I think I heard that satan was arrogant and tried
to overthrow God in heaven in a battle led by
arch angel against the demons.
Now what was jesus' role in that scenario? Was he
in existence then and what role did he play in the
battle and was he mentioned in that scenario
specifically?
When was the first biblical documentation of the
contact between satan and jesus? Was it at the
mountain during the 40 days prayer or in heaven
before then?
Over to the experts here.

gbadexy: I think I heard that satan was arrogant and tried
to overthrow God in heaven in a battle led by
arch angel against the demons.
Now what was jesus' role in that scenario? Was he
in existence then and what role did he play in the
battle and was he mentioned in that scenario
specifically?
When was the first biblical documentation of the
contact between satan and jesus? Was it at the
mountain during the 40 days prayer or in heaven
before then?
Over to the experts here.

Jesus was the LORD that gave the command "Satan You Are Banished From The Kingdom Of Light And Glory". That was Jesus' role. He is God whom satn rebelled against.

You lost ♍ƺ pal.
You mean jesus is the God satan rebelled against? And that eventually banished satan from heaven?

gbadexy: You lost ♍ƺ pal.
You mean jesus is the God satan rebelled against? And that eventually banished satan from heaven?

Is it too good to be true or what ever you think. Yes I tell you. Why you may ask. Let me take you to the scriptures and to open your eyes to see what you never new

God talked about the birth of Jesus long before you great grand parents were born. In Isaiah 9:6 " For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace" and Jesus said to the pharisees in John8:58 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I Am" compare his words with God's word to moses in Genesis 3:14 "And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: anms he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you"

THIS ARE NOT MY WORDS BUT OUR CREATOR WORDS THAT HAVE BEEN PRESERVED BY IS POWER. IF YOU HAVE ARGUEMENTS. PLEASE DO THAT WITH YOUR CREATOR,THE MIGHTY GOD. BUT IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS TO KNOW HOW YOU WILL ACCEPT JESUS, I WILL BE WILLING TO ANSWER YOU.

Was Lucifer also God's creation or was/is Lucifer God? The whole God/Satan debate has been lopsided. We have never heard from Satan himself. Every single story about the Devil has been told from one perspective. What about Lucifer's version of events?
Furthermore,in Isaiah 45-7 God states categorically,unequivocally & unambiguously;'I form the light & create darkness,i make peace & create evil. I the Lord do all these things'. So which is it? Are both God & Satan one & the same or do they work as a team taking the story of Job as our bench mark?

cold: Was Lucifer also God's creation or was/is Lucifer God? The whole God/Satan debate has been lopsided. We have never heard from Satan himself. Every single story about the Devil has been told from one perspective. What about Lucifer's version of events?
Furthermore,in Isaiah 45-7 God states categorically,unequivocally & unambiguously;'I form the light & create darkness,i make peace & create evil. I the Lord do all these things'. So which is it? Are both God & Satan one & the same or do they work as a team taking the story of Job as our bench mark?

God created Satan(formally known as lucifer). But satan rebelled against God. Of course,if you ask the Satan(the great deceiver) what he deed, he would tell "Hahn! What an unjust God Jehovah is. He judged me unjustly." Satan did not know that God could read thoughts, if he knew he would not have put his thoughts into action. Well, the devil will never tell you the truth just has he lied to the angels that fell with him. Please don't buy his story if you meet him. As for the scriptur "evil" is also translated as disasters. If God could cause a great flood in the days of Noah after warning the evil men to repent of their sins, will you call Him a wicked God. Of course, if those nephilims had lived, you can imaging what the world will look like. God, your creator, is not a God of evil. I can imaging how beautiful you would look if I see you. Will you call your God an evil God for creating you? Read the whole chapter and pray that God will explain every verse for you to know how great he is to keep you alive till now.

I must confess that the verses you quoted supports your claim, although one can easily get other verses too countering it.
Do we now say jesus is simply God's alter ego or what because I don't understand the concept of one same God with different personalities.
You are even confused also and can't distinguish one from the other when you claimed it was jesus satan rebelled against and banished him.
I'm a muslim and there is this slight complicated question on free will and destiny as we are made to believe anything either good or bad is what God has destined for us and we should take heart while also humans 'being' responsible for their action also!
Religion could be complicated with no clear logic though because God almighty must have known what satan would end up doing before creating it or what hitler would do before he was born and could simply have stopped their production.
Know that adam was borne without any parents and animated with God's breath(spirit)?
Also eve had only adam as father but no mother while jesus has a mother without father and animated with God's spirit (breath)?
Would that make adam and eve divine too? Is there a difference between spirit and breath of God and why didn't jesus say he was before adam, was he created much later and if so supporting that he wasn't in the scenario of satan's rebellion.

