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Nairaland Forum / Entertainment / Sports / European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) / Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England (220935 Views)
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Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Silentgroper(m): 3:27pm On May 27, 2022 |
Openmine.. wasnt lovren exit d reason we got vvd... U said matip stepped up only when we go konate.. No that's very wrong.. Being paired with vvd might have bring out his best but it's surely nt wen konate was gotten.. If u say gomez- vvd pair was better, y did klopp kept opting for matip- vvd pair |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 3:32pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside: ![]() Ohh lord....so lovren was the only defender that partnered Matip abi? Did Matip not partner Gomez? What was the outcome? More goals conceded! ![]() Even when VVD partnered lovren,he turned to a superstar defender thanks to VVD! Smh I even thought I was going to see an 8 or even an 8.5 at least to justify your 'best defender' narrative of Matip! Now go and check the stats of VVD and while checking also compare with Matip's performance after VVD arrived! Oga let's get one thing clear....l admire the performance of Matip so far as an LFC fan and I have said it in several occasions but confidently saying Matip was the best defender before VVD showed up is absurd and explicitly confusing! If I buy a defender and he is already walking into the first team and giving instructions,then it means there was virtually no defence initially! Why hire an expert to an accounting firm when the head accountant who is described as being the best and yet can't tell why the company keeps losing money! VVD made all the defenders better joor! Give honour to whom its due! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 3:43pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:So, LFC conceeding too much goals wasn't because of Klopp's non-conservative approach in his earlier days, Lovren being a shitty defender, and Mignolet/Karius being shitty keepers? According to you, it was all down to Matip's ineptitude. You are very funny. ![]() ![]() ![]() Below is a list of LFC Centre backs before VVD: Joel Matip Mamadou Sakho Dejan Lovren Ragnar Klavan Joe Gomez Please tell me who was better than Matip amongst the listed. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 3:48pm On May 27, 2022 |
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Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Silentgroper(m): 3:49pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside:You're right.. 4rm what i recall, lovren was d problem of our backline then not matip.. Atleast if matip wasnt so good, klopp wouldnt prefer his pairing with vvd over gomez's. What now has me shocked abt his whole write up was when he said d purchase of konate made matip stepped up. Openmine, do u knw using stats to judge a player has its flaws esp wen d player constantly goes out on injury.. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 3:52pm On May 27, 2022 |
Silentgroper: The context of Matip stepping up was that he became more prominent this season in defence and attack esp and also had more time to rest as konate was also sharing in the partnership of VVD...hence he never played all the matches which would have been bad considering his injury history! VVD didn't just make the other defenders better,he made them step up to the plate....infact,according to a pundit,VVD made the job of his partner to be less stressful due to his leadership,calmness and the very fact that he anticipates danger before it happens with his timely tackles! During the 2019/2020 season which was our season when we clinched the EPL,VVD/Gomez were so phenomenal in defence to a point where we hardly conceded goals...All of a sudden,Matip and lovren were looking like 3rd and 4th choice defenders! The VVD/Matip partnership returned after Gomez had a lengthy injury! Lovren did not leave after the emergence of VVD! VVD came during the middle of 2017/2018 season and lovren left after the 2019/2020! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 3:58pm On May 27, 2022 |
Silentgroper:Ask him to bring the stats to prove Matip was not our best defender pre-VVD. ![]() |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 3:58pm On May 27, 2022 |
EgusiShankly:He is actually starting out bro. Saying he is trash just condemns him totally. Even Klopp almost got Mainz relegated. Have some respect for him. He is why we won the 5th and 6th UCL. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 4:01pm On May 27, 2022 |
Silentgroper:There is no difference between stats and watching a game! Infact watching a game can make one bypass the performance of some players that are key to the overall success of the team...for instance,not everyone sees what the likes of Fabinho or Jorginho does on the pitch but only stats will actually let u in on their performance! Don't get me wrong, I also watch games asides checking the stats! See I acknowledge the fact the performance of Matip and we all can relate with his injury history,however we must put things into context...Before VVD,we were poor in defence and this was not only the fault of lovren because when Matip was partnered with Gomez,the leak did not stop! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 4:02pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside:Yeah best defender and we could not stop the goals until VVD showed up! Waoh...amazing! ![]() |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 4:05pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside:None until VVD showed up and made them better! Simple! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 4:18pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:Only VVD was responsible for the reduction in goal conceeded. Klopp tweaking his game to a more conservative approach, Allison's outstanding performances, selling dross like Moreno, Mignolet, Lovren etc played no part ![]() ![]() |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 4:20pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:That's has been my point since the beginning. Matip was clear of the rest of our defenders before VVD. