https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c62rygz20gjt

Prisoners are being released today.

Thanks Ticha for always sharing your stories and experiences. So much to learn from you.

Ticha:


Hmnn, we have been incredibly lucky with a series of being in the right place at the right time, finding friends who were open to combining resources with us and Covid. Covid has been both a blessing (sorted our finances and gave us clarity of thought around plans) and a curse (lost a few friends and family).

We still have to work, after all our properties are mortgaged heavily except 1. However if shit hits the fan, we can just sell down and pay off the debts and be fine.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/08/13/worklessness-crisis-britain-dangerously-dependent-foreign/

What can be done about this? 9.5 million adults not working!!!

I am never against peaceful protest against far right thugs but bringing out knives and dagger while wearing balaclavas is crossing the line. This seem to me like an intention to kill.

While condemning far right thugs,we should not turn to them or even worse than them.

If we can't condemn that, the we are hypocrites.

kaybee3:
I can equally say, I condemned but understand why some Muslim thugs were rioting as they were responding to the initial attacks, if I want to go by zahra logic and yours too… or justify kicking of the man in that pub because he was racist to them, I’m sure you follow that particular case (the man has been kicked out of the pub twice before, for been racist). Its okay not to like Muslims or its practice but its sad how some people try to paint all Muslims as terrorist or extremists.

I dont care which water is being muddied. I care that all extremists views should be dealt with.
No one should incite violence in our nation and nobody should be afraid to go out.

Goodenoch:


I'm not contending anything. I asked one very simple question about something you claimed with certainty and you haven't been able to substantiate it.

I won't be drawn into this attempt to muddy the waters with random irrelevant points.

I'm certain the pattern I outlined is clear to anyone who takes a look now. Up to you to self-reflect...or not. ✌🏿️

Before I continue with this conversation,
what's the bone of contention?

That some thugs did not carry knives and daggers in Birmingham and they were not far right?

That they incited violence but did not say rape women?

That they are not MDL?

That they did not beat innocent people as well?

That they are not extremists?

Or that it is false information?

We are not allowed to talk about other extremists on this forum unless it is far right?

I said I am afraid of those carrying daggers and knives in my city as well as far right.

What's wrong with saying that?

I did not know that on this forum, we are only allowed to mention the evil perpetrated by far right. Any other information is false?

Goodenoch:


And you know they are MDL members because...?

As someone said on this thread earlier, if some of you spend any more time on the fence, you'll run a real risk of becoming bricks.

The summary of your contribution to this whole discussion has been just the kind of 'bothsideism' Olusoga described in his article. From two weeks ago when these attacks started, you said not one thing in condemnation even as people here were describing various attacks and threats to their lives. Your first related post was almost two weeks later when you came with your 'gotcha!' news that 'some of the far left can be violent too' when you posted the link to that councilor inciting violence. The actual violence didn't warrant a mention. Today you have come with 'news' of MDL (specifically) encouraging women to be raped and when asked for evidence your answer is nothing related to what you actually claimed but we should take your word for it because you live in Birmingham.

Lol. Na wah.

I am working. Will respond after work.

Goodenoch:


And you know they are MDL members because...?

As someone said on this thread earlier, if some of you spend any more time on the fence, you'll run a real risk of becoming bricks.

The summary of your contribution to this whole discussion has been just the kind of 'bothsideism' Olusoga described in his article. From two weeks ago when these attacks started, you said not one thing in condemnation even as people here were describing various attacks and threats to their lives. Your first related post was almost two weeks later when you came with your 'gotcha!' news that 'some of the far left can be violent too' when you posted the link to that councilor inciting violence. The actual violence didn't warrant a mention. Today you have come with 'news' of MDL (specifically) encouraging women to be raped and when asked for evidence your answer is nothing related to what you actually claimed but we should take your word for it because you live in Birmingham.

Lol. Na wah.

Do you live in Birmingham?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/06/uk-riots-birmingham-pubgoer-attacked-masked-men/

Here is one. There are loads of others.

Goodenoch:


Can you please share the videos or any reference at all?

And maybe some info on how you're definite the people involved were part of the Muslim Defence League?

