We hear of rebellion in heaven, how Lucifer led an army of angels to revolt against God, infuriating God.

We hear of the garden of Eden, the perfect place that God prepared for man to live, but the plan was sabotaged by the talking snake which deceived man.

It made me begin to wonder about the possibility of God's salvation plan being sabotaged by something or someone, perhaps another of his beloved angels, maybe Michael planning another coup'.
It made me wonder about the possibility of the heaven plan degrading to another failed plan. And God is forced to come up with another plan.

If Divine plan can be sabotaged once, what stops it from happening again?

If angels can rebel, what stops it from happening again...

Is heaven really safe?

Let us discuss...





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Can you define Heaven.
We have several layers of heavens,
And don't equate it with a physical place.

Proudlyngwa:
Can you define Heaven.
We have several layers of heavens,
And don't equate it with a physical place.

CHAIIII. Tell me more. Several layers of heavens (Heaven 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 i guess) lolzz.

An insecure Christian Heaven. No thanks to Roman fairy tales that corrupted the Bible.

Proudlyngwa:
Can you define Heaven.
We have several layers of heavens,
And don't equate it with a physical place.

Heaven as many understand it including me, is the final destination of the faithful and righteous believers, where they meet solace, peace, and eternal life, free from all the suffering and challenges of life. A place where God and his angels reside and where the righteous are awaited.

This is the popular understanding of what heaven is.
Although various religious groups have their different versions.

So give us your opinion...

matrix600:
Heaven as many understand it including me, is the final destination of the faithful and righteous believers, where they meet solace, peace, and eternal life, free from all the suffering and challenges of life. A place where God and his angels reside and where the righteous are awaited.

This is the popular understanding of what heaven is.
Although various religious groups have their different versions.

So give us your opinion...

Heaven can be described as
1. The abode of the Almighty God to a physical man, bit as I said it can't be equated to a physical place because the laws of the physical world are completely different from that of the spiritual.
This means Heaven will be more of a situation than a place.
2. Heaven can also mean different levels of righteousness , which in correlation to 1 above, means different situations/environments/stages for different levels of the faithful.
3. I hope you know the bible equates heaven as a place of righteousness and also as a place for the righteous. What this simply means that this is a level believers should aspire to get to

Heaven in earlier analogies was referred to as a place above the sky, this is correct and also wrong based on how you view it
As for rebellion, I want you to know that any being blessed with free will can rebel, but all the forces in the world both spiritual and physical combined can never be equal to the source of the force, so any rebellion can never shift the creators original plan for us, which is physical perfection matt 5.48, gen 1.26. Delay yes, Change never. Fortunately God is not bound by the laws of physical time.

Proudlyngwa:


Heaven can be described as
1. The abode of the Almighty God to a physical man, bit as I said it can't be equated to a physical place because the laws of the physical world are completely different from that of the spiritual.
This means Heaven will be more of a situation than a place.
2. Heaven can also mean different levels of righteousness , which in correlation to 1 above, means different situations/environments/stages for different levels of the faithful.
3. I hope you know the bible equates heaven as a place of righteousness and also as a place for the righteous. What this simply means that this is a level believers should aspire to get to

Heaven in earlier analogies was referred to as a place above the sky, this is correct and also wrong based on how you view it
As for rebellion, I want you to know that any being blessed with free will can rebel, but all the forces in the world both spiritual and physical combined can never be equal to the source of the force, so any rebellion can never shift the creators original plan for us, which is physical perfection matt 5.48, gen 1.26. Delay yes, Change never. Fortunately God is not bound by the laws of physical time.

The fact that we're not in the garden of Eden is obvious enough to know that something went wrong, or are you saying it was god's original plan to have Adam and Eve kicked out of the Eden?

About rebellion, if there's still freewill in heaven then there's also the possibility of another rebellion, after all it happened before.

matrix600:
The fact that we're not in the garden of Eden is obvious enough to know that something went wrong, or are you saying it was god's original plan to have Adam and Eve kicked out of the Eden?

About rebellion, if there's still freewill in heaven then there's also the possibility of another rebellion, after all it happened before.

The garden of eden is metamorphical, it was never Gods plan to have Adam and Eve leave such state, Outside the death of Christ, I think that was the most painful thing to happen to the Father.
Yes there is possibility of rebellion till now, but Gods love conquereth all.

This is a very good question OP

Proudlyngwa:

The garden of eden is metamorphical, it was never Gods plan to have Adam and Eve leave such state, Outside the death of Christ, I think that was the most painful thing to happen to the Father.
Yes there is possibility of rebellion till now, but Gods love conquereth all.

I think you're seriously and dishonestly dodging the question

Who created Satan?

do the angels have freewill?

will there be freewill in heaven when good Christians go there?

hopefulLandlord:


I think you're seriously and dishonestly dodging the question

Who created Satan?

do the angels have freewill?

will there be freewill in heaven when good Christians go there?

Can you kindly quote where I dodged the question dishonestly, why not follow the discuss from the very start.

God created Lucifer who became Satan due to his pride.
Angels have freewill, they also have desire.

When Christians die will they have freewill in heaven, there is nothing like religion in heaven. The human spirit will still have desire and freewill of what to do.

