₦airaland Forum

What are you saying bro?

Nastrademus:
I have HND from the prestigious federal politechnic Nasarawa, and I'm fine been an HND holder, why can't they upgrade BSC to the HND status instead

While the almighty hunger awaits both Bsc and HND holders after school to humble them

CodeTemplar:
Safe to conclude then that BSc and HND cant be equated.

I wouldnt say that in the western world though. I switched courses, hence the need to take additional courses for me. In Nigeria, I studied Electrical/Electronics Engineering, in the US I decided to get a Bachelors in Information Technology and Masters in Cybersecurity.

The areas are different, most of my electives from Nigeria transferred, but the core courses still had to be taken. It would have been different if I wanted to continue with just BSc in Electrical/Electronics Engineering, but I didnt want to study same thing again. IT was boomin, so I switched to it.

LARRYOBRAIN:
You got it wrong, most universities are mushroom universities, it is the same o levels requirements for both institutions.
Lack of admissions into universities and financial constraints make some students go for diploma courses.
I attended Yabatech when it was a polytechnic, most universities don't have Yabatech standards..
Late President Yaradua signs non discrimination of HND and B. Sc. certificate in FG workplaces.

You are still getting it wrong and I do not find it funny when people like you display this level of ignorance mixed with deliberate mischief.

There is no discrimination between diploma and degree. They are not equivalent.

And if you attend mushroom schools that made you see university education through that prism, it is not a general malaise. It is avoidable if you attend top universities with competitive admission criteria.

Diplomas are diplomas.Degrees are degrees.

Jobs that require the specific orientation and training for diploma must go to diploma holders. Same applies to jobs that require university degree certificate holders.

You are wrong with your assertion regarding a candidate with HND/PGD/Master's degree will likely not be offered admission for his/her PhD programme, this is not true.

We should stopped deceiving ourselves, Polytechnic and University systems have different curriculum and depth of study.

As someone who started a Federal Polytechnic @ND1 and Later switched over to a Federal University to start 100L due to multiple admissions I got in 2006 within a state in North-Eastern Nigeria, I know that Polytechnic and its curriculum are a lot easier to grasp than a conventional Universities especially the Federal Universities. For instance, I was given Admission to study ND in an Engineering Course with a deficiency in Chemistry, however the Polytechnic used to consider Agricultural Science in line of Chemistry. But, due to my lack of Chemistry I was denied admission to study similar course in the University, so I have to switched over to a course that don't require Chemistry at O'Level). Meanwhile, some Federal Polytechnics are better than some State and private Universities.

Also, as an Academic staff with a Federal University in North-Eastern Nigeria, even though the quality of education is quite deteoriating nation wide, I have come across Jamb Direct Entry ND students that graduate with First-class or upper class and ends up performing poorly in the University either withdrawn or graduating with a Third-Class or Pass Grade Degrees in the University.

There will always be dichotomy in our lives, if you pass someone, then definitely someone too pass you. E.g it is assumed
NCE (Certificate) < Diploma < HND < B-Tech/BSc (Even in some Universities, they rated B-Tech graduate more than BSc graduate in terms of Academic Job) < Master's (M-Tech or BSc) < then ultimately, PhD the highest form of Academic Degree worldwide. In the University system, without a PhD degree you can not progress to be a Senior Lecturer, Associate Professor, then the Professor.

OlujobaSamuel:
The problem is from the introduction of HND, Nigeria is the only one running such system. 5yrs for HND is not making sense. Other countries with the diploma system leaves it at ND, which you get in 3yrs max, 2yrs lecture, 1yr intern.
After the HND, Nigeria introduced a system of progression which is PGD, however, even with your PGD and MSc, some schools won't employ you, neither will they admit you for PhD, meaning you have to go start afresh for a BSc just to have PhD, despite having a MSc already.
Because of capacity issues that govt is facing in respect to admission (all tertiary institutions COE, Polytechnics and Uni) can't admit more than 30 to 40% of jambites every year, they are not willing to shut down the HND system and leave on ND
Lagos has shut down its Polytechnics and COE, all upgraded to University, and the lecturers were given a window to upgrade their qualifications for those that needed additional qualification to teach in a Uni
That's the way to go, but our FG isn't interested in that for now

Those with inferiority complex needs to top up to feel amongst the university products, people like me are more thank ok with my HND in Civil engineering technology from nuna poly Zaria. I think what Nigeria needs is an interschool competition between universities and polytechnics every academic year to keep the students awake. But they'll be afraid what if the polytechnic students win all the time.

