₦airaland Forum

Again, I am going to play devil’s advocate here. It bothers me to see that someone with your experience and education is looking for how to pull 2M a month in naija when infact you should be thinking about creating jobs and employing people. With your experience have to thought of starting an IT consulting firm??
The problem as most posters have already stated is that the market is saturated every dick and harry has a foreign MS degree from any university, most of them are roaming the streets now trying to find jobs. Companies are all about cutting costs, I can guarantee that there are people that have the same skill set as you and companies are willing to pay less than you are demanding. Gone at the days (mid 2000’s) when corporate Nigeria worshipped people with foreign degrees.
I work in finance (m&a) and know of friends that came to the states for mba/ms went back home are jobless, and these folks have mba’s from top15 b-schools.

Now will be the time to work your phone and reconnect with any contacts you have in Naija. Ideally you can work for someone, make ur connections and branch out in abt 2-3yrs. Eventually 2M will become pocket change

Just my two cents.

I am going to play devil’s advocate here. These comments are not to slight anybody or in any way am I trying to compare dick sizes. From a personal perspective, currently living in the states (been here for abt 9 years now, came after I graduated high school in Naija),

I am of the school of thought that getting a degree from abroad should not automatically guarantee a cushion job back home, I believe the Nigerian worker has a better mental capacity to get the job done (in Nigeria). A friend was going to relocate home back in 2007 and he was offered 11M naira, but in all fairness I am sure that his company instead of paying him all that cash could easily hire four Nigerian graduates. Coming with a foreign degree does not mean jack, I have come across Nigerian graduates with more on the job skills than their American counterparts.

I am a big advocate of entrepreneurship, why cant Nigerian abroad save up money go back home and create jobs instead of taking jobs from poor graduates that have suffered the “Nigerian factor(s)”- ASSU strikes, etc.

No sir.
I do not need a degree in Finance to understand that Lafage has operations in Africa in addition to the rest of the world.
Therefore, the bold comments do not hold water.

best of luck to those hoping to buy these or other shares.
I would not buy any such thing in this country again until I see a semblance of transparency and professionalism in the capital and equity market.
It takes a higher power differentiating the frauds of the genuine.[b][/b]


Ok, I made up my mind not to post on this topic again, but I have to address some misconcenptions about my earlier posts.

First, I never said you needed a degree in finance, pple have various talents/passions so it will be iresponsible to say that,

LaFage has operations in Africa, but do they supply all the cement in Africa? I just checked thier financials for 2009 and cement sales was E2.61 billion for Africa/Middle east region, taking note of the construction boom in the middle east.

When I said the continent will need abt $1 trillion in infastructure spending, I never said Dangote was going to supply all the cement, Its just that there is a ready market for his products, and forces of demand and supply will come into play


As i said earlier, playing the stock market is not for the faint hearted, the market is manipulated everywhere from Somalia to the US, so buying is at your own risk, It really does not take a higher power in diferentiating frauds from the genuine, you only need two things due diligence and technical analysis,

I repeat those buying this share will either be smiling to the bank in a few years or cld be jumping off the bridge, the choice is yours,

@Bigben431
   Are you serious? So you mean an Investment bank wont research the offer to see if it is over or under valued and advise their clients appropriately. If we  are to use our head as you advise then it must be based on hard metrics after due research. Thats is part of the problem with some of our " finance professionals"-No research.


Ok, it seems I am being misunderstood, I should be more detailed next time, what I meant by no alternate research is needed is because, it can be almost guaranteed that most investment banks will come with a close valaution, i am yet to see the prospectus of the offering but there is no doubt that most of the big players of the industry are underwritting this offering, and all they care about getting their fees period.the higher the valuation the higher the fees, thats how it works in the industry, speaking as an insider

I rest my case here, this is a simple choice if you dont trust the valuation u can simply walk away and invest elsewhere, people that invest in this company will do that at their own risk, this is not rocket science

I guess the fundamental issue is that people think the company is overvalued. First shareholders will receive 1 share per 2 shares of BCC @ the Tuesday closing price of N67.50 which amounts to N135 …that’s how the share price was derived.

