₦airaland Forum

randomperson:
- No I didn't admit the existence of God. U seem to assume that God is always equal to creator of the universe. But that's a presumption without any basis in either science or philosophy. If I create a robot today which can do basically all things a human can do, does that make me God? No, that simply makes me a creator. If you are claiming the being that created the universe is god, then u have to show the logical or scientific basis for equating creator with god. Because, if we are simply assuming, I can as well assume that we were created by a super intelligent alien who is not god...

KingEbukasBlog:
God : The extremely powerful uncaused necessarily existing non-contingent non physical immaterial eternal being who created the universe and everything in it .

Exist : to be real or to have actual being

God exists : An extremely powerful uncaused necessarily existing non-contingent non physical immaterial eternal being who created the universe and everything in it is real .

KingEbukasBlog:
Singularity before expansion . Galaxies have been observed to be moving steadily apart from each other . That means they were closer to each other before in the past .

The best explanation for this is : take a balloon and glue buttons to the balloon . Then fill the balloon with air . You'd observe the higher the volume of air the greater the distance between the buttons . Then release the air slowly from the balloon , you'd see that the distance between the buttons decreases .

In reality the continuous contraction will lead to a single point or singularity . But this singularity isn't a physical affair or state . It is a mathematical idealization

Everything in the universe began to exist at some point because of the law of causality . That's why the argument states that

1. Whatever begins to exist must have a cause

2.The universe began to exist

3. Therefore the universe has a cause

There are possible causes

a. God - an uncaused cause

b. Abstract objects

Abstract objects have no beginnings and they exist necessarily. But these abstract objects are causally impotent - they do not cause anything . So we are left with a maximally great being - God - who evidently has the ability to cause the universe to exist approx 14 billion years ago .

I don't think you understand the argument . As far as we can see that objective moral values and duties exist therefore God exists - that is , no matter where we come from we can agree that to show , love , kindness , compassion , justice , even forgiveness are good moral values . And this makes it objective . Therefore , God exists .

This has to be expounded .

1. Fine Tuning cannot come by chance : There is possibility that life permitting universe just popped out into existence by chance .

2. Fine tuning cannot come by physical necessity : Since these constants and quantities are not determined by the laws of nature then there's no reason or evidence to suggest that fine tuning is necessary

3. Fine tuning can come by design alone

The fine tuning of the universe is the proposition that the conditions that allow life in the Universe can only occur when certain universal fundamental physical constants and quantities

Let me give three examples

1. Higgs vacuum expectation value =246.2Gev

2. Electro magnetism coupling constant = 0.00729

3.Cosmological constant = 2.3 x(10)^-3 e(v)^4

Now if these numbers should be altered by a hair's breath then physical interactive life of any kind will not exist anywhere

Take for example

Expansion rate of the universe : (4πG)/3(p+3p) + ^/3

Now if the cosmological constant (^) is changed by even 1 part in 10^120 , this would cause the universe to expand too quickly or too slowly . In either case , the universe would be life prohibiting . Exciting right ?

Even Stephen Hawking admitted : "The remarkable fact is that the values of these numbers have been very finely adjusted to make possible the development of life."

A very logical conclusion is that the universe was designed to be life permitting .

There here's the question if it is possible then the universe could not have existed , then why does it exist ?

dalaman:
Too much meaningless verbiage. If the universe was designed to be life permitting then why is it that most part of the universe will immediately destroy life? So far only the earth as we know permits life. Most part of the universe is made of matter that will immediately destroy life. In fact life can not survive in space. If you leave the earth into space without special gadgets, you'll die immediately. Most part of the universe does not permit life to exist so far the only part of the universe that we know that permits life is so insignificant in the scheme of things. Take away our planet and the universe will not notice anything at all.

If the universe is designed to be life permitting then most parts of the universe will support life, so far only an insignificant part of the universe permits life while all other parts that we know terminates life immediately.

KingEbukasBlog:
Only about 4 percent of the universe has been observed or is observable and you are here saying most of the universe does not support life .

Like I said "...if these numbers should be altered by a hair's breath then physical interactive life of any kind will not exist anywhere .

That means if these numbers are to be altered , life will not even exist on earth or any part of the universe .

dalaman:
In the 4 percent that has been observed only about 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000 0000000000000000000000000000001 allows and permits life. Too in signification be considered as anything of value. The universe isn't design to be life permitting because majority of the universe destroys life. Life as we know it will be automatically terminates in most parts of the observable universe.

randomperson:
What about the Christians becoming Muslims... Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, u know

dalaman:
In the 4 percent that has been observed only about 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000 0000000000000000000000000000001 allows and permits life. Too in signification be considered as anything of value. The universe isn't design to be life permitting because majority of the universe destroys life. Life as we know it will be automatically terminates in most parts of the observable universe.

dalaman:
In the 4 percent that has been observed only about 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000 0000000000000000000000000000001 allows and permits life. Too in signification be considered as anything of value. The universe isn't design to be life permitting because majority of the universe destroys life. Life as we know it will be automatically terminates in most parts of the observable universe.

felixomor:
So u still ran away?
Even after I answered your question abi?

