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A saddening fact about Christians is a blatant refusal to search the origin of their religion. It is as if Christians have a morbid fear that researching the origins of stories they have held dear to heart will shake the foundations of all their beliefs.

On this thread we are going to attempt to research the origins of Christianity. If you are offended and not interested in knowledge you are free to stop reading at this point. If you are not offended and wish to gain a little knowledge then you are free to follow me down the rabbit hole.

Whatever is written in this thread can be freely cross checked and researched independently.

First of all,none of the names on the four gospels in the Bible are the names of the writers of those books!
Mathew,Mark,Luke and John are not the names of the writers of those books. These names are pseudonyms of the unknown writers of those books.
None of these nameless writers were witnesses to the gospel stories they wrote about nor were they followers of Jesus.
Jesus himself did not write a single word in any shape or form about his work.
The writers of these gospels simply relied on oral traditions, myths, and the letters of Paul formerly known as Saul to create the content in their stories.

Be informed that the way the books of the New Testament appear in the Bible is not in any chronological order. In fact it is better in my opinion to read Paul's letters first and to understand his concept of Jesus before proceeding to read the gospels of Mathew,Mark, Luke and John because the undisputed letters of Paul were written several years before the gospels.

Timeline summary of Paul's letters vi's a viz the gospels.

1. AD48- AD 62; The undisputed Pauline letters(Galatians,Romans,Corinthians)

2. AD50-AD67: The disputed Pauline letters(Ephesians, Timothy)

3. AD 65-AD70- Gospel of Mark.

4. AD70-AD85-Gospel of Mathew.

5. AD80-90-Gospel of Luke.

6. AD90-100-Gospel of John.

Timeline Summary above shows which books were written first.
Jesus Christ himself wrote no books of his ministry. Paul wrote letters to the early church members. It was based on Paul's writing that the gospels were written by later writers and embellished.
Readers are free to do research on these issues raised in this thread.


To be continued.

Paul formerly known as Saul at around AD33-AD36 had an epiphany on the road to Damascus.
Acts 9:35

At this point in his life Paul realised
1. Jesus is his Lord.
2.Jesus is alive
3. Persecution of believers is persecution of Jesus who is his Lord.

4. Jesus is the son of God risen in power. He is not just a messiah,he is also a son of God made more powerful by resurrection.

5. Jesus is a crucified saviour.
1st Corinthians 1:23-25.
Romans 3:24-26.
Galatians 2:20

6. Jesus is a cosmic creator.
1st Corinthians 8:6
1st Colossians 1:15-17


7. Jesus is the new Adam.
Romans 5:18-19.
1st Corinthians 15:45

8. Jesus is the mediator and intercessor.
2nd Corinthians 5:19


Paul's view of Jesus which were later copied and embellished by the nameless writers of the gospels were the following facts;
1. Jesus is the risen son of God.
2. Jesus is divine Lord.
3.Jesus is a crucified saviour.
4. Jesus is a cosmic creator.
5.Jesus is the new Adam.
6.Jesus is a heavenly intercessor.
7. Jesus lives within every believer.

Goosethetruth:
First of all,none of the names on the four gospels in the Bible are the names of the writers of those books!
Mathew,Mark,Luke and John are not the names of the writers of those books. These names are pseudonyms of the unknown writers of those books.
None of these nameless writers were witnesses to the gospel stories they wrote about nor were they followers of Jesus.
Jesus himself did not write a single word in any shape or form about his work.
The writers of these gospels simply relied on oral traditions, myths, and the letters of Paul formerly known as Saul to create the content in their stories.

They used several sources like the writings of Josephus and ancient tales about Marduk....

I don't think Paul was a real person too. The works attributed to Paul are all works of Apolinius of tyna. It was edited probably by John chysostom.

Goosethetruth:
Paul formerly known as Saul at around AD33-AD36 had an epiphany on the road to Damascus.
Acts 9:35

At this point in his life Paul realised
1. Jesus is his Lord.
2.Jesus is alive
3. Persecution of believers is persecution of Jesus who is his Lord.

4. Jesus is the son of God risen in power. He is not just a messiah,he is also a son of God made more powerful by resurrection.

