₦airaland Forum

stuffs2002:
The Catholic priests showed a lot of disrespect to the president and they did that to him just because he is a southern Muslim.

That level of disrespect can never ever be shown to Buhari, Atiku, Yar'adua or Abacha

Pathetic and shameless liars. The Catholic priests have been speaking truth to powers

[quote author=CharlesCNG post=140223499]

You are arguing against a position nobody took.

The discussion was not about the Catholic Church as an institution. It was about the public comments of Cardinal John Onaiyekan as an individual church leader.

inwhat capacity did the bishops visited the President is it as CAN, catholic republic or Nigerians.

when you go represent the people, pass their grievances message, How is it out of line to Report back to the people that sent you.
Dont you data think, if i say i went to represent the people in a meeting and i came back looking like non disclosure app ... is that not a betrayal
Onaiyekan came back to the people to clock it, we delivered the message you sent us. that is a message to all Nigeria whether xtain, muslim or atheist. he explain bishops from 36 state in Nigeria made up that representation .. i watch the meeting i saw everything, Tinubu arrogance, demeanor .. we will wrestle i wont leave power easily .. All is fair i politics, there is hunger before i was born, so !

Those are two different things.
Nobody said the Catholic Church should "sing Bola on your mandate." In a democracy, religious leaders are free to comment on public affairs, and politicians and citizens are equally free to respond to those comments.

As a Nigerian why are you angry Onaiyekan said the truth, everything the Bishop said in that meeting which one was cooked up .. which one if you enter public bus n raise pepple will discard nd say No insecurity, no hunger
We have being talking about the Messenger, Please Me vs You or Tinubbu review the Message bring out the lies and hypocrisy


That is not politicising the Church. That is exercising free speech.

You mentioned Jonathan and Rev. Mbaka. Thank you. They actually prove the point: individual clerics have made political comments under different administrations, and those comments have attracted public criticism or support.

You see, you jumped at Mbaka forgetting that is just one man quest and the same catholic bwala discredit as partisan today suspended Mbaka for apolitivcal. Go n watch the video was it only Onaoyekan that sat with the president so why are you fguyz making it look like others at the meeting wrre ghost . the message was convey as a group singling out Onaiyekan is one wack ploy we know politicians for..

Critiquing those comments is not an attack on Christianity or the Church.

Attackiing Oniayekan is beyond attack on the church, it is an attack on Nigerians at large.. those old men convey nessage that affect majority of Nigerian outside religion, tribe or whatever division Tinubu boiz want to deploy

As for "every critic works for Peter Obi," that is another strawman. Nobody said that. But when a criticism closely mirrors the talking points of a political campaign, people are entitled to examine and challenge it.

oga lets here word, i just watched journalist hangout Babajide explicitly said Onaiyekan should kum n swear he with bible he is not supporting OBI
Go n read Bwala 1st attack, he linked Onaiyekan to Obi nd said OBi owns catholic ..one man own catholic thathave existed for over 100yrs .. Bwala is gettng pay to feign stewpeed,

Finally, saying Tinubu will "force" himself into a second term is not an argument—it is a prediction without evidence. If the opposition believes it has a better alternative, let it present its programme, build its coalition and win the election at the ballot box.

pleaese interprete these phrase " ALL is fair in politics" .. the context we wil wrestle go n watch the video... thats an evidence. i watch it i saw Tinubu demeanor. Go on youtube watch n read Tinubu body language, are you proud thats ur leader

In a democracy, respect is earned, votes are counted, and arguments are answered with better arguments—not with exaggeration or by pretending that criticism of one individual's public comments is an attack on an entire Church.

Bro you cant kid me, you cant give what you don't have ...Tinubu never had respect for anybody not even obasanjo the president when he was governor.

incase you don't know, Men like Onaiyekan have being speaking truth to power since military days, googlle bishops blast Jonathan, google Onaiyekan criticise Buhari on corruption ...these mam has earn is resoect from Nigerians he is certainly not looking for politician Respect ... eat it

The discussion concerns Cardinal John Onaiyekan's publicly expressed political views, not the Catholic Church as an institution.

The conversation shouldnt be about the messenger, if we are in the right frame of mind .. the conversation was aired i wss watch it, so what makes it private. political views is hunger in the land, insecurity, nigerians are worried we are sliding into one oarty state .. which one does not resonate with what Nigerians have being saying egbami 🤣

He has, on several occasions, made public comments on elections and governance that have attracted political debate.
Those comments are therefore open to public scrutiny and disagreement, just like those of any other influential public figure.

