₦airaland Forum

Jodera:
I'm sorry if I sound so but that's how it you made me understand it

If you feel that Saliba handling that ball in the Penalty area(whether deliberate or not) or Gabriel conceding a penalty against tottenham is a good decision for us to concede a penalty, then It'll be difficult to know how else to put it

I used Saliba handball as an example of penalty missed.

Unfortunately it wasn't same for Gabriel.

Go and watch Tottenham Vs Everton highlights and see what led to the penalty. Pickford missed the ball and clipped Kane's legs. But again unfortunately Kane scored. Had he missed, it would have been a good decision from Pickford.

Jodera:
1..If this is the question you asked in the first bolded, then the answer is yes. I gave you examples in Saliba ystdy who allowed Bamford a free run to take a shot at goal after his error even when he had the opportunity to "engage". I gave you another example with Ramsdale and Vardy with more recent one in Pope and Rashford this weekend. All these people had the opportunity to engage the attacking player but they preferred the player a free run on open goal and in the case of Saliba, he allowed Bamford a free run on one on one with Ramsdale.

2.. As for the 2nd bolded. That instructions work only when attacking players are outside the Penalty box and never inside. No coach will ever ever tell you do that nonsense inside the penalty box and that's the issue of this our differences. Even Simeone and Mourinho, two of the world's aggressive coaches never ever allow their players to be aggressive in the box. You think if Gabriel slide Richarlison outside the Penalty box, there would be backlash?

My contrary opinion is that, no team should try to concede a penalty, no matter what. No team should have a choice to gift his opponent a penalty no matter the situation except if it's last minute or almost last minutes of the game and it's an open goal . Anything aside that, penalty should be avoided at all cost

You implying that it's good that Saliba handled the ball just to prevent an open goal from Bamford is totally wrong. Worst part is that Bamford didn't even have an open goal to score from in that sequence leading to the penalty

Corrections please it wasn't Bamford, it was Marc Roca or so.

And you sound like all you have comprehended from me is that I said players should look for penalties against their team like it's a thing of joy. That's too cheap and petty. No. But it's a matter of last resort. If you don't get it then I am sorry. Last resort.

Pickford did it against Kane. Go and watch it. If you're still doubting then good for you. But that's what is demanded from any top player. As a matter of last resort, foul the player instead of allowing him through on open goal. Pickford was not carded. But unfortunately Kane scored. Had he missed, Pickford would have been a hero. This is an ideal scenario for my opinion.

Rashford Vs Pope was a case of outside the box and the keeper was very smart to guide him to the side. However fouling Rashford would attract a red card so early in the game. So better to concede. That scenerio is not the ideal for my opinion. Stop mentioning it.

On Saliba's hand ball, it seems you can't tell the difference between ball to hand and hand to ball. Just that these days all are punished once it's inside the box. The good thing is that Bamford missed the penalty so good for Saliba. This too is not an ideal scenario for my opinion. I only mentioned it because the penalty was missed. So stop mentioning it.

Spy360:
I used Saliba handball as an example of penalty missed.

Unfortunately it wasn't same for Gabriel.

Go and watch Tottenham Vs Everton highlights and see what led to the penalty. Pickford missed the ball and clipped Kane's legs. But again unfortunately Kane scored. Had he missed, it would have been a good decision from Pickford.

that's a wrong example cos he didn't intentionally clip Kane's leg. You're making it seem as if Pickford deliberately did that but it isn't. Pickford spilled a low shot and in the process of catching the ball back, Kane quickly kicked the ball away from him and commited him(Pickford). Looking at it from all angles, Kane even add dive join but the contact with Pickford was what made that thing a penalty.

If Kane wasn't looking for penalty in that scenario, why do you think he dived?

You're making it seem conceding a penalty is good and that's the issue.... It is not good!!

Whether the penalty is scored or not, it is not good!! There's a reason why attacking teams and fans scream for joy when a penalty is given and there's a reason why the defending team are always downcast when they concede a penalty.

