₦airaland Forum

Kobonaire4:
Cheap fuel provided the environment for corruption and nepotism to flourish...key word being the fact that subsidy does not allow a profit to be made, and also provides for free money to flow whether or not things are working.

Whereas, if there had been no subsidy, refineries would be forced to work for a profit...meaning sabotage and corruption under such a system would hurt everyone, saboteur included.

That's not rational.

Who said subsidy does not allow profit to be made?

Does subsidy reduce or increase production cost?

If you like remove subsidy , as long as the refineries are under government management, they would not function well.

Was subsidy the reason why Nitel,Ajeokuta, NEPA and many other government establishment failed?

englishmart:
I don't know if you knew that Dangote refinery is a money laundering project. That refinery is a northern project. Dangote alone can't fund that project.
Shame on you all.

Did Dangote tell you he alone funded the refinery? What you don't know you don't comment on it.

Your sight is beyond correction. By human standard you can never regain your sight again, what a pity, but with God miracle is possible, pray more and change your mindset.

FalseProphet1:
I see dangote exploiting Nigerians once he's refinery is completed, I see fuel selling for over N200 per liter, I see people complaining, I see dangote exporting the file to neighboring African countries and selling to them at N80 per liter.

This I have seen.

FalseProphet1:
I see dangote exploiting Nigerians once he's refinery is completed, I see fuel selling for over N200 per liter, I see people complaining, I see dangote exporting the file to neighboring African countries and selling to them at N80 per liter.

This I have seen.

Exactly, the Government has a huge share in dangote refinary. To make profit they will increase the price now to 800 per liter and say they have removed subsidy.
When dangote starts selling they will reduce it to 400naira per liter.
Wicked government.

onadana:
Irresponsible people.Waiting for a private individual's investment before subsidy can be removed.Is it safe for us to say the refinary was built with government funds?

With the comment of the “honorable”; with the expectations they show with Dangote’s refinery; my brother, it is very safe to think you way. You are spot on.

377:
for your dream abi

How does removing subsidy help the common man.
Are you giving that money directly into the hands of the masses ?

blueAgent:
That's not rational.

Who said subsidy does not allow profit to be made?

Does subsidy reduce or increase production cost?

If you like remove subsidy , as long as the refineries are under government management, they would not function well.

Was subsidy the reason why Nitel,Ajeokuta, NEPA and many other government establishment failed?

Yes, subsidy is the main reason why our refineries, nitel and nepa failed.

At the end of the day when goverment price is below the production cost problems start.

Private companies do not have that problem because they have to run at a profit and their getting money depends on having everything working.

Public companies get free subsidy momey and free allawee whehter they work or not, which is why they fail.

Keep that in mind.

YinkaOlusesi16:
We can't wait oooo. Atleast removing the subsidy will reduce cost of living of Nigerians.

I tire for your thoughts! What makes you think so?

FalseProphet1:
I see dangote exploiting Nigerians once he's refinery is completed, I see fuel selling for over N200 per liter, I see people complaining, I see dangote exporting the file to neighboring African countries and selling to them at N80 per liter.

This I have seen.

More like N700per litre

ZombieSlayer1:
What are you guys even saying?
I bought fuel at 420 2days ago in Owerri and I bought at 450 this morning in Port Harcourt

And considering that Nigeria is an oil producing country, are we supposed to be buying fuel at such high cost?

Oil producing doesn't make much of a difference if you take away subsidy. There is a cost to finding oil, developing, producing and refining it. If you are an oil producing country the only benefit is you avoid shipping costs.

But funny enough, because of high cost of production here, it could be cheaper to buy crude from Russia right now, compared to refining locally produced crude.

COMPAQ:
Oil producing doesn't make much of a difference if you take away subsidy. There is a cost to finding oil, developing, producing and refining it. If you are an oil producing country the only benefit is you avoid shipping costs.

But funny enough, because of high cost of production here, it could be cheaper to buy crude from Russia right now, compared to refining locally produced crude.

But artisinal refiners are refining the same crude without spending billions. The funny thing is that a lot of petrol stations are buying from these artisinal refiners

englishmart:
I don't know if you knew that Dangote refinery is a money laundering project. That refinery is a northern project. Dangote alone can't fund that project.
Shame on you all.

That is where the forex that was supposed to be used to sustain the economy was channelled in under the guise of NNPC have shares in the refinery.

Sleekfingers:
Is 420 or 450 the official price ?

That's what I'm saying, people aren't selling at official price and some people here are saying it'll be 400 without subsidy.

That's not even the main ish; there are more than 15 checkpoints between Owerri and port Harcourt and drivers of commercial vehicles have to drop between ₦100 and ₦200 in each. Imagine that kinda rubbish

ZombieSlayer1:
That's what I'm saying, people aren't selling at official price and some people here are saying it'll be 400 without subsidy

I was just buttressing someone comment. Yes Officially, it will be in the region of 400- 500 or more per litre without subsidy.