5. Jesus is a crucified saviour.
1st Corinthians 1:23-25.
Romans 3:24-26.
Galatians 2:20

6. Jesus is a cosmic creator.
1st Corinthians 8:6
1st Colossians 1:15-17


7. Jesus is the new Adam.
Romans 5:18-19.
1st Corinthians 15:45

8. Jesus is the mediator and intercessor.
2nd Corinthians 5:19


Paul's view of Jesus which were later copied and embellished by the nameless writers of the gospels were the following facts;
1. Jesus is the risen son of God.
2. Jesus is divine Lord.
3.Jesus is a crucified saviour.
4. Jesus is a cosmic creator.
5.Jesus is the new Adam.
6.Jesus is a heavenly intercessor.
7. Jesus lives within every believer.

Paul's Jesus was never on earth. It is thosr who edited and redacted it

I have written here that Paul's letter were written several years before the gospels which were written by nameless persons. It was the early fathers, elders and leaders of the early church that in their infinite wisdom that choose to affix these names to these books. It was by this same wisdom they decided which of the uncountable gospel stories floating around at this period in time made the cut and were included in the Bible.



It is of importance to note that Paul's missives that preceeded these nameless gospels (and I say this because Paul's name is attached to his letters.). Paul NEVER mentions very important points which are reflected in the gospels.
Paul never mentions :

1. The virgin birth ( mentioned in Mathew 1-2/ Luke1-2)

2.Paul never mentions the baptism of Jesus by John the Baptist. (Mentioned in Mark.1,Luke3,and John1)

3.Paul never mentions Jesus being tempted by Satan in the wilderness(mentioned in Mathew 4:1-11,and Luke 4:1-13)

4. Paul does not mention the Sermon on the mountain and rarely mentions Jesus' parable and teachings.( mentioned in Mathew 5.

5.Paul never mentions the feeding of 5,000 people, nor Jesus walking on water,nor the raising of dead persons.

6. Paul never mentions any triumphant entry into Jerusalem on a donkey.( mentioned in Mathew 21,Mark 11,Luke 19,and John 19.)

7. Paul never mentions Jesus trial before Pilate.

8. Paul does not mention the empty tomb or the women at the tomb( mentioned in Mark 16:1-8. Mathew 28:1-10,Luke24:1-12,and John 20:1-18)

So where do all these stories included in the gospels and regarded as cornerstones of Christianity come from??

sonmvayina:
They used several sources like the writings of Josephus and ancient tales about Marduk....

I don't think Paul was a real person too. The works attributed to Paul are all works of Apolinius of tyna. It was edited probably by John chysostom.

Interesting. So where does all this leave Christianity because I have seen scholars claiming that Jesus himself never existed. You may like to express your views on this thread please.

Goosethetruth:
A saddening fact about Christians is a blatant refusal to search the origin of their religion. It is as if Christians have a morbid fear that researching the origins of stories they have held dear to heart will shake the foundations of all their beliefs.

On this thread we are going to attempt to research the origins of Christianity. If you are offended and not interested in knowledge you are free to stop reading at this point. If you are not offended and wish to gain a little knowledge then you are free to follow me down the rabbit hole.

Whatever is written in this thread can be freely cross checked and researched independently.

See ignorance in full display, The origin of Christianity is clear and unambiguous, it's origin is form Jesus himself and his apostles. First you guys claim he didn't exist, when you found out your lie couldn't hold you switch to attacking the historicity of the scripture.
Do a proper study of the historicity of Jesus and you will find out the Bible is more reliable than any historical books.

Goosethetruth:
First of all,none of the names on the four gospels in the Bible are the names of the writers of those books!
Mathew,Mark,Luke and John are not the names of the writers of those books. These names are pseudonyms of the unknown writers of those books.
None of these nameless writers were witnesses to the gospel stories they wrote about nor were they followers of Jesus.
Jesus himself did not write a single word in any shape or form about his work.
The writers of these gospels simply relied on oral traditions, myths, and the letters of Paul formerly known as Saul to create the content in their stories.

Who Wrote the Four Gospels?

The only firsthand testimony that we have about the life and teachings of Jesus comes from the four Gospels. Who were the people that wrote these books?

The authorship is credited to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. There are three basic reasons why we believe the men bearing their names wrote the four gospels.

