₦airaland Forum

JuanDeDios:
You didn't say Tamar was MARRIED to Shelah. A betrothed person can simply break the betrothal by going off with someone else.

Yes, the "fornication" argument can be made since they had sex without being husband and wife. But every society has always been fluid on and tolerated that practice. It's adultery that is not tolerated.

Anyway, my initial argument was that no adultery or incest was committed. You're just splashing the matter everywhere now.

Have a great day.

AbuTwins:
Abeg which kind custom is that for a brother to sleep with his brother's widow to produce offspring for him even if he doesn't want to?

Na by force?

And it's not only Onan! The father later slept with the same woman pretending as an harlot and she got pregnant. He wanted to punish her untill he realised he was the culprit.

God punished the sinful first son with death!
God punished the second with death!
The father committed adultery and incest but was forgiven!

How is such fair?

Shedrack777:
I have concrete evidence that even today, as a married man, if you spill your semen outside the opue, you'll lose your success for one year

gohf:
which infidelity? who was she married to?
Or you don't know what prostitution is again. Read what is actually written and stop making things up

Discountsempai:
It had nothing to do with Onan spilling his seed, and the verse in question had nothing to do with masturbation (and no, I am not excusing masturbation...especially as I have never engaged in it, because quite frankly it does not make sense).

Onan was supposed to marry his late brother's wife, and under the customs of that time, the first child he had with his wife would be counted as his brother's child (strange to us, but in a society with high child mortality, and a concern over keeping lineages alive...).

Onan refused to do that because (as the verses imply)...he hated his brother Er. So, out of bitterness, he denied Er THE RIGHT TO KEEP his lineage alive.

Essentially, what Onan also was doing was

1. Denying Tamar the right to have a child...in a society where barreness was a BIG STIGMA. (See how Jacob, Onan's grandpa, wife Rachel felt about having no kids...and later on Hannah. And even Sarah, Onan's great-great grandmother).

2. Essentially telling his father that he wanted both his and Er's inheritance...ie greed. If he had done what he was supposed to do, then when Judah died, his (Onan's) firstborn son would have gotten Er's portion of the inheritance. By having no kids, he gets a dobule portion.

3. Essentially commiting an injustice to his late brother and dishonoring his memory.

Thus..as the bible put it in Genesis 38 vs 8-10

8 Then Judah said to Onan, “Sleep with your brother’s wife and fulfill your duty to her as a brother-in-law to raise up offspring for your brother.” 9 But Onan knew that the child would not be his; so whenever he slept with his brother’s wife, he spilled his semen on the ground to keep from providing offspring for his brother. 10 What he did was wicked in the Lord’s sight; so the Lord put him to death also

So, nothing to do with seed or with masturbation as the OP thinks it does.

At its base it is a story about how harmful greed and resentment can be. And how wickedness also can provoke resentment (Er is described as a wicked man, so it is obvious that he was wicked to his two younger brothers, breeding anger and resentment).

AbuTwins:
Abeg which kind custom is that for a brother to sleep with his brother's widow to produce offspring for him even if he doesn't want to?

Na by force?

And it's not only Onan! The father later slept with the same woman pretending as an harlot and she got pregnant. He wanted to punish her untill he realised he was the culprit.

God punished the sinful first son with death!
God punished the second with death!
The father committed adultery and incest but was forgiven!

How is such fair?

MaxInDHouse:
God condemned Esau for a reason try to find out why then you will understand why Onan deserves to die!

AbuTwins:
Abeg which kind custom is that for a brother to sleep with his brother's widow to produce offspring for him even if he doesn't want to?

Na by force?

And it's not only Onan! The father later slept with the same woman pretending as an harlot and she got pregnant. He wanted to punish her untill he realised he was the culprit.

God punished the sinful first son with death!
God punished the second with death!
The father committed adultery and incest but was forgiven!

How is such fair?

AbuTwins:
Abeg which kind custom is that for a brother to sleep with his brother's widow to produce offspring for him even if he doesn't want to?

