₦airaland Forum

Spy360:
I accept that words are dynamic, but please don't claim them to be correct if they are not simply because people use them. For example, people refer to all northerners as Hausa or aboki, but that will never ever make it correct. So if someone tries to use the better term, don't tag the person as not dynamic.

Again, I am not against anyone using any terms, it's a personal thing, but people should not impose it just because it aids their arguments. There is a reason why inverted commas are used in writing.

Back to the main discuss, if Partey is a 'modern DM' as you put it and hence not a DM, doesn't that mean that I am correct?

Lol, he's a DM. The modern just means he contributes to attacking roles.

But he's a DM.

If I say modern GK, I can't think of anything else than a GK and more.

Meaning Partey is a DM and more

Spy360:
We all know Arsenal is a big club and should be playing CL, but you should appreciate the progress made so far towards achieving that.

Take away the injuries to Partey and Tierney, we would have been in CL this season. The lack of depth is what the club is solving now and hopefully things will get better. Try to see the brighter side of things

Miss me with all the excuses you are making for your MCM… Don’t you get tired of them?

What progress are you speaking about? We were in the UEL when your scam came on board, we finished 8th for 2 consecutive seasons and are now back where we were when he took over, so where and what exactly is the progress you are bragging about? Tell me!

3 years into his reign, no one can definitively see any improvement with the team tactically, other than the fact that we play Haram football and approach games with a defeated mentality to protect and defend. I am sorry, I don’t see any progress you are speaking about because it is non existent.

Is Arsenal the only team that struggle with injuries every season? You have purchased everything you want this season, all I am asking for is one more midfielder, thank goodness Partey looks clean and will be part of the season. Else, it would have been another bout of excuses..

I don’t care what I am labeled on this thread because I don’t don’t tolerate mediocrity, worsestill, your MCM has not done anything to prove me otherwise.

Jodera:
Lol, he's a DM. The modern just means he contributes to attacking roles.

But he's a DM.

If I say modern GK, I can't think of anything else than a GK and more.

Meaning Partey is a DM and more

You are now twisting things. If he is a DM then there is no need to say modern just as I have explained.

If he does more than DM it means he is something else. Just admit it.

Roland17:
Miss me with all the excuses you are making for your MCM… Don’t you get tired of them?

What progress are you speaking about? We were in the UEL when your scam came on board, we finished 8th for 2 consecutive seasons and are now back where we were when he took over, so where and what exactly is the progress you are bragging about? Tell me!

3 years into his reign, no one can definitively see any improvement with the team tactically, other than the fact that we play Haram football and approach games with a defeated mentality to protect and defend. I am sorry, I don’t see any progress you are speaking about because it is non existent.

Is Arsenal the only team that struggle with injuries every season? You have purchased everything you want this season, all I am asking for is one more midfielder, thank goodness Partey looks clean and will be part of the season. Else, it would have been another bout of excuses..

I don’t care what I am labeled on this thread because I don’t don’t tolerate mediocrity, worsestill, your MCM has not done anything to prove me otherwise.

You omit the part of winning the FA cup and getting to the SF of the Europa League when he came in. That's why I said you should see the brighter side, because there are other side's too.

The progress I mean was the genuine effort to finish 4th last season which we lost by the whiskers. Assuming that happened would you still claim he was giving us haram football?

Now, even though, you accept he is getting the right players to create the much needed depth that affected performances last season, you still chose to water it all down by making fictitious demands on how to use the players.

Oga smile at least for once.

Ike gwuru o

Spy360:
You omit the part of winning the FA cup and getting to the SF of the Europa League when he came in. That's why I said you should see the brighter side, because there are other side's too.

The progress I mean was the genuine effort to finish 4th last season which we lost by the whiskers. Assuming that happened would you still claim he was giving us haram football?

Now, even though, you accept he is getting the right players to create the much needed depth that affected performances last season, you still chose to water it all down by making fictitious demands on how to use the players.

Oga smile at least for once.

Ike gwuru o

Genuine effort to make top 4 you said? This is what you call progress? Since when did "Genuine effort" become a parameter to judge progress? In case you are not aware, these guys including your MCM are not volunteering to play. The last time I checked he just signed a bigger contract, so, please help me understand this "Genuine Effort" progress.

