₦airaland Forum

Inspirer1:
He didn't say he was going to do anything that will affect the Refineries badly.

If Dangote Refinery or any other Refinery is selling at say 1,000, he can subsidze directly from there so they sell at 500.

He can also choose to sell crude cheaper to Dangote Refinery or any other Nigerian owned Refinery at a cheaper rate than that of International cost price at an agreement that they sell cheaper to Nigeria.
How will that affect the refineries negatively for God's sake

As a matter of fact, I expected the present FG to do this same thing, subsidize directly from the Refinery.
By now we should know the average amount of litres we consume daily or weekly, this should guide them.

Furthermore, trackers can be installed on all petrol tankers lifting from Dangote Refinery to monitor movement and delivery to various petrol stations etc.
Even the Alhaji Dangote himself talked about this tracking.
Strengthen operations of Nigeria Customs to mitigate smuggling etc.
What are they FG if they can't do all these!

Hedonisco:
Who the hell is Rotus and what does he know?

All these disgusting I too know 'anal-lysts' who yap nonsense theories.

Before the so-called removal of subsidy, was the economy materially and objectively better for Nigerians, yes or no? Was fuel cheaper and inflation lower for Nigerians, yes or no?

If the so called subsidy is restored, and fuel price is slashed to something like N500 per litre, will it reduce the economic suffering of Nigerians, yes or no?

These are the hard core questions that Nigerians care about. Not any senseless big English.

Dancebreaker:
Nobody has said life is not difficult anywhere. But compare the living standards of 50k randomly picked teachers and nurses in the UK, Canada and Australia with the same in Nigeria.

We talk of the life of average people.

Rutherinspace:
Sometimes you try to learn. Do you understand economic policies and the implications for businesses? Listen to him again and ask questions if you don't understand. If AA is serious about subsidies, let him start with his businesses. My cousin paid over 5M per year in his university. How many Nigerians can afford that? Mark this words. No one can bring back petrol subsidies again. Politicians will say anything just to deceive others for votes.

nairalanda1:
SO government should go into more debt providing everything free for you guys?

The problem is, even if government stops looting, we do not earn enough money as a nation. Also price controls drives away a lot of much needed investment

You can hate me, but you cannot have a subsidy without getting into more debt. Unless you want to pay more in tax.

zbigniew:
There is this concern i have about journalists like Rotus who try to form expertise and knowledge of what they know not...The other day he was exhibiting his ignorance inadvertently while trying to demean the knowledge base of Dino...It was tragic to hear Rotus say that Eurobonds are bonds sold outside of the USA in dollars....This is the highest level of ignorance and misinformation in major public media News cast....ROTUS Eurobonds are simply bonds denominated in currencies other rhan the currency of the issuer or the issuer's domicile....So for instance Issuing Sterling Bonds in Frankfurt is a Eurobond!!!!....Now back to the matter of subsidy....The first premise to start from is to ask a basic fundamental question...Is the economy made for the society or the society is made for the economy?...The straight answer is that the economy is made for a society and therefore it is a tool for societal goals....Subsidy is a part of economic policy and Subsidy removal is also a part of economic policy...None is inherently good or bad to the extent of it's serving its purpose...Has subsidy removal served the purpose of Nigerian society....Has it birthed more benefits to the society than costs?..The majority answer to this is no...On the other hand was Subsidy regime beneficial to Nigerians? the answer is yes....Where there leakages Nd challenges? The answer is yes ..So why not pluck the leakages and get the program working optimally....Is that too much to ask ROTUS....The other way to see it is assuming subsidy regime was workng optimally and removal of subsidy policy was also executed optimally, which od the two will bring more benefits to the citizens?...Under optimal subsidy regime, the benefits are direct and immediate in terms of reducing cost of living but under removal of subsidy,the benefits are indirect through income redistribution....It is obvious to get the benefits from subsidy removal , a middle man is created to channel the benefits which can create obstacles and road blocks...The middle men are the Governors who are 36 in number plus that MAD MAN in Abuja....Even if they are all saints and cardinals there is no way to guarantee their sanity all the time.... Sorry i forgot the elephant in the room the 38th MIDDLE MAN which is the FG with insatiety for waste and folly...Thank you ROTUS for given me the opportunity to school you...

garykoeman:
Atiku presidency will be the end of the country.

