₦airaland Forum

tctrills:
You must be more intelligent than Christ to be able to explain for him.
Anyway I choose to believe Christ and not you.
He is smarter than you, he expressed himself better than you ever can. He said he is I Am so I agree with him. I am sorry but I hope you understand?

tctrills:
I don't understand you point here please explain clearly. What are you even trying to say. We can't respond to you if you can make clear points.
Or can you get MaxInDHouse to explain for you? Not saying he is smarter than you.

tctrills:
I always knew you were incapable of making sense. What does any of this have to do with the I Am debate? Please link your thoughts.

The question here is, did Jesus Christ say he is I Am or not? Again, what does John 8:28 have to do with this discussion? Please learn to focus.

tctrills:
I Am, (Jesus Christ) has a Father. I don't get your point here. He never said He was fatherless. Please what is your point here?

Father meaning Senior.
Oga,Is the God you call "I Am" @ Exodus 3:14 Fatherless?

Hebrew 6:13 & Acts 3:13 proven that Unbelievers too dey deceive themselves on this forum.

Janosky:
If you understand Jesus @John 8:19,28, you won't rush to John 8:58 and make false claims about Exodus 3:14.

Jesus said " You do not know my Father", John 8:19,24.
Oga, Jesus proves that John 8:58 no concern Exodus 3:14.
The God of Exodus 3:14 has no Father (no Senior).
Hebrew 6:13 confirmed.

Janosky:
Tctrills post:
"JW's claim others have wrong translations".

The evidence backing JW's claim.
*1
Acts 10:25. ...
"And as Peter was entering, Cornelius, having met him, having fallen at the feet, worshiped him."

Peter was NEVER worshipped.

*2.
1 John 5:7 KJV.
"The Father, the son and the holy ghost: these three are..."
16th century Fake translation of holy scriptures.

*
1 Timothy 3:16
"God" was made manifest in the flesh " Fake translation.

Correct rendition.
"He wh was manifest in the flesh "

Janosky:
@John 8:28 Jesus Christ said the intelligent comprehensible words you rejected on this forum.
@John 8:28, Jesus takes Orders from the Supreme Being God his Father.

The Supreme being you reference as " I Am" @ Exodus 3:14 has no Father (meaning Senior).
Hebrew 6:13 = Exodus 3:14.

Olaniyi in Yoruba doesn't mean Olaniyi in Igbo, just as John 8:58 doesn't have any link to Exodus 3;14.
Oga,you just dey deceive yourself.

tctrills:
The only question I have for you is where is it written that I Am has no Father? Did you make that up or is there a bible verse that says so. Because Jesus Christ (I Am ) has a Father.

Janosky:
Jesus Christ the representative of God's kingdom was in the midst of those pharisees he preached to. @ Luke 17:20-21.


know it today with all clarity, that God's kingdom is a physical reality, Daniel 2:44 & Matthew 6:9-10 confirmed that.

Janosky:
Jesus Christ the representative of God's kingdom was in the midst of those pharisees he preached to. @ Luke 17:20-21.

know it today with all clarity, that God's kingdom is a physical reality, Daniel 2:44 & Matthew 6:9-10 confirmed that.

MaxInDHouse:
Excellent!

That's what Moses and Jesus said about their God:

“Listen, O Israel: Jehovah our God is one Jehovah" Deuteronomy 6:4; Mark 12:29

Jesus said about his God:

"God is a (one) Spirit" John 4:24

In English language one person is equally a person!

What was Moses before God made him a God? Exodus 7:1

Janosky:
[b]In koine Greek, ho Theo's ( the God) references the Almighty Supreme Being without any Father.

Jesus has a Father, therefore Jesus is NOT Almighty or Supreme.

A god references Angels, man and Jesus.
John 10:34-36 , Jesus identified himself as a god because himself is son of God whom His Father calls god @ Psalms 82:1,6 (Jesus quoted at John 10:34-36).

In a nutshell,Koine Greek differentiates God Almighty Yahweh from a god his son (or sons called gods.)

Emusan:
So what is The Word was before becoming God before the Creation?

MaxInDHouse:
Good!

Moses was a man before Jehovah made him a God {Exodus 7:1} likewise the Word was an angel (spirit son of God) before God made him a God.

Remember in the Bible book of Job it is written that the morning stars are God's children {Job 38:7} in the same manner the spirit son of God who became the Word is also one of the morning stars but the Bright one among them! Revelations 1:5

So the Word was an angel or God's spirit son before creation!

Emusan:
@color-red is the key point here.
Before Creation no entity exists EXCEPT GOD, all Angels are CREATED BEINGS which means no single one can be BEFORE creation.
So, John 1:1 shows "The Word WAS with God and WAS GOD" before Creation is perfectly grammatical accurate because anything IN THE BEGINNING (i.e at Creation) no longer valid.
Let's recap:
1. You already agreed that there's no different between A GOD and GOD.
2. You already agreed that The Word predate CREATION (i.e BEFORE CREATION) and as stated in the scripture.
3. Now placing The Word as Angel (created being) negate the two stance above.
The implication is:
You unanimously used the phrase "BEFORE CREATION" which means you are claiming the Word is UNCREATED. Do you realize that?

