₦airaland Forum

It's high time. That Starit of Hormuz crap and dangote excuses really dey frustrate Nigerians.

Importing is bad for currency appreciation, bad for the value of the naira, this affects purchasing power of Nigerians. Since we have crude, build your refineries and compete.

How did a Refinery estimated to finish at $9billion dollars in 2009 or thereabout actually finished at $20 billion? Many people are not asking relevant questions. I know many will respond with time and inflation. How many times did Dangote shifted the goal posts? How did he source the $ to fund the refinery project? Now Dangote dey buga after making so much $ to his personal pockets at the expense of the Refinery. Many Nigeria business men and women are dressed in fake atires, don't let me call them names that they don't like.
So Dangote should go and sit down and allow competition.

If I supported Dangote to disrupt the import cabals in order to favor the citizens, I must also support price war in favor of us Nigerians. The goal is the people

First there is no monopoly in the downstream sector, because dangote is not the only one that has refinery in Nigeria. NNPC should revitalize their own refinery and stop the issue of importation.

NNPC staff are interested in importation not because they care about the supply of fuel from multiple channels because because importation gives them access to free dollars which they in turn sale to BUREAU D CHANGE. Most of the NNPC staff have a bureau d change outlets scattered through out Nigeria. They Don't care about the supply they only care about the dollar involved.

Since Dangote started supplying fuel, they have been some stability in forex, because they is more forex made available to other sector that needs forex to survive. Let's us stand with DANGOTE on this .

nairalanda1:


1. Saudi uses about 60 billion dollars, which is way above our budget of 40 billion dollars for this year, to keep fuel cheap. Unless you want us to take our entire budget, borrow 20-30 billion on top, and use it to fund subsidy for fuel so that we can all have cheap fuel, while salaries go unpaid and projects go unfunded, and everything grinds to a halt, but hey, you got cheap fuel that you cannot pay for now...lol......you better not bring Saudi here.

If Nigeria wanted to be like Saudi, we would have to earn something like 7-10 times what we earn from oil to be able to fund such subsides on fuel. SInce such money does not come overnight, it is either you want us to borrow the money...which would create the largest ever debt in the history of mankind, or you just accept we cannot fund oil subsides for now


2. Russia? Russia pays 22 billion dollars per annum to keep subsides on fuel. And it is not like that money is easy to come by.

And their fuel price per liter are between...466-1000 naira. Yes, it is low, but it costs a lot of money...which Russia can afford because it runs a diversifed economy...that produces industrial goods for export. Does Nigeria do that?

Nigeria relies on 1.8 million bpd revenue for crude oil. Our budget this year was about 54 trillion naira, to subsidise fuel to N200 per liter would require 22-24 trillion naira. Like I said, since we have no budget for subsidy...having a budget now, would mean taking money from other sectors of the budget, including money we borrowed...to fund the subsidy budget.

You know that means we go borrow more, worsening our debt, sha?

We are not RUssia or Saudi..we are Nigeria, a nation that since independence has not diversifed our economy and has a very poor tax uptake. And sadly tinubu dey continue am up till now

So, please forget subsidy, unless you want your debt to be around 500 trillion naira or more in two years time.

There is no country that does not run a subsidy scheme in one or more things. All those things you said are just excuses. Before Gaddafi died the citizens were been taken care of and much welfare go round. Tell me after removing subsidy what have we achieve with that? Our problem was never subsidy but stopping the corruption in the scheme.
The government lack creative ideas, knows nothing. It's just about looting and stealing they know. What problem has APC government solved for over 10 years now and this administration has solved zero problem but help to expand it dimensionally.

YouandiAllofus:
NNPC at it again... No be dangote say make una mismanage una refineries.

Good Point!

The NNPC should pick up the challenge of revitalizing it's refineries and sell refined products at a cheaper price. This is the best way to bring down the cost of refined products alongside selling crude products to refineries at a reasonably fair price too.