The fact that Onaiyekan has criticise both pdp president and apc president consecutively as exonerated the man. He has consistency to represent and boldly speak out Nigerians mind out that those in office wil hear

i watched the Meeting.. so what is private about it
Seyi makinde had a private meeting with Tinubu, did fayosevnot kum n use it to discredit seyi ..

if these Bishop keep quiet, Nigerians wil believe they have gone to collect there share of national cake, or Govt will pose the pictures of the bishop with Tinubu as endorsement ... we know ourselves

ZombieTERROR:
Things are getting worse under this administration

Everything, every sector is going down since This administration took over

Look at the economy and security for example..
families hardly feed
Towns emptied residents displaced
what we only hear in Borno under previous administrations is now everywhere.

They'll tell you it will get worse before it gets better... bloody lies

Governors , senators, appointees all receive improved salaries courtesy of subsidy removal, how does that trickle down to the common man in the streets

This government has borrowed more without paying subsidy than previous administration that paid. this is absurd

Tinubu never had a clue about governance before contesting and still has no idea what he's doing in office

This is a familiar opposition narrative, but it is remarkably light on evidence and even lighter on alternatives.

First, nobody denies that many Nigerians are under economic pressure. The hardship is real. The question is WHY, and what is the credible alternative?

For years, Nigeria postponed difficult decisions. Fuel subsidy consumed trillions. Multiple exchange rates encouraged arbitrage. Oil theft crippled revenue. Public debt kept rising while infrastructure deficits widened.

Those problems did not begin in May 2023.

Second, to say "everything is getting worse" is simply inaccurate.

Oil production has recovered from some of its lowest levels. Major highways are under construction across the federation. States now receive substantially higher FAAC allocations. The student loan programme is operational. CNG adoption is expanding. Tax reforms have been introduced to improve the fiscal system. Whether you support these reforms or not, pretending they do not exist is not analysis.

Third, on security, Nigeria still faces serious challenges. But it is incorrect to suggest that every part of the country is now "another Borno." Different regions face different security threats, and there have also been significant operations against criminal groups in several parts of the country. The picture is mixed—not the caricature you present.

Fourth, you say the government has borrowed more. Fine. Tell us WHAT your preferred candidate would cut.

Would he stop the Lagos-Calabar Coastal Highway?

Would he cancel the Sokoto-Badagry Superhighway?

Would he halt Abuja, Kano, East-West and other strategic road projects?

Infrastructure is financed because it is an investment, not because it is free.

Finally, you conclude that Tinubu "has no clue."

That is an opinion.

But elections are not won by slogans.

If Tinubu's approach is wrong, then present a better one.

Will your candidate restore fuel subsidy?

Will he reverse exchange-rate reform?

How will he stabilise the naira?

How will he increase oil production?

How will he fund infrastructure?

How will he reduce debt while increasing spending?

Criticism is easy.

Governing requires answers.

So far, I have heard plenty of outrage but very few practical alternatives.

[quote author=chidiokay post=140224445][/quote]No, the bishops did not visit President Tinubu as CAN, as a “Catholic Republic,” or as elected representatives of all Nigerians.

They visited as the leadership of the Catholic Bishops’ Conference of Nigeria, led by its president, Archbishop Matthew Ndagoso. The official account says Ndagoso attended with 19 CBCN leaders—not one bishop formally delegated by each of Nigeria’s 36 states.

The bishops were perfectly entitled to communicate the hardship reported by their congregations and to tell Catholics—and Nigerians generally—what concerns they raised. Nobody disputes that.

But reporting the issues presented is different from giving one participant’s interpretation of the President’s mood, motives and supposed rejection of everything said.

Cardinal Onaiyekan is Archbishop Emeritus of Abuja; he is not the current CBCN president. Unless the delegation formally appointed him its sole spokesman, his television account remains his account, not automatically the only authoritative record of the meeting.

And this “non-disclosure app” argument is another exaggeration. Nobody says the meeting was secret. The Presidency itself published the visit, identified the delegation and reported both the bishops’ concerns and Tinubu’s responses.

As for “all is fair in politics,” you cannot amputate the sentence from its context and then sew on “rigging” yourself. Tinubu immediately spoke about equal opportunity for political parties and INEC’s neutrality. Disagree with his wording, certainly—but do not manufacture ballot-box snatching from words he did not utter.

The bishops may criticise government. The Presidency may answer them. Citizens may scrutinise both sides.

That is democracy—not betrayal, sacrilege or an attack on the Church.

[quote author=CharlesCNG post=140223544]My brother, you are asking the wrong question.

The question is not whether Nigerians are facing hardship.

They are.

The real question is what caused the hardship, what is being done about it, and what is the credible alternative?