Now going to Lafarge I just checked and the closing stock price is E38.75 which equals to $49 at an exchange rate of $1 = E0.78638. Outstanding shares for the company is 286.5 million so the valuation is $49X 286.5million = E14.08 billion.

Basically both companies are valued the same BUT note two underlying differences

1. Dangote is listed in Naira as to euro or dollar, if it was listed in usd the share price would be about $0.9
2. Dangote has more shares outstanding than Lafarge

Many factors come into valuing a company, enterprise value, ROE, ROIC, capex, working capital etc…so you cannot jump into a conclusion saying the company is overvalued. BBC is a public company, u can look at the financial statements and draw conclusions for your self.


Is Dangote telling us that Dangote Cement is worth more that the largest building material company in the world in terms of asset. All I am going to say is look before you leap.[b][/b]


Refer to my statement above – you do not use only an asset to determine the value of the company. You use enterprise value


Dangote is probably one of the most transparent bizman out there.

It is really hard to explain core finance terms to people who are not in the field (no offense) , there are just too many factors that come into play that an outsider really doesn’t crap. One big thing I forgot is the future cash flow for the company, there is always going to be demand for cement in Africa. The continent needs about $1 trillion of infrastructure spending over the next 20 years.

And no alternate research analysts are needed to come up with an alternate valuation. Playing in the stock market is not for everyone…u should use your head to invest and not your heart.

Quote from: naijatoday on Today at 06:08:16 PM
$14Billion?

How did they arrive at this number, and what companies will be under Dangote Cement?


The only reason I am asking is because Lafarge the largest building material manufacturer has a market cap of 11.2 billion pounds.


Well done for pointing this out. There is something fishy about this valuation.


The article says the company will be listing 15.5 billion shares @ N135 each. I will try and use the market cap method to make the math easier assuming an exchange rate of N150 to $1

N135 = $0.9
15.5 billion shares X $0.9 = approx $13.9 billion

So from the above, their valuation seems accurate, the other company u guys mentioned might have a lower valaution if they have less outstanding shares (less than 15.5 billion shares), dont really have time to check some foreign company.

Have to tip your hat to this guy

Although I love Baba and all he has done for naija, I had to post this enjoy,


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNhBt_kkqhk

@ theforce

Again i repeat that angel investor is a type of VC, what happenes to a rich individual that starts up a VC shop and when he is the sole owner (general partner and limited partner)? terminology might be different but concept is the same, not trying to compare dick sizes just laying out fact,

well good luck with ur fund hopefully u can raise an army of enterpreneurs that the country dearly needs.

Haven read all of the posts, I think there is a little of confusion between venture capital and private equity. Although both are forms of alternative investments, they operate on different levels. I think the poster wanted someone to fund a new business venture that is the main difference between VC and PE. VC helps entrepreneurial companies grow from the ground up and in the process taking a stake in that company. VC can be backed by either internal management money or through limited partners.

PE on the other hand invests in already established business or distressed business, pumps in capital, restructures and sells or take it public.

For aspiring entrepreneurs, most PE firms will not even look @ ur biz plans just because you don’t have anything solid on ground. VC are made to take more risks.

The long and short is that there are lots of PE firms in Nigeria, but less VC, take note when writing you biz and seeking funds. Just my 2cents.

@ theforce - angel investor is a type of venture capital, BUS 101,

I agree with all the other posts here which say that most of the big boys will only look @ multi-million dollar deals, In conclusion, given the Nigerian factor etc, the market is not just ripe for venture capital yet, maybe one day someone will have the balls to become the next Georges Doriot and raise an army of enterpreneurs ( cos we have tons of them in Nigeria)

@ Tolulop001 - I have checked the website and there does not seem to be anywhere to send pm messages maybe we can keep in touch via email? keep the hustle.

