offending his northern buck breakers .

The SE had shown they oppose this bill on the same grounds that the northern parasitic states are opposed to it - it ends the feeding bottle regime.

AntiMarxist:
Where you purchase goods and services directly.

Your local provision shop in your neighborhood is considered as a "Point of Sale".

I think the point is that we are discussing legislation
The term should have a definition

What does purchase mean? E.g if I buy a recharge card in Ibadan and use it in Kano what is the Point of sale?
What you have said does not meet the standard of a legal definition
If a company In Abuja hires an architect from Lagos to do work in Abuja but pay him in Lagos
Where is the point of sale a good example is the foreign coaches hired by NFF often paid in their home country or online services

There is also value addition in the business to business sector eg a security escort from Lagos to Maiduguri and so on

These things need technical definition not comm9n sense definition

I

There are so many layers to Value

aribisala0:
I think the point is that we are discussing legislation
The term should have a definition

What does purchase mean? E.g if I buy a recharge card in Ibadan and use it in Kano what is the Point of sale?
What you have said does not meet the standard of a legal definition
If a company In Abuja hires an architect from Lagos to do work in Abuja but pay him in Lagos
Where is the point of sale a good example is the foreign coaches hired by NFF often paid in their home country or online services

There is also value addition in the business to business sector eg a security escort from Lagos to Maiduguri and so on

These things need technical definition not comm9n sense definition

I

There are so many layers to Value

I buy whiskey from a liquor store in Abuja, I take it along with me to Sharia state Kano and consume it in the confines of my hotel room.

Where was the point money changed hands? That's where the Point of Sale is and not where it is consumed.

Where I purchase Airtime is the state of point of sale. Any subsequent purchase outside that state does not qualify .

AntiMarxist:
Lolz

Orji Ozwor Kalu aka the "gift from a slave girl" who is your highest ranking Senator has come out to openly oppose the bill.

Your obi is doing his usual empty mouth salad over this bill out of fear of not offending his northern buck breakers

The SE had shown they oppose this bill on the same grounds that the northern parasitic states are opposed to it - it ends the feeding bottle regime.

I repeat you cowards should look the north in the eyes and speak to them for once without hiding behind south east, if you say orji kalu opposed the bill then I will say compression in English is your problem, grow some balls, Yoruba grow some balls

AntiMarxist:
I buy whiskey from a liquor store in Abuja, I take it along with me to Sharia state Kano and consume it in the confines of my hotel room.

Where was the point money changed hands? That's where the Point of Sale is and not where it is consumed.

Where I purchase Airtime is the state of point of sale. Any subsequent purchase outside that state does not qualify .

You are talking beer parlour talk

What is money ? How is it defined
what is changed hands how is it defined?
Your perspective is very superficial
Money in a cashless society can mean anything. You can buy a thing in London and payments happen in New York

Nigeria import mostly from China and a lot of that money changes hands in dollars in American banks

All that you said is what seems good to you in the limit of your understanding it might not seem good to the next person

That is why we need explicit definition not what makes sense to you

A large segment of VAT is business to business e.g transportation, logistics, security warehousing which can happen across multiple states

Mrfeel:
I repeat you cowards should look the north in the eyes and speak to them for once without hiding behind south east, if you say orji kalu opposed the bill then I will say compression in English is your problem, grow some balls, Yoruba grow some balls

I am here to remind everyone here of my past warnings of you guys opposing any talk of restructuring and my earlier statement that the SE is the least productive zone in Nigeria even when compared to the north that you guys have been condemning as parasitic

Why are you all and your leaders all opposed to this bill?

I have been asking this question and not one of you had answered me this ?

The truth remains that this bill not only exposes your dependency on the federal government albeit other productive regions and seeks to put an end to such parasitism but it also affirms my position that SE will aways oppose anything that benefits both the SS and SW.

The coastal highway is just the latest act of sabotage . Opposition to Obasanjo's 25% to oil producing states at which time no SE state was producing oil. You only have your marginal wells operating after Yaradua granted 13,% and you then got GEJ to grant licences to open up oil wells in the SE that are owned exclusively by SE businessmen.


The PIB is another example of your treachery .

No be today.

Isn’t that what the tax reform bill is proposing?

aribisala0:
You are talking beer parlour talk

What is money ? How is it defined
what is changed hands how is it defined?
Your perspective is very superficial
Money in a cashless society can mean anything. You can buy a thing in London and payments happen in New York

Nigeria import mostly from China and a lot of that money changes hands in dollars in American banks

All that you said is what seems good to you in the limit of your understanding it might not seem good to the next person

That is why we need explicit definition not what makes sense to you

A large segment of VAT is business to business e.g transportation, logistics, security warehousing which can happen across multiple states

Spewing trash.

By your logic any transfer or cashless payment should be narrowed down to NIBS platform of the CBN in their Lagos btanch.

Ok, let me make it simple for you.

POS within any sovereign state is where goods or services are exchanged for cash and a physical receipt bearing the address an location where the transaction occured is duly presented as evidence of transaction completed.

Does this satisfy your query?

yoruboid:
Isn’t that what the tax reform bill is proposing?

Yes.

AntiMarxist:
I am here to remind everyone here of my past warnings of you guys opposing any talk of restructuring and my earlier statement that the SE is the least productive zone in Nigeria even when compared to the north that you guys have been condemning as parasitic

Why are you all and your leaders all opposed to this bill?

