₦airaland Forum

rvp2018:
Sometimes stats from unreliable sources like Yemi Kale 500B Nigerian GDP can lie. Pictures, Videos and such cannot lie. I have gone to Youtube for a few Accra and Kumasi shots - and it's underwhelming. Here you're claiming it's a city equal to Nairobi. What do Accra people do for a living - wait for remittance from abroad?

The funny part of your argument is the fact that the economic structure of Ghana Kenya and Tanzania are not the same.

whiles the structure in east african countries are formal,

In Ghana, The economy is 80% informal meaning they dont require formal institutionalised commercial property space which is under supplied.
They put up their own office spaces than rent from commercial property providers.

rvp2018:
Sometimes stats from unreliable sources like Yemi Kale 500B Nigerian GDP can lie. Pictures, Videos and such cannot lie. I have gone to Youtube for a few Accra and Kumasi shots - and it's underwhelming. Here you're claiming it's a city equal to Nairobi. What do Accra people do for a living - wait for remittance from abroad?

nobody uses picture and video without statistical data for scientific evidence. it is called pseudoscience. Talking about remittance abroad, Ghana with its 30 million population size only fall behind Nigeria and Ethiopia in sub Saharan African. Ghanaian are both in former and informer sector abroad.

I have never been to Nairobi so how will I know ? i can only argue on what kind of opportunities abounded for both citizens as it is reported by numerous statistics in each country. As it stands,there is high chances of making more money in accra than Nairobi. this is more important to me than video or pics....

Shma:
Not only sevens even women's 15s.

The leading African women's fifteens rugby teams are:

15 South Africa

25 Kenya

34 Zambia

40 Namibia

42 Botswana

43 Madagascar

44 Zimbabwe

46 Uganda

African News Agency (ANA)
What can you say about this

Lets celebrate

rvp2018:
Straw man childish arguments. Of course South africa rugby is on another level - but Kenya is doing better than many countries in Rugby - Kenya 7s is very good.

Main Cup winners at the 2016 Singapore Sevens
Main cup finalists at the
2009 Adelaide Sevens
2013 Wellington Sevens
2018 Canada Sevens
2018 Hong Kong Sevens

I know im just fooling around lol

This doesn't make sense. You should question the stats your gov is dolling out. Even China did not claim that level of urbanization. Even now I doubt China has reached 50% urbanization. The economy start from farming rural communities - then informal in urban cities supported by tiny formal sector - and finally formal urban or cities.

I am not sure how those 4.5M people are surviving in Accra -

Just30:
The funny part of your argument is the fact that the economic structure of Ghana Kenya and Tanzania are not the same.

whiles the structure in east african countries are formal,

In Ghana, The economy is 80% informal meaning they dont require formal institutionalised commercial property space which is under supplied.
They put up their own office spaces than rent from commercial property providers.

You don't need statistics to tell that a country is developed or not. You just need your naked eyes. Economic development is not something you can hide in books.

vaxx2:
nobody uses picture and video without statistical data for scientific evidence. it is called pseudoscience. Talking about remittance abroad, Ghana with its 30 million population size only fall behind Nigeria and Ethiopia in sub Saharan African. Ghanaian are both in former and informer sector abroad.

I have never been to Nairobi so how will I know ? i can only argue on what kind of opportunities abounded for both citizens as it is reported by numerous statistics in each country. As it stands,there is high chances of making more money in accra than Nairobi. this is more important to me than video or pics....

Kazikazi:
You are very wrong on Tz electric sgr.
Electric sgr don't consume a lot of power.Its usually about 200 MW only.So can anyone suggest we can't have 200 MW?
Currently Tz has 1700mw. Yes its small.But most big industries in Tz use gas.I mean underground piped gas to power industries. Dangote cement plant in mtwara is one of big manufacturers who uses underground piped gas. That technology I never saw even in SA.In east Africa,no country uses underground piped gas but only Tz.So on paper written by many folks who lack engineering knowledge, they think Tz uses only 1700mw! They don't count power generated through a modern techniques of underground piping.For them,energy means electricity only! Underground piped gas is a complex stuff which they cant grasp. And that is not all,we have a big under construction hydo dam(2115mw), will be complete on 2022.Still we have others under construction like mbeya coal to power project(600mw),gas plant(kinyerezi,I,II,III,IV) and other small projects.The gov targets to have 10,000 mw by 2025.So,there is no need to worry about sufficient power!

