₦airaland Forum

meipsum1: If a child of God divorce his/her spouse on the ground of infidelity and remarries, will he/she still be able to make Heaven owing to the fact that Jesus said we should not divorce?

Jesus did not condemn divorce. He said the only scriptural ground for divorce allowing for remarriage is adultery- Matt 19:9-New Living Translation (©2007)
And I tell you this, whoever divorces his wife and marries someone else commits adultery--unless his wife has been unfaithful." Ofcourse the offended mate can chose to forgive.

It depends on how comfortable you and your hosts feel. If you're adding value, helping the family with lil errands and generally being useful, chances are that they wont get easily irritated by ur presence. But if u're taking space, eating food and acting like its a hotel doing stuff only for urself, no initiative whatsoever, u'll be seen as a pest and I'll personally make sure u sense that if I'm ur host. Truth is, as soon as u can afford, u shd leave sha. Heard of a guy who squats with his a married friend but has made enough from his job to buy a ride- misplaced priority if u ask me.

adventisty: With human logic/reasoning you WILL never comprehend the concept of TRINITY!
This is absolute mystery that ONLY God will explain to you when you make heaven.
Your primary duty now is to make heaven and ask GOD this question when you get there.
So many mystery human cannot really give explanation to, you can think of many more of such!!!!

Unless you know the truth about God and his purposes and live in accordance with God's will, you stand no chance of making heaven, infact your worship will be in vain.-Mark 7:6-8He said to them: “Isaiah aptly prophesied about YOU hypocrites, as it is written, ‘This people honor me with [their] lips, but their hearts are far removed from me. 7 It is in vain that they keep worshiping me, because they teach as doctrines commands of men.’ 8 Letting go the commandment of God, YOU hold fast the tradition of men.”
You're better off making sure of the more important things, and holding fast to what is true. ONLY THE TRUTH CAN SET YOU FREE.

adventisty: The analogy of an egg best explain this: The parts are three but still one each with distinct functions.
Also, using a three in one stereo which has a cassette cormpartment, a radio and a CD compartment but it is still one Unit.
Or A machine which is mono block that has a rinser, a filling and a capping units all in one block.
You do not refer to these aformentioned analogy as different but one.

You definitely are intelligent. I Can't imagine however, how the greatest man who ever lived, the very epitome of wisdom could not think of any illustration to help us understand this 'mystery'. Especially considering that he came down to earth to help us gain KNOWLEDGE of the father, KNOWLEDGE that our lives depend on-John 17:3

peterugoobi: I will tell you a story which you can google to verify its authenticity

a man now st augustine didn't believe in the trinity, but as a devout and pious man he wasn't rash in his judgement as many christains are concerning the things of God so he prayed for enlightement.

On day walking on a beach, he saw a young boy with a spoon in this hand. The boy would repeatedly go to the ocean, get ocean water in is spoon then pour the ocean water into a small hole he dug by the beach. Saint augustine who has being watching the boy came up worried to him and asked him "young man what are you trying to do?" the boy still carrying on with his task replied the saint " l want to empty the entire ocean into this small hole!". The saint said to him "that it is IMPOSSIBLE! To do that" then the boy who had very turned to look at saint augustine turned and told him "how then do you expect to understand the mystery of the blessed trinity" and disappered.

Virgin l love you save souls

1st Timothy 4:7 Do not have anything to do with godless myths and fables of old women. Instead, train yourself to be godly. One reason Jesus came to earth was to teach us the truth about God, reveal as it were, the father to us-John 1:18. Truth that can set us free. Truth we're incapable of grasping?

tevinsolt: No you are the one trying so hard to disqualify what bible teaches....can God die = no, can man die= yes
Jesus being fully God and man, was obedient to death in his human state

1. If the son is GOD/MAN and the father is GOD. How is it that there are co-substantial or of thesame essence?
2. Why are the roles never reversed? Father knows some things, son doesn't. Father sent son to die. Father raises son from death. Father grants son authority. Father created son. Father sits on throne, son sits on the right hand. Are there instances where the son plays roles that suggest superiority or even eqaulity with father?