Listen man, if Arteta finished top 4, I would have been more understanding of some of your positions. It is so bad that I did not mind the Haram football if it meant we going to Europe..I mean! We were in position twice, both on a platter on gold but we flunked both chances and your MCM signed his contract once UEL was achieved. FA Cup is great but it doesn't change much neither can it be used as a strong parameter for growth, especially when it doesn't align with your league performances.

Fictitious demands on how to use players? Hahaaa.. I fit type 4 paragraphs easily on this but you are obviously on the Kool-Aid so it would make no difference. Fictitious he said...

The fact remains, we finished 5th before he came and since then, we finished 8th/ 8th and are now back where we were before we took over.

I have no smile to spare for you and your scam

Spy360:
You are now twisting things. If he is a DM then there is no need to say modern just as I have explained.

If he does more than DM it means he is something else. Just admit it

Like I said, we have different understanding of what we've been saying. I even brought a recent coach quote using the word "modern" and I can even bring more for you if you want but you still insist that it doesn't exist thereby denying the facts.

At this juncture let's just stick to what we know cos it seems we won't meet at a point in this discussion. Hopefully, time will explain it better to one of us. Time explains most things.

Roland17:
Genuine effort to make top 4 you said? This is what you call progress? Since when did "Genuine effort" become a parameter to judge progress? In case you are not aware, these guys including your MCM are not volunteering to play. The last time I checked he just signed a bigger contract, so, please help me understand this "Genuine Effort" progress.

Listen man, if Arteta finished top 4, I would have been more understanding of some of your positions. It is so bad that I did not mind the Haram football if it meant we going to Europe..I mean! We were in position twice, both on a platter on gold but we flunked both chances and your MCM signed his contract once UEL was achieved. FA Cup is great but it doesn't change much neither can it be used as a strong parameter for growth, especially when it doesn't align with your league performances.

Fictitious demands on how to use players? Hahaaa.. I fit type 4 paragraphs easily on this but you are obviously on the Kool-Aid so it would make no difference. Fictitious he said...

The fact remains, we finished 5th before he came and since then, we finished 8th/ 8th and are now back where we were before we took over.

I have no smile to spare for you and your scam

I totally understand your argument. But like Spy also wrote, I think we can be a little bit optimistic this season.

Much as I will always agree that Arsenal deserves better, the problem didn't start from Arteta. After Wenger left rather than us getting a manager better than him, we stepped down getting Emery, when we realized the error, instead of correcting it by bringing in an experienced manager, the board decided to step down again and start a new process with a green horn who has zero experience but sellable dream of overhauling the team...and he asked everyone to trust the process.

In fairness, he has overhaul the team. Someone showed Arteta first eleven in his first march on this thread some days ago, and I don't think we have more than 2 in that team that are still regular. In his 2yrs+ season, he has changed the face of the team. When he took over, the team was already nosediving and in disarray, he managed to win us FA cup which took us to Europe... Then the overhauling process started and it was rough but he kept telling us to trust the process... At a time that season, we were far below the mid table, then came Odegard and co in January and we started winning matches again and ended 8th... With no Europe.

That was painful and everyone felt bad and angry including myself... But in fairness, it is not easy for any coach to achieve much during that transformation process, we were changing squad and changing our style of play at the same time. Remember even Klopp didn't find it easy at the start of Liverpool transformation.

Then came last season, the players we wanted didn't come on time, after 3 matches we were at the bottom of the table with 0 point and 0 goal... Now from that position we finished 5th and we would have finished 4th but for not getting players expected in January and injury hitting our key players...

Whichever way we wanna look at it, we have made progress from where Arteta started to where we are now... I think we should just encourage him to do better and take us to our Dreamland. The team is almost complete now, I think we just need like 2 key more signings to give us the meaningful depth we need.

I agree that Saka might wanna take his time to see the progress of things before signing new contract and I have no problem with that, I will expect new contract from him in January when the team becomes fully established and doing well. And if bigger clubs demand for his signature and he leaves, I will still not blame him for pursuing his dream... I hope soon we will also be in position to attract qualities like Saka from lesser teams. A team like Man City today have no fear of any player wanting to leave cos they know they can attract similar or better player. That is the position I want Arsenal to also be... Not to be over dependant on any player.

I pray and hope we get better this new season.

