₦airaland Forum

HellVictorinho4:
The onus is on you to state how he can exist after death or after ceasing to exist.

Atheism is inability to believe right?

You know why it is inability to believe?
Because it is as a result of inability to read, and i wouldn't blame you people.

For you to read you have to first of all condition your mind by being introduced to the basics. It's like an adult who never studied science from childhood, then you give him advanced science textbook to read, he will not be able to read it, that's how religious books are

Infact, religious books are even more complex

paxonel:
you can't impose this belief to anyone, you have to present a strong argument first
how do you know this, have you ever find yourself at a realm after death to know this?

After death, nothing else.
Also, I can't impose my belief on anyone. Same nobody can impose any religious beliefs on me because they can't proof the existence of God.
Even if he actually exist, he weak, dull and not all knowing.

paxonel:
you can't impose this belief to anyone, you have to present a strong argument first
how do you know this, have you ever find yourself at a realm after death to know this?

The question should be directed to you who believe there is a realm after death. Have you been there before?

paxonel:
Atheism is inability to believe right?

Wrong. I was a believer before I became an atheist.

paxonel:
You ask intelligent questions

Yes!
And this death will only occur in the spirit realm after his death
ofcourse i will die. But i will not die in the spirit realm like LordReed
atheists are giving birth to children like everyone else, so more atheists will come up
God's plan is that he gives everyone options to choose. You can either choose to be believer or a Non believer like atheists.

Deuteronomy 30:15 See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;
that i choosed life.

But whether that life exist or not.
Whether God exist or not .
Where LordReel will die or not, will only be justified after we die.

You started by sounding sure then ended by saying whether this or that, anything after death will justify.


You spoke like there's anything like God's plan because of Bible quotes with no proof of verifiability.

Furthermore, the justification after death is impossible since there's nothing after death that justifies it.


In fact,you have failed to define the spirit realm.

You have also failed to state how a spirit can exist.


I know a spirit is meant to be a living possessor of certain characteristics which never includes a surface.



But that's impossible because a living possessor must also possess a surface.


A surface is required for a non-living possessor or some other living possessor to have direct contact with it.

In other words,if something is alive ,it must have a surface where another living possessor or a non-living possessor can have direct contact.


The direct contact with this or that living possessor or non-posssessor anyhow possible has to show an awareness or exposure by chance.


So,if a person dies,does it mean there's a transformation into a different sort of living possessor?

Well, ageing has to do with a breakdown which is sometimes required for a transformation of something but the question is what breaks down here?


So, you want to know what it means to be dead while alive or dead...... that's not really possible.


You can't know what it means to know nothing while you know something .

You can't know what it means to know nothing even when you don't know anything..... because if you don't know anything , you won't know you don't know anything.


But if you know something, you would know you know something.


You would know you know something because knowing is the state in which a drive or drives are accidentally manifested when there's direct contact between surfaces.


The specific drive starts and ends by chance .....it might last for as long as knowing remains...it might not.


The drive is what causes you to move or remain stationary in order to show that you know that you know something but you might not really be able to show that you know anything specific.


You know that you know means you experience the state of your drive being accidentally manifested or formed as something without a surface or as the message being passed across through a behavior and such message might be this or that.


You experience the state means your existence as a combination involves you moving or remaining stationary to show there's a message to be considered by some other living possessor.....as this or that.

If the drive ends while the knowing remains, another must replace it.

In fact, when you're dead, you won't know you're dead except death is not the end of you as a living possessor.


You can't know when you cease to know your environment.


When death means you cease to know your environment,then you can't know where you are as the dead.


If you can't know where you are,then you can't know you are.


Knowing that you are also means knowing how you are which is someone with a phone at least.

Knowing you're someone with a phone is impossible if you don't know where any phone is.


So,if there's a transformation, what's transforming?


Is it the state in which a drive or drives are accidentally manifested or formed?


Is it the surfaces?


A specific living possessor possesses both the state and the surfaces.