Gud ! I luv your questions, lets address it one by one

A. What caused the hardship, it is true Tinubu is not the originator of hardship Nigerians face But it is a Fact Tinubu has complicated nd worsen the hardship Nigerians presently face
Pick jonathan, buhari and Tinubu for comparison .. under who is the hardship on another scale or what do we call 300% inflation,

B. speaking of what is being done, Yes the president have explained what he as done and what he is doing .... But are the results reflecting changes in the daily lifes of the people

If you employ me to fix a car , i did my job, to me i have done my best ..buh it is not in my place to creditscore myself as mechanic ... Na you go score me n thats the logic Tinubu dont want to accept, that you give your best doesnt not mean we must lower the cut off to meet your best ...

C . alternatives ; if you are open minded nd have being following politics closely ... What as shown the Govt of Tinubu is receptive to alternatives.

I see you use the word " credible" thats the mischief, ... the credible is never about the message it always about the Messenger, as i am talking Tinubu boiz problem is to detect if i am igbo, obedient or catholic .. So how do we move ahead

Lets be sincere, nobody disagreeing voice can ever be credible to Tinubu, in the last 3yrs mention that one name in Nigeria that have criticise or advice Tinubu nd it was well taken. Just one

Kalulu44:
Can you pls differentiate this bishops. One look like Agberos and the other looks decent.
So those Agberos is the real bishops you thought visited Tinubu and licked his balls in praising him.

The bishops you feel are decently dressed passed through the same seminary schools with all sort of bad news amongst the seminarians.

But not to talk dirty..... If the agbero looking bishops will support my political agenda..... Then, they're my ordained bishops.

Catholic should hold their bishops down. They might just be disgraced.

What happened to their mouth when Buhari was the president?

JASONjnr:
You can't comfortably lie to yourself that Obi isn't their preferred candidate. After all, he divided Anambra people along other Christian faithfuls....He made Catholics more powerful and gave them appointments in his government.

The same bishops who distanced themselves from other bishops that supported Tinubu in the last general elections...Now want to have a say and be heard.

Catholic heads are politicians and they played early politics that created democracy. But then, Tinubu is more advan6tgan what they're offering today.

Who was their preferred candidate when the Bishops criticised Jonathan government for the activities of bandits and terrorists?

Very infantile and pedestrian argument.

The Catholic church is 2,000 years old, and have been speaking truth to power before Iragbiji - Tinubu's hometown came into existence.

[quote author=CharlesCNG post=140224678]

No, the bishops did not visit tvPresident Tinubu as CAN, as a “Catholic Republic,” or as elected representatives of all Nigerians.

what amuses me the most is the constant play of mischief ... not elected representatives of Nigerians you mean like the useless baxters in the senate nd house ofvreps that are serving there on interest nd simgimg Bola on your mandate
when Tinubu spoke against military did the people elect ed him, when he criticize jonathan ntold jonathsn to resign did Nigeria give him an office to say that ...late San Gami fawehimi was he elected to speak for Nigerians

Now under Tinubu you must first be elected by Nigerian before you can speak for them .. i keep asking what did Onaiyekan say that Nigerians are not saying.. Apc boiz dont want that conversation

They visited as the leadership of the Catholic Bishops’ Conference of Nigeria, led by its president, Archbishop Matthew Ndagoso. The official account says Ndagoso attended with 19 CBCN leaders—not one bishop formally delegated by each of Nigeria’s 36 states.

Nice one, what does the catholic bishop conference of Nigeria represent if not All states are covered, so far have you seen any catholic body issue a disclaimer on that visit or issue disclaimer on Bishop onaiyekan. simple logic

if i don't believe in your Criticism about a Person will i follow you down to the meeting nd sit there. what are you saying ??



The bishops were perfectly entitled to communicate the hardship reported by their congregations and to tell Catholics—and Nigerians generally—what concerns they raised. Nobody disputes that.

But reporting the issues presented is different from giving one participant’s interpretation of the President’s mood, motives and supposed rejection of everything said.

Bronwe are not teenagers, we are grown Adults ... If you think Onaiyekan interpretation was personal other might differ why have we not seen disclaimer from other attendees .. i repeat i watched te Meeting, i swear before Onaiyekan even went on Arisetv i told my friend Tinubu act arrogantly, themanner he relaid his efforts nd what he is doing .. it like who are you people to query me!

the one that broke the carmel back was when hebsaid ALL is fair in politics ! any democracy lover should be worried. i listened to him forget what Onaiyekan ieven saying Watch the context that led to All is fair in politics n tell me why you think 2027 won't be coronation. Tinubu went as far as Me n opposition will " wrestle" when Obasanjo said politics is do or die we all condemned him ... Onaiyekan is not a youth or small boy as an elder he can read into words even me small boy can interprete All is fair ... if i shoot yu n yu die to win . fair nonii

Cardinal Onaiyekan is Archbishop Emeritus of Abuja; he is not the current CBCN president. Unless the delegation formally appointed him its sole spokesman, his television account remains his account, not automatically the only authoritative record of the meeting.