@ Tolulop001 - I am currently based in the States. You can pm anytime you need to talk or need any advice - FREE of charge.

@ Other posters.

About the article, although I dint read it, u shld know that the finance world has a cut throat mentality, what most investors care about is that IRR because the have limited partners to answer to. Most VC firms try to make 20% return on investments annually - so any "legal tactic" might be deployed.

As per IP/copywrite/patent- you have to know what kind of VC firm is interested in you, what is their track record, mgt background and experience, what other companies have they invested in? Run away from investors who tell you that u are the first enterpreneur they want to invest in, DO YOUR DUE DILIGENCE, I can't stress that enough.

Its not about just getting raising money from family and friends, Legit VC firms bring in operational and industry experince to guide you along the way.

Having said all these, doing VC work in naija na another different story- you just need that one firm to be a pioneer in the industry - do things the right way - and that is what i want my firm to eventually be, it might take me 2, 5 or even 10 yrs, but the most important thing is doing it right.

**IMPORTANT** know your biz plans by heart, you never know when u will need to give an "elevator pitch".

Ok for some reason, I have tried to post two detailed responses trying to give FREE advice to pple in need and it gets deleted. This is an example why VC can't work in Nigeria when we have non-progressive individuals!!!!

@ Tolulop001 - I am currently based in the States. You can pm anytime you need to talk or need any advice - FREE of charge.

@ Other posters.

About the article, although I dint read it, u shld know that the finance world has a cut throat mentality, what most investors care about is that IRR because the have limited partners to answer to. Most VC firms try to make 20% return on investments annually - so any "legal tactic" might be deployed.

As per IP/copywrite/patent- you have to know what kind of VC firm is interested in you, what is their track record, mgt background and experience, what other companies have they invested in? Run away from investors who tell you that u are the first enterpreneur they want to invest in, DO YOUR DUE DILIGENCE, I can't stress that enough.

Its not about just getting raising money from family and friends, Legit VC firms bring in operational and industry experince to guide you along the way.

Having said all these, doing VC work in naija na another different story- you just need that one firm to be a pioneer in the industry - do things the right way - and that is what i want my firm to eventually be, it might take me 2, 5 or even 10 yrs, but the most important thing is doing it right.

**IMPORTANT** know your biz plans by heart, you never know when u will need to give an "elevator pitch".

@ Tolulop001 - I am currently based in the States. You can pm anytime you need to talk or need any advice - FREE of charge.

@ Other posters.

About the article, although I dint read it, u shld know that the finance world has a cut throat mentality, what most investors care about is that IRR because the have limited partners to answer to. Most VC firms try to make 20% return on investments annually - so any "legal tactic" might be deployed.

As per IP/copywrite/patent- you have to know what kind of VC firm is interested in you, what is their track record, mgt background and experience, what other companies have they invested in? Run away from investors who tell you that u are the first enterpreneur they want to invest in, DO YOUR DUE DILIGENCE, I can't stress that enough.

Its not about just getting raising money from family and friends, Legit VC firms bring in operational and industry experince to guide you along the way.

Having said all these, doing VC work in naija na another different story- you just need that one firm to be a pioneer in the industry - do things the right way - and that is what i want my firm to eventually be, it might take me 2, 5 or even 10 yrs, but the most important thing is doing it right.

**IMPORTANT** know your biz plans by heart, you never know when u will need to give an "elevator pitch".

@ Tolulop001

Wow, since you are in the R& stage then I say keep grinding and funding will come. what is the ballpark figure u need to get up and running in USD. Is the business based in Nigeria? Are you based in Nigeria too?

Honestly, as I said earlier, I am still fundraising and if I have any disposable cash could have asked for your biz plan for review. However, I will not hold you back, if by next year things go as planned for me and you still need capital we might have a deal if terms are right.