1. There Is Unanimous Tradition As To The Authorship Of The Gospels

The four gospels are unanimously attributed to Matthew, Mark, Luke and John - there are no other candidates. With works as important as the gospels it is unlikely that the original authors would have been forgotten. To quickly command acceptance from the people it had to have an author that was known.

Three Of The Four Authors Are Unlikely

The authors of our four gospels would not have been the obvious choices to write the accounts of the life of Christ. Only one of these four men (John) was a prominent character in the New Testament. Why attribute a book to the others if they were not the authors? The unanimous attestation of these unlikely authors is another strong reason for accepting the traditional view that they penned their respective gospels.

The Documents Were Identified By Tags

The early preservation of the name of the author is another consideration. It was a common literary practice during the time of Christ to preserve the name of the author of a written work. Scrolls with written text on both sides had tags glued to them (called a sittybos in Greek) that insured the preservation of the author's name. They were attached in such a way that a person could see who authored the scroll without unrolling it. This is similar to the function of the spine on our modern books - one does not have to open the book to find out who wrote it.

With four different written gospels circulating, there needed to be a way to distinguish them from each other. The term "gospel" would not be enough, seeing that there was more than one circulating. Therefore the church had to preserve the name of each gospel writer at an early date. The tag on the outside of the scroll would accomplish that purpose. It would read in Greek, "Gospel of Matthew" or "Gospel of Mark."

There Are No Variations In The Titles

The fact that this happened is clear in that there are no variations in the titles of the gospels. Every source is unanimous that Matthew wrote Matthew, Mark wrote Mark, Luke penned his gospel, and John wrote his.

These three reasons - the unanimous testimony of the church, the unlikely authorship of these men, and the early identification of the document, all present a strong case for the traditional authorship of the gospels.

sonmvayina:
They used several sources like the writings of Josephus and ancient tales about Marduk....

I don't think Paul was a real person too. The works attributed to Paul are all works of Apolinius of tyna. It was edited probably by John chysostom.

Paul is not a real person? What a dunce! You can as well say Christopher Columbus is not a real person.

Goosethetruth:
I have written here that Paul's letter were written several years before the gospels which were written by nameless persons. It was the early fathers, elders and leaders of the early church that in their infinite wisdom that choose to affix these names to these books. It was by this same wisdom they decided which of the uncountable gospel stories floating around at this period in time made the cut and were included in the Bible.



It is of importance to note that Paul's missives that preceeded these nameless gospels (and I say this because Paul's name is attached to his letters.). Paul NEVER mentions very important points which are reflected in the gospels.
Paul never mentions :

1. The virgin birth ( mentioned in Mathew 1-2/ Luke1-2)

2.Paul never mentions the baptism of Jesus by John the Baptist. (Mentioned in Mark.1,Luke3,and John1)

3.Paul never mentions Jesus being tempted by Satan in the wilderness(mentioned in Mathew 4:1-11,and Luke 4:1-13)

4. Paul does not mention the Sermon on the mountain and rarely mentions Jesus' parable and teachings.( mentioned in Mathew 5.

5.Paul never mentions the feeding of 5,000 people, nor Jesus walking on water,nor the raising of dead persons.

6. Paul never mentions any triumphant entry into Jerusalem on a donkey.( mentioned in Mathew 21,Mark 11,Luke 19,and John 19.)

7. Paul never mentions Jesus trial before Pilate.

8. Paul does not mention the empty tomb or the women at the tomb( mentioned in Mark 16:1-8. Mathew 28:1-10,Luke24:1-12,and John 20:1-18)

So where do all these stories included in the gospels and regarded as cornerstones of Christianity come from??

why should Paul write what has already being written?
Paul letters agreed with the gospels that Jesus was a real person who died and rose again from the dead. There is an internal agreement with scriptures that separates it from falsehoods. The new testament is centered on Jesus sinless life, death and resurrection, that has always being the church tradition from inception.

Steep:
See ignorance in full display, The origin of Christianity is clear and unambiguous, it's origin is form Jesus himself and his apostles. First you guys claim he didn't exist, when you found out your lie couldn't hold you switch to attacking the historicity of the scripture.
Do a proper study of the historicity of Jesus and you will find out the Bible is more reliable than any historical books.