Spuds want to sell regulion
He's way better and younger than Grimaldo though
Not injury prone too

Jodera:
Like I said, we have different understanding of what we've been saying. I even brought a recent coach quote using the word "modern" and I can even bring more for you if you want but you still insist that it doesn't exist thereby denying the facts.

At this juncture let's just stick to what we know cos it seems we won't meet at a point in this discussion. Hopefully, time will explain it better to one of us. Time explains most things.

Why can't you just accept. If it was me, I'd quickly take a bow and moved on.

I have just explained to you and you refuse after seeing the clear picture.

You said Partey is a DM. I said Partey is a CM not a DM according to what he does for Arsenal. You said he is a modern DM. I asked if he defends in midfield. You said no, he also does attack. I said, if he does both then he is a CM. You said no, it's called modern DM according to some coaches. I asked, what makes it modern, because in the past people have done same, and I gave you examples. You said, it's English and coaches have used the term. I said, it doesn't matter if it's wrong.

If Partey does more than DM in this Arsenal team, doesn't it mean he is something else? Yes or no. Don't run, admit.

Roland17:
Genuine effort to make top 4 you said? This is what you call progress? Since when did "Genuine effort" become a parameter to judge progress? In case you are not aware, these guys including your MCM are not volunteering to play. The last time I checked he just signed a bigger contract, so, please help me understand this "Genuine Effort" progress.

Listen man, if Arteta finished top 4, I would have been more understanding of some of your positions. It is so bad that I did not mind the Haram football if it meant we going to Europe..I mean! We were in position twice, both on a platter on gold but we flunked both chances and your MCM signed his contract once UEL was achieved. FA Cup is great but it doesn't change much neither can it be used as a strong parameter for growth, especially when it doesn't align with your league performances.

Fictitious demands on how to use players? Hahaaa.. I fit type 4 paragraphs easily on this but you are obviously on the Kool-Aid so it would make no difference. Fictitious he said...

The fact remains, we finished 5th before he came and since then, we finished 8th/ 8th and are now back where we were before we took over.

I have no smile to spare for you and your scam

As you admit, we were close to CL. We lost it for one reason - lack of depth. Can't blame the coach for that. Arsenal had the leanness squad amongst the top 6. Very lean squad. The genuine effort I mentioned was hampered by this. With same genuine effort and squad depth, we should be finishing 3rd.

Meanwhile, I understand your conservativeness or inability to waste a small smile for me and my gee. Chill with a shot of akpuru achia (dry gin) e go force you smile . I tried it once and the result was excellent to the external viewer alone.

iamoyindamola:
Spuds want to sell regulion
He's way better and younger than Grimaldo though
Not injury prone too

Way better?

iamoyindamola:
Spuds want to sell regulion
He's way better and younger than Grimaldo though
Not injury prone too

we could have said the same thing too with Emerson vs Tomiyasu transfer. If Arteta is going for Grimaldo, we should let him.
BTW, Arsenal's link to Grimaldo might just be a smoke screen. We're after Vitinha then before we signed his teammate.

Spy360:
Why can't you just accept. If it was me, I'd quickly take a bow and moved on.

I have just explained to you and you refuse after seeing the clear picture.

You said Partey is a DM. I said Partey is a CM not a DM according to what he does for Arsenal. You said he is a modern DM. I asked if he defends in midfield. You said no, he also does attack. I said, if he does both then he is a CM. You said no, it's called modern DM according to some coaches. I asked, what makes it modern, because in the past people have done same, and I gave you examples. You said, it's English and coaches have used the term. I said, it doesn't matter if it's wrong.

If Partey does more than DM in this Arsenal team, doesn't it mean he is something else? Yes or no. Don't run, admit.

I've shown on this board countless times that If I'm certainly wrong over something with so much proofs and fact, I'll apologize, accept my goof and move on. I no stubborn too much to dey form agidi for head or to claim one unnecessary W, afterall we are all here to learn.

In this case,

1.. I've explained to you why someone like Tielemans or Odegaard can't play Partey role and why we need someone like Partey attributes, you still no wan open your mind
2.. I've explained and showed you countless proofs on why Partey is a DM and what DM does but you still no gree nor open your mind
3.. I've explained, used examples, quotes and screenshot on why the word "modern" exist and why it's an official generally accepted word in football terms, you still no gree nor open your mind


And the worst part is that you don't want to even give proofs or reason but you're just always stuck with your claim then start looking on how to punch holes in mine . This is just exactly like our Sambi-tavarez debate where instead of giving me points you just counter my already laid points

And the main reason why I even want us to end it is simple — the basics of that Partey's position is what we have contrasting ideas on.