They were all wearing masks. Sky news even showed some of it but were forced to stop it because of the rude and racist remarks that were said by them.

https://news.sky.com/video/birmingham-protesters-surround-sky-correspondent-and-slash-tyre-amid-unrest-13191564

They wanted the to slash tyres. I saw videos of daggers and big knives

justwise:


Possible to share the video link? I'm actually surprised to hear this, if its true then they should be arrested as well

I saw the videos and live in Birmingham. A friend was caught in the whole drama. So I am certain.

Goodenoch:


Do you have a source for MDL 'encouraging women to be raped'?

Good article!!

I stumbled upon this while reading the article which captured my view

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/aug/11/extremism-in-all-its-forms-has-been-ignored-for-too-long-by-british-politicians

While I felt threatened by the far right and we have dwelt so much on them and glad to see that the justice system is dealing with them. However, I was equally afraid of the MDL that made news in Birmingham. They brought out knives and dagger and were encouraging women to be raped. I don't see this reaction as a counter protest but as another extremism hijacking this sad event to showcase their views.

How do we differentiate far right women?

For both parties, innocent people will be victims.

I just saw us "Blacks" as pawns in the battles of 2 extremists.

The British intelligence and politicians need to take their stands against all forms of extremism.

Cyberknight:


At the bolded, reading the comments section on a Daily Telegraph article on any given day should suffice.
Since hostilities have been renewed, this article in the good old Guardian is instructive. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/aug/10/there-can-be-no-excuses-the-uk-riots-were-violent-racism-fomented-by-populism

The Guardian is what it is, the bane of the right and the delight of the left and all that, but I sometimes agree with Telegraph or Times articles, and I do think this article does really encapsulate what happened over the last week well.

When there is lack of awareness and education, people will always direct their grievances to the wrong people. A lot of Caucasians are misinformed and will continue to see us as the problem unless they are re-educated and made aware of immigrants contributions to the nation.

To make matter worse, all political parties have used "immigration being the problem" to campaign. This is one of the causes.

Goke7:


So how can we manage Grandma's emotions in Barnsley bayi, should we all go to Barnsley and beg Grandma that we are sorry for trooping into her country unabated so Grandma can be happy abi wetin be the solution bayi cos I don't still understand how this is our bloody business. You have even mentioned it's Govt business so what's your problem here?

If you want to hear the truth and I mentioned it already, close both the air and sea border but if you can't close it then please channel your grievances to the appropriate quarters e no concern us but if you don't gerrit forget about it. Sounding apologetic can never assuage anybody's feelings in this matter.

That's good. All extremist should be dealt with.

justwise:


Done.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cy8497l7dx8t

I hope he does.

justwise:


Pretty sure he will be arrested before the end of today, he should be treated the same way those thugs are treated.

The ones I attended uni did not even apply for psw. The left for China immediately after their courses. Their parents own manufacturing coys in China and were waiting for them to get foreign certificate and put them as head of the coys.

While Nigerians and Indians were struggling to get COS, they just did not care as they had no intention of staying back.

They came with top electronics gadgets and phones and were very rich.

TBH, these are just top 5-10% of their population, which translates to millions of them. A lot of their population cannot afford to leave China.

Zahra29:


So true. I read that the Chinese were one of the key reasons the PSW route was retained in its original form. Durham university, LSE and some other red bricks that attract a large number of Chinese students heavily lobbied the govt on the basis that the graduate route was important to their Chinese students, many of whom want to gain some UK work experience before going home.

I had a young Chinese postgraduate in my team. She did her masters in Imperial I believe. Really smart and hardworking. The company had sponsored her visa fees fully including IHS, legal fees etc. She recently announced that she was leaving, barely 2 years into her visa. She said she missed home and her parents wanted her to come back, plus she had other opportunities waiting for her.. . She was even offered a nice package to entice her to stay, but she still said adiós. For a lot of them the UK is merely a stepping stone/rite of passage to bigger and better back at home.

https://www.gbnews.com/news/riots-labour-councillor-suspended-cut-throats

This shows some far left can be very violent too. This councillor is not different from the Tory councillors wife. He too should be arrested for inciting violence.

Do you see a lot of Chinese struggling to pay for COS?
They mostly come here to school in top schools and go back to their country. Except, recently when UK allowed a lot of people from Hong Kong to come into the Uk. Therefore,to a racist, Chinese are no threats. They are also
hardly on the news for committing crime.