Again u mentioned sgr as cosmetic stuff.Not true.
Tanzania isn't a small nation.Just think a distance between two largest cities in Tz,Dar to Mwanza is about 1200 kms.If one uses a bus,he will arrive a next day! There are many speed restrictions on a way.The distance from Dar to Bukoba is about 1400 kms. These are cities on shores of lake Victoria which need speed rail for simplifying Transportation.Again our electric sgr will go as far as Kigali Rwanda to Goma in DRC. All those areas has enough population to need a fast train,and again,they are far from Dar.
The other thing is the costs.Its worldwide known electric trains are cheaper to run than diesel.Many mining products, or agricultural goods which were far from the port of Dar will be competitive in a world market.We have huge reserves of minerals which need a cheap transportation to the port.We are in industrialization program which we need to support that with cheaper,efficient and fast transportation. Can all those benefits equates to a cosmetic project? The Germany,our formal colonial power built the similar railway in 1905,but back then that wasn't seen as cosmetic. Today,a century later,we are building a similar,but more modified railway which connects to more cities and neighboring nations.Can we call that cosmetic? Why can't we call cosmetic when Germans did the same 114 years back?

Again,u shouldn't say we can't afford traveling on electric trains.Just know,electric trains will be cheaper than a bus or planes between those big cities.It will be cheaper hauling stuff by electric train than lorries.

The issue of your people going to SA and other nations.You know very well no Japanese is going to seek employment or mending shoes in a street corner in SA.Although not all your people are doing same thing.But the point is,when u see many of African graduates are unemployed back home,if many goes away seeking employment, That shows there are problems either in education system, or there are problems in the economy, or there are problems in both sectors. But us Africans love lies.We would rather praise ourselves as educated(on paper) than face out two big failures in economy and education

You are making noise

In Ghana, Almost all the large energy consumers were forced to produce their own power when Ghana went into an energy crisis in 2014
Almost all the mining companies built their own power generation facilities and became independent power producers.

rvp2018:
You don't need statistics to tell that a country is developed or not. You just need your naked eyes

Its funny your unclad eyes tells you Tanzania comes even close to the level of development of Ghana

Kazikazi:
You are very wrong on Tz electric sgr.
Electric sgr don't consume a lot of power.Its usually about 200 MW only.So can anyone suggest we can't have 200 MW?
Currently Tz has 1700mw. Yes its small.But most big industries in Tz use gas.I mean underground piped gas to power industries. Dangote cement plant in mtwara is one of big manufacturers who uses underground piped gas. That technology I never saw even in SA.In east Africa,no country uses underground piped gas but only Tz.So on paper written by many folks who lack engineering knowledge, they think Tz uses only 1700mw! They don't count power generated through a modern techniques of underground piping.For them,energy means electricity only! Underground piped gas is a complex stuff which they cant grasp. And that is not all,we have a big under construction hydo dam(2115mw), will be complete on 2022.Still we have others under construction like mbeya coal to power project(600mw),gas plant(kinyerezi,I,II,III,IV) and other small projects.The gov targets to have 10,000 mw by 2025.So,there is no need to worry about sufficient power!

Again u mentioned sgr as cosmetic stuff.Not true.
Tanzania isn't a small nation.Just think a distance between two largest cities in Tz,Dar to Mwanza is about 1200 kms.If one uses a bus,he will arrive a next day! There are many speed restrictions on a way.The distance from Dar to Bukoba is about 1400 kms. These are cities on shores of lake Victoria which need speed rail for simplifying Transportation.Again our electric sgr will go as far as Kigali Rwanda to Goma in DRC. All those areas has enough population to need a fast train,and again,they are far from Dar.
The other thing is the costs.Its worldwide known electric trains are cheaper to run than diesel.Many mining products, or agricultural goods which were far from the port of Dar will be competitive in a world market.We have huge reserves of minerals which need a cheap transportation to the port.We are in industrialization program which we need to support that with cheaper,efficient and fast transportation. Can all those benefits equates to a cosmetic project? The Germany,our formal colonial power built the similar railway in 1905,but back then that wasn't seen as cosmetic. Today,a century later,we are building a similar,but more modified railway which connects to more cities and neighboring nations.Can we call that cosmetic? Why can't we call cosmetic when Germans did the same 114 years back?

Again,u shouldn't say we can't afford traveling on electric trains.Just know,electric trains will be cheaper than a bus or planes between those big cities.It will be cheaper hauling stuff by electric train than lorries.