You can no locus standi to tell CBCN how to convey there message, if Onaiyekan conveyed a message contrary to CBCN they should have issued a disclaimer by now
mbaka was strong critics of Buhari, the catholic body distance itself at some point n even suspended him So you see Tinubu boiz dont have point

its being over 48hrs Onaiyekan granted an interview why have CBCN not issued a disclaimer he is acting alone ... bodies dont protect what they dont share

And this “non-disclosure app” argument is another exaggeration. Nobody says the meeting was secret. The Presidency itself published the visit, identified the delegation and reported both the bishops’ concerns and Tinubu’s responses.

i am surprise you are dwelling on Report,, oga video dey go watch what transpired n interprete yourself Tinubu demeanor

As for “all is fair in politics,” you cannot amputate the sentence from its context and then sew on “rigging” yourself. Tinubu immediately spoke about equal opportunity for political parties and INEC’s neutrality. Disagree with his wording, certainly—but do not manufacture ballot-box snatching from words he did not utter.

these is very lame coming from you, how is equal opportunity a conjunction to " ALL is fair in politics ... that phrase was originally for All in fair n love and war .. the World largely frown at such assertion that All is fair. There are rules n limit ...so All can be in the conversation . Dont insult my intelligence ... wil Tinunu say Inec is not Neutral ni or inec work for me, we be babies

The bishops may criticise government. The Presidency may answer them. Citizens may scrutinise both sides.

That is democracy—not betrayal, sacrilege or an attack on the Church.

i dont know what to make of your last paragraph cos its like you are speaking from AlL side of the mouth ... People in govt are intolerant to criticism and we have seen it everytime. obsanjo talk he is not credible, Obi talk he is not credible,Atiku talk he is not credible ... So whu is credible .. Trump said there was xtain genocide they launched attack , he is after nigeria oil .... So my broda who is credible, igbos are not even credible at All they must not talk na wa

JASONjnr:
You can't comfortably lie to yourself that Obi isn't their preferred candidate. After all, he divided Anambra people along other Christian faithfuls....He made Catholics more powerful and gave them appointments in his government.

The same bishops who distanced themselves from other bishops that supported Tinubu in the last general elections...Now want to have a say and be heard.

Catholic heads are politicians and they played early politics that created democracy. But then, Tinubu is more advan6tgan what they're offering today.

So the bishops should not be heard because they "distanced themselves from other bishops that supported Tinubu in the last general elections"?

mannobi:
Indeed. Criticism from a known Peter Obi fan. The particular Mr Onaiyekan had shown his bias before now so whatever his point is. It is coming from his bias for his own condidate and not for the nation

in all the pictures you posted not one said he is a Peter Obi fan. What are you talking about

NewHe:
And after each of the previous visits,do they (Bishops) went on live TV to debate what they discussed with them?

Yes they do
Bishop KAIGAMA went on air to discuss their meeting with Jonathan.

Fortunately Jonathan was receptive of criticism and went on to promise them that he would do his utmost to address the issues raised particularly taking back the territories claimed by boko haram.

This is the first time they meet a president who thinks critique is an attack, they said Nigeria is bleeding he said it is fine, economy is affecting the poor, he said there will always be poor people. People are worried about the neutrality of inec, he said all is fair in politics. In all his response he was defensive when these are glaring issues for the common man

[quote author=reddingtonblack post=140224773][/quote]Your argument raises several distinct issues that are worth separating.

First, saying that hardship is greater today than under previous administrations is a different claim from saying the current administration is solely responsible for it. To evaluate that fairly, it would be necessary to consider inherited economic conditions, policy choices, external factors, and a range of indicators such as inflation, exchange rates, public finances, employment, growth, and security—not a single measure in isolation.

Second, it is true that citizens ultimately judge governments. At the same time, public assessments are typically informed by both lived experience and measurable outcomes. During periods of major reform, those two may not always move in the same direction at the same time.

Third, the assertion that alternative ideas are rejected because of who proposes them is a factual claim that requires evidence. Demonstrating that would require documented examples where a proposal was dismissed because of its source rather than its merits.