Guy, even the four gospels don't agree on the historical Jesus and the story of his ministry. The gospels are contradictions of themselves!The gospel writers copied themselves after embellishing Paul's letters and concept of Jesus plus oral traditions.
Educate yourself and do some research.
Best regards.

Goosethetruth:
I have written here that Paul's letter were written several years before the gospels which were written by nameless persons....

So as you have written here it is by force we must accept it as True even without query?

Your query is still standing here and for the past one week you cannot answer for the bible shows that Saul/Paul learnt from a disciple so, how can he come before the gospels that he himself even learnt?

Steep:
why should Paul write what has already being written?
Paul letters agreed with the gospels that Jesus was a real person who died and rose again from the dead. There is an internal agreement with scriptures that separates it from falsehoods. The new testament is centered on Jesus sinless life, death and resurrection, that has always being the church tradition from inception.

I showed you when Paul's letters were written vis when the gospels were written. Paul's wrote his missives in AD 48-AD67.
The first gospel which is Mark was written in AD65-AD70.
Guy,once again I admonish you to unlearn the dogma. Educate yourself. Do research on the origin of your religion.

Goosethetruth:
Guy, even the four gospels don't agree on the historical Jesus and the story of his ministry. The gospels are contradictions of themselves!The gospel writers copied themselves after embellishing Paul's letters and concept of Jesus plus oral traditions.
Educate yourself and do some research.
Best regards.

See how you are embarrassing yourself by changing post to talk about genealogy when the topic is about the gospel. You are just embarrassing yourself oo

Goosethetruth:
I showed you when Paul's letters were written vis when the gospels were written. .

Do you not see that it is grossly irrelevant? N one cares which dem say says it's so so time


From the documents themselves we can see who came first and who came next

Steep:
Paul is not a real person? What a dunce! You can as well say Christopher Columbus is not a real person.

Wow, you can say that word? If it's me who said it now, freeze is what I am going to get. Obviously, bot has been sent out against me

Goosethetruth:
I have written here that Paul's letter were written several years before the gospels which were written by nameless persons. It was the early fathers, elders and leaders of the early church that in their infinite wisdom that choose to affix these names to these books. It was by this same wisdom they decided which of the uncountable gospel stories floating around at this period in time made the cut and were included in the Bible.



It is of importance to note that Paul's missives that preceeded these nameless gospels (and I say this because Paul's name is attached to his letters.). Paul NEVER mentions very important points which are reflected in the gospels.
Paul never mentions :

1. The virgin birth ( mentioned in Mathew 1-2/ Luke1-2)

2.Paul never mentions the baptism of Jesus by John the Baptist. (Mentioned in Mark.1,Luke3,and John1)

3.Paul never mentions Jesus being tempted by Satan in the wilderness(mentioned in Mathew 4:1-11,and Luke 4:1-13)

4. Paul does not mention the Sermon on the mountain and rarely mentions Jesus' parable and teachings.( mentioned in Mathew 5.

5.Paul never mentions the feeding of 5,000 people, nor Jesus walking on water,nor the raising of dead persons.

6. Paul never mentions any triumphant entry into Jerusalem on a donkey.( mentioned in Mathew 21,Mark 11,Luke 19,and John 19.)

7. Paul never mentions Jesus trial before Pilate.

8. Paul does not mention the empty tomb or the women at the tomb( mentioned in Mark 16:1-8. Mathew 28:1-10,Luke24:1-12,and John 20:1-18)

So where do all these stories included in the gospels and regarded as cornerstones of Christianity come from??

I once asked questions on why Paul never once mentions the virgin birth and Jesus parentage but recieved no answers. Rather I was insulted by people on this forum for the question. I did not even know Paul's letters preceeded the gospels of John,Mathew,John and Luke.
Hmmnm.



https://www.nairaland.com/5955499/paul-loud-silence-virgin-birth

TheMadame:
I once asked questions on why Paul never once mentions the virgin birth and Jesus parentage but recieved no answers. Rather I was insulted by people on this forum for the question. I did not even know Paul's letters preceeded the gospels of John,Mathew,John and Luke.
Hmmnm.



https://www.nairaland.com/5955499/paul-loud-silence-virgin-birth

Briefly read your thread and found it hilarious .😃
The insults passed on you were just Christians burying their heads in the sand as usual. When Christians see questions for which they lack answers they usually become afraid and cover their ignorance with throwing insults. Pay them no mind.😂

Ask Jehovah's Witnesses any question in your mind they are sent to you by the Author Himself!