Also if you need any help with financial analysis, strategic & business plans, or just review of any documents, I am willing to help. I have been in M&A for abt five years now and have been basically raping financial statements all my career.

Just keep grinding, hang in there.

@ Tolulop001

Are you currently based in Nigeria? Is your product already selling in the market? also what type of owenership structure do you and ur friends have?

I understand how fustrating it is to find willing investors, one thing that i would advice is to network, network and network, keep talking to pple and you would be suprised where the funds will come from. Just make sure you can show that you will be free cash flow positive (ebit -(1*tax rate)+depreciation &amort - capex-change in net working capital) and that will do the trick.

I have seen that angel investors are lacking in Nigeria and all the big boy vc/pe firms only do multi-million dollar deals, there might just be a good business potential here, wink, wink

Most investors look for abt 30% stake, this depends on how much they have invested in the company though.

Saw this thread and got interested. The only problem that i have come across is valuation when the investor is trying to exit the investment. When the client is presenting their business plan. their valuation (using dcf) just seems to be too optimistic, a not too experienced investor gets excited and then funds them thinking they will make a good irr. However, when you want to exit, the valuations do not hold water anymore. In most cases, you have to get a very good lawyer and probably a good audit firm to check the books CONSTANTLY. as most companies try to cook the books as much as possible.

Which industries are you trying to invest in? I am keen on the hospitality and consumer goods sectors. With a population of 150M+, you cannot go wrong with this.

Are you an angel investor, growth capital etc?? Alternatively, are you an entrepreneur looking for funds?

I am actively fundraising now, will have to formally register with CAC and hope to close on some investments early/mid next year.

Hope this helps.

Any input would be appreciated. I posted on business section and got no comments.


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Hello All,
I just need some opinion from the house. I have been in the US for about 8 years now and will like to start a chain of hospitality businesses in Nigeria. I would like to open a few restaurants in Lagos and then Abuja, PH and eventually Accra.

I have been doing a lot of research mainly on the web on “international” restaurants in Lagos and there seems to be a wide variety. However, I would like my restaurants to be more of Nigeria/(Whatever – Asian etc) fusion.

My most important task is to establish good brand names for my restaurants before trying to make profits. Let’s put it this way, I am going into the restaurant business for my passion of food first. Ideally what locations in Lagos will be good for upscale restaurants? I am not familiar with Lagos, but I am planning to take a trip for one month over the summer to sample food from all the “upscale” places in Lagos.

In summary, please any form of criticisms/questions would be welcomed. With the numbers I have I think I am comfortable sinking in about 30M-50M on each restaurant. Does that sound reasonable?

Thanks.

It really depends on what you use ur bb for. Personally, I prefer a bb with a keypad. I currently own the tour which is very good but cld be slow sometimes. I send out/receive 70+ work related emails a day, so it just makes since to have a keypad.

However, if its strictly for enterntainment/personal, then the the storm works better. Just my two cents.

Hello All,
I just need some opinion from the house. I have been in the US for about 8 years now and will like to start a chain of hospitality businesses in Nigeria. I would like to open a few restaurants in Lagos and then Abuja, PH and eventually Accra.

I have been doing a lot of research mainly on the web on “international” restaurants in Lagos and there seems to be a wide variety. However, I would like my restaurants to be more of Nigeria/(Whatever – Asian etc) fusion.

My most important task is to establish good brand names for my restaurants before trying to make profits. Let’s put it this way, I am going into the restaurant business for my passion of food first. Ideally what locations in Lagos will be good for upscale restaurants? I am not familiar with Lagos, but I am planning to take a trip for one month over the summer to sample food from all the “upscale” places in Lagos.

In summary, please any form of criticisms/questions would be welcomed. With the numbers I have I think I am comfortable sinking in about 30M-50M on each restaurant. Does that sound reasonable?

Thanks.