Finally, asking for examples of criticism that influenced government decisions is an empirical question. The appropriate way to answer it is with specific, verifiable cases rather than general impressions. Likewise, claims that no criticism is ever considered would also require supporting evidence.

Keeping these questions separate helps make the discussion more precise and evidence-based.

mannobi:
Indeed. Criticism from a known Peter Obi fan. The particular Mr Onaiyekan had shown his bias before now so whatever his point is. It is coming from his bias for his own condidate and not for the nation

In all these news headlines you posted, which one is carrying Obi name?
According to bwala, once you are associated with APC, you don't need your brain anymore.

[quote author=CharlesCNG post=140229248]

Your argument raises several distinct issues that are worth separating.

First, saying that hardship is greater today than under previous administrations is a different claim from saying the current administration is solely responsible for it. To evaluate that fairly, it would be necessary to consider inherited economic conditions, policy choices, external factors, and a range of indicators such as inflation, exchange rates, public finances, employment, growth, and security—not a single measure in isolation.

i agree inherited condition is valid arguement, But the moment you changed to you own policy nd run for over 3yrs ... I am ready to judge you on you. I no know if you follow
If i give mechanic my car with a bad ansorber if he patches it up for me to continue to use .... I cant blame him everytime it fails But the moment he ask me to change nd i pay him to buy absorber .... should the car hand fail i can blame him exclusively thats an analogy

Second, it is true that citizens ultimately judge governments. At the same time, public assessments are typically informed by both lived experience and measurable outcomes. During periods of major reform, those two may not always move in the same direction at the same time.

What " reform" are we talking about, A reform that takes away what people benefit from govt and take more from the people
A reform that says people should sacrifice But the politicians are on a lavish spree chopping n ordering isewu anyhow
are you kidding .. A reform that completely ignores Oransanye report and focus on how govt can extort more money out of Nigerians instead of looking into production. I don't need to be an harvard graduate to forecast a economy built on Tax, levies & loans instead of productivity is going nowhere.

Third, the assertion that alternative ideas are rejected because of who proposes them is a factual claim that requires evidence. Demonstrating that would require documented examples where a proposal was dismissed because of its source rather than its merits.

Now you sound entitled, point of correction we didnt vote the president and still be the ones racking our brains to provide solutions However for objectivity i will oblige you
Atiku gave recommendations at some point to these govt and if you can just open google type Open letter to Tinubu you will see loads of it giving recommendations nd telling the president the state of the nation like they knew he is not aware .. If that does not impress you, May i remind you we dont owe Tinubu recommendations.
I cant give car to mechanic nd still be the one proffering solutions

Finally, asking for examples of criticism that influenced government decisions is an empirical question. The appropriate way to answer it is with specific, verifiable cases rather than general impressions. Likewise, claims that no criticism is ever considered would also require supporting evidence.

The catholic bishop that just happened nkor, is that not a fresh evidence, To the point they attacked & discredit catholic church can't speak for xtain.
I have mentioned one, Please you tew mention one criticism Tinubu have considered,

Keeping these questions separate helps make the discussion more precise and evidence-based.

There is no answer or evidence you are demanding of me that you won't see if you listen to programs on channelstv or Arisetv, or mainland fm daily

[quote author=reddingtonblack post=140231875][/quote]Your mechanic analogy leaves out an important variable: the condition of the car.

If a mechanic tells you the shock absorber is bad, but inspection also reveals a cracked chassis, worn suspension arms, damaged steering components and neglected maintenance accumulated over many years, replacing only the shock absorber does not instantly make the car drive like new.

In that situation, the owner may still experience a rough ride for some time, not because the new shock absorber was unnecessary, but because multiple underlying faults remain to be repaired.

The analogy illustrates a broader point: judging a repair requires considering both the condition of the vehicle at the start and the nature of the work being undertaken. A difficult repair may involve short-term disruption before its longer-term effects can be assessed.

That does not mean the mechanic should be immune from criticism. It means the evaluation should distinguish between problems inherited with the vehicle, the quality of the repairs performed, and the results achieved over time.

[quote author=reddingtonblack post=140231875][/quote]You have mixed a fair criticism with a false conclusion.

Yes, politicians must reduce waste and live by the sacrifice they demand from citizens. Lavish spending weakens public trust and deserves criticism.

But saying Tinubu completely ignored the Oronsaye Report is simply untrue. In February 2024, the Federal Executive Council approved the merger, relocation, subsuming or abolition of dozens of overlapping agencies, although implementation has admittedly been slower than promised. So the accurate criticism is “implement it faster,” not “it was ignored.”