LemonBoy1: in dt case, u nd animals r dsame. U av never seen God, bt u believe in God dt He exists? Y? Y wil u believe smbody's own reasoning (cos u were actualy taught so by sm one) dt God exists when u av nt seen God wit ur 2 eyes?

(Romans 1:20) For his invisible [qualities] are clearly seen from the world’s creation onward, because they are perceived by the things made, even his eternal power and Godship, so that they are inexcusable; Again the scriptures show that only the stupid say that there is no God.-pd 14:1

There really is no comparison here cos my believes are based not only on what I see but on what the bible says. I do not mean to get you worked up but if you have believes that you hold on to without scriptural basis, then u shd drop it. In between, try to refer to the bible in ur next post.

LemonBoy1: D trinitarians / catholics in ds thread need nt waste their strength nd time xplaining the HOLY TRINITY, reasn because " Its beyond Human reasoning nd comprehension" nd dts y here in Catholic Church its called "the Mystrey of The Holy Trinity" sch dt even His Holiness (The Pope) himself won't venture exhausting ds issue for fear of blasphemy sef. So my fellow trinitarians, GOD'S ESSENCE can't be fully comprehended evn by angels nt 2 talk of humans sef

Why are we different from animals if we cannot reason logically and draw conclusions? The only reason y the trinity doctrine cannot be explained is that it is false. The truth is so so glaring. I wish you could just step away for a while and examine the facts and let the scriptures speak for themselves.

magmegas: Jn 1vs1
In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God and through him all things were made and the word was made flesh.
Christ is the word made flesh, the flesh is with God and the flesh is God. therefore Christ is God and the Spirit is God that comforts and edifies.

Read also vs 18.

He was with God, so he couldn't have been the same person he was with. So two persons are referenced here. Isaiah said Jesus would be called Mighty God. He is, however, not the Almighty God, who is superior to him. That's the crux of the issue.

John 1:1 does not show equality or that they are the same person. Other Bible verses clearly show that God is the head of the Christ. Jesus also clearly said the Father is greater than him.

If you agree that God the Father is above Jesus, then there's no argument. And you do not believe the Trinity. You need to check the definition of the Trinity by it's creators - Athanacean (sp?) creed they call it, I think.

Oahray: Hehehehe.... Funny thread. Trinitarians, una funny sha. Its only Trinitarians that would say:
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(1) A person (Jesus) can be equal to his God (John 17:20).
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(2) The Father is greater than the Son (John 14:28), yet they are equal.
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(3) The Father gives the Son authority, and the Son subjects himself to God (1 Cor 15:27,28), yet they are equal.
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(4) The Father is the head of the Son (1 Cor 11:3), yet they are equal.
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(5) The Father's will dominates that of the son (Luke 22:42), yet they are equal.
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(6) The Father sent the Son (John 17:3), but they are equal.
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(7) The Son cannot speak of his own originality but what the father tells him (John 7:17; 14:10), yet they are equal.
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(8.) The Father gave the Son a revelation (Rev 1:1), yet they equal.
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(9) The Father resurrected the Son (2 Cor 4:14), yet they are equal.
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(10) The Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative (John 5:19) but does what he beholds the Father doing, yet he is equal to the father anyway.
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(11) The Father is the ONLY TRUE GOD and Jesus is the one He sent (John 17:3), yet they are equal.
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(12) Jesus doesnt have the power to grant the sitting at his right or left, but his Father does (Matt 20:20-23), yet they are equal.
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(13) Blasphemy against the Son will be forgiven but blasphemy against the holy spirit will not be forgiven (Matt 12:31,32), yet they are the same.
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I don tire to cite instances sef... Its endless. The Bible quashes the pagan doctrine everywhere you go.
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When people who refuse to think, have no sensible answers to the questions posed to them from the gaping holes of that pagan doctrine, they would say God is a mystery. Yet Jesus said knowledge of God and (Jesus) himself would mean life (John 17:3).
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Trinitarians, I smh for una sha.

Good Job! this is all so staright forward and easy to understand. It baffles me how people chose to believe a mystery they cant explain.

tevinsolt: a woman being the helper to her husband doesn't disqualify the fact they're both Human by worth
a boss being higher than his employee doesn't make him more of human or the employee less a human

my dad is higher than me but we are still coequal in the sense that we both have the ability of doing a human can do. as simple as that bro

so u dont agree that JESUS IS EQUAL TO HIS FATHER?