Fantastic reasoning here!

ogascomax:
There is no country that does not run a subsidy scheme in one or more things. All those things you said are just excuses. Before Gaddafi died the citizens were been taken care of and much welfare go round. Tell me after removing subsidy what have we achieve with that? Our problem was never subsidy but stopping the corruption in the scheme.
The government lack creative ideas, knows nothing. It's just about looting and stealing they know. What problem has APC government solved for over 10 years now and this administration has solved zero problem but help to expand it dimensionally.

I am not speaking against subsidy, I am showing you with facts why Nigeria cannot afford subsidy witout getting into severe debt

As for Libya, under ghadaffy, they were doing 5 million bpd for six million people. That's why

fashrola:
The solution to number 1 is simple and direct... Reduce the cost of governance.... Cut down the salary of the Senators and house rep or you merge them to one house...

Both state and FG Projects should be strictly monitored and money disbursed only from the CBN and must be transparent and all inflows and outflows must be updated in real time and open to scrutiny.

Consequences for stealing public funds must be severe to deter anyone from thinking about it.

Public funds stolen in this country can fund our budget for the next 5 years without borrowing.

We know the solution but keep turning a blind eye

Reducing the cost of government won't do nothing

Total cost of government no reach ten trillion naira . E no reach 5 trillion self.

Meanwhile we need 23 trillion naira or more per annum to subsidise fuel

HenryWilliams:
oga shut up

Hurt too much, batch?

fashrola:
Abeg with their hefty taxes they still have access to basic amenities, would that be said to an oil rich country like Nigeria?

We are still struggling to build good roads, Healthcare centers in the rural areas in comatose state, what about education? Nothing to write home about.

We still provide our own water, Security and even electricity... What is my tax then used for? Politicians embezzling public funds without repercussions and consequences.

Nigeria would have passed this level we are in today.... Even Pensioners are crying over their funds... Bros no be life we dey live in this country.

I've had opportunities to travel to different countries as a seafarer, water dey commot for my eyes when I see countries improving and developing faster than us.

If we had good public transport system and steady power supply, this fuel pricing wouldn't have been a big issue to us.

Abeggi, if you think that 40 billion dollars can do the same thing 600 billion dollars does for developed countries , you really need to change your thinking

The problem is your government needs to change the way it runs the economy. That is my message to you

babaztee:
How did a Refinery estimated to finish at $9billion dollars in 2009 or thereabout actually finished at $20 billion? Many people are not asking relevant questions. I know many will respond with time and inflation. How many times did Dangote shifted the goal posts? How did he source the $ to fund the refinery project? Now Dangote dey buga after making so much $ to his personal pockets at the expense of the Refinery. Many Nigeria business men and women are dressed in fake atires, don't let me call them names that they don't like.
So Dangote should go and sit down and allow competition.

Dangote sourced for most of that money with loans from banks. Government gave him only 3 billion out of that 20 billion

And yes, inflation is the reason. Long term construction projects always run over cost. Also the global economy was bad especially during COVID so that worsened inflation.


Infact nine out of ten construction projects run over cost. Globally.

No need to suspicious at all.

This Dangote monopoly is too much and it's getting out of hand all because he is a Fulani man

Skullminers1:
This Dangote monopoly is too much and it's getting out of hand all because he is a Fulani man

No, because Nigerians refused to support subsidy removal since 1993.

In 2011 there were even people waiting to build refienries. The fact that subsidy was not removed as planned ended those refineries. Because no bank is going to loan money to refinery project

Dangote got away with it because his other lucrative businesses are his collateral for loans.

And there is a refinery in Edo state that last I checked is owned by a Southerner

nairalanda1:
No, because Nigerians refused to support subsidy removal since 1993.

In 2011 there were even people waiting to build refienries. The fact that subsidy was not removed as planned ended those refineries. Because no bank is going to loan money to refinery project

Dangote got away with it because his other lucrative businesses are his collateral for loans.