MaxInDHouse:
Ask Jehovah's Witnesses any question in your mind they are sent to you by the Author Himself!

Were the gospels written in Hebrew Aramaic or in Greek?
That is the question for your author.

Goosethetruth:
Were the gospels written in Hebrew Aramaic or in Greek?
That is the question for your author.

They were written in Greek according to the information we received!

MaxInDHouse:
They were written in Greek according to the information we received!

Good. What was the language spoken by Jesus in the 30 years of his life and did he leave any written word in his language?

Goosethetruth:
Good. What was the language spoken by Jesus in the 30 years of his life and did he leave any written word in his language?

Jesus spoke both Hebrew and Aramaic fluently he told his disciples that God's Holy Spirit will bring back to their memories everything he taught them so there's no need for him to pen down anything since it's his thoughts, word and actions they need to help in teaching others!

TheMadame:
I once asked questions on why Paul never once mentions the virgin birth and Jesus parentage but recieved no answers. Rather I was insulted by people on this forum for the question. I did not even know Paul's letters preceeded the gospels of John,Mathew,John and Luke.
Hmmnm.

https://www.nairaland.com/5955499/paul-loud-silence-virgin-birth

Must he?

Neither did Jude nor Peter!

And in the first page no one insalted you so you are Lying and blowing it out of size

MaxInDHouse:
Jesus spoke both Hebrew and Aramaic fluently he told his disciples that God's Holy Spirit will bring back to their memories everything he taught them so there's no need for him to pen down anything since it's his thoughts, word and actions they need to help in teaching others!

You need to answer the question. Did Jesus write down a single word about his ministry or Christianity in Aramaic?

Goosethetruth:
You need to answer the question. Did Jesus write down a single word about his ministry or Christianity in Aramaic?

YES!
According to God's word that Jews believe before Jesus' coming it was WRITTEN in the hearts of his followers:

“For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares Jehovah. “I will put my law within them, and in their heart I will write it. And I will become their God, and they will become my people.” Jeremiah 31:33

So he actually WROTE the laws he wants to establish in their hearts!

MaxInDHouse:
YES!
According to God's word that Jews believe before Jesus' coming it was WRITTEN in the hearts of his followers:

“For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares Jehovah. “I will put my law within them, and in their heart I will write it. And I will become their God, and they will become my people.” Jeremiah 31:33

So he actually WROTE the laws he wants to establish in their hearts!

This is getting exasperating. Can you refer anyone to empirical evidence of any physical written words by Jesus of his ministry while on Earth in Aramaic or Hebrew?
Stop sending me on a wild goose chase of word purportedly written by Jeremiah and scribing them into Jesus mouth!
If you want to play games with words I will simply ignore you like that Truth chap and proceed with my thread.

Goosethetruth:
This is getting exasperating. Can you refer anyone to empirical evidence of any physical written words by Jesus of his ministry while on Earth in Aramaic or Hebrew?
Stop sending me on a wild goose chase of word purportedly written by Jeremiah and scribing them into Jesus mouth!
If you want to play games with words I will simply ignore you like that Truth chap and proceed with my thread.

Stop wasting your time with these guys. They are not here to learn or provide any superior knowledge. Their target is to derail this thread and keep people inside the darkness of the cave. It is a known fact that Paul a pharisee was the founder of what we call Christianity today based on his spiritual encounter with Jesus on the road to Damascus and from Paul's writing it is clear he only has a cosmic vision of Jesus .
Please proceed with your thread.
Some of us are following.

Goosethetruth:
This is getting exasperating. Can you refer anyone to empirical evidence of any physical written words by Jesus of his ministry while on Earth in Aramaic or Hebrew? Stop sending me on a wild goose chase of word purportedly written by Jeremiah and scribing them into Jesus mouth! If you want to play games with words I will simply ignore you like that Truth chap and proceed with my thread.

You called for Christians that's why i tried to explain some things to you but if your mind is made up already it's OK just know that true Christians have very good reason to believe that everything written in the gospel is true and those are documents written by eyewitnesses who lived with Jesus of Nazareth.
Thanks for your time!