daviddext: God created Satan(formally known as lucifer). But satan rebelled against God. Of course,if you ask the Satan(the great deceiver) what he deed, he would tell "Hahn! What an unjust God Jehovah is. He judged me unjustly." Satan did not know that God could read thoughts, if he knew he would not have put his thoughts into action. Well, the devil will never tell you the truth just has he lied to the angels that fell with him. Please don't buy his story if you meet him. As for the scriptur "evil" is also translated as disasters. If God could cause a great flood in the days of Noah after warning the evil men to repent of their sins, will you call Him a wicked God. Of course, if those nephilims had lived, you can imaging what the world will look like. God, your creator, is not a God of evil. I can imaging how beautiful you would look if I see you. Will you call your God an evil God for creating you? Read the whole chapter and pray that God will explain every verse for you to know how great he is to keep you alive till now.

'The devil will never tell you the truth'.Huh!How do you know this?Oh let me guess,because your bible said so.Still boils down to the what I said earlier.Everything in the bible comes from a single perspective & does not give us a holistic view on issues.Isn't it interesting that the name 'God' isn't symbolic of something else,Satan isn't symbolic of something else but you had find a different meaning for evil.For the simple reason that it doesn't fit into your idea of the ideal God.
Now let us break this issue down properly & thoroughly, & determine who the good guy is here & who the fall guy is
Let us start with the name 'Jehovah'.“The LORD is a man of war: the JEHOVAH is his name.” ~ Bible, Exodus 15:3
In Hebrew, Je or Jeh or Jah means Lord or God [ref].
The suffix “hovah” has the meaning of “ruin, mischief.” (No. 1943 in Strong’s Hebrew Dictionary)
It is another form of ‘havvah’, which is translated “calamity, iniquity, mischief, mischievous (thing), naughtiness, naughty, noisome, perverse thing, substance, very wicked.” (No. 1942)
Put the two (Je + hovah) together and you get “God of ruin, mischief, calamity, perversion, and wickedness”. And don’t forget ‘noisome‘ – which means it stinks! From the foregoing,one is bound to ask; is Jehovah The God of Evil or Good?

The Wrathful God

“Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations also of the hills moved and were shaken, because he was wroth. There went up a smoke out of his nostrils and fire out of his mouth devoured: coals were kindled by it. He bowed the heavens also, and came down: and darkness was under his feet. And he rode upon a cherub, and did fly: yea, he did fly upon the wings of the wind. He made darkness his secret place; his pavilion round about him were dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.” (Psalms 18:7-11)
Let us consider that these verses describe an angry (wroth) being, spouting smoke and fire, whose secret place consisted of darkness. This devilish entity sounds like a description of Satan, but believe it or not, actually comes from the Bible as describing God.

God rejoices over death
“And it shall come to pass, that as the LORD rejoiced over you to do you good, and to multiply you; so the LORD will rejoice over you to destroy you, and to bring you to nought; and ye shall be plucked from off the land whither thou goest to possess it.” (Deuteronomy 28:63)

If the religious mind believes that God represents a loving God, then one must wonder about God, as described in the Bible, who would rejoice to destroy.God appears completely devoid of any wit or humor; a mental state that psychologists have observed in many schizophrenics.

I'm always befuddled at how many times this God orders the killing of innocent people even after the Ten Commandments said “Thou shall not kill”. For example, God kills 70,000 innocent people because David ordered a census of the people (1 Chronicles 21). God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value (Deuteronomy 3). He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city: men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses” (Joshua 6). In Judges 21, He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-Gilead, except for the virgin girls who were taken to be forcibly rap3d and married. When they wanted more virgins, God told them to hide alongside the road and when they saw a girl they liked, kidnap her and forcibly rap3 her and make her your wife! Just about every other page in the Old Testament has God killing somebody! In 2 Kings 10:18-27, God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church! In total God kills 371,186 people directly and orders another 1,862,265 people murdered.

The God of the Bible also allows slavery, including selling your own daughter as a sex slave (Exodus 21:1-11), child abuse (Judges 11:29-40 and Isaiah 13:16), and bashing babies against rocks (Hosea 13:16)Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up. (& Psalms 137:9)Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones. Wow!Even reading this now makes my blood curdle.Believe me,this is God speaking.
You can add the story of Job here for good measure.