Here in Lagos , some filling stations are selling for 185 - 250 .

ZombieSlayer1:
But artisinal refiners are refining the same crude without spending billions. The funny thing is that a lot of petrol stations are buying from these artisinal refiners

The quality won't be as good as refined fuel from a good refinery...with checks and balances. (plus the fact that people are buying from the artisinal refineries does not make them good....if there were modular or big refineries, no one would look at the artisinal...but subsidy regimen makes investing in good domestic refining a big risk...unless you are dangote...and even then)

englishmart:
I don't know if you knew that Dangote refinery is a money laundering project. That refinery is a northern project. Dangote alone can't fund that project.
Shame on you all.

When JP Morgan Chase refuses to be a project value at over $1B underwriter. That was a red flag for me. I think the project underwriter is some European obscured Bank.

FalseProphet1:
I see dangote exploiting Nigerians once he's refinery is completed, I see fuel selling for over N200 per liter, I see people complaining, I see dangote exporting the fuel to neighboring African countries and selling to them at N80 per liter.

This I have seen.

You see terrible things

savcy:
If Dangote didn't build one, an entire oil producing country wouldn't have one working refinery. We've been having consecutive bad leaders since 1999. So bad it's unbelievable that we're still one after 23 years.

And all the ND Govs cant build one
My Rivers state Go is busy dashing out money

Jummate:
Doesn't selling at a price "not less than N400" still amount to extortion? This still leaves us in the unwanted situation of being at his mercy. I don't think the PPPRC can do very much to stop this, given the lack of competition that would arise as a result.

The petroleum industry isn't influenced by competition but by OPEC pricing of crude oil .Dangote has specific profit margin for each commodity he produces .. excluding subsidies.

Have buying the crude product and processing..

He will sell it at an intentional price expressed in Naira..(around N400)
Other factors that may slightly impact the price is taxes and other levy..
This is what PPPRP ensures

So weather the you have 10 refineries by different owners or 1...they will operate the same way..

They will make more money depending on their refining capacity..in lane man terms

Refinery A buys 1 barrel of crude for N20 and process to sell for N30 everyday

A larger refinery B can buy 2 barrel of crude for N40 and process to sell for N60 everyday

Kobonaire4:
No, it is because subsidy, the thing most of you agitate for, and love, forces NNPC to operate at a loss, which means it has no extra funds for new refineries and suchlike.

That is why many NNPC execs past and present have been shouting for years that subsidy must go.

Right now, NNPC is importing fuel above N500 and selling it at N172 depot price. HOW would they make profit to pay for new refineries? By magic.

Even the subsidy we use...most of the time, money is taken from other sensible things, and used for subsidy, so that NNPC does not collapse in the process.

I mean, if you were a rice farmer, and it cost you N30000 to produce one 25kg bag of rice, and you sell it at N35000 to make a profit of N5000...WOULD you agree for government to tell you to sell that bag of rice at N10000 instead...to help the poor?

We do not have a refinery, because subsidy forces the NNPC to operate at a loss. That is why we are in the mess we are. Plus, since free government money comes to NNPC whether refineries work or not, thanks to subsidy, corruption results.

They have deceived you and want to use you to deceive others. But you can't deceive us. All this Balablu you're saying won't change anything. That subsidy must stay. Liars. The money you recovered from subsidy removal on AGO and DPK where is it? Enemies of the masses. Agents of the World Bank.

Everlastingson:
They have deceived you and want to use you to deceive others. But you can't deceive us. All this Balablu you're saying won't change anything. That subsidy must stay. Liars. The money you recovered from subsidy removal on AGO and DPK where is it? Enemies of the masses. Agents of the World Bank.

I'm no apc supporter

YinkaOlusesi16:
We can't wait oooo. Atleast removing the subsidy will reduce cost of living of Nigerians.

subsidy removal will increase the cost not reduce the cost of living. Prices will go up not down.

Sick PPL,imagine waiting for one man to give a whole nation refinery for 60years after indep.This mental problem.
Colonial masters needs to come back to naija.
NO PATRIOTISM IN GOVERNANCE AGAIN AMOUNG PUBLIC OFFICE HOLDERS.
FABRIC OF GOV IS BADLY MANGLED BY GREED AND WICKEDNESS AMOUNG D FEW MANAGERS OF NAIJA RESOURCES.

Misterone:
subsidy removal will increase the cost not reduce the cost of living. Prices will go up not down.

WONT THEY NEED POWER,THEY WILL CHARGE WHAT THEY LIKE,JUST LIKE D THE CEMENT BAGS? And they will claim to guarantee supply to pay the price.subsidy is only share poor man dey enjoy as citizens,if they remove subsidy nothing for poor masses.

Everlastingson:
They have deceived you and want to use you to deceive others. But you can't deceive us. All this Balablu you're saying won't change anything. That subsidy must stay. Liars. The money you recovered from subsidy removal on AGO and DPK where is it? Enemies of the masses. Agents of the World Bank.