That's because this probability of a striker missing it is very very very very low.

Jodera:
that's a wrong example cos he didn't intentionally clip Kane's leg. You're making it seem as if Pickford deliberately did that but it isn't. Pickford spilled a low shot and in the process of catching the ball back, Kane quickly kicked the ball away from him and commited him(Pickford). Looking at it from all angles, Kane even add dive join but the contact with Pickford was what made that thing a penalty.

If Kane wasn't looking for penalty in that scenario, why do you think he dived?

You're making it seem conceding a penalty is good and that's the issue.... It is not good!!

Whether the penalty is scored or not, it is not good!! There's a reason why attacking teams and fans scream for joy when a penalty is given and there's a reason why the defending team are always downcast when they concede a penalty.

That's because this probability of a striker missing it is very very very very low.

I mentioned a reliable example that fits my opinion you say it's not a good one. Is it your opinion?

If you think Pickford did not deliberately leave two hands on Kane's legs then it's a pity. Kane diving is true, but it's immaterial to the discuss.

As for conceding penalties, it's never a good thing of course but it can be the last resort when you feel you are more likely to lose a match if you concede from open goal. It doesn't always work, but it gives you the slightest but more brighter opportunity of not going down by the goal you avoided.

It's that simple. It's like choosing to lose your queen as a last resort when your king have been checked. I am talking of chess now.

Spy360, this is the sequence that led to the penalty.

The purple arrow is the direction of the ball

The red marker is the player(attacker) whom the ball was intended for

The green marker is Marc Roca. (your supposed 'dangerous' player)


From the screenshot we can see how everybody was looking at the direction of the ball(including Ramsdale) and how Saliba had already man marked his attacker before ball mistakenly hit his hand.

How will you look at this sequence (with respect to the direction of the ball) and say that Marc Roca (the one marked green) have an open goal opportunity and that the decision for Saliba to handle the ball is a good decision.

Isn't it ridiculous to think that Marc Roca who is faraway from the sequence is now the most dangerous so the best way to avoid that is by handling the ball?
How is Saliba handling the ball the best/last resort to prevent Marc Roca from scoring in this scenario?

You see why I said you're justifying PKs but you'll say I'm witch hunting you

Jodera:
Taahh!!... I no believe you.

So tell me say If Barca get all or nothing, you no go watch?

I won't .... trust me. Messi was the reason why I supported Barcelona then and since he left the club, my mind no dey the club totally.

Jodera:
I didn't dispute the bolded but what I'm saying is that ref never makes any decisions concerning offsides. It's only Var. Any other thing aside offsides (fouls, penalties, violent conduct or sort) is within ref right to check the pitchside monitor.

Okay, let's do this. Anytime an Offside call is being reviewed, if ref doesn't go with what Var says but goes to the pitchside monitor to check things out, just call me out.

Ok

iamoyindamola:
Is Tomi a starter

You were not specific. Even at that, Tomiyasu is currently a starter.

mostob:
I won't .... trust me. Messi was the reason why I supported Barcelona then and since he left the club, my mind no dey the club totally.

Lol....
Meaning if they do PSG all or nothing you'll watch?

Thus una argument sef...
I remember Luiz that time. He would commit a foul as the last defender and still collect red card. The team will be a goal down and at the same time, a player down.
Conceding a penalty deliberately is a wrong decision for me cos the team might be losing in two ways.

Jodera:
Lol....
Meaning if they do PSG all or nothing you'll watch?

I may watch because of Mbappe's saga. But I won't be as enthusiastic as I would be when watching Arsenal's.

mostob:
I may watch because of Mbappe's saga. But I won't be as enthusiastic as I would be when watching Arsenal's.

... Lol, you see why I said I no trust you .

Jodera:
... Lol, you see why I said I no trust you .