Na by force?

And it's not only Onan! The father later slept with the same woman pretending as an harlot and she got pregnant. He wanted to punish her untill he realised he was the culprit.

God punished the sinful first son with death!
God punished the second with death!
The father committed adultery and incest but was forgiven!

How is such fair?

donmik:
But u are supposed to know based on your depth of analysis.

Dey there d kick against what holy instruction they were asked to keep. Don't u know that human races then were few in numbers?

What entailed then may not apply today based on the new Covenant that Christ fulfilled.

AbuTwins:
Ah!

Unbelievable!

Hope it's not by force?

ZombieDredd:
This one you are emotional.

Customs are customs, if you don't like them shift.

For your village Dem no get different customs?

gohf:
What are you even writing about, have you ever read the Bible before?

Or you are making things up again from your imagination?

christopher123:
No

AbuTwins:
Who Jehovah no dey condemn?
Er, Onan,....

AbuTwins:
I should be the one to tell to read what is actually written.

Judah told Tamar to go home and wait for Shelah to mature so that they can get married!

Is that not a form of betrothal?

Discountsempai:
It had nothing to do with Onan spilling his seed, and the verse in question had nothing to do with masturbation (and no, I am not excusing masturbation...especially as I have never engaged in it, because quite frankly it does not make sense).

Onan was supposed to marry his late brother's wife, and under the customs of that time, the first child he had with his wife would be counted as his brother's child (strange to us, but in a society with high child mortality, and a concern over keeping lineages alive...).

Onan refused to do that because (as the verses imply)...he hated his brother Er. So, out of bitterness, he denied Er THE RIGHT TO KEEP his lineage alive.

Essentially, what Onan also was doing was

1. Denying Tamar the right to have a child...in a society where barreness was a BIG STIGMA. (See how Jacob, Onan's grandpa, wife Rachel felt about having no kids...and later on Hannah. And even Sarah, Onan's great-great grandmother).

2. Essentially telling his father that he wanted both his and Er's inheritance...ie greed. If he had done what he was supposed to do, then when Judah died, his (Onan's) firstborn son would have gotten Er's portion of the inheritance. By having no kids, he gets a dobule portion.

3. Essentially commiting an injustice to his late brother and dishonoring his memory.

Thus..as the bible put it in Genesis 38 vs 8-10

8 Then Judah said to Onan, “Sleep with your brother’s wife and fulfill your duty to her as a brother-in-law to raise up offspring for your brother.” 9 But Onan knew that the child would not be his; so whenever he slept with his brother’s wife, he spilled his semen on the ground to keep from providing offspring for his brother. 10 What he did was wicked in the Lord’s sight; so the Lord put him to death also

So, nothing to do with seed or with masturbation as the OP thinks it does.

At its base it is a story about how harmful greed and resentment can be. And how wickedness also can provoke resentment (Er is described as a wicked man, so it is obvious that he was wicked to his two younger brothers, breeding anger and resentment).

AbuTwins:
Ah! But I don't think Igbos still practice such today.

Lewiseze1988:
I'm surprised that in this scientific age and time,that there r still some people who still believe in bible bullshit.if u take time to study the bible very well,u will see that the bible is just a cock and bullshit story invented by the middle east men.all Gods were created by man.know this and know peace.also many portions of the bible shows that the writers doesn't even know anything about most of the things they were written down.when I read the portion where Jesus told a multitude lies,I knew bible is just fairytale.jesus told a multitude that truly many of u gathered here will be alive to see me return back to earth.now we know it is pure fat lie.he conned those foolish people

gohf:
it is not, you don't bethrol a widow, no bride price would be paid, she already belongs to the family who paid for her.

If such was betrothal, then Boaz should not have married Ruth.

AbuTwins:
What's the custom? That the widow marries the dead one's brother.

That's the betrothal!

Tamar belongs to Shelah after Onan died. She doesn't belong to Judah.