The identity is also the combination of the state and the surfaces.


If the surfaces breaking down means those drives would stop showing LordReed, there would never be the EXACT LordReed you witnessed on Nairaland ever again.


But if there is a pattern of drives to be manifested as the drives of LordReed no matter what happens to the surfaces involved ,then LordReed would surely remain on Earth as LordReed even if it means re-incarnating.

paxonel:
Atheism is inability to believe right?

You know why it is inability to believe?
Because it is as a result of inability to read, and i wouldn't blame you people.

For you to read you have to first of all condition your mind by being introduced to the basics. It's like an adult who never studied science from childhood, then you give him advanced science textbook to read, he will not be able to read it, that's how religious books are

Infact, religious books are even more complex

Listen to yourself again

1MILLIONLiGHTS:
Even demons know GOD is real and powerful.
But the same demons are deceiving you, so that you'll join them in their suffering, damnation and everlasting restlessness. PLEASE BE WISE.

Who created demons?

AntiChristian:
There are mainly Christians/Jews terrorists. You can help us find out? Every terrorist organization will always have their aims and objectives.

Like fighting in the name of their God? What a weak and irresponsible God

Kobojunkie:
I hope you are not here suggesting jungle justice be the order of the day here ?

If the irresponsible heavenly father, like many claim can't protect is so called children, shouldn't the children protect themselves?

HellVictorinho4:
You started by sounding sure then ended by saying whether this or that, anything after death will justify.


You spoke like there's anything like God's plan because of Bible quotes with no proof of verifiability.

Furthermore, the justification after death is impossible since there's nothing after death that justifies it.


In fact,you have failed to define the spirit realm.

You have also failed to state how a spirit can exist.


I know a spirit is meant to be a living possessor of certain characteristics which never includes a surface.



But that's impossible because a living possessor must also possess a surface.


A surface is required for a non-living possessor or some other living possessor to have direct contact with it.

In other words,if something is alive ,it must have a surface where another living possessor or a non-living possessor can have direct contact.


The direct contact with this or that living possessor or non-posssessor anyhow possible has to show an awareness or exposure by chance.


So,if a person dies,does it mean there's a transformation into a different sort of living possessor?

Well, ageing has to do with a breakdown which is sometimes required for a transformation of something but the question is what breaks down here?


So, you want to know what it means to be dead while alive or dead...... that's not really possible.


You can't know what it means to know nothing while you know something .

You can't know what it means to know nothing even when you don't know anything..... because if you don't know anything , you won't know you don't know anything.


But if you know something, you would know you know something.


You would know you know something because knowing is the state in which a drive or drives are accidentally manifested when there's direct contact between surfaces.


The specific drive starts and ends by chance .....it might last for as long as knowing remains...it might not.


The drive is what causes you to move or remain stationary in order to show that you know that you know something but you might not really be able to show that you know anything specific.


You know that you know means you experience the state of your drive being accidentally manifested or formed as something without a surface or as the message being passed across through a behavior and such message might be this or that.


You experience the state means your existence as a combination involves you moving or remaining stationary to show there's a message to be considered by some other living possessor.....as this or that.

If the drive ends while the knowing remains, another must replace it.

In fact, when you're dead, you won't know you're dead except death is not the end of you as a living possessor.


You can't know when you cease to know your environment.


When death means you cease to know your environment,then you can't know where you are as the dead.


If you can't know where you are,then you can't know you are.


Knowing that you are also means knowing how you are which is someone with a phone at least.

Knowing you're someone with a phone is impossible if you don't know where any phone is.


So,if there's a transformation, what's transforming?


Is it the state in which a drive or drives are accidentally manifested or formed?


Is it the surfaces?


A specific living possessor possesses both the state and the surfaces.


The identity is also the combination of the state and the surfaces.


If the surfaces breaking down means those drives would stop showing LordReed, there would never be the EXACT LordReed you witnessed on Nairaland ever again.