When it comes to Cybersecurity, the British intelligence see them as threats.

lavida001:


Also in all of this happening, the agitators has never mention Chinese as immigrants they want to leave their country. It’s the usual brown and black skin countries they keep mentioning.

Meanwhile the Chinese arguably own more houses and investments in this country than any other ethnicity yet, they don’t scream we want our country back from them.

The reflection of your ethnicity is how people will treat you in the diaspora. Chinese advancement in technology has given respect to their citizen wherever they go.

If we don’t come together and make Africa great, thinking because we own ILR… one day they will ask you where you are really from?

Where have you been? Welcome back.

hustla:
I remember being on this thread, ranting about how immigrants, especially legal immigrants like students are portrayed by the English media...

I also remember some people here defending their racist actions and portrayal of immigrants, same people who now would be afraid to go out due to the anti immigrant protests going on right now

I hope we can all see that no matter the spree spree English you speak with your nose and the government you defend cos you feel you're now part of them, you're still black and a bloody immigrant at the end of the day

Light n*gga, dark n*gga, faux n*gga, real n*gga
Rich n*gga, poor n*gga , house n*gga, field n*gga..
... Still n*gga

And those 3 guys should be where? Beating and punching police like that and atill claiming victim? They deserve much more than that.

Anyone that assault our public officers should be punished severely. Those thugs should be taken off our streets.

They should thank their stars that they assaulted a police in Uk and not in the US.

missjekyll:


I was saying that at the moment that the man was kicked in the head and stamped on with jack boots, he was already prone and not resisting.

That was excessive force even deadly force and that's why the police officer was suspended .

Policing is an honorable profession especially in the UK where they police by consent. They ve taken a hit in recent years but are trying to build back up a reputation.
Videos showing unwarranted use of force only undermines that.

I hope things get better but will it? Fingers crossed.

wallg123:


I wish Labour luck in the divided and intolerant country they’ve inherited. NHS queues are going nowhere

I agree, reform took away a lot of share of conservative votes.

Also, so many people decided not to vote.

I just checked Lizz Truss's constituency. She won with about 35,000 votes in 2019 while Labour had just over 9,000 votes.

Labour has now gained close to 4000 more votes. Where are the other voters?

deept:


Well, it's not all about you. Reform has been a huge influence on the results of this election and cannot be overlooked. They cannot be taken for granted.

Where is Liz truss, gone into hiding?

Looking like Liz Truss will lose her seat.

We want to see the boat stopped ASAP and NHS queues reduced drastically.

Your time starts now...

missjekyll:
Bloody Fabricant is gone....Brilliant.

Unseated my rubbish con MP . Best result I could have hoped for.
YAY!

Starmer better hop to it, I m expecting results in 1 month already.

@hustla, where are you? Have you got the cybersecurity job?
Just checking as it has been a while

Welcome back Justwise.

What really happened?

justwise:


Thanks a lot, i have thousands of mentions.. yours included.

Thanks for your concerns

Count me in if the awoof involves giving the best education to my children without extra VAT after paying huge tax already.

Lexusgs430:


I hear you also love awoof.......🤔😂

We have moved close to grammar school and the idea has been binned.

Lexusgs430:


I moved to Rochester because of the grammar schools, all my children attended Grammar schools....... Why would I want to waste money on private education, when I am already heavily taxed........🤣

I agree!! Voting labour after Tories is from frying pan to fire IMO.

Cyberknight:


That's the problem with the FTP system, alas.
I'm no fan of either Labour or the Tories; they're two cheeks of the same fundament.

I am definitely not voting Labour as I dont want more tax.
I am not sure of who I will vote instead.

Peerielass:


Wahalla no dey finish for this country! Once Labour succeeds with the VAT charge on private schools. Their next target will be grammar schools, they will be stripping them off that status and making them non-selective schools which is why we should all fight against this policy by not voting Labour. It’s private schools today, tomorrow it will be grammar schools turn. We are living in a free state and people should be allowed to make choices that suits them.

