₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
Most readers of the Bible were misled by the erroneous interpretation of this verse.
What exactly did Jesus mean by this statement?
Was he saying we shouldn't speak up when someone deliberately goes against laid down principles?
What if we have all agreed to live by a set of rules and someone chooses to break such laws?

AntiChristian:
When Jesus was asked about the adulteress why didn't he judge by the established set of rules in the Torah?

MaxInDHouse:
Ọmọ muhammadu, the Torah says both the man and the woman should die but those hypocrites dragged only the lady.
So who committed adultery with her so that both could be punished?

AntiChristian:
Stop ascribing lies to me as I am not ọmọ muhammadu.
Allah says what means:
Muhammad (SAW) is not the father of any man among you, but he is the Messenger of Allah and the last (end) of the Prophets. And Allah is Ever All­Aware of everything. Al-Ahzab 33:40.

AntiChristian:
And why didn't Jesus accuse them of what you claim? Jesus refused to use the established law! He as the Judge of God on earth should have told them told them to bring the other party to the sin! And also expose them of their own crimes! But in the end, no law was used. Every sinner goes Scot free!

AntiChristian:
When Jesus was asked about the adulteress why didn't he judge by the established set of rules in the Torah?

Westerhoffe:
That was grace and mercy.

“For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”
— John 1:17 (KJV)

“But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.” — Matthew 9:13 (KJV)

AntiChristian:
Same Jesus said he did not come to abolish the law but to fulfil them Matthew 5:17. How do you fulfil a law without observing it? Your claim are that Jesus abolished the law of Moses but it is clear that when Jesus was asked which was the greatest commandment he mentioned Loving God.... and the neighbour as yourself. All these are part of the laws of Moses.

Was Jesus really meant to call the sinners?

The Purpose of Jesus' Parables
…He replied, “The mystery of the kingdom of God has been given to you (i.e. the disciples), but to those on the outside everything is expressed in parables, so that, ‘ they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven. Mark 4:11-12.

Try explain the words in red!

Westerhoffe:
When mercy and grace speak, the law and its condemnation are folded.

Jesus Christ openly declared He came to call sinners to repentance.
I believe that shouldn't be difficult for you to understand.

To the words in Red, that is why you and everyone alive needs to come to Jesus Christ so that you may understand His words.

Whenever we say you need the Holy Spirit to understand the words of Jesus Christ, this one oart of it.

Now, if you had been for Jesus Christ, you would have also been given the mystery of the kingdom of God.

"Those outside" are those who would not come to Jesus Christ for the salvation of their souls even though they listen to hear, but not to follow or accept.

AntiChristian:
You still failed to explain how Matthew 5:17 doesn't contradict your John 1:17!

Did Jesus lied he did not come to abolish the law since you claim he came to abolish it?

Even the Holy Spirit is helpless in this.

Premise 1:
The Purpose of Jesus' Parables
…He replied, “The mystery of the kingdom of God has been given to you (i.e. the disciples), but to those on the outside everything is expressed in parables, so that, ‘ they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven.[/b]Mark 4:11-12.

[b]Premise 2:
Everyone the Father gives me will come to me. John 6:37.

Premise 1 simply says Jesus spoke in parables so that some will be ever seeing but not perceiving and ever hearing but not understanding so that they won't repent!

Premise 2 says Jesus's father has already given him some flocks that he will save! So whoever is not among the father's flock given to him is not among!

Your "Holy Spirit" explained it wrongly!

Westerhoffe:
That is why the Lord Jesus Christ said, to people like you, it is not given to understand the mystery of the kingdom of God, because you would not come to Him that you might be saved.

First, what do you understand by the word 'grace' and 'mercy'?
Grace:
(uncountable,theology) Free and undeserved favour, especially of God; unmerited divine assistance given to humans for their regeneration or sanctification, or for resisting sin.

Mercy:
(uncountable) Relenting; forbearance to cause or allow harm to another.
Synonyms: ruth, kindness, leniency

Now, when Jesus Christ said He will have mercy and show grace, how will mercy and grace be manifested if not by pardoning an offender?
Will you pardon a non-offender and call it mercy or grace when they have done nothing wrong?

These are the differences between Jesus Christ and your prophet.

Secondly, you denied the Holy Spirit because He was never in you, and you failed to have Him in you because you have never believed in who should have given Him to you.

According to you, you want to insist that whoever is not an Israelite will not believe, hear nor understand, but mercy and grace still break through according to:
John 1 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
¹¹ He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
¹² But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
¹³ Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Who do you even liken God to?
When Jesus Christ said:
Acts 1 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
⁷ And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
⁸ But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

Now, you failed to understand the power in grace and mercy, that's why you hear but never understand. I heard and understood. You see but never perceived, I saw, and knew! You read and never figure! I read and figured it all!
Why, because I believed in who would open my eyes and understanding, but you refused to.

This is where the Holy Spirit comes in to break the curse of bondage.
That is the blessing in believing in the Lord Jesus Christ.
Or would you say you are among those who would hear and see but never understand or perceive?

Do you even know this:
Acts 2 (KJV)
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³⁸ Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
³⁹ For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
⁴⁰ And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
⁴¹ Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

Why did they, despite the prophecy, being so many, yet they understood, believed, and were converted?

Give your life to Jesus Christ, then you will understand the secret and mystery.

AntiChristian:
Repeating the same thing many times does not make it the truth!

I agree that's what you've been on and it'll be difficult to see reasons!

You just proved Jesus lied sha in Matthew 5:12! He came to abolish the law with Grace and mercy theory! But he said otherwise!
Thanks for your time!

Westerhoffe:
[b]And here you go repeating your wish, but unfortunately for you, reality doesn't go your way.
If you are knowledgeable enough, you should know the meaning of grace and mercy

Jesus Christ didn't come to abolish the law, just as He had said, but to fulfill it, in which He Himself kept the law by abstaining from sin.

And for Him to show mercy and grace to everyone, hereby giving everyone including you a chance for repentance is not abolishing the law, because trust me, you don't want to die in your sins without believing in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour.

If Jesus Christ was to deal with everyone according to the law and not show mercy and grace, what makes you think you should still be alive today?
My friend, that is grace and mercy He has extended towards you too.

So, here, your arguments are baseless and meaningless in totality.[/b]

AntiChristian:
I don't want to know. If God didn't create grace and mercy before Jesus then that's also discriminatory! Why rule Israel with iron hand and then when your son comes around you brandish grace and mercy? What ideology is that? Can't you see all the killings in the Old testament? But when Jesus came God stopped killing people! If that were to be done by any human we'll judge such to be unfair!

Come off all these rhetorics! He didn't come to abolish the law but he refused to apply the law on people? He was without sin. Didn't the Bible say honor your mother and your father. How many people in the Bible called their mother "O woman" like Jesus did? And Jesus already said by himself he can do nothing! He can't even save himself not to talk of anyone!

He can't deal with himself. The authority he got was granted by someone up above! And I will be alive because I'm not among Jesus's flock. His flock were Israelites of his days! I think it is your argument that is baseless and meaningless!

Westerhoffe:
AntiChristian, I'm still waiting for your reply.

AntiChristian:
Holy spirit ought to have informed you that I don't have your time again!