But if there is a pattern of drives to be manifested as the drives of LordReed no matter what happens to the surfaces involved ,then LordReed would surely remain on Earth as LordReed even if it means re-incarnating.

you see now, you already have some school of thought perhaps you have been reading some books, not that they only come from your personal intuition and experiences.

So is mine!
I have been reading bible,that's how i know that LordReed will die in the spirit.

Now, if i want to debunk to you about this surface thing and recarnation you just said(what I'm not ready to do because i don't know anything about the book you have read to arrive at it ), then i must read the book you have read first. Otherwise, I have no business trying to convince you.
The same thing applies : if you want to tell me that LordReed will not go into a spirit realm when he dies, then you have to read the bible first to see what i saw before arriving that LordReed will die in the spirit.Then you will be in a better position to debunk my point

LordReed:
Wrong. I was a believer before I became an atheist.

it is still your inability to remain a believer, perhaps there were things you didn't understand as a believer

paxonel:
it is still your inability to remain a believer, perhaps there were things you didn't understand as a believer

It is not a question of ability/inability. If it was I would never have been a believer at all. BTW that excuse holds no water, there are many people who are believers who don't understand a tenth of what I knew as a believer.

paxonel:
you see now, you already have some school of thought perhaps you have been reading some books, not that they only come from your personal intuition and experiences.

So is mine!
I have been reading bible,that's how i know that LordReed will die in the spirit.

Now, if i want to debunk to you about this surface thing and recarnation you just said(what I'm not ready to do because i don't know anything about the book you have read to arrive at it ), then i must read the book you have read first. Otherwise, I have no business trying to convince you.
The same thing applies : if you want to tell me that LordReed will not go into a spirit realm when he dies, then you have to read the bible first to see what i saw before arriving that LordReed will die in the spirit.Then you will be in a better position to debunk my point

How do you know what the Bible said about life after death is correct?

OGwales:
If the irresponsible heavenly father, like many claim can't protect is so called children, shouldn't the children protect themselves?

Did He promise these so-called children protection from death or am I missing something here?

Are those who are able to "protect themselves" spared similar calamities as a result?

LordReed:
How do you know what the Bible said about life after death is correct?

simple!

Consistency of prophesies written in the bible.

It becomes mysterious when someone predicts a thing and that thing comes to pass.
Where did he get the power to explore the future from?

The same person now says when i die he will resurrect me back to life. that is an offer, free offer. On the condition that i believe that's all.

Now, i look at it.
Believing does not take anything from me, i have nothing to loose.
I'm not in a position to argue that you are lying sir, because I'm not spirit, i don't have supernatural powers.(remember the identity principle: if you do not know the identity of anything you cannot say anything categorically about it)

So, i do not know whether sporits exist so i cannot argue, all i can argue is the physical.

But seeing that his prophecies were consistent, obviously he has supernatural powers that is capable of fulfilling his promise.

I look at life
Life is beautiful and worth living again and again.
If mere believing will ensure that i live again after i die according to the supernatural power i have seen in him, then i will be most stupid to continue doubting since i have nothing to loose by believing.

So I believe

What have i done?
I have just applied simple wisdom

paxonel:
simple!

Consistency of prophesies written in the bible.

It becomes mysterious when someone predicts a thing and that thing comes to pass.
Where did he get the power to explore the future from?

The same person now says when i die he will resurrect me back to life. that is an offer, free offer. On the condition that i believe that's all.

Now, i look at it.
Believing does not take anything from me, i have nothing to loose.
I'm not in a position to argue that you are lying sir, because I'm not spirit, i don't have supernatural powers.(remember the identity principle: if you do not know the identity of anything you cannot say anything categorically about it)

But seeing that his prophecies were consistent, obviously he has supernatural powers that is capable of fulfilling his promise.

I look at life
Life is beautiful and worth living again and again.
If mere believing will ensure that i live again after i die according to the supernatural power i have seen in him, then i will be most stupid to continue doubting since i have nothing to loose by believing.