Nor is the economy being built only on taxes, levies and loans. Tax reform is meant to raise Nigeria’s extremely weak public revenue and simplify overlapping taxes—not replace production. Meanwhile, official data show manufacturing grew 3.29% in real terms in the first quarter of 2026, trade grew 2.08%, construction’s contribution increased, and the non-oil economy accounted for over 96% of GDP.

Local refining is expanding, petroleum-import dependence is falling, and investments are being directed into agriculture, energy, manufacturing, mining, technology and transportation.

A productive economy and an effective tax system are not enemies. Every serious country produces wealth AND collects revenue to fund roads, schools, security and healthcare.

Your argument is like accusing a farmer of abandoning farming because he finally repaired the leaking basket used to collect his harvest.

Nigeria needs more production—absolutely. It also needs to stop losing revenue through subsidies, tax loopholes, multiple levies and inefficient agencies.

Criticise government extravagance. Demand faster Oronsaye implementation. But don’t pretend fiscal reform means production has been abandoned.

You cannot industrialise a country with an empty treasury—and you cannot tax your way to prosperity without production. A serious reform programme must do both.

[quote author=reddingtonblack post=140231875][/quote]You are confusing citizens with opposition candidates.

Ordinary Nigerians do not owe Tinubu a policy blueprint. But Atiku is not an ordinary observer; he is asking to replace the President. The moment he applies for the mechanic’s job, he must explain what is wrong, what he will repair differently, how much it will cost and why Nigerians should trust him with the car.

An open letter listing problems is not automatically a workable alternative.

Criticism is free. Candidacy comes with a burden of proof.

[quote author=reddingtonblack post=140231875][/quote]The bishops’ visit is not evidence that Tinubu rejects criticism. They presented their concerns; the President answered them.
Disagreement is not censorship.

You asked for one example: after labour rejected the government’s ₦62,000 minimum-wage offer, Tinubu raised it to ₦70,000 and shortened the review cycle from five years to three.

The student-loan law was also rewritten in 2024 after concerns about restrictive access and implementation. You asked for one, i gave you two. there are many , many instances.

So “Tinubu has never considered criticism” is demonstrably false.
Listening does not mean accepting every demand exactly as presented.

[quote author=reddingtonblack post=140231875][/quote]Media interviews and commentary are useful for understanding a politician's views, but they are not substitutes for specific evidence.

If a factual claim is being made, it's more helpful to point to the particular interview, speech, policy document, or official statement that supports it rather than referring generally to TV or radio programmes.

That makes the discussion clearer and allows others to verify the claim directly.

Finally, Thank you for the civility of your arguments. This is what democracy is all about.

There can never be unanimity of opinion in a free society, and there shouldn't be.

People with diffrent political leaning will analyse the same facts differently and arrive at different conclusions.

What matters is that we continue to engage with one another through facts, logic and mutual respect rather than insults or intimidation.

We may never agree on every issue, but we can certainly agree to disagree without being disagreeable.

That, ultimately, is the hallmark of a mature democracy.

CharlesCNG:
Media interviews and commentary are useful for understanding a politician's views, but they are not substitutes for specific evidence.

If a factual claim is being made, it's more helpful to point to the particular interview, speech, policy document, or official statement that supports it rather than referring generally to TV or radio programmes.

That makes the discussion clearer and allows others to verify the claim directly.

Finally, Thank you for the civility of your arguments. This is what democracy is all about.

There can never be unanimity of opinion in a free society, and there shouldn't be.

People with diffrent political leaning will analyse the same facts differently and arrive at different conclusions.

What matters is that we continue to engage with one another through facts, logic and mutual respect rather than insults or intimidation.

We may never agree on every issue, but we can certainly agree to disagree without being disagreeable.

That, ultimately, is the hallmark of a mature democracy.

[quote author=CharlesCNG post=140232265]

Media interviews and commentary are useful for understanding a politician's views, but they are not substitutes for specific evidence.

If a factual claim is being made, it's more helpful to point to the particular interview, speech, policy document, or official statement that supports it rather than referring generally to TV or radio programmes.

Once again you need keep dis entitle mentaliy in check ...

Note ; we dont owe the president Alternative, you are pivoting nd making it sounds it is Nigerians that are failing the president nd not the other way. that said

I don't know how to be more specific for you when you are not ready to search yourself ... Google is there, search Atiku gives recommendation to president Tinubu. Read through, if yu think i wil attempt wake a man feigning to sleep.

That makes the discussion clearer and allows others to verify the claim directly.