Some grammar schools are as good or even better than some private schools. So the child is not losing but I am not paying any additional tax to any government. It is a win win for me and my child.

missjekyll:


Clap clap clap. The only vat payable on this one is on your child's cerebrum.

I was already punching calculator to consider independent school for my son but based on this policy, our focus is now on Grammar School. Let us use our tax well and save our money.

Peerielass:


Second bolded - I belong to a few Facebook groups of parents in private schools and majority of them have categorically stated they won’t be able to afford 20% fee increase especially those of them with more than 1 child. Some of them living in England have even gone to the extent of contacting their LAs and MPS requesting information on available school places in their catchment schools. Majority of the schools are oversubscribed and councils are offering schools which are more than 5 miles away which would also mean additional transportation expense for the LA (read Taxi to and fro school).

Perhaps you should be asking Labour how they intend to staff the schools. I see many adverts for primary and secondary school teachers on my local authority’s website but there are no takers. You would argue that they would probably pinch the teachers from private schools that have gone bust but those teachers left the state sector for a reason and I highly doubt they will be willing to go back.

Those sending their children to independent schools paid for oversubscribed state schools through their taxes, so in effect Labour now want them to pay twice.

The Govt should be giving parents a refund on their taxes for not using the state system, not doubly penalising them.

Imagine if all people sending their schools to private schools decide to use state schools instead. Is there provision for everyone?

Goodenoch:


But it is a discount. We buy cars and houses and whatever else from already taxed income. That argument doesn't mean anything and doesn't show why private education should be VAT exempt.

The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of parents cannot send their children to private schools. If you can, you're 'well to do' far above the average whether you consider yourself wealthy or not or whether you're making sacrifices to do it or not. Same as parents sending their children to Covenant University are almost universally going to be doing much better than the average parent of kids at UNILAG.

In principle, there's zero reason why the government and general public should be subsidising what is essentially a luxury (because private school parents not paying VAT costs the entire country via the loss of the funds that could have been raised, and therefore result in lost services or increased tax elsewhere).

Now, one valid point you've made is about how kids leaving private schools could lead to lots of pressure on public schools but the counter argument will be that funds raised from VAT on private school fees will pay for expanding capacity in state schools. It's not even clear that so many people will leave private schools. There has been conflicting data on that from what I've been reading, e.g. https://taxpolicy.org.uk/2024/06/02/independent_schools_misleading_vat/

My thoughts exactly!! This policy will mostly affect the middle class earners, who are trying their best to give the best to their kids.

Labour wants everyone to remain under council control. No incentive of increasing income as you will be taxed to death. I wonder how a country will be productive when productivity is being discouraged.

Peerielass:


The trouble with the bolded is that only 1% of private schools fall in the category of Winchester and Eton college. Those type of schools will easily absorb any VAT charge as their clientele are mostly rich kids from abroad and wealthy locals. It’s the smaller independent schools that provide support for SEND kids and provide bursaries and scholarships to thousands of gifted kids from poorer background that would bear the brunt of this policy. This is what Labour fails to understand.

According to you and Labour, anyone that sends their kids to private schools is wealthy. You fail to realise that a lot of parents make huge sacrifices to put their kids through private school by choice. Some people forego holidays, drive old jalopy cars and live in smaller houses just to be able to afford tuition fees whereas some state school parents are driving top of the range cars, live in fancy houses in the best catchment area for grammar schools and are able to holiday in various exotic destinations but according to Labour, these people are not wealthy….it’s the private school parents that are wealthy. Real politics of envy! It costs the Council about £8,000 to educate a child in secondary school. Private school parents are actually saving the government a lot of money by not taking up state school places. Instead they should be given a tax rebate as done in other European countries for saving the government money. What will now become of this your £1billion additional funding if 50% of the pupils in smaller private schools decide to withdraw their kids due to unaffordability, will Labour find spaces for them in oversubscribed states schools and how will the government fund it?

I couldn’t help but laugh at the second bolded. You are speaking from a place of ignorance if you think it’s perfectly ok for a transgender person to share public spaces with women and girls. Google Isla Bryson and see what happened when they were sent to a female prison. All hell broke loose - this is one of the main reasons why Nicola had to quit as SNP leader.

Like I said, each to their own but I will not vote Labour not whilst they are pursuing these policies.