So I believe

What have i done?
I have just applied simple wisdom

So if a person can predict football scores with accuracy, if he tells you there's a pink unicorn floating between the moon and the earth you would believe he was accurate on a different subject?

LordReed:
It is not a question of ability/inability. If it was I would never have been a believer at all. BTW that excuse holds no water, there are many people who are believers who don't understand a tenth of what I knew as a believer.

In any way, a lot of people believe not because they know. They believe because they were groomed by their parents from childhood to believe so
That is the idea of salvation, it makes it totally free for everyone who believe

LordReed:
So if a person can predict football scores with accuracy, if he tells you there's a pink unicorn floating between the moon and the earth you would believe he was accurate on a different subject?

If there is any past record that shows that his predictions were consistently true, why then should i doubt.

I will simply say Baba carry on jo

paxonel:
you see now, you already have some school of thought perhaps you have been reading some books, not that they only come from your personal intuition and experiences.

So is mine!
I have been reading bible,that's how i know that LordReed will die in the spirit.

Now, if i want to debunk to you about this surface thing and recarnation you just said(what I'm not ready to do because i don't know anything about the book you have read to arrive at it ), then i must read the book you have read first. Otherwise, I have no business trying to convince you.
The same thing applies : if you want to tell me that LordReed will not go into a spirit realm when he dies, then you have to read the bible first to see what i saw before arriving that LordReed will die in the spirit.Then you will be in a better position to debunk my point

I read not because books make my statements true but because the truth has to make it necessary to have books.

paxonel:
you see now, you already have some school of thought perhaps you have been reading some books, not that they only come from your personal intuition and experiences.

So is mine!
I have been reading bible,that's how i know that LordReed will die in the spirit.

Now, if i want to debunk to you about this surface thing and recarnation you just said(what I'm not ready to do because i don't know anything about the book you have read to arrive at it ), then i must read the book you have read first. Otherwise, I have no business trying to convince you.
The same thing applies : if you want to tell me that LordReed will not go into a spirit realm when he dies, then you have to read the bible first to see what i saw before arriving that LordReed will die in the spirit.Then you will be in a better position to debunk my point

I never said I was sure about reincarnation.

As for surfaces....., what do you call the top of your skin for example?

paxonel:
If there is any past record that shows that his predictions were consistently true, why then should i doubt.

I will simply say Baba carry on jo

Really? Well good for you. Me on the other hand will not trust someone on a topic they have not previously shown accuracy in simply because they showed accuracy in a different topic. I tend to check things up and see how accurate they are. For me that kind of "blind" trust is what leads to being scammed and I don't want to be scammed.

While you are satisfied with the accuracy of biblical prophecy ( a highly debatable point but that's for another day) and are willing to trust what it says about every other thing, I on the other hand have not found the Bible to be accurate enough to describe this reality around us so I cannot believe what it has to say about some other realm nobody has seen or can consistently describe.

This is an example of what that kind of "blind" trust can lead to: https://people.com/crime/inside-word-of-life-christian-church-cult-murder-new-york/

HellVictorinho4:
I never said I was sure about reincarnation.

As for surfaces....., what do you call the top of your skin for example?

skin surface?

LordReed:
Really? Well good for you. Me on the other hand will not trust someone on a topic they have not previously shown accuracy in simply because they showed accuracy in a different topic. I tend to check things up and see how accurate they are. For me that kind of "blind" trust is what leads to being scammed and I don't want to be scammed.

While you are satisfied with the accuracy of biblical prophecy ( a highly debatable point but that's for another day) and are willing to trust what it says about every other thing, I on the other hand have not found the Bible to be accurate enough to describe this reality around us so I cannot believe what it has to say about some other realm nobody has seen or can consistently describe.