Nigeria should brace up for $1 to #5000 exchange rate.

nairalanda1:
SO government should go into more debt providing everything free for you guys?

The problem is, even if government stops looting, we do not earn enough money as a nation. Also price controls drives away a lot of much needed investment

You can hate me, but you cannot have a subsidy without getting into more debt. Unless you want to pay more in tax.

Mattswaggz:
Whether he will restore it or not isn't the main issue....the main issue is what have become of the monies saved from subsidy removal so far?.

Dancebreaker:
To begin with, I have never benefited from 9ja in decades, so saying "you guys" is you making assumptions.

If petrol goes up to 10k per litre, I really don't care. But I do pity the millions who may perish. I know how many are already groaning and seeking help. People who were doing fairly well a few years ago.

Do enjoy the high prices and inflation. All the best.

Lovit:
Has Tinubu not borrowed more than when subsidy was in place?

Who do una this thing?

givedemwotowoto:
Peter Obi remains my choice for 2027.

I DO NOT support Atiku’s proposed restoration of subsidy. However, if the choice were between Atiku and Tinubu, I’ll choose Atiku.

Rather than restore subsidy, commit the entire subsidy money to job creation. Commit up to N 3 trillion naira annually to empower up to 500,000 businesses and employ up to 2 million jobs nationwide (0% interest interest loan with up to 2-year deferred repayment plan) before it starts reporting to your credit score.

Tinubu is completely clueless and greedy. Lagos and Nigeria needs to be free from his grip.

Streetinvestor2:
Atiku did not say he was going to subsidise Dangote Refinery. He said he will subsidise the cost of fuel Nigerians use as we buy it at Dangote price. How did subsidy affect the Refineries that we whr buying it from when Dangote Refinery was not operating. Is Dangote Refinery servicing only Nigerian market. How about when we allocated a particular quentity of crude to be refined for Nigerians.
Do this people think we don't have senses now because baron is president. All is needed is to get the right consumption of Nigerians daily and not the bloated figures by drug baron and his criminality apc party and subsidise it.Then check mate the corruption of taking it to neighbouring countries to sell. It is not rocket science for a serious government to handle and implement

givedemwotowoto:
Peter Obi remains my choice for 2027.

I DO NOT support Atiku’s proposed restoration of subsidy. However, if the choice were between Atiku and Tinubu, I’ll choose Atiku.

Rather than restore subsidy, commit the entire subsidy money to job creation. Commit up to N 3 trillion naira annually to empower up to 500,000 businesses and employ up to 2 million jobs nationwide (0% interest interest loan with up to 2-year deferred repayment plan) before it starts reporting to your credit score.

Tinubu is completely clueless and greedy. Lagos and Nigeria needs to be free from his grip.

Streetinvestor2:
Atiku did not say he was going to subsidise Dangote Refinery. He said he will subsidise the cost of fuel Nigerians use as we buy it at Dangote price. How did subsidy affect the Refineries that we whr buying it from when Dangote Refinery was not operating. Is Dangote Refinery servicing only Nigerian market. How about when we allocated a particular quentity of crude to be refined for Nigerians.
Do this people think we don't have senses now because baron is president. All is needed is to get the right consumption of Nigerians daily and not the bloated figures by drug baron and his criminality apc party and subsidise it.Then check mate the corruption of taking it to neighbouring countries to sell. It is not rocket science for a serious government to handle and implement

Misterone:
Who calculates the subsidy? No business man wants bottlenecks in his business! The best form of business is willing buyer willing seller!

Streetinvestor2:
Atiku did not say he was going to subsidise Dangote Refinery. He said he will subsidise the cost of fuel Nigerians use as we buy it at Dangote price. How did subsidy affect the Refineries that we whr buying it from when Dangote Refinery was not operating. Is Dangote Refinery servicing only Nigerian market. How about when we allocated a particular quentity of crude to be refined for Nigerians.
Do this people think we don't have senses now because baron is president. All is needed is to get the right consumption of Nigerians daily and not the bloated figures by drug baron and his criminality apc party and subsidise it.Then check mate the corruption of taking it to neighbouring countries to sell. It is not rocket science for a serious government to handle and implement

Lovit:
You said nothing meaningful to counter his opinion

Who told you that Tinubu alone knows better than everyone else?

