₦airaland Forum

Thanks VO and all other contributors to this thread, though this topic has been vigorously pursued recently, i will like to point out some observations on the k1 visa denial due to engagement/traditional marriage. Pls bear with me its gonna be long.
1. Quoting ( “Re: U.S. Immigration Questions: Ask A U.S. Consular Officer by VisaOfficer: 8:40am On Feb 25
justwise:
VO the member you quoted [Euma] is right...couple is considered married the moment the bride price/dowry is paid...in Igbo culture the dowry and the traditional marriage could be done the same day and the wife officially go home with her husband....marriage done.

And Yoruba and Hausa culture? “)

Based on Justwise, does it mean one can then adjust status in the US base on this so called traditional marriage, am sure your answer is NO, cos it is not a legal marriage and infact it can not be. Then why is it been used to deny K1 applicants?

2. ( Re: U.S. Immigration Questions: Ask A U.S. Consular Officer by VisaOfficer: 1:02pm On Feb 24
gbengene8012:
A quick one here, heard someone was refused K1 visa because he said he paid dowry during their engagement ceremony, and the visa officer says that shows that the marriage was paid for, and as such fraud is detected. Could this be true in an African context, thought paying dowry was part of the engagement culture?

It depends on the tribe and the local custom. If a bride price is paid under conditions such that it constitutes customary marriage, and the couple is then considered married to each other and would need a divorce to become free to marry someone else, then yes, we consider the couple married by Nigerian law and custom, and they are not eligible for the K-1 (fiance) visa. )

May I then know is this someone else still the fiancé he or she intends to marry in the US? If she is, then why will they need to first dissolve any traditional consummation done back in Nigeria, am confused?
Are we still talking about this two individuals who had a tradition engagement? Why will they need to first breakup then to make up?

3. Quoting Jchi9876, where he states the “right steps are introduction, engagement, traditional marriage then the marriage itself,” I was always thinking he was right till he bungled it again,
Re: U.S. Immigration Questions: Ask A U.S. Consular Officer by Jchi9876: 3:33pm On Feb 25

VisaOfficer:
So you would travel to the US before you do your traditional marriage?

If you file the I-129F right now, you might be able to travel before December. But it generally takes at least six to eight months to get an appointment if everything goes perfectly, so I'm not sure you'd have time.

Question should be what happens to the already "fixed traditional marriage" if she travels before December and marries in the USA (first marriage) as prescibed by law?

will OP go back to do traditional after the wedding in USA? kinda weird and strange.

Would a cart rather be in front or behind a horse? Different strokes for(different) folks. )


Now am 49, and the k1 petition that am making now is for my fiancé who is gonna be 2nd spouse should we marry ( am I right to say she’s 2nd , not sure myself), having had a former separation.
I remembered while back in Nigeria and working with a Federal agency, I was then married traditionally to my former spouse (we didn’t have reason to take it further to registry) and then I traveled to the US, and then my pension were due, I sent my spouse to file for my pension giving her a letter of authority on my behalf, but was shocked to be told that she cannot claim my entitlement due to the fact that she is not recognized based solely on traditional marriage to be legal and bonafide wife, though we share between us to 2kids who are now adult and are with me. Again I remembered then trying to bring her into the US through relative petition and I hit a brickwall, saying there is not a bonafide marriage due to lack of marriage certificate, now I understand why.. if I may quote

Re: U.S. Immigration Questions: Ask A U.S. Consular Officer by VisaOfficer: 10:42am

MarieEyre :
Morning, Thanks a lot for your assistance. I would like to inquire - My fiancee and I have done our Introduction i.e payment of the Brideprice. We have pictures as proof. Is this sufficient enough for him to file a spousal visa or does he go with the fiancee visa. Can one be deemed married with just the payment of the brideprice without a traditional wedding ceremony. Thank you.

It sounds to me like you are traditionally married.

I'm going to quote a response I posted a long time ago: This is an area where Nigerian law and U.S. law don't dovetail neatly. Traditional marriages in Nigeria do count as marriages and make people ineligible for K visas -- and if your fiance gives the bride price, that's a marriage under customary law. But because such marriages are often undocumented, the Nigerian spouse can't benefit from the IR1 or CR1 petition, because there's no piece of paper to submit to NVC. So people who have had traditional or customary marriages, but not a registry or religious marriage*, are stuck, unable to get either a fiance or a spouse visa.


Looking at your above response, how then can filing for a fiancé with whom I had a traditional ceremony with becomes marriage in terms of k1 visa, but cannot become marriage for spousal petition?

4. Finally, I will like you to adjucate between me and my friend I called Mr T who happens to have a fiancé without any tradition ceremony and they have seen face to face 3 times in about 2yrs before filing k1 petition for her. Now we both have elderly parents who are sick, while am comfortably able to tell my traditionally engaged fiancé to go stay with my parents so as to look after them, Mr T is unable to do so, because his family are not so conversant with her and she herself cant persuade her parents to let her go cos they don’t know each other and wouldn’t want to endangered their daughter (can’t blame them, they are just fiancé, and am sure they’ve seen enough that didn’t materilaised).
Now between my own fiancé and my friend Mr T fiance who is more going to get to the US and get married within 90 days?
Do we now penalize someone who has gone the extra mile to prove his or her relationship and intent to continue with such in the US, having demonstrate that back here in Nigeria, over those who have not shown as much, save for their picnic pictures and Whatsapp messages?
It is high time we don’t disenfranchise those with situation like this, remembering that at a time same sex fiancé/couple are ineligible for petition based on the pure traditional definition of marriage, (today with better understanding that 2 people of the same sex can still be in love genuinely), its now a thing of the past.
Thanking you for always reasoning and willing to accept our humble suggestions.

Jchi9876:
At v what point do people start to tag one another "fiance/fiancee? Kinda curious to me as to the best of my knowledge that tag can come with just either party acceping to spend a life together (irrespective of who proposes)

Now I understand the "tag" in itself is non-procedural and either party only needs a telephone or face to face talk with their parents individually to intimate them on their recent proposal and it is only in some cases that a small living room introduction where NOTHING i mean NOTHING is exchanged except discussions that pertain to both families wanting to know each other more (more like Dangote meeting Larry Page or Jeff Bezos at a Luncheon/meering/conference and then discussing over few drinks no CONTRACTs, no Paperworks just casual).

At this stage plans they are technically still dating as NOTHING is and both parties can quit without no hassles or paperwork!

My worry is why in the world do K1 apllicants proceed to the fourth stage ( first stage being knowing one another, second being proposal and technically third meeting parents) in the process which is mainly the marriage proper and this is where the exchanges occur!!!

This cuts across all tribes in Nigeria i think this fourth stage is done naively by applicants out of fear or for security of the relationship

U nailed it.. I just recently joined n also been following this thread... thanx for ur insight

My fiancee interview is coming up shortly, but she told me that she has lost all the pictures. I sent out several pictures of us along with the Form 129F. Would u please tell us if USCIS forwarded copies of all those pictures to you in Lagos Nigeria with our Approved petition? Pls say yes they forwarded them!!