This is an example of what that kind of "blind" trust can lead to: https://people.com/crime/inside-word-of-life-christian-church-cult-murder-new-york/

and you think there are no blind trust in atheism also?
I mean, are there no atheists that don't misunderstand atheism too?

paxonel:
and you think there are no blind trust in atheism also?
I mean, are there no atheists that don't misunderstand atheism too?

Of course there is but it is not taken as a virtue as an atheist to "blindly" trust anyone. Also there is no "book of atheism" urging me to "blindly" trust its conclusions or compulsorily act according to its dictates so there is little avenue for me to develop that kind of "blind" trust. As a matter of fact all the popular atheists I hear always urge everyone to critically examine what they say.

paxonel:
skin surface?

Hell yeah

LordReed:
Of course there is but it is not taken as a virtue as an atheist to "blindly" trust anyone. Also there is no "book of atheism" urging me to "blindly" trust its conclusions or compulsorily act according to its dictates so there is little avenue for me to develop that kind of "blind" trust. As a matter of fact all the popular atheists I hear always urge everyone to critically examine what they say.

so, what reference do you use to validate that God do not exist since you say "there is no book of atheism" ?
because, obviously blind trust of believers or atheists have nothing to do with me or you respectively, except we want to keep generalizing thereby not letting the truth stand on it own objectively.

As for me this my reference :

Mark 4:31 It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown in the earth, is less than all the seeds that be in the earth:
Mark 4:32 But when it is sown, it groweth up, and becometh greater than all herbs, and shooteth out great branches; so that the fowls of the air may lodge under the shadow of it.

Jesus made this statement about 2000 years ago before he was crucified.
2000 years have pass now, Google it.
Which herb(religion) is currently the greatest in the world?
You will discover that it is Christianity.

How did Jesus knew that this will happen?
Because he is God.

No mere human can ever, ever, ever, ever...

..make that kind of prediction.

LordReed:
Of course there is but it is not taken as a virtue as an atheist to "blindly" trust anyone. Also there is no "book of atheism" urging me to "blindly" trust its conclusions or compulsorily act according to its dictates so there is little avenue for me to develop that kind of "blind" trust. As a matter of fact all the popular atheists I hear always urge everyone to critically examine what they say.

This is a lie and deceit!
Books are recorded thoughts believed to be wise sayings meant to control the thoughts and actions of people who later read it!
So if you often meditate on the utterances of people like Charles Darwin and co you're in no way different from religionists. The slight difference is that atheism lied to you that you're free as in freethinkers while the concept subtly infuse false ideas like evolution in your brains then since it's author (Satan) only wants you to be lawless he stylishly makes you feel you're better than others who are meditating on righteousness.

But the truth is whatever makes you wake up and think of correcting the thoughts of your fellowman equally makes you a believer in some forms of tenets even though you can't point out specifically what you want your neighbour to believe!

MaxInDHouse:
This is a lie and deceit!
Books are recorded thoughts believed to be wise sayings meant to control the thoughts and actions of people who later read it!
So if you often meditate on the utterances of people like Charles Darwin and co you're in no way different from religionists. The slight difference is that atheism lied to you that you're free as in freethinkers while the concept subtly infuse false ideas like evolution in your brains then since it's author (Satan) only wants you to be lawless he stylishly makes you feel you're better than others who are meditating on righteousness.

But the truth is whatever makes you wake up and think of correcting the thoughts of your fellowman equally makes you a believer in some forms of tenets even though you can't point out specifically what you want your neighbour to believe!

LoLz. That's your headache man. Bwahahahahaha!

I have not asked anyone to believe anything. What I have asked is for people to be reasonable, believe whatever thing you want but act within reason.

LordReed:
LoLz. That's your headache man. Bwahahahahaha!
I have not asked anyone to believe anything. What I have asked is for people to be reasonable, believe whatever thing you want but act within reason

There you go again PREACHING but denying it!