At this juncture,it is safe to assume reading through the Old Testament appears to affirm the observation that God and Satan, if not one and the same, at least work as a team.Or better still,God is the evil one and Lucifer just got framed.But the level of indoctrination coupled with the Bible will never allow anyone to see things differently

@cold, that's real deep and cold.
I really do wonder about all these religious stuffs a times.
But I believe in a creator, I know or learnt he created lucifer and I feel he would have known what lucifer would do because only Him knows the future.
I suppose He knows adam and eve were going to eat the forbidden fruit eventually and should have placed them in another place. You still can't tell human of this day with the benefit of hindsight to use everything in a room except one in full glare. Humans are curious by nature and without the serpent they would have eaten it anyways.
I have doubts about some parts of both religious books and wonder if that wouldn't have condemned the whole if part is questionable but both faiths and other various religion seem to work for their adherents.
•̸Ϟ•̸y simple solution is that I still retain the platform of Islam to relate with •̸Ϟ•̸y creator and know in •̸Ϟ•̸y mind that anytime I'm praying in whatever language, I'm worshiping •̸Ϟ•̸y creator.
If humans can have sense of humor, I seriously wonder how the creator of humans won't have same and would take serious offense even at a slight jest. I want to believe some parts of those book misrepresent God.
•̸Ϟ•̸y simple logic is that God doesn't really interfere in human affairs but gave guidelines for fair dealing with themselves and encourages and reward same. And He gave evil free reign of the world with humans left to decide to give in to it or reject it, as a form of test.
But knowing how weak us humans are, I doubt if up to 1% would make heaven judging by religious books. I don't believe in one saintly imam or bishop. They are all mere mortals with the same weakness albeit putting up appearance as is expected.

Just Paxcing!!! Una fit make person lose dem faith if the person no dey strong.

^
All religion preaches dogmatism, i.e don't question just accept. That's simply playing ostrich.
I guess the early people that brought this messages were aware of some inconsistencies hence the fear of believers asking logical questions.
Truth would always be truth and would stand all probing and questions.
Over 10 major religions and hundreds of indigenous religion preaches dogma too. Don't question just accept or you have sinned which would nearly always make most people to die in the religion they were born into except really desperate ones looking for quick fix that convert. Percentage of converts into other religion without any problem forcing them to hop about is low.
And it is obvious that only one of this various religion is the genuine one going by the argument of all different religion and even the correct one would most likely have various sects or denomination within it with conviction the other sect is wrong and unacceptable.
♍ƺ, I just worship •̸Ϟ•̸y creator and try to follow the principle of the 10 commandments even though I'm a muslim but because it cuts across what all religion preaches and it stands to logic.

Ladies and Gentle men, I am not here for a debate. I am here to tell you that your soul is at risk of Hell if you don't believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. It is left for you to believe it or not. It is left for yuo to choose if your soul will be condemned forever. You question because you have the right to question God's Sovreinty while you are alive but you won't have the right to question when you die and you discover that you have a soul and that God truely exist and that satan as been the bad guy giving you all this ideas. All I have to say is this, your rational thinking and philosophy affects not my love for God but it only makes me grieve over your lost soul which I still hope will be found in Christ one day before you die. You must know this; The devil is the father of atheism.

Very typical. Spoken like a true Christian. Once cornered,resorts to the the best weapon available to him;Fear.'You'll forever burn in hell'! They say.Religion thrives solely on fear & that's the major difference between me & you; you're good because you fear damnation,i am good without obligation

cold: Very typical. Spoken like a true Christian. Once cornered,resorts to the the best weapon available to him;Fear.'You'll forever burn in hell'! They say.Religion thrives solely on fear & that's the major difference between me & you; you're good because you fear damnation,i am good without obligation

I pray that God will show you how real He is. Fear the Lord O soul. Tremble for you are like dust that is blown off by wind. May God give you no rest until you see how real and good it is to fear Him, your creator.