If fuel is subsidized at say N450 won't you benefit? How has the removal of fuel subsidy benefitted you and your family

How has your state getting more allocation benefitted people in your village?

Tinubu should kill corruption in the subsidy regime and not kill subsidy itself.

Don't throw away the baby with the bath water!

SixSeven:
Rotus came from the US. Smart guy but if you listen to him, he's likely to follow a Western-style school of thought and apply it to Nigeria. In fact, I think Tinubu will like him because the capitalism influence is great to talk about in theory but are they appropriate for us? My big question though is that, subsidy is a form of welfare. What are the welfare Nigerian tax payers getting from their government? The elephant in the room is the big question for this subsidy argument,

WHEN ARE OUR NATIONAL REFINERIES GOING TO WORK

That question is as old as Obasanjo's first step into Aso Rock in 1999


I also remember this US Iran war. That war was a big eye opener to both Nigeria and the US. Despite sanctions from the US, Iran has never ever used it as an excuse to not have working refineries yet we blame their war for our fuel price 🤡 That Iran war is a good example that we have wicked people in power. If they can be fighting a war and despite their facilities being hit by US, they choose to repair it in 2 months, there is no analysis wants to tell me about Nigeria except that we don't have the willpower to love the nation. Wicked, wicked people we have in power. Very heartless

The excuses they gave for subsidy removal are weak institutional regulations. No consequence for crime and we've excused it away.

It's always convenient for our so-called educated people to refer to US and west but conveniently ignore your peers who are/were just like you.

chinchum:
Do you live in a cave? Iran-us war has impacted pump price virtually in all countries. Nigeria having 20 owned refineries will not fix this except it wants to sell below pump price, which now means subsidy of oil. In fact if Nigeria runs a refinery and not privately managed, it will become moribund in a short while and a conduit for average corrupt Nigerian managers and cost of production will be higher than comparative refineries.

Rutherinspace:
I don't expect it to be meaningful to you because your post shows that you lack the ability to read and understand.

I never mentioned Tinubu in my post so I don't know why you're bringing it up.

If you're truly interested in learning, read up on why IMF supports the policy. Read up on why the world bank called it a "vital fiscal reform".

You need to understand that the world is moving fast. If you don't read you will have less knowledge and slow thinking.

garykoeman:
Atiku presidency will be the end of the country.

Nigeria should brace up for $1 to #5000 exchange rate.

CharlesCNG:
The problem with your defence of Atiku VOODOO economics is that Atiku has now clarified his own proposal—and it is NOT what you are describing.

Atiku’s team NOW says the subsidy will “move subsidy from importation to production” !! and that qualifying Nigerian refineries, public and private, will receive crude at preferential prices , tied to verified domestic production and lower consumer prices. In other words, Dangote and other refineries are directly inside the subsidy mechanism.

So saying, “Atiku did not say he would subsidise Dangote” is simply outdated. The have made another u-turn!

And there is another problem. The PIA says wholesale and retail petroleum prices should be based on unrestricted free-market pricing conditions, while wholesale transactions are supposed to be negotiated transparently on an arm’s-length basis.
So the questions remain:

* What exactly is the preferential crude price?
* How much below market price will Dangote receive crude?
* Who pays that difference?
* What volume qualifies?
* How is “verified Nigerian consumption” determined?
* What happens when crude prices rise?
* What happens when the naira weakens?
* How do you stop cheaper Nigerian petrol from being diverted or smuggled?
* How does this preferential pricing sit with the PIA’s free-market framework?

And “just checkmate corruption and smuggling” is not a mechanism. That is like saying: “Just stop armed robbery.”

This latest Atiku's subsidy rigmarole idea is even more nonsensical than the one of YESTERDAY,

The moment identical petrol has two economic values—one subsidised for Nigerian consumption and another reflecting commercial/export value—you create an arbitrage opportunity. The bigger the price gap, the bigger the incentive to divert it.

The really ironic part is this:You say it is “not rocket science.”

Exactly. Then Atiku should have no difficulty telling Nigerians one elementary number: WHAT IS THE BENCHMARK PRICE?