Until we reach an agreement on that, I'm not sure we'll ever agree on that or even reach a compromise. Reason why I'm leaving it to time. You see it as running away, but I'm not.

Same way I left your "Nketiah will bench Lacazette before season end" to time and it favoured you spectacularly and also same way that you said "Sambi can replace Partey in that role as long as it's the same structure" and it backfired spectacularly.

It's also same way I'm saying let's leave this to time and it'll always have a way of answering all these debates. It's simple.

Read arsenal are going for Paqueta too.

Tielemans or Paqueta which one do you guys prefer.

If I'm to go for one, I'll choose Paqueta sha

iamoyindamola:
Spuds want to sell regulion
He's way better and younger than Grimaldo though
Not injury prone too

I'm never too sold on that reguilon sha. Tho, I've not watched Grimaldo but if we need someone better, I'll pass on reguilon

Spy360:


As you admit, we were close to CL. We lost it for one reason - lack of depth. Can't blame the coach for that. Arsenal had the leanness squad amongst the top 6. Very lean squad. The genuine effort I mentioned was hampered by this. With same genuine effort and squad depth, we should be finishing 3rd.

Meanwhile, I understand your conservativeness or inability to waste a small smile for me and my gee. Chill with a shot of akpuru achia (dry gin) e go force you smile . I tried it once and the result was excellent to the external viewer alone.

Squad depth didn't make us lose 3 straight matches but stupid and baseless tactics
He used lonkonga in matches he could easily win

Like Roland said if we buy all the best players and this man doesn't have tactical sense to out smart his opponents we will be where we are
We saw how top coaches destroyed us last season because of his tactical deficiency

Jodera:
Read arsenal are going for Paqueta too.

Tielemans or Paqueta which one do you guys prefer.

If I'm to go for one, I'll choose Paqueta sha

We don't need paqueta
This man is beginning to go outside our transfer
Paqueta is an AM why do we need another one
Viera is AM
ESR is AM
Odegaard is AM

iamoyindamola:
We don't need paqueta
This man is beginning to go outside our transfer
Paqueta is an AM why do we need another one
Viera is AM
ESR is AM
Odegaard is AM

Well, I think he wants to turn ESR to a winger to battle it out with Martinelli on the left side

If that's the case then it'll be

Odegaard/Viera, Xhaka/Paqueta, Partey/Elneny/Torreira.

Nketiah/Jesus, ESR/Martinelli, Saka/

Not bad if you ask me.

iamoyindamola:
Squad depth didn't make us lose 3 straight matches but stupid and baseless tactics
He used lonkonga in matches he could easily win

Like Roland said if we buy all the best players and this man doesn't have tactical sense to out smart his opponents we will be where we are
We saw how top coaches destroyed us last season because of his tactical deficiency

Actually the overall cause of our failure is squad depth, even for the reason you gave. You can only change tactics on the spot when you have intelligent personnel to execute it. But our bench was too weak for that.

If I have to blame Arteta, it has to be his not quickly giving up on weak-link players (that might also not be bad when building and helping certain players to develop). He kept trust with Laca for too long till he reluctantly gave Nketiah a chance, same with Lokonga you mentioned, he taught the young lad will execute his tactics better, but he failed, then he decided to give Elneny a chance and we saw the difference. These 2 players were on their way out of the team till he had no other players to use (due to lack of squad depth) and he had to go back to them.

The team is still young and IMO, some of these players like Lokonga and Tavares will need special one on one tutoring like Arteta did with Sterling and Jesus at City and they might turn out better or they are sent out on loan to develop.

Jodera:
Well, I think he wants to turn ESR to a winger to battle it out with Martinelli on the left side

If that's the case then it'll be

Odegaard/Viera, Xhaka/Paqueta, Partey/Elneny/Torreira.

Nketiah/Jesus, ESR/Martinelli, Saka/

Not bad if you ask me.