The issue of your people going to SA and other nations.You know very well no Japanese is going to seek employment or mending shoes in a street corner in SA.Although not all your people are doing same thing.But the point is,when u see many of African graduates are unemployed back home,if many goes away seeking employment, That shows there are problems either in education system, or there are problems in the economy, or there are problems in both sectors. But us Africans love lies.We would rather praise ourselves as educated(on paper) than face out two big failures in economy and education

I love the point you rose @bolded......your entire write up was fantastic..

rvp2018:
This doesn't make sense. You should question the stats your gov is dolling out. Even China did not claim that level of urbanization. Even now I doubt China has reached 50% urbanization. The economy start from farming rural communities - then informal in urban cities supported by tiny formal sector - and finally formal urban or cities.

I am not sure how those 4.5M people are surviving in Accra -

Ghana economy is fully driven by informal sector. Ghana isn't kenya or Tanzania. the reason I sometimes support Nigeria Is that the economy is driven mainly by informal sector. Tanzania and kenya economy will break trying that... in west africa , people mostly survived on their own without much of goverment intervention.

I haven't said that. Tanzania is poor. I am also starting to question the numbers Ghana are dishing out. They are not mutually exclusive.

Just30:
Its funny your unclad eyes tells you Tanzania comes even close to the level of development of Ghana

Kazikazi:
Yes I asked about Ghana with higher hdi and per capita than Tz,isn't seen developed than Tz.Or,Dar looks more developed than Accra.Why so?
A quick look at Dar properties will reveal that the real estate in Dar is more valuable than Accra! Even transportation in general, Tz looks better than Ghana.I don't mention some stuff like hotels and other little thing.The question I keep on asking is..
A country which has higher hdi,higher per capita income,larger middle class,etc, shouldn't that country need more modern offices,more modern transport,more sport and recreation facilities? Or better hospitals? Or far better residential homes? After all, middle class folks wants these stuff!

Or I can put this way..
India has less per capita than SA. And its true,SA looks more developed than India.That is due to percentage of middle class between two nations.Middle class dudes in SA buys properties, wants golf courses,wants better hospitals,want better transportation etc.Its a norm worldwide.The higher u earn,the more u will acquire better stuff

Honestly I get what you are saying about Accra real estate market..trust me they equally do but it's just a display of patriotism....Real estate sector drives urbanisation..

Can you break this for me sector wise? The formal economy that is for sure is mining (with lots of informal minners) and now oil industry. Cocoa farming is also not in doubt. Now what you mean by informal sector is what retail & wholesaling? transport? finance & inter-mediation? hotel & tourism? What kind of informal economy are we talking about.

vaxx2:
Ghana economy is fully driven by informal sector. Ghana isn't kenya or Tanzania. the reason I sometimes support Nigeria Is that the economy is driven mainly by informal sector. Tanzania and kenya economy will break trying that... in west africa , people mostly survived on their own without much of goverment intervention.

Just30:
You are making noise

In Ghana, Almost all the large energy consumers were forced to produce their own power when Ghana went into an energy crisis in 2014
Almost all the mining companies built their own power generation facilities and became independent power producers.

it is even more funny when he said 200 megawatt aren't much for the electric train . I doubt he knows how much Tz household will have benefit from that capacity ?

rvp2018:
1) I guess my point is still valid - that household electricity consumption per capita - is being distorted by minning - just like you find in South Africa - which has one world highest electricity consumption per capita.

2) You're making it worse - because if Accra had 4m population - then clearly something is wrong with either the city or the stats - coz I have checked couple of pics and videos - and Accra doesn't look like a city of 1m people.

3) Adventure thanks to wealthy Ghanians - would reflect in out-bound tourism. This is more economic refugees. It's hardly anything to be proud of.As you plead with slaves that left Ghana 500yrs ago to return - you need to stop current Ghanians from leaving - mostly forever - abroad. You only see such in war torn countries like Syria, Somalia, Ethiopia, etc. This is called brain and resource drain.

You talk as if kenyans are different...US citizen are in China and ice versa...Some Asaians live in Europe and vice versa..

rvp2018:
This doesn't make sense. You should question the stats your gov is dolling out. Even China did not claim that level of urbanization. Even now I doubt China has reached 50% urbanization. The economy start from farming rural communities - then informal in urban cities supported by tiny formal sector - and finally formal urban or cities.

I am not sure how those 4.5M people are surviving in Accra -

The stats are highly credible and reliable

that is why we can do proper planning along the stats.