^
I take it that you don't have answers to the valid questions asked hence the reason for your little speech.
I'm not an atheist or anti christ. I just want explanations I can fathom and relate with.
If I'm very certain the creator wants ♍ƺ to worship His creature (jesus) and call him God, then what's •̸Ϟ•̸y business but to do so!
But I need good reason to do so since I've not been to heaven to confirm that I have to call jesus God, worship/praise him, give credit and glory to him and admit he is •̸Ϟ•̸y salvation before the creator would admit ♍ƺ

I know God is the good guy and satan is evil. Satan worship world over consists of blood rituals and evil/ negative energy. Witches and wizards are 100% real and the type whether black or red simply depends on the type of jinn attached to the witch and they report to devil. I have fair idea about that. The satan doesn't even send his worshipers.
God encourages goodness and rewards for it. Most laws of all religion is about goodness to fellow man and only a single one about worshiping Him.
I just have problem with divinity of jesus, and seeming game by God and satan with humans as the pun. Islam and christianity admitted as much that satan said he would mislead humans and God said he should try and see with satan given the powers of various temptation and humans just warning.
I'm musing loud now. Perhaps God knows what satan would do before creating him and this life is just a testing ground to sieve out worthy creatures or why would He ask satan to bow to man in the first place.
Maybe satan is the real pun from the beginning to use in testing man.
I worship •̸Ϟ•̸y creator though and try to do good. I guess we all would find out the truth after death. Death is an adventure I'm not in a hurry to experience but look forward to after fulfillment on earth.

daviddext: I pray that God will show you how real He is. Fear the Lord O soul. Tremble for you are like dust that is blown off by wind. May God give you no rest until you see how real and good it is to fear Him, your creator.

Why are you so scared of death?Don't you want to meet your creator,this loving wonderful God of yours?I'm sure you must have a million & one excuses why you don't want to cross the great divide just yet.Or could it be that somewhere deep in your heart you're not so sure of this heaven?Everybody wan go heaven but nobody wan die

gbadexy: I know God is the good guy and satan is evil. Satan worship world over consists of blood rituals and evil/ negative energy. Witches and wizards are 100% real and the type whether black or red simply depends on the type of jinn attached to the witch and they report to devil. I have fair idea about that. The satan doesn't even send his worshipers.
God encourages goodness and rewards for it. Most laws of all religion is about goodness to fellow man and only a single one about worshiping Him.
I just have problem with divinity of jesus, and seeming game by God and satan with humans as the pun. Islam and christianity admitted as much that satan said he would mislead humans and God said he should try and see with satan given the powers of various temptation and humans just warning.
I'm musing loud now. Perhaps God knows what satan would do before creating him and this life is just a testing ground to sieve out worthy creatures or why would He ask satan to bow to man in the first place.
Maybe satan is the real pun from the beginning to use in testing man.
I worship •̸Ϟ•̸y creator though and try to do good. I guess we all would find out the truth after death. Death is an adventure I'm not in a hurry to experience but look forward to after fulfillment on earth.

What most people fail to know is that "our God has emotion" too. I can see someone quote Isaiah talking about God creating "evil" is true because He's the one who created Satan. In Genesis 3 where we read that devil deceived Eve, if you read it carefully when God came to pay them visit and they told God they're naked; and God asked Adam, how did you know you're naked? Adam replied "the woman you gave me enticed me to eat the fruit. Immediately God asked the woman; and the woamn said it is serpent(devil) that enticed her to eat but to the serpent; He couldn't find anyone to acuse! Meaning any action performed by satan it's self-will. "though God knows about it" Before God begins to curse them.

Bible scholars have looked into the scenaro and concluded that the SPIRIT that God used to create Angels is totally different from that man (that's why God still call them to witness the creation of man).

Give more detail tomorrow!

Emusan:

What most people fail to know is that "our God has emotion" too. I can see someone quote Isaiah talking about God creating "evil" is true because He's the one who created Satan. In Genesis 3 where we read that devil deceived Eve, if you read it carefully when God came to pay them visit and they told God they're naked; and God asked Adam, how did you know you're naked? Adam replied "the woman you gave me enticed me to eat the fruit. Immediately God asked the woman; and the woamn said it is serpent(devil) that enticed her to eat but to the serpent; He couldn't find anyone to acuse! Meaning any action performed by satan it's self-will. "though God knows about it" Before God begins to curse them.

Bible scholars have looked into the scenaro and concluded that the SPIRIT that God used to create Angels is totally different from that man (that's why God still call them to witness the creation of man).

Give more detail tomorrow!

you cannot use the bible to prove the reality of God any more than you can use the comic book to prove the reality of Superman.

^
Dats wicked, lol.
We may all disagree with the position of organized religion on God but I know there is no atheist in the real sense of the word.
Probably folks that feel let down by the creator and rebelling through bitterness or folks linking atheism to being sophisticated free thinkers.
I suspect if an ant stop to wonder, it would know their is a being behind creation.
The universe as we know and all within was purposefully designed and even if it were random and spontaneous, the materials and energy would come into being through something.