We need players in their natural position
All these turning like he want to prepare amala no follow at all
ESR scored majority of his goals from midfield why change that

ObaIgwe1:
Actually the overall cause of our failure is squad depth, even for the reason you gave. You can only change tactics on the spot when you have intelligent personnel to execute it. But our bench was too weak for that.

If I have to blame Arteta, it has to be his not quickly giving up on weak-link players (that might also not be bad when building and helping certain players to develop). He kept trust with Laca for too long till he reluctantly gave Nketiah a chance, same with Lokonga you mentioned, he taught the young lad will execute his tactics better, but he failed, then he decided to give Elneny a chance and we saw the difference. These 2 players were on their way out of the team till he had no other players to use (due to lack of squad depth) and he had to go back to them.

The team is still young and IMO, some of these players like Lokonga and Tavares will need special one on one tutoring like Arteta did with Sterling and Jesus at City and they might turn out better or they are sent out on loan to develop.

We hope he has improved his football reasoning

iamoyindamola:
Squad depth didn't make us lose 3 straight matches but stupid and baseless tactics
He used lonkonga in matches he could easily win

Like Roland said if we buy all the best players and this man doesn't have tactical sense to out smart his opponents we will be where we are
We saw how top coaches destroyed us last season because of his tactical deficiency

He used Lokonga because he lacked depth. Elneny was just a lucky discovery.

We have seen how Arteta's quality signings have performed (apart from the young ones), in terms of tactics he is definitely not lagging behind. Definitely not.

Jodera:
I've shown on this board countless times that If I'm certainly wrong over something with so much proofs and fact, I'll apologize, accept my goof and move on. I no stubborn too much to dey form agidi for head or to claim one unnecessary W, afterall we are all here to learn.

In this case,

1.. I've explained to you why someone like Tielemans or Odegaard can't play Partey role and why we need someone like Partey attributes, you still no wan open your mind
2.. I've explained and showed you countless proofs on why Partey is a DM and what DM does but you still no gree nor open your mind
3.. I've explained, used examples, quotes and screenshot on why the word "modern" exist and why it's an official generally accepted word in football terms, you still no gree nor open your mind


And the worst part is that you don't want to even give proofs or reason but you're just always stuck with your claim then start looking on how to punch holes in mine . This is just exactly like our Sambi-tavarez debate where instead of giving me points you just counter my already laid points

And the main reason why I even want us to end it is simple — the basics of that Partey's position is what we have contrasting ideas on.

Until we reach an agreement on that, I'm not sure we'll ever agree on that or even reach a compromise. Reason why I'm leaving it to time. You see it as running away, but I'm not.

Same way I left your "Nketiah will bench Lacazette before season end" to time and it favoured you spectacularly and also same way that you said "Sambi can replace Partey in that role as long as it's the same structure" and it backfired spectacularly.

It's also same way I'm saying let's leave this to time and it'll always have a way of answering all these debates. It's simple.

Here's what we have agreed on...

That Partey does both attacking and defending duties very well.

I just simply asked you what that role is called. You said Modern DM, while I said CM. Which is what we have not agreed on.

Our disagreement is not a matter of opinion or philosophy but misconception, which is what I want us to clear out. If it is about opinion then what you have posted about time will be valid. But it's not.

I will boldly accuse you now of being arrogant based on what we have agreed already.

Jodera:
Well, I think he wants to turn ESR to a winger to battle it out with Martinelli on the left side

If that's the case then it'll be

Odegaard/Viera, Xhaka/Paqueta, Partey/Elneny/Torreira.

Nketiah/Jesus, ESR/Martinelli, Saka/

Not bad if you ask me.

LoL

We can have Saka/Marquinhos for now..

But Marquinhos is not Premier League proven so it will be better we sell Pepe and get another reliable right winger, before we have another "Lokonga disappointment" when we have to rest Saka.

iamoyindamola:
We need players in their natural position
All these turning like he want to prepare amala no follow at all
ESR scored majority of his goals from midfield why change that

Lol, but ESR wasn't doing bad when he was asked to play Martinelli wing na. Even most of his goals last season came from there.

Maybe Arteta trusts him to slug it out with Martinelli than with Odegaard Or Xhaka.

Not bad if you ask me sha cos na Saka side be my problem

ObaIgwe1:
LoL

We can have Saka/Marquinhos for now..

But Marquinhos is not Premier League proven so it will be better we sell Pepe and get another reliable right winger, before we have another "Lokonga disappointment" when we have to rest Saka.