MaxInDHouse:
The first angel (archangel) existed before other things and he was with God during the creation of other things {Proverbs 8:22-31; John 1:2; Colossians 1:15-16} so just as God used Adam to start populating planet earth He did the same thing with the archangel (first angel) that is why both of them were called God's Son! Luke 3:38; John 3:16; 1Corinthans 15:45

FreeIgboho:
I HONESTLY don't understand for the life of me how anyone who reads Jesus' words can say he was Angel Michael!!!.
HE HIMSELF said who he was! He said JohnTB was Elijah. He could easily have added that he himself was Angel Michael!!! At his baptism the Father could have said "Here's Angel Michael, my beloved son" He didn'tl!! No mention of Angel Michael in anything concerning Jesus!!!!!!

Here's Mathew 16:
13 Now when Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?” 14 And they said, “Some say John the Baptist; and others, [a]Elijah; and still others, [b]Jeremiah, or one of the other prophets.” 15 He *said to them, “But who do you yourselves say that I am?” 16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the [c]Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon [d]Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18 And I also say to you that you are [e]Peter, and upon this [f]rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you [g]bind on earth [h]shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you [i]loose on earth [j]shall have been loosed in heaven.” 20 Then He gave the disciples strict orders that they were to tell no one that He was the [k]Christ.

MaxInDHouse:
The first angel (archangel) existed before other things

and he was with God during the creation of other things {Proverbs 8:22-31; John 1:2; Colossians 1:15-16}

so just as God used Adam to start populating planet earth He did the same thing with the archangel (first angel) that is why both of them were called God's Son! Luke 3:38; John 3:16; 1Corinthans 15:45

MaxInDHouse:
That's his true identity as an heavenly being before his earthly life so whether you agree or not millions of people have been taught this truth and they are one big and happy family of peace loving worshipers just as the scriptures foretold about Michael's earthly mission so it's you who doesn't know the identity of your own God we know our God is not Jesus because Jesus was one of the many angels worshiping our God as His spirit sons!

Emusan:
Which means He exists BEFORE CREATION STARTED.

FreeIgboho:
Ok o. Jehovah's Witnesses know Jesus better than he knows himself. By the way, I notice they never mention Jesus, only "Jehovah God", meanwhile they won't adopt the attributes of "Jehovah God" like war-likeness. That's why despite everything your organization is devoid of spiritual empowerment, only dry human morality.

Angel Michael had come to earth in various forms and roles. No prophet, angel, person, or he himself ever came close to saying he'd be returning as Christ or in any way connected him with Christ. Well, things DON'T happen like that in the Bible. Huge things like that are touted and retouted - example, the coming of God (Jesus), which was clearly stated, yet you don't believe it, but believe what is neither said nor implied anywhere in the Bible!

MaxInDHouse:
Guy, just go straight to the point!

Is Jesus a son of God?
Are angels sons of God?
Is Jesus a morning star?
Are angels morning stars?
Does Jesus depend on God for survival?
Do angels depend on God for survival?

The simple answer to all these questions is "YES" so how do you think he is not one of the angels in heaven before his earthly life?

Unless you can prove that there are other beings in heaven who are not angels and at the same time equal to God!

FreeIgboho:
Where do you see that all angels are morning stars.

MaxInDHouse:
while the morning stars sang together and all the angels shouted for joy? ‭Job 38:7 NIV‬

When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy? Job 38:7 KJV

When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause? Job 38:7 NWT
I hate talking too much!

FreeIgboho:
Morning star refers to group of angels.

MaxInDHouse:
And Jesus is one of them. Period!

FreeIgboho:
This sounds so ignorant! Jesus is the light to God,
He is the light that symbolizes God. Morning star in this case carries a symbolic meaning. It does NOT mean angel. Read it below again

MaxInDHouse:
I thought you're going to quote the Bible to prove that Jesus is not a morning star.

Please keep those references to yourself if you want me to take you seriously quote the Bible!

FreeIgboho:
Why don't you quote where the Bible says Jesus is Angel Michael

Janosky:
Hebrew 6:13
When God made His promise to Abraham, since He had no one greater to swear by, He swore by Himself."

*
Is the God @ Exodus 3:14, the same God @ Hebrew 6:13?
Yes, definitely. He is the God of Abraham @ Exodus 3:6,14 & Hebrew 6:13.

Therefore , the God @ Hebrew 6:13 & Exodus 3:6,14 " I Am" has no Father (no Senior) ANYWHERE !!!

Oga,@ John 20:17, John 8:19,28 ,38,58 & Hebrew 6:13, Exodus 3:6,14 In heaven, is Jesus the Father (Senior)?

Definitely Not !!!!
Exodus 3:6,14 = Acts 3:13.

OTILO .......

MaxInDHouse:
Why don't you quote where the Bible says Jesus is not angel Michael?

FreeIgboho:
Too many to quote them all. Let's just quote only New Testament:

John 1:1,: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

AND
John 14:9 “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?

AND
Mathew 16
16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

AND
John 20:28
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”

AND
John 8
58 “Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him... (for obviously claiming to be God)

AND
John 10:33,: "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God,"

AND
Mark 14,: Again the high priest asked him, “Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed One?”
62 “I am,” said Jesus...
63 The high priest tore his clothes. “Why do we need any more witnesses?”
(Here again Jesus uses the divine "I am"}

Now, mention anywhere in the Bible where ANYONE implied that Jesus was Angel Michael.

So my good man, if you honestly study the Bible with an open heart, you'd not only know who Jesus is NOT, you'd know who he IS!