Chuksxp: I addressed your question earlier:
https://www.nairaland.com/1113061/believe-holy-trinity/5#13114002

Almighty is superior. The thing is, Jesus was called both Mighty and Almighty in the Bible. See Rev 1:8 and Isaiah 9. Even the Father was called Almighty and Mighty. So, it's all the same.

Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. The only capital 'S' we see in the Bible.

JESUS has never been referred to as ALMIGHTY COS HE'S NOT. Google REV 1:8 and confirm that that verse refers to His father.

Chuksxp: I agree. No one said they were the same person. One God: three persons.

You say John 1:1 does not show equality. Please tell us what it shows.

Jesus said He had all authority on heaven and on earth. Sounds like Almighty to me. In Revelations He calls Himself the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end.

“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.” ~ Revelation 1:8

When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades. Revelation 1:17,18

I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Revelation 22:13

WHO GAVE HIM ALL THE AUTHORITY? PLEASE READ 1ST COR 14:24-28 BEFORE YOU RESPOND.

Chuksxp: Son of God or God, all join. If I say I'm the son of a man, then automatically I'm claiming to be a man, right? Likewise, by saying He's the Son of God, Jesus is claiming to be God.

Please answer this qestion. Why was Jesus worshiped?

What is the difference between MIGHTY and ALMIGHTY? Which is superior?

Plus u need to get a more encompassing word, the angels are sons of God(n therefore GODS according to you), Adam was also referred to as son of God(and therefore God, according to you). So there are definitely not just 3. You just showed that TRINITY IS FALSE.

TroGunn: John was explaining what the Jews thought.

Actually, Jesus is not the only one call son of God. Angels are several times called the sons of God (e.g. Job 38:7) since they had no fathers, being directly created by God. Likewise, Adam was called the son of God (Luke 3:38), because he was directly created.

Jesus, of course, is far special from the other sons of God because he is "the only begotten Son of God", far above Adam and angels. Something the Jews also misunderstood.

Everything you have said here is scriptural and I agree. HE IS SO SO SPECIAL,HE'S THE ONLY ONE WHO IS 'ONLY BEGOTTEN SON', 'FIRST BORN OF ALL CREATION'-COL 1:15, AND HE'S 2ND IN COMMAND ONLY TO GOD-1ST COR 14:26-28

Chuksxp: And it's interesting that no one addressed my post here:

https://www.nairaland.com/1113061/believe-holy-trinity/1#13110823

Jesus was worshipped, prayed to, and praised and given glory.

If you worship, pray to, or praise someone other than God, just know you're an idol worshipper.

I didn't see it earlier. I'll respond after you say whether the titles ALMIGHTY and MIGHTY mean thesame thing. And if not, which is greater.

Chuksxp: Re-read John 5:18. Unlike John 10:33, it wasn't the jews speaking now. It was John, the author, explaining what was happening.

But who said that Jesus was making himself equal to God? Not Jesus. He defended himself against this false charge in the very next verse (19): “To this accusation Jesus replied: . . . ‘the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees the Father doing.’”—JB.
By this, Jesus showed the Jews that he was not equal to God and therefore could not act on his own initiative. Can we imagine someone equal to Almighty God saying that he could “do nothing by himself”? (Compare Daniel 4:34, 35.) Interestingly, the context of both John 5:18 and 10:30 shows that Jesus defended himself against false charges from Jews who, like the Trinitarians, were drawing wrong conclusions- NAMELY THAT HE CLAIMED HE WAS EQUAL TO GOD

Chuksxp: Re-read John 5:18. Unlike John 10:33, it wasn't the jews speaking now. It was John, the author, explaining what was happening.

The account simply states what the Jews said. Maybe its ur turn to explain JOHN 14:28, 1ST Cor 11:3 and the many other scriptures that categorically say that GOD IS GREATER THAN JESUS

Artemisthe1st: king James, is triple times better than NIV, but it was compiled by the Anglicans, and there just abt 500 yrs old... I prefer using scriptures that av nt bn soiled by human hands... U knw say sm of d reasons we av many denominations is because of the number of different translated bibles... So i use the new Jerusalem bible, or the Armenian or the Septuagint, those were the first scripture compiled books used by the apostles themselves

Now here's the king James version
New King James Version (NKJV)- 1 Corinthians 15:24-28

24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death. 27 For “He has put all things under His feet.”[a] But when He says “all things are put under Him,” it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted. 28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.