I guess jesus wasn't around when lucifer refused to bow for adam after all since I couldn't get a specific response.

gbadexy: I think I heard that satan was arrogant and tried
to overthrow God in heaven in a battle led by
arch angel against the demons.
Now what was jesus' role in that scenario? Was he
in existence then and what role did he play in the
battle and was he mentioned in that scenario
specifically?
When was the first biblical documentation of the
contact between satan and jesus? Was it at the
mountain during the 40 days prayer or in heaven
before then?
Over to the experts here.

A DIRECT ROLE. JESUS IS ARCH-ANGLE MICHAEL REVELATION 12 VS 7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

obadiah777: A DIRECT ROLE. JESUS IS ARCH-ANGLE MICHAEL REVELATION 12 VS 7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

obadiah777: A DIRECT ROLE. JESUS IS ARCH-ANGLE MICHAEL REVELATION 12 VS 7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

May Christ have mercy on u 4 this blasphemy. Did ur bible tell you that "they overcame him by the blood of Michael"?

Debroslink:

May Christ have mercy on u 4 this blasphemy. Did ur bible tell you that "they overcame him by the blood of Michael"?

JUDE 9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

Was satan 'overcomed' with blood of something or he was just plain defeated.

daviddext: Jesus was the LORD that gave the command "Satan You Are Banished From The Kingdom Of Light And Glory". That was Jesus' role. He is God whom satn rebelled against.

Smh. Can you show us that where it is written in the bible ?

daviddext: Is it too good to be true or what ever you think. Yes I tell you. Why you may ask. Let me take you to the scriptures and to open your eyes to see what you never new

God talked about the birth of Jesus long before you great grand parents were born. In Isaiah 9:6 " For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace" and Jesus said to the pharisees in John8:58 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I Am" compare his words with God's word to moses in Genesis 3:14 "And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: anms he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you"

THIS ARE NOT MY WORDS BUT OUR CREATOR WORDS THAT HAVE BEEN PRESERVED BY IS POWER. IF YOU HAVE ARGUEMENTS. PLEASE DO THAT WITH YOUR CREATOR,THE MIGHTY GOD. BUT IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS TO KNOW HOW YOU WILL ACCEPT JESUS, I WILL BE WILLING TO ANSWER YOU.

^^^

"You are lost pal!"

This is One of the most directionless thread NL.

I thought this was the op ?

gbadexy: I think I heard that satan was arrogant and tried
to overthrow God in heaven in a battle led by
arch angel against the demons.
Now what was jesus' role in that scenario? Was he
in existence then and what role did he play in the
battle and was he mentioned in that scenario
specifically?
When was the first biblical documentation of the
contact between satan and jesus? Was it at the
mountain during the 40 days prayer or in heaven
before then?
Over to the experts here.

now, that is not being addressed again.

Na wao!

truthislight: This is One of the most directionless thread NL.

I thought this was the op ?



now, that is not being addressed again.

Na wao!

I don't get you, could you be more specific.
If I asked another question, its to lay foundation to support an opinion I'm forming.

@cold

You've made very intelligent observations; however, those observations do not justify the idea of throwing the concept of God away. Such would be throwing away the baby with the bathing water.

The obvious and undeniable inconsistencies in the various religious texts only show that these texts are man's perception of God. These texts were written by various individuals at different levels of spiritual maturity.

You don't need religion to recognize God. You stand in creation, which is the work of God. A good understanding of this creation will bring you closer to the recognition of God, just as one can recognize the mind-frame of an artist in the artist's work.

Stand away from a religions, creeds, and dogma; and search for the creator with a free and open mind. If you seek this way, you will find.

Thanks and remain blessed

cold: Very typical. Spoken like a true Christian. Once cornered,resorts to the the best weapon available to him;Fear.'You'll forever burn in hell'! They say.Religion thrives solely on fear & that's the major difference between me & you; you're good because you fear damnation,i am good without obligation

This is a fallacious argument called argumentum ad baculum: An argument based on an appeal to fear or a threat. (e.g., If you don't believe in God, you'll burn in hell). Nigerian Christians use this a lot. It is their last resort if they don't have a valid point. But what sort of choice is that? Methinks, it is coercion!

It is the same thing like when an armed robber holds you up and says : your money or your life. No difference.