Mandesz:
But u people do argue polytechnic is equal or better than university education. Why do u top up in the first place?

FreeStuffsNG:
If you truly have both then you will not suggest it is discrimination.
Nowhere in the world is a diploma equated with degree certificate.

Diploma serves a completely different career path whereas degrees serve as foundation to all the way to PhD.

Those who desire to pursue diploma should do so after appropriate counselling so that they will not equate HND diploma with university degree.

It is so unreasonable in the first place when you want to convert a diploma degree holder with F in English language and 3 to 4 credits in O level to B.Sc with a minimum O level requirement of 5 credits. This is the main reason none of the top universities in Nigeria will be part of such dubious arrangement. It makes no sense!

If you want university degree, you must meet the O level requirement and vetted by JAMB and admission program to run on the established format for degree programs instead of a seperate program not supervised by NUC.

Will HND be in 400 level or 500 level ? Or 600 level? Where is their academic record from 300, 400?
It is a fraud and no organization should accept certificate issued under that fraudulent 'conversion'. It is a fraud and every university administrator that has taken advantage of the misinformed HND holders should be arrested and prosecuted.

So in your mind now Polytechnic admits students with F9 or students without OLevel while your University admits the best.

Jamb is losing direct entry money to this institutions. Na money matter

MemoriesAndMe:
I wouldnt say that in the western world though. I switched courses, hence the need to take additional courses for me. In Nigeria, I studied Electrical/Electronics Engineering, in the US I decided to get a Bachelors in Information Technology and Masters in Cybersecurity.

The areas are different, most of my electives from Nigeria transferred, but the core courses still had to be taken. It would have been different if I wanted to continue with just BSc in Electrical/Electronics Engineering, but I didnt want to study same thing again. IT was boomin, so I switched to it.

illogical that poly will run uni syllabus/coursework.

SMT042:
Shut up !
All over the world , HND to Bsc conversion is seamless without any noise, it's common in UK . Is Nigeria better than UK in education advancement?

Una go just dey unnecessarily aggressive. You can make your views known without insult. I'm not the cause of your problem oga

Maj196:
Why do they see HND graduates as olodo

because most of them are olodo. And can't think outside the box. I have been fortunate to work with some and I didn't like them. The worse ones are even the midwives and NCE

Nastrademus:
I have HND from the prestigious federal politechnic Nasarawa, and I'm fine been an HND holder, why can't they upgrade BSC to the HND status instead

Different roles, poly gives technicians, university gives officers/scientist as the case maybe 🤷🏿

nurudeen181:
Those with inferiority complex needs to top up to feel amongst the university products, people like me are more thank ok with my HND in Civil engineering technology from nuna poly Zaria. I think what Nigeria needs is an interschool competition between universities and polytechnics every academic year to keep the students awake. But they'll be afraid what if the polytechnic students win all the time.

It's not inferiority complex, sir.

Many that are converting are doing so because of career limitations they face with HND certificate. If they are giving the same privileges like university graduates, there will be no need for the conversations.

sprints1:
because most of them are olodo. And can't think outside the box. I have been fortunate to work with some and I didn't like them. The worse ones are even the midwives and NCE

If we check your result now it's 2:2.

suleimanshehu:
You are wrong with your assertion regarding a candidate with HND/PGD/Master's degree will likely not be offered admission for his/her PhD programme, this is not true.

We should stopped deceiving ourselves, Polytechnic and University systems have different curriculum and depth of study.

As someone who started a Federal Polytechnic @ND1 and Later switched over to a Federal University to start 100L due to multiple admissions I got in 2006 within a state in North-Eastern Nigeria, I know that Polytechnic and its curriculum are a lot easier to grasp than a conventional Universities especially the Federal Universities. For instance, I was given Admission to study ND in an Engineering Course with a deficiency in Chemistry, however the Polytechnic used to consider Agricultural Science in line of Chemistry. But, due to my lack of Chemistry I was denied admission to study similar course in the University, so I have to switched over to a course that don't require Chemistry at O'Level). Meanwhile, some Federal Polytechnics are better than some State and private Universities.