I have been asking this question and not one of you had answered me this ?

The truth remains that this bill not only exposes your dependency on the federal government albeit other productive regions and seeks to put an end to such parasitism but it also affirms my position that SE will aways oppose anything that benefits both the SS and SW.

The coastal highway is just the latest act of sabotage . Opposition to Obasanjo's 25% to oil producing states at which time no SE state was producing oil. You only have your marginal wells operating after Yaradua granted 13,% and you then got GEJ to grant licences to open up oil wells in the SE that are owned exclusively by SE businessmen.


The PIB is another example of your treachery .

No be today.

Like I said speak to the north without hiding behind south east, you cowards should grow some balls, be brave enough to look north in the eye and speak to them, south east can't be your shield all the time ,I hate cowards

AntiMarxist:
Yes.

Now you lie.
The bill is not proposing that states collect their own VAT. It is rather proposing a Vague term of derivation which will be falsified by companies, and lead to tax accruing to other states being paid to Lagos.

Nobody will complain if VAT collection is removed from the Federal Government and ports.

GerogeI:
Now you lie.
The bill is not proposing that states collect their own VAT. It is rather proposing a Vague term of derivation which will be falsified by companies, and lead to tax accruing to other states being paid to Lagos.

Nobody will complain if VAT collection is removed from the Federal Government and ports.

That's because the current VAT collection is done at point of production and were corporate HQs are located.

This why this thread is telling those opposed to it ,to seek redress by ensuring the collection of VAT occurs at the point of sale.

Mrfeel:
Like I said speak to the north without hiding behind south east, you cowards should grow some balls, be brave enough to look north in the eye and speak to them, south east can't be your shield all the time ,I hate cowards

So you didn't see me call out the north as being clueless, lazy and full of ineptitude and how I proposed they can go about ensuring that consumer tax aka vat are collected on point of sale?

Ewü.

AntiMarxist:
Spewing trash.

By your logic any transfer or cashless payment should be narrowed down to NIBS platform of the CBN in their Lagos btanch.

Ok, let me make it simple for you.

POS within any sovereign state is where goods or services are exchanged for cash and a physical receipt bearing the address an location where the transaction occured is duly presented as evidence of transaction completed.[/b]

Does this satisfy your query?

You talk stupidly like an OMATA

WE are talking about legislation

Things must defined using precise legal language not something you just cook up because it seems good in your head
This is obviously beyond your brain power.
cash ?..

Is where?.. who taught you English ?

aribisala0:
You talk stupidly like an OMATA

WE are talking about legislation

Things must defined using precise legal language not something you just cook up because it seems good in your head
This is obviously beyond your brain power.
cash ?..

Is where?.. who taught you English ?

Another name for VAT is Consumer TAX and it is beared solely by the consumer at the point of purchase.

There. I have simplified it for you.

If I buy anything that isn't exempted from VAT in Anambra, then Anambra state gets to keep half.

AntiMarxist:
That's because the current VAT collection is done at point of production and were corporate HQs are located.

This why this thread is telling those opposed to it ,to seek redress by ensuring the collection of VAT occurs at the point of sale.

You should rather address the proposers to decentralise VAT collection to states to make the bill acceptable, not the opposers.

AntiMarxist:
So you didn't see me call out the north as being clueless, lazy and full of ineptitude and how I proposed they can go about ensuring that consumer tax aka vat are collected on point of sale?

Ewü.

No , I see you trying to smuggle south east into the conversation just to shield your cowards self like you always , look the north in the eye speak to them without mentioning south East , as far as I know south east has no problem with the bill knowing fully well that all those big companies with their headquarters in Lagos, PH , Ogun will start paying taxes directly to south east states which will increase our revenue we are ok with it, why should we be against it in the first place? Do you know how many people from middle belt and as far as Cameroon troop to Onitsha and ABA to buy goods that their headquarters is not based in the south east? If those headquarters start paying directly to south east how will we lose ?

AntiMarxist:
Another name for VAT is Consumer TAX and it is beared solely by the consumer at the point of purchase.

There. I have simplified it for you.

If I buy anything that isn't exempted from VAT in Anambra, then Anambra state gets to keep half.

You are just making stuff up like a dunce

VAT can happen between two businesses e.g a transporter and a wholesalers.
Even warehousing can attract VAT, insurance security and so on all on a bag of cement even before it gets to the builder

It is the same across the value chain and is called B2B VAT

JUST SHUT UP
ABEG
There can be 8 VAT able steps in the value chain long before the end consumer
This matter is beyond you stop talking on what you are clueless about

Mercenary321:
. The ediot is the popular nairaland troll called bishopmgic from southern Kaduna or benue. He is the number one Igbo hater here. His real name is Bishop Adamu Chitinmu

Check him out on Twitter. We have been following him and we promised to reveal the man behind that handle. Now we got him

Check out his pictures

Oh really? Didn't know the north plays that cowards sort of game , I now understand why real northerners hate southern Kaduna people

Mercenary321:
. He claims to come from niger Delta here just to pitch the real niger Deltans against igbos. He has numerous moniker that he uses to push his anti Igbo rhetorics here.

Don't forget his name, Bishop Adamu Chitinmu

Look at his ugly face here. We've got his family involved too. This is a promise we made to every Igbo hater here,we will come for you and reveal your identity no matter where you are. This is just the beginning

He is here doing all these when his people are suffering in southern Kaduna, what is his gain sef ?