Bro ! Don't give me lecture 101, you have brought nothing to this arguement other than asking questions.
I have ask more than 2 times ...Mention one alternate recommendation given that Tinubu have taken. Look at Tinubu countanance when the Bishop were talking to him in that meeting ...does that man look like someone open to advice. I have gift i can read body language, demeanor in 60sec with you

Finally, Thank you for the civility of your arguments. This is what democracy is all about.

I dont know what to thank you for cos you given me nothing to validate why you support a babarian government, how can you say this is democracy nd your president said ..ALL is fair in Politics

How can you say this is democracy nd El rufai is unlawful held in prison over a bailable offence

There can never be unanimity of opinion in a free society, and there shouldn't be.

don't patronise bro, the truth is we have never had it this worst .. We are almost in a state kiss Tinubu ring or rot away

People with diffrent political leaning will analyse the same facts differently and arrive at different conclusions.

conclusions may differ, buh majority group conclusion stand as Fact., Nigreria largely are saying Tinubu is a failure

What matters is that we continue to engage with one another through facts, logic and mutual respect rather than insults or intimidation.

The question is are you receptive to truth, cos if you cant stand the truth you cant take Facts.

We may never agree on every issue, but we can certainly agree to disagree without being disagreeable.

we don't have to Agree, buh where you see Facts n peoples reality ... disembark

That, ultimately, is the hallmark of a mature democracy.

You are the one that want to defend Tinubu a govt that want to bully its way back to power ... God dey
Here is Atiku recommendation hope its specific.. Google search

CharlesCNG:
The bishops’ visit is not evidence that Tinubu rejects criticism. They presented their concerns; the President answered them.
Disagreement is not censorship.

You asked for one example: after labour rejected the government’s ₦62,000 minimum-wage offer, Tinubu raised it to ₦70,000 and shortened the review cycle from five years to three.

The student-loan law was also rewritten in 2024 after concerns about restrictive access and implementation. You asked for one, i gave you two. there are many , many instances.

So “Tinubu has never considered criticism” is demonstrably false.
Listening does not mean accepting every demand exactly as presented.

I am very disappointed in you, Just say you did not understand the Question instead of descending to concortion lies

Labour asked for 62k 🤣🤣🤣 i was even telling my woman labour is just being unrealistic, govt cant afford it

2nd you said student loan, now student loans applies to less than 4% of Nigeria population, i find it inadequate for the convo.
The ammendment of the student loans may appear to be becos of criticism buh for deep thinkers .. It is becos it is demmed unimplementable. It is not like they have a choice, it is unimplementable they just have to re write then it appear like we listened to the people.

tax reform , electoral reform that applies to greater % of Nigerians why dem no listen,

Ubenedictus:
So the bishops should not be heard because they "distanced themselves from other bishops that supported Tinubu in the last general elections"?

They were listened to..... The main reason you heard this news is because the president had a meeting with them and heard their biased statements.

The country isn't in a mess and there are policies that is put into place.

It's not been easy with everyone and there's nobody that's enjoying at the moment but we are hoping that the reforms will set things right at the appropriate time and you don't expect overnight miracles.

reddingtonblack:
I am very disappointed in you, Just say you did not understand the Question instead of descending to concortion lies

Labour asked for 62k 🤣🤣🤣 i was even telling my woman labour is just being unrealistic, govt cant afford it

2nd you said student loan, now student loans applies to less than 4% of Nigeria population, i find it inadequate for the convo.
The ammendment of the student loans may appear to be becos of criticism buh for deep thinkers .. It is becos it is demmed unimplementable. It is not like they have a choice, it is unimplementable they just have to re write then it appear like we listened to the people.

tax reform , electoral reform that applies to greater % of Nigerians why dem no listen,

You began by accusing me of “concocting lies,” yet your first claim is itself wrong: Labour did not ask for ₦62,000. The Federal Government and private sector offered ₦62,000, while Labour reduced its demand from ₦494,000 to ₦250,000.

On the student-loan law, nobody denies that the original Act contained implementation problems. But rewriting an unworkable law after criticism is precisely what listening and responsive governance look like.

You cannot say, “They amended it because it was defective,” and then insist the amendment does not count because they had “no choice.” Governments always have a choice: correct mistakes or stubbornly preserve them. The 2024 law removed obstacles that had delayed implementation.

Your claim that government ignored Nigerians on tax reform is also false. After public opposition and legislative consultation, lawmakers retained VAT at 7.5% instead of the proposed 12.5%, exempted minimum-wage earners from personal income tax and substantially altered the proposed VAT-sharing formula. Those are not cosmetic changes; they affect millions of Nigerians.

Even on electoral reform, public pressure produced movement: the Senate reversed its earlier position and supported real-time electronic transmission of results.