Also, as an Academic staff with a Federal University in North-Eastern Nigeria, even though the quality of education is quite deteoriating nation wide, I have come across Jamb Direct Entry ND students that graduate with First-class or upper class and ends up performing poorly in the University either withdrawn or graduating with a Third-Class or Pass Grade Degrees in the University.

There will always be dichotomy in our lives, if you pass someone, then definitely someone too pass you. E.g it is assumed
NCE (Certificate) < Diploma < HND < B-Tech/BSc (Even in some Universities, they rated B-Tech graduate more than BSc graduate in terms of Academic Job) < Master's (M-Tech or BSc) < then ultimately, PhD the highest form of Academic Degree worldwide. In the University system, without a PhD degree you can not progress to be a Senior Lecturer, Associate Professor, then the Professor.

You might want to make more enquiry on the HND PGD route to PhD, not all Universities accept it, as long as the first degree remains HND, they won't accept even with your MSc.
I'm actually not even about the facilities in different institutions or the strength of different schools.
Do more research on it, we are basically the only one offering HND, there is no other country in the world running a 5yrs course (2-1-2) to give out an Associate degree/diploma.
The so called foundation principle that people references is not designed for HND, it was just ND, it was an abuse of the system that created OND and HND.
On issue of performance of students from Poly with good grades, I went through both system, and that's a biased judgement, not in most cases, I had better grades, I have friends with better grades at uni level too. The best student in my faculty still came out as the best in his faculty for his BSc. Some students had good WAEC result, yet they performed poorly in tertiary institutions, some with good grades from tertiary perform poorly on the job.
People do ND then proceed to Uni for their Degree, but our policy makers started introducing HND without considering future effect.
Currently, Nigeria is virtually the only one with such system, and it's creating more evil than good.
All issues of admission requirements, teacher's qualifications and the likes can actually be fixed. The buildings and facilities are there already, just a policy shift and all these will come to an end

SageTravels:
So in your mind now Polytechnic admits students with F9 or students without OLevel while your University admits the best.

Smh.
If you have F9 in English and pass other subjects then go through prelim in polys, you will get into full ND programs.

My point is not to emphasize that bar is higher for degree admission but to state clearly that they are different programs.
Or should we one day wake up to hear university admission seekers accuse JAMB of discrimimation because it acccepts lower UTME scores for polys?

[quote author=aestake post=139576553][/quote]E be like u no get work ba

tosyne2much:
While the almighty hunger awaits both Bsc and HND holders after school to humble them

all because they are rivalling instead of partnering.

SageTravels:
If we check your result now it's 2:2.

you are right. Grades don't define who you are. Am so sorry I offended you lot but it's just the plain truth. HND have a terrible work culture. They seem okay with everything thrown at them.

LARRYOBRAIN:
I have both, HND (5yrs) in Yabatech now University, B.Sc Taraba State University (5yrs).
I hate discrimination

Who lied to you that yàba tech is now university

Delu lu

Plight21:
Exactly!!

Can't we just get it right in this country?

Why the Dichotomy?

I'm an University graduate but I don't see the reason for the Dichotomy.

You can't see bcox you haven't been in both system.

Only some of us that have been in the system would understand better

Nastrademus:
I have HND from the prestigious federal politechnic Nasarawa, and I'm fine been an HND holder, why can't they upgrade BSC to the HND status instead

I graduated with distinction in computer science from there too and I am fine also. I am a management staff in a reputable organisation with degree holders my far subordinates

sprints1:
you are right. Grades don't define who you are. Am so sorry I offended you lot but it's just the plain truth. HND have a terrible work culture. They seem okay with everything thrown at them.

Technicians are pragmatic

I'm a b.sc holder, kindly link me up.i need a job.