Chuksxp: To call yourself the Son of God isn't something to take lightly. Everyone knew that by calling Himself the Son of God He was claiming deity. He was claiming equality with God. See John 5:18

For this reason they tried all the more to kill him; not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God. ~ John 5:18

That's what the Jews claimed, not what Jesus said. We haven't exhausted the things he said about he and his father and you think we should start looking out how his listeners(not his disciples but his enemies) understood him? Naaaaaah. Now this is how his disciples understood him- MATT 16:16. 'In response Peter said to him, you are the CHRIST, THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD"

Artemisthe1st: guy, i don't av dt luxury to sit down n read ur boringing post, i advise wen next u want to quote bible for us, use a reasonable bible not one dt was twisted by heretics n schismatics

KK. U prefer King James?

Artemisthe1st: hahahahaha... rOTFLMAO... NIV is nt a bible joor, that is a book that has twisted the original scriptures (bible)

You should read that verse from a bible and see if the meaning is different before rotf and l

Chuksxp: Not just purpose. Please read the full context of that scenario where Jesus said He and the Father were one. And observed the reactions of the jews to that. They understood what He meant.

I and the Father are one.” Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus said to them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?” “We are not stoning you for any good work,” they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God” ~ John 10:30-33

You base your believe not one what Jesus said, but on how the Jews UNDERSTOOD him? Isn't that risky? What if the jews misunderstood him(like they obviously did)?

Please don't stop at 33, read down to verse 36. Clearing up their MISUNDERSTANDING Jesus said,"do you say I blaspheme because I say to you I AM GOD'S SON?"

Chuksxp: In another place He says He and the Father are one. We need to harmonize the two. Let's not take on one scripture and reject the other.

Concerning His servant-ship, He chose to be a servant, in mutual agreement with the Father.

"Who, being in very nature of God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant" ~ Philipians 2:6,7

We will not take one scripture and reject another, we will allow the bible to explain itself. Jesus is very very important, the mediator between God and man-1st Tim 2:5, Our ransomer- John 14:28 SUBJECT ONLY TO GOD-1ST COR 15:27,28

Chuksxp: In another place He says He and the Father are one. We need to harmonize the two. Let's not take on one scripture and reject the other.

Concerning His servant-ship, He chose to be a servant, in mutual agreement with the Father.

"Who, being in very nature of God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant" ~ Philipians 2:6,7

JOHN 17:21- Jesus prayed that all his disciples be ONE just as he and the father are ONE. That we be ONE with himself and his father. This godhead is BIGGGGGGGG. Now on a serious note, the oneness means unity of purpose. Husband and wife are one, and yet Husband is head of wife. 1st cor 11:3

Jutresbien: Faith alone is not enough. ACCURATE KNOWLEDGE is required- John 17:3. Thats what Jesus meant by 'the truth will set you free'. Its important to confirm that the bible supports you believes as a christian, else, it'll all be a waste of time.

JOHN 17:3 "This means everlasting life, their taking in knowledge of YOU, THE ONLY TRUE GOD and of the ONE WHOM YOU SENT FORTH, JESUS CHRIST". Jesus said those words in prayer to his father. READ AGAIN AND AGAIN AND PRAYERFULLY MEDITATE.

ikachi1: Has anyone seen God? We all work by faith and faith is believing in those things not seen. We are all here killing ourselves on existence of trinity or no trinity. As a Catholic, I believe in the doctrine of trinity because I have faith that it is correct. God Himself has appeared to us in three ways. He has Himself, through His son Jesus Christ and through the Holy Spirit. We invent everything controversial and not useful in this country and we are taking the lead in re-inventing Christianity. It is not a place of worship any more but a place for business and class display.

Faith alone is not enough. ACCURATE KNOWLEDGE is required- John 17:3. Thats what Jesus meant by 'the truth will set you free'. Its important to confirm that the bible supports you believes as a christian, else, it'll all be a waste of time.