MonkeyMods:
Are you Igbo? They practice it till tomorrow

Jughead29:
Sperm testing for fertility is through masturbation

Is that a sin to you?

Masturbation is bad but stop giving wrong information using the Holy Book

Wallade:
That is a big lie

Discountsempai:
It had nothing to do with Onan spilling his seed, and the verse in question had nothing to do with masturbation (and no, I am not excusing masturbation...especially as I have never engaged in it, because quite frankly it does not make sense).

Onan was supposed to marry his late brother's wife, and under the customs of that time, the first child he had with his wife would
be counted as his brother's child (strange to us, but in a society with high child mortality, and a concern over keeping lineages alive...).

Onan refused to do that because (as the verses imply)...he hated his brother Er. So, out of bitterness, he denied Er THE RIGHT TO KEEP his lineage alive.

Essentially, what Onan also was doing was

1. Denying Tamar the right to have a child...in a society where barreness was a BIG STIGMA. (See how Jacob, Onan's grandpa, wife Rachel felt about having no kids...and later on Hannah. And even Sarah, Onan's great-great grandmother).

2. Essentially telling his father that he wanted both his and Er's inheritance...ie greed. If he had done what he was supposed to do, then when Judah died, his (Onan's) firstborn son would have gotten Er's portion of the inheritance. By having no kids, he gets a dobule portion.

3. Essentially commiting an injustice to his late brother and dishonoring his memory.

Thus..as the bible put it in Genesis 38 vs 8-10

8 Then Judah said to Onan, “Sleep with your brother’s wife and fulfill your duty to her as a brother-in-law to raise up offspring for your brother.” 9 But Onan knew that the child would not be his; so whenever he slept with his brother’s wife, he spilled his semen on the ground to keep from providing offspring for his brother. 10 What he did was wicked in the Lord’s sight; so the Lord put him to death also

So, nothing to do with seed or with masturbation as the OP thinks it does.

At its base it is a story about how harmful greed and resentment can be. And how wickedness also can provoke resentment (Er is described as a wicked man, so it is obvious that he was wicked to his two younger brothers, breeding anger and resentment).

Discountsempai:
It had nothing to do with Onan spilling his seed, and the verse in question had nothing to do with masturbation (and no, I am not excusing masturbation...especially as I have never engaged in it, because quite frankly it does not make sense).

Onan was supposed to marry his late brother's wife, and under the customs of that time, the first child he had with his wife would be counted as his brother's child (strange to us, but in a society with high child mortality, and a concern over keeping lineages alive...).

Onan refused to do that because (as the verses imply)...he hated his brother Er. So, out of bitterness, he denied Er THE RIGHT TO KEEP his lineage alive.

Essentially, what Onan also was doing was

1. Denying Tamar the right to have a child...in a society where barreness was a BIG STIGMA. (See how Jacob, Onan's grandpa, wife Rachel felt about having no kids...and later on Hannah. And even Sarah, Onan's great-great grandmother).

2. Essentially telling his father that he wanted both his and Er's inheritance...ie greed. If he had done what he was supposed to do, then when Judah died, his (Onan's) firstborn son would have gotten Er's portion of the inheritance. By having no kids, he gets a dobule portion.

3. Essentially commiting an injustice to his late brother and dishonoring his memory.

Thus..as the bible put it in Genesis 38 vs 8-10

8 Then Judah said to Onan, “Sleep with your brother’s wife and fulfill your duty to her as a brother-in-law to raise up offspring for your brother.” 9 But Onan knew that the child would not be his; so whenever he slept with his brother’s wife, he spilled his semen on the ground to keep from providing offspring for his brother. 10 What he did was wicked in the Lord’s sight; so the Lord put him to death also

So, nothing to do with seed or with masturbation as the OP thinks it does.

At its base it is a story about how harmful greed and resentment can be. And how wickedness also can provoke resentment (Er is described as a wicked man, so it is obvious that he was wicked to his two younger brothers, breeding anger and resentment).