3Si69:
You're smart, and I don’t think you’ll regret your decision. With an HND certificate, there are several jobs you may not be eligible for, even in some government recruitments and certain professional roles. I gained admission into Federal Polytechnic Offa with a friend, and after our ND programme I applied for Direct Entry and encouraged him to do the same, but he didn’t think it was necessary. After graduation, the job search started. I attended several interviews before eventually getting a job, while he couldn’t even apply for many opportunities due to qualification limits. It’s been over 6 years since I started working, I'm an IT Manager now he is still struggling to secure a stable job, with opportunities becoming fewer for him over time, which is why I believe a university degree generally gives wider access compared to an HND. I’ve tried several times to recommend him for the IT support role in our organisation, but management insisted that the minimum requirement is a B.Sc holder, so he couldn’t be considered and the pay for the first 6 months is ₦317,000.

I think you should get some sense here, I am entitled to my opinion, stay with yours.
Find work to do.

FreeStuffsNG:
You are still getting it wrong and I do not find it funny when people like you display this level of ignorance mixed with deliberate mischief.

There is no discrimination between diploma and degree. They are not equivalent.

And if you attend mushroom schools that made you see university education through that prism, it is not a general malaise. It is avoidable if you attend top universities with competitive admission criteria.

Diplomas are diplomas.Degrees are degrees.

Jobs that require the specific orientation and training for diploma must go to diploma holders. Same applies to jobs that require university degree certificate holders.

Go and ask Min of Education and President Tinubu, so that you can rest.

DenreleDave:
Who lied to you that yàba tech is now university

Delu lu

HND in federal poly Oko...The system of education in Nigeria is very bad... School ruined my life... I happy say me and Nigeria no get business

Bluffly:
E be like u no get work ba

Learn parts of speech, bro. Even BSc won't help.

TimiofAbuja:
seriously, I dont see any reason for conversion. Bsc should be Bsc, HND should be HND.

You don't understand!!!

All Universities in the European Union member countries don't accept HND for direct admission into a Masters program.

This alone is enough reason for any HND graduate to go for a conversion to BSc.

Look at how Nigeria is messed up, do you really want our youth to hold on to qualifications that limits them to Nigeria alone

FreeStuffsNG:
If you truly have both then you will not suggest it is discrimination.
Nowhere in the world is a diploma equated with degree certificate.

Diploma serves a completely different career path whereas degrees serve as foundation to all the way to PhD.

Those who desire to pursue diploma should do so after appropriate counselling so that they will not equate HND diploma with university degree.

It is so unreasonable in the first place when you want to convert a diploma degree holder with F in English language and 3 to 4 credits in O level to B.Sc with a minimum O level requirement of 5 credits. This is the main reason none of the top universities in Nigeria will be part of such dubious arrangement. It makes no sense!

If you want university degree, you must meet the O level requirement and vetted by JAMB and admission program to run on the established format for degree programs instead of a seperate program not supervised by NUC.

Will HND be in 400 level or 500 level ? Or 600 level? Where is their academic record from 300, 400?
It is a fraud and no organization should accept certificate issued under that fraudulent 'conversion'. It is a fraud and every university administrator that has taken advantage of the misinformed HND holders should be arrested and prosecuted.

You need to read wide and find out about HND in the west that we copied from. Your writup is the usual strotypical naija opinion of HND. Both university and polytechnics have the same entry requirement in terms of waec credits so I don't know what your assertion is based on. Even if you enter through preND you can't graduate without 5 credits including maths and English. I changed my mind about Bsc/Hnd argument after some colleagues sent their certificates to WES for evaluation and the HND guy got waivers for the same masters degree in Canada.

The discrimination is local to Nigeria. And until this descrimination stops many HND holders will continue to compete for university admission that is already stretched thin

LARRYOBRAIN:
Go and ask Min of Education and President Tinubu, so that you can rest.

Be deceiving yourself...

See week response. Shows how slow you are

Yaba wey still dey award diploma, na university for your dream

babakb:
You don't understand!!!

All Universities in the European Union member countries don't accept HND for direct admission into a Masters program.

This alone is enough reason for any HND graduate to go for a conversion to BSc.

Look at how Nigeria is messed up, do you really want our youth to hold on to qualifications that limits them to Nigeria alone

This is also a valid reason