Chuksxp: I'm not saying for sure He can't be seen. I just said I coudn't recall any passage which says He could be seen. I could be wrong. I'll study more on that.

I'll be glad to learn what you find out on that. Check out too if the holy spirit has a name, the father and son do. And maybe why the holy spirit takes on forms-flame of fire, dove etc when it is seen.

Chuksxp: I don't know. Do you prefer disorder?

For God is not a God of disorder but of peace ~ 1Corinthians 14:33a

God is definitely not a God of disorder. Jesus himself said THE FATHER IS GREATER THAN I AM.-John 14:28 Again the apostle Paul was inspired to write THE HEAD OF THE CHRIST IS GOD-1st Cor 11:3. That is why the order exits and can never be reversed. Infact more than one verse of the bible refers to Jesus as God's servant(of course thats why God was able to SEND him)-Acts 3:26

Chuksxp: The Holy Spirit is God. He's omnipresent. He was on the throne. By the way, I don't recall that the Holy Spirit could be seen.

same essence, same nature, same this, same that and yet father and son can be seen but not the holy spirit.

Artemisthe1st: I have seen plenty mumu in this post, so let me shed some light to all those who doubt the existence of the holy trinity...
Our lord, Jesus revealed God's three in oneness rather gradually in order not to shake the deep and abiding faith of the Jews in the oneness of God :

1) he first revealed the father : Christ started by first revealing God the father. He begins with the same ancient Jewish doctrine. " hear O Israel! The lord (Yahweh) our God is one God" (mk. 12:29) and continues the familiar teaching of the kingdom of God (Matt. 13). But then, he shows how this God in heaven, truly loves us, cares for us and watches over us. (Matt 6:25-32, 7:7-11).

2) then he revealed the son : once Jesus has revealed his father to his listeners, he gradually reveals that he too is God. He is the son of God in a very special way, not just as we are. But the true and proper son of God, the only begotten of the father. He claims power to change divine laws (matt 5:21-48), to be lord of the sabbath (Matt 12:28), to be able to forgive sin (mk 2:5), to have existed before Abraham (Jn 8:57) and to be the only one hu truly knows the father in heaven (Matt 11:27). In fact at his trial, he clearly claimed to be God (Mk 14:61-62) and openly allowed Thomas to call him "my lord and my God" (Jn 20:28). Jesus is not claiming to be a second God for he says " I and the father are one" (Jn 10:30). As proof of theses claims Jesus worked countless miracles.

3) Finally he revealed the holyspirit : Towards the end of his life on earth, Jesus revealed the holyspirit. He promised to send the spirit after his ascension : "The advocate, the holyspirit, whom the father will send in my name, he will teach you all things" (Jn. 14:26). Chapter 14 through 17 of the same gospel indicates that the spirit really is a person, together with the father and the son, for the second person pronoun He and not it is used for him...

Apart from theses proofs that the holy trinity does exist... I have 3 more proofs

1) Genesis 1:2 :- "in the beginning, GOD created the heavens and the earth... And the SPIRIT OF GOD was hovering over the waters"

2) Genesis 1:26 :- here God said, "let us make man in our own image...." thus revealing that he (God) was not alone before creation. Jesus, the son was to confirm when he told the Jews "before Abraham, i was" (Jn 8:58). And Jn 17:24, Jesus talked about the love the father has for him "... Before creation of the world". The prophet Micah 5:1 tells us that the origins of Jesus "are from old from ancient times".

3) Gen 11:7 :- God planned to confuse the tongues of the builders of the tower of babel as a trinity when he said "Come, let us go down and confuse their language"

I've obviously made my point, if you have any doubts about the most holy trinity, then the devil is using you to ruin the doctrine passed down for over 2000years... I rest my case...

I got put off my your first line. If you want responsible people to listen and reason with you, take out the insults, there's nothing christlike about throwing insults around. I'd prolly have read and responded. sowi.

Chuksxp: Yes, they are equal. Same nature, essence, substance.
At the same time, I believe there's an order in the Godhead. Father - Son - Holy Spirit

Why is there an order? Equality means either HS-SON-FATHER, FATHER-HS-SON SON-HS-FATHER ETC