And there is a refinery in Edo state that last I checked is owned by a Southerner

on top of that, if an individual braves what everyone is afraid of braving (and when I say everyone, I also mean the likes of of Shell, Shevron and Mobil, all of which are bigger than Dangote), should he not also enjoy the benefit of being a pioneer pending when other, who have clearly taken from his own lead, come up?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXEaaZN03uM


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kttlZqu0AsQ

Skullminers1:
This Dangote monopoly is too much and it's getting out of hand all because he is a Fulani man

since the brands below are well-known to you, it means Dangote IS NOT A MONOPOLY.

nairalanda1:
Reducing the cost of government won't do nothing

Total cost of government no reach ten trillion naira . E no reach 5 trillion self.

Meanwhile we need 23 trillion naira or more per annum to subsidise fuel

What people especially those who are always on Dangote's neck do not realize is how poor we are as a country.

even if we use every kobo of the FG's budget and there is zero corruption, we still won't be able to achieve much.

ogascomax:
There is no country that does not run a subsidy scheme in one or more things. All those things you said are just excuses. Before Gaddafi died the citizens were been taken care of and much welfare go round. Tell me after removing subsidy what have we achieve with that? Our problem was never subsidy but stopping the corruption in the scheme.
The government lack creative ideas, knows nothing. It's just about looting and stealing they know. What problem has APC government solved for over 10 years now and this administration has solved zero problem but help to expand it dimensionally.

We already do.

Which one? Education!

Education is not cheap anywhere in the world including in Nigeria. If we pay the meagre amount we pay at the universities and in some cases, pay nothing at the primary and secondary levels, then it is because the government HEAVILY subsidizes it.

What we say we are not paying again, is the subsidy on petrol and such products; it is too expensive and we cannot afford it anymore.

nairalanda1:
Well, most nigerians opposed subsidy removal, which essentially made it difficult for dangote to have healthy competition

Last chance was in 2012. Had subsidy gone totally then, there would have been more people ready to build refineries, and more investors ready to put money in them..meaning we could have had refineries by the dozen by now. But everyone said no then.

Now subsidy has gone since 2023, and unfortunately it takes some years to get a decent refinery up and running. NNPC refinereis that could have picked up the slack were sent into terminal decline by government choolsing subsidy over refinery maintenance in 1993/4.

Although I don't agree with your posts atimes, especially when it comes to more taxes, I want to say kudos with the way you analyse issues

Been following your reply to others on this matter and I completely agree with you

My question is, will it actually be possible for other refineries to spring up, enough to reduce the price of fuel, seeing that subsidy has been removed?

Looking at the cost of a big refinery like Dangote's, will setting up many modular refineries help to improve the situation? (Emphasis on MANY... America has over 120 refineries)

ogascomax:
Dangote is a criminal and he won't hold us hostage with fuel like in cements.
Is agenda of wants to be the only one controlling the fuel industry shall fail.

A criminal someone who vote in government that removes subsidy, devalue the naira, increases taxes and expect the price of petrol to be cheap.

Razzness:
This is a good development. Fuel importation should not have been banned in the first place; it doesn't make any sense for Dangote to be the sole distributor and determinant of oil prices in the country. A healthy competition is necessary to create checks and balances that will ultimately benefit the final consumer.

Government of other countries are subsidizing energy products, reducing taxes while yours is doing the opposite and the only you could do is to quote imaginary competition theory while suffering and smiling.

Yampotatocarrot:
Although I don't agree with your posts atimes, especially when it comes to more taxes, I want to say kudos with the way you analyse issues

Been following your reply to others on this matter and I completely agree with you

My question is, will it actually be possible for other refineries to spring up, enough to reduce the price of fuel, seeing that subsidy has been removed?

Looking at the cost of a big refinery like Dangote's, will setting up many modular refineries help to improve the situation? (Emphasis on MANY... America has over 120 refineries)

There are other refineries either in the pipeline or under construction. The problem is refineries take time to build.

Why cant they compete by also starting local production? Must we keep importing?