China urbanization has surpassed 50% , just do your proper research.

the level of urbanization in Ghana has grown beyond what was expected and causing huge drain on government resources because of it ever expanding nature.


How do you even say Tanzania is more urbanized than Ghana when the consumption of cement tells you otherwise.?

I doubt. Ghana and Nigeria have claimed since late 80s and 90s that their urbanization is 50% - I think the figure has hardly changed. The same with electricity access - although Ghana is now racing toward universal access.

China recently got to 50% urbanization. India urbanization is maybe around 35% now.

Maybe their is Ghana and Nigeria competition to produce dodgy stats.

Just30:
The stats are highly credible and reliable

that is why we can do proper planning along the stats.

China urbanization has surpassed 50% , just do your proper research.

the level of urbanization in Ghana has grown beyond what was expected and causing huge drain on government resources because of it ever expanding nature.


How do you even say Tanzania is more urbanized than Ghana when the consumption of cement tells you otherwise.?

samorobo:
Honestly I get what you are saying about Accra real estate market..trust me they equally do but it's just a display of patriotism....Real estate sector drives urbanisation ..

stop typing nonsense. urbanisation are driven by opportunities not real estates. real estates comes later. how many estate do you see springing up in oshodi or ikorodu compare to island where minority of lagosian live?

Just30:
Accra is ever-expanding than building high.
No one wants to live in an apartment.
Single owned homes with backyards is an ish here

so you will have farmlands like Ayimensah , Dodowa becoming highly residential areas than apartments in the centre of Accra going up

this kind of development is both good and bad at the same time for the government.

I think you are speaking for yourself rather than the rest gh citizens....Look I am not telling you to build skyscraper or high rise , if you can make your mid rise building look so sophisticated and ultra modern then I am super fine with it...for instance no serious multi national will want their business in Accra because you lack grade A office spaces for such companies to operate......
Citizens building randomly is an error and it's happens even here in Nigeria...if such privileges should be granted to citizens let the govt create a body that monitors the standard of buildings you are putting up...

rvp2018:
You don't need statistics to tell that a country is developed or not. You just need your naked eyes. Economic development is not something you can hide in books.

The fact remain , investors don't look at pics or videos before migrating but data and volume of buisness opportunities.... Nairobi and Darussalam are NOTHING comparable to Accra when it comes to economy opportunities.

vaxx2:
it is even more funny when he said 200 megawatt aren't much for the electric train . I doubt he knows how much RD household will have benefit from that capacity ?

i wonder if he knows how much it cost to produce 200MW of electricity from a thermal unit.
How much the sgr needs to be charging and how much passengers it needs to carry for them to break even

vaxx2:
stop typing nonsense. urbanisation are driven by opportunities not real estates. real estates comes later. how many estate do you see springing up in oshodi or ikorodu compare to island where minority of lagosian live?

Explain further...By opportunities do you mean job opportunities in the formal sector?

samorobo:
I think you are speaking for yourself rather than the rest gh citizens....Look I am not telling you to build skyscraper or high rise , if you can make your mid rise building look so sophisticated and ultra modern then I am super fine with it...for instance no serious multi national will want their business in Accra because you lack grade A office spaces for such companies to operate......
Citizens building randomly is an error and it's happens even here in Nigeria...if such privileges should be granted to citizens let the govt create a body that monitors the standard of buildings you are putting up...

why are you lying.... what do you understand by grade A office space, can you tell me what i dont know?

And for your info, international companies are now sighting Accra as a choosing spot.

for building of office and space, there is Accra metropolitan assembly in charge of that. there are residential area you can just spring up anything and there is economic enviroment where citizens are allowed to come up with theor choice of lifestyle temporarily since goverment understand the economy impact it will create making a whole nation looking like Dubai when Ghana hasn't getting there yet .

Maybe an investor looking for natural resources will consider Accra before Nairobi or Dar Slum. Otherwise an investor looking at other sectors of economy from real estate, finance, tech, industries, hotels, social amenities, transport, name it - Nairobi is so much ahead of any city in Ghana there is no point doing a comparison. Nairobi is already ahead of Lagos (despite the pop) - and is starting to compare with South African cities.

Something is wrong with Ghana statistics. If I have time - I can tell you - it easy to know if data has been cooked. You can ask Nigerians how we debunked most of their doggy stats. It easy to cross-reference with easily available international data that are outside your stats body.

vaxx2:
The fact remain , investors don't look at pics or videos before migrating but data and volume of buisness opportunities.... Nairobi and Darussalam are NOTHING comparable to Accra when it comes to economy opportunities.

samorobo:
Explain further...By opportunities do you mean job opportunities in the formal sector?