CONFUSED and DESPERATE Atiku has announced the destination without showing Nigerians the vehicle, the route—or the fare.

nairalanda1:
RIght, time to teach these my fellow oppositon supporters some lessons

1. Fuel consumption is not static
2. We know the real value of fuel consumption...it is 50 million liters a day. It came down from 74 -99 million liters when there was a subsidy as recently as 2022.
3. If ya think it is less, in a country that depends on petrol, lol, I can't help una.

Having said that

1. What is the price you guys want your fuel at? Let's assume it is N200 per liter.

That means that at best government pays subsidy of N1250 per liter for fuel to make sure it covers the country adequately. That means that out of this year's budget, government would spend something like 28 trillion naira for subsidy...budget is 68 trillion naira.

That means that if Atiku took over today, and resumed subsidy, he would have to find another 28 trillion naira to add to our 68 trillion naira budget. That means borrowing, or taking money from salaries, projects, etc...which still may mean borrowing

Result, more debt.

2. The above calculation is based on oil price as it is today. If oil prices rise...the cost of subsidy could rise to a level where it would be more than our budget. You want government to borrow more than our budget to fund cheap fuel

3. If oil prices fall, yes subsidy cost may fall, but ironically, government revenue would fall. Meanwhile naira would fall in value against the dollar, which means that the cost of subsidy in naira would rise. That means some more borrowing eventually.

4. And we have not even mentioned smuggling..

Something about smuggling...Northerners, SOutherners , everyone living acorss the border does it. That shoots our fuel to 99 million liters per day. COst rises...more borrowing to pay for subsidy

5. Also, because government would inevitably struggle to pay subsidy in full, there would be massive losses. Guess how the marketers and the refineries would recoup costs...that is where corruption and stealing comes in. Another way is in estimating subsidy costs for a year...since we do not know how much government would need to spend on subsidy for a given year, what stops some corrupt politican, including a president inserting his extra 2-3 trillion for himself and the boys?

Look...I want tinubu out. BUT...sometimes, one has to forget about politics, forget about who one supports, and look at some decisions from a neutral point of view. Yes, times are hard, but bringing back subsidy would force our debt to imaginably high levels.

Streetinvestor2:
You just wrote ur usual lengthy trash
Subsidy happens in different ways. Atiku only said he will adopt a template of selling a particular quentity of crude to refineries in Nigerian at low cost so that the refined products will land at domestic consumers at low cost. The major thing is to determine the actual consumption in nigeria to equity the crude for it and manage the borders for bad elements to take it out.

How is is rocket science to achieve. This is how u claimed tertiary education can not be Subsidised when many other countries are doing it.

Was thr no time we allocated a particular crude quantity for Nigerians purposes. Why won't it be cheaper now that we don't need to pay the cost associated with taking the crude outside and bringing back refined products.

You drug baron and his few partners are the only ones benefiting from the removal which was not what we asked for then.

Why are we not seeing the cng mass transit they promised everywhere after 3 yrs

Even the NELFUND they claimed it was being funded from it is lie.

They are now after unclaimed dividend from investors when the money is suppose to be returned to the companies. The took 70% of banks dollar gain sometimes ago

. The quentity of domestic fuel they claim we consum is fraud. When Dangote started his refinery we did consumer that much .it was in the range of 30million

Streetinvestor2:
You post is based on assumptions. When Dangote Refinery came on board and was doing like 50% capacity. Nigerian was consuming like 30 million litters

This other figures are just bloated. And it is left for Atiku to decide what percentage of subsidy he was going to implement. He didn't tell you he will seel the fuel at #200.He can decide to do 50% or any percentage when true cost is determined

Can you in all honesty tell me the benefit of the 79% of Nigerians who fall into poverty and hunger bracket is benefiting from the removal even as I supported it initially.

Policies are made for the living and not dead

They say they are removing subsidy for power next yr.They have removed for education and health services. So what is left for the low and middle class Nigerians

Dogalmighty17:
Fun fact. Japan has subsidised the petrol consumption of its citizens with over 650 million dollars this year already. Donald Trump is steadily drawing from the US crude oil strategic petroleum reserve just to keep the price of gas low. China has been doing same as well.

Full scale adoption of neo-liberal economic policies like Nigeria has done is mind-blowingly stupid.