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 4:20pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside:Openmine. Matip was actually really good and our best before VVD. The problem is he rarely frequently played, and had people who were too error prone alongside him. Don't forget the GKs we had, and oh,the Midfield. We also had Moreno in defense. Gomez and Matip first partnered as CBs last season. They've never ever been paired prior to then. For Matip to still remain even after Klavan, Lovren Sakho, you need to know he did something right. Don't forget the others aren't injury prone. Even Van Dijk admits Matip is better than him in some areas. What Matip lacks is that calmness and commanding nature and game reading. But if it's to carry the ball, tackle and all, he is good. Real good, and better than the others we had. The only debate is who between him and Gomez is better. I would say, it has both sides to look at. In terms of defending, Gomez on his day is ruthless, you can't bully him, he bullies you. But when it comes to giving that attacking pass or breaking into Midfield, Matip has it. Lovren is good but too error prone and too hasty. The guy too dey do gra gra. But I like him in terms nodding ball into the net and bullying attackers. 1 Like |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 4:25pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside:This is the mistake you guys have. He isn't really the only one, cause if you follow it well, when VVD came, the error prone guys started taking a step back, guys like Moreno, we got Robertson playing more and Trent getting into the team. Am not discrediting VVD but putting it on the team also. After all, VVD was in the game we played where 7 goals went past him. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 4:29pm On May 27, 2022 |
Minemrys:I do not deny what you are saying! However, the narrative of Matip being the 'best defender' felt sightly odd to me and made it look as though VVD was not actually needed! They were all average until VVD showed up and administered is leadership qualities and calmness which none of them including Matip had! This brought the best out of Matip and Gomez and also lovren because VVD had once pair with him! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 4:31pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside:Simple! Sarcasm or not! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 4:36pm On May 27, 2022 |
Minemrys:That was an off game that could have happened to any team! Even during the glory days of manutd,they got trashed by a LFC at old trafford and yet won the league! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 4:41pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:Getting trashed by arch rivals Lfc at old Trafford isn't to be considered a one off. We actually challenged for the league in those years. Yes, the Villa game was a one off but my point is it happened not because of one person but cause the team was off. It was until Klopp's 2nd full season that we started having a team. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 4:44pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:You aren't getting the argument. The argument was of all the CBs then,Matip was the best. He was actually better than the average guys. In games without VVD, he has actually had to stand up. That's assuming everyone in the team do their part. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 5:06pm On May 27, 2022 |
Minemrys:Oh! You didn't get the sarcasm. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 5:07pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:Sarcasm my friend, sarcasm ![]() |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Nobody: 5:51pm On May 27, 2022 |
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Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 8:20pm On May 27, 2022 |
alekside:Unfortunately your half hearted sarcasm is an indirect plus about VVD! VVD is the one and only defender! He leads the defence calmly and the rest follow including your dearly beloved 'world best defender' Matip! Its as simple as that! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 8:23pm On May 27, 2022 |
Minemrys:This is not true! Games without VVD have been tough and the goals started leaking! Case in study...LFC vs Benfica! At this stage,we cant do without him..Its as simple as that! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 8:26pm On May 27, 2022 |
Minemrys:You were alluding to VVD letting 7 goals get past him and i only showed U using that Manutd as an instance where they conceded heavily despite having a watertight defence then! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 8:49pm On May 27, 2022 |
Good news LFC fans! Thiago will likely play tomorrow!
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Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 10:34pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:That one is quite different. We were actually good on the day and better than United. Besides when we have always beaten United at old Trafford, it usually goes by 3 goals, 4 goals. It's not like it's a one off. Vvd letting 7 past him was because the boys lost focus against an opponent that wasn't a derby. It's like saying we concede 7 against Everton or United. We can't cause we will be very focused. Winning a derby is by merit. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 10:38pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:Nope. I disagree. You make it sound like we don't keep clean sheets without VVD. Listen, VVD is good at defense but it's also a team effort. I have seen where Vvd makes a mistake and Robbo covers for him. Vvd has an input but it's all on the team not just him. That's the notion I want to correct. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by Minemrys: 10:40pm On May 27, 2022 |
openmine:If you talk about Benfica then what about Inter Milan or Villarreal? It's cause the boys lacked concentration. Like against West Ham, Brentford Brighton. Van Dijk started those games. |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 10:45pm On May 27, 2022 |
Minemrys:Those were just few games...the question is did such results happen consistently? However games where he didn't feature, we suffered defensively! Check your stats! |
Re: Liverpool FC Fan Zone: Champions of England by openmine(m): 11:03pm On May 27, 2022 |
Minemrys:U are entitled to your opinion! VVD is not just great but a colossal in defence! He brought calmness and leadership qualities to that defence that no one has ever done since the time of Sami Hyypia! True its a team game but without VVD we are no where! Let me ask...if you were a manager playing Real madrid or Mancity,would you pair Matip and konate knowing there is a VVD on the bench? Input? hilarious! Please state just 5 EPL games we played this season without VVD and did not concede! |
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