Lol, thank God you know Marquinhos can't be counted for now and that's the main reason I did that triple questions mark

Another thing I'm suspecting is that Jesus might play that wing then Nketiah drafted into the 9 role. I believe that's one of the reasons again he was bought while marquinhos will use Europa to grow into the role.

Just my thoughts sha

Spy360:
Here's what we have agreed on...

That Partey does both attacking and defending duties very well.

I will boldly accuse you now of being arrogant based on what we have agreed already.

This bolded here was the beginning of our debate and we didn't agree on anything. If we did, we wouldn't have gotten here.

You said Partey duties is just attacking in that role while I said the bolded. That's why anytime you're bringing dem Tielemans or Odegaard to play that role, I'm always insisting that they can't since they lack the defensive attributes to play that role (I didn't bring attacking attributes since I know they already have it) but you said it doesn't matter. You even said Partey is not focused on the defensive duties and I proved it to you that it was false. It's that defensive issue that brought about the DM-CM brouhaha.

How you now suddenly agreed on Partey doing defensive duties well needs to be studied sha. From nowhere to are now-here

Jodera:
Lol, but ESR wasn't doing bad when he was asked to play Martinelli wing na. Even most of his goals last season came from there.

Maybe Arteta trusts him to slug it out with Martinelli than with Odegaard Or Xhaka.

Not bad if you ask me sha cos na Saka side be my problem

It was here we complain that xhaka was useless in lb
Don't worry I will remind us when ESR fvck up

iamoyindamola:
We hope he has improved his football reasoning

I think he is learning fast.

One of the mistakes he made in January was selling players and sending others out on loan before getting the ones he needed and it backfired cos he didn't get the ones he wanted. AMN should not have gone on loan that January.

He is not making same mistake now. He is focusing on getting his full squad in place 1st before sending out those surplus to requirement.

I want to expect a better and improved Arteta this season... At least now he has about 2 and half years of experience

iamoyindamola:
Squad depth didn't make us lose 3 straight matches but stupid and baseless tactics
He used lonkonga in matches he could easily win

Like Roland said if we buy all the best players and this man doesn't have tactical sense to out smart his opponents we will be where we are
We saw how top coaches destroyed us last season because of his tactical deficiency

God bless you sir! After I read Oga ObaIgwe’s post, I decided to just leave everything. I encourage them to go and watch Arsenal v Newcastle all over again. You can make all the excuses in this world, lack of depth, injuries and all but I know a coach that lacks tactical abilities when I see his team on the field. Talking tactics is very easy, after all G. Neville and TH14 do it on TV but we all know they failed as coaches.

Let’s not forget that Arteta was responsible for the same lack of depth with his inability to manage big squads. Here we are again in July, 3 weeks to the start of the new season and the squad is looking over bloated again. We will go into his 3rd season with same over bloated squad and by January there will be nothing left because he had mismanaged transfers/ loans and we will cry the squad lacks depth.

This is the same coach that bought Willian, offered Luiz an extension and bought Tavarez who we are now trying to sell after only 1 season and other mistakes. Like I said, he is getting everything he wants right now, I can’t wait to see how we play this season.

ObaIgwe1:
I think he is learning fast.

One of the mistakes he made in January was selling players and sending others out on loan before getting the ones he needed and it backfired cos he didn't get the ones he wanted. AMN should not have gone on loan that January.

He is not making same mistake now. He is focusing on getting his full squad in place 1st before sending out those surplus to requirement.

I want to expect a better and improved Arteta this season... At least now he has about 2 and half years of experience

Oga Oba, our coach is horrible in managing big squads. Check Arteta’s history and antecedents since he joined us. We always start every season with a lack of clarity when it comes to rotation and the size of the squad. It is July, 3 weeks I think to the start of the season and we are with another bloated squad that he will struggle to manage.

I wish I can be as positive as you are about the man but I am struggling to see substance in what he has done thus far. Let me remind you that only very few coaches, especially rookie coaches have enjoyed 3 years of what Arteta is enjoying at Arsenal, especially with the traditional top 4-6.

You said something interesting that I liked in your previous response. We made a mistake in hiring Ebening and doubled that mistake by hiring a rookie.. guess what, we are suffering the consequences of both decisions.