Are you saying your fellowman doesn't act with reason?
Is there any yardstick to measure the power of reasoning?
Come on my friend, you're also preaching but Satan has blindfolded you making you feel you're free whereas you're also trying to convince others on how they should use their brains!

paxonel:
so, what reference do you use to validate that God do not exist since you say "there is no book of atheism" ?
because, obviously blind trust of believers or atheists have nothing to do with me or you respectively, except we want to keep generalizing thereby not letting the truth stand on it own objectively.

As for me this my reference :

Mark 4:31 It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown in the earth, is less than all the seeds that be in the earth:
Mark 4:32 But when it is sown, it groweth up, and becometh greater than all herbs, and shooteth out great branches; so that the fowls of the air may lodge under the shadow of it.

Jesus made this statement about 2000 years ago before he was crucified.
2000 years have pass now, Google it.
Which herb(religion) is currently the greatest in the world?
You will discover that it is Christianity.

How did Jesus knew that this will happen?
Because he is God.

No mere human can ever, ever, ever, ever...

..make that kind of prediction.

It's not really a single book I reference to know that your god doesn't exist and in fact it's not really the books either, it's reality. Reality doesn't operate the way most of the so called holy books seem to portray it. Is there a bigger truth than the reality you and I both live in, I don't think so.

Of course the Bible would say that, any community would guide against loosing it's members. Jesus saying people would stop believing is like me saying the sun will rise tomorrow, it is any inevitability but is been harnessed by the Bible to prove some kind of magical/supernatural power. TB Joshua is the prime example for our times, claimed to have the ear of God but couldn't forsee his own death or plan accordingly. Fact is no supernatural insight into the future can be properly demonstrated. One can take several educated guesses and narrow down a desired outcome but that isn't a supernatural power. Humans are subject to all manner of repeating pressures and behaviours that predictability is not far fetched at all. This is why analysts exist, they can take data, figure out the trends and make predictions based on it, doesn't require any kind of godlike power to do.

MaxInDHouse:
There you go again PREACHING but denying it!

Are you saying your fellowman doesn't act with reason?
Is there any yardstick to measure the power of reasoning?
Come on my friend, you're also preaching but Satan has blindfolded you making you feel you're free whereas you're also trying to convince others on how they should use their brains!

I am saying not all my fellow man act within reason and some of them use religious excuses to act unreasonably.

Is there any yardstick to measure the power of reasoning? There are but that is not what I am talking about. How you behave to your fellow man is the point.

Exactly! I am preaching for people to use their powers of reason AKA their brains, you are very correct! Thank you!

paxonel:
so, what reference do you use to validate that God do not exist since you say "there is no book of atheism" ?
because, obviously blind trust of believers or atheists have nothing to do with me or you respectively, except we want to keep generalizing thereby not letting the truth stand on it own objectively.

As for me this my reference :

Mark 4:31 It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown in the earth, is less than all the seeds that be in the earth:
Mark 4:32 But when it is sown, it groweth up, and becometh greater than all herbs, and shooteth out great branches; so that the fowls of the air may lodge under the shadow of it.

Jesus made this statement about 2000 years ago before he was crucified.
2000 years have pass now, Google it.
Which herb(religion) is currently the greatest in the world?
You will discover that it is Christianity.

How did Jesus knew that this will happen?
Because he is God.

No mere human can ever, ever, ever, ever...

..make that kind of prediction.

There is a glittering botanical error in that passage you quoted

Firstly the mustard seed is not the smallest of all seeds like Jesus said
Secondly when it grows up it is not the largest of all herbs like Jesus said

Now to the topic,I'm not impressed by that prediction because of course it's a parable which is open to numerous interpretations. What happened to Jesus simply saying something like ....."This religion I have instituted would become the greatest religion in future".
But even if I accept that your interpretation of the passage is correct,it's not so impressive that Jesus predicted that the movement he was starting would become so great in future I mean so many successful people predicted or envisaged there success,nothing extraordinary about that
I would have thought you would quote a certain scripture
....behold I come soon....

over 2000years is not soon enough