Our ultimate desire is to be one with God and that is what a good spirit will strive to aspire

Proudlyngwa:

Can you kindly quote where I dodged the question dishonestly, why not follow the discuss from the very start.

God created Lucifer who became Satan due to his pride.
Angels have freewill, they also have desire.

When Christians die will they have freewill in heaven, there is nothing like religion in heaven. The human spirit will still have desire and freewill of what to do.

Our ultimate desire is to be one with God and that is what a good spirit will strive to aspire

can the angels and those that'll go to heaven chose to do bad?

Heaven is a place of sentient peace, good health, joy, happiness that is not everlasting but last for a while like earth it's also inhabited by people whose good act and knowledge are of great merit. moreover heaven's inhabitants still have the free will of doing good or evil, when they do evil and there time expires in the heavenly realm they fall to a lesser world repeating the cycle.

akindlesfarm:
Heaven is a place of sentient peace, good health, joy, happiness that is not everlasting but last for a while like earth it's also inhabited by people whose good act and knowledge are of great merit. moreover heaven's inhabitants still have the free will of doing good or evil, when they do evil and there time expires in the heavenly realm they fall to a lesser world repeating the cycle.

may I ask for the source of this information?

hopefulLandlord:


can the angels and those that'll go to heaven chose to do bad?

Angels yes.
Human spirits still have desire even after death,
The ultimate aim is to achieve oneness with God.
And yes it is far far tougher in the spiritual world.

Proudlyngwa:
Angels yes. Human spirits still have desire even after death, The ultimate aim is to achieve oneness with God. And yes it is far far tougher in the spiritual world.

are you now agreeing that Heaven is NOT safe?

hopefulLandlord:

may I ask for the source of this information?

that is the problem with you guys looking for physical proofs to spiritual things.
It doesn't work that way.

Proudlyngwa:
that is the problem with you guys looking for physical proofs to spiritual things.
It doesn't work that way.

lol, he made claims and I'm only asking for his source or are you saying any claim should be made to stand without scrutiny? that leads to absurd results, don't you think?

hopefulLandlord:


Who created Satan?

do the angels have freewill?

God created Satan. He is not an angel but part of the Jinnskind(Wrongly call demons)
They were created of smokeless fire and have freewill like mankind.

Angels have no freewill.

hopefulLandlord:

may I ask for the source of this information?

it what we experience in life, some living a heavenly life while others living a hellish but in as much as we suffer or enjoy we must remember that it just for a while. The rationale behind my opinion is that we deserve all that life gives to us because life is fair but we might not know that.

hopefulLandlord:


are you now agreeing that Heaven is NOT safe?

Heaven is very safe, all force in the world can never be equal to that of God, which is supreme love.

hopefulLandlord:


lol, he made claims and I'm only asking for his source or are you saying any claim should be made to stand without scrutiny? that leads to absurd results, don't you think?

You can't scrutinise spirituality with physicality

If it is the question of security, I would advice you check out Satan's Luxury suites in hell

We have upgraded hell's facilities to suit your needs with cooling systems, 24 hour cctv and helicopter surveillance, orgy clubs, good weed, best alcohol, parties daily, opportunity to relate with millions of wise men who couldn't make heaven simply because they did not believe in sky daddy etc

Heaven is boring and their power supply is operated by NEPA!

Choose wisely

PM me to order for your own luxury suites today!

Proudlyngwa:
that is the problem with you guys looking for physical proofs to spiritual things.
It doesn't work that way.

How the hell do you know about "spiritual" things if not by imagining them? So we should take your imaginations for facts?

benzics:

How the hell do you know about "spiritual" things if not by imagining them? So we should take your imaginations for facts?

The Holy Bible was written through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
Do you think God the father don't still inspire people today.
What you should know is some message/revelations are for one person, some for group of people, some for a certain age and some for totality.

Proudlyngwa:


The Holy Bible was written through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
Do you think God the father don't still inspire people today.
What you should know is some message/revelations are for one person, some for group of people, some for a certain age and some for totality.

Lol, so how did you come to the conclusion that the holy spirit inspired the writers of the bible, because you were told? And we should take your word for it?

benzics:

Lol, so how did you come to the conclusion that the holy spirit inspired the writers of the bible, because you were told? And we should take your word for it?

Because I know the Bible is true
I know the Bible is true because what it says is true.
I know what it says is true because I have witnessed and benefitted from its amazing powers.

Proudlyngwa:


Because I know the Bible is true
I know the Bible is true because what it says is true.
I know what it says is true because I have witnessed and benefitted from its amazing powers.

Extreme circular reasoning.

The bible is true because it says it's true.

Tom Riddle is Lord Voldermot because he said so in Harry Potter...

You see how circular this is

SirWere:
Extreme circular reasoning.

The bible is true because it says it's true.

Tom Riddle is Lord Voldermot because he said so in Harry Potter...

You see how circular this is

Proudlyngwa:


Because I know the Bible is true
I know the Bible is true because what it says is true.
I know what it says is true because I have witnessed and benefitted from its amazing powers.

Kindly re read slowly

Proudlyngwa:

Kindly re read slowly

reminds me of this meme

hopefulLandlord:


reminds me of this meme

did u miss where I said I believe it to be true because I have witnessed its amazing powers or you just chose to ignore that.