Ranchhoddas:
Mtchew.

---

Na wetin I ask you be this?

dalaman:
The universe began to exist has not been established. It is NOT a scientific fact. Allen Guth when asked if the universe is eternal said it is possible. The universe is energy and energy can neither be created nor destroyed. We have not objectively observed the universe coming from nothing and having a begining. We have the big bang model but that it self has so many holes. There is no scientific consensus on the universe having a begining from nothing. It has NOT been established.

dalaman:
The universe began to exist has not been established. It is NOT a scientific fact.

OLAADEGBU:
Even Bill Gates believes in God. So you are on your own (O.Y.O).

dalaman:
How do you go from saying objective moral values existing to saying that God exist? We do not all agree to show love, kindness and compassion the same way. Love, kindness and compassion are all subjective because we express them differently. Some societies believe that showing love to your enemies is wrong as such your enemies must be destroyed. Failure to destroy your enemies is a criminal offence. Other societies believe that forgiving people for violating laws is wrong as such those those that violate laws must be punished.

But that aside. Do you believe that the sharia law as revealed by God is objective since it advocates for justice, fairness, love, orderly conduct, kindness and compassion? Answer the questionand stop running away from it. Is the sharia law objectivesince it shows Gods character?

OLAADEGBU:
Even Bill Gates believes in God. So you are on your own (O.Y.O).

Ranchhoddas:
You know you've lost so you resort to foolish red herrings. Alert me when he starts attending Deeper Life.

DoctorAlien:
THE IMPOSSIBILITY OF AN INFINITE REGRESS IN TIME PRECLUDES AN ETERNAL UNIVERSE

If we are to assume that the universe never began to exist:

1. The universe has always been.

2. Therefore it is infinitely old.

3. Therefore an infinite amount of time has elapsed before today.

4. But day infinity of the universe couldn't have been reached(since any day you choose to call day infinity has an infinite number of days stretching behind it, and the universe has to pass those days before it gets to day infinity, just as we have to pass through today before we get to tomorrow).

5. The day after day infinity couldn't have been reached either. Neither could the day after that.

6. Therefore today couldn't have been reached.

7. But today has been reached.

8. Therefore the process of reaching it was not infinite.

9. Therefore the universe began to exist.

OLAADEGBU:
I thought you atheists use Bill Gate as an poster, no? Whatever the case God is waiting for you.

OLAADEGBU:
I thought you atheists use Bill Gate as an poster, no? Whatever the case God is waiting for you.

KingEbukasBlog:


What in God's great name did I just read ?

Wawu

Before I started this thread I was asked to define God . Here's my definition :

DoctorAlien:
The second law of thermodynamics provides that the universe must have begun to exist.

randomperson:
Boy, you're not interested in an intellectual argument. Or maybe it's not lack of interest, maybe it's incapability. And you can't even say someone is running away.. No one runs away more than u and 4everGod...
Just yesterday, I asked u a simple question. If one account says Judas bought the Potter's field, how come another account says the chief priests bought it... A totally normal question...
U are trying to redefine atheism to suit your opinion.. So...

jimmyjenseng:
I also asked that clown whether it was the evangelists or the holy spirit who suffered from tritanopia since the writers couldn't reach a universal consensus on the colour of robe Jesus wore. What that clown was ignore my question. I'm beginning to perceive that some of these xtians folks are teens who don't worth a modicum of my time.

jimmyjenseng:
I also asked that clown whether it was the evangelists or the holy spirit who suffered from tritanopia since the writers couldn't reach a universal consensus on the colour of robe Jesus wore. What that clown was ignore my question. I'm beginning to perceive that some of these xtians folks are teens who don't worth a modicum of my time.

4everGod:
Kingebukasblog strangely i am not usually this quiet over something that intrigues me like the banter i have been observing here especially being the logical ones we are.

I am well rested now so let me now join in the fray.

randomperson:
Boy, you're not interested in an intellectual argument. Or maybe it's not lack of interest, maybe it's incapability. And you can't even say someone is running away.. No one runs away more than u and 4everGod...
Just yesterday, I asked u a simple question. If one account says Judas bought the Potter's field, how come another account says the chief priests bought it... A totally normal question...
U are trying to redefine atheism to suit your opinion.. So...

jimmyjenseng:
I also asked that clown whether it was the evangelists or the holy spirit who suffered from tritanopia since the writers couldn't reach a universal consensus on the colour of robe Jesus wore. What that clown was ignore my question. I'm beginning to perceive that some of these xtians folks are teens who don't worth a modicum of my time.

randomperson:
So your definition of God is what exactly?? Are u like an authority on the nature of God or have u proven that God has the nature u ascribed to him??

4everGod:
I have asked you to desist from mentioning my Moniker whether deliberately or as a typo. If you seem fixated on me then get over that addiction. Thank you.