Thing is anything apart from Arsenal doesn't excite me.

mostob:
Thus una argument sef...
I remember Luiz that time. He would commit a foul as the last defender and still collect red card. The team will be a goal down and at the same time, a player down.
Conceding a penalty deliberately is a wrong decision for me cos the team might be losing in two ways.

That's exactly what people hated Luiz then for.
Even Xhaka sef that most people once hated because of his penchant of giving away PKs and collecting red cards(due to needless fouls— "if you miss ball, don't miss the leg".).

Now Spy is famsing "if you miss ball, don't miss the leg", Like say na better thing

mostob:

Thing is anything apart from Arsenal doesn't excite me.

Na now you come

Jodera:
That's exactly what people hated Luiz then for.
Even Xhaka sef that most people once hated because of his penchant of giving away PKs and collecting red cards(due to needless fouls— "if you miss ball, don't miss the leg".).

Now Spy is famsing "if you miss ball, don't miss the leg", Like say na better thing

David Luiz that year ehn...I almost burst TV. As in..why not allow him score and we will equalize. But the guy go still carry red card.

Jodera:
That's exactly what people hated Luiz then for.
Even Xhaka sef that most people once hated because of his penchant of giving away PKs and collecting red cards(due to needless fouls— "if you miss ball, don't miss the leg".).

Now Spy is famsing "if you miss ball, don't miss the leg", Like say na better thing

Our players then will escort the player to box18 and commit foul

mostob:
David Luiz that year ehn...I almost burst TV. As in..why not allow him score and we will equalize. But the guy go still carry red card.

Since after David Luiz and Willian, I hated anything from Chelsea.

Though I had soft spot for David Luiz sha. Maybe it's because of his long range passes and the way he can play as a world best defender anytime his head no touch. But mehn, his "head-touching" pass him advantages

sod09:
Our players then will escort the player to box18 and commit foul

Luiz and Xhaka on the beats

Jodera:
Since after David Luiz and Willian, I hated anything from Chelsea.

Though I had soft spot for David Luiz sha. Maybe it's because of his long range passes and the way he can play as a world best defender anytime his head no touch. But mehn, his "head-touching" pass him advantages

Jodera:


Luiz and Xhaka on the beats

Thank God mustafi no follow

sod09:
Thank God mustafi no follow

Mustafi case dey different na. Na another realm

Jodera:
Mustafi case dey different na. Na another realm

With gabu

sod09:
With gabu

Gabu never reach there na
Though village people don dey tanana him phone. I just hope say him no dey pick

Jodera:
Gabu never reach there na
Though village people don dey tanana him phone. I just hope say him no dey pick

Until he carry to where we no know abi

sod09:
Until he carry to where we no know abi

Na so na.
We gave Mustafi that privilege till he fvck up, let Gabu enjoy that privilege too

Jodera:
Spy360, this is the sequence that led to the penalty.

The purple arrow is the direction of the ball

The red marker is the player(attacker) whom the ball was intended for

The green marker is Marc Roca. (your supposed 'dangerous' player)


From the screenshot we can see how everybody was looking at the direction of the ball(including Ramsdale) and how Saliba had already man marked his attacker before ball mistakenly hit his hand.

How will you look at this sequence (with respect to the direction of the ball) and say that Marc Roca (the one marked green) have an open goal opportunity and that the decision for Saliba to handle the ball is a good decision.

Isn't it ridiculous to think that Marc Roca who is faraway from the sequence is now the most dangerous so the best way to avoid that is by handling the ball?
How is Saliba handling the ball the best/last resort to prevent Marc Roca from scoring in this scenario?

You see why I said you're justifying PKs but you'll say I'm witch hunting you

It's funny how you skew things to your favour and even bring graphics to gather sympathy.

First, you are all wrong with all your assertions. If you want to be certain, watch that highlights with a neutral person and ask for views. You obviously did not watch the motion picture before bringing up still photography to describe live actions. Abeg go and watch the highlight. That's your assignment now.