So the honest argument is not that government listens to every demand or always responds adequately. It plainly does not.
The defensible argument is that it has listened and adjusted on several major issues.

You cannot redefine every concession as “they had no choice” and then declare that nobody listened. That is not deep thinking; it is constructing a conclusion that no amount of contrary evidence is allowed to disturb.

[quote author=CharlesCNG post=140235489]

You began by accusing me of “concocting lies,” yet your first claim is itself wrong: Labour did not ask for ₦62,000. The Federal Government and private sector offered ₦62,000, while Labour reduced its demand from ₦494,000 to ₦250,000.

thats why i said if you did not understand the question you should have left it instead of playing smart ?

the question was mention one recommendation Tinubu took and applied ??

By evidence i posted, Labour recommendation and what Tinubu later implemented as minimum wage are coastal lane apart, #250, 000 to #70,000 that over 300+% slash

On the student-loan law, nobody denies that the original Act contained implementation problems. But rewriting an unworkable law after criticism is precisely what listening and responsive governance look like.

Oga no whyne yourself, if you buy a toyota camry fender mistakenly for your corrolla, nd panel beater tell you oga return it ... Are you a listener becos yu returned it 🤣 .. No go naw make dem nack camry fender for corrola for you 🤭

The 2023 student loan act is like bringing a square peg brought for a round hole you have no choice, even if nobody complain, you will have to make changes.
cleverly, i get they can present it as we listened to Nigerians. But you nd i should know thats not true

You cannot say, “They amended it because it was defective,” and then insist the amendment does not count because they had “no choice.” Governments always have a choice: correct mistakes or stubbornly preserve them. The 2024 law removed obstacles that had delayed implementation

See this man, i just did an amendment that comes from a place of wrong match does not count as listening thats my point, i didnt say, do not count as amendment .. Lets be clear

Your claim that government ignored Nigerians on tax reform is also false. After public opposition and legislative consultation, lawmakers retained VAT at 7.5% instead of the proposed 12.5%, exempted minimum-wage earners from personal income tax and substantially altered the proposed VAT-sharing formula. Those are not cosmetic changes; they affect millions of Nigerians.

Oga pap no get mark, na leaf draw mark on it .. The vat was retained nd speculations of increment never went beyond speculation So we cant Posit they listened.
Let me tell you an interesting fact, Buhari increased VAT from 5% to 7.5% after 26yrs and crazy emilokan want to increase VAT btwn 4yrs .. That Tinubu wicked oo !

Even on electoral reform, public pressure produced movement: the Senate reversed its earlier position and supported real-time electronic transmission of results.

You have completely lost it 🤣🤣 my broda say real time .... The real time wey dis yoruba senator came to channels to discredit its not realistic, no network in some place there it is back to discretional, as the presiding officier deems fit, our fate is on presiding officier.
Emilokan no even wait 24hrs, baba use 5G speed sign am.🤣

So the honest argument is not that government listens to every demand or always responds adequately. It plainly does not.
The defensible argument is that it has listened and adjusted on several major issues.

Bro ths arguement is these Govt have no record of doing one things according to Nigerians demands.

If your wife ask you for 500k for house upkeep then in the morning you give 90k .. Shebi you have listened, 90k is money 🤷 i hope the ladies are listening

You cannot redefine every concession as “they had no choice” and then declare that nobody listened. That is not deep thinking; it is constructing a conclusion that no amount of contrary evidence is allowed to disturb.

I will, Becos you have failed to establish were these govt had choice, and they listened to nigerians. Common national anthem emilokan change am

nysc cloth they wan change to yoruba cultural attire .... Na becos of election they sharply put that one on hold 🤣🤣 make dem no offend youth

So many evil on hold, becos of election, Nigeria will see shege pro kuku kill us in 2nd half 🤣 by

JASONjnr:
They were listened to..... The main reason you heard this news is because the president had a meeting with them and heard their biased statements.

The country isn't in a mess and there are policies that is put into place.

It's not been easy with everyone and there's nobody that's enjoying at the moment but we are hoping that the reforms will set things right at the appropriate time and you don't expect overnight miracles.

So it is baised to say that the country is bleeding or that there is poverty in the land?

Ubenedictus:
So it is baised to say that the country is bleeding or that there is poverty in the land?

If it isn't biased, let the bishop declare no tithe and no offering. Since they know that people are suffering, they should stop collecting the little money from the people.

JASONjnr:
If it isn't biased, let the bishop declare no tithe and no offering. Since they know that people are suffering, they should stop collecting the little money from the people.

There is someone in the bible who thought this idea made sense. His name was Judas and Jesus rebuked him for it