Dreal1247:
If importers are hindered from importing petroleum into this country, Dangote will make people to buy the products at #2,000.00 per liter. Even if they are eventually allowed to import the products, he will frustrate them with price. Let more people build refineries in Nigeria for a healthy competition.

Samsungx2:
First there is no monopoly in the downstream sector, because dangote is not the only one that has refinery in Nigeria. NNPC should revitalize their own refinery and stop the issue of importation.

Just as there is no monopoly in any of the other businesses he is into.

Also, the same NNPC that has 4 refineries is the one accusing people of monopoly? If you do not want a monopoly, assuming it exists, then fix your refineries as especially when the government basically gave you what amounts to a blank cheque all these years.

With this behaviour of theirs, no wonder Dangote does not want them to increase their stake in the refinery. If he allows them, as soon as somebody who doesn't like Dangote comes into position, they will definitely wreck the company from within.
NNPC's behaviour in relation to the Dangote refinery has shown that they do not care about their stake in the company.

They Don't care about the supply they only care about the dollar involved.

If continuous supply and fair price is their concern, they would allow the refinery run and when if Dangote begins to sell at unfair prices, then they can threaten with repealing the law that prohibits import, and then license marketers to import fuel.

Ikemba007:
Why cant they compete by also starting local production? Must we keep importing?

ask them oo

better still, we can dash the marketers our refineries, let them turn it around and compete locally.

keemsleek:
If NNPc don't tackle dangote now by the time other refineries come up and nnpc comes or they have sold the refineries it will be hard to compete with dangote and he will be the sole dictator of Price like otedole did with AGO then.

Wh8ch means everyone will be waiting for dangote to fix price before they will like he's doing in cement

Vote in bad government using tribe and religion and blame Dangote for showing you your reality

Fiscus105:
He has succeeded in suffocated us in cement, he wants to extend same to Petrol

You set up your refinery and only you taking the profit and want to drain the citizens for your profit.

Vote in bad government and blame Dangote later.

Why must importation be the only competition? Can't NNPC or others try to compete by producing locally?

neutralmind:
I'm not in support of NNPC or the government.

However , it's important to note that Dangote is a private enterprise and in a free market.

He should buckle his sleeves and compete like any other business.

Lets bear in mind that monopoly is not healthy too

It appears Dangote is not willing to compete like any other business in Nigeria

ogascomax:
Let me remind you that Russian fuel and Saudi Arabia is less than a dollar.

Let me also remind you that Saudi Arabia and Russian government subsidizes petrol with lower taxes while your own government removes petrol subsidy and increases taxes

TechCapon:
Nnpc is right. Anything to reduce fuel price is welcome

Anything to reduce petrol when Dangote petrol is the 11th cheapest in the world while NNPCL imports the top 10th expensive petrol from Europe and receives subsidy through the backbone. How long will you keep deceiving yourself?

Didi2d:
So, because dangote built a refinery that no one can build according to you. That means we should allow him to control the downstream sector.
How una dey reason sef, this your reasoning shock me o

Last time I checked, Tinubu removed subsidy petrol exposing it to international pricing. Dangote or NNPCL, importation or local production, petrol price is tied to global pricing with Middle East not ending anything soon and the Nigerian not bring back subsidy also.
We all know that after the 2027 election, minimum wage will be increased leading to more excessive naira in circulation causing more inflation. The better you realize that the cheapest petrol is will ever buy as a Nigerian is ₦1,400 per litre, the better for you.

commoditiesnig:
Very welcome news.. as much as I admire and respect Dangote for the tremendous job he’s done with his Refinery, he should understand it’s a free market- other players can import and sell their products as well.. I don’t support monopoly at all..

I’m with the NNPC on this!

Are you aware PIA only mandates those with functional refineries to only import petroleum if local production is not sufficient?
Are you also aware that free market means the price of petroleum products is determined by the crude price international market and if the Middle East crisis escalate further, petrol price increases further?