Nope, and to start my full response, I used to talk like you until over a decade ago when my eyes were open.

1.First, yes, subsidy on AGO and DPK was removed. If it was not removed in 2013, by now, we would have been spending far more on subsides than we are spending right now...to the point that we would have been spending our entire revenue plus loans to pay for the thing.

Right now, DPK costs over N800. If we were still paying subsidy it would have been close to about 600 naira a liter...which adding up means extra trillions of naira in subsidy.

2.Second, you don't get what subsidy is.

Subsidy is the difference between the cost price of petrol as set by government and the actual price, which is due to the cost of production plus transportation...which is higher than the cost price of petrol as set by government

Right now, the actual price has been rising...from N231 in March 2021, to N261 in June 2021 to N396 in august 2022, to 510 in November 2022.(All per liter)

The price as set by government has risen from N167 in 2021 to N195 now.

The difference is the subsidy cost...which has been rising (Ukraine war for now is the main driver, plus rising cost of diesel which is used to transport the petrol).

As the subsidy rises, so does the amount of money spent from the budget...which creates something called a deficit...which leads to more debt...and government taking more loans to cover the deficit.

There is a reason why Peter Obi, Tinubu and Atiku support subsidy removal

Infact, if not for government over the decades increasing the price of fuel to cover the differences left by selling subsidised fuel, by now things would have been in big problems.

It is not a matter of world bank...it is quite simply the fact that if you do not let people make a profit, wahala and problems follow.

Like I said, I saw the light 11 years ago...back when Tinubu was opposing fuel subsidy removal. So calling me a tinubu supporter is nonsense. It was not easy, but it took me reading more and thinking more before I saw why subsidy is bad...and why Niger and Ghana which have NO SUBSIDY have working refineries, while we don't.

t2luv1:
When JP Morgan Chase refuses to be a project value at over $1B underwriter. That was a red flag for me. I think the project underwriter is some European obscured Bank.

JPMorgan chase is not the only bank in the world...

Plus here are the guys funding dangote (It is in the public).

THE Dangote Group said it received financial support from both local and international bodies on its 650,000 barrels per day refinery under construction in Lekki, Lagos State.

The group revealed that the African Finance Corporation (AFC), the African Development Bank, (AfDB), the United Bank of Africa and other indigenous banks supported it with 70 per cent of the needed finances for the project

SIAUCE

And from 2013 when the thing kicked off

Mr Dangote signed a $3.3bn loan deal with local and foreign banks to build the refinery, as well as fertiliser and petrochemical plants.

The entire venture would cost $9bn, with $3bn in equity from Dangote Industries and $6bn to be raised in loan capital.

The initial loan facility was co-ordinated globally by Standard Chartered and in Nigeria by Guaranty Trust Bank

Source


And then again, JP Morgan won't finance the project because Nigerians want Dangote to sell fuel to them at a price less than what it cost to produce it...'because we are poor'.

FalseProphet1:
I see dangote exploiting Nigerians once he's refinery is completed, I see fuel selling for over N200 per liter, I see people complaining, I see dangote exporting the fuel to neighboring African countries and selling to them at N80 per liter.

This I have seen.

l


200 will be cheap,, be expecting 500 per litre.

MarketDispatch:
No one has talked about how Dangote will be getting supply stock of iCrude oil that will be refined.

This is my biggest worry. We have lost this country

pocom35:
The petroleum industry isn't influenced by competition but by OPEC pricing of crude oil .Dangote has specific profit margin for each commodity he produces .. excluding subsidies.

Have buying the crude product and processing..

He will sell it at an intentional price expressed in Naira..(around N400)
Other factors that may slightly impact the price is taxes and other levy..
This is what PPPRP ensures

So weather the you have 10 refineries by different owners or 1...they will operate the same way..

They will make more money depending on their refining capacity..in lane man terms

Refinery A buys 1 barrel of crude for N20 and process to sell for N30 everyday

A larger refinery B can buy 2 barrel of crude for N40 and process to sell for N60 everyday

This seems to be a great deal, and would be somewhat relieving if it would play out just like this. Thanks for the explanation.

YinkaOlusesi16:
We can't wait oooo. Atleast removing the subsidy will reduce cost of living of Nigerians.

Hehehe leemaoo 😂😂
Bros think 2wice o Damgote na monopolist disguised as business man.
If he likes he would just drink burukutu and add 200 to price of fuel

Segzy19:
Dem don start again with nonsense.
Dangote who took a world Bank loan for his project yet you are here spewing nonsense...

Money laundering ko, money printing ni.

You guys are just something else

You day there?
How do you know it is true

Even if it is true,fine but it won’t be news if someday it is found out that his company is used to launder funds.

Well, if all the money those bastards have been stealing have been put into use on projects like this, things would have been cheaper in nigeria by now.
Instead they choose to build estates in dubai and buy expensive vehicles That benefits no one here