1. The ball landed right in the middle of that box, it was a drop ball and not a diagonal pass.

2. Marc Roca (red marker) is the no 8 and not the black player you assumed. Roca is in the middle with Saliba where the ball dropped. He was the target.

3. The black player (green marker)is Sinisterra no23, he was not the target but was going for a possible rebound.

Saliba was in a good position to clear the ball so no need to commit a foul. However, he missed control of the ball that would have handed a clear scoring opportunity to Roca before he handled. Please note, he did not go handle deliberately but it happened.

Now listen, that penalty is not something to desire, but right now as I am typing, I will gladly accept that a penalty was given than for Roca to take a shot at Ramsdale. Results? No shot was taken, penalty missed, we won. Case closed.

mostob:
Thus una argument sef...
I remember Luiz that time. He would commit a foul as the last defender and still collect red card. The team will be a goal down and at the same time, a player down.
Conceding a penalty deliberately is a wrong decision for me cos the team might be losing in two ways.

Take a look at these two scenerios and tell me what you think. Who's smarter between Saurez and Valdez?

Had Valdez grabbed Torres' legs who knows. Men should be wiser.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CcPELUFKKU

www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCmSJvT0Z1Y

Spy360:
Take a look at these two scenerios and tell me what you think. Who's smarter between Saurez and Valdez?

Had Valdez grabbed Torres' legs who knows. Men should be wiser.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CcPELUFKKU

www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCmSJvT0Z1Y

I understand you bro... But you have to put the scenarios into consideration too.
The examples you gave here are in knockouts.
Now imagine against United in first half, Rashford was through on goal and Gabriel (our last defender) was just behind him.
Now, according to you, Gabriel should hack him down and concede a penalty which will definitely be a red card offence.
The team will now be forced to chase the game with a man down.

mostob:
I understand you bro... But you have to put the scenarios into consideration too.
The examples you gave here are in knockouts.
Now imagine against United in first half, Rashford was through on goal and Gabriel (our last defender) was just behind him.
Now, according to you, Gabriel should hack him down and concede a penalty which will definitely be a red card offence.
The team will now be forced to chase the game with a man down.

No. Just follow the examples I gave strictly. It's all about wisdom and good timing.

There's no need sacrificing a player early in the game when you know you have a chance 11vs11. But if you know you don't, then take the risk. Note it's a risk.

You weigh your chances.

Let me take you to 2006 CL finals.

Eto was through on goal, Lehmann fouled him, gets red carded. Arsenal scores 1-0.

Take away his mumu replacement Almunia, and we would have a CL trophy today.

There are many examples.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uf-6aRJk8q0

Spy360:
No. Just follow the examples I gave strictly. It's all about wisdom and good timing.

There's no need sacrificing a player early in the game when you know you have a chance 11vs11. But if you know you don't, then take the risk. Note it's a risk

You weigh your chances.

Let me take you to 2006 CL finals.

Eto was through on goal, Lehmann fouled him, gets red carded. Arsenal scores 1-0.

Take away his mumu replacement Almunia, and we would have a CL trophy today.

There are many examples.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uf-6aRJk8q0

the bolded is the main point.
This is exactly what Saliba did.
Trust me, I understand your point perfectly just that both Saliba and Gabriel examples you stated don't follow your argument.

Another example is Valverde against Atletico in super Copa. Dude clipped Morata's leg which prevented a goal. They later won the match.

mostob:
the bolded is the main point.
This is exactly what Saliba did.
Trust me, I understand your point perfectly just that both Saliba and Gabriel examples you stated don't follow your argument.

Another example is Valverde against Atletico in super Copa. Dude clipped Morata's leg which prevented a goal. They later won the match.

Saliba's case is not a good example because it was not deliberate and he was in a position to clear. But then he lost control of the ball. If that ball had not hit his hand it would have fallen for Roca who would take a clear shot at goal. Had Leeds scored, winning that match would be by grace. Because Leeds already had the momentum and they are at home.

So that handball incident and the missed penalty really favoured us.