There is high opportunities in informal sector in Nigeria than formal sector. over 65 percent of NIGERIA GDP is driven by informal sector, informal employs the largest pool of labour in Nigeria. majority of informal sector jobs are not located in the island , they are right there at mainland ......

Just30:
Accra population are into the informal economy
One that does not need and office to thrive.

In most West African countries, the informal economy is bigger than the formal and known economy.
Trying to put Tanzania on this level will break its back.


putting up empty or half full office blocks is not real development

Tanzania has a huge informal sector than Ghana probably.But still our few middle class need better homes and better offices.Always,demand will bring supply.As u can google,Dar looks better than Accra. Our second largest city with a population of less than a million,Mwanza city( aka rock city) still looks better than Kumasi.
The question remain,where are Ghana's middle income dudes working from? Where are their offices and homes?
I should admit,I was shocked when I googled " Kumasi city". May be what I saw are photos of over 30 years back

rvp2018:
Maybe an investor looking for natural resources will consider Accra before Nairobi or Dar Slum. Otherwise an investor looking at other sectors of economy from real estate, finance, tech, industries, hotels, social amenities, transport, name it - Nairobi is so much ahead of any city in Ghana there is no point doing a comparison. Nairobi is already ahead of Lagos (despite the pop) - and is starting to compare with South African cities.

Something is wrong with Ghana statistics. If I have time - I can tell you - it easy to know if data has been cooked. You can ask Nigerians how we debunked most of their doggy stats. It easy to cross-reference with easily available international data that are outside your stats body.

Sometimes you have brain.Ghana stats are questionable.African stats.I mean,with that huge stated middle class,why can't we see and witness a property boom?

vaxx2:
The fact remain , investors don't look at pics or videos before migrating but data and volume of buisness opportunities.... Nairobi and Darussalam are NOTHING comparable to Accra when it comes to economy opportunities.

how does he even compare urbanization in Ghana with 30 million people and consumes 10 million metric tonnes of cement to Tanzania with 57 million people and consumes 7 million metric tonnes of cement ?

rvp2018:
Maybe an investor looking for natural resources will consider Accra before Nairobi or Dar Slum. Otherwise an investor looking at other sectors of economy from real estate, finance, tech, industries, hotels, social amenities, transport, name it - Nairobi is so much ahead of any city in Ghana there is no point doing a comparison. Nairobi is already ahead of Lagos (despite the pop) - and is starting to compare with South African cities.

Something is wrong with Ghana statistics. If I have time - I can tell you - it easy to know if data has been cooked. You can ask Nigerians how we debunked most of their doggy stats. It easy to cross-reference with easily available international data that are outside your stats body.

Hahaha this boy is so funny ..he said they should ask us ...I can't laugh...

You make noise alot.....I advice vaxx to also investigate your GDP....your middle class is faulty..

Just30:
The stats are highly credible and reliable

that is why we can do proper planning along the stats.

China urbanization has surpassed 50% , just do your proper research.

the level of urbanization in Ghana has grown beyond what was expected and causing huge drain on government resources because of it ever expanding nature.


How do you even say Tanzania is more urbanized than Ghana when the consumption of cement tells you otherwise.?

How is Tanzania's cement consumption?

Real estate is offices, malls, hotels, social amenities,residential estates - and Ghana has a long way to go - for example in branded hotels - Nairobi I think has 20,000 branded hotel beds - the whole of Ghana has 2,000.

vaxx2:
why are you lying.... what do you understand by grade A office space, can you tell me what i dont know?

And for your info, international companies are now sighting Accra as a choosing spot.

for building of office and space, there Accra metropolitan assembly in charge of that. there are residential area you can just spring up anything and there is economic enviroment where citizens are allowed to come up with theor choice of lifestyle temporarily since goverment understand the economy impact it will create making a whole nation looking like Dubai when Ghana hasn't getting there yet .

Kazikazi:
Sometimes you have brain.Ghana stats are questionable.African stats.I mean,with that huge stated middle class,why can't we see and witness a property boom?

there is a property boom in Ghana

but that boom is not for apartments


Ghanaians stats are not questionable
because whiles those stats from government agencies are generated every 5to 10 years,

Those from